Dr Lav (EUW)
: A curious summoner reflecting over it's behavior, searching for guidance by fellow summoners
Remus Wins (EUNE)
: DARK COSMIC JHIN, DARK STAR KARMA & DARK STAR SHACO
I am very happy about the karma skin, but the Icon is kinda disappointing when compered to the others: https://boosteria.org/guides/dark-star-league-skins
: The problem with that rework was the fact that no one asked for more support mechanics on Karma. Karma mains old and new wanted many things addressed: 1) Address the fact that she has no gameplay identity and unique concepts within her kit. What does Karma do better than any other mage or enchanter? The answer is that there are champions who do her job better and are more fun to play. 2) Riot Game Developers not addressing glaring problems with her kit: the fact that she only has one damage move that is overloaded with power early game but blocked by minions, the fact that her Mantra W is the least used ability and has no ally function, the fact that Mantra W is abused in a role she shouldn't be able to abuse it with, and finally the Mantra E changes that aren't really that great when you think about the fact that they exist on two item actives. 3) Incomplete art assets, bland art assets, and art assets that do not match her theme and splasharts with in game models.
> [{quoted}](name=Winterkill,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=uL9pjojm,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-05-08T17:31:55.983+0000) > > The problem with that rework was the fact that no one asked for more support mechanics on Karma. Karma mains old and new wanted many things addressed: > > 1) Address the fact that she has no gameplay identity and unique concepts within her kit. What does Karma do better than any other mage or enchanter? The answer is that there are champions who do her job better and are more fun to play. > > 2) Riot Game Developers not addressing glaring problems with her kit: the fact that she only has one damage move that is overloaded with power early game but blocked by minions, the fact that her Mantra W is the least used ability and has no ally function, the fact that Mantra W is abused in a role she shouldn't be able to abuse it with, and finally the Mantra E changes that aren't really that great when you think about the fact that they exist on two item actives. > > 3) Incomplete art assets, bland art assets, and art assets that do not match her theme and splasharts with in game models. I actually enjoy her Q's in lane. You can poke the enemy by hitting the wave and in the same time you're pushing.
Dr Lav (EUW)
: "we've backed away from plans to put that on Karma" I am very happy about that. And I aslo agree with you that she is not fit for this ability. But correct me if I am wrong by giving her a charge system, you can not interact as much in team play as now. Would that not be considered as a nerf? And sure you would with much more ease get your second mantra in a team fight but in the same time it would take longer to get the third mantra in a team fight. And the way I play karma is that I try to survive as long as possible in a team fight so that I can land as many Q's, W's and assist as much with E's as possible. And is that not the right choice considering her low CD? And the price for that is that you would have a better burst as karma. And I don't rely understand why I would want that. She is good as she is but I wouldn't say no for some buffs ^^!
Btw she haves a lower win rate in higher elo https://champion.gg/champion/Karma/Support?&league=platplus
: Hi Meddler. I still don't understand how Charges and the current Karma would have different Mantra results. You're saying what I'm assuming are two different things: 1) You'd have easy access to Mantra possibly twice a skirmish. 2) You'd also run out of access until you recharge the charges. Currently a good Karma can almost instantly reset Mantra anyways, so the benefit end of this tweak probably would be negligible unless you explained more in depth where and when the charge system would benefit. It sounds like an outright nerf to me. Here's why: Karma's current skill expression is NOT in just Q spamming. It's in getting close enough to champions to secure a W, while moving fast enough to avoid skill shots, and then accenting play with Q's when W is secured as a root. It usually requires 2 sets of casts to kill, but is far more reliable than just flinging Mantra > Q. When you put a cap on Mantra recovery, the result is she may lose this identity, because it may remove her auto attack/w/ then Q viability. It would basically bottleneck her methodology into 2 volley Q spam, which is a reduction of expression. It basically turns her into a short range Zoe. Something I did like in the previous Karma talk: You mentioned that your Karma passive was going to activate on Large/Epic Monsters/Minions. That's a function not currently in the game, and I wouldn't mind that. Karma has a strong synergy with jungle minions already due to her R / W.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: February 15
"we've backed away from plans to put that on Karma" I am very happy about that. And I aslo agree with you that she is not fit for this ability. But correct me if I am wrong by giving her a charge system, you can not interact as much in team play as now. Would that not be considered as a nerf? And sure you would with much more ease get your second mantra in a team fight but in the same time it would take longer to get the third mantra in a team fight. And the way I play karma is that I try to survive as long as possible in a team fight so that I can land as many Q's, W's and assist as much with E's as possible. And is that not the right choice considering her low CD? And the price for that is that you would have a better burst as karma. And I don't rely understand why I would want that. She is good as she is but I wouldn't say no for some buffs ^^!
: > [{quoted}](name=Dr Lav,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=uL9pjojm,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2019-05-07T23:47:17.215+0000) > > I can understand that you could interpret that way but if you look my match history it's all support Karma Then you have no reason at all to complain. Similarly, unless you're one of the players who perfers to not actually support and only uses mantra for empowered Q's.
> [{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=uL9pjojm,comment-id=000100010000,timestamp=2019-05-08T00:53:08.431+0000) > > Then you have no reason at all to complain. > > Similarly, unless you're one of the players who perfers to not actually support and only uses mantra for empowered Q's. I am a karma support just as much as: {{champion:63}} {{champion:143}} {{champion:45}} The fun thing about this champ is that she is flexibel, I can both be the one making the shots and assist my team. But this reworks pushes karma to more of the support role.
: You didn't say anything about it not being unique though. No one else can do that. Basically, what you're saying is you like to play solo-lane Karma, which when it works is completely braindead and has little to no counterplay.
> [{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=uL9pjojm,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-05-07T23:38:28.135+0000) > > You didn't say anything about it not being unique though. No one else can do that. > > Basically, what you're saying is you like to play solo-lane Karma, which when it works is completely braindead and has little to no counterplay. I can understand that you could interpret that way but if you look my match history it's all support Karma
: I'm ok with it if they give me another free skin.
> [{quoted}](name=A Swarm of Koala,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=uL9pjojm,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-05-07T23:22:19.805+0000) > > I'm ok with it if they give me another free skin. Thank you for addressing the matter
Rioter Comments
: Hi all, I'm glad there are a lot of people really excited about the changes, but I think that I've heard two main negative sentiments crop up. I'll try to address them as best I can.     #\#1 - Karma's Ally W is broken with certain champs or will be super strong in coordinated play, forcing us to nerf her/balance her around her new W First, the new Ally-W is a strong effect. We wanted to give Karma a tool which has really great strengths when used effectively - experienced Karma players should be able to use this to the best of its abilities. However, we did very intentionally take a number of steps to try to mitigate these risk factors. 1. We gave Karma her _Souls Alight_ passive to help Karma understand when its valuable for her to use W without having to be on voice comms. Additionally, the flat Cooldown Reduction is applied fairly flexibly, opening up the number of picks that its useful with. We've noticed it feels great with Tanks, Mages, other Supports, ADCs with long cooldowns or mana hungry ADCs, so we're hoping that there are a lot of different viable targets and team compositions that feel nice with Karma. 2. The cooldown reduction applied has a stipulation to prevent outright abuse cases of back-to-back spellcasts (chain hard CC). Karma's W attempts to apply CDR every quarter second, but it will not reduce an ability's remaining cooldown to a point of coming off cooldown within 3s of the last time it was cast. This ensures a "3s buffer" between spellcasts affected by Karma's W. We believe this mitigates most of the straight up abuse cases associated with Karma's W. We understand that there's still some risk here, and will be actively monitoring anything that gets too out of control.     #\#2 - These changes feel like they are shoving Karma strictly into the support role/as a solo-lane Karma player, I feel underserved by these changes This is fair feedback. The biggest, coolest change is definitely the Ally-cast W, which primarily serves to help your allies. I'd argue that Allycast-W has a lot of applications for solo lane Karma, whether that's jungle ganks or teamfights. However, I think something I failed to deliver was the scope of buffs and tuning changes we're planning with these changes (since I did not include numbers). So I'll preview the tuning changes below. **Please keep in mind that these are not final numbers - we may change these drastically depending on initial balance reads from the PBE**: * Base Stats * Move Speed: 335 >>> 330 * HP Regen: 5.5 (+0.55/lvl) >>> 7 (+0.6/lvl) * Armor: 26 >>> 30 * Passive - Gathering Fire * Kindled Spirit * Cooldown reduced on Mantra from damage dealt: 2/3/4 (levels 1/7/13) >>> 3/4/5/6 (ult ranks) * No longer halved on auto-attacks * Now works against large monsters * Now operates on a charge system * Karma gains 1 charge per 7 seconds, to a cap of 3 charges * [NEW] Souls Alight * Karma can see an indicator for her ally's total basic spell cooldowns * Q - Inner Flame * Mantra - Soulflare * Bonus Damage: 25/75/125/175 (+30% AP) >>> 35/105/175/245 (+45% AP) * Detonation Damage: 35/140/245/350 (+60% AP) >>> 25/110/195/280 (+45% AP) * W - Spirit Bond * Cooldown: 12 >>> 16 * Mana: 50-70 >>> 70 * Damage per tick: 30/55/80/105/130 (+45% AP) >>> 50/75/100/125/150 (+60% AP) * Mantra - Renewal * Healing (per tick): 20% (+0.01% AP) of missing health >>> 15% of missing health + 25% AP * [NEW] Ally Cast: * Reduces an ally's basic ability cooldowns by up to 10s total over the bond duration (2s). * Mantra - Harmony * Plus 20/30/40/50s cooldown reduction. Returns 20% of Max Mana to the ally. * E - Inspire * Shield: 70/95/120/145/170 (+50% AP) >>> 75/100/125/150/175 (+55% AP) * Move Speed Bonus: 40/45/50/55/60% >>> 35/40/45/50/55% * Mantra - Defiance * Shared Shield Percent: 30% >>> 75%, split across all shared targets * Shared Movespeed Percent: 100% >>> 75%, split across all shared targets We believe that solo lane Karma is properly served by the base stat changes, adjustments to AP ratios, and relative strengths of the Enemy-W cast as a alternative option, but we will definitely see how these land and make sure that solo lane Karma players feel like they can play their champion effectively. However, I will reaffirm that proper choice of which cast of W to use in a given situation is an important skill for Karma in any lane - good Karma players will exercise the proper decisionmaking, both through the modal W cast and Mantra choice, her signature spell.
"I'm glad there are a lot of people really excited about the changes" Yea and as many if not more thats NOT {{sticker:sg-shisa}}
: Karma rework sounds cool as shit
: Hi all, I'm glad there are a lot of people really excited about the changes, but I think that I've heard two main negative sentiments crop up. I'll try to address them as best I can.     #\#1 - Karma's Ally W is broken with certain champs or will be super strong in coordinated play, forcing us to nerf her/balance her around her new W First, the new Ally-W is a strong effect. We wanted to give Karma a tool which has really great strengths when used effectively - experienced Karma players should be able to use this to the best of its abilities. However, we did very intentionally take a number of steps to try to mitigate these risk factors. 1. We gave Karma her _Souls Alight_ passive to help Karma understand when its valuable for her to use W without having to be on voice comms. Additionally, the flat Cooldown Reduction is applied fairly flexibly, opening up the number of picks that its useful with. We've noticed it feels great with Tanks, Mages, other Supports, ADCs with long cooldowns or mana hungry ADCs, so we're hoping that there are a lot of different viable targets and team compositions that feel nice with Karma. 2. The cooldown reduction applied has a stipulation to prevent outright abuse cases of back-to-back spellcasts (chain hard CC). Karma's W attempts to apply CDR every quarter second, but it will not reduce an ability's remaining cooldown to a point of coming off cooldown within 3s of the last time it was cast. This ensures a "3s buffer" between spellcasts affected by Karma's W. We believe this mitigates most of the straight up abuse cases associated with Karma's W. We understand that there's still some risk here, and will be actively monitoring anything that gets too out of control.     #\#2 - These changes feel like they are shoving Karma strictly into the support role/as a solo-lane Karma player, I feel underserved by these changes This is fair feedback. The biggest, coolest change is definitely the Ally-cast W, which primarily serves to help your allies. I'd argue that Allycast-W has a lot of applications for solo lane Karma, whether that's jungle ganks or teamfights. However, I think something I failed to deliver was the scope of buffs and tuning changes we're planning with these changes (since I did not include numbers). So I'll preview the tuning changes below. **Please keep in mind that these are not final numbers - we may change these drastically depending on initial balance reads from the PBE**: * Base Stats * Move Speed: 335 >>> 330 * HP Regen: 5.5 (+0.55/lvl) >>> 7 (+0.6/lvl) * Armor: 26 >>> 30 * Passive - Gathering Fire * Kindled Spirit * Cooldown reduced on Mantra from damage dealt: 2/3/4 (levels 1/7/13) >>> 3/4/5/6 (ult ranks) * No longer halved on auto-attacks * Now works against large monsters * Now operates on a charge system * Karma gains 1 charge per 7 seconds, to a cap of 3 charges * [NEW] Souls Alight * Karma can see an indicator for her ally's total basic spell cooldowns * Q - Inner Flame * Mantra - Soulflare * Bonus Damage: 25/75/125/175 (+30% AP) >>> 35/105/175/245 (+45% AP) * Detonation Damage: 35/140/245/350 (+60% AP) >>> 25/110/195/280 (+45% AP) * W - Spirit Bond * Cooldown: 12 >>> 16 * Mana: 50-70 >>> 70 * Damage per tick: 30/55/80/105/130 (+45% AP) >>> 50/75/100/125/150 (+60% AP) * Mantra - Renewal * Healing (per tick): 20% (+0.01% AP) of missing health >>> 15% of missing health + 25% AP * [NEW] Ally Cast: * Reduces an ally's basic ability cooldowns by up to 10s total over the bond duration (2s). * Mantra - Harmony * Plus 20/30/40/50s cooldown reduction. Returns 20% of Max Mana to the ally. * E - Inspire * Shield: 70/95/120/145/170 (+50% AP) >>> 75/100/125/150/175 (+55% AP) * Move Speed Bonus: 40/45/50/55/60% >>> 35/40/45/50/55% * Mantra - Defiance * Shared Shield Percent: 30% >>> 75%, split across all shared targets * Shared Movespeed Percent: 100% >>> 75%, split across all shared targets We believe that solo lane Karma is properly served by the base stat changes, adjustments to AP ratios, and relative strengths of the Enemy-W cast as a alternative option, but we will definitely see how these land and make sure that solo lane Karma players feel like they can play their champion effectively. However, I will reaffirm that proper choice of which cast of W to use in a given situation is an important skill for Karma in any lane - good Karma players will exercise the proper decisionmaking, both through the modal W cast and Mantra choice, her signature spell.
Why would you reduce her base movement speed and reduce her movement speed bonus when using E. Why would you give her a bigger shield and reduce her movement speed buff. I am not fan of the cooldown reduction on her W, it feels excessive. I feel like you are rely forcing her to the support role. I like karma because she is flexible now you'r forcing her to play more of a support. Why can't you focus on giving her more damage our making her more of a skill cap champion? longer range on Q when activated with mantra? You're forcing me as a karma player to be playing around my team more, because I cant utilize her full potential without her W, why would you force a certain roll one a champion like that?
: Karma Gameplay Change Preview
Karma is my most enjoyable champ to play by all the champs. Some points that makes me enjoy her: - How to use her q's on minions to make dmg on champions in lane, it's so satisfying beyond anything. - When I flash R + Q on enemy, this move is a total killer - How I can secure kills for my team, when my team mates chasing enemy and need to close the gap just a tiny bit and I rush in to give him the E so that he are she can close the the gap and execute - How I enjoy when enemy team _try_ to chase me - I love that her E gives her a movement speed, always loved having a high movement speed in any game I ever played. - I love playing her in team fights there is so much different plays I can do just as simple how I can go in and out with e's and q's _I am the one that can give out the shot our a reaching hand, I am the enlightened one _ I **don't** play karma to be independent In my team mates more than I already am, I play karma because I am flexibel as I am and I don't want to play a champ that will be so strong dependent in my team mates. I don't want to play a champ that can't utilize her potential without a team mate. I play karma because I am flexibel, I can solo carry game and I can be the support in the team. I don't want to pick any other champ than karma, by giving her a cd reduction to team mates she will be a pick thats not sufficient when we don't have champs that's independent in cd. If u want a unique champ as a support go make a new champs don't go mess up another one thats already a good support. I don't play karma support because I want to be a support. Just as much as a {{champion:1}} {{champion:63}} {{champion:9}} {{champion:99}} {{champion:54}} {{champion:518}} {{champion:555}} {{champion:161}} {{champion:45}} {{champion:143}} plays support
Prandine (NA)
: To answer your question I would definitely say that having a defeatist "when things get tough I give up" mentality is definitely detrimental to success. We've all had times where we've felt like the game was lost, whether due to us and/or our teammates constantly messing up or the enemies just being too powerful, but spending time complaining about it in the chat isn't gonna change anything. If anything it's gonna lower your teams chances of a comeback since not only is that time not spent playing the game but your teammates are forced to listen to you rage in the chat (assuming they haven't muted you) which distracts from the game. Sometimes just farming to late game can be enough to turn the tide of the game, which is something I find myself saying often in those situations. Having one member split-push while the others play distraction (or vice-versa) can also work sometimes. Some other advice: if you must rage then do so at the screen instead of in chat. This will allow you to vent your frustrations and not compromise your teams chances of success. Alternatively you could just hit a pillow or squeeze a stress ball or whatever if yelling out loud isn't an option for you. These are things I've done to help release some of my frustrations so they may work for you too. Finally I would say instead of focusing heavily on yours or others mistakes try looking for ways for your team to get back in the game and also try praising your teammates (a simple "gj" or "nice one/shot" and things of that nature will suffice in most circumstances) or reassuring them if they fail ("we'll get em next time" for example). I've found that teammates are often more willing to listen to me if I'm doing these things (not always but most of the time). Hope these helped some.
Yes It does help, Thank you for taking your time and giving me your opinions I am truly thankful. I totally agree that you can get back _especially_ in silver elo they do lots of misstakes the problem is that my team don't know how to play behind. But I see your point, I will definitely try be more positive in chat, I will try to not be toxic at all and try ventilate on the screen. I try improve my self so I can be a greater asset to the team and eventually I should climb. Btw do you know if you can you get reported for pinging?
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Dr Lav

Level 48 (EUW)
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