: god forbid if you play a tank jg vs an assassin or fighter jg
: Some quick math behind the new Phantom Dancer and its gold efficiency
meanwhile trinity is 103% gold efficient without spellblade but thats fine right? {{sticker:sg-lulu}}
: I'm not looking forward to Spear of Shojin Renekton/Tryndamere, at least ER wasted some stats...
do you realize its nerfed compared to live er? the 200 hp is valued a little bit less than the 15 ad and the item cost 400 more. so its useless hp (if you're going er you want damage and the passive not defense) no mana regen (neutral on champ like renekton/riven but big on fiora) and delayed the powerspike compared to live
: And then? What does fervor do if you don't hurt tanks? Like you guys keep talking for weeks on end about conq and bruisers despite you guys having zero clue what you talk about. Because shockingly you don't play toplane or even bruisers to begin with. If conq is removed bruisers go straight back to trash tier. Oh wait THE GOOD BRUISERS AREN'T EVEN CONQ USERS TO BEGIN WITH. It just lets kled, renek and similar champs stay relevant past 10 minutes and let them deal with tanks AS IT IS INTENTED. Irelia is broken because it's irelia and it's hilarious to me conq is now scapegoated for her being strong despite electrocute especially midlane being her best keystone for quite some time. But nono conq is the problem with the game obviously. Tanks cannot walk toplane and rightclick bruisers to death anymore, the horror. Let's remove 50 champs from the game so mao, cho, poppy can be mindlessly spammed again and autowin everything ever. That's the league we want zero interaction, zero mechanics, zero skill. Farm up and hope your botlane carries and this is where most of the conq circlejerk actually comes from. Armless ADC mains that cannot fathom they aren'T super broken anymore and that the problem with adcs is the current GAME ITSELF AND THEIR OWN LACK OF SKILL. Just look at the top ladder of korea how many adc mains you find and yes they do not play crit carries that has a reason and the reason is not conq. Too fast, too snowbally, way too much impact by the jungler especially combined with a competent midlaner.Hilariously oppressive supports but we rather close our eyes and pretend nothing happens when alistar, rakan destroy adcs in the lane. But somehow they cling to this illusion that if we just make tanks happen in toplane again ADCs will be all powerful again. Like do you guys even realize even with fervor bruisers weren't doing too hot toplane? And it was all maokai, nauti for months? And eventually poppy. The old rune tree atleast gave 7% armor pen on top of fervor combined with black cleaver it was SOMETHING. But that was even before bramble garbage, adaptive helmet and shit that remove bruisers from the game. Without conq an ADC with GA and tabis is basically unkillable. Same with fuckin mages who somehow got to get massive pen while being able to go tabis, seeker, not sacrifice any AP or CDR or anything AND ALSO GET HIGH HEALTH STATS ON TWO MAJOR ITEMS if they choose to.
check top 20 korean ladder find 1 (one) adc main. woah so this is the power of adc...
D357R0Y3R (EUW)
: The support role sure has changed
lmao elise was literally played after release (also) as support because she had busted numbers. season 3 was literally annie zyra meta
hoganftw (NA)
: Be honest: Chadshinshin was wrong.
hash simply complain about the last thing that beated him in lane. when he's right it's simply because random luck
: everyone complained about assassins like ahri and zed dominating the game and how adc were garbage cause forced to rush bt for lane but then needed bt+pd+lw to be actual champions with ie being 4th or even last item since you simply needed lw to deal with armor
oh and also top lane with no impact and the only viable junglers being lee+elise+ either vi or j4 depending on who was less nerfed between the 2
: It's nowhere near close to season 3. Most complaints in season 3 were about specific champions, I hardly remember any actual core gameplay complaints and people who wanted Morello fired were small minority of mains whose champions he gutted swiftly after becoming overpowered. Now most of the complaints are about gameplay sucking a major dick, players leaving and I would bet my life that 50% of the entire community would actually pay money to see CertainlyT gone and pay triple the money to see all his champs deleted from the game. So stop spreading misinformation, it's not even close, season 3 had minor problems, seasons 6,7,8 and 9 as well by the looks of things were/are/will be a major fuckup and the definitive death of this game.
everyone complained about assassins like ahri and zed dominating the game and how adc were garbage cause forced to rush bt for lane but then needed bt+pd+lw to be actual champions with ie being 4th or even last item since you simply needed lw to deal with armor
hoganftw (NA)
: Better Jungler Wins
such is life. btw more than half of the top 10 in kr euw and na ladders are junglers. hopefully riot will gut the role soon
: I did the math correctly. I didn't add 10% true damage, I did the math for what IE actually does. It doesn't convert 10% of the bonus damage to true damage, it converts 10% of the TOTAL damage done by the critical strike. This comes out to 180% AD physical damage, and 20% AD true damage. Using these actual numbers, my math is correct. Let me walk you through it step by step so you can understand: Let's say you have 100 AD, and your target has 50 armor. For simplicity's sake, we don't have any on-hit effects, no damage amplifiers, no other armor penetration, and our opponent has no damage reduction. A normal hit would deal 66.7 damage. A crit with old IE would deal 20 true damage, and 120 physical damage, for 140 damage total. A crit from new IE would deal 150 damage. Factoring in the crit chances, 60% for old IE and 50% for new IE, we get an average of 110.7 damage for old IE, and 108.35 for new IE. This difference in damage only increases the more armor a target has. Since the lowest armor in the game at level 18 is Orianna (not including Thresh who has his passive for infinite armor) at 68 armor, most champs will take at least the +5 (soon to be +6) armor rune, old IE will be doing much more damage to targets. Even the champs with the worst armor in the game, like Ryze, Zoe, Lux, Heimer, etc. all have around 50 armor by the time you would finish IE, and as a single first item with no other crit chance IE wouldn't be amplifying your damage NEARLY as much as Stormrazor+brawlers+dagger would. New IE will make stormrazor obsolete by being the new thing ADCs have to rush in order to go online. It costs 600 more gold, so that's a big delay in the power spike, and it has a much worse build path than stormrazor does, but it will be a viable first item so no one will need to get it anymore. From this we get our new build, IE into Zeal item into Zeal item/ER. Two Zeals and an IE is worse than current Stormrazor, IE, and Zeal. Here's the total stats you can get: SR+Z+IE: Total of 60% crit chance, 130 AD, and 65-80 AS. IE+Z+Z: Total of 75% crit, 70 AD, and 60-75% AS. IE+ER+Z: Total of 75% crit, 140 AD, and 30-40% AS. New zeal items give you slightly more passive movement speed, but Stormrazor gives you more on the proc, which also guarantees your first hit to be a critical strike. Phantom dancer is losing it's high attack speed and movement speed in favor of a better hexdrinker, and ER has CDR and mana over the other two builds.
you wont go 2 zeal with the new ie. it will be bf->zeal->ie->actual decent items that keep you alive/boost your damage. ga is godlike and will be build probably almost 100% as 3rd items. 2nd zeal will be for lategame 6 slotted or 4th+boots if glass cannon
: Update on Yesterday's Capsule Pricing Error
Look at all these seething whales {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-popcorn}}
: Riot let bug abusers get thousands of skins for free
people bitching about other people getting free stuff is one of the reason i need to report someone for flame every time i lose a match. just terrible people in this community
Rioter Comments
l MrD l (NA)
: Did something happen this patch?
> Honestly if conqueror gave the true damage after 4 seconds in champion combat rather than being easy to get by slapping minions i wouldnt mind it and the game would have been more fun throughout o_O literally no one would use it
: Nasus needs to reaffrim his identity
but nasus was always a mid game champ since adcs with a brain just build qss and kite him in 5v5 teamfights
: Which of these champion groups is the most OP?
atm galio is pick/ban tier in competitive while having 54% wr in soloq. hope he gets nerfed soon
: Why is camille allowed to be the jg she is?
what? her clear is trash, she doesn't even clear half her jungle until tiamat
MrHaZeYo (NA)
: Which isn't going straight pen now is it? Mages should have their mana helped, they depend on it far more then any other class in the game. They absolutely need the item to succeed.
? they still get enough dmg to kill you, extra waveclear and mana fix. is just as big as a powerspike as duskblade. then they go oblivion and do true damage to adcs in mid game fights
MrHaZeYo (NA)
: Ya, that's what he's saying, they can't go double pen right away because they need their mana item (Ludans)
boots->chapter->sorc->luden (cdr-dmg-mana)->oblivion it's not like luden isn't a big fucking powerspike that let them 100 to 0 anyone on the map while fixing forever their mana and giving cdr
: It isn't the income as much as it is their base damage output.
it's 100% the gold income. you can get reliably get sorc boots+oblivion orb+mask by midgame if you do decent in lane. if you snowball hard you're half an item behind your mid the entire game
: Champions such as Velkoz & Xerath should NEVER be "supports"
then nerf the support gold income. why would people play utility based support when there is enough income to let them play carries and bring a 75% mid worth of damage and cc to a teamfight?
Infernape (EUW)
: To be fair no mage straight up rushes Oblivion Orb and Sorc shoes unlike assassins with Duskblade. They have to get a mana item otherwise they'd be oom in a couple of rotations.
: 3k hp at 3 items what you building {{item:3083}} {{item:3022}} {{item:3071}} and you level 16-18. Or you could be a mage and be no less than 2.8k hp with just {{item:3027}} some even make it to 3k hp. even more if you get {{item:3151}} or {{item:3165}}. or you can be 2.6 with no health items built at all
lvl 16 titanic-trinity-steraks give you well over 3k hp+ with the shield
GigglesO (NA)
: It had way more customization. I had alot of my friends that were only slightly mana hungry that they should splash 2-4 mana regen runes into their blue runes... Suddenly they didn't run out of mana in lane phase... The thing about the old runes that riot hated was that players just played "the same god damn thing" every game because "thats what the pros do". Well we have the same exact thing happening but now there is even more screen clutter and no real customization to how I play the game. You want mana spend 1/6 of your runes on it or gtfo. Before you could spend 3-4/30 runes on it. Then you still had all of your masteries left to play with.
people did the same thing pro did because runes were super expensive so you wanted to buy as little as possible and use them on as many as possible champs
: Cait does not “hard counter” Draven or Lucian lmao. She _hard_ counters Vayne.
she used to counter draven, this is why draven one tricks used to ban her. also had a really good matchup vs lucian if she didn't get enaged on by the support
: you dieing is not an excuse to have more damage otherwise fighters would have infinite damage by now.
implying they don't already have infinite damage while having 3k hp at 3 items
: > [{quoted}](name=charge attack,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ib6AwKla,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-12-07T01:20:48.975+0000) > > Base defenses also nerfed. Fleet also nerfed. He's strong because other ADCs are garbage - he's objectively in one of his weakest states since release right now in terms of raw numbers/ratios. > > This is Zven btw. Challenger level. ADCs lost armor and gained HP, Ali did mostly true and magic damage. Zven has more defensive stats then he would have pre 8.11. If this exact play happened on 8.10 Zven would've died then too. Just a fact. Funny thing about the fact you mentioned FFW because he would've lived had he taken it instead of DH. But hey his DH did almost 600 damage that game, wouldn't want to be able to kite better and get off a crit auto for that much. LMAO I'm also not sure how buffing IE would change Alistar's damage.
because an ie-rfc-something jhin would've exploded ali with the 4th shot
: by the way, there is another thread here that ill quote, where a rioter explained very well the issue with adc and game agency https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/a3pp81/a_rioters_personal_stance_on_the_state_of_marksmen/ > I'm going to heavily caveat this with "this is just my opinion". > Marksmen are systemically overpowered. That's gonna be true of a role that is functionally mandatory to the game. Yes there are some counters - but they are seen as cheese. If they were actual accepted counters to them, we would see pros adapt rather then literally bench >themselves and wait out until we make their role OP again (looking at you Rekkles). And there are also really good reasons that we keep them >overpowered. They create a very understandable game-flow for all players with inevitability (they will win the game if not dealt with). > That said, Marksmen have low agency. Agency is a measure of how impactful their own actions are at determining their success - and I strongly suspect this is what marksmen actually complain about. They got this weird conception that they are supposed to be carries (adc lul) - but that's literally the opposite of what they are. The more reliable your output is (repeatable ranged unmissable dps), the less agency you can have. Really you can view every ability as a way to buy agency - and the more unreliable (missable/dodgeable/high cost/difficult to position/long CD) your ability is the more agency it can buy. And since Marksmen put the majority of their power budget in a very reliable ability (AAs), they can buy the least agency. >Imagine how miserable a fight would be if Marksmen had the most agency. You can't outplay an AA, you can't wait for it to be on CD or dodge it, and therefore the Autoattacker also can't outplay with that AA. Anything you tried to do to stop this, the marksmen would negate because they have higher agency. Every other role MUST have agency over them - or they reliably lose because marksmen are reliable. So as long as their AAs consume the majority of their power budget, they are functionally very powerful cannon minions, not carries. Carries are the players who do something proactive that wins the game - definitionally something that requires high agency (ie: Malphite Ulted 5 ppl). >This is made worse by how well marksmen scale with gold, which just means they need to be weak early game. Since games snowball and players tilt and get mad at teammates, mistakes can easily compound to functional defeat before they get enough gold. This effect is generally sharper the further away from coordinated professional play you get (especially with flaming teammates in game - something I assume basically never happens in actual profession matches). I would go as far as to say that a significant amount of our players should probably not even be playing marksmen at their MMR since they and their teammates simply can't play around them well enough. season 7 during the ardent meta when crit itemization was cheap and "good", it was exactly the situation that lead to marksmen having too much game agency. that being said, i dont deny that stormrazor didnt cause issues and some marksmen have very skewed power curves at the moment, while others adopted stormrazor just fine. thats why they intend to work on the item. but the overpowered early game and midgame that marskmen enjoyed for 2 years is done. from the sound of it, youre not going to get it back. theyre thinking of making marksmen a bit more defensive and tune down their overall damage scaling in return, and work on stormrazor to smoothen out some of their power curves. but you can never expect a lategame build to kick in with 2 cheap items. the fact that this ever happened was disgusting when it did.
yeah it had nothing to do with supports being strong af and buying overpowered items like ardent censer, nope nothing at all
: This is so dumb you can literally just build {{item:1051}} {{item:3031}} and have just like the old ie with broken true damage. Marskmen have pretty high base ad about 90-95% of bruisers while having at least 50% better base attack speed. and due to range they can forgo defense if they dont walk into the enemy front lines range like sven did.
explain how does that gives me back the +50% crit damage. ah yes i get 10% conversion to true damage vs the irelia that build tabi (-10% to my dmg output) ga and steraks so my 10% true damage ignore what 150 armor? id take the +50% damage thx
: So what was the Ali building? And how fed is said alistar? Also Ignite OP.
Alistar was fucking 1/4
Rioter Comments
Mirkhail (EUW)
: I honestly don't see a correlation, the removal of team builder or dominion would "force" people to play blind or draft, more people play ranked because they now can play with 3 or 4 friends instead of only 5 or 2
I played only tb before dq for a year+. After playing 200 games of dq I quitted lol
: For a bunch of people crying about "representative samples" - being 20,000 or so people crying and wailing and moaning about Dyanamic queue, you further prove you people have no idea what that means. One game isn't enough to form any sort of valid opinion.
http://euw.op.gg/summoner/userName=achaoticmind Quitted after 200+ games of DQ. I just felt I had no impact in half of my games (win or losses). It's just not fun being smashed or carried by premades because they can simply comunicate better. Also the ranking system means nothing now so couldn't give a shit abut the game (and they closed teambuilder, wich was my main mode for the last year+). I quitted after a polish guy flamed in post-game's chat and everyone reported him. btw I didn't quit because of flaming. I quitted because when I was going to click again the play button, I got the message that the flamer got banned. I burst out in laugh (his flame was fun, a mix of polish and broken english) genuinely happy for the first time since 100+ ranked games. And then I realized. That was more fun than playing the game. I closed the client and unistalled League.
Rioter Comments
: Eight games like this? Someone either feeds or trolls. Am I just unlucky or what? I don't have a powerful premade to play with but this shouldn't be so ridiculous like this...
I had a 14 ranked loss streak a months ago... shit happens but sooner or later your MMR will drop enough to play vs worse player for easier wins :)
: What champion makes your day when playing him/her
{{champion:29}} Nothing is like being full build at 50 min, just stealth past the frontline and obliterate the enemy mid's _and_ adc's HP bars with 3 aa. After that easy clean up with resetting stealth and perma 70% AS buff Kreygasm
: im so bloody tired of bruiser master yi
Imo it's because {{item:3748}} and {{item:3053}} are stupid items. They give enough damage to burst down a carry _and_ enough HP to survive at least 1-2 sec of CC. Guess what is the counterplay to high dmg low defense carry (esp if they are melee)? CC and burst
: To everyone who isn't an Assassin Main
As an ADC main i prefer an assassin meta to a tank meta. You can beat an assassin with positioning, itemization, a good support player or by not feeding the Talon 5 kills pre-10 min. When tanks are strong they simply out-stat you and walk over your team without taking damage. I still have PTSD from the cinderhulk meta when Sejuani would smite gromp, rush {{item:3083}} + {{item:3075}} with red smite and simply jump on your ass. It wasn't even worth aa her pre {{item:3072}} + {{item:3035}} .
: This new item of yours is kinda disgusting...
I love how they said in the pre-season: we don't want AD assassin to burst down tank so lw is now bonus armor. And then release a %max HP AD assassin item
: Another case of Riot pandering to people who do not know how to play the game. I always play GP, every chance I get. If someone picks him before me I know exactly how to counter him. Lots of people are void of this type of decision making. Believe me, it's not hard to shoot his barrels out beneath him (it's really fun), it's probably the most infuriating thing a GP player will deal with. He is also susceptible to ganks when he has pushed too far in lane.
You should coach some LCK teams then, because they clearly aren't good enought to counter GP
: If they aren't rooted or heavily slowed, I find this hard to achieve.
Lucky that he has an heavy slow on his E...
: WHAT DO YOU MEAN UNPLAYABLE http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/9/92/SionSquare_old.png/revision/latest?cb=20140926025627 was beautiful :C AP: I could turn on my shield and the enemy {{champion:4}} would walk back to his turret out of fear Crit/AS : I got triple ganked and got a triple, which included me chasing down the {{champion:254}} afterwards Don't you dare call my baby unplayable *pouts* -he was gross AF but I loved it-
The last time I played vs Sion pre-rework he got fed. Like 1v4 fed. But i was playing Lulu support and i never ever seen someone so much fed but so much useless at the same time. We literally run circles around him and he could do nothing about it.
Rioter Comments
: that;s not difficult. Games are way easier to end in season 6. If you have a team that actually pushes their advantage and takes objectives, it's really not hard at all to end before 25 mins. and an AoE knock back that can chunk multiple people for 25%+ HP isn't exactly useless
If Lee can consistently get a 2+ men knock up with his ult the enemy team is bad and should feel bad. Also if they stack on 2 pixels why not just pick Amumu flash+R and auto-win the fight?
Cloud273 (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=J Eevo,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0VJhTfFx,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-02-04T22:07:47.647+0000) > > Except there's a difrence between manaless and energy based. > > Also there is actually an assassin that is manaless > > forgot about {{champion:55}} ? I honestly don't give a sh*t what kind of resource they use. What it boils down to is mages (and everyone else who uses mana) have one more resource that they have to purchase and manage. Manaless/energy/whatever don't have to buy this stat and get to spam their abilities all game.
Energy is better in lane, Mana in teamfights
: Lee sin is totally the highest skill cap champ in this game
Even a monkey can play Lee pre-25 min and do decent with him. The point is manage to snowball the game and close super early and/or be more useful than a cannon minion in temfight
: SO... i want to try and main twitch ADC
**Builds** Build 1: {{item:3031}} {{item:3085}} core. It's the highest DPS build for teamfighting and gives an incredible powerspike at 2 items. Rush {{item:1038}} (if u can't afford it go {{item:1043}} {{item:1038}} ) into {{item:3085}}. This is the standard build. Build 2: {{item:3142}} {{item:3085}} {{item:3031}} core. Go for this build if you face a team that can't stack armor. Why? because you can't build {{item:3035}} till 4 items and if the enemy Mundo has 250 armor you're fked. Use {{item:3142}} 's active when you use your ult because they have the same duration and you want to maximize your DPS during the ult (your strongest point). Build 3: {{item:3153}} {{item:3085}} {{item:3031}} core. I usually rush {{item:3153}} if they have 3 HP stacker (like Mundo+Tahm+Darius). After the core you build what you need: {{item:3072}} if you need the shield and sustain, {{item:3153}} vs HP stackers/need kiting, {{item:3155}} vs AP burst, {{item:3140}} vs cc, etc. Pretty much you obliterate everyone with items (_any_ items) so just build to counter the enemy. P.S. always build {{item:3085}} because it let you reset your Q as soon as anyone die and clean up the teamfight **Laning. ** Twitch is weak for the same reason Vayne is a weak laner: he win over long trades (2+ aa) but can't react well to short burst like Lucian's combo aa+Q+aa or poke. Also he is much better when he engages that when he gets engaged on thanks to his Q. Try to use E with 4+ stack because at 2-3 isn't worth the mana of your W+E combo. Best trade for twitch is aa+W+aa+E (use E after the trade ends). Try to keep refreshing your stack on the enemy and play more aggro if the stacks haven't faded yet. You get an HUGE powerspike at lvl 6 (think Vayne lvl of powerspike) and you win almost every all-in if your supp engage and you can line up the ADC and supp. Pretty much if the enemy ADC isn't fed at 6 you won the lane.
Shonjl (NA)
: Lets be real. The only reason Raka is "Cancerous" is because everyone in league hates champs that counter your damage, with Raka being the best at it. Let's look at all the healing champs and see why they suck? Kayle? Has probably been one of the most nerfed champions in the game. If she is in any way viable, she is OP, so she is gutted so hard that she has no chance at coming back. Sona? While playable somewhat, she has also been nerfed a lot since Riot hates auras, even though they made an aura champion. Nidalee? She is similar to Kayle in she is either pretty strong or entirely irrelevant. Atm she is good but no one bothers crying about her heal since people that do cry, cry about her damage. I dont count Janna since hers is in her ult. So all that is left is Raka. So please, people just need to stop crying that she counters "Muh Damages!"
Was talking about pre-rework Soraka AKA the illimitate sustain, point and click silence, Q spammer lane bully. That was dumb and Riot did the right thing when they reworked her. Just watch the LCS (when she was played mid-lane) and tell me if that was a fair and balanced champion.
: I agree completely with the OP. This is not the League I used to enjoy, I used to love League and picking up a mage like {{champion:16}} and {{champion:26}} when they could BOTH work as Solo laners. Both were much much better before Riot DESTROYED them and now Soraka is getting MORE nerfs because she was played ONCE in the LCS instead of the usual boring mix of Thresh/Alister/Morgana. I am TIRED of seeing the same champs like {{champion:117}} in the LCS. The bitch was supposed to be a support and now she's doing better then Soraka EVER did in solo lanes and somehow she's NOT getting a rework. The favouritism from Riot is annoying and completely unfair to AP mains like myself who prefer skill over spammy assassins and bruisers.
Soraka and Zilean were the most cancerous champions to play in a solo lane. Soraka was the only champ i ever felt dirty playing in top lane. Lets not pretend the changes weren't justified
: > [{quoted}](name=Silents429,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=gAXWkyUg,comment-id=000d,timestamp=2016-01-30T16:47:32.325+0000) > > Okay, what has changed? I don't see any posts about {{champion:114}} but here, it's like overnight everyone collectively decided it's time for {{champion:114}} threads. It's Fiora QQ week. We got bored of complaining about Rengar and Zed so now it's Fioras turn. I can't wait until {{champion:121}} is finally good again and we can all so QQ'ing about how broken he is instead of constantly asking for buffs.
You forgot the complain about Lee and of course the all time favourite Riven P.S. honourable mention to Yasuo
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A Chaotic Mind

Level 74 (EUW)
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