: The lore based Vs event I want for 2020
{{champion:126}} vs {{champion:112}} PLEASE. Both are pretty dated, their animations are kinda ugh, but have such cool kits and can really use a Legendary skin, Viktor's can change with every upgrade for example, while Jayce Idk, just give them some love
: We need raptor cloak back
Oh yes I miss it on {{champion:122}} and just imagine building it on {{champion:875}} and run at people, dayum
: I said it as well and got downvoted to oblivion. His kit is goddamn disgusting. I think his W shield should just be removed and his hp regen needs to be nerfed.
> [{quoted}](name=Waaaarrrrgggghhh,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xNZJHyQe,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2020-01-30T23:55:05.641+0000) > > I said it as well and got downvoted to oblivion. His kit is goddamn disgusting. I think his W shield should just be removed and his hp regen needs to be nerfed. Yeah and then lower his AA to 10 and his MS to 100 too. Did you really think at least 1 second before typing this bull?
: Ok so now that we have so many adcs can we get a "Pretend" skinline.
{{champion:119}} {{champion:15}} Fidget spinners.
: Even though it will forever keep me in silver/gold, I will keep my enemy under his tower every game and slap him hard if he dares to walk out. Sometimes it's quite satisfying when the jungler comes twiche or 3 times to give you double kills. Some other times unfortunately the opponent slaps me 100 to 0 before I can touch him. But NEVER, and I mean NEVER will farm under tower or do the boring freeze. Always forward. Since we are all gentlemen here, I feel obliged to share with you my chad champion pool. {{champion:122}} {{champion:875}} {{champion:106}}
> [{quoted}](name=200 IQ OPTICIAN,realm=EUNE,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=PvEx8gAE,comment-id=000d,timestamp=2020-01-22T12:02:29.877+0000) > > Even though it will forever keep me in silver/gold, I will keep my enemy under his tower every game and slap him hard if he dares to walk out. > > Sometimes it's quite satisfying when the jungler comes twiche or 3 times to give you double kills. > > Some other times unfortunately the opponent slaps me 100 to 0 before I can touch him. But NEVER, and I mean NEVER will farm under tower or do the boring freeze. Always forward. > > > Since we are all gentlemen here, I feel obliged to share with you my chad champion pool. > {{champion:122}} {{champion:875}} {{champion:106}} You indeed are a true gentleman, sir. We are fellow juggernaut mains. We do move forward. We do want the confused jgl and/or mid to gank us, more people=more brawl. Gain advantage and then make them farm under their tower, trembling while trying to hit those lane mini-gentlemen while calling for their little friends from other lanes, only to make you hug them as well. {{champion:122}} {{champion:420}} {{champion:875}} {{champion:82}} Chad fellow gentlemen unite.
: > [{quoted}](name=Ryusaether,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=apRimAPN,comment-id=00090002,timestamp=2020-01-17T06:11:41.531+0000) > > Sett gets demolished by {{champion:122}} {{champion:420}} and probably {{champion:82}}, while freight train juggs have easy chances to avoid his true dmg burst with their mobility, so it's a "skill" matchup. He gets countered by ranged but has means to survive and kill them, and in teamfight he's a beast (like other juggs when they meet their condition to shine). > I don't know where your hate comes from, but I don't think your points are really valid in this case. No he doesn't lol. He wins. I played him myself. I never actually played against a Sett top. Darius and Morde are super easy match ups for him. Illaoi also not that hard if you know what you are doing. Sett doesn't even struggle as hard against ranged match ups as other juggernaut, because he has so much regen. But I am not gonna pretend that he is "good design" just because I always win with an overtuned champion, that's just pure hypocrisy. If OP wanted to discuss "good design" maybe he should have told us what "good design" even means. For the people who say he is "not overloaded"... idk what your definition of overloaded is and I don't care because it's just another meaningless attribute similar to "good design", but Sett has a double passive, damage and regen, and a low cooldown basic ability that gives him aoe damage and a shield and smaller aoe true damage, basically stronger than a lot of ultimates in the game. If you think Urgots W (used to have the shield) and Ornns W (used to have a shield), Ekko W, were or still are overloaded/too strong whatever you call it, than Sett is like them just stronger.
> [{quoted}](name=Salty Mc Feed,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=apRimAPN,comment-id=000900020000,timestamp=2020-01-17T07:17:39.381+0000) > > No he doesn't lol. He wins. I played him myself. I never actually played against a Sett top. Darius and Morde are super easy match ups for him. Illaoi also not that hard if you know what you are doing. Sett doesn't even struggle as hard against ranged match ups as other juggernaut, because he has so much regen. > But I am not gonna pretend that he is "good design" just because I always win with an overtuned champion, that's just pure hypocrisy. If OP wanted to discuss "good design" maybe he should have told us what "good design" even means. > For the people who say he is "not overloaded"... idk what your definition of overloaded is and I don't care because it's just another meaningless attribute similar to "good design", but Sett has a double passive, damage and regen, and a low cooldown basic ability that gives him aoe damage and a shield and smaller aoe true damage, basically stronger than a lot of ultimates in the game. > If you think Urgots W (used to have the shield) and Ornns W (used to have a shield), Ekko W, were or still are overloaded/too strong whatever you call it, than Sett is like them just stronger. Yeah ok you played against randos and/or people who don't even know what Sett does and can claim he destroys them. Illaoi absolutely dumpsters most melees, Sett is no exception, try watching one of the latest Dirtymobs video, and Darius completely statchecks him on paper, they have a similar kit but Darius is more sticky and has slower delayed damage that gives him time to wait for Sett's bar to dissipate and then burst him keeping stacks and then ulting. Sett does decently against ranged, but far from well. His passive regen helps, but it doesn't matter if you can't hit them. Immobile ranged are a bit easier, but you have to waste your AA reset on Q to get the MS, and/or take {{summoner:6}}. His kit has good extra things, but it's not like he has a kit with so many tools like Camille, he's maybe more overtuned in the things he has. And please don't compare different champions with a similar ability but a whole different kit. Ornn has tons of knockups, a poke ability with decent range, a giant AoE ranged Knockup. I think they should've kept the shield on him and reduced the W damage but whatever. Urgot is mid-ranged and has ranged poke, Ekko is an assassin with 1 super delayed stun and beefy shield that ends rather quickly, I don't even know why you're bringing back these champions, it's not like they are that annoying (and Ekko is not annoying because of the shield imo). Sett's niche is to take damage and deal it back to you, if you remove that from him he doesn't have much going for him. Remove the shield and he dies in a second, remove the damage and he isn't a threat. But, for example, remove {{champion:114}}'s reposte massive AS slow, do you think she would become a useless champ?
: This is hilarious. Clear strengths and weaknesses? Can we talk about this idea of having counterpicks as the only clear weakness? Is that really interesting design, is this what you wanna depend on when playing top? Sett outclasses the older juggernauts and just beats them either by straight up killing them in lane or by being the better teamfighter. It's really just juggernaut powercreep. Now Riot isn't gonna change their non existent balance philosophy any time soon so I really don't care, game isn't gonna be balanced anyway, but for the love of god stop making cringey posts like these "ohhh random new champion X has really good design unlike random new champion Y and Z". Nonsense. You can't even tell us why he is good design other than you enjoying him, most likely because you win melee match ups super easy as Sett.
> [{quoted}](name=Salty Mc Feed,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=apRimAPN,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2020-01-16T09:58:48.312+0000) > > This is hilarious. > Clear strengths and weaknesses? Can we talk about this idea of having counterpicks as the only clear weakness? Is that really interesting design, is this what you wanna depend on when playing top? > Sett outclasses the older juggernauts and just beats them either by straight up killing them in lane or by being the better teamfighter. > It's really just juggernaut powercreep. > Now Riot isn't gonna change their non existent balance philosophy any time soon so I really don't care, game isn't gonna be balanced anyway, but for the love of god stop making cringey posts like these "ohhh random new champion X has really good design unlike random new champion Y and Z". > Nonsense. > You can't even tell us why he is good design other than you enjoying him, most likely because you win melee match ups super easy as Sett. Sett gets demolished by {{champion:122}} {{champion:420}} and probably {{champion:82}}, while freight train juggs have easy chances to avoid his true dmg burst with their mobility, so it's a "skill" matchup. He gets countered by ranged but has means to survive and kill them, and in teamfight he's a beast (like other juggs when they meet their condition to shine). I don't know where your hate comes from, but I don't think your points are really valid in this case.
: I did not say monsters are bad, I said, why does he look so ugly? He's about as generic as it gets. Try comparing him to Mundo or zac Seriously, play Dead Space and you'll kill this guy 100x over. You've probably seen him a bunch of times in other undead monstrosities as well What defines him? Right there, he's just unpolished and looks like he was just made to murder weak people and not to be a lethal weapon forged by a demon to act as his body? Put him against garen, who wins? Garen...he blocks every weapon he has and just mows him down. Darius? The same happens {{champion:56}} , the guy can kill you in your dreams and is a horrifying phantasm that watches as your outlook on life gets bleaker and more akin to death before he kills you by rending you to death
> [{quoted}](name=3TWarrior,realm=NA,application-id=EBBIvmVK,discussion-id=dRGWF2p1,comment-id=00080000000000020000,timestamp=2020-01-15T17:33:09.232+0000) > > I did not say monsters are bad, I said, why does he look so ugly? He's about as generic as it gets. Try comparing him to Mundo or zac > > Seriously, play Dead Space and you'll kill this guy 100x over. You've probably seen him a bunch of times in other undead monstrosities as well > > What defines him? Right there, he's just unpolished and looks like he was just made to murder weak people and not to be a lethal weapon forged by a demon to act as his body? Put him against garen, who wins? Garen...he blocks every weapon he has and just mows him down. Darius? The same happens > > {{champion:56}} , the guy can kill you in your dreams and is a horrifying phantasm that watches as your outlook on life gets bleaker and more akin to death before he kills you by rending you to death He's not FORGED BY A DEMON, he's simply TRAPPED in there, probably by some ritual like in the previous lore. And your claims are based on thin air. Who says the entity itself isn't powerful enough to rip people to pieces, crack armor or what else? You are looking at the puppet and sayjng "oh yeah that thing is harmless", completely ignoring the monster inside it. We don't have lore, short stories, or anything else, yert you are judging it based on your assumptions. And as for {{champion:56}}? If you just had to look at his artwork, walk and run and 1 of his ability, would you think he's scary or a real threat? I don't think so, looking at him almost makes me laugh. "Woah bois, generic spooky ghost BUT THIS TIME with armblades is coming at us!" {{champion:86}} *spins his magic sword and kills it* Instead, we know his lore, and he's much more than just that (though he really needs a visual update, he's not scary and his animations are clunky as hell), but who would've said so? It's incredible how lore and a complete champion can help you judge it, don't you think so?
: once, twice maybe? You say that he is really well done, but he looks completely generic. What defines him? The dragging claws (done to death) ? the claw blades on his other hand (probably over a thousand years old and you see it EVERYWHERE despite it being not very efficient) ? how about his pointed beak face with red eyes? it's generic...very generic. Even the tongue thing...
> [{quoted}](name=3TWarrior,realm=NA,application-id=EBBIvmVK,discussion-id=dRGWF2p1,comment-id=00080000000000030000,timestamp=2020-01-15T17:41:29.327+0000) > > once, twice maybe? You say that he is really well done, but he looks completely generic. What defines him? The dragging claws (done to death) ? the claw blades on his other hand (probably over a thousand years old and you see it EVERYWHERE despite it being not very efficient) ? > > how about his pointed beak face with red eyes? > > it's generic...very generic. Even the tongue thing... Its base is that he's a scarecrow, even if he doesn't look much like one, so he doesn't really need to be that memorable in his appearance, even though it looks cool as heck, maybe not a super new concept, but one never seen this way in League. What's memorable about him is that he's THE horror creature in League of Legends, he's the crawling monster you hear tales about, he's the boogie man of this universe. Not everyone is memorable by their appearance, in fact I dare to say that a lot of LoL champions are pretty generic even after reworks/VU ({{champion:86}} {{champion:82}} {{champion:103}} {{champion:84}} {{champion:14}} {{champion:13}} {{champion:48}}), but you remember them because of how they interact in the world of runeterra and for their in-game features, or quotes, or uniqueness in the game itself. Heck who would remember Garen if not for the spinning meme? He's just a generic Paladin (now they are giving him some attention in the Lore as well, at least). I'm all down to get finally a creepy champion in LoL, and imagine how spooked new players would get from seeing that aberration running at them with its demonic hands coming from the cage. And I know a lot of people are just like me, many of them voiced the need of a really scary champion, and seeing the animations we got he's pretty uncomfortable to see at first glance, it really got my attention. It's the concept, the power fantasy it has that sells it, not only its appearance (which is pretty damn cool to me). So ppease wait at least for the champion to come out, with all its animations, interactions, spells and lore, before deeming it unworthy of praise.
: no, but I at least expected it to look like someone spent time and effort into making the character Someone could throw this together in a machine shop in like an hour or so What's memorable about this? What is there to define his character? If you just make a monster, why would you play it?
> [{quoted}](name=3TWarrior,realm=NA,application-id=EBBIvmVK,discussion-id=dRGWF2p1,comment-id=000800000000,timestamp=2020-01-14T19:32:00.967+0000) > > no, but I at least expected it to look like someone spent time and effort into making the character > > Someone could throw this together in a machine shop in like an hour or so > > What's memorable about this? What is there to define his character? If you just make a monster, why would you play it? How many times have you played a game and told yourself " I would really like to play as the enemy/monster"? Personally I did that a lot, and a lot of games (Dead By Daylight, Last Year after Dark and even some platformers) prove that people like playing as the mindless killing monster. Heck, how many people love the Demogorgon? He doesn't have much personality, yet people still love him and many other monsters. This Fiddlesticks is really well done, and all his develomwnt updates prove that they really were into it while redesigning him, I don't think your point really stands taken these factors into account tbh.
: The art is sooo good
Do you know where I can find all the artworks of this countdown? I can't open the client at home and I really wanna check them all, this is the first I saw.
: If you could ban ONE champion from the game...
{{champion:67}} Since I don't play ADC anymore I can't keep her under check (used to play {{champion:119}} and demolish her). Now I play juggs only top ({{champion:82}} {{champion:122}} {{champion:420}}) and I have to ban scum the likes of {{champion:23}}, so I have to waste my ban on this mess of a champ and get a Vayne either top which is a complete nightmare (because she has %hp true dmg, a repositioning tool, a getoff me option + potential stun, and MS to chase you down after dodging your only chance to get to her) but at least you can manage something there with the jgl maybe (or Ghost Darius) or get her botlane and risk your bot feeding her and you come out of lane winning but then you look at her in teamfights and she explodes you and then all your team.
: What did you watch? I couldn't find a single gameplay video on youtube that I would consider meta. Only attack speed on hit, crit, lethality, full tank clickbait garbage. I don't think he is underwhelming, I think his normal playstyle is actually busted. Bruiser build + Stoneplate, ult tank into enemy team, be unkillable and do a massive true damage blast. His impact is massive.
> [{quoted}](name=Salty Mc Feed,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NEXvGNAu,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-12-18T12:19:53.327+0000) > > What did you watch? > I couldn't find a single gameplay video on youtube that I would consider meta. Only attack speed on hit, crit, lethality, full tank clickbait garbage. > I don't think he is underwhelming, I think his normal playstyle is actually busted. Bruiser build + Stoneplate, ult tank into enemy team, be unkillable and do a massive true damage blast. His impact is massive. I've seen someone go the jugg build, but he really can't do shit vs ranged (I can only imagine his lane phase against the likes of {{champion:85}} {{champion:126}} {{champion:67}} {{champion:133}} {{champion:74}} {{champion:17}}) and is still lacking in his sustain/burst resistance tbh (for the playstyle he has at least) Didn't think about the stoneplate though, that sounds neat.
Rioter Comments
Abyzmal (EUW)
: OPINION: Riot has turned Pyke into a complete mess.
They ruined Pyke because people complain when a champ (specificalli supports) get to be played in other lanes and they don't know how to counter them. They removed every interesting micro he had and made him a gold-generator ultbot. On release he was pretty annoying with the Armor build, I think the best spot was when they mase him scale off lethality+AD and didn't have the "your cut" passive so unbalanced. They should've just tuned some numbers or made him a bit more vulnerable like putting the recent changes (hp is fine maybe but the W regen just killed him imo). Dunno, it's just sad to see the champ in this state.
: > [{quoted}](name=Ryusaether,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=5Zf6slUr,comment-id=000c,timestamp=2019-11-01T09:31:46.042+0000) > > Voted {{champion:102}} and {{champion:56}} > > Both because they really don't deliver on their theme in my opinion. > Shyvana is supposed to be a dragonborn, a strong humanoid with dragon powers that can become a fierce and strong dragon, but right now she's just an AA based champ that can be built as an OTP burst mage with only 1 available spell. > I would like to see an hybrid juggernaut with proper abilities, maybe keep her a bir auto-based but give her more satisfying abilities. > Noc really doesn't deliver on the power fantasy of a nightmare incarnate, ult aside. His model is so clunky an not spooky, and his abilities don't scare at all, much like {{champion:9}}. > > I don't think they are worse than {{champion:72}} nor {{champion:36}}, but they are the ones I look forward to the most. Sounds fair, everyone have a point of view of why they want to pick {{champion:72}} or {{champion:102}} or {{champion:56}} or {{champion:36}} all these people made great points and I totally understand why each of them need the VGU - {{champion:102}} Just like you said, she can rely more on her dragon form by possibly advancing empowering herself in passive? For example, she can grow defense and other stats at level 6, 11 and 16, possibly at 16 she can be a permanent dragon form? I could be wrong there, but there are multiple ideas of a dragonborn character. I expect Shyvana to have an amount of CC over on hit damage. She could be played as a juggernaunt indeed but possibly a Vanguard as well if she is going to have a CC in her dragon form, just like how Gnar plays as 2. **Around {{champion:78}} Poppy level rework** - {{champion:56}} His ultimate might be the spooky ultimate in game, but it doesn't provide an interesting concept of a "fearful ultimate" I do think his overall theme of being a jungler shadow is great theme, but they could work on his visuals and improve/change his abilities a bit into more interesting concepts. I think he should be played mostly as an assassin, no CC but full amount of damage, so his " nightmare " will be scarier in later game if they keep a similar concept to it. **Around {{champion:84}} Akali level rework** - {{champion:36}} Has pretty old graphical design, he is indeed looking funny over "madman" I don't mind him being funny at all, but that's not the main problem because the main problem is that realizing his kit is weird and adding to the way he looks visually is also out of place is the reason his priority is pretty high now, and I am assuming that's why people wanted to have a VGU so bad. He could be really reworked from scratch and change his abilities into more of a madman juggernaunt who can also rely on such health regeneration as well. As for his cleaver weapon, It would make more sense if he breaks armor physically and deal a physical damage instead of % magic damage. His W and E could be more interesting, really. **Around {{champion:14}} Sion Level Rework** - {{champion:72}} Is a complete different story about him really, he is completely away from his lore. As a Shuriman scorpion who is meant to be a lethal predator, Venemous, deadly, mean and big. There is no way to see him in game like that. Skarner should be a duelist late game jungler because his lore applies him of being the one to not get close to or never mess with, he is not suppose to be a walking tank. I agree that he could use defense in his gameplay and itemization but a deadly venom to any sort of tank that deals % damage overtime is definitely recommended on this concept of a character. When they said in lore "Skarner guards his crystalline area" doesn't mean he is a guardian or anything, people got it wrong back then, it means that he is self-guarding predator who is going to say "Get closer to me and I'll sting you to death, no matter who you are" Yeap that's what he is exactly saying, he is a scorpion afterall, and he is also big guy. As for his visuals, I think he really needs work from scratch because Skarner should represent an savage appearance over cute appearance, I believe he looks cute in his original con and in gameplay, I don't mind him looking cute at all, but his theme requires him to look savage. Take a look at his comerades {{champion:58}} {{champion:75}} they do look savage, and Skarner should be the savagest of them so as for his visuals, I think he needs to look an intimidating scorpion king, a shuriman armor on his neck, and bigger pincers, longer sting, and larger overall body with scales, thicker legs would be fantastic and perfect form of a the Scorpion King. As for his gameplay, there is too much to mention because nothing really makes sense on him now, aside from his W which shields him, I understand that this is something he can use in his VGU, but every other ability could use a full rework to something that matches his predator theme. I would go ahead and say that his rework should be **around {{champion:114}} level rework in terms of reworking most abilities and adding % damage dueling combat.**
> [{quoted}](name=I say Facts,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=5Zf6slUr,comment-id=000c0000,timestamp=2019-11-01T13:44:22.338+0000) > > Sounds fair, everyone have a point of view of why they want to pick {{champion:72}} or {{champion:102}} or {{champion:56}} or {{champion:36}} > > all these people made great points and I totally understand why each of them need the VGU > > - > > {{champion:102}} Just like you said, she can rely more on her dragon form by possibly advancing empowering herself in passive? For example, she can grow defense and other stats at level 6, 11 and 16, possibly at 16 she can be a permanent dragon form? I could be wrong there, but there are multiple ideas of a dragonborn character. I expect Shyvana to have an amount of CC over on hit damage. She could be played as a juggernaunt indeed but possibly a Vanguard as well if she is going to have a CC in her dragon form, just like how Gnar plays as 2. **Around {{champion:78}} Poppy level rework > > -** > > {{champion:56}} His ultimate might be the spooky ultimate in game, but it doesn't provide an interesting concept of a "fearful ultimate" I do think his overall theme of being a jungler shadow is great theme, but they could work on his visuals and improve/change his abilities a bit into more interesting concepts. I think he should be played mostly as an assassin, no CC but full amount of damage, so his " nightmare " will be scarier in later game if they keep a similar concept to it. **Around {{champion:84}} Akali level rework** > > - > > {{champion:36}} Has pretty old graphical design, he is indeed looking funny over "madman" I don't mind him being funny at all, but that's not the main problem because the main problem is that realizing his kit is weird and adding to the way he looks visually is also out of place is the reason his priority is pretty high now, and I am assuming that's why people wanted to have a VGU so bad. He could be really reworked from scratch and change his abilities into more of a madman juggernaunt who can also rely on such health regeneration as well. As for his cleaver weapon, It would make more sense if he breaks armor physically and deal a physical damage over % magic damage. His W and E could be more interesting, really. **Around {{champion:14}} Sion Level Rework** > > - > > {{champion:72}} Is a complete different story about him really, he is completely away from his lore. As a Shuriman scorpion who is meant to be a lethal predator, Venemous, deadly, mean and big. There is no way to see him in game like that. Skarner should be a duelist late game jungler because his lore applies him of being the one to not get close to or never mess with, he is not suppose to be a walking tank. I agree that he could use defense in his gameplay and itemization but a deadly venem to any sort of tank that deals % damage overtime is definitely recommended on this concept of a character. When they said in lore "Skarner guards his crystalline area" doesn't mean he is a guardian or anything, people got it wrong back then, it means that he is self-guarding predator who is going to say "Get closer to me and I'll sting you to death, no matter who you are" Yeap that's what he is exactly saying, he is a scorpion afterall, and he is also big guy. > As for his visuals, I think he really needs work from scratch because Skarner should represent an savage appearance over cute appearance, I believe he looks cute in his original con and in gameplay, I don't mind him looking cute at all, but his theme requires him to look savage. Take a look at his comerades {{champion:58}} {{champion:75}} they do look savage, and Skarner should be the savagest of them so as for his visuals, I think he needs to look an intimidating scorpion king, a shuriman armor on his neck, and bigger pincers, longer sting, and larger overall body with scales, thicker legs would be fantastic and perfect form of a the Scorpion King. > As for his gameplay, there is too much to mention because nothing really makes sense on him now, aside from his W which shields him, I understand that this is something he can use in his VGU, but every other ability could use a full rework to something that matches his predator theme. I would go ahead and say that he rework should be **around {{champion:114}} level rework in terms of reworking most abilities and adding % damage dueling combat.** For {{champion:102}} they could let her "progress" to her dragon form tranformation by making her unleash it at lvl 16 by making it something like a stance change like Nidalee. She already is a potential powerfarmer and decent lategame champion, change that and make her abilities more interesting (and with proper scalings, even if open to different buildpaths). For {{champion:56}} they should really make him better visually and give him really scary abilities outside from his ult, because he's basically a splitpusher+ultbot in lategame, not a scary champion at all. {{champion:36}} is just a ball of stats with abilities that are just "more stats" and "deal damage because you're there". He could deliver way better on his chemical hazard born man and feel way more satisfying to play and play against, because right now it's pretty much "do my stats win against the opponent?". Visually he's a pain to watch, both model and SFXs, they can definitely improve him by a great margin. {{champion:72}} can become such a cool champion, put some dot on him and keep the conditional CC, and make his (nowadays) ult something he can use properly even when he's alone fighting more than 1 enemy. He should be a better zoner/don't come near me champion (since that's his whole concept in his lore), like a proper jugg, more than a Tank/Vanguard. And even visually he can be so much more, some wasted potential here and a really boring passive if you ask me.
: Which of the 2 champions who need to be in the VGU list the "most" after Fiddlesticks and Volibear?
Voted {{champion:102}} and {{champion:56}} Both because they really don't deliver on their theme in my opinion. Shyvana is supposed to be a dragonborn, a strong humanoid with dragon powers that can become a fierce and strong dragon, but right now she's just an AA based champ that can be built as an OTP burst mage with only 1 available spell. I would like to see an hybrid juggernaut with proper abilities, maybe keep her a bir auto-based but give her more satisfying abilities. Noc really doesn't deliver on the power fantasy of a nightmare incarnate, ult aside. His model is so clunky an not spooky, and his abilities don't scare at all, much like {{champion:9}}. I don't think they are worse than {{champion:72}} nor {{champion:36}}, but they are the ones I look forward to the most.
: Horror themed Volibear Is Better: Bring It Back, Or At Least Do Something For The Fans Who Loved It
I didn't expect them to go with the eldritch beast in the first place, but I really did hope that they would push on the armored war god bear with thousand arrows on his back, maybe catering lightnings from the Iron they were made of. Now it's just a Kung Fu Panda villain, really not appealing. I like juggernauts a lot but Voli is so boring to look at, I did hope that his rework could've made him more interesting (I did like the idea of an unstoppable monster as well, but whater maybe a better jugg will have it). Guess I'll have to hope for the Ionian juggernaut to be cool instead.
: Eh I guess but for those of us that used it for the true damage got nothing out of the exchange, and mages remain as the safest and strongest class while bruisers lose more tools to keep up, such as ZZ'rot and raptor cloak (Not bringing up Ohmwrecker because no one used it.) and now we also don't really have that soild a keystone to stand on now, sure the AD is nice, and the healing is good, but I feel that other runes will show more instant power early and things like ignite and grievous wounds will hurt Conqueror's ability to stay relevant throughout a game.
> [{quoted}](name=Lt Cuddles,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=317ZRBHz,comment-id=0000000500010002,timestamp=2019-10-25T17:23:28.323+0000) > > Eh I guess but for those of us that used it for the true damage got nothing out of the exchange, and mages remain as the safest and strongest class while bruisers lose more tools to keep up, such as ZZ'rot and raptor cloak (Not bringing up Ohmwrecker because no one used it.) and now we also don't really have that soild a keystone to stand on now, sure the AD is nice, and the healing is good, but I feel that other runes will show more instant power early and things like ignite and grievous wounds will hurt Conqueror's ability to stay relevant throughout a game. Yeah, they should up one of if not both stats, and bring some good melee item to the table (since SoS was garbabe, I would give Atma's a try...)
: Whats the point of removing niche items?
I'm ok with removing these Items because they are pretty nuch useless, maybe they can rework them afterwards. But PLEASE don't remove {{item:2053}}, it's an underused item that is potentially useful on some champions, just maybe change some stats or put it as it is as an item component for {{item:3742}} and {{item:3800}} maybe?
: > [{quoted}](name=Rhabdomyolysis,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=PeZLcjxg,comment-id=0016,timestamp=2019-10-25T04:09:18.440+0000) > > So I normally never post my opinions on this game, even though I have been playing this game since Season 2. Never been more than a Gold player, I greatly enjoy playing ranked and participating in every season in some form. Im a pretty casual player. > > I believe this victorious skin has caused and will continue to cause a community outrage until actions are taken to hopefully appease people. Every year, people complain about the selected victorious skin.. every year this happens but aside from a few disliking it, this year it’s obvious somebody dropped the ball on the victorious project because there was no teaser, no trailer and suddenly we find out in a small announcement to sweep it under the rug. > > Here are the facts: > The skin resembles Justicar too much, color scheme is not that far off, also the armor is too similar. > Victorious skins are made to feel unique from the others. This doesn’t reflect that. > The model is smaller than his base model in comparison.. no reason for that. > VFX are good but the skin design needs to be reconsidered. > > I think the Skin Team should rethink the design of victorious skins.. at a minimum this skin needs to be more different than Justicar. How? > > My opinion: > Add more Armor > Add real wings, not misty wings. > Remove cloths he is wearing, not every victorious champion needs to wear cloths and wreaths of gold to be a great design. > It doesn’t matter if November 19 season ends, players will be satisfied if you continue to work to fix it even after the deadline. > > Moving forward, I recommend in the future Riot takes victorious skins a little more seriously because obviously the community takes a lot of concern and anticipation into these rewards. The community should be involved in the decision making process and have a vote in these victorious skins regardless of what the numbers statistically looked like a champion had in the season. This is a community reward... Why not let them vote. I’ve seen past seasons how they have presented these rewards and over all it’s underwhelming this year. Many are frustrated, some are okay with it, but nobody seems impressed on this skin. > > TL;DR: > Please continue to work through to fix this skin Riot. I think allowing people to vote on what Champ they think most deserves Victorious is a very good idea.
> [{quoted}](name=kaijukitten,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=PeZLcjxg,comment-id=00160000,timestamp=2019-10-25T05:09:42.020+0000) > > I think allowing people to vote on what Champ they think most deserves Victorious is a very good idea. Don't agree because we'll then get victorious Lux or something like that. Maybe they could vote Champions and then they can pick one of the most voted that also meets the requirements to be Victorious.
: Victorious Aatrox Design Poll
It looks like Aatrox had sex with SKT Jhin and this abomination came out. Really, doesn't blend well with Aatrox nor with the other Victorious skins. He's too much dressed and in the wrong way in my opinion. The effects are Okay I guess.
: This is a misconception, the general consensus on PBE is that it's a massive nerf 12-30 AD is minuscule compared to what fervor of battle used to give, and fervor of battle also came with 7% armor pen. The 15% healing is AFTER mitigation, not before like the current conqueror. The damage is less across the board, and the healing is considerably less unless you're hitting a target that's very squishy or hasn't been any armor, which in today's day and age, is pretty much only supports.
> [{quoted}](name=FalconPawwwwnch,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=317ZRBHz,comment-id=0000000500010001,timestamp=2019-10-24T20:10:42.880+0000) > > This is a misconception, the general consensus on PBE is that it's a massive nerf > > 12-30 AD is minuscule compared to what fervor of battle used to give, and fervor of battle also came with 7% armor pen. The 15% healing is AFTER mitigation, not before like the current conqueror. > > The damage is less across the board, and the healing is considerably less unless you're hitting a target that's very squishy or hasn't been any armor, which in today's day and age, is pretty much only supports. Yeah I read it later the post-mitigation thing, and losing the true damage will make conqueror worth only with champions that already shred defenses like maybe {{champion:122}} {{champion:86}} {{champion:82}} like it was intended? But it's still a nerf for them as well. I think they should push more towards the healing part rather than damage maybe, although I would like them both, so it can be a rune that promotes prolonged fights not only because you need to stack it but also because after that the healing matters and you can really sustain during a fight, and not a mere damage boost like PTA or having more stats to deal damage like Lethal Tempo.
: You know what's really crazy? Conqueror is getting nerfed because riot thinks bruisers are pushing tanks out, but it's been mages the entire time, yet Conqueror is getting nerfed through the floor when no one uses it anymore..
> [{quoted}](name=Lt Cuddles,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=317ZRBHz,comment-id=00000005,timestamp=2019-10-23T23:06:41.597+0000) > > You know what's really crazy? Conqueror is getting nerfed because riot thinks bruisers are pushing tanks out, but it's been mages the entire time, yet Conqueror is getting nerfed through the floor when no one uses it anymore.. Conqueror is getting rebalanced, not nerfed, and I really like what they are doing. I mean, 15% healing from any source of damage at max stacks + more adaptive force per stack (I read you can reach +18AD lvl 1), I'm all up for it. I rather have more sustain and damage than shredding a tank tbh, so I can survive and pop squishies and leave the poor tank to his fate.
: Revert Asol
He is not unique anymore and bis damage is so strange to apply now that you have to recast your W everytime. They removed catalyst from GLP and he lost that because he is mana hungry, they reworked him and made him so clunky, he feels like a complete mess. His gameplay was unique because with his toggle you really felt he was the center of the universe, and you had to reposition during the whole toggle to hit enemies. I would keep the changes on his Q and give him back the passive MS from running in a straight line, I like it that he can rely on MS as a meaningful stat, and revert his W please, I know it was hard to lane against him but then again you can jump on him and he doesn't have much he can do besides a mini Q stun.
TehNACHO (NA)
: Okay let's be real, who honestly likes playing against X champion?
By taking a different approach on the game, I'm starting to enjoy (or maybe better worded "not hate") playing matchups that I couldn't stand before, such as {{champion:84}} {{champion:17}} {{champion:150}} {{champion:10}}, ofc there still are some champ I don't like to lane against, but not as much as before and (unlike almost everyone who makes those posts) I look for a way to play around them.
iV0lt4GE (EUW)
: Almost all of them have been nerfed hard because of Pro Play (Exception being ASol, Ziggs and Nunu).
> [{quoted}](name=iV0lt4GE,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AtkediwE,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2019-10-21T20:45:51.759+0000) > > Almost all of them have been nerfed hard because of Pro Play (Exception being ASol, Ziggs and Nunu). Asol got whacked what are you saying, he has become a mess of a champ sadly...
: Please Show Us Which Order Drakes Will Spawn In During Champ Select Next Season.
> [{quoted}](name=Mrs Qtpie,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RGNMoJcx,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-10-20T19:34:13.193+0000) > > NOTE: please read the dragon changes next season if you have not already. > > These dragon changes will give far more substantial buffs to some champions over others (e.g. wind drake for Hecarim, Ocean drake for Rengar). It would just feel awful if I was in my ranked series and I lost game 5 because the enemy team happened to select a team comp better suited to exploit the 3rd drake buff of the game. If you give me the ability to draft around this in champ select, at least I will know I could have done something. > > Also, it feels kind of strange to me that if the enemy team has a Hecarim, and wind drake spawns 3rd, that I will be more inclined to protect it from being taken as opposed to seeking it out for myself like usual. It's like I'm being denied the third drake and elder drake because I don't want to buff the enemy team. The fun part is that you can't kmow in advance which drake will be the third and its effects kick in as soon as you kill the 2nd Drake, so yeah you can't even protect it from being taken. I hope they put in champ select just the Dominant drake, don't need the order of the first 2 drakes tbh
Keiaga (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Ryusaether,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sE1KvKHc,comment-id=000200010000000300000000,timestamp=2019-10-20T08:30:18.615+0000) > > Man I understand your point, but we can't just go and nitpick every word and every champion. > If we do that, I should come in and say {{champion:36}} {{champion:86}} don't have any hard cc/displacement/AoE CC, so they can't be classified as tanks with the LoL meaning of the term. Yes, tanks all TEND to have similar traits but may be missing out on one or two of them. The only thing that's 100% consistent with a tank in every circumstance is that they're hard to kill because of durability - which is a trait that juggernauts excel at. The reason I'm nitpicking everything you bring up is to illustrate the point that the LoL terminology for what a tank is based on their secondary traits like CC and shielding is completely inconsistent and unreliable. {{champion:122}} and{{champion:89}} are both tanks in the traditional sense of the word, but I can understand a need for specification between "Tank that does damage" and "Tank that has CC" or even "Tank that has peel" Subcategories like "Warden" and "Juggernaut have their purpose, but it's asinine to say that juggernauts aren't tanks because of the flawed LoL classifications.
> [{quoted}](name=Keiaga,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sE1KvKHc,comment-id=0002000100000003000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-20T08:46:40.755+0000) > > Yes, tanks all TEND to have similar traits but may be missing out on one or two of them. The only thing that's 100% consistent with a tank in every circumstance is that they're hard to kill because of durability - which is a trait that juggernauts excel at. > > The reason I'm nitpicking everything you bring up is to illustrate the point that the LoL terminology for what a tank is based on their secondary traits like CC and shielding is completely inconsistent and unreliable. > > {{champion:122}} and{{champion:89}} are both tanks in the traditional sense of the word, but I can understand a need for specification between "Tank that does damage" and "Tank that has CC" or even "Tank that has peel" > > Subcategories like "Warden" and "Juggernaut have their purpose, but it's asinine to say that juggernauts aren't tanks because of the flawed LoL classifications. I was about to edit something like that, but I didn't know if it would be right to put juggs in the Tanks or in the Bruisers... But at this point I think we can agree that they are "different kinds of Tanks": Vanguards (bulky champions with initiation, usually AoE CC/disruption capabilities, relatively low damage and good survivability) Wardens (champs with ways to survive and help their allies survive as well, with some CC but not as CC oriented as Vanguards, don't usually do the engage themselves) Juggernauts (big bois with big damage, they either have decent CC or in rare case some mobility as a tradeoff, they thrive in the center of a fight with conditional damage and survivability based on their damage) Just don't expect a subclass to do another subclass' job and these posts won't even extist {{sticker:slayer-jinx-wink}}
Keiaga (NA)
: It's a case of both sides being right. Anyone with common sense will identify juggernauts as tanks in the traditional sense. But because riot chose to inconsistently mislabel them as juggernauts on their website, but leave them as tanks in the in-game client, people are being pedantic for no reason other than to disagree.
> [{quoted}](name=Keiaga,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sE1KvKHc,comment-id=00020001000000000000000000000002000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-20T08:17:00.530+0000) > > It's a case of both sides being right. Anyone with common sense will identify juggernauts as tanks in the traditional sense. But because riot chose to inconsistently mislabel them as juggernauts on their website, but leave them as tanks in the in-game client, people are being pedantic for no reason other than to disagree. Yeah, it's about that. I guess people are being annoying about that because they also got annoyed by people in game expecting juggernauts to do the vanguards' job. I can't count how many times I've beem told "DARIUS ENGAGE" like HOW? I personally think juggernauts work best at counter-engaging and punishing mispositions, they just can't go in there at a reasonable speed and expect to survive (unless EXTREMELY fed and with MS boosts), but are great when assassins go in braindead on your carry or when an enemy vanguard engages and you stop them and whoever follows them dies.
Keiaga (NA)
: Judging by the fact that you said "while being inherently bulky and having those qualities, tanks' kits also scale with HP/resists (and mostly only on those)" in very decisive, certain wording but you then said "They** _generally_** have initiation, disruption, peel and some damaging capabilities" already indicates that durability and hp/resists are more important for a tank to be considered a tank than every other trait they happen to also have. {{champion:86}} before his rework, he built mostly health/resists because of his passive and his W scaling with them. {{champion:36}} has almost zero AP scaling, and instead relies entirely on building HP/resists {{champion:106}} {{champion:82}} {{champion:6}} all have traits in their kit that scale with their health. Meanwhile {{champion:223}} {{champion:31}} {{champion:12}} are all classified as tanks, yet have zero skills that directly scale off of their HP/resists. There's plenty more champs classified as a vanguard or warden that only have a a very minor part of their kit that scales with health/resists which just illustrates how terrible the idea of classifying tanks based on anything other than their durability is.
> [{quoted}](name=Keiaga,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sE1KvKHc,comment-id=00020001000000030000,timestamp=2019-10-20T08:09:25.436+0000) > > Judging by the fact that you said > > "while being inherently bulky and having those qualities, tanks' kits also scale with HP/resists (and mostly only on those)" in very decisive, certain wording but you then said > > "They** _generally_** have initiation, disruption, peel and some damaging capabilities" already indicates that durability and hp/resists are more important for a tank to be considered a tank than every other trait they happen to also have. > > {{champion:86}} before his rework, he built mostly health/resists because of his passive and his W scaling with them. > > {{champion:36}} has almost zero AP scaling, and instead relies entirely on building HP/resists > > {{champion:106}} {{champion:82}} {{champion:6}} all have traits in their kit that scale with their health. > > > Meanwhile {{champion:223}} {{champion:31}} {{champion:12}} are all classified as tanks, yet have zero skills that directly scale off of their HP/resists. There's plenty more champs classified as a vanguard or warden that only have a avery minor part of their kit that scales with health/resists. Man I understand your point, but we can't just go and nitpick every word and every champion. If we do that, I should come in and say {{champion:36}} {{champion:86}} don't have any hard cc/displacement/AoE CC, so they can't be classified as tanks with the LoL meaning of the term. Cho isn't classified as a Tank (yet he has hp scaling on ult) and Tahm has hp scalings on his autos, while also having his shield that is more effective with high HP and has a self slow on one of his abilities (which is also a peel for his allies), it's a mix of their kits+scalings, not just nitpicks on nitpicks. I get it, Tanks are commonly viewed as things that won't die, I know. But here on LoL tanks are champions that have (usually AoE) disruption capabilities/peel and pair that with being bulky and (almost always passively) hard to kill, via their optimal build, scaling and also non-conditional self peeling. Juggernauts are meaty bois with usually telegraphed abilities, that can soak some damage but need to meet their conditions to properly sustain and deal their own damage, that usually scales with their damage ratio. In the best cases they can deal a great amount of damage and be really hard to kill, but they need to be active in the fight because both their dmg and surviving capabilities rely on them hitting the enemies. I know you get it and I don't understand why you keep nitpicking everything, ofc there are some specific cases, but the general LoL classification is not that bad or intricate.
Keiaga (NA)
: each game does have it's own terminology. as I said before, the general consensus established by almost 30 years of video game terminology across every applicable genre for what a tank is revolves around the central idea that a tank is "durable". Other traits like utility, CC, shielding, are all traits that are very much less important to the identity of a tank. Every other trait is so much less important that even if a tank has none of it's secondary traits, people will still identify it as a tank as long as it's just "durable"
> [{quoted}](name=Keiaga,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sE1KvKHc,comment-id=000200010000000000000000000000020000,timestamp=2019-10-20T07:47:03.956+0000) > > each game does have it's own terminology. as I said before, the general consensus established by almost 30 years of video game terminology across every applicable genre for what a tank is revolves around the central idea that a tank is "durable". Other traits like utility, CC, shielding, are all traits that are very much less important to the identity of a tank. Every other trait is so much less important that even if a tank has none of it's secondary traits, people will still identify it as a tank as long as it's just "durable" Indeed, I agree with you here and in many of your posts. Juggernauts ARE tanks in a common sense, but aren't tanks as a LoL class, as I stated in my previous comment.
Keiaga (NA)
: All juggernauts are inherently tanky without runes. Some of them are tanky without heals likes {{champion:82}} {{champion:102}} {{champion:86}} . Just now you used the term "Tankiness" as a quality of being "hard to kill" and not as a quality of having any of the traits you previously listed are mandatory for tanks like CC, initiation or ally shielding. All the champions I listed are obviously not tanks, but they all have the qualities you're insisting are integral for tanks. {{champion:79}} has a slow, a stun, a passive heal and a displacement in his kit. {{champion:555}} also has a slow, a stun, a passive heal, and a displacement in his kit. Why is Gragas a tank and not pyke? If it's because Gragas also has inherent bulk and is hard to kill then why isn't {{champion:122}} a tank even though he also has a slow, a displacement, and a heal in his kit? Meanwhile {{champion:32}} has 2 stuns in his kit and is a tank. But for some reason {{champion:106}} is not a tank even though he has a displacement, and a slow/fear. If tanks are dictated by how much cc/initiation/ shielding in their kits there's a whole lot of exceptions, confusion, and conditions. But if you think of a tank as "a champion that is hard to kill due to health and resistances" then everything suddenly makes sense. you're also wrong about your tangent in the last paragraph, but lets keep things focused.
> [{quoted}](name=Keiaga,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sE1KvKHc,comment-id=000200010000,timestamp=2019-10-20T00:58:57.684+0000) > > All juggernauts are inherently tanky without runes. Some of them are tanky without heals likes {{champion:82}} {{champion:102}} {{champion:86}} . Just now you used the term "Tankiness" as a quality of being "hard to kill" and not as a quality of having any of the traits you previously listed are mandatory for tanks like CC, initiation or ally shielding. > > All the champions I listed are obviously not tanks, but they all have the qualities you're insisting are integral for tanks. > > {{champion:79}} has a slow, a stun, a passive heal and a displacement in his kit. > {{champion:555}} also has a slow, a stun, a passive heal, and a displacement in his kit. Why is Gragas a tank and not pyke? If it's because Gragas also has inherent bulk and is hard to kill then why isn't {{champion:122}} a tank even though he also has a slow, a displacement, and a heal in his kit? > > Meanwhile > > {{champion:32}} has 2 stuns in his kit and is a tank. But for some reason > > {{champion:106}} is not a tank even though he has a displacement, and a slow/fear. > > If tanks are dictated by how much cc/initiation/ shielding in their kits there's a whole lot of exceptions, confusion, and conditions. But if you think of a tank as "a champion that is hard to kill due to health and resistances" then everything suddenly makes sense. > > you're also wrong about your tangent in the last paragraph, but lets keep things focused. Simple, because while being inherently bulky and having those qualities, tanks' kits also scale with HP/resists (and mostly only on those). They generally have initiation, disruption, peel and some damaging capabilities, some of them {{champion:54}} {{champion:31}} can be in fact also be built with damage, losing a bit of their tanking role but gaining some extra burst, but they remain tanks (Cho is a particular case tho) as a class because of their kit and their scalings. They also usually have subclasses which they can fit, but they are still tank as a main role. Juggernauts are meaty damage dealers with telegraphed abilities and some conditions to deal their immense damage while still being able to take some hits, but usually they aren't as bulky as a real Tank, because they want to build damage, but have to build resistances not because of their scaling with those stats but because they have to in order to survive. Juggernauts HAVE TO deal damage in order for them to sustain through the fight, they just can't press a button to get a free meaty resist/hp based shield, or such things. I know you know the difference and are only challenging to find a proper definition, hope this, while still leaving some margin of misinterpretation, makes it clearer.
Charmy Bird (EUNE)
: i rl dont see point click cc existing,point click is literally without counter its compelitely unhealthy,if new fiddle can keep u feared for over 3 secodns likes hes doing now just by clicking with u then hell be unhealthy,we need as less point click as possible.
> [{quoted}](name=Charmy Bird,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4u5vWRT8,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2019-10-17T18:55:24.960+0000) > > i rl dont see point click cc existing,point click is literally without counter its compelitely unhealthy,if new fiddle can keep u feared for over 3 secodns likes hes doing now just by clicking with u then hell be unhealthy,we need as less point click as possible. Yeah I see so much counterplay to poin&click dashes or to multiple movement options as an immobile champ, ofc, remove point and click CCs only and let Irelia Yasuo Riven &co do as they please (unless you hit your 1s delayed or predictable CCs!) seems fair to me! Plus, we don't even know if they'll change the duration or the conditions to use it, so what are we even talking about?
Håppy (NA)
: "Nothing actually drastic changes" bro the entire map redesigns itself halfway through, 1 of 4 options, at complete and utter random every game. 4 drakes of the same type, except the 3rd drake that spawns is the only drake that'll spawn for the rest of the game until a dragon soul is obtained, and then elder starts to spawn. you need to go back and read all of that before you come here arguing about that. Talkin all this "good luck getting it" bro _it is guaranteed that it will be gotten_
> [{quoted}](name=Håppy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=scoWExWf,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2019-10-16T17:14:15.826+0000) > > "Nothing actually drastic changes" bro the entire map redesigns itself halfway through, 1 of 4 options, at complete and utter random every game. > > 4 drakes of the same type, except the 3rd drake that spawns is the only drake that'll spawn for the rest of the game until a dragon soul is obtained, and then elder starts to spawn. you need to go back and read all of that before you come here arguing about that. Talkin all this "good luck getting it" bro _it is guaranteed that it will be gotten_ Buddo, I rarely even see games with 4 drakes being taken counting both teams, if one team single handedly gets 4 fucking drakes it deserves to wina nd will probably do it no matter what, this just makes things quicker. The map changes MAY be debatable but are really cool, I just hope they let you know the elemental dominance in advance (like in champ select) and it would be way better. Sometines you guys cry too much without even thinking.
Håppy (NA)
: Season 10 Preemptive Disaster
The changes look well done tbh, now people will maybe understand that objectives are important. If a team gets 4 drakes, it deserves to win, and they deserve the rewards from the dominant drake. If a toplaner is far ahead of his opponent and gets an early herald, he deserves the chance to get another one and stomp even further. The Elder drake spawning means the game has gone on for too long, time ti end it, and the winning team seailing it and closing the game deserves it. Impactful dragons mean Bot, Mid and Jgl better win lane and try to seal them, double Herald top means asserting dominance in lane can result in great pushing potential. Simply, now you'll feel the power these advantages give you, instead of having just passive stats. I just hopw the Dominant Dragon gets displaye in champ select, so you can pick/ban based on that (if Ocean is the dominant, I will probably ban Rengar, if Mountain is dominant I will think about Vayne/Qiyana/Taliyah/MF and other picks that thrive in narrow spaces), thus giving you some control over it. Changes look good, I guess some people just can't help but complain.
Håppy (NA)
: Season 10 Preemptive Disaster
{{champion:112}} Adapt or be removed
: Do not put execute on the elder buff
> [{quoted}](name=TentacleBoi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AkO8AEzO,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-10-16T03:22:47.953+0000) > > Elder is a buff meant to end a game that’s lasted long enough, as it is now it doesn’t always fill that role effectively. I think with the current elder it could work but I think most people don’t actually know how much power the elder gives them and nothing says fight now like a threshold execute. I still have faith in humanity. Thank you, dear player.
: The New Fiddlesticks Design
> [{quoted}](name=Linna Excel,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ilAO1nnd,comment-id=000400000000,timestamp=2019-10-17T00:50:23.503+0000) > > I'm not against metal, I just don't like how it was done. If it was integrated with him as a part of his arm and not something he was holding, maybe with shadows around it, I think I'd like it more. If they wanted to do a full on robot like FNAF, I think it'd work. Man, he's not holding it. It is kept tied by a rope, that's not his hand holding it, it's part of him.
: Unpopular opinion but it needs to be heard
The fact is that, in my opinion, you don't really get the point. TL;DR: The world of Runeterra finally expanding in more ways is good and is League related, people cry too much about balance without trying to adapt and improve. This 10th year anniversary is not only for Riot, but for League mainly. The universe of Runeterra (born, or maybe better, GROWN with League) will finally be expanded in other aspects, we will get a fighting game, a card game that will give us an even greater worldbuilding and different concepts, and that other game that even further expands the world of Runeterra and its creatures/characters. I don't want to say it, but as your title reads, someone has to say it, I think you don't really understand what these announcement mean. They aren't only for the single game you play, of course, but this game has become something more. It appears to me that you don't really care for it to expand but only want the title you play to fit your expectations. Can Riot do better with LoL? Of course. The game has its flaws, and they aknowledged them, they even said sorry in the video for all their mistakes and thanked the players for keeping on and believing in them, they DID revert things such as Rengar and LB, I haven't seen Viktor top in months and they are currently making him a proper midlaner again, nerfed Akali to the ground etc. They CAN do more, they can bring back some gutted champion/work on them so they aren't overloaded (Azir/Kalista), they can keep some fun build diversity without forcing champs to buy specific Items to be good, and many other things, bring back some game modes (don't really care about those though, never found them that much entertaining, I like the competitive aspect more), slightly reduce damage, etc. But that doesn't mean they have to focus ONLY on this, the game isn't as bad as some people make it look, it has its flaws, but some cry waaaaay too much about them, instead of adapting/accepting their own mistakes and going on.
: Its harder to display a legitimate outplay these days
Or more simply, people out there are just crybabies that won't admit they got outplayed. If this is the "damage meta", almost everyone has damage, so you going 3v1 in your {{champion:122}} scenario: you have 3 high damage dealer vs 1, yet you all die and he survives. How is this not an outplay? He probably got 5 stacks then killed 1 of them/got a 2/3 men pull and then healed back with Q and proceeded to dunk their asses. If you let Darius 5 stack you and turn around the fight, you got outplayed, as simple as that, especially against juggernauts with telegraphed abilities such as him or {{champion:420}} (whose kit is basically made for 1v2>, I love it when junglers go gank her, eat her E and then collapse on her and die alongside the toplaner going "???"). Outplays are still there, unless someone is EXTREMELY fed, like a fed LB isn't even outplaying you by clicking on the ADC and instadeleting him, but even if you go on a fed LB with 3 people and she outmaneuvers you with her dash + blink back, that's still an outplay. I can agree that dmg is pretty high and CDR is kinda lame, but that doesn't mean people can't display their skill. For example, in the Illaoi example, people can dodge his tentacles with flash/dashes (during her ult they are faster), deny her heal and kill her, just to make an example. Skill is still there, people just need to complain less and try more.
: I'm not even complaining about juggernauts dude. I love juggernauts. It's one of my favorite classes to play. I was just pointing out that Morde's range is relatively long for a juggernaut in counter to Jamaree's point that his range is relatively short. It's really not. Most of his abilities actually have relatively long range for his class. I didn't say anything about whether they were hard to dodge or not, I didn't even complain about the range as I brought it up. You're getting defensive over nothing. Personally, I think his passive is actually way more annoying than the rest of his kit.
> [{quoted}](name=yay nibbers,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J5Q7q6YX,comment-id=00000000000000000000000300020000,timestamp=2019-10-12T18:30:41.707+0000) > > I'm not even complaining about juggernauts dude. I love juggernauts. It's one of my favorite classes to play. I was just pointing out that Morde's range is relatively long for a juggernaut in counter to Jamaree's point that his range is relatively short. It's really not. Most of his abilities actually have relatively long range for his class. I didn't say anything about whether they were hard to dodge or not, I didn't even complain about the range as I brought it up. You're getting defensive over nothing. > > Personally, I think his passive is actually way more annoying than the rest of his kit. Yeah but the conversation was about champions having no counterplay, so when you brought the range in I thought you were considering ittoo big to have counterplay. Gotta be honest: his passive is a bit broken, but he doesn't have anything else going for him in terms of damage aside his Q and E, the first having lower dmg on multiple targets and the second not being that strong either. His autos are strong but nothing out of control, so he kinda needs his passive as it is or else he would need a huge powershift on easily dodgeable abilities or on his autos AP ratio. Like I will try some times going Nashor just to see if he becomes an even better duelist with that
: > [{quoted}](name=Hi im 12,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J5Q7q6YX,comment-id=000000000000000200000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-12T08:35:48.693+0000) > > oh for sure his overall 50% ish winrate shows us that his destroying games in challenger with his 0.5% pick rate, you just can't go into a game and not be destroyed by a competent volibear player, challenger is also filled with volibear players because his just so good when mastered. > > because you're claiming that every champion is broken when you know how to play em lmao He literally said in which patches he was OP when mastered, are you even reading? There are plenty of games stomped by non-OP champs because good players are playing them, take for example Asol before they changed him (not when he was strong with GLP), Viktor, Orianna, Jhin, etc. Ofc if a champ is dumpstered it's a bit harder, but tell me if you haven't seen Kalista or Azir pop off in some of your games even with all the nerfs they got.
> [{quoted}](name=Hi im 12,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J5Q7q6YX,comment-id=00000000000000020000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-12T08:54:56.841+0000) > > he wasn't changed in any of the patches, the only reason he was winning games was that the sample size was 20 games and rng lmao > > asol hasn't been weak at a single point since release. > > well considering 20 games sample size made volibear destroy challenger > https://u.gg/lol/champions/kalista/build?rank=challenger > your "weak" kalista has a 80% wr :) When they made GLP not build from Catalyst he got fairly weaker, he was way less reliable and easier to go on top and hit until he died. Plus it's not a pick up and play, only few people play Asol and make his winrate rise, thus proving that, when highly mastered, champs are strong Yeah, so when few people play a champ well they are more threatening than one might thing, confirming Jamaree's post? I agree with you then. I know it's on few games, but I bet if you get to OTP's profiles they have high winrates for these champs even in more games.
Hi im 12 (EUNE)
: oh for sure his overall 50% ish winrate shows us that his destroying games in challenger with his 0.5% pick rate, you just can't go into a game and not be destroyed by a competent volibear player, challenger is also filled with volibear players because his just so good when mastered. >why does challenger even matter for you? because you're claiming that every champion is broken when you know how to play em lmao
> [{quoted}](name=Hi im 12,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J5Q7q6YX,comment-id=000000000000000200000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-12T08:35:48.693+0000) > > oh for sure his overall 50% ish winrate shows us that his destroying games in challenger with his 0.5% pick rate, you just can't go into a game and not be destroyed by a competent volibear player, challenger is also filled with volibear players because his just so good when mastered. > > because you're claiming that every champion is broken when you know how to play em lmao He literally said in which patches he was OP when mastered, are you even reading? There are plenty of games stomped by non-OP champs because good players are playing them, take for example Asol before they changed him (not when he was strong with GLP), Viktor, Orianna, Jhin, etc. Ofc if a champ is dumpstered it's a bit harder, but tell me if you haven't seen Kalista or Azir pop off in some of your games even with all the nerfs they got.
: Morde's Q has 625 range. That's enough to hit all but a very small number of ranged champs from the very edge of their auto-attack range and then some.
> [{quoted}](name=yay nibbers,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J5Q7q6YX,comment-id=000000000000000000000003,timestamp=2019-10-11T13:54:34.067+0000) > > Morde's Q has 625 range. That's enough to hit all but a very small number of ranged champs from the very edge of their auto-attack range and then some. Morde's Q cast time makes it fairly predictable, even though it has range you can 1) expect it whe he comes up close in that range 2) react to it on cast 3) use a movement option to dodge it. Plus, its damage is not much when near minions, it's like an Illaoi Q but shorter and with no heal (and a bit faster). > [{quoted}](name=yay nibbers,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J5Q7q6YX,comment-id=00000000000000000000000300000000,timestamp=2019-10-11T15:14:16.066+0000) > > It's long for a juggernaut though. Don't forget that he also has a huge pull with up to 900 range. Yeah, and they are both instant cast point&click uh? People complaining on juggernauts having no counterplay is always funny.
: I picked the 3 most recent reworks for simplicity and to make a point. None of these are counterplay.
> [{quoted}](name=Blue Shift,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J5Q7q6YX,comment-id=000000000000000000010000,timestamp=2019-10-11T08:12:17.184+0000) > > I picked the 3 most recent reworks for simplicity and to make a point. None of these are counterplay. {{champion:82}} poke him if you're ranged or have a ranged ability, dodge his E (not difficult at all) and try to not proc his passive if you can (in small trades). In general, go on him after he misses E or if he uses W to heal, when he has 6 poke him or fight him only if he misse his E, it has 21s CD lvl1 rank so it's pretty meh, as Jax don't ult before he ults you or he gets a % of your buffed stats, spare your E for when you're in the shadow realm if you can, if you want to escape after spare your jump for when the ult finishes so you can jump on your minions, use E after he uses his Q so he only has Autos going for him. {{champion:80}} I don't know much tbh, I imagine you should try and start your E when he leaps because when empowered it has multiple autos after that make him get his passive up again, so if you cancel those he deals no damage, and then you can stun/leap+stun him and proceed with your damage (after his Shield expires, don't blow your load before). As for {{champion:10}}, I hate her as well, but I gotta recognize she's pretty useless pre-6, and even until 11, but at that point she becomes basically unfightable (at least for my non-mobile champs). Go for some tank item that reduces attack speed and try to avoid her slow
: The thing is, CDR is a stat that is stronger the more you have it. First 10% cdr are much less valuable than those 10% that push you from 35% to 45%(going from 100% cd to 90% cd improves your damage over time by 10/9 or +11%; going from 65% to 55% improves your damage over time by 65/55 or +18%). If people have to get that 1 item with 10% cdr but they can't reliably fill that cdr up to 40% with other items, that would feel bad. It already feels bad for me now, when I am playing any mage and have 20% cdr with Ludens but can't make it to 40% without disrupting my itembuild towards {{item:3157}} and {{item:3102}} . Or if I am playing something like Jhin, and can get {{item:3508}} for 20% cdr but there is no way to get another 20% without building something really bad for him({{item:3078}} ) One possible way of solving this problem could be making all cdr stack multiplicatively instead, changing every "+10 CDR" to "x0.9 cooldown"(and x0.81 instead of +20 cdr) and removing the cap. This way, every source of CDR gives the same % increase in overall damage over time, regardless of how much of them you already have and there is no "maximum" you feel bad not being able to reach. In the extreme case of someone buying {{item:3078}} +{{item:3071}} +{{item:3025}} +{{item:3508}} +{{item:3285}} +{{item:3158}} (somewhat a waste of gold if you ask me, overpaying for 2 Rage passives and 2 Spellblade passives) you will get a total of x0.9^10=0.35 or 65% lower cd overall, which is not really too op
> [{quoted}](name=Posui Gart,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=YuYtN7zP,comment-id=000100010000,timestamp=2019-09-24T08:38:44.121+0000) > > The thing is, CDR is a stat that is stronger the more you have it. First 10% cdr are much less valuable than those 10% that push you from 35% to 45%(going from 100% cd to 90% cd improves your damage over time by 10/9 or +11%; going from 65% to 55% improves your damage over time by 65/55 or +18%). If people have to get that 1 item with 10% cdr but they can't reliably fill that cdr up to 40% with other items, that would feel bad. It already feels bad for me now, when I am playing any mage and have 20% cdr with Ludens but can't make it to 40% without disrupting my itembuild towards {{item:3157}} and {{item:3102}} . Or if I am playing something like Jhin, and can get {{item:3508}} for 20% cdr but there is no way to get another 20% without building something really bad for him({{item:3078}} ) > > One possible way of solving this problem could be making all cdr stack multiplicatively instead, changing every "+10 CDR" to "x0.9 cooldown"(and x0.81 instead of +20 cdr) and removing the cap. This way, every source of CDR gives the same % increase in overall damage over time, regardless of how much of them you already have and there is no "maximum" you feel bad not being able to reach. > In the extreme case of someone buying {{item:3078}} +{{item:3071}} +{{item:3025}} +{{item:3508}} +{{item:3285}} +{{item:3158}} (somewhat a waste of gold if you ask me, overpaying for 2 Rage passives and 2 Spellblade passives) you will get a total of x0.9^10=0.35 or 65% lower cd overall, which is not really too op Can't you go hybrid Lethality with {{champion:202}}? I know it requires you to snowball, but it is not that bad of a build and grants you the CDR you wish for + utility with {{item:3142}} and/or the extra dmg of {{item:3147}} (I put "or" because you can take Transcendence and get the 40% CDR cap with 3 items) Even though on Jhin now you have to go for just more dmg, I loved when you cold go for a more high damage spellcaster build with lethality and CDR.
: He wins for free because having a DoT that scales damage per stack, on top of giving a steroid at 5 stacks in this current age is a great idea apparently. He needs a mini rework that reworks a bit of his entire kit (change how some things work). Bleed becomes a debuff and not a damage thing, W gains effects pertaining to HP thresholds (a simple 3 second damage bleed based a small portion of the spell damage is fine), E no longer full pulls in, but instead deals a bit of damage and grounds for a brief moment (E with how Q works right now hurts more than helps), as for R, other things can be done to it.
> [{quoted}](name=Ragnaveil,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wUYBgdPo,comment-id=0011,timestamp=2019-08-26T02:46:04.020+0000) > > He wins for free because having a DoT that scales damage per stack, on top of giving a steroid at 5 stacks in this current age is a great idea apparently. He needs a mini rework that reworks a bit of his entire kit (change how some things work). Bleed becomes a debuff and not a damage thing, W gains effects pertaining to HP thresholds (a simple 3 second damage bleed based a small portion of the spell damage is fine), E no longer full pulls in, but instead deals a bit of damage and grounds for a brief moment (E with how Q works right now hurts more than helps), as for R, other things can be done to it. Yeah, and then how does he get to his enemies and what threat does he represent? E+Q is a 100% sure hit, what are you talking about? And if you hit enemies with Q you're 100% sure to be in range for E, they have great synergy as abilities. Darius has a cool concept and is one of the true juggernauts of the game: no mobility, decent tankiness, high windups and great damage in long fights. He doesn't need a mini rework, let it be what you came up with here, at this point it becomes another champion.
: Darius has a 32% banrate
Reading the comments got me to answer here Immobile champs builds movespeed and gets unkiteable, it's not like every single champ in the game except some adc like Kai'sa has slows or CCs, and almost everyone has a dash. Ofc, if you are all alone by yourself with no self peel and Ghost Darius runs at you, you die as you deserve. If you're with your team though I highly doubt no one will throw his shit at Darius running at them, and he's not the quickest to dodge, and even if he manages to dodge you force him to change paths and slow him anyway. If Darius Ghost Flashes on your ass in a teamfight and your carries don't have F, he deserved to destroy them because it's a calculated play. And even still, he will most likely build his stacks first and then flash, he's a good juggernaut that needs time to rack up his burst potential and has telegraphed abilities, even in lane. I've beaten Darius countless times with {{champion:420}}, another telegraphed juggernaut, and as a Darius player it's a real pain to play against the likes of {{champion:10}} {{champion:85}} {{champion:67}} {{champion:133}} {{champion:126}} {{champion:240}} {{champion:58}} (more of a skill matchup) {{champion:92}} {{champion:83}}. I get it, he's really strong in lane, but at the same time he's easy to gank. Ofc if your jgl decides to gank when he has 5 stacks on the toplaner, it won't end well for both of you, but it is to be expected. However if you manage not to get him to 5 stacks it's an easy fight, and putting him behind means you basically made him useless. "Yeah but ganks shouldn't be the solution", then learn the champion. I myself know all his windups and ranges, hence I can manage his trades and know what he'll try to do next, I can't recall anytime I lost in lane against {{champion:122}} where I had my other main {{champion:420}}. He ofc is annoying to deal with, but there are annoying treats/waya of playing against him too, he's nowhere near impossible to beat.
: > [{quoted}](name=Ryusaether,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=QXrrE4Es,comment-id=0005000200000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-14T06:40:49.237+0000) > > It's not Vayne, just face it. > > No glasses, different facial traits, completely different hairstyle, black skin, completely different weapon set and Vayne already has a legendary, so I doubt they'll give her a big ass lasergun that needs new animations, no smaller bow on her arm, and Vayne doesn't have a proper scarf but more likely a mantle/cloak. Arclight, Soulstealer and Project all lack glasses. I suppose that must mean they're not proper Vayne skins. It's also something that wouldn't be particularly noticed in game anyway. Soulstealer also has a very different skin color. Guess that means Zombie Brand isn't an appropriate skin either since it's decayed flesh instead of burnt. Kai'Sa has had her hair style changed for her KDA skin (default) and her team skin. Irelia has also had her hair considerably shortened in both Project skins and in Frostblade. Prestige Arcade Caitlyn also has short hair compared to her other skins. There may be more examples, the point is that there are already precedents. Looking again at the artwork, I still see a cloak trailing behind the character. Doesn't immediately discount Vayne in either case. I'm also not seeing totally different facial features. I can still see Vayne's triangle-shaped face in the artwork. Cho'Gath, Tristana, Heimer and Corki all have 2 legendary skins. Technically Leona too although they're both variants on Eclipse. Lastly, the two guns still in the image on the lower right are clearly out of place and could be hiding the smaller gun she would normally be using, even though it would be in her off hand. Not only are there precedents for almost everything, you may need to simply look at the classic Vayne with fresh eyes for the facial aspects. I did it myself to make sure I was getting a solid comparison.
> [{quoted}](name=Busty Demoness,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=QXrrE4Es,comment-id=00050002000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-14T07:13:34.493+0000) > > Arclight, Soulstealer and Project all lack glasses. I suppose that must mean they're not proper Vayne skins. It's also something that wouldn't be particularly noticed in game anyway. Soulstealer also has a very different skin color. Guess that means Zombie Brand isn't an appropriate skin either since it's decayed flesh instead of burnt. > > Kai'Sa has had her hair style changed for her KDA skin (default) and her team skin. Irelia has also had her hair considerably shortened in both Project skins and in Frostblade. Prestige Arcade Caitlyn also has short hair compared to her other skins. There may be more examples, the point is that there are already precedents. > > Looking again at the artwork, I still see a cloak trailing behind the character. Doesn't immediately discount Vayne in either case. I'm also not seeing totally different facial features. I can still see Vayne's triangle-shaped face in the artwork. > > Cho'Gath, Tristana, Heimer and Corki all have 2 legendary skins. Technically Leona too although they're both variants on Eclipse. > > Lastly, the two guns still in the image on the lower right are clearly out of place and could be hiding the smaller gun she would normally be using, even though it would be in her off hand. > > Not only are there precedents for almost everything, you may need to simply look at the classic Vayne with fresh eyes for the facial aspects. I did it myself to make sure I was getting a solid comparison. I understand your points, believe me, but they usually don't change these many aspects all at once in a single skin, and her silhouette visualization is kinda different from Vayne's. Different silhouette, facial expression, skin color, hairstyle, clothes (if you look at it closely, that's a punk style of wearing not a cloak, but something with sleeves, since she wears one of the sleeves with hee right arm and the other floats in the air), no glasses, and that big ass gun has a totally different shape than her usual crossbow. All these different traits mean either a different character or an impossible to recognize Vayne skin, to me.
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Ryusaether

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