Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 22
Hi Meddler, any thoughts on Kindred after the preseason changes? It feels like an improvement but does the data reflect it?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 25
Hey Meddler, how do you think will Kindred take those marksmen (and recent jungle) changes? They seem pretty decent now and I think we'd all like it to stay this way.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 18
Hey Meddler, what do you think about Kindred's state and how they might be affected by upcoming changes? I feel like the red smite nerf is going to hit them pretty significantly.
Rioter Comments
: Literally every other Energy-based Champ:
Well, that's one of the reasons people consider CT's champs cancerous: they often do things that no other champion can do and they have them for free.
: I would intentionally drop down to silver just so I don't get that shit, even if it was a free skin.
Well, I would honestly consider dropping as well.
Rioter Comments
: Can we stop letting CertianlyT make champions?
I mean, he is creative, his designs are original and innovative. But not suitable for this game. The amount of rage they induce in players playing against his champions makes me think that CT would do a better job at designing fun stuff for single player games.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: September 12
Hey Meddler, any thoughts on Kindred? They are okay in regular play but almost perma banned in pro. What do you think about it?
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: It's likely that you're noticing that you're lower because the lack of atkspd slow punishes not kiting a lot more. It should be close to neutral with some bugfixes tagged along that'll make it an overall buff. I don't think there should be a minimum value, personally. The intent is that this should just feel better vs live Kindred's functionality.
Yeah, that's what I was thinking too. And are there any specific bugfixes that you could share? I know that there should be a sound and visual effect when you get the 100th stack of Hunter's Vigor but it's currently missing (I hope it will be fixed before the patch goes live). Also, I'd suggest a change to make the heal not proc when it'd heal for 0 which happens quite often (1 hp can sometimes make the difference so I'm okay with that).
: PBE Chat with the Playtest Team - 8.13
Hello, 650k mastery points Kindred main here. I played a couple of games with them on the PBE and I wanted to ask you if you noticed that during the 1st clear you lose more health with the heal than without it? Later, of course, healing is better since it helps in fights etc ( i survived ignite thanks to it a few times), but overall I feel like it should have a minimum value (maybe 50% of the original one or slightly less) regardless of your missing HP and normally increase as you get lower. What are your thoughts on this?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: June 14
Hi Meddler, I thought it might be a good idea to let you know that there's a little gameplay clarity issue with Kindred and their heal on the PBE. heal. As we gain the 100th stack of Hunter's Vigor there used to be a sound effect that informed us of it and Lamb's model would also shimmer for a second on top of that. Here's an example from their Champion Spotlight (between 2:48 and 2:49): Also, don't you think it would be good to add a minimal amount you can heal for? Like 50 or even 30% of the maximum value regardless of how low you are. It's kinda weird when it sometimes heals me for 0 or 5 HP.
: PBE Chat with the Playtest Team - 8.10
Hello guys. How do you think the upcoming jg/crit changes will affect Kindred? IE is losing its bonus +50% crit DMG so I feel like there won't be those juicy 1,5k crit executes on the enemy ADC. Also, how do you think they will do when contesting scuttle crabs with other junglers? Don't you think that they could use some love with their lvl 2 duelling potential?
: Marksman changes coming to PBE in the next couple days
I'd like to know how these changes will affect Kindred. They are pretty reliant on critical strike chance since it increases the threshold at which their E crits, plus +50% crit DMG from IE was crucial to their late-game power allowing them to efficiently execute squishy champions. Do you have some changes for them in mind? I know that Wrekz is working on them due to the jg changes, but could you share something atm?
: Feature/QoL change/Idea Generator for 2018 and beyond!
**Feature/Suggestion Name:** Making the life of Kindred's pray scarier **Opportunity/Problem Statement:** As we all know, when one gets marked by Kindred they only hear one quote once the mark activates. It's nice but it doesn't feel like the Death is chasing you. There should be something more, to remind players that the Eternal Hunters are coming for them. **Brief Description:** Certain Kindred's quotes that a marked champion hears when the mark activates will play and the mark will appear above their head like it currently does (not randomly anymore) once every minute (or something around that) if the target is below an HP threshold (25-15% should be okay). Additionally, as a background, SFX of Kindred's W should play for the victim along with the quote (like WW's theme). **Target Audience:** Every player that faces Kindred and cares about immersive gameplay. **Mockups/Screenshots:**
: Can we revert Kindred back to their original kit?
Well, people can say that they are not that bad RN. They can say that the rework fixed some of their problems and brought them back into the game... But honestly, I miss being able to melt tanks with few autos, healing on W with its sweet SFX and that satisfaction whenever you got a stack because you knew that you're getting closer to the point when a full tank Maokai will fear you. Over 600K mastery points and I find my main so... bland and not mine anymore.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: {{champion:131}} {{champion:4}} {{champion:26}} {{champion:91}} I think if these are known enough in Ionia to qualify, then this criteria works for almost every champion IMO. Don't think that this is really a factor here.
Diana got it because of moon in "Blood Moon". She's kinda connected to the concept of our natural satellite. Talon is a Noxian and Noxus was at war with Ionia, or rather they invaded it. Unfortunately I have no idea what TF and Zilean are doing there. But hey, I said **usually**, not always.
: Will we get some new Blood Moon skins this year?
Agreed with your choices considering the fact that Blood Moon champs are usually somewhat connected with Ionia or they are just known around Runeterra (and Kindred obviously are). Plus, there's going to be an actual Blood Moon on 31st January so it would be a terrible waste for Riot, not to do anything about it.
: If you touch Vel'Koz you are going to suffer.
I think I've found a new main {{champion:161}} {{champion:161}} {{champion:161}} {{champion:161}} {{champion:161}} {{champion:161}} {{champion:161}}
: vayne's got a nerf slated for next patch, its a fairly beefy nerf to her ult.
Well that's because I started playing her. Every champion I started playing and wanted/got a skin for got nerfed. Kindred, Cait, Vayne, Aurelion Sol. I should start playing Yasuo. You'll thank me later {{sticker:slayer-jinx-wink}}
Rioter Comments
: Kindred, no new skins, so much opportunity.
Kindred is one of those champions that almost all skin themes suit them. Personally, I'd love to see the Elderwood line expanded or at least a Blood Moon skin for them during the upcoming event.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 10
Hey Meddler, I want to ask you, how are Kindred doing with the new runes? Strong, weak or reasonable?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 1
Hey Meddler, Since you mentioned that you'll be adjusting champion's voices when speaking to other players, I'd like to suggest something that I think should be done to Kindred (or rather to their pray). It doesn't change the gameplay at all, but would be a very nice, climatic touch to actually help people remember that the death is after them. When a marked champion gets low below a certain HP threshold, a Mark will spawn above their head and Kindred will say one of their quotes that currently play only upon activation of the mark. To better show you what I mean, here's a little video with examples:
: Decoy Suggestion - Kindred's Mark system needs help - Too easy too counter-bully
Well, I've made a post about my suggestion of their passive rework and I still think that it should be done at some point. Lemme quote it here: > Sooo, Kindred's rework has took away their core identity of a tank buster, making them more of a traditional ADC which IMO is not so fun. I was thinking what could be done to keep the best of both worlds and I came up with an idea that not only brings back Kindred's previous identity, but also fixes their core problem of RNG passive. > Passive has 2 componets: > **Mark of The Kindred:** > Kindred gains 1 stack of Mark of The Kindred for every large monster they kill in their jungle, 5 stacks for every large monster they kill in the enemy jungle and every epic monster, and 15 stacks for every enemy champion that Lamb has marked. > Every stack gives Kindred 1.1 bonus range on basic attacks, Q and E, while also amplyfiying Kindred's basic abilities as follows: > Q - gives +0.5% Attack Speed for every 1 mark E - gives +0.05% Missing Health damage for every 1 mark > **Swift Arrows:** Kindred's bonus AD deals damage equal to 40% of it's original value on basic attacks and can't crit. Every 15 bonus AD Kindred gets is converted into 1% Enemy's Current Health damage which can crit for 2% Enemy's Current Health or 2.5% Enemy's Current Health after purchasing Infinity Edge. > Wolf's Frenzy [W]: Wolf deals 40% damage from Swift Arrows ( AD scaling the same as now). > Of course, I'm aware that it would require some damage values tweaks on their basic abilities, like probbably increasing Q base damage early on. And finally, they could be balanced like a normal champion since we no longer have RNG in their kit, so it's much easier to assess their power and adjust it accordingly. >Some of you may be afraid that it's basically old Devourer in champion's kit... However, Devourer gave you pure damage and basically needed to be stacked in order to be worth it's price. It's not the same here, because the goal is to make the bonus range (mainly) more like side effect of doing normal jungle stuff, while preserving Kindred's identity of a hunter (bounty for marked champion takedowns and reward for invades).
Rioter Comments
  Rioter Comments
: @Riot A Serious Insight on How to Help Kindred
I 100% agree on the mobility buffs. This champion needs to jump and kite, but can't do it properly in early game due to high Q CD in W zone. It's funny how Riot is still balancing them as a mobile champion by keeping their movement speed low as if it was still compensated by a 2 seconds CD jump.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 3
Hey Meddler! I'm gonna make it short: **Kindred buffs when?**
: Hey Meddler, anything on {{champion:203}} ?
Probbably something like that: "They seem pretty strong right now power-wise so we don't have any current plans on them". Like almost every time somebody decides to ask about Kindred.
: Patch Chat with the Playtest Team - 7.19
Hello, I guess you've had quite an experience with playtesting the new runes and therefore I have a question: What runes would you recommend for Kindred? I've been thinking about domination as the primary path with Electrocute as our keystone for an additional early game power (also sudden impact should be pretty strong on them). Alternatively I was thinking about Precision path with press the attack as a keystone since it will be pretty easy to stack in the ult area. But how about the second path? Were there some things that you've tested and they worked well?
Rioter Comments
Razyelx (EUNE)
: The Most Favorite Champion of All Time [Voting Elimination] - QUARTERFINALS, Rengar vs Kindred
Wait, Kindred was winning by having like 50% more votes.... And Rengo mains happened.
Razyelx (EUNE)
: The Most Favorite Champion of All Time [Voting Elimination] - QUARTERFINALS, Rengar vs Kindred
: Patch Chat with the Playtest Team - 7.18
Hello, don't you feel that something bad has happened to Kindred? They were pretty fine after final buffs in 7.13, but they feel a lot weaker since like a month or so. I guess it has to do with tanks dominating the jungle, but shouldn't Kindred be given something to compensate such a change in game? Look at Fiora, her nerfs got reverted since items that counter her are pretty strong (bramble vest). As the meta changes, some champions' stats should be adjusted (and some are), but it feels like Kindred's been completely forgotten and no longer supported...
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: September 6
Hi Meddler. Any thoughts on Kindred? They feel pretty weak in current meta which in my opinion should favor them. ADC's are strong and tanks dominate the jungle so there's no threat of being counterjungled while support will protect you in late game fights. Or at least that's how it should be...
Rioter Comments
Nhifu (NA)
: They already buffed her, we don't need more.
Yeah, buffed them so hard that most OTP's do not want to play the champion anymore for how bad it is. Kindred is currently trash and need some serious work on them. The thing OP proposed is a step in the right direction IMO.
Wrekzzz (NA)
: Runes Corner: Late-Game Focused Runes
Honestly, I'd love to see Kindred's old W heal reforged into a rune (maybe even a keystone). It would be great for both duelists and junglers, having something in common with both Grasp of the Undying and Warlord's Bloodlust. Only make it so laners couldn't abuse it lane since we don't want to have obligatory lane sustain meta as it was earlier this year. I'd suggest making it as follows: * Your basic attacks or ability casts that damage enemy champion or a jungle monster, generate 10 (?) stacks of Hunter's Vigor. At 100 stacks, your next basic attack heals you for 34 - 102 (based on level). Melee champions are healed immediately after attacking, while ranged, after a brief delay based on how far their target was when the projectile connected (exactly the same way it worked on Kindred). Stacks are generated twice as fast when in combat with an enemy champion.
Eunson (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Scopé,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Yky2oZTr,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-08-30T14:55:42.015+0000) > > I started playing League in march 2016. stopped reading right there.
Thanks for adding something valuable to this discussion... Really? Just because I'm not playing this game since the beginning doesn't mean I don't have anything valuable to say. Every player's voice is equally as important since this is how we can assess how people actually feel about the game right now. Feedback is a good thing regardless of player's experience. We all know how we feel about the game and we all have different background to those feelings. Some people are sentimental about certain things and can regard to them when giving feedback. Some players though, doesn't have such view at the game but still, can look at it and objectively say what's going on. How can you be so biased against me when you didn't even bother to read everything... Disgusting approach.
Rioter Comments
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: August 29
Hi Meddler, I want to share an idea for a rune since you guys said that you want to know what we'd like to see in the game. I was thinking about something that was fun, satisfying but is no longer in the game. I ended up with an idea that has something in common with both Grasp of the Undying and Warlord's Bloodlust but is much better! Let's get down to it: _**Blessing of the Hunters**_ * _ Your basic attacks or ability casts that damage enemy champion or a jungle monster, generate 10 (?) stacks of Hunter's Vigor. At 100 stacks, your next basic attack heals you for 34 - 102 (based on level). Melee champions are healed immediately after attacking, while ranged, after a brief delay based on how far their target was when the projectile connected (exactly the same way it worked on Kindred). Stacks are generated twice as fast when in combat with an enemy champion._ Rune would be great for both junglers and duelists who doesn't want to choose damaging runes. It doesn't create that feeling of necessity that old Bloodlust enforced (you either take it or you get outsustained by the enemy laner). It's also a great help for those junglers who want to farm without loosing most of their HP and thus, making them able to gank lanes without having to back so often. Also, it makes you feel rewarded for fighting since unlike Bloodlust, it does not generate on movement. What's great about it is that it doesn't really require much of artists' work since all the sounds and particles are still in the game files. Don't waste it - Recycling is important!
Meddler (NA)
: Urgot - Buffs helped a moderate amount, we'll likely do a little bit more on him sometime in the next few patches though. That's an estimate not a guarantee however. Nocturne - I think Noc shows his age pretty hard, in particular his dependence at this point on going in and bursting someone down as only real path to success. Power wise I think he's ok, and his ult's still I'd argue one of the coolest skills in the game. Would love to see a mini update on him at some point, lot of folks we should do first though (Azir, LB for sure, likely others like Garen, Karma, Ez etc). Kindred - We think the bigger issue with Kindred is satisfaction, rather than power. If the definition of viable being used is 'not pro viable' then yeah, they're not viable, though there's a general issue with carry style junglers in pro there. Imagine we'll put some work into them again at some point, would be surprised if it was until solidly after pre-season at the earliest however, barring new developments.
I think that one of the biggest factors that made Kindred's gameplay less satisfactory is lack of the W heal. It was really great with all the sounds and effects. Instead of removing it, you should've just tune it down to almost insignificant values (that could scale with missing health I think). That would definitely bring some sort of satisfaction back into their kit. I think that overall, things that give champions sustain are almost equally as satisfying as damage.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: August 25
Hey Meddler, I have two questions for you: I feel Kindred are pretty weak vs tanks that they were intened to counter (before the rework). Don't you feel like there's something that should be done to make them better at dealing with this particular class of champions? Kindred's animations and sounds of W heal were amazing and super satisfying. Would it be possible to use it again somewhere in their kit or maybe rework it into a new rune? It feels like a big waste.
Rioter Comments
: Patch Chat with the Playtest Team - Patch 7.17
Hello guys, I'd like to talk a bit about the champion that most people forget - Kindred. Don't you think that the rework kinda killed their entire tank shredding identity and made Kindred more of a ranged assassin as they tend to 3 shot squishies with their E? Maybe they could use some sort of change that would make them better vs. tanks (as they were intended to counter them) and fit current meta a bit better. Maybe something similar to Vayne's R change you guys tested the PBE on one of their abilities... Like healing when the target is below a health threshold (which would also fulfil that fantasy of growing stronger when people fear death). Don't know about you, but I really pay attention to details and art when it comes to playing a champion and the thing that really hurts me since Kindred's 6.13 nerfs is that we no longer have those sweet sounds and VFX of their W heal. It was an awesome piece of "gameplay art" so to speak and I wish it could come back in some form (maybe something similar to what I've mentioned above). Don't you think that a champion shouldn't have parts of their kit completely removed unless you're making something similar to Maokai or Katarina update? TL;DR Kindred are pretty weak vs tanks that they were intened to counter (before the rework). Can anything be done to make them better at dealing this particular class of champions? Kindred's animations and sounds of W heal were amazing. Do you think it would be possible to use it again somewhere in their kit? It feels like a big waste.
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