Wranger (NA)
: I'm Done
: > [{quoted}](name=5ogtredveogheit,realm=EUW,application-id=GgNYATV4,discussion-id=TxAucn08,comment-id=000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-05-20T21:51:41.355+0000) > So you are saying that eating a banana is impressive? Because you know, its subjective so someone somewhere could believe that it is, so then it is? ... smh If the objective was staying alive and you had a choice between harvesting a banana and a dragon, it's probably safer to eat the banana, even though the dragon is more difficult and spectacular. I am allowed to be equally as impressed with their decision-making ability to choose the banana given how much better of a decision it was given the objective at hand, assuming the choice to be flashy and kill the dragon was a tempting one. The banana isn't necessarily Garen, but let's say it is in the context of it being a good pick given the team comp or matchup. Are you now going to tell me I'm not allowed to determine what I'm impressed by? Or is your fascination for fast-paced outplays (as opposed to the "slow-paced" outplay of playing garen under tower against someone who would really like it if you didn't play garen under tower) the only kind that matters?
As a human, it is harder to slay a dragon than to eat a banana. Objectively. So it is more impressive to slay the dragon than to eat the banana. If you find it equally impressive to eat the banana, thats an issue with your way of looking at it. Again, a certain action CAN be skillful, but it can also be non skillful, the action itself, doesnt determine wether its skillful, the process behind it does that. The case of garen sitting under tower is usually not a skill expressive decision. Gotta be fucking joking, we got humans with brains, top of the food chain and whatnot, trying to say eating a banana is an impressive skill to have?????? {{sticker:zombie-brand-facepalm}} Just admit ur wrong guys. {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-thumbs}}
toon9822 (NA)
: Impressive is completely subjective. To you impessive is getting kills that took skill, to me its being able to win a game with your team performing as best as you can. As for the football analogy, that doesn't really work because skill is reliant on the people. I cant say that I'm just as good as a team because we both couldnt beat the same opponent. Because that's just a brash assumption.
Holy fucking shit this guy is fucking stupid. OMFG i didnt know these people existed, you hear about them. WOW. So you are saying that eating a banana is impressive? Because you know, its subjective so someone somewhere could believe that it is, so then it is? ... smh > I cant say that I'm just as good as a team because we both couldnt beat the same opponent. Because that's just a brash assumption. But this is literally my fucking point u inbred holy fucking shit i must keep myself from reading your absolutely crazy stupid shit MIND FUCKING BLOWN IM NOT EVEN JOKING {{sticker:sg-lux-2}}
: > [{quoted}](name=5ogtredveogheit,realm=EUW,application-id=GgNYATV4,discussion-id=TxAucn08,comment-id=000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-05-20T21:06:28.352+0000) > > You might not be able to believe this but, impressive really isnt as subjective as you think. I'd say the best yardstick to measure by is what an average person finds difficult, if only a few humans are able to do it, its impressive. And by that, impressive isnt subjective. > > Some things are objectively more impressive than others. 2 rally drivers, one in your old skoda and one in my fresh as fuck 06 modded to 300bhp gti, They cross the finish line at the same time. Because, the skoda driver was really good at driving and the other guy just had a fast car. Im outplaying garen, and garen has his turret, so we come out of lane roughly even, except for the fb i took which made him hide like a bitch, and the crabs ive been stealing. > > I could say that im just as skillful as an incredible footballer because neither of us were able to defeat a certain team. Just because our actions lead to the same result, doesnt mean our skill level is equal. Doesnt really work like that. The fact of the matter is that, most of the time, pretty much all the time i would say, the garen simply realizes that shit, i cant do anything about this guy, better just play under turret, or he simply gets pushed in because he isnt able to walk up without being shit on. theres no intricate thought process behind his actions, its just the only option he has, given his skill level. Just because its possible for something to happen because someone is skilled doesnt mean it must happen only when someone is skilled. In this case it very rarely is because the garen is skilled. > > {{sticker:zombie-brand-mindblown}} > > You guys... You're not spitting logical truths like you keep saying you are, and you're projecting _really hard_, coming at this whole thing from a very narrow point of view. What's impressive to me is one's ability to calculate and win a game. If they knew picking Garen under tower into your [not garen under tower] will be the safest choice for them to win the game, and they win largely in part because of it, that's arguably impressive for sure. The term "game mechanics" is an umbrella term for anything you can do to affect the outcome of the game using the game itself. I'm like 100% sure you know you're eventually gonna end up talking yourself into a corner here. This is an argument as old as time itself, and I feel like you're not going to be the first one ever to debunk it.
The logic is there 100%, wether you can see it or not. I dont know how to explain it any clearer. Its clear as day for me. So you're saying that its always regardless of anything, impressive to calculate and win a game off of it? Thats so incredibly illogical and im sure even you can see it. If they knew this and if they calculate that. THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THIS. GAREN IS PLAYING UNDER TOWER BECAUSE IF HE LEAVES TOWER HE DIES. THERE IS NO THOUGHT PROCESS. AND EVEN IF THERE IS, ITS HARDLY SKILL, TO BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND THAT PLAYING UNDER YOUR TOWER IS SAFE. Im getting trolled here am i not? Cant be serious. Its just that, I'm not worried about talking myself into a corner, because i KNOW that wont happen. Because the idea, the bigger picture is clear as day and completely un-deniably correct. Its not about me being convinced, its 100% correct. Are you even reading my posts?
Exin0 (EUNE)
: > > Just for one minute, pull your head out of your ass and realize, that no riot doesnt know best... they know best, how to get money thats their goal. They dont care about you or your game experience but they care about your creditcard.
Yup, completely true. It makes perfect sense then, that the game should perfectly suit an average player.
: You might not be able to believe this but, impressive really isnt as subjective as you think. I'd say the best yardstick to measure by is what an average person finds difficult, if only a few humans are able to do it, its impressive. And by that, impressive isnt subjective. Some things are objectively more impressive than others. 2 rally drivers, one in your old skoda and one in my fresh as fuck 06 modded to 300bhp gti, They cross the finish line at the same time. Because, the skoda driver was really good at driving and the other guy just had a fast car. Im outplaying garen, and garen has his turret, so we come out of lane roughly even, except for the fb i took which made him hide like a bitch, and the crabs ive been stealing. I could say that im just as skillful as an incredible footballer because neither of us were able to defeat a certain team. Just because our actions lead to the same result, doesnt mean our skill level is equal. Doesnt really work like that. The fact of the matter is that, most of the time, pretty much all the time i would say, the garen simply realizes that shit, i cant do anything about this guy, better just play under turret, or he simply gets pushed in because he isnt able to walk up without being shit on. theres no intricate thought process behind his actions, its just the only option he has, given his skill level. Just because its possible for something to happen because someone is skilled doesnt mean it must happen only when someone is skilled. In this case it very rarely is because the garen is skilled. {{sticker:zombie-brand-mindblown}} You guys...
Your car: https://puu.sh/DuYQ4/1cab44d356.png {{sticker:slayer-jinx-unamused}} My car: https://puu.sh/DuYPH/0a85098356.png {{sticker:darius-angry}}
: You see something "impressive" as outplaying your opponent(s) in some sort of mechanical face off to see who can land or dodge more skill-shots. When in reality the word impressive is very subjective and opinion based. I personally can see a garen sitting under turret and regenerating when the enemy has the ability to kill you at any instant due to their potential damage output. The garen is "skillful" enough to understand that the enemy can put his team behind while putting the enemy ahead given the correct circumstances (in this case using his proper damage output to kill him), so he uses his judgement or "skill" to determine the correct course of action which is to play passive. Sure at the moment when a player side-steps an ability and lands their own ability to win a teamfight or duel looks cool or makes it appear as though the player is carrying. But in reality that's simply your point of view of someone who looks like they have skill. I think it's a bit naive of you to be denouncing TOON9822 for "misunderstanding" skill or not "seeing the big picture" when you're the one not looking at it properly. {{sticker:galio-happy}}
You might not be able to believe this but, impressive really isnt as subjective as you think. I'd say the best yardstick to measure by is what an average person finds difficult, if only a few humans are able to do it, its impressive. And by that, impressive isnt subjective. Some things are objectively more impressive than others. 2 rally drivers, one in your old skoda and one in my fresh as fuck 06 modded to 300bhp gti, They cross the finish line at the same time. Because, the skoda driver was really good at driving and the other guy just had a fast car. Im outplaying garen, and garen has his turret, so we come out of lane roughly even, except for the fb i took which made him hide like a bitch, and the crabs ive been stealing. I could say that im just as skillful as an incredible footballer because neither of us were able to defeat a certain team. Just because our actions lead to the same result, doesnt mean our skill level is equal. Doesnt really work like that. The fact of the matter is that, most of the time, pretty much all the time i would say, the garen simply realizes that shit, i cant do anything about this guy, better just play under turret, or he simply gets pushed in because he isnt able to walk up without being shit on. theres no intricate thought process behind his actions, its just the only option he has, given his skill level. Just because its possible for something to happen because someone is skilled doesnt mean it must happen only when someone is skilled. In this case it very rarely is because the garen is skilled. {{sticker:zombie-brand-mindblown}} You guys...
toon9822 (NA)
: It takes skill to be able to tell when you have to do what, like being able to tell you have to camp turret or rush and bully. Thats the biggest problem for this topic. you describe skill as "something impressive" but that couldn't be the same thing as i see it. I see skill as being able to perform well in a majority of your games, but (from what i can tell, you can correct me if im wrong) you see it as being able to almost carry the game. as for "It isnt skill to just move your champion close to your teammates is it?", I disagree. just look at ganking. sometimes you can try to group, but get killed by roaming champs. It can take skill to be able to tell where/how to get to your team.
''skill'' that isnt impressive is worthless, i mean it really is. There is nothing exciting or interesting or motivating or engaging or anything about skill that isnt impressive. No one cares about being able to sit under turret, you want to outplay people and display your skill, skill that the other player can look at and think shit i couldnt do that. See the bigger picture, this isnt about definitions its about an idea of a flawed game/system. SEE THE BIGGER PICTURE, you're a human with intuition, use it. Cant believe i have to explain this.
Krylon (NA)
: They 100% rig matchmaking for any account that's ever had any history of toxicity. I got a 10 game chat restriction a couple months ago because I tilted off the face of the earth in ONE game, my first ever account punishment of any kind, and I swear the account has just become cursed to shitty matchmaking. I very rarely see players that are my actual elo in my games anymore, only people that are either much better or much worse than me. I'm so sick of one sided stomps, there is nothing worse than this fucking game for anyone's mental stability and blood pressure.
I can TOTALLY believe this, i BET they rig games, honestly. Its like, you have the same experience over and over and over, you KNOW it shouldnt be possible, but it happens. Over and over. But it shouldnt be possible. Well this would explain it, I dont doubt this for a second, its the sort of thing riot would do, I can just tell.
toon9822 (NA)
: you say this doesn't require skill, but if it doesn't then it would be pretty much even all game. if it doesn't require skill, then shouldn't like level 1s be on the same experience level as level 100's? it requires skill to learn and master a champ. Thats why not everyone is playing the same 5 champs every game. Sure some are more common than others, but they still take skill. if your a first game akali, your not gonna be able to go 10/0/19. But if you take time to learn her, you can learn to get up to this level. As for "Garen camping under turret isnt skill" it could be. if you have a champ like teemo top, who can outrange you, hugging turret and farming until you can kill him can take skill instead of just trying to rush to him. This game does promote skill, but it's just not the games top priority.
Thats kinda the point that i wanted to get across with the first statements. It doesnt require any meaningful skill to sit under turret as garen. Sure it needs to be done, but skill? Cmon, its not skill, you cant possibly believe that. By skill i mean something that is impressive. And by definition, if the average player can do it, its not impressive. You say it requires skill to learn and master a champ, to master, sure it does require alot of skill, to apply a champions abilities in an impressive creative way. Learn? not really, playing any champ in the game to a reasonable level doesnt require any skill. Once again by skill i mean something that is impressive. Thats just what im getting at, mastering a champ and playing it well isnt related to victory. It doesnt matter how well you're playing a champ because at the end of the day, the things that determines wether you win or not is grouping and other mundane non skillful ''plays''. It isnt skill to just move your champion close to you teamates is it? Lets get back to the garen statement. How is it skill to sit under turret and wait until you can kill your opponent? How can there possibly be skill involved here? If u bait out his blind and somehow manage to time your all in as he takes one too many towershots sure, starting to be skillful. But to sit under turret and just wait isnt skill. and it isnt skill to hit level 9 and just run at the teemo until he dies. Wtf are u saying?
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5ogtredveogheit

Level 79 (EUW)
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