: Please Riot, these Renek and Kled changes are terrible for toplane. What are u doing?
They just bring the bot lane experience to top. In my experience, the counters are so strong that whoever picks later wins bot heavily. That's why bot goes 10/0 or 0/10. Unless the enemy support is troll / autofilled.
: It is weird, I have the same problem and from time to time it shows the "or" condition, but now it doesn't, which means you have to do both. Hope this gets fixed soon.
That is the main mission of the line, it gives you 60 tokens + an orb. It needs to be long.
: Hey Junglers, let me explain to you why top laners are always so toxic (explaining; not excusing it)
Supp has this "who picks later wins" system. Every supp has 2-3 hard counters, so banning is not possible.
Haze97 (EUW)
: I understand what you're trying to say, but how often do you guys ever make the same exception for top lane and mid? I've literally never heard anyone tell a bot lane player to 'roam top or mid to help' when either the top or mid laner have been having a bad day. It's always the other roles who are told to lay a secondary role in order to help the bot lane. This just goes to show how influential bot lane is and has always been. It's also a pity that Riot does nothing about it, whether it be making dragon steals less game changing or attempting to make supports well more supportive and getting those damage dealers such as Brand or Veigar out of the lane in order to make the lane less influential should it go down and lose priority.
Bot lane is the glass cannon lane dominated by adcs and enchanters. Their task is to control the late game if they manage to scale up. This is an intentional design from riot. So I play healer supports to avoid loosing bot lane and it works. In my experience top and jg are the main source of feeding, especially jg make horrible decisions these days. Not just in my team, but also in enemy team.
: I own every Champ. I don't like the bans. Sometimes it's fun to play as Teemo, Sona, Yi or Veigar. I see them win and I see them lose. They are not as OP as people think. Annoying yes, but OP beyond reason? Not really. I find that the bans remove some Champs from play entirely. It makes the game less fun. If anything it gives me a better chance of winning. I have 50 Champs above rank 4. I feel I can carry with at least 40. But subtracting Champs seems like subtracting fun to me. I don't get it. It points to your weakness as a player if you can't counter something. Get over it.
Aram bans are needed because aram is not random. Limited champion pools and rerolls hurt the randomness even more. Bans could be removed if: - Rerolls are removed - All champions allowed for everybody and they have equal chance to appear.
: Does the balance team play this game?
Whether they play or not is irrelevant. They do changes based on the priorities set by their bosses.
cabbysb (NA)
: League is evolving into garbage
Vicious circle. Assassin complains, they get buffs -> people leave lol -> oh no, fix tanks, because people leave -> more people leave game -> oh no, adcs leaving the game, fix them -> more people leave game -> ... Matchmaking is terrible because it was designed with a lot of players with lots of games in mind. Now since there are less games, matchmaking simply cannot predict your actual level, because it cannot predict the level of the other 9 players, and makes random adjustments after games. I think they want to make league as a show rather than a game.
PaladinNO (EUNE)
: >Would love to see the "feedback" they got That's what I asked too. https://eune.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/special-event/aram-back-bilgewater I often see them talk about the "feedback" they get, but I never see any references to this feedback.
Riot devs have a boss. What he says is THE feedback. Ha cannot play his OTP sona anymore, so he hated the change. Any more questions?
: "Ranked is about skill and not at all a coinflip"
What I don't get why they don't change anything. This game is about ranked. Good ranked experience -> more revenue. Bad ranked experience -> less revenue. My ranked experience is awful, if we get the feeder/afk, we loose, if my opponents, they loose. It seems irrelevant what I do. The result? I haven't buy anything this year from riot.
: Part of the issue is team performance dictates individual ranking. I don’t really understand why when team composition is random. With all the stats they have and other ways to rate your play I don’t know why they simply won’t use this to create a more fair and maybe more individual based ranked system. It’s just not fair to get penalized for bad team composition. It seems this problem is throughout the tiers because it happens in the low levels where I am too.
The answer is always money. You get random teams -> you need to play more to get a deserved rank -> you invest more time in the game -> you invest less time on far more important things -> you likely invest more money in the game. And here we are. So the whole point of unwinnable matches is play more, spend more.
: What if we removed runes and masteries?
I like this idea. Champions should have weaknesses, which they could still reduce with paying gold if they want, but it is a sacrifice, and not coming free from a rune system.
: E-Sports Rewards Bugged.
They say adblocking can kill the feature. I get rewards although I usually skip pause times, and the boring discussion before and after the game. Sometimes even the champ select.
Hotarµ (NA)
: Okay, I'm totally fine with people complaining about Pyke but he's definitely **not** the most forgiving champion. He has one dash and one MS/invisibility spell. In return he can't build max health, doesn't build resistance items (since tank builds are dead), and his base stats are laughably low. At level 18 he gets 135 armor, 59 MR, and 2,400 HP. Those stats are so poor that any midlane champion could burst him down with ease.
Talking about theoretical weakness.... There is no fed mid laner on bot during early game that is for sure.
Hotarµ (NA)
: He really just needs to have his passive gray health be less effective early-mid game and if needed, have his ultimate's base damage toned back to what it was before the buffs. The rest of his kit is fine.
Yes. Doing dmg is not the problem. Most forgiving champ + doing insane dmg is the problem. He simply needs an accessible (not theoritical) weakness.
: Nexus Blitz was DESIGNED to be short; Summoner's Rift wasn't. That's all there is to it and it doesn't take a genious to understand the difference.
I completely agree. It was really good to introduce blitz, since if you just want a quick game with many kills, its perfect. And summoner rift does not need to balanced into that anymore.
Kryptone (EUNE)
: Pyke Nerf Suggestion
Honestly, riot doesn't understand their own game. Assassins cannot be played on bot because they have no sustain and just die to frequent pokes / trades which is the signature playstyle of bot. So they created an assassin which regens back the lost trades, and they surprised that it is op EVERYWHERE. A strong and forgiving champion is always op in every role. Riot needs to take away the regen. Yes, pyke will not be a good blind pick anymore, but this is true for all other bot lane champs. We don't need exceptions.
: I dont think pyke is bad design but rather bad balance with far too much in base damage (and ability wind ups) and not enough ad scaling on his spells and far too much base damage on his ult His ad scaling is just fine (yes im saying it needs less damage) that ult should not be over 1/3 of a health stacking bruisers hp bar and it reached halfway for most of them.
I agree that the core idea is good, but they made it an awesome laner who is tankier than taric, alistar, leona, etc. + assassin strengths. At some point they have to take the tankiness, making it a high risk champ like other assassins.
faelight (NA)
: enchantress buffs, specifically lulu? adc buffs? i’ve tried to adapt to the shield/aery/spelltheif/adc meta changes and lulu’s 2.5 shield duration that stays the same if e is maxed feels like real garbage. maxing q is alright but the damage is lacking due to the damage reduction through multiple targets nerfs. any thoughts or changes planned?
I think riot hates enchanters. They consider them too simple. I liked playing with them, but they are not viable anymore. Probably never will. Riot hates when you have choices, they want you to play 1 current meta champ.
: You don't see the truth in it though? Boards is 90% negativity. It sucks for the 10% of players that make it a great community, (concepts and creations, general discussion specifically) but the hate threads, empty complaints, and toxic hostility are undeniable. Rioters don't even come around anymore to shitpost since Cactopus left :(
This is normal. People don't waste time on praising others, because fighting against stupid decisions takes all their power. Just think about dark harvest or new turret gold. Even a bronze player can tell without landing it that it will be a source of issues. Still riot pushed it through and got a lot of negativity. Is this a surprise? And now people are forced to express their issues instead of talking about other things...
: Is it hard to get out of silver or am I just bad?
The problem is not your skill, but your rank/skill pair. If you are better than your rank, the matchmaking compensates by giving you worse teammates, to force you back. Also if you are lower than your rank, the game starts giving you better players. The result of this is streaks. You win 10 games and then loose 10 games and back to square 0. You can climb if you are 2-3 times better than your rank, but if you are just 20-30% better you cannot climb. Also if you are 20-30% worse than your rank you cannot drop. If you feel your invested time is wasted, try other games, or get a real life.
: Stupid and misleading thread. Lets compare this to Morgana Q- 300 (+ 90% AP) R- 600 (+140% AP) Are you gonna say Morgana is busted now too? You list Neeko's Q damage and fail to mention that it triggers 2 times after the initial cast so the only way to get full damage is if your target is CCed or they are standing still(aka terrible) If Neeko Q + Rs a non CCed target shes actually doing LESS damage than a fucking Morgana. Squishy no mobility mage with a short range ultimate that deals a lot of damage clearly busted.
Morg R has a 3 sec delay, and 500 range leash. You can only catch those who died anyway.
: Turret Plating snowballs the winning team even harder
I hate these new towers. As a support I was allowed to do ganks at the cost of some tower health. Now that means free gold for the enemy while I risk a lot. So I am forced to sit under tower and I hate it. It is also awful when somebody is afk for a few minutes. The enemy gets so much free gold. You can also get a lot of money with lane bullies with catcher support that everybody is forced to use them. This limits my options and I hate it as well. Ty riot, great work!
Dr Dog (NA)
: when is kogmaw actually gonna get a passive?
If it would get a real passive, they need to strip power from other areas. E.g. w %maxhp damage. Think about it.
: I don't understand the thought process that lead to these changes.
Lcs is bigger business now. They don"t care about players anymore, just want lcs matches with 100 kills in 20 min. Viewers love it.
Meddler (NA)
: Additional note since time of writing: Looks likely we'll put some more time into Sejuani and Galio changes. They'll be in 8.24 or later as a result. Will likely see them gone from the PBE shortly, work's still ongoing though, that just reflects preparing 8.23 for launch. For Sejuani something we'll be looking at in addition to, or instead of some of the above changes, is how much power her passive's giving her in pro given how much front loaded power is valued there. Might be a good angle to reduce that instead of some of the CC changes. For Galio, considering bigger changes potentially.
Just a question: why do you focus so much on competitive level when it is pre-season time? There are a lot of champs who needs help, and there are groups like enchanters who got nothing just nerfs for 2 years.
: Because anything that lets people avoid dying is bad for Riot's revenue stream. Big Plays, killstreaks, this is what the viewers want. And never forget, Riot balances the game for the VIEWERS watching from the sidelines, not the players who have to put up with it. Fair play is unhealthy, the people want bloodsport.
VIEWERS even has zoom-out, while you have to play that you cannot see anything just the big head of your champ. Many of the skillshots can go out of the screen if you center on your champ.
Kaìju (NA)
: The issue with short laning phases is it lead to situations like 4 man dives bot where you automatically got 2 kills a dragon and a tower.
True. You get a lot without any risk. There is too much pressure on bot now and that needs to be spread across more lanes.
: Get in line. Old Karma mains feel the same. The stupid Developers don't care. They are about making current kits better and catering to new players. You are wasting your time. Trust me.
Rioter Comments
Ulanopo (NA)
: >Reduce complexity, increase quality! League should be a simple game with complex player interaction, not a complex game with braindead "woops ya dead" interaction! That's hyperbole. A simpler game is not, by definition, better than a complex one. I received received a game called Vanagard through Kickstarter. It was marketed as a simple roleplaying game based around Norse animal-kin. Unfortunately, the mechanics are so rudimentary, it amounts to a "make your own fun" kit. As far as "braindead 'woops ya dead' interactions" go, that's a balance issue, not a design issue. Frankly, I would argue that many more items are problematic (Stormrazor, anyone?) than runes.
Overwatch? Most champions has 2-3 core skills and it works awesome. In the game you need to outplay your opponents rather than finding op combinations left by game designers.
: I think something closer to the Augments system would be much better. Instead of having 15+ keystone runes for every champion in the game to choose from, you could have 3 keystones that only your champion could choose from. So you wouldn't have to worry about Ezreal ruining your Kleptomancy Yorick build, Fiddlesticks would have Keystone runes to choose from that make sense for him, and assassins wouldn't just be running Electrocute in 90% of games. As we can see in Odyssey, runes designed for just one champion have an incredible variety of possibilities.
I suggested something like this several times. Generic stuff with 200 champions just doesn't work.
XeroKimo (NA)
: Well making items cost more would usually mean they'd have to provide better stats or buffs to passives because items usually aren't super gold inefficient unless the passive makes up for it. If stats do get buffed in compensation for higher cost, I'd argue that laners/ junglers would love the items more, since they aren't sacrificing as much tankiness or damage anymore for the item. On the flip side if they buff the passives, this would either A) supports become OP due to items and supports get nerfed and become reliant on them B) like ardent meta, people would stack whatever support items they can or shift the meta so much to favor using support items. I think supports items are better this way, because if other roles want to buy the items, they're sacrificing stats for getting an item that's quicker to buy, meanwhile supports won't get bothered too much because it's optimal for them to buy cheaper items with their lower income
I am sorry if I was not clear. I don't want stat buffs for support items. Their support specific advantages should worth buying them for supports even if they cost more.
: I don't think they'd really wanna do that. Gold income shouldn't be a massive thing because it's generally in line with the items you buy as a support. You get less gold but you also don't need to spend as much gold. If they brought gold level in line with other players you'd see nothing but mage/fighter champs in the bot lane to try and stomp.
The opposite direction is a problem: cost efficient support items are too good for laners / junglers. If supports get more gold, and their items are more expensive, problem solved. However riot usually do awkward changes instead.
Ralanr (NA)
: When people complain about a reworked champion ruining what they liked about the champion.
These are not reworks. They just introduce a new champ as a refund for deleting an old champ. And for me this is perfect. I want a tryndamere rework. His ulti was designed when CC-s were 3 sec long, and it is extremely unhealthy now.
KeirosCZ19 (EUNE)
: Will RIto ever buff towers
It would be good to remove gold from riverside towers. They are opening the map, that should be enough reward. They could add some temporary buff as well.
Infernape (EUW)
: I personally wouldn't class Braum's Unbreakable as frustrating. It's pretty fair imo. At least he only blocks projectiles from one direction, only completely nullifies ONE projectile and redirects any CC and damage onto himself.
I agree. Braum is in a pretty bad shape in soloQ, since regardless of damage reduction, he just looses health to poke and dies at some point. Only coordinated 5 man teams can use him. Yasuo is the opposite. His wind wall is mostly useless against 5 man teams, but super strong and frustrating in soloQ. It counters any ranged champions, blocks ultimates, and protects a whole team, not just yasuo. This spell should be removed, and replaced by some personal defense. E.g. wind-up: yasuo jumps to the skies and avoids all damage for 1.5 seconds. Basically a free stopwatch effect.
: In my opinion all Enchanters should be reworked into Utility-Mages capable of healthy solo-laning. Because if the kit is healthy in a Solo lane, it can't suddenly be bad in a Duo-Lane (the other way around is a WHOLE different story tho). The perfect example is {{champion:267}} here - her kit is pretty solid and fun, she's just kept low on purpose, but with some damage buffs, especially to the ratios she could become definetly a viable top/midlane pick. Aside from that, most champs you listed are old as fuck and due for a full-blown VGU.
Well, this is a though problem. Nami is a great design, her strength is that she has no weakness, and her weakness is that she has no strength. Meaning that regardless your team is ahead or behind, she is always useful, but never too op. These days I am just an otp nami because of the rune nerfs (typical riot: nerf enchanters because runes are too strong, then nerf runes, and no compensation, except for yasuo or lee), although I am not that happy about it. If you want to make nami a solo laner, and buff her, she would be too strong since the "no weakness part" still remains. There is another champion who was not mentioned: bard. He constantly gets buff these days, and still nobody plays it. Reason? 500 AA range and with basic level positioning, he cannot stun you. So he loose all trades. I think he is the prime example of a bad design: your opponent needs to be stupid (or never see a bard before) to be efficient. He also should be a roaming support, but if you leave your lane, the opponent just wins it and snowball out of hand.
: rengar is doing great in both top and jungle, why are you buffing him?
Why buff? Riot wants more cat videos on the internet.
Sirsir (NA)
: I'll be missing my {{item:2031}} start... I thought supports were SUPPOSED to have significant lane sustain because they do a lot of trading...
Riot did this change for LCS viewers: more deaths on bot = more viewers. However, their logic is flawed, since support players will react with picking safe supports and play passively to prevent enemy snowball. Especially on LCS level. With a safe, late game support your aim is doing nothing early game.
Malak (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=shadowmacer123,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=xr46V60s,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-06-20T19:45:37.885+0000) > > problem is with janna you cant just shield to give your adc ad cause its way to easier to destroy the shield now yea gotta becareful and only use the shield when your adc is completely safe for the ad, or when he's about to get bursted
But your adc dies if bursted without a shield. The design issue of shields is they are defensive abilities, and giving offensive ability with them is bad idea. Lulu is better, since her MS/AS ability does not give shield. Her shield gives pix, but that is just a bonus not the critical part of the ability. Nami e also does not provide shield, just dmg and slow.
Ramyskie (EUW)
: Ranked is no longer about challenging players, but crippling them and see if I can 1 vs 5 fed champ
Lol matchmaking is not about fair play. If that would be, there would be far less bronze/silver. Instead it is about pulling you back, which makes you addicted to the game. That results more income to riot. Just ask this question: would you play as much if you would be satisfied with your progress? Honestly, nothing is fair in this game: teams are uneven, champions are unbalanced, items are unbalanced, red/blue sides are different, and more RNG is added. One misplay is enough to loose a game. To win games you need luck rather than skill. The strange thing is, if you accept that games are based on luck, your winrate improves. Less tryhard, just play with OP champs buy OP items and do your best. And also take breaks when you simply don't play this game.
saltran (EUW)
: Didn't most mages use Mana Band over Ultimate Hat?
Funny, but I use the hat with sona. Late game a frequent r worth more than the extra mana.
Rioter Comments
Sw4de (OCE)
: I logged in just to reply say i literally cannot believe you are giving supports even more power lol, i actually cant fathom it. Holy moly, are u really so out of touch with ur own game
Outplayed by supports? Supports are weak, so their players are always better on the same level. If you want weaker supports, then buff them, so those skilled players go away from your level.
Dasdi96 (NA)
: Knockups are way too common and powerful compared to other forms of cc.
People choose champs with knockups because they cannot be countered. Even if their number would be lower, they would still be popular. It is called reliability. If your champion can be countered effectively, your game is over.
AmazoX (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=FrostQueensPlane,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3tig1EqZ,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-04-23T02:23:01.272+0000) > > There's is literally NOTHING enjoyable in a mage vs {{champion:7}} or{{champion:157}}or{{champion:55}} match up BECAUSE ONE SIDE HAS BEEN GIVEN ALL THE TOOLS TO OUTPLAY THE OTHER RIOT GAMES AND ONE TOUCH FROM THEIR ABILITIES CAN COST YOU YOUR FUCKING LANE, yet _<Removed by Moderation>_ is perplexed as to why mages choose to abandon "laning" completely and opt to clear waves. It blows his ADC mind that having literally 0 options to play aggressively because of a severe discrepancy in mobility and ability consistency results in people who play their champions passively unless the skill discrepancy is so massive that none of that matters. > > Even vs {{champion:105}} or{{champion:238}} every match up literally boils down to roll your face at them before they hit level 3, if you didn't slap your face on your keyboard hard enough then you're not allowed to interact anymore because you'll take 90% of your hp in a single trade, and post 6 if you get touched you die. Wow Riot, that's so fun to play against, I can't understand why mages don't choose to MUH INTERACTION more with assassins :O. > > _<Removed by Moderation>_ Thing is, ADCS too powerful to the point they can 1v1 the characters made to destroy them, they hit their power spikes at 2, 2.5 items the hardest in the game. Mages on the other hand are the only ones left on the Mid lane capable of producing utility, zoning & wave clear for their team. The mages adjustments are part of the larger plan which is related to the ADCs taking an adjustment hit during Mid Season.
You mean they can say that they nerfed adcs after nerfed everybody else to keep their dominance? Clever.
: RIOT ADC's needs gutting not MAGES
I haven't heard any complain about mages for a long time. It is strange they attack them.
: League is no longer fun.
Reason: match time reduction. Because players wants short matches. Of course. The game always started with an isolated so called "early game" phase, but in an 50 min game, the team can fix an early feed. In a 30 min game it is impossible.
: Cannon Minion changes targeted for 8.7
Can we get numeric health values for minions? It is difficult to know when you need to last hit them. Also if the minion dies less than 0.1 sec after your damage or your basic attack missile is flying to them when they die you should also get their gold. This would reduce the effect of counterpicking, which is unavoidable 50% of time, or make dodging free.
: I dont really know the counter to xayah / rakan bot lane
Morgana invalidates rakan, and partly xayah. Your adc win all fights. GG
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