: Just gonna burry the dream of riot showing love to ad assassins
What? Ghostblade is buffed, if anything - losing 5 AD and 100 gold for 20 more ooC MS and a doubled speed on the active (initially, at least) is a worthy trade-off. Duskblade is weird - it loses 10 AD and the true damage of the passive proc, but gains 10% CdR while being a lot cheaper. The proc seems to be a tad on the weaker side with only 150 damage, but still does as much damage to squishies for quite a while (150 physical damage is better than 150 true damage unless the target has 40% physical damage mitigation, which means 66.7 Armor). Still, if it does not enough throughout the game, the proc's damage is a simple lever to tune.
Rioter Comments
Skorch (NA)
: Thats a problem with Caitlyns balance, when AAs are all underperforming collectively, no one complains about ADCs, thats because they are REALLY Binary. When 1 is strong, odds are they ALL are. This cause an honestly excessive and completely blind hatred towards anything that even smells ADC.
Good that Riot does have their own opinions on balance, and don't generally listen to the Boards and Reddit, eh?
: >Are ADCs overbearing? How many ~~roles~~ classes are viable bot lane?
Do you know why ranged, auto-attack-based champions are the virtually only viable bot lane option?
: > [{quoted}](name=Malicious Metal,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=cRaTbjHi,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-06-26T22:48:46.172+0000) > > I KNOW this is a team game, and I like it for that, but not everyone's effectively 20% of a team's power as it all revolves around our buddies in the bot lane carry position. believe it or not, but in season 3, season 4, or basically at almost any time of league, it was like this https://youtu.be/Bbn0szRR4GA?t=3670 xin building locket renekton building black cleaver into full tank the entire team relied on ezreal to do damage i remember clearly as i was a PURE TOPLANE main in season 3, i never played any other role except when old selection forced me to i had 82% win rate on shen on 40 games, renekton was one of my most played champ and everytime, i went full tank and relied on my adc to win on both champs and there is nothing wrong about that, because you still have your own impact **believe it or not** , your adc won't win if you don't manage to dodge shit/block skillshot ect... it's a teamgame and everyone has his job **_my only problem is marksmen being mandatory, other than that, the adc ROLE (not marksmen) being the center of the game is fine, it works like this in dota 2_** by the way: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6dPbIee3OI&feature=youtu.be
> my only problem is marksmen being mandatory, other than that, the adc ROLE (not marksmen) being the center of the game is fine, it works like this in dota 2 The thing is, due to the way XP works, this will not be changed easily. Game always has a marksman because they are, as ranged auto-attack-focused champions, the least negatively affected by sharing XP - unlike melees, they don't require the base stats from leveling up for safety, as range seldomly scales with levels. And auto-attack DPS scales WAY harder with gold than with experience - for most marksmen, base AD is barely doubled between level 1 and 18, whereas the AS gain from levels does not exceed 68%. Contrast abilities, whose base values are often tripled between rank 1 and rank 5. To truely offer an alternative to marksmen in the bot lane, Riot needs to find a non-problematic way to make less XP-dependent mages. For example, they could revive Cass' old stacking passive - that was feeling odd on her kit back then, but was, at least in theory, a way to make a champion's strength scaling somewhat XP-independent. Current Cass did a 180° turn from that direction, though - the implementation of her MS/lvl passive made her more XP-dependent, and thus a worse bot laner.
Dasdi96 (NA)
: ADC season 2 vs season 7:
Season 2 ADCs were doing comparable DPS to Season 7's ADCs at four offensive items, though. The difference between then and now is that back then, these ADCs were balanced around having to purchase at least 1 defensive item (GA, Banshee's or QSS - which did not have an upgrade!). Also, S2 tanks had far superior anti-DPS tools: Randuin's slow had a 20% proc chance, but slowed AS by 35% for 3 seconds. In addition, the active applied this AS slow, as well. Frozen Heart was 20% AS reduction.
: Why ADCs are always going to be meta, and why that isn't a bad thing
No, this is not the reason why there is always an ADC in the duo lane, specifically. This is more like, the explanation why it is advantageous for teams to always bring an ADC. The reason why teams usually put an ADC in the duo lane position is because the class consists of champions that are either completely auto-attack based or that are focused around using abilities and auto-attacks in tandem. This means that they are the least negatively affected by sharing XP.
Lyseth (NA)
: Tested out this build on several adc's
Did you tell your friend to build this: {{item:3075}} ? Because Thornmail shuts that build down completely in a 1vs1. To outdamage that build's sustain (35% Lifesteal, 51 MR) with the scaling damage of Thornmail alone, one would need 268 Armor. That's Thornmail and another big-ticket Armor item, for example a Randuin's.
: {{champion:114}} {{champion:92}} you would think {{champion:420}} but her winrate's been on a downward slope since the tank update
In Illaoi's case, isn't the reason for her sinking winrate the fact that the more common top laners work quite well against her? In addition to the higher focus on resistances being somewhat detrimental, as she cannot build penetration beyond Cleaver and is almost purely physical damage? Death's Dance itself seems to be quite popular and good for her - http://current.lolalytics.com/champion/Illaoi/
: Spellvamp was a problem, but Lifesteal, Attack Damage Vamp and Damage turned into Bleed is fine.
There are a few facets that make pure Spellvamp **in an item** problematic, compared to Lifesteal, Physical Damage Vamp and Omnivamp. - Abilities are diverse in their damage profiles, targeting types and executions, with quite a lot of them being reliable burst. As such, Spellvamp is a type of burst healing, as compared to Lifesteal which is tied to the sustained damage output of auto-attacks and thus works in a more sustained manner itself. - Most mages do not particularily benefit from Spellvamp due to their more alpha-strike nature (fire everything at once from full HP, retreat to wait for CDs). Also, most mages are constrained in how well they'd be able to employ Spellvamp, anyway, due to their dependance on a second resource. - For mages without a restrictive second resource (aka, without mana), access to early Spellvamp can utterly break their laning phase, due to essentially removing the need to back except for shopping. Previous problem cases in that regard: {{champion:85}} {{champion:8}} {{champion:84}} {{champion:68}} {{champion:55}} {{champion:82}} - Beyond mages, Spellvamp also has the potential to majorly break bruisers like {{champion:102}} or {{champion:77}} , due to the combination of high base damages and tankiness to amplify the healing's effectiveness. Riot learned that with the first version of {{item:3104}} . Contrastingly, Spellvamp in champion kits does not feature this problem (their kits are balanced around it individually). As for Physical Vamp and Omnivamp, they don't suffer from these problematic facets as much. - Firstly, Physical Vamp is basically an improved version of Lifesteal. thus sharing its nature of working in a more sustained manner. Omnivamp is similar, but even more encompassing, and works on all damage. - Both effects are tied to items that work best on champions who are more focused around sustained damage output, as both items build from a Lifesteal-based component and thus feature auto-attack improving stats.
: The fix for midlaners to be better carries is probably to add more spellvamp items tbh.
No. A carry threat is a champion with high SUSTAINED damage output. Most mages are burstfocused. If you want to play a carry midlaner, play {{champion:69}} {{champion:13}} {{champion:8}} {{champion:268}} {{champion:30}} .
Kyunsei (EUW)
: Posting here the post of **Glory ln Death** (NA) (give a medal to this man, he sums it up greatly) --------------------------------------------- Every position except Bot has multiple viable classes that normally fill it. Support has Enchanters/Catchers, Tanks, and Mages. Mid has Assassins and Mages. Top has Divers, Skirmishers, Tanks, and Battle Mages. Jungle has Divers, Assassins, Tanks, etc. Bot has Marksmen. Not only that, but Marksmen go to literally every other position. Why is it a problem when Ziggs Bot has under a 5% pick rate? Marksmen should not have a monopoly on the Bot position. Just because other champions can viable be played there does not mean Marksmen are weak. It means that they aren't oppressively strong.
The reason the gold-getting partner of the duo lane has virtually always been marksman is because that champion class - ranged, auto-attack-focused champs - suffers the least from sharing experience. You don't see melees in a duo lane, as they absolutely NEED the tankiness that comes with additional levels (between levels 1 and 18, base stat tankiness triples to quadruples. Offensive stats, meanwhile, barely double for most marksmen). And purely ability-focused champions suffer as well, since they want the extra levels for the benefits of more ranks on their abilities (lower CD, higher base damage, better utility) - and unlike champions with a mixed ability/auto-attack-focus (like {{champion:202}} {{champion:236}} {{champion:81}} ), purely ability-focused champs don't have their autos to fall back on. That is also the reason why something is utterly screwed up if you see a Juggernaut in a duo lane - they are the single most XP-dependent champion type in the game, between being melee, rather ability-focused (low AS in general) and having the highest base stat increases with additional levels. Morde was the one Juggernaut who played bot, and he only could because he got to ignore the XP penalty of the duo lane.
Rioter Comments
: "...we'll start to prioritize reworks based on need rather than on a champion's specific class."
Yeah, I like the idea as well. That is not to say that the class updates did not have their place - after all, they idea there was to bundle work on champions with work on items. For example, the Marksman Update made sense in that regard, as it modernized not only the champions themselves, but also their itemization options - introducing a few new items and majorly tweaking existing ones.
Memesy (OCE)
: Marksthings? Is that a joke or is that a genuine category?
Joke. There is no further distinction in Riot's Marksman category.
Pyro (EUNE)
: Riot wants to rework assassin items - what would you want to change?
An idea for {{item:3252}} : Taking a camp on your side of the map takes 30 seconds of the cooldown. You'd still need three distinct journeys to poach the three necessary camps, but you can chain them faster.
Meddler (NA)
: Likely stuff in 7.14 or 7.15.
Good to hear. I hope, though, it is not again something changed with the ult. Would it make sense to have Cho's Q work somewhat like Sion's Q, starting smaller than now but being able to grow a bit bigger?
: Is it safe to say Maokai's rework was a complete failure?
No, it is not safe to say that. Was he released underpowered? Definitely. Did Riot work to get him to a good spot? Also definitely. From a look at the stats, he looks fairly good now: http://current.lolalytics.com/champion/Maokai/Jungle/ 58.86% winrate for the best users is top 10 in the game. And I won't be surprised if he is even stronger in 7.13, since they are buffing the tank jungle items.
: {{champion:113}} {{champion:3}} {{champion:78}} {{champion:44}}
If you think about it, Galio is rather similar to Sion in his telegraphing: - Winds of War is a distinctive motion and two rather slow-moving projectiles. - W needs to be channeled to have a real radius. - E has the charge-up. - R has the delay between the target circle appearing and Galio smashing into it.
: I don't remember seeing any Gnar or Poppy buffs, and your lack of an explanation for what theirs were makes me suspicious. The others were superficial, and haven't done anything to improve their performance.
http://www.surrenderat20.net/p/current-pbe-balance-changes.html#balance
: The tanks who aren't Sej/Zac/Mao need to be changed too
Top lane tanks got screwed over, for the most part, because they finally nerfed the laning crutch that was Sunfire Cape. Now that the item is mainly a waveclear tool instead of giving you more power in champ-to-champ combat, the ability of tanks to lane got turned down. I even made a threat on it back when the tank update hit: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/bYuQIwXF-mstu-observations-on-top-lane-tanks Since then, quite a few tanks got buffs: {{champion:33}} got a minor rework, and looks fairly decent in the jungle - which was always more of his home than top lane. {{champion:36}} , while not being a true tank, got buffed, as he was affected by the Sunfire nerfs. {{champion:54}} 's E got buffed with an increased Armor ratio. He is back at a winrate of about 51% on top lane. {{champion:14}} 's W got buffed to have a lower CD and a better HP ratio. On PBE, there are also some more beneficial changes: {{champion:150}} is buffed. {{champion:78}} is buffed. {{item:3001}} is changed to build out of Catalyst, giving lane tanks a really nice build path for that item. You'd think that tanks really ought to like Catalyst's passive - mana sustain through the damage they take, and health sustain based on their high mana costs. {{item:3751}} is cheaper and accessible after a full jungle clear. ---- Also, I'd like to contest your assertion that tank items, overall, took heavy nerfs in the tank update: {{item:3742}} got a goldneutral stat change and a positive passive change. {{item:3143}} got a hefty nerf, I agree. {{item:3001}} got improved for tanks (and gets even better on PBE). {{item:3194}} and {{item:3193}} were added - and while the former is somewhat underwhelming, the latter is a massive powerhouse. {{item:3065}} got first buffed, but then nerfed as it was too strong. {{item:3068}} got a goldneutral stat change, but the nerf that harshly affects its champ-to-champ prowess (and now awaits a cost reduction). {{item:3083}} was buffed. However, what really signifies the changes to be a buff to defensive itemization were the changes to Black Cleaver and the Last Whispers: While the combined HP/Resistance items were changed to have higher emphasis on the Resistance part, the ArPen of these items went down significantly (by roughly 20%).
Pyro (EUNE)
: Riot is thinking about buffing the Ancient Coin line. What do you think needs to be done about it?
> Stat line Overall, the stat line of the item is acceptable. Although I miss the time when the item gave movement speed, and would love to see that returned. > Gold gain game Can't say that I terribly like the minigame. As far as interactivity is concerned, it is a lot better than the previous mechanism, but I really dislike that the enemy team is very capable of cutting you off from your gold source, especially if you're playing a non-frontline support. Maybe the item could benefit from a return of the HP-per-nearby-minion death mechanic? > Quest Compared to the other two item lines, the quest is rather underwhelming. Coin merely gives you a skill point, whereas Relic Shield gives you a Shield for about 8-15% of max HP of a typical support's HP pool and Frostfang gives a massive speed boost (50% for up to 3 seconds).
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: June 16
If Kindred's buffs are not enough, might it make sense to target her base AS next? She has quite a low base AS for champion that needs to auto-attack so much.
: I find this very unlikely that you all blew all your combos, zed and diana alone going lets say class cannon should have killed that mf. If you didn't kill her the enemy team most likely helped to protect her. Shields, and heals. If 3 assassins are all full comboing her at the same time, someone missed. I find that extremely unlikely that she lived to tell the tales by herself.
Three assassin going all-in on a ADC is, by numbers alone, impossible for the ADC to survive. Each of them will do at least 2000 raw damage if they hit everything, in the span of at most 3 seconds. While MF might have 2k base HP, a 345 point heal and BT's 350 damage overshield, she will not have nearly enough resistances to raise her effective HP to 6000.
: I can see why they nerfed Quinn
Yeah, I feel you, even as a Quinn player. Which is why I'd like them to eventually shift her pattern to be a bit more sustained, but less burst. Although not every Quinn player thinks that way.
: Lee Sin is still the most popular jungler by far.
Most popular, yes. Still, his popularity is on the decline since his nerfs: http://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/stats/leesin/jungle/platinum Also, he doesn't seem to be as strong anymore: lolalytics.com/champion/LeeSin/ He still is played a fair amount, due to him being strong early (gank-heavy meta) and rather broadly appealing. But, as long as his performance reflects that popularity, I don't have as much of a problem with him.
: > [{quoted}](name=Seenan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=q9ueuWan,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-06-14T14:28:39.687+0000) > > I think Lucian's gonna take somewhat of a hit just based on this bugfix, along with other champs that end up building both. Why was this a thing? Lmao. Why the bug was a thing, or the item synergy? Bugs pop up, and people don't notice. Until someone thinks that combining those two items might actually work. Kinda the weird thing about these two items is, back when Riot decided to revert BC back to the Kindlegem recipe, (Trying to cement it more as a Juggernaut item) They also nerfed the passive on Giant slayer. On the basis that the HP discrepancy should be higher before the damage amp kicked in. The reasoning behind that adjustment was to remove synergy from the two item. Because BC countered Armor, and Giant Slayer countered health, it wasn't a Healthy combination. And now we have the same problem with BotRK, because it also counters health.
The issue with Lord Dominik's and Cleaver was not that it countered health, in itself. Rather, the problem was that the combination took out a huge amount of Armor (more than 50%, usually) and still countered Health.
LankPants (OCE)
: That's because that Syndra nerf was fucking giant. There's a reason why Riot rarely touches AoE sizes, small changes have huge impacts. In fact they did this exact same change to Syndra's E before and it destroyed her that time as well.
I'd argue that changing an AoE's size often has a huge impact because it messed a lot with their user's muscle memory and feel - hits that would've occured under the old system might not occur anymore, and you are required to not only learn this in your head, but also in your fingers and muscles. To that end, I find it easier to adapt to such a change if you willfully let yourself get rusty with said champ by not using it for a while, then pick it up again.
: That's an interesting interaction if it's true.
It never did that. I tested it multiple times. Everyone just thought it did because they forgot about his 6-stack Leap range increase.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: June 13
> ...make out of combat movement speed something you choose to itemize into rather than just getting... Like the sound of that. > ...make Duskblade a decent 1st item... How so, and how will you prevent Quinn from becoming broken with it? > change access to CDR/impact of Black Cleaver In what way would this be accomplished? Having Cleaver's CdR stack with extra bonus HP?
: And all of them have hundreds of upvotes? Shit I thought Malzahar/Karma/Kog'maw was insane, this is just ridiculous. Every post about Rengar shoots to the top and has hundreds of upvotes. I agree with their points but I wouldn't rule out someone using alts, its getting to a ridiculous level and completely came out of nowhere.
Or linking to /r/rengarmains .
: I think something like this would really improve her quality of life.
Maybe limit it to the first four-five marks, as well - enough so she can possibly catch up to her biggest power jump (4 marks and 575 range), but not enough so she suddenly gets access to too easy a mark in a game of tower trades.
: @Riot: State of the Rek'Sai Rework?
2 more days, then 7.12 will hit live. With a few Rek'Sai buffs concerning points 1 and 2.
: i wrote the most popular one, and I can honestly say I've ever been to that subreddit, and tbh I rarely eve go on reddit in general. I just wanted to express my opinions and ideas.
You don't need to have gone there yourself. It just needs someone to link your thread, and some dozen copy(knife)cats. If anything, take it as a compliment to your original thread. It seems to be written well enough to gather such as response.
: I think the problem with Kindred's rework is they changed up her play pattern and failed to fix her biggest issue. The problem with the play pattern is her damage used to be focused on her AAs, but now it scales better on her skills. This isn't a big difference, but it's there. Her autos also used to get better damage and now they get better safety. The other problem is she's always been a bit of a win-more champion, in that from how her passive works, she's either going to snowball or be snowballed against. Riot didn't fix that, they didn't do anything to make it easier for her to get back into the game, and for her autos, they made it worse by making her need 4 stacks to get a little bit safer. If I could sum up the problem with Kindred as a jungler is that she's very team dependent instead of being a jungler that enables her team. That's why I call her a win more champ.
Hmm. Maybe have her marks start to appear in her own jungle if her outer ring of towers is down? That's when you really lose the opportunity to go into the enemy jungle, and it becomes equally risky to enter your own...
: Indeed. Help me talk sense into them lol. But they're right about one thing. She isn't in a good spot yet.
Which is why she has a few buffs on the PBE.
: every juggernaut has been on a slow decline
Shouldn't {{item:3800}} be better for Juggs come the next patch?
: Come on man. While there certainly are individuals, the vast majoirty of the community is a hivemind. Take a look around. Throw a few popular buzzwords around and the community jumps ship in an instant. Legit look at the front page. There are like 10 Rengar threads on it. A month ago everyone overwhelmingly hated Rengar. People ***overwhelmingly despised*** old Rengar's design and now we're begging for it back. Same shit with LB. The community absolutely despised that champ and now they want her back. Same shit, different story. Over and over and over and over and over again. > the community is not a hive mind 90% of it is without a doubt.
These upvoted Rengar threads are probably coming from someone linking all the Rengar threads on the Rengarmains subreddit.
Salson (EUNE)
: I'm starting to think a jungler can never go full damage and be healthy, I don't mind being proven wrong though. At least I know where {{champion:238}} and {{champion:91}} are. And the camo is nessesary now that ping wards were removed.
I don't agree on that - there are junglers that are healthy if they can go full damage, and there are also junglers that would be an issue with full damage if they were laners - case in point, Rengar. The issue is more, imo, that junglers that can go full damage (or, in fact, need to go full damage) and be strong early. I'd imagine that the overhauled Kindred, once they are balanced, are going to be a more healthy full damage jungler.
: Yeah I know it does, because i've played ADC with a Lifesteal item + Red Pot, and still found myself dying to Thornmail People who say "one lifesteal item invalidates thornmail" are full of shit
Quite possibly. Although I'd say that Thornmail's effect could be communicated better - for example, by displaying, for the Thornmail user and his attacker, Lifesteal and Thornmail damage in a single instance (for example, by saying "+ 50 - 70", the 50 being green for Lifesteal and the 70 being purple for magic damage).
: Isn't Zac a little overpowered?
Yes. Which is why he has nerfs on the PBE.
: "So damn easily" I'm sorry is your single thornmail supposed to outweigh his TWO lifesteal items? What?
Even then, Thornmail does outweigh the two Lifesteal items here. To counter Thornmail, an ADC needs MR and ArPen in addition to Lifesteal. > [{quoted}](name=ProfDrDeath,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6EbGEiPH,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2017-06-12T05:25:22.000+0000) > > Let's just look at the numbers, shall we. > > The ADC in your example probably has 51 MR, since you did not buy him an MR item. Converting Phantom Dancer's passive, said ADC has 72 effective MR. > > **Lifesteal = Percentage of damage x ratio of (Thorn user's Armor + 100) to (Thorn attacker's MR + 100)** > > With current Thornmail in the above formula, a {{champion:33}} with his 109 base Armor would need, against an AD with your build, 101 bonus Armor after Last Whisper's ArPen (155 bonus Armor) to negate all the ADCs 27% Lifesteal - but merely for the scaling damage part of Thornmail. This calculation does not account for the flat damage. > > So, no, Thornmail is not useless because it gets countered by Lifesteal. In fact, it is the other way 'round - a Thornmail user is NOT a valid Lifesteal target. > Thornmail is simply not used because the item is too specialised and too cost-ineffective - it doesn't help you much against possibly 4/5ths of the enemy team, and it is a 2200 gold item for a class that is starved for item slots as is.
: Then why would people buy IE. It would give 20% crit, and 70 AD, and nothing else. Sounds like a useless item buy.
I think that, in the end, Riot will rework IE.
: Okay, so even on Rammus, Thornmail is still a piece of garbage.
Let's just look at the numbers, shall we. The ADC in your example probably has 51 MR, since you did not buy him an MR item. Converting Phantom Dancer's passive, said ADC has 72 effective MR. **Lifesteal = Percentage of damage x ratio of (Thorn user's Armor + 100) to (Thorn attacker's MR + 100)** With current Thornmail in the above formula, a {{champion:33}} with his 109 base Armor would need, against an AD with your build, 101 bonus Armor after Last Whisper's ArPen (155 bonus Armor) to negate all the ADCs 27% Lifesteal - but merely for the scaling damage part of Thornmail. This calculation does not account for the flat damage. So, no, Thornmail is not useless because it gets countered by Lifesteal. In fact, it is the other way 'round - a Thornmail user is NOT a valid Lifesteal target. Thornmail is simply not used because the item is too specialised and too cost-ineffective - it doesn't help you much against possibly 4/5ths of the enemy team, and it is a 2200 gold item for a class that is starved for item slots as is.
Yara0 (NA)
: So its been 11 days...... Can i complain about the Kindred and Rek'Sai reworks now?
No. Both of them already have buffs one the PBE, after all.
: > [{quoted}](name=Shuyin178,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=r4YWtMMo,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-06-10T21:18:42.789+0000) > > I made a post awhile ago about Riot making a new item system. > One that focuses on > Melee Only (melee champion only items) > Ranged Only (ranged champion only items) > Neutral (anyone can use items) > In a small sense this is already in the game with Hydra and Runann's, but a system that fully separates them would allow balancing of 1 class without screwing over the items for another because it would block 1 class from even being able to use them anyways. the problem with this is that it creates rigid game design and kinda destroys the itemization system. In essence, an item should never be gated by whether it is melee or ranged, as if it does than it is inherently poor;ly designed. When Riot limits something to melee or ranged only, they are effectively admitting defeat in terms of game design. An item should be designed to where the player is the one that comes to the conclusion of how ineffective it is based on synergy they discover, not because the game outright prevents them from using it.
The exception being things like the Hydras and Hurricane, whose effects don't really work on the range type they are prohibited on, respectively.
Avienal (NA)
: Lets Discuss~ About why Blade of the Ruined King is having such a massive impact currently~
https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/s1u3EYma-the-thing-with-the-ruined-king Some thoughts of mine on the subject.
: her nerf is gonna be base movement speed reduced by 5. That would be the biggest slap on the face LOL
You might laugh about it, but 5 base MS reductions can be a lot more impactful in game than they seem on paper. Movement speed's value is not necessarily about each champion's numbers in a vacuum, but more about the differences between all champions.
Meddler (NA)
: That could be a good approach yeah. OOC MS looks like it's probably more snowbally on those items than predicted. Could remove if from some, strengthen it on others to make them easier to balance and more distinct. Having said that giving assassins non direct combat power's also got some good arguments for it (more ability to start good fights, less just raw 100-0 potential).
Both aspects certainly have their merit. Although I'd argue that making the items more distinct would serve as a tool to lessen single-item snowballing - if, for example, Duskblade was more damage focused and Ghostblade was more mobility-focused, having only one of them would make an assassin good in 100-0 potential, but lacking in ability to start good fights (Duskblade) or being able to start favorable fights, but lacking raw 100-0 potential (Ghostblade). Besides, if you buffed Lethality, I'd wish that you'd take a look at Quinn to ascertain whether the stat should be as good as it is on her currently. Personal feeling is, no, Lethality should not be as good on her, as her 100-0 potential is not really fun to play against.
Meddler (NA)
: Some items with Lethality on them are too weak. Planning to work on those in the short to moderate term.
Concerning Lethality: How much of a difficulty, balance-wise, is the fact that all Lethality items are intrinsically also giving out-of-combat MS? And would that ooC MS be a possible avenue to tune these items?
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ProfDrDeath

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