: No thanks sounds disgusting and will make me quit the game.
don't think people are against that idea :p
GGLineaR (NA)
: Uh, how much scripting is really needed to play those two well, exactly? That's more pathetic than anything else.
he uses script to automatically dodge skillshots everyone knows that he scripts because when you play against him and throw a skillshot, his champion bugs for nearly 1 sec before walking again watch wickd's video that i posted above
: We're definitely not looking at this as an easy thing to do, but I also don't think it's impossible. I'm also seeing a lot of people latching onto the idea we'll only be focusing on melee champs. More mages is another thing I'd be really happy to see in the botlane (how do we get more Ziggs types down there?)
I'm definitly not latching onto the idea that you will be **ONLY** focusing on melee champions Meddler during the ziggs stuff said that melees are harder to bring bot and thus mages will be first https://i.gyazo.com/9825b53535c50bb4e2866358b5477ee5.png But what you have to keep in mind is: Mages go mid to get an XP advantage just like in dota2 if you bring them bot, it would mean that the XP advantage from mid is no longer relevant to a point where decision making would not be increased since you gain the same thing from going mid or bot Going bot should be because you're a late game powerhouse that needs protection in early game So i suggest you look at Mages who are really risky choises to play mid due to being immobile or squishy and easy targets for ganks
: Wait, you mean our favorite memers actually play the game between two posts and are good at it ? _I'm still trying to climb out of bronze !_
jokes on you malicious is not good at the game unless the game means mordekaiser {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-popcorn}}
Penns (EUW)
: If it replaces Hexdrinkner/Maw Im in {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-thumbs}}
i do agree {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-thumbs}}
: A Look at Past Non-ADC Bot Lanes
{{champion:24}} was played as an adc before his rework that nerfed him chaox played jax+soraka bot to counter urgot in season 1 http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=1122460 the reason he went bot is essentially like morde during season 5 he was broken af and had around 50% dodge
Penns (EUW)
: Idk if it would be balanced even then tbh. Negating Syndra ult, Fizz ult and stuff with an offensive item. If they ever do it I think they would at least give it a delay like {{item:3814}}
make it a morgana black shield don't give 100% magical immunity, but like a scaling magical damage shield that lasts 3 seconds and gives cc immunity for the duration
: Scripting Twitch+Lulu premades are terrorizing diamond+ soloQ again
i'm going to complete this thread made by my friend https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTPpdf7FKGc wickd already pointed out this issue, and **EVERYBODY IN HIGH ELO KNOWS THAT HE SCRIPTS** for people who don't know Rat Irl: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IiMu8WHUe3M boost accounts by scripting to challenger, makes easy money from it gets banned then script again to challenger literally plaguing the game when the ** are we going to tyler1 him?
Penns (EUW)
: Ye but league items are garbage compared to dota so youd have to nerf it a lot. 100% magic damage reduction + cc immunity for 10 seconds lel also another item to fuck fizz over because delays :[
yea reduce it to 3 seconds or something
Penns (EUW)
: But unlike adcs, melee champs need counterplay so they wouldnt make blink dagger :)
i don't really care about blink dagger at this point of the game tbh but i do care about BKB tenacity is garbage and it doesn't even have gameplay because it's permanent BKB is more effective and has gameplay built in it you need a good reaction time to BKB in time, because you can't use it while being cc'ed you need to use it on the right moment the right timing it's way more skilled than tenacity
: Regarding the newest Riot Video
quotting maple nectar: > [{quoted}](name=Maple Nectar,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LTMxGH15,comment-id=0003000200000001,timestamp=2018-01-21T00:16:07.274+0000) > > Definitely agree with the short list. Some of the other things that we need to make sure are that they can contribute to objectives (turrets, dragon etc) meaningfully in early/mid game, _**as well as scale up adequately with game length**_ so that you're not gimping yourself if you take a melee bot into a ranged bot and lose when the game gets to 30 because they're able to take objectives faster. These are all just things on very long lists of problems we'll need to solve for it, but I'm excited. See, Melees already scale well with game length Mordekaiser is able to kill a 8k hp cho in 4 sec in late game (malicious feel free to post your gif) as fast as a 6 slots vayne in late game Thing is Melees are **unreliable** it's rare for them to dish out all of their damage in teamfight unlike marksmen So Riot announced that they would introduce items to make compositions without marksmen working and i can only think about 2 items http://i.imgur.com/1v8JBdH.png https://i.ytimg.com/vi/4jm81wAd7dk/hqdefault.jpg i'm sorry but what else? Melees are as reliable as ranged in dota2 because of blink dagger and black king bar Now Now Riot might have other ideas of items to make melees more reliable, but feel free to tell me what kind of items can make melees more reliable other than: -a blink -cc immunity for a very short duration i feel like {{champion:23}} {{champion:11}} would be op with it, but they need a rework in the first place so they should not hold the balance of melees in hostage
Rioter Comments
: Not marksmen are the problem. The problem are the melees themselves since they don't have reliable gap closers or escapes. Yasuo and Morde work on bot because(besides mordes xp passive) they have shields to negate most of the damage from poke. They kinda have to rework the supports into more "melee friendly"- champs or more procteting champs who can provide help to melees in early stages which wouldn't work because marksmen would abuse it. They could also try to give more sustain to melees in form of items. Not sure what you think about it but maybe a different form of dorans shield which will act like a xin ult except instead of blocking damage it could reduce the damage in a certain range and become the full damage the closer you get? Melee toplaner wouldn't abuse it and marksmen on top wouldn't be such a problem anymore. Just my 2 cents tho :P
Mordekaiser also works because of his insane sustain Afterall, the video said they're looking into **items** to make a comp without marksmen so it will be more about items making melees and other champions like mages able to lane bot against marksmen+supports maybe they will make an item giving bonus xp in duo lane like morde passive? maybe they will make an item reducing poke, i have no idea like maple nectar said, there is a lot of ways they just have to pick the good ones
Wuq (NA)
: What Kind of None ADC Composition Do You Guys Want?
skirmisher: {{champion:164}} (is a diver but feels like a skirmisher to me){{champion:23}} {{champion:157}} juggernauts: {{champion:122}} {{champion:2}} mages: {{champion:82}} {{champion:8}} {{champion:268}} {{champion:45}} selection will be such a clown fiesta just like in dota 2 and i love it
: This would be the kind of things that's completely on the table / we've started exploring. We can accomplish this goal in quote a few ways, just a matter of finding/picking the right ones
maple nectar!!!!!!!! https://youtu.be/x0XVYu88vmQ **As a diamond/master tier Mordekaiser+Blitzcrank player and Dota2 player i have my own idea about what you can do** if i can make it short i suggest you look into: -creep aggro -base ad of marksmen -reliability of melees -**XP sharing in the bot lane** creep aggro really doesn't help against ranged poke bot base ad of marksmen hurts so much if you try to farm melees are really unreliable Mordekaiser is the only melee able to work bot **because of his XP passive allowing to get lvl 3 faster than any melee** Sincerly
: Beta and early season 1. Garen/Taric bot lane was the best, but I'm also biased.
you had every combination possible in beta, people were not smart my first ranked game in 2011 was brand+blitz against morde+annie top
: Can we go back to the fighter/support bot lane days? Even if it's just for a week?
  Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=I am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AfANT7FR,comment-id=001300010000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-20T21:04:55.638+0000) > > Except i SAID she is picked when the broken adcs are banned > > it's just like soloq, she has 46% win rate because other hypercarries are overpowered Except she's been like that regardless of who was on top ever since before Worlds (and she still showed up at Worlds). She needs a shift in gears, if anything.
i'm literally starting to lose my patience with you Before world **she was top tier and beyond busted** after world, kog trist twitch are broken and SINCE WORLD they didn't get nerfed how do you expect cait to be good when nothing changes? the hell
: AND THIS friends is why Aurelion NEEDS some love when full on MELEE
He missed his ult He could have literally used Q+Ult combo to kill her He could have run in a straight line and get bonus movement speed from E but he decided to stand still nothing wrong indeed
: > [{quoted}](name=I am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AfANT7FR,comment-id=0013000100000000,timestamp=2018-01-20T20:42:39.804+0000) > > cait can't abuse solo queue easily? > > lol ok If she could (as she is now), she wouldn't have such a low solo queue win rate despite still being shown interest in the pro scene, from Worlds to now. > what? > she had 50% win rate the entire year In the pro scene, I said. The issue with your argument is that it allows you to easily pivot the goal post. Jinx and Cait don't necessarily need blatant buffs. They need *power shifts* that bring their solo queue and pro scene performance closer together. I see the move they're pulling on Jinx as an attempt on that front.
Except i SAID she is picked when the broken adcs are banned it's just like soloq, she has 46% win rate because other hypercarries are overpowered
: > [{quoted}](name=I am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AfANT7FR,comment-id=00130001,timestamp=2018-01-20T10:17:56.333+0000) > > Not being in the LCK doesn't mean your champion is weak > Being in the LCK means your champion is fine > > that's how it works I disagree ENTIRELY. Solo queue is an environment where some champs appear significantly stronger or weaker than they *actually* are. Twitch? People bitch about him, but he's just abusing solo queue. Sona? Just abuses solo queue. Jinx? Same deal. Cait? Can't abuse solo queue easily, but there's elements of how she plays that's *really* good if you have a team to coordinate with. This is ultimately a team game, so I'd claim that taking advantage of solo queue randomness at a 50% win rate isn't as valuable of a balancing point than actually being useful to an organized team, but on a lesser win rate. > For Jinx, it's the same case than Cait, trist kog picked--->no reasons to pick jinx And if Jinx is overshadowed by other marksmen for *a full year,* then yes, something is wrong.
cait can't abuse solo queue easily? lol ok >And if Jinx is overshadowed by other marksmen for a full year, then yes, something is wrong what? she had 50% win rate the entire year
Rioter Comments
BubbaV (NA)
: why are you calling it flee footwork
: You didnt understand what he is talking about probably because you dont play toplane. Its not about balance, its about healthy playstyles. Maokai wastes his Q? He still has his W and some saplings in the bush. Once their cc finishes, Maokai has his Q again. Plus he is tankier and has natural sustain so why bother. Ornn's W shields him for 2,5 seconds at the start of the duration, then marks you with brittle for 6 seconds. Thats 9 seconds you have to substract from the "12 seconds" (sure, 12 seconds if he is lvl 3 and hasnt rushed cdr), and even if you engage then, he can still slow you with Q, or E out or into a nearby wall. I dont personally think Teemo is an issue, and Hash only plays AD bruisers which Teemo is supposed to counter, so he may be biased on this one. Riven always had this same problem, non-existant cds, spammable mobility and bufferable Q so you end up chosing all your fights. Although Riven has long since stopped being the worse offender. Now take Illaoi for example. If Illaoi wastes her E, even if she may be currently overpowered, you can safely trade with her because she has nothing to disengage nor retaliate. I mean, she could retaliate, but that would only make her eat more free damage to get a couple of weak-ass AAs and maybe a Q that can be dodged so whats the point. Its kinda like playing aggresive against a Blitzcrank while he has hook on cd. Or playing aggresive against a Zed that has W on cd. They still have other abilities, sure, but they cant trade effectively without that one primary ability. With the majority of toplane champions, there are no windows of oportunity, no punishable mistakes. Everyone has his abilities up all the time and the lane ends ups being decided by picks and jungler presence instead of skill. And even if you outplay ur opponent somehow and stomp lane the ADC is still gona solo u in 4 AAs so whats the point lol. But thats another topic. Honestly I dont like Hashinshin as a player nor as a human being, but when he talks about the problems of toplane without the in-game tilt he is usually on point.
don't forget that maokai Q doesn't have 8 seconds cd at all ranks too, it's a scaling CD unlike for instance renekton Q who which cd doesn't scale with levels maokai Q cd is so low in lane not only because it scales, but also because of the things you said there is literally no widow of opportunity against him
: This is some quality design right here
that's not a design problem clickbait at its finest
: Well, one reason for shy (and seju) useing fleetfoodwork is because it works in the jungle and gives them sustain for the early clears, while press the attack only works on champs. >then explain why draven goes for aery? camille goes for comet? Both have poor AS scaleing, so getting the bonus AD rather than bonus AS from runes makes a big difference on them. Not saying press the attack is very attractive right now, but alot comes from the overall state of the game and runes system. Linking stats to the primary tree is rather stupid imo, there are plenty of champs that can't really go for intteresting keystones because the'd end up with bad bonus stats for them. The current state of the game favours save early laneing(in high elo) to minimize the risk of an opposing snowball, so an all-in focused mastery like PTA is not as wanted as a savety+sustain mastery like flee. Toplane has a similar issue there going for all-out trades exposes you to the jungler that can punish you very early, which also generally favours ranged poke and tanky cc bots over bruisers, since all-out trades are the one big strength of most bruisers and if they can't really use that strength, they struggle alot. The overall powerlevel of runes is just to high, and the (to) strong runes outshine the ok ones. Imo it's like with adc, nerf the ones that dominate rather than buffing the ones that struggle, we don't need more powercreep. Also, did you ever see lethal tempo on anyone ever?(exept maybe Vayne or Kog) that one is basically a more shitty version of PTA...
i saw lethal tempo on jinx kog aatrox it will work once the overheal flee footwork relic shield thing disappear
Rexxiee (NA)
: It needs a buff for everyone, its bad on adcs aswell, all you have to do is take PtA on any champion, then 20 mins in you press tab and check its damage done and compare to every other damage keystone in the game and have a good laugh. The last nerf needs to be reverted, idk why they keep nerfing precision when inspiration and sorcery are the trees dominating the game (+ resolve keystones).
Lol it's rare that i agree with you let's nerf triumph and coup de grace when stopwatch is disgusting
Penns (EUW)
: He would if it gets buffed
So? Yasuo is doing good with a good keystone (flee footwork) if he goes for an other good keystone there won't be any change of power
Penns (EUW)
: >if you're a melee champion you're literally exposing yourself to little reward for a long time i mean goddamn it reminds me of a 2 second delayed mark hehe I wouldnt mind a melee buff to it but ya gotta nerf {{champion:102}} and maybe {{champion:240}} {{champion:157}} then Also Draven goes Aery/Klepto for de AD
nerf yasuo who doesn't take press the attack sounds good
Rioter Comments
: he mean irelia frost skin{{sticker:sg-ahri-2}}
: Ya watching SKT vs Jin Air game 2 just confirmed my beliefs. ADCs are disgusting and so is Caitlyn. Watch that and tell me Caitlyn is underpowered. Absolutely ridiculous. 1k autos, literally.
inb4 "but she lost" when cait wasn't the problem, but faker outplaying them like hell
: > [{quoted}](name=I am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A2knAsWj,comment-id=000a0001,timestamp=2018-01-20T12:23:48.005+0000) > > {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-popcorn}} > > well played unless she's on ice.
: > [{quoted}](name=bbQsauçe,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A2knAsWj,comment-id=00050001,timestamp=2018-01-20T08:32:10.278+0000) > > {{champion:98}} {{champion:516}} 48% winrate both, on a good day.
And? they're beyond broken, ornn is getting a nerf in next patch shen manages to go through the radar while ruining high elo games and pro games, just because plat players make him look balanced Also, you point out morde's win rate who has 0.6% pick rate, i assumed that everyone on this boards knew how statistic works
zero356 (NA)
: On a completely unrelated note, if Irelia is your standard for THICC You don't really know THICC
{{sticker:slayer-pantheon-popcorn}} well played
iiCrispi (NA)
: So Where did you end up in Season 8
Diamond 1 last season placed in plat 1 currently d5 69 lp
: Beside the standard definition of abusing there is also the abusing in a way that the keystone itself is too strong and while there are other keystones existing, nobody takes them. Have you seen any mage taking phase rush? Even dedicated mages like Cass and Ryze who before were using stormraiders dont even bother taking phase rush because both comet and aery is more than decent on them. On ryze it is actually kinda busted since he has all spells single target and barely any cooldown so he spams comet all day.
Lol what? cass and ryze go for unsealled spellbook where did you see aery and comet on ryze and cass?
: I mean, that's kind of unfair. You quote the LCK for why Caitlyn's fine and doesn't need buffs. Jinx hasn't been pro scene viable for a year, regardless of meta, and she's ALSO fine? How does that work?
Not being in the LCK doesn't mean your champion is weak Being in the LCK means your champion is fine that's how it works Twitch is not picked but that doesn't mean he's weak, because in this context him not being played makes sense in organized play Cait picked and this means the pros find her good when other broken adcs are banned For Jinx, it's the same case than Cait, trist kog picked--->no reasons to pick jinx
Elohaven (NA)
: You know what tilts me as a Vayne main about Vayne right now
yea because everyone is on shiphtur's lvl obviously el le mao
saltran (EUW)
: Maybe only looking at pro play pickrate, and in the pro play only looking at KR isn't the best way to see if a champ is weak or not. Pro play matters but there's more to look, or at least talk about how Cait works in the Lck, she is 1 win-2 lose, and in the games look if she's performing right or being carried, if she is a liability or if she is crucial.
Twitch is worse in organised play because they will disengage and engage at the right time when he uses ult additionally they buy pinks against his stealth to prevent him from flanking Cait is obviously better in organised play, and if you don't count twitch that has a handicappe, the fact that she gets picked when trist/kog are banned just proves that she's decent enough to be picked and other adcs should be nerfed
: That's not a buff, lol. You could easily pass 120 at the mid levels if you were stacking armor and MR. It's a buff to low income tanks (supports) and non-tanks (top laners). It sucks for real tank players.
you're talking to someone who made a post about post buff aftershock being abused by fizz vayne and shaco
Penns (EUW)
: >where did you hear it? https://youtu.be/TOBeYJ1ikVs?t=8m40s of course adcs are gonna abuse fleet footwork buff now and the top laners that are played have better runes. It got nerfed for a reason tho. If Jax is good with Klepto he doesnt suck imo, assassins arent good with anything except kat in soloq hehe
i don't care why it got nerfed i'm not playing in the past jax is decent, not good, with kleptomancy and klepto is going to be nerfed if the top laners that are played have better runes, it simply means that press the attack is garbage and cannot make its users relevant also flee footwork isn't broken, press the attack is garbage i played 3 games of cait with it and hardly felt any differences edit: also the part you linked was talking about **jax's design, not his current power**
Penns (EUW)
: tl,dw: Jax sucks and Ornn W has 2 seconds cooldown. press the attack and grasp + others like Klepto dont exist so bruisers have no keystone hehe
Jax sucks right now unless you abuse klepto on him tho i didn't hear anything about jax in this video where did you hear it? also press the attack is beyond garbage it's not even picked on A SINGLE CHAMPION in lck not bruiser, adc, or anything it's pure garbgae
: Pretty much sums up the state of top lane and the frustration top laners face
i posted it but deleted it cuz it got posted on meddler's gameplay thoughts and meddler said that he's going to give a reply in next tuesday/wednesday so i saw no point in posting it a second time, it's not going to make meddler giving an answer faster
: Why go back to BO1?
i thought this was a discussion about black ops lmao
Rexxiee (NA)
: Dont see how those stats make caitlyn look any better, shes trash tier in solo q (btw 43~45% win rate in diamond) and barely even a thing in competitive. Besides you dont even know how they are going to buff her, she could def use something like an actual base attack speed so she can actually be a thing late game. I mean i cant take you seriously when you talk about adcs after the whole "jinx is so good right now doesnt need a buff".
you think i can take you seriously when you point out a never existing win rate? no i don't no point in discussing at all actually
: > [{quoted}](name=I am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zRQctLFU,comment-id=00010000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-19T20:24:07.181+0000) > > No Yes. Jhin can build crit and pen like any other marksman. It's "harder" for him to get through tanks, but he can eventually get through tanks. It's a matter of efficiency, and he's the least efficient for it. Doesn't mean he *can't.* > because the others are broken as fuck If you just "nerf them all" we go back to early game bullies being too strong, like the lethality days. Also, Ezreal is still a strong pick...so there's that I guess? > and? > i'm sorry that you're unlucky dude I'm saying it's a bullshit excuse at this point. Like legit bullshit. > which explains her nerf in late season 6 XD STARTING in season 5.
crit jhin takes about 12 shots to kill a tank compare this to twitch who literally kills a tank in 4 seconds you're literally making yourself unable to be taken seriously well played
: The crazy thing is, LeBlanc is (probably) even older than him. {{sticker:slayer-jinx-wink}}
: > [{quoted}](name=I am Rubick Sama,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zRQctLFU,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2018-01-19T19:51:21.290+0000) > even lucian who's garbage atm can kill a tank > the only adc who can't is jhin due to kit issues Jhin can kill a tank just like any adc objectively can at this time. The point is that hyper carries are picked when you *really* want to deal with a tank, sacrificing early game power in order to deal with them better when *they* hit *their* powerspikes. With that said, Jinx is the worst hyper carry to actually pick, and has been for a long time, assuming we exclude the nonsense and baboonery of solo queue. > Jinx is viable, she has 50 % win rate > she > does > not > need > a buff Jinx isn't a competitive pick to other hyper carries. Like, she just isn't. > and the same is viable for cait who has 46% win rate Cait actually had a Worlds appearance while being even weaker than she is right now. Jinx didn't, save one loss, in a meta full of hyper carries. Jinx isn't a competitive hyper carry pick, hence the changes. I made a large post on the topic earlier, but short, watered down posts are the only ones that get attention so I made this one. > those adcs are overwhelmed by incredibly busted adcs that are kog/twitch/trist/ezreal/vayne who are right now pick/ban in lck See, the weird thing is, that for my favorite champs, there's always some weird "excuse" for why they sort of just never show up in pro play anymore. "Eh, it's not their meta." "Eh, everyone else is op." "Eh, they'll show up eventually." Maybe, just maybe, solo queue isn't exactly the end all, be all measure of if a champ's *actually* good or bad, and maybe, just maybe, Jinx actually has been struggling as a hyper carry ever since she was gutted, started from late season 5. I'm not saying she needs to have a massive win rate to be fixed. I'm saying that this specific change *should* be made, even if they nerf other parts of her kit afterwards. The lack of a proper steroid is a major part of her issue, anyway.
> [{quoted}](name=chipndip1,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zRQctLFU,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-19T20:19:51.014+0000) > > Jhin can kill a tank just like any adc objectively can at this time. No >Jinx is the worst hyper carry to actually pick, because the others are broken as fuck > See, the weird thing is, that for my favorite champs, there's always some weird "excuse" for why they sort of just never show up in pro play anymore. "Eh, it's not their meta." "Eh, everyone else is op" and? i'm sorry that you're unlucky dude >started from late season 5. which explains her nerf in late season 6 XD ok dude ok
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I am Rubick Sama

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