: While Morde is strong atm, It´s the AP Item that´s the big problem Compare {{champion:122}} and {{champion:82}} They pretty much do the same thing, but they builds different items Darius has better stats than Mordekaiser, including base damage and Ratio. https://leagueoflegends.fandom.com/wiki/Darius https://leagueoflegends.fandom.com/wiki/Mordekaiser Read for yourself, anyway back to the items, You can see the difference between what they are building {{champion:122}} {{item:3078}} {{item:3053}} and {{champion:82}} {{item:3151}} {{item:3116}} Mordekaiser has more options to build tanky ap items and, and there isn´t that many good mr items in the game that can deal against ap damage Darius has fewer option to build tanky bruiser items. And you can itemize against armor for all roles {{item:3157}} {{item:3026}} {{item:3068}} while the options for mr items suckz in comparison
> [{quoted}](name=Jazzchimera,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xhN93jMQ,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2020-02-24T14:13:40.955+0000) > > While Morde is strong atm, It´s the AP Item that´s the big problem > > Compare {{champion:122}} and {{champion:82}} They pretty much do the same thing, but they builds different items > > Darius has better stats than Mordekaiser, including base damage and Ratio. > > https://leagueoflegends.fandom.com/wiki/Darius > > https://leagueoflegends.fandom.com/wiki/Mordekaiser > > Read for yourself, anyway back to the items, You can see the difference between what they are building > > {{champion:122}} {{item:3078}} {{item:3053}} and {{champion:82}} {{item:3151}} {{item:3116}} > > Mordekaiser has more options to build tanky ap items and, and there isn´t that many good mr items in the game that can deal against ap damage > > Darius has fewer option to build tanky bruiser items. And you can itemize against armor for all roles {{item:3157}} {{item:3026}} {{item:3068}} while the options for mr items suckz in comparison The difference between morde and darius is the consistency adn the fact that darius is way more toxic.
Lazlum (EUNE)
: Yasuo fizz talon dianna cassio kassadin are the best mid laners right now play with them
> [{quoted}](name=Lazlum,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=K8Ev9AfJ,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2020-02-24T14:21:14.995+0000) > > Yasuo fizz talon dianna cassio kassadin are the best mid laners right now play with them He is yasuo main who doesnt want to play yasuo, at least for now...
: Not at all, this can easily make the jhin player chose to go for a diffirent target because he thinks the enemy is out of his range. What you do here is basically admit that you guys have a bugged interaction and consider it a win win for everyone. Players dont like bugs. One would think that recent outrages about 76 and WC3 Reforged showed that to companies enough, but nope... appearantly not.
> [{quoted}](name=Kpt JUDr Danko,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AEwWdEsY,comment-id=002400070008,timestamp=2020-02-24T13:51:36.748+0000) > > Not at all, this can easily make the jhin player chose to go for a diffirent target because he thinks the enemy is out of his range. What you do here is basically admit that you guys have a bugged interaction and consider it a win win for everyone. > Players dont like bugs. One would think that recent outrages about 76 and WC3 Reforged showed that to companies enough, but nope... appearantly not. Necrology...
Magikrap (NA)
: Fiora is a champion that should not be viable, ever.
She doesnt win Lane automatically. She can be played safe and win throught scaling but that wont win you your lane. In early she has to fight ONLY in favorable situations, Is easily punishable por mistakes and isnt oppressive as other duelists that slay you every time you do even slight mistake. Last but not least, before she has at least second item, she doesnt that much from true dmg And that she does true dmg doesnt mean that she does a lot of dmg.
: Who do you think the best tank is?
I think that the best tank was {{champion:223}} at his prime. We all know why :D
: Choosing a Champion to defend you in a court of law
{{champion:10}} Why not to have judge herself as your defender? :D Isnt it literally bribing?
: Scariest FED champion
{{champion:23}} NO FKIN ONE IS SCARIER THAN THIS UNKILLABLE SH;T! Also {{champion:10}} and {{champion:119}} are pretty scary... But no champ mentioned in this thread beats trynda in dreadness when fed. You all forgot him? I see lot of you mention kassa, but he isnt nowhere OP as half the roaster. With many toplaners I dont even have to have half the kills he has when I have the same farm to beat him. He is somewhat broken with his perma flash ult but he doesnt have that high numbers. I really dont get what ppl see on him...
: > [{quoted}](name=Romuva,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AfWMX62B,comment-id=000400010000,timestamp=2020-02-23T13:46:27.694+0000) > > Its troll because {{champion:92}} isnt in anyway weak. She's actually broken if you what you are doing. https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/winrates-by-xp Riven is 107/148 in winrate for people with 50+ games. As a champion who takes a lot of practice, this should _**not**_ be the case. Someone who knows what they're doing with her, is still in the last 1/3rd of champion onetricks. But yeah she aint weak at all rn.
> [{quoted}](name=Parallelity,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AfWMX62B,comment-id=0004000100000000,timestamp=2020-02-23T17:49:59.047+0000) > > https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/winrates-by-xp > > Riven is 107/148 in winrate for people with 50+ games. As a champion who takes a lot of practice, this should _**not**_ be the case. Someone who knows what they're doing with her, is still in the last 1/3rd of champion onetricks. But yeah she aint weak at all rn. Actually this **should** be the case for champion that takes a lot of practice... Also, she loses a lot just because she use a lot her stats alone to crush the opponent but since she is not supposed to be statstick champ, she doesnt have that high stats that she requires in certain matchups. What I want to say that for exmaple Fiora almost doesnt have any true counter. She has lot of hard matchups but there arent that many champions that lowers her WR but isnt because of that broken af.
: "opressive" ok
And how do you call champ that completely deny your existence for the rest of the game just because of single mistake? I have played her myself and if noob like me can manage to abuse her oppressive like playstyle then there is something really wrong, especially when she is in good hands...
: Can we get riven buffs?
Maybe some deff buff on the expense on dmg. She is too oppressive to get any random buffs.
: Ahri is such an ugly champion
> [{quoted}](name=Akali is SO HOT,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=O7UBNxcb,comment-id=,timestamp=2020-02-22T07:09:11.096+0000) > > I can't believe someone would create such an ugly champion wow That nickname :D
: > [{quoted}](name=BiriLeazor,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9xvrjdEG,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2020-02-22T14:08:25.906+0000) > > I'll say this to you. If you don't play her for sure is that you cant play her and don't know how to. Most of people is like that. Try to play her, try to learn how to play with her , then we can talk, don't say that she's fking op when she's actually trash if you don't know how to play her. Akali have ez counters, just play with a team with a lot of CC and she's dead, etc. Akali after that nerf is = to nothing, people that play her know that when she got the "point click" ult now she's trash. you can't make plays that used to do. And you saying "no i play agaisnt her, she is pure aids" dude that's because you are bad. its true, you can easily win a lane vs her. Don't give me that shit. akali smells like poop and your essay means nothing to me
Because of players like you is the whole game mess right now...
2gudaiya (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LbGjJaAE,comment-id=000300000000000100000000,timestamp=2020-02-21T21:58:22.524+0000) > > I am writting this for sec time... First of all. HER R is too much of gamebreaking and no one else posses such gamebreaking spells from AD assassins and even mages have hard time comparing with her, The only one that is as gamebreaking is fizz, not akali. Calling this non akali's situation is quite narrowminded and hypocritical, just biased. If you were at least halfway as smart as you make me look, then you would know that the most broken thing for assassins is free pass to do dmg and that is exactly what she has thanks to her R. You talk about her R as if it was easy to dodge and had lot of free space to position so that she wont knock you to wall, which is not the case. Its already easier to sidestep morde's E and unless he gets baited to the other side or he just miss his spell then its almost impossible to sidestep. Her R is aoe instacast, not just some skillshot. Moreover her kit is point and click with Q stuns included. From all AD assassin, only pyke and noc have stuns and both of them require heavy set up unlike qiyana, which is the thing I am refering to alongside of her R. Honestly, what you say is laughable, since you are calling me out for things I am just "supposed" to say as some third rate thinker while not even considering how balance works and how numbers works. Really, her R is too big to be outplayed by positioning. You dont have so much free space... Nor it is dodgeable. You can bypass whole champ beforehand and "dodge" this way but this is not really dodge as react to something but just predict ( If you miss that spell, its you who is bad. not enemy who is good...). https://youtu.be/L6rAzcY__T4?t=28 > > Please, restrain from talking about game with such arguments and narrowminded view of game. you're unskilled, it's ok. dude posts the aoe of the wall like bruh we've already seen it get crossed with 2 taliyah walls and a j4 ult to cover literally half the map with explosions. leader must have done that vid, you can search it yourself.
> [{quoted}](name=2gudaiya,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LbGjJaAE,comment-id=0003000000000001000000000000,timestamp=2020-02-22T03:55:52.905+0000) > > you're unskilled, it's ok. > dude posts the aoe of the wall like bruh we've already seen it get crossed with 2 taliyah walls and a j4 ult to cover literally half the map with explosions. > leader must have done that vid, you can search it yourself. Thats all you can say, just some simple discard of someone else's argument and insults without any proper explanation... I posted that vid to fkin show you how big her R range really is. You just fkin say, dont fkin stay near walls when it really doesnt fkin matter. GOT IT? I am just proving invalidity of your arguments. You just suck something from fingers and think that its wisdom itself when it just random sh;t that doesnt even give any sense... Like: >this isn't an akali situation where "yes she shouldn't have true stealth" >there are assassins on this map that have untargettability, there are assassins with resets, there are assassins with blinks ffs, there are assassins with aoe, and cc, cc which btw is far less situational than being thrown into a wall, >so, seeing as you have such an elite thought process to the game, why should the easiest to dodge ultimate get nerfed? >you why the easiest to dodge ultimate in the game is such a mare for your elite wired brain to dodge? is it because qiyana had to use HER WHOLE KIT to land the move on you?
: adc sucks
I have the same feeling but other way round when enemy bot get 4/0 in first 7 minutes.
2gudaiya (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LbGjJaAE,comment-id=0003000000000001,timestamp=2020-02-21T13:30:07.590+0000) > > Eh? Did I complain that she is hard to beat? No. I said that she has mechanics she should not posses, not that she is overall strong... ( my Fiora and Rengar are stronger ) Second, to suggest my whole way of thinkig just from sentence representing just final results from my way of thinking. Thats equal to saing that I had easy math exercise if answer is "3"... THATS FLAWED THINKING! And I didnt say that she shouldnt exist, its just her point and click mechanics... Dont talk about "flawed thinking" with "flawed thinking"... Thats disgusting. Really look at your own backyard first before you start lecture. Last but not least, you even GENERALIZED your own opinion, thats another dumb sh;t. > > In summary, you talk about sh;t I didnt write. Talking about sh;t I didnt write. Judging my "flawed thinking" with your "flawed thinking" and generalizing your opinion that something is flawed without anything backing it. Not even analogy, nothing. And you even go and insult me: > > My thinking is way more complex than what you can comprehend. That you can not even predict such think that I wont write whole thesis as to why I am right says something about yourself. Even balance is uncertain, but there are acceptable limits "from , to" by overall you can acknowledge or set first ( in comparison with one another ). So by this logic there is a lot of champions that are actually well balanced while champions like Qiyana are not. what mechanics should she not possess? this isn't an akali situation where "yes she shouldn't have true stealth" so give me one mechanic being removed that doesn't absolutely gutter the champion. the champion is what the champion is. there are assassins on this map that have untargettability, there are assassins with resets, there are assassins with blinks ffs, there are assassins with aoe, and cc, cc which btw is far less situational than being thrown into a wall, you would think players would wise up and just not stand near them. heck one of the assassins even has permastealth, a few of them have range of all the preposterous things, and none of them has these mechanics in isolation. what makes qiyana different? because all her effects lead from her Q? the champion cannot stun you and stealth it up at the same time a decision has to be made to do either or. likewise the decision is yours as to how close to that wall you're gonna get, cause ofc all complaints are about the easiest to counter ultimate in the game. so, seeing as you have such an elite thought process to the game, why should the easiest to dodge ultimate get nerfed? i already know you're gonna say "the aoe stun with the max health dmg must be nerfed" so i'm asking you why the easiest to dodge ultimate in the game is such a mare for your elite wired brain to dodge? is it because qiyana had to use HER WHOLE KIT to land the move on you?
> [{quoted}](name=2gudaiya,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LbGjJaAE,comment-id=00030000000000010000,timestamp=2020-02-21T16:36:40.246+0000) > > what mechanics should she not possess? > this isn't an akali situation where "yes she shouldn't have true stealth" so give me one mechanic being removed that doesn't absolutely gutter the champion. > the champion is what the champion is. > there are assassins on this map that have untargettability, there are assassins with resets, there are assassins with blinks ffs, there are assassins with aoe, and cc, cc which btw is far less situational than being thrown into a wall, you would think players would wise up and just not stand near them. > heck one of the assassins even has permastealth, a few of them have range of all the preposterous things, and none of them has these mechanics in isolation. > what makes qiyana different? because all her effects lead from her Q? > the champion cannot stun you and stealth it up at the same time a decision has to be made to do either or. > likewise the decision is yours as to how close to that wall you're gonna get, cause ofc all complaints are about the easiest to counter ultimate in the game. > > so, seeing as you have such an elite thought process to the game, why should the easiest to dodge ultimate get nerfed? > i already know you're gonna say "the aoe stun with the max health dmg must be nerfed" so i'm asking you why the easiest to dodge ultimate in the game is such a mare for your elite wired brain to dodge? > is it because qiyana had to use HER WHOLE KIT to land the move on you? I am writting this for sec time... First of all. HER R is too much of gamebreaking and no one else posses such gamebreaking spells from AD assassins and even mages have hard time comparing with her, The only one that is as gamebreaking is fizz, not akali. Calling this non akali's situation is quite narrowminded and hypocritical, just biased. If you were at least halfway as smart as you make me look, then you would know that the most broken thing for assassins is free pass to do dmg and that is exactly what she has thanks to her R. You talk about her R as if it was easy to dodge and had lot of free space to position so that she wont knock you to wall, which is not the case. Its already easier to sidestep morde's E and unless he gets baited to the other side or he just miss his spell then its almost impossible to sidestep. Her R is aoe instacast, not just some skillshot. Moreover her kit is point and click with Q stuns included. From all AD assassin, only pyke and noc have stuns and both of them require heavy set up unlike qiyana, which is the thing I am refering to alongside of her R. Honestly, what you say is laughable, since you are calling me out for things I am just "supposed" to say as some third rate thinker while not even considering how balance works and how numbers works. Really, her R is too big to be outplayed by positioning. You dont have so much free space... Nor it is dodgeable. You can bypass whole champ beforehand and "dodge" this way but this is not really dodge as react to something but just predict ( If you miss that spell, its you who is bad. not enemy who is good...). https://youtu.be/L6rAzcY__T4?t=28 Please, restrain from talking about game with such arguments and narrowminded view of game.
Saezio (EUNE)
: Read what I said again. I already told you Maw isn't a bad item. But you only complete it as LAST ITEM. You make the hex around 1,5-2,5 items and you only complete it as LAST ITEM. SAME with scimitar. You sit on the QSS until 6 items and then you complete it.
Ok, fine. I read it wrongly as "Maw IS bad", sry.
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LbGjJaAE,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2020-02-21T14:30:48.901+0000) > > I think that its not about whether she is OP or not but what makes her OP. That she has something assassins as class shouldnt have by commonly acknowledged norm, since it gives her too much of gameplay advantage in comparison to assassins that are "balanced" around this so called norm. Btw, you cant go support like you cant catch him and kill him or you cant beat him? Well all assassins need something that make them stand out otherwise they are just a Talon without wall hops. Qiyana's is teamfights based abilities which is different from most assassin's but still has counterplay
> [{quoted}](name=BrokenRayquaza,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LbGjJaAE,comment-id=000500000000,timestamp=2020-02-21T19:03:12.703+0000) > > Well all assassins need something that make them stand out otherwise they are just a Talon without wall hops. Qiyana's is teamfights based abilities which is different from most assassin's but still has counterplay But her ult is too far out of line, if it was just knockback then its OK, but it is also stun and her spells are point and click without any set up as OP mentioned. Thats not something needed to be different from Talon. And when it comes to counterplay, I am not sure about it since all I know so far is that the way goes through macro management instead of micro. I honestly dont think that she has "counterplay" as counterplay refers to pressing against her mechanics weaknesses in micro management. If anything, she is outplayable and doesnt have big stats, but that is not counterplay. Well, I dont play against her on lane so I know a sh;t in comparison to toplaners so I shouldnt talk about match up against her, not is what I say necessarily even close to being truth.
Saezio (EUNE)
: MAW isn't bad. It's just that the gold investment isn't worth it for HOW MUCH BETTER it is compared to Hexdrinker. Also, since you most likely want to deal damage, you buy the drinker and keep on with the more offensive itemisation. It's 2k gold you spent into the passive basically. (sure you get 15 MR and 25 AD but that's no reason to give 2k gold) So, most of the people buy hex and then sit on it and only complete maw as 5th or 6th item. Because of how good hex is and how valuable it is to hit powerspikes (maw is not a powerspike so you don't want to sink 2k gold into it 99% of the time)
Do you also see those 20 additional ad, 10% spellvamp and 10% lifesteal? Do you see how much MR you gain that you dont have spent sigle item slot on DEF item? Do you see the comparison to other items? If there is more cost efficient item that is also overall stronger, fine. But what should I take into full build if not the strongest item? The most cost efficient item? Well that kind of item may not even fit my champ... If tank items are more gold efficient should I build full tank Rengar or Fiora? You know, when it comes to Fiora, the most optimal build is full AD, but if I build full ad then I am no different than ADC with just 0,75 sec of invulnerability with quite good lifesteal. So, I have to sacrifice as low DMG as possible for as much def as possible and that is by buying Sterak Dary's item and Maw or GA with Scimitar if I want to focus on survivability. I already showed you those certain builds of mine, with highest stats possible, when we favor AD.
: Well here comes the downvotes but here's my opinion Personally I just think qiyana is strong. Not op or broken but strong. She has a lot of counterplay that most assassin's don't have. First off, like you mentioned, a common way argument on her counterplay is don't stand near walls. I agree, her ulti (like most assassin's) is a ton of her burst, especially late game and also stuns you for a decent amount of time. You compared this to leblancs e, which takes at least 1.5 seconds to root, you said this was counterplay, even though the tether is too long for you to flash out of and even too long to flash then dash out of for most champs. I still think this is fair for her though as that ability is tough to hit but let me ask you. Is being stunned because you were near a wall and being hit by a full spell rotation any different than being rooted because you were semi close to a champion and being blown to smithereens? Especially because her ability is on her ulti and leblanc is on her e. You do have a fair point about her e q combo though. However something to note is most qiyana players only use this combo for a needed fast kill as it does significantly less damage than her e cancel auto into q, which takes like 1 more second to do and gives you an extra 500 or so damage late game. Her ulti does way too much damage. Us qiyana players want more damage into out other abilities because so much of our burst later on is our ulti we literally can't 1v1 a support if we don't have it and that's kinda dumb. Take 20% ratio off her ulti and give it to 10% in her q and 10% into her e and we have a deal my friend, the only issue with her now is her wonky numbers
> [{quoted}](name=BrokenRayquaza,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LbGjJaAE,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2020-02-21T13:59:00.449+0000) > > Well here comes the downvotes but here's my opinion > > Personally I just think qiyana is strong. Not op or broken but strong. She has a lot of counterplay that most assassin's don't have. First off, like you mentioned, a common way argument on her counterplay is don't stand near walls. I agree, her ulti (like most assassin's) is a ton of her burst, especially late game and also stuns you for a decent amount of time. You compared this to leblancs e, which takes at least 1.5 seconds to root, you said this was counterplay, even though the tether is too long for you to flash out of and even too long to flash then dash out of for most champs. I still think this is fair for her though as that ability is tough to hit but let me ask you. Is being stunned because you were near a wall and being hit by a full spell rotation any different than being rooted because you were semi close to a champion and being blown to smithereens? Especially because her ability is on her ulti and leblanc is on her e. > > You do have a fair point about her e q combo though. However something to note is most qiyana players only use this combo for a needed fast kill as it does significantly less damage than her e cancel auto into q, which takes like 1 more second to do and gives you an extra 500 or so damage late game. > > Her ulti does way too much damage. Us qiyana players want more damage into out other abilities because so much of our burst later on is our ulti we literally can't 1v1 a support if we don't have it and that's kinda dumb. Take 20% ratio off her ulti and give it to 10% in her q and 10% into her e and we have a deal my friend, the only issue with her now is her wonky numbers I think that its not about whether she is OP or not but what makes her OP. That she has something assassins as class shouldnt have by commonly acknowledged norm, since it gives her too much of gameplay advantage in comparison to assassins that are "balanced" around this so called norm. Btw, you cant go support like you cant catch him and kill him or you cant beat him?
: Lol everytime i play her, i'm useless and i always lack of damage. The worst is when my opponent goes armor, i end up being an Ulti bot because all the others abilities have 0 dmg. I don't understand the Q spell, sometimes it's goes trought minions, sometimes not... The W is just a dash for me... I try to use the passive but it's not that useful... The E is a dash with some dmg. I understand you must use EQ. And i hate the ultimate, i think it's hard to place in lane. Making Qiyana useless in lane, she must teamfight in jungle. But i agree, the ultimate deals so much dmg with this big CC but the rest of her kit deals so low when you are not feed. If she is nerfed, then i will have a 0% win rate with her lol. Most of the games i play with her are games where i get carried by my team because i'm so useless with her. She may be point and click but she is hard to play honestly.
> [{quoted}](name=StormBladeMaster,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LbGjJaAE,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2020-02-21T11:38:27.257+0000) > > Lol everytime i play her, i'm useless and i always lack of damage. The worst is when my opponent goes armor, i end up being an Ulti bot because all the others abilities have 0 dmg. > > I don't understand the Q spell, sometimes it's goes trought minions, sometimes not... > > The W is just a dash for me... I try to use the passive but it's not that useful... > > The E is a dash with some dmg. I understand you must use EQ. > > > And i hate the ultimate, i think it's hard to place in lane. Making Qiyana useless in lane, she must teamfight in jungle. > > But i agree, the ultimate deals so much dmg with this big CC but the rest of her kit deals so low when you are not feed. > > If she is nerfed, then i will have a 0% win rate with her lol. Most of the games i play with her are games where i get carried by my team because i'm so useless with her. She may be point and click but she is hard to play honestly. The same goes with my playing tryndamere, since I am more familiar with more dynamic champions like Fiora, Rengar, Kayn and etc.
2gudaiya (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LbGjJaAE,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2020-02-21T10:40:21.925+0000) > > This is not just b;tching its pointing out something that shouldnt exist no matter how many champions sh;t on her. what a flawed way of thinking. so which champions should exist? i can very easily take your logic and say none of them should exist. you're very upset by a champion that is not even hard to beat, renekton is still harder to beat than qiyana but no one complains about renekton for some reason. please don't come here trying to sound legitimate when you're just butthurt you got outskilled.
> [{quoted}](name=2gudaiya,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LbGjJaAE,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2020-02-21T10:49:42.083+0000) > > what a flawed way of thinking. > so which champions should exist? i can very easily take your logic and say none of them should exist. > you're very upset by a champion that is not even hard to beat, renekton is still harder to beat than qiyana but no one complains about renekton for some reason. > please don't come here trying to sound legitimate when you're just butthurt you got outskilled. Eh? Did I complain that she is hard to beat? No. I said that she has mechanics she should not posses, not that she is overall strong... ( my Fiora and Rengar are stronger ) Second, to suggest my whole way of thinkig just from sentence representing just final results from my way of thinking. Thats equal to saing that I had easy math exercise if answer is "3"... THATS FLAWED THINKING! And I didnt say that she shouldnt exist, its just her point and click mechanics... Dont talk about "flawed thinking" with "flawed thinking"... Thats disgusting. Really look at your own backyard first before you start lecture. Last but not least, you even GENERALIZED your own opinion, thats another dumb sh;t. In summary, you talk about sh;t I didnt write. Talking about sh;t I didnt write. Judging my "flawed thinking" with your "flawed thinking" and generalizing your opinion that something is flawed without anything backing it. Not even analogy, nothing. And you even go and insult me: > legitimate when you're just butthurt you got outskilled. My thinking is way more complex than what you can comprehend. That you can not even predict such think that I wont write whole thesis as to why I am right says something about yourself. Even balance is uncertain, but there are acceptable limits "from , to" by overall you can acknowledge or set first ( in comparison with one another ). So by this logic there is a lot of champions that are actually well balanced while champions like Qiyana are not.
2gudaiya (NA)
: this is just gonna be a thread for people to bitch and complain, meanwhile 45% irelia beats qiyana handily.
> [{quoted}](name=2gudaiya,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LbGjJaAE,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2020-02-21T10:37:35.220+0000) > > this is just gonna be a thread for people to bitch and complain, meanwhile 45% irelia beats qiyana handily. This is not just b;tching its pointing out something that shouldnt exist no matter how many champions sh;t on her.
IMelchorI (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0fH6mAKt,comment-id=00030000000000000001,timestamp=2020-02-21T05:53:09.921+0000) > > You are telling me that this: > EMPOWERED BASIC ATTACK DAMAGE RATIO 0.4 attack damage ⇒ 0.5 attack damage > W - Courage > newBLOOD OF MY ENEMIES At max resistances from enemy kills, Garen increases his bonus armor and magic resist by 10% > SHIELD 0.1 maximum health ⇒ 70/95/120/145/170 (+0.2 bonus health) > > ...is god damn nerf? Are you alright? Showing 3 out of 6 item where only 2 of them dont give AD while saying: "the ad buff only becomes strong if you build ad items like the shield buff only becomes strong when you build health and is even a nerf when you only build attack speed items. the resistance buff only increases bonus resist." Are you really dumb or just pretending? Garen also build AD, that buff does not lower his dmg in comparison to previous patches and he also gets free bonus armor and mr from passive and can get another from runes... Really, get your sh;t together. Its because of players like you that others are toxic AF, while also big part of those aggressors are ppl like you claiming to be above others then flaming af and making another toxic ppl out of ppl that dont mind carrying such ppl like you, who cant even tell what is actual NERF and what is just pilling numbers... quote me on the fact that i said it is a nerf. the only nerf to the attack speed build is the w shield value at early levels because you have about 50 points less shield if you build attack speed items and no more health than trinity force. i said these buffs do not impact garens strongest builds by more than a tiny bit and all improve garens weaker builds. at no time did i say they are a nerf overall. garen did not have 50% winrate with his bruiser builds before this patch because they were weaker than the attack speed builds. if you imagine that everyone would have built bruiser items on garen then he would have like 46% winrate or something like that. now they buffed the bruiser build so they are just as strong as the attack speed build. the three core items are most important because more games only go until you have your first three big items than the ones that go longer and allow to build one or two more items.
Garen on lvl 3 has 743.9 Hp base HP and if he has health rune then he has 19,41 additional Hp(763,31). He gets 74 on rank 1 now and would get 76 before. Wow 2 units shield difference. The biggest difference in on lvl 12 where you have other spells maxed while also having W on 1st rank. From then on you are tankier and tankier in comparison resulting in being even tankier than before no matter whether you go bruiser or full tank. >the ad buff only becomes strong if you build ad items like the shield buff only becomes strong when you build health and is even a nerf when you only build attack speed items. the resistance buff only increases bonus resist. Even if you build full AS build with just trinity giving HP, then you would still end up tankier in comparison to previous patch when you hit max rank on W. Beside all of this. HE also got DMG buff, which is way more significant than nerf you have on that lvl 12.
McDaddy (NA)
: Let's talk about Qiyana
In summary, she has good dmg and also stun from point and click abilities combined with aoe point and click stun stacking even more dmg. She also have good CDs to have all this deserved with good escape on top of all. Pretty much sounds like assassin version of garen with more CC instead of durability and another adjustements suitable for assassin.
: What does RIOT have against Jarvan IV? Worst shield in game.
Depends his strength a lot on his shield? I mean, is he weak overall? Is there space for buff into his kit? Regardless of it being shield or dmg... Does he deserve to have stronger shield? Its it where he should receive buff?
: Balancing Executes (looking at you Pyke)
You know who shouldnt have exsecute at all, let alone refresh on it? DARIUS Fkin full tank oppressive champ who kills you on combo just because of god damn execute and high numbers right from the start. I have to completely crush darius who does mistakes or just avoid contact with him until I gain enough dmg to kill him before he stacks his passive. ( this goes with all toplaners) His WR isnt insane just because this is teamgame and there exists lot of good team comps that can win over 5 soloQ god champions but only in good teamplay and because some champions have their weaknesses based on such situation.
: The eternal hate on eternals.
One of the Reasons Is that you have to pay for it which Is greedy as fk.
IMelchorI (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0fH6mAKt,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2020-02-20T17:42:50.196+0000) > > The hell is this logic? As if you wanted to say that his W buff made his full dmg version weaker... No, it just means that there might be even stronger version that benefit from the buff more than the full dmg version while the full dmg version also benefits off of it... The same goes with jungle buffs. That ppl know how to take care of so primitive champions does not mean that he is weak, that means that those playing him doesnt know how to deal with such ppl. Cmon guys, learn how to use your brains, they arent meant for show... the attack speed build does not benefit from the buffs today or only very little. the strongest and most popular build for garen before this patch was {{item:3078}} {{item:3006}} {{item:3046}} this build has very little to no ad, health or resistances. the ad buff only becomes strong if you build ad items like {{item:3071}} {{item:3053}} the shield buff only becomes strong when you build health and is even a nerf when you only build attack speed items. the resistance buff only increases bonus resist. without tank items it can increase attack speed garens armor and magic resistance by 3 to 4 and not more. with a below 50% win rate and low pick rate ad diamond there was enough room even for a tiny buff like this to his attack speed build so his bruiser/tanky builds could be buffed to be as good as the attack speed build.
You are telling me that this: >Q - Decisive Strike EMPOWERED BASIC ATTACK DAMAGE RATIO 0.4 attack damage ⇒ 0.5 attack damage W - Courage newBLOOD OF MY ENEMIES At max resistances from enemy kills, Garen increases his bonus armor and magic resist by 10% SHIELD 0.1 maximum health ⇒ 70/95/120/145/170 (+0.2 bonus health) ...is god damn nerf? Are you alright? Showing 3 out of 6 item where only 2 of them dont give AD while saying: "the ad buff only becomes strong if you build ad items like the shield buff only becomes strong when you build health and is even a nerf when you only build attack speed items. the resistance buff only increases bonus resist." Are you really dumb or just pretending? Garen also build AD, that buff does not lower his dmg in comparison to previous patches and he also gets free bonus armor and mr from passive and can get another from runes... Really, get your sh;t together. Its because of players like you that others are toxic AF, while also big part of those aggressors are ppl like you claiming to be above others then flaming af and making another toxic ppl out of ppl that dont mind carrying such ppl like you, who cant even tell what is actual NERF and what is just pilling numbers...
Sylaelque (EUW)
: Garen Jungle
Garen was already top tier secret pick into jg during JG karthus meta. He countered him so well and didnt have any problem with jungler's main job.
IMelchorI (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Tentaku,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0fH6mAKt,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2020-02-20T17:24:01.016+0000) > > He recieved 3 other significant buffs that patch ( more damage, more shield, more res ). > > I'd say that I didn't see a quadruple buff going wrong, but well, I did. they are all independent from each other. the jungle buff increases his clear speed and the ability buffs do not become active before he has some items that give ad, health and has his w passive stacked. the buffs to his abilities also buff his tanker builds and his lategame. before those buffs garen had below 50% winrate and a low pick rate in diamond.
The hell is this logic? As if you wanted to say that his W buff made his full dmg version weaker... No, it just means that there might be even stronger version that benefit from the buff more than the full dmg version while the full dmg version also benefits off of it... The same goes with jungle buffs. That ppl know how to take care of so primitive champions does not mean that he is weak, that means that those playing him doesnt know how to deal with such ppl. Cmon guys, learn how to use your brains, they arent meant for show...
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=oJdWk7ye,comment-id=0003000000010000,timestamp=2020-02-20T12:53:26.848+0000) > > So, you want to tell me that maw isnt good item because you can't change your mind halfway building it? Or that it Is bad item just because and require hexdrinker on of of it. Either way, Its really good item with huge stats and good passives giving shield and additional stats. Usually when player buys hexdrinker then he already knows whether he Is gonna build maw or not... There are few items in game that are comparable or better ( In term of ad items. Ap items are stupid joke when it comes to stats and cost efficiency...) No. Maw itself is not as good, not as efficient, as the item that it builds from. It wasn't even good before it was nerfed, and now it's worse. It exists so that something may be built from hexdrinker, basically. We build it when we must, otherwise it's not a particularly good item. It DOESN'T have "huge stats". It's sub par for AD **AND** MR. The reason why the completion is delayed used to be because the shield scaled with HP anyway. And now it is delayed, because, it's just not that great, and if the game goes differently then the player might even consider selling the hexdrinker late game. The player buys hexdrinker HOPING that he will NOT need to finish the item. Hexdrinker is %102 gold efficient on stats alone. Maw is <%90 gold efficient on stats alone. Maw is a relatively bad item. At lvl 18, the Hexdrinker shield is %80 as strong as the Maw shield (which is the main reason for buying the item). Yet the item costs less than half as much. Now, I haven't tested this, but what SHOULD happen, when wearing Maw and PD, is that if the triggering damage is physical, then the PD shield goes off, but with LIFEGRIP. And if the damage is Magic, the PD shield should go off, with LIFEGRIP, and then, after 2s it should be reduced to 350 if it has not been spent below 250 yet. The Steraks - PD combination is also possible, but Steraks has the shorter CD, and is usually easier to proc, AND the stronger Shield. Steraks / Maw would give you LIFEGRIP on the Steraks LIFELINE, which is probably how that will go down.
You are telling me that item that gives 50 MR when highest amount given by any tank item is 60 ( 80 stoneplate) with 50 MR and 10% cdr with Shield and 20 additional AD (70 total) with 10% spell vamp and 10% lifesteal is sub par for AD and MR? Its subpar to what? To 2 fkin black cleavers or what? Its as good as Sterak Dary's item but with adjustments. Its way better than some spirit visage when it comes to bruisers vs AP dealers. That there are ppl like you who see stats selectively like, it gives 50 MR and then 50 AD as if separately ( not even counting the passive which has 2 part ) doesnt make it weak item. That only means that your itemization skills are bad. There is list of top AD items for pure stats: {{item:3071}} {{item:3053}} {{item:3812}} {{item:3814}} {{item:3156}} {{item:3095}} ({{item:3181}} too niche) Honorable mention: {{item:3153}} {{item:3124}} {{item:3004}} which require synergy with champion or with other items ( which means that power of this items may differ heavily from champ to champ since some of them cant make use of them so well...)
Bultz (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Eedat,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Ar5EeARr,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2020-02-20T02:17:44.727+0000) > > Still a top tier top laner even with the nerf. Sorry he isn't the freelo you want him to be anymore Says the dude playing champions that Sett was beating.
Sett is stupid ball of numbers just like garen. That there are players that know how to beat someone like sett with weaker champion doesnt fkin mean that Sett is also weak :D Garen is also stupidly strong but almost everyone know how to play against him, thats why he doesnt have so high success despite being one of strongest champions. That you dont have kit without any possible weaknesses doesnt mean that you are weak, that means that you should play around your strong points and be aware of your weaknesses.
Powwer69 (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Posui Gart,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=69mRabEW,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2020-02-20T12:42:13.255+0000) > > A nerf isn't a restriction. A nerf is what someone gets if that someone has 56+% winrate with quite a huge pickrate, promotes non-interactive gameplay and all that in fucking Master+ elo You're saying that making spells cost more, unless they're in bot lane isn't a restriction? Its not a nerf for the people who play how "they" want you to play.
> [{quoted}](name=Powwer69,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=69mRabEW,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2020-02-20T12:45:42.009+0000) > > You're saying that making spells cost more, unless they're in bot lane isn't a restriction? Its not a nerf for the people who play how "they" want you to play. They arent meant " Th fk you want here?" they mean "Try harder a bit if you want to play her, at least as hard as your opponents."
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=oJdWk7ye,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2020-02-18T15:58:01.135+0000) > > Even if Maw didnt give that shield, its still good item, so that you have PD already doesnt matter that much. Maw isn't actually a good item. One who must make hexdrinker is generally advised to hold that item and complete Maw last.
So, you want to tell me that maw isnt good item because you can't change your mind halfway building it? Or that it Is bad item just because and require hexdrinker on of of it. Either way, Its really good item with huge stats and good passives giving shield and additional stats. Usually when player buys hexdrinker then he already knows whether he Is gonna build maw or not... There are few items in game that are comparable or better ( In term of ad items. Ap items are stupid joke when it comes to stats and cost efficiency...)
: I think it could be an interessting, fun and unique kit but there is one main issue i see if you change his W to a spell like old rek'sai ultimate he would be abused by high elo players you could see him as tf with his ult on a W, this would be very strong. But the rest sounds quite funny {{champion:17}}
I am glad that you like it :P. I dont know that thing with pro play but it wouldnt be as OP as TF's ult, since his pathholes can be set where they lead and from where. Like to some camps and some bushes. ( red buff, maybe raptors and tribushes )
: Darkin Skins theme suggestions
I dont think thats good idea as darkins arent so badass looking as they should. Tbh, when I first saw kayn, I was quite impressed but when I saw aatrox, the look wasnt so good. Tho, this is all just my own opinion since I had much higher expectations. Dont get me wrong, the design itself is good, its just that there is so much lacking when it comes to details (Horns, sword, chest and etc.). I think that if old VGU and new VGU was combined by someone reasonable and then upgraded then it would be awesome design, but that is not the case in current state ( still just my opinion). EDIT: Wait, I take back that with chest. I havent noticed this little update https://i.imgur.com/RjmYQYK.png But I still dislike the shape of his sword's tip and horns...
: I agree that our rework idea has problems but it appears to be a missleading thought of his W, we considered it more like a Corki W, Kai'sa E or Rek'sai W not as a global dash, only for a few hundred units. You could remove the attack speed bonus completely so he would only have the bonus damage on shrooms in this area and the camouflage (which will be interrupted like every other camouflage if he attacks, recalls or uses abilities) and you could extend the channeling time or extend the range of his camouflage detection radius. This all depends on how good it would be if you really would use this kit and you would need to test how good Teemo would be. I hope my answer satisfied you Have a nice day{{champion:17}}
> [{quoted}](name=Clankaempfer,realm=EUW,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=ki1YFBgs,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2020-02-19T18:21:10.672+0000) > > I agree that our rework idea has problems but it appears to be a missleading thought of his W, we considered it more like a Corki W, Kai'sa E or Rek'sai W not as a global dash, only for a few hundred units. > You could remove the attack speed bonus completely so he would only have the bonus damage on shrooms in this area and the camouflage (which will be interrupted like every other camouflage if he attacks, recalls or uses abilities) and you could extend the channeling time or extend the range of his camouflage detection radius. > > This all depends on how good it would be if you really would use this kit and you would need to test how good Teemo would be. > > I hope my answer satisfied you > Have a nice day{{champion:17}} Thanks for reply, but to be honest, the process of my thought was: "He is problematic pick who is problematic on the lane because he easily becomes too oppressive when viable" -> "lets move him to jg" -> "As a jungler, what would give him unique advantage in comparison to similar junglers like twitch, kept his character as "swift scount" and made him useful and efficient jungler?" -> "unique scount-like mobility in term of sneaking to desired places via path holes, just like hamsters do underground." It might be as well just a passive with W free to have something differen. It was just my own suggestion without response to your design. But still thanks for reading. What do you think about it?
: a few different kind of low elo mistakes i see all the time
Players should also know some special interactions even of other champions than their mains, in case of facing them...
BigFBear (EUW)
: This season it's way worse than in previous seasons imho. But this toxicity is generated by Riot itself. I play this game since Season 3. Although people complaining about the game every season I enjoyed it so far. But this season feels so frustrating. It just feels so coinflip and I kinda have 0 impact on my games. Idk if it's my champ (Voli) or my lane (jungler). I peaked Dia2 Promos in Season 9 and now I stuck in Plat4 with 47% winrate on 300 games. In Preseason I was Dia3 and climbing even with the jungle nerfs and now i can do what I want. Often I am Ace or MVP but that doesn't change a thing when you have a 0:6 top and a 3:12 botlane after 10 minutes. This is very frustrating and I can understand why people are in a bad mood and flame more. I started drawing again now and will try to play less games a week because i realized that i feel bad while playing this game. I am angry and frustrated and full of hate playing a game that usually gave me a fun time. That's not what a game should feel like. And I don't want to spend my free time being in a shit mood. Will be a challenge because I am fucking addicted to this shit.
> [{quoted}](name=BigFBear,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=k5K8IOh3,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2020-02-18T17:49:01.418+0000) > > This season it's way worse than in previous seasons imho. > But this toxicity is generated by Riot itself. > I play this game since Season 3. > Although people complaining about the game every season I enjoyed it so far. > But this season feels so frustrating. > It just feels so coinflip and I kinda have 0 impact on my games. > Idk if it's my champ (Voli) or my lane (jungler). > I peaked Dia2 Promos in Season 9 and now I stuck in Plat4 with 47% winrate on 300 games. > In Preseason I was Dia3 and climbing even with the jungle nerfs and now i can do what I want. Often I am Ace or MVP but that doesn't change a thing when you have a 0:6 top and a 3:12 botlane after 10 minutes. > This is very frustrating and I can understand why people are in a bad mood and flame more. > > I started drawing again now and will try to play less games a week because i realized that i feel bad while playing this game. I am angry and frustrated and full of hate playing a game that usually gave me a fun time. > That's not what a game should feel like. > And I don't want to spend my free time being in a shit mood. > Will be a challenge because I am fucking addicted to this shit. This is why I dont play rankeds... I had never played until I had a lot of argues with some ppl that if I was right on what I am saying and then I would be also good enough to climb out of silver, so they called me out that I am just noob who is just crying who is just crying and calling myself unlucky. So I decided to play few game just to get fkin 11 times out of first 15 games, trolls, feeders, cry babys, ppl that trow the game because of their gigantic ego while having 0/6, few afkers and really lot of noobs that deserve to be forever in wood division. ( 1/5 cass called me "KDA player" just because I had 6/0 while being busy stomping those who she just fed, to who she just handed over 5 kills. And those 5 kills werent from just any mistake under pressure. They were fkin clear INT.) One of those games I had sylas/zed who went afk because yasuo beat his ass, all of us had 0/2 or 0/3 and I remembered that someone once told me that I dont deserve to be in higher elo because I am too pessimistic ( when I was just talking about cases exactly like these... And that I get distracted while in reality I dont...) so I tried to be as cheerful as possible, I talked it out with team so that they wont surrender, thanks to my experience with Fiora I managed guide Fiora, almost single handedly turned whole 5v4 game and when we was about to win I went to get drake as cherry on cake and my team who could easily end it ( exactly it was caitlyn who was only one stubborn enough to pull whole team to the bottom via /ff command ): "Lol, we wanted to surrender and now we are winning." meanwhile whole team just throwed the game and gave enemy team second chance ( that was my first mistake, to count with my team). So, as I feared, enemy team used the second chance they got and started pulling the game in their favor and when I managed to pull it back to us I did second mistake and died on miscalculation ( not on throw, on miscalculation where I didnt foresaw something I couldnt even foresaw but could avoid if I did different choice which wasnt even that risky to begin with) and then they managed to end the game 5v3 as easily as if those 3 even werent in the game. The point I want to tell is that I did just 2 fkin mistakes that wouldnt happen if my team intentionally didnt throw and I got flamed by 9/11 fkin useless caitlyn, of all teammates it was that caitlyn that was whole game only useless and as only person and even tried to backfire everything, she flamed me, me 19/6 rengar who single handedly managed to turn whole game in our favor... I would also like to say that I hadnt played ranked because exactly of reasons ***BigFBear*** is talking about. If I am supposed to play with such trash even in high elo, whats the point of climbing then? Why should even hurt myself this much just for climbing to begin with and what do I really get for it? Why should I suffer so much? I will rather hold onto normals where I dont have to climb to at least sometime play with ppl from plat and low diamond and dont always have to carry this load of sh;t...
: This is such an dogshit argument, do you have any evidence? Of course not, its just classic “Its Asia, its bcs of them”, all while Asia is known to prefer strategic, slower games(PUBG, Starcraft, Dota). Not to talk about how op is wrong engage=win In current meta, will you survive being focused by 5 players? No. Should you? No. Ornn, Malph, Cho, Grag, Leo, Naut, Seju, Shen, Taric, Zac. All perfectly playable champs, if you are willing not to be carry. Boards... (Tencent owned majority of Riot since forever, what made them to push changes now?)
> [{quoted}](name=Jng Account,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EwilfJKq,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2020-02-18T06:10:10.463+0000) > > This is such an dogshit argument, do you have any evidence? Of course not, its just classic “Its Asia, its bcs of them”, all while Asia is known to prefer strategic, slower games(PUBG, Starcraft, Dota). > > Not to talk about how op is wrong > engage=win > In current meta, will you survive being focused by 5 players? No. Should you? No. > > Ornn, Malph, Cho, Grag, Leo, Naut, Seju, Shen, Taric, Zac. > > All perfectly playable champs, if you are willing not to be carry. > > Boards... > > (Tencent owned majority of Riot since forever, what made them to push changes now?) They are in no fkin way playing slower games :D. Those games length is probably long and have lot of those "peace before the Storm" situations but they are in no fk way played slowly... And btw, you can see on Wiki when Tencent bought LoL. Really interesting that thé date is overlapping with the time when lol started to fall down. Coincidence? Maybe, but I dont think so...
: maw/Steraks/PD is not necessarily poor itemization. They all have different conditions to proc Lifeline. When Lifeline procs for any one of them, they will all go on CD, BUT all of the different various secondary effects will also proc. One is wearing Steraks and PD, and if PD procs, not only does get the stronger shield (probably Steraks), but also Tenacity, etc
> [{quoted}](name=True Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=oJdWk7ye,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2020-02-18T11:12:21.964+0000) > > maw/Steraks/PD is not necessarily poor itemization. They all have different conditions to proc Lifeline. When Lifeline procs for any one of them, they will all go on CD, BUT all of the different various secondary effects will also proc. One is wearingS Steraks and PD, and if PD procs, not only does get the stronger shield (probably Steraks), but also Tenacity, etc Even if Maw didnt give that shield, its still good item, so that you have PD already doesnt matter that much.
: in silver i could probrably carry if 2 people went afk, imo if ur in silver its because you don't understand the game at all and need more games played, or your mechanics are the equivalent of a 90 year old trying to play league u dont need mechanics to get out of silver is what im trying to say
> [{quoted}](name=Summoner SpeII,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Gb84uPoA,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2020-02-18T06:19:33.220+0000) > > in silver i could probrably carry if 2 people went afk, imo if ur in silver its because you don't understand the game at all and need more games played, or your mechanics are the equivalent of a 90 year old trying to play league > > u dont need mechanics to get out of silver is what im trying to say In silver its sometime better when they go afk, they at least dont give enemy free gold...
: so exactly what the other guy did first and you just did right now? hmmmmmmm... weird.
> [{quoted}](name=JustA kleo,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=GdPpHJiQ,comment-id=00020000000000000000,timestamp=2020-02-18T05:24:37.241+0000) > > so exactly what the other guy did first and you just did right now? > hmmmmmmm... weird. Sry, I mistook his name with OP's name. Tbh, I also got 4 honors as 5/27 yasuo when we won.
: guess youre the type of player who still thinks that kills win games. you prob. go 7/3 and end up with 0 damage done to towers dragons inhibs and nexus and go "np for carry team"
> [{quoted}](name=JustA kleo,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=GdPpHJiQ,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2020-02-18T05:01:21.910+0000) > > guess youre the type of player who still thinks that kills win games. > you prob. go 7/3 and end up with 0 damage done to towers dragons inhibs and nexus and go "np for carry team" Guess that you are that type of person who judges others pursuant small fragments of information completed with imagination.
iiGazeii (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PYdmOGEV,comment-id=000000000000000000000000000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2020-02-17T12:14:51.013+0000) > > Ok, fine but now also tell me, why the hell are they so hard to gank when they have proper position and wave management? How many times you can just go and charge at them not risking tower shots... The logic I was talking about is: > > 1. You say that her strength is compensated heavily while in early game she has as "dmg support" big stats, while having very the same stats in lategame as every other adc... > 2. You say that she is immobile champion that has perma MS boost with long range... Range champions first of all are supposed to be totally immobile while she has MS boost. > > 3. Mistake is strong only in short trades early on, while she has bonus AD getting idk from where, has free dmg bonus via POKE so, those so called trades are irrelevant to her and has also tons of heals to sustain your dmg while you keep dying to her dmg. > 4. As I said, she has the very same dmg as other adcs... With Eon on top of it giving her extra safety. So, how the hell does she not scale so well as other adcs? Hmm? ( btw, Brand and Lux arent designed to win when no one has item, thats just side effect of balance...) > > 5. Listing champions that dont have anything to do with her kit directly just the fact that they create good 2v1 situation where the problem she has is common with every other champion that isnt hyper-mobile. The same goes for many other champions while they dont have any problem with those listed champions. In short, she this doesnt give her any unique trade off that she would deserve for what she has... Yet, thanks to her range she has quite safe position when it comes to ganking and that half sec bonus is more than enough combined with W which isnt suppossed to be good self peel when its clearly enough to shake off most of the ganks. > > For this: > > There is also quite nice summary of what I am trying to say: > From: ***Baby Ghoul*** > > Nothing you said is valid reason for Mistake to be such cancer... NOTHING. You are exaggerating everything Senna does to prove your point. Her damage is not the same as other ADCs. She has more burst, but lower sustained damage than a true marksman can deal due to her slow attacks and poor synergy with crit and attack speed items. Raw AD will only get you so far. Other marksman like Xayah, Kai'Sa, and Jinx can easily outdamage Senna. She gets bonus AD from stacks because she doesn't get it from levels. She gets zero AD from levelling up, so if she is forced to play passively and can't stack up, then she won't get AD. She doesn't do a ton of healing. The healing she provides to herself and her teammate is lower than what true enchanters like Soraka, Yuumi, and Nami can provide. Senna traded good heals for good autos, a source of damage that doesn't require mana. _She doesn't have a permanent movement speed boost._ When she attacks, she gets a small amount of bonus movement speed for 0.5 seconds. She's slightly faster for **half a second after an auto**. She's not running around faster than everyone, she just gets a small nudge so that her slow autos don't feel like garbage. Her E doesn't give her safety. The movement speed it provides isn't enough to escape a threat, and the cloak doesn't hide her when enemies are already in her face. She needs to use it preemptively to get out before danger has arrived. Plenty of long range champs have mobility tools. Caitlyn has her net to dash backwards. Ezreal has his blink. Jhin has his passive movement speed. The difference is that their mobility tools are on long cooldowns, conditional, or inconsistent. Senna's mobility definitely falls into this category. Your problem is that you have put Senna on a pedestal. You have blown everything she does out of proportion and have resolved yourself that she is broken regardless of the facts. Her damage and healing is NOT as good as other marksmen and enchanters. Her self-peel is weak, hinging on landing a single, slow skillshot and praying the enemy can't close the gap. If she is playing from long range and only poking with aa-Q combos, she won't get enough AD to be a threat in the lategame. Your logic is flawed because it is based on your caricature of Senna, rather than her actual numbers.
> My arguments are solid and rational, you've done nothing to disprove them other than say "You're wrong" and complain about Senna. Putting in smiley faces and using big words doesn't make you personable nor right. I'm done with you. You can continue to ignore Senna's weaknesses all you like, but I'm going to continue crushing her in lane. I have already done analysis of your arguments, pointed out what is wrong with them in detail and gave quite reasonable evidence to prove my truth ( and there cant be my truth alongside of your truth :D). They were not merely big words :-). You know, ever since I have hit mastery lvl 7 badge on Fiora, I havent lost almost any game against vayne. I have won every single game beside that one particular game because of which I will never say that Fiora can beat vayne in skill match up where both of them plays perfectly... It was on theoretical level as to how would that fight look like and what and who would do. Exactly that fight where no one fk up because he is "human who does mistakes" ( like, I mean it the way that we can argue on what would and who do without even caring whether it is mechanically possible since it clearly was, for both of us and none of us did stupid mistakes thats what I meant that "human...") because we both knew exactly what and how we should do everything and how it will look like if given condition is met ( I couldnt do much on lane but I won via macro and thanks to my team :D).
HideSide (EUNE)
: > [{quoted}](name=King Lego,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VpeczAu2,comment-id=000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2020-02-17T16:44:38.421+0000) > > As someone who took MMA, this is so cringe and piss poor. So much you have to say to that statement beside " CRiNge aNd PiSs pOoR." :D Now also tell me that you would beat someone aiming at you from few meters distance and even after taking 2 shots in the head you would keep fighting until you would beat his as s into pulp... So far, all you have said is meaningless and has nothing to do with topic as to why is zhonya such cancerous item. Just either unreasonable answers like saying its rainy day when I has you whats the time or irrational reasons that give no explanation as to why it isnt such cancer...
> [{quoted}](name=King Lego,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VpeczAu2,comment-id=00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2020-02-17T20:18:15.086+0000) > > Somebody hasn't seen Bollywood drama. > > "my awesome one shot combo got interrupted by Zhonya Hourglass! What a cancerous! Please nerf so I can do my combos without a counter!" > That's what you sound like and I'm the one who said something "meaningless"? > Please. If you want someone to agree with your "Zhonya is cancer" bullshit, then you're talking to the wrong person who ACTUALLY KNOWS how to use Zhonya and how to deal with Zhonya. If you want a ton of people to agree with you, make a thread of your own and go preach preach. I dont sound like: "my awesome one shot combo got interrupted by Zhonya Hourglass! What a cancerous! Please nerf so I can do my combos without a counter!" :D Thats your brain trying to act smart :D What I am saying is : " I got killed without even getting chance to fight back." You are the one crying that you get oneshotted by assassins, while assassins are only ones that can somehow deal with you in reasonable merits... I dont want you to agree with me :D I am merely arguing with you because I know I am in right and you cant say a sh;t and thus I want to show you what kind of sh;t you are spouting cuz you are not right. Simple... You are just pissing at other's heads and wondering why they hit you out of rage, while calling it a rain but raging yourself when someone dont give you candy for whatever the reason is. You are exactly like those sly sneaky insidious film characters that are calling out the justice when someone is just a little bit rude while happily murdering everyone they dont like. THATS YOU. I gave you more than enough reasons as to why is zhonya cancerous item. That your tiny brain is unable to comprehend it is not my problem. Your mind is too narrowminded to even discuss something seriously... Go discuss some cartoon with kids, thats your level of understanding. ( Characters there are evil for the sake of being evil, not so hard to comprehend for you.)
King Lego (EUNE)
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VpeczAu2,comment-id=00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2020-02-17T11:20:50.280+0000) > > What you say is the same as if I said that to have gun mma isnt advantage since I can shot myself... I can say it in Czech too if English isnt enough... As someone who took MMA, this is so cringe and piss poor.
> [{quoted}](name=King Lego,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VpeczAu2,comment-id=000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2020-02-17T16:44:38.421+0000) > > As someone who took MMA, this is so cringe and piss poor. So much you have to say to that statement beside " CRiNge aNd PiSs pOoR." :D Now also tell me that you would beat someone aiming at you from few meters distance and even after taking 2 shots in the head you would keep fighting until you would beat his as s into pulp... So far, all you have said is meaningless and has nothing to do with topic as to why is zhonya such cancerous item. Just either unreasonable answers like saying its rainy day when I has you whats the time or irrational reasons that give no explanation as to why it isnt such cancer...
iiGazeii (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PYdmOGEV,comment-id=000000000000000000000000000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2020-02-17T12:14:51.013+0000) > > Ok, fine but now also tell me, why the hell are they so hard to gank when they have proper position and wave management? How many times you can just go and charge at them not risking tower shots... The logic I was talking about is: > > 1. You say that her strength is compensated heavily while in early game she has as "dmg support" big stats, while having very the same stats in lategame as every other adc... > 2. You say that she is immobile champion that has perma MS boost with long range... Range champions first of all are supposed to be totally immobile while she has MS boost. > > 3. Mistake is strong only in short trades early on, while she has bonus AD getting idk from where, has free dmg bonus via POKE so, those so called trades are irrelevant to her and has also tons of heals to sustain your dmg while you keep dying to her dmg. > 4. As I said, she has the very same dmg as other adcs... With Eon on top of it giving her extra safety. So, how the hell does she not scale so well as other adcs? Hmm? ( btw, Brand and Lux arent designed to win when no one has item, thats just side effect of balance...) > > 5. Listing champions that dont have anything to do with her kit directly just the fact that they create good 2v1 situation where the problem she has is common with every other champion that isnt hyper-mobile. The same goes for many other champions while they dont have any problem with those listed champions. In short, she this doesnt give her any unique trade off that she would deserve for what she has... Yet, thanks to her range she has quite safe position when it comes to ganking and that half sec bonus is more than enough combined with W which isnt suppossed to be good self peel when its clearly enough to shake off most of the ganks. > > For this: > > There is also quite nice summary of what I am trying to say: > From: ***Baby Ghoul*** > > Nothing you said is valid reason for Mistake to be such cancer... NOTHING. You are exaggerating everything Senna does to prove your point. Her damage is not the same as other ADCs. She has more burst, but lower sustained damage than a true marksman can deal due to her slow attacks and poor synergy with crit and attack speed items. Raw AD will only get you so far. Other marksman like Xayah, Kai'Sa, and Jinx can easily outdamage Senna. She gets bonus AD from stacks because she doesn't get it from levels. She gets zero AD from levelling up, so if she is forced to play passively and can't stack up, then she won't get AD. She doesn't do a ton of healing. The healing she provides to herself and her teammate is lower than what true enchanters like Soraka, Yuumi, and Nami can provide. Senna traded good heals for good autos, a source of damage that doesn't require mana. _She doesn't have a permanent movement speed boost._ When she attacks, she gets a small amount of bonus movement speed for 0.5 seconds. She's slightly faster for **half a second after an auto**. She's not running around faster than everyone, she just gets a small nudge so that her slow autos don't feel like garbage. Her E doesn't give her safety. The movement speed it provides isn't enough to escape a threat, and the cloak doesn't hide her when enemies are already in her face. She needs to use it preemptively to get out before danger has arrived. Plenty of long range champs have mobility tools. Caitlyn has her net to dash backwards. Ezreal has his blink. Jhin has his passive movement speed. The difference is that their mobility tools are on long cooldowns, conditional, or inconsistent. Senna's mobility definitely falls into this category. Your problem is that you have put Senna on a pedestal. You have blown everything she does out of proportion and have resolved yourself that she is broken regardless of the facts. Her damage and healing is NOT as good as other marksmen and enchanters. Her self-peel is weak, hinging on landing a single, slow skillshot and praying the enemy can't close the gap. If she is playing from long range and only poking with aa-Q combos, she won't get enough AD to be a threat in the lategame. Your logic is flawed because it is based on your caricature of Senna, rather than her actual numbers.
> [{quoted}](name=iiGazeii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PYdmOGEV,comment-id=0000000000000000000000000000000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2020-02-17T16:40:11.361+0000) > > You are exaggerating everything Senna does to prove your point. > > Her damage is not the same as other ADCs. She has more burst, but lower sustained damage than a true marksman can deal due to her slow attacks and poor synergy with crit and attack speed items. Raw AD will only get you so far. Other marksman like Xayah, Kai'Sa, and Jinx can easily outdamage Senna. > > She gets bonus AD from stacks because she doesn't get it from levels. She gets zero AD from levelling up, so if she is forced to play passively and can't stack up, then she won't get AD. > > She doesn't do a ton of healing. The healing she provides to herself and her teammate is lower than what true enchanters like Soraka, Yuumi, and Nami can provide. Senna traded good heals for good autos, a source of damage that doesn't require mana. > > _She doesn't have a permanent movement speed boost._ When she attacks, she gets a small amount of bonus movement speed for 0.5 seconds. She's slightly faster for **half a second after an auto**. She's not running around faster than everyone, she just gets a small nudge so that her slow autos don't feel like garbage. > > Her E doesn't give her safety. The movement speed it provides isn't enough to escape a threat, and the cloak doesn't hide her when enemies are already in her face. She needs to use it preemptively to get out before danger has arrived. > > Plenty of long range champs have mobility tools. Caitlyn has her net to dash backwards. Ezreal has his blink. Jhin has his passive movement speed. The difference is that their mobility tools are on long cooldowns, conditional, or inconsistent. Senna's mobility definitely falls into this category. > > Your problem is that you have put Senna on a pedestal. You have blown everything she does out of proportion and have resolved yourself that she is broken regardless of the facts. Her damage and healing is NOT as good as other marksmen and enchanters. Her self-peel is weak, hinging on landing a single, slow skillshot and praying the enemy can't close the gap. If she is playing from long range and only poking with aa-Q combos, she won't get enough AD to be a threat in the lategame. > > Your logic is flawed because it is based on your caricature of Senna, rather than her actual numbers. :D The thing that is broken is that she doesnt have to choose between healing and dmg. Imagine soraka doing way more dmg via bonus Range on her Q, like way bigger. That is Mistake. I didnt blow things out of proportions, only ADCs that overdmg her are Xayah and Kaisa ( who are complete beasts among ADCs), jinx not ( all in early - mid game) and in lategame she isnt behind, while having that brokeness as well... And the things " regardless of the facts" is just accuse as I am building everything on facts. For example, that 0,5 sec MS boost lets her kite as normal adc and that E gives quite good MS bonus when you take into consideration the distance you need to get over in order to be safe + that MS buff on aa isnt small ( 390 -> 464 isnt small amount :D). Nothing reasonable and valid you can say about her does not justify her being overtuned cancer making her feel also as overloaded champ. As so far, you havent even said anything valid. https://youtu.be/Yrq99fPEB9Q?t=34 This is good example of Mistake and what I am talking about. In summary, facts on which you are building your statements arent valid, nor is rational your interpretation of view on given facts. This seems like attack on your arguments but I am just telling you that you havent said anything rational nor you used anything solid to back up your statements, so you should now do your own summary to look whether you yourself know what you are talking about and what you have said all until now... Mistake is currently mistake due to lack of quality and creativity compensated by quantity and high numbers. She have potential but that potential was tossed away by dev team and what was left is just whole sack of random primitive spells and passives stacked on one another creating game breaking toxic combo completed by quite high numbers as a thin "tape" holding everything together...
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=t4yIFjas,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2020-02-16T11:37:08.899+0000) > > What the hell is wrong with you ppl? Do you play champ because of that champ or because of lore? Champ is not supposed to match the lore but the lore is supposed to match the champ. You shouldnt change champ just because he does not express the lore how would you like. If that champ doesnt work intended whay, ok, but changing him for the sake of lore is bullsh;t... theres nothing wrong with playing a champ bc of thier kit or bc of thier lore. sure gameplay doesn't match lore 100% but the kit is inspired by the lore also, this statement is partly false "You shouldnt change champ just because he does not express the lore how would you like" Riot has shown quite a few times that if a champion is not executing on their intended thematic goals, they are willing to rework them, with Irelia, poppy, sion, and Urgot and a few others being very good examples, they have changed them all for the sake of lore/theme, and currently Kindred isn't FULLY delivering on the them of the aspect of death.
> [{quoted}](name=FlameHalbrdOkido,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=t4yIFjas,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2020-02-17T02:54:41.222+0000) > > theres nothing wrong with playing a champ bc of thier kit or bc of thier lore. sure gameplay doesn't match lore 100% but the kit is inspired by the lore > > also, this statement is partly false > "You shouldnt change champ just because he does not express the lore how would you like" > Riot has shown quite a few times that if a champion is not executing on their intended thematic goals, they are willing to rework them, with Irelia, poppy, sion, and Urgot and a few others being very good examples, they have changed them all for the sake of lore/theme, and currently Kindred isn't FULLY delivering on the them of the aspect of death. They changed them because of wanted NATURE not lore... By what you said, every champion should have more game breaking mechanics and playstyles.
: She is no worse than {{champion:84}} {{champion:245}} {{champion:523}} {{champion:82}} Pre gut {{champion:266}} {{champion:114}} {{champion:240}} {{champion:555}} {{champion:58}} {{champion:157}}
> [{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PYdmOGEV,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2020-02-17T08:49:47.112+0000) > > She is no worse than {{champion:84}} {{champion:245}} {{champion:523}} {{champion:82}} Pre gut {{champion:266}} {{champion:114}} {{champion:240}} {{champion:555}} {{champion:58}} {{champion:157}} But yasuo can be destroyed quite easily via unique weaknesses, IS vulnerable unlike Mistake and require skill in order to do something making him worth pick. Fiora has clear trade off, so her 1v1 potential is justified while she isnt that oppressive and strong in early game ( low snowball capabilities due to quite low kill pressure and is in early weak as every other scaling champ), has set weaknesses that gives her really hard time overcoming opponent that is abusing them and they are based on playstyle rather on pick ( like, you dont have to have unique pick or pick with specific spells). She also requires skill for outplay. Akali isnt that terrible to face once you know how to play against her with given champ, with garen you just smash her, the same goes with many other toplaners and when she use shroud you just afk farm minions that are the furthest away from shroud. As Fiora I just wait until she appear to use Q and then I use Q and E + tiamat/hydra, when I am out of shroud then its hard for her to hit me while I can quite easily reach her thanks to my Q range and thanks to my superior dmg I can always win if we clash with each other since she got gutted to the ground. All I need to do is to avoid fight on her terms and fight only in favorable situation. The same goes with all champions I am familiar with, beside aatrox who is too hard for me to play cuz I havent played him enough to be sure that I can play him in every kind of situation. When it comes to Aatrox then he isnt anything else than ball of stats that have skill expression only against other skill cap champions. Against really skill cap champion he is so clunky that he is viable only thanks to high stats... Morde needs only some tuning down on his passive, and additional move of power from dmg to shielding, thus he wont be monster that kills everything in sigh but still keep his power when someone try to pick fight with him. About others... I simply dont know, but none of them is so sh;tty designed as "current" Mistake. Mistake needs complete overhaul of balance in order to be good.
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