: Riot do not listen to this Garen main.
> [{quoted}](name=Mavëríck,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=28AsKPpA,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-12-05T23:48:10.897+0000) > > Riot do not listen to this Garen main. Yes, don't listen to the people who have the most experience with the champion and know how painful the matchups can be. No, lets instead listen to the bronze player who tanks full spin to the face because they don't know how to run away from Garen and use CC.
Andarius (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=TheMoobile,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=28AsKPpA,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-06T00:22:48.561+0000) > > It'll be the most powerful for his spins since he'll have the maximum amount of spins by then. > > Again, it's even weaker early. You could easily do the math yourself but old Garen at level 1 spin did 210 damage with spin, this new one with the changes is 224. > > Wow, I get 14 extra damage. For the removal of 20 armour, and 30% damage reduction on W. > > That's not worth in any fucking world. Ah yes, more numbers, good. So cool, at lvl 1 he's clearly weaker... What about every other relevant point? Cuz let me tell you, lvl 1 with no items vs lvl 18 with 1 that's never realistically going to happen?,,, 14 damag at lvl one matters much more
> [{quoted}](name=Andarius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=28AsKPpA,comment-id=00010000000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-06T00:24:42.099+0000) > > Ah yes, more numbers, good. So cool, at lvl 1 he's clearly weaker... > > What about every other relevant point? > > Cuz let me tell you, lvl 1 with no items vs lvl 18 with 1 that's never realistically going to happen?,,, 14 damag at lvl one matters much more 14 extra damage doesn't mean jack shit when you're losing out on 20 armour and MR + 30% damage reduction on W for it.
Andarius (NA)
: > Also Black Cleaver armour pen is a non-factor, again, old Garen with black cleaver first did more damage to you than new garen does with either Triforce first or Black Cleaver first (which is even worse since now AS scaling). > > > I think it's absolutely bizarre I played him since season 4, even prior to rework when he lost a good chunk of matchups +70% and I'm saying that GAREN is going to be stronger than Garen after these nerfs. > > And yet, people like you, who can't even kite for shit have the audacity to say that full crit + AD Garen is OP. He's squishy just like any other fucker who goes full AD + crit, like Darius, Nasus etc; Also the armor pen does matter, ALOT lol, if you're up against a average 150-200 armor tank (Which he's a top laner... they're up there, unless we're choosing to ignore this case, and saying it has absolutely no merrit... which it does.) Shredding %'s off that actually means a lot all things considered. And it'd be AWESOME to see those numbers and compare... but you didn't put them up there because you think they're irrelevant, which they aren't. And dunno why you're coming at me like I'm disagreeing with you, IDC really weather he's nerfed or not, hell maybe he needs a buff and we're not seeing it... but I couldn't tell you cuz the numbers aren't there.
> [{quoted}](name=Andarius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=28AsKPpA,comment-id=000100000001,timestamp=2019-12-06T00:23:01.530+0000) > > Also the armor pen does matter, ALOT lol, if you're up against a average 150-200 armor tank (Which he's a top laner... they're up there, unless we're choosing to ignore this case, and saying it has absolutely no merrit... which it does.) Shredding %'s off that actually means a lot all things considered. > > And it'd be AWESOME to see those numbers and compare... but you didn't put them up there because you think they're irrelevant, which they aren't. > > And dunno why you're coming at me like I'm disagreeing with you, IDC really weather he's nerfed or not, hell maybe he needs a buff and we're not seeing it... but I couldn't tell you cuz the numbers aren't there. Are you trolling me? OLD. GAREN. WITH. BLACK. CLEAVER. DOES. MORE. DAMAGE. THAN. NEW. GAREN. This is why the armour pen doesn't matter - even if new Garen got black cleaver - IT'S STILL DOING LESS DAMAGE THAN OLD GAREN DID WITH IT. And now, in order to even come close to the base damage of Old Garen rushing cleaver you need to by triforce - WHICH DOESN'T HAVE ANY ARMOUR PEN ON IT.
Andarius (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=TheMoobile,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=28AsKPpA,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-12-06T00:14:15.964+0000) > > It's even *worse* early because he has less spins lol. > I took max rank to show him at his most powerful. but that's NOT most powerful if you're evaluating every champ at lvl 18 being their most powerful, let me tell you... Garen beats 80% of the champion base. If you're citing him as a late game hyper carry or something, cool cite your math at max lvl, but he's a juggernaut, they're Early-mid game powerhouses that dom,inate tanks if they get ahead.... soooo why is your math doing nothing for armor? And only checking him at lvl 18 where any true late game person crushes him anywayys?...
> [{quoted}](name=Andarius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=28AsKPpA,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2019-12-06T00:16:37.848+0000) > > but that's NOT most powerful > > if you're evaluating every champ at lvl 18 being their most powerful, let me tell you... Garen beats 80% of the champion base. > > If you're citing him as a late game hyper carry or something, cool cite your math at max lvl, but he's a juggernaut, they're Early-mid game powerhouses that dom,inate tanks if they get ahead.... soooo why is your math doing nothing for armor? And only checking him at lvl 18 where any true late game person crushes him anywayys?... It'll be the most powerful for his spins since he'll have the maximum amount of spins by then. Again, it's even weaker early. You could easily do the math yourself but old Garen at level 1 spin did 210 damage with spin, this new one with the changes is 224. Wow, I get 14 extra damage. For the removal of 20 armour, and 30% damage reduction on W. That's not worth in any fucking world.
Andarius (NA)
: First, I look at your numbers and notice from the math, you're only citing max lvl garen, which... doesn't matter... games are over and decided so long before then, those numbers are pretty irrelevant... Second, the numbers are showing MAX lvl garen with ONLY trinity force and ONLY a Black cleaver to compare, you're telling me the only points in a game where this damage would matter are at max lvl, and ONLY when he has a black cleaver or ONLY when he has a trinity force? How bout like... do the math for points and breakpoints in the game that matter, like lvl 1, 3, 6, and 9 (1 when u first get the ability, 3 when you have all 3, 6 cuz... duh... and 9 when you max 1) Cuz like... those are breakpoints that actually matter, not EXCLUSIVELY lvl 18 with 1 item to boot. Check the math IDK... comparing lvl 11 PD, Trinity Garen, with and without Zerk Grieves, vs Garen with BC, and Steraks, then post something... cuz those breakpoints just don't even matter, THIRD, you're completely leaving out armor shred calculations which... BC gives aswell as his e, so ya know, look at the equations for armor and the actually percentages you're shredding for an actual accurate "Real" representation of damage, cuz lets face it, no garen with exclusively a trinity force is actually dealing 1,000+ dmg with a spin to anyone with any semblance of armor, which matters. Half baked post honestly, if you're going to go through the effort to actually convince the company doing the changes not to do something should probably think bout it like a developer.
> [{quoted}](name=Andarius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=28AsKPpA,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-12-06T00:12:51.469+0000) > > First, I look at your numbers and notice from the math, you're only citing max lvl garen, which... doesn't matter... games are over and decided so long before then, those numbers are pretty irrelevant... > > Second, the numbers are showing MAX lvl garen with ONLY trinity force and ONLY a Black cleaver to compare, you're telling me the only points in a game where this damage would matter are at max lvl, and ONLY when he has a black cleaver or ONLY when he has a trinity force? > > How bout like... do the math for points and breakpoints in the game that matter, like lvl 1, 3, 6, and 9 (1 when u first get the ability, 3 when you have all 3, 6 cuz... duh... and 9 when you max 1) Cuz like... those are breakpoints that actually matter, not EXCLUSIVELY lvl 18 with 1 item to boot. > > Check the math IDK... comparing lvl 11 PD, Trinity Garen, with and without Zerk Grieves, vs Garen with BC, and Steraks, then post something... cuz those breakpoints just don't even matter, > > THIRD, you're completely leaving out armor shred calculations which... BC gives aswell as his e, so ya know, look at the equations for armor and the actually percentages you're shredding for an actual accurate "Real" representation of damage, cuz lets face it, no garen with exclusively a trinity force is actually dealing 1,000+ dmg with a spin to anyone with any semblance of armor, which matters. > > Half baked post honestly, if you're going to go through the effort to actually convince the company doing the changes not to do something should probably think bout it like a developer. It's even *worse* early because he has less spins lol. I took max rank to show him at his most powerful. Also Black Cleaver armour pen is a non-factor, again, old Garen with black cleaver first did more damage to you than new garen does with either Triforce first or Black Cleaver first (which is even worse since now AS scaling). I think it's absolutely bizarre I played him since season 4, even prior to rework when he lost a good chunk of matchups +70% and I'm saying that GAREN is going to be stronger than Garen after these nerfs. And yet, people like you, who can't even kite for shit have the audacity to say that full crit + AD Garen is OP. He's squishy just like any other fucker who goes full AD + crit, like Darius, Nasus etc;
: Riot do not listen to this Garen main.
> [{quoted}](name=Mavëríck,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=28AsKPpA,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-12-05T23:48:10.897+0000) > > Riot do not listen to this Garen main. Do you even look at the post? HE DEALS LESS DAMAGE WITH TRIFORCE FIRST ITEM, THAN HE DID BEFORE THE REWORK RUSHING BLACK CLEAVER. OLD GAREN DID MORE DAMAGE, WHERE WERE YOUR COMPLAINTS THEN? Also, if Darius goes full crit, he can 1 shot you with W + 5 stacks. Fucking low elo, man.
Rioter Comments
: This feels like the worst season to play ranked
Alternative title: This feels like the worst season to play League.
: this post shoulda been another "whats armor vs yi???" thread.
> [{quoted}](name=Corrector1,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EIjEuE7k,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2019-04-23T12:07:09.566+0000) > > this post shoulda been another "whats armor vs yi???" thread. Idk why you got downvoted, by definition **TRUE** damage **IGNORES** armour and magic resistance, you're literally just stating the obvious and being downvoted for a true statement. Whatever lmao.
: I'm tired of hugging the tower while Zed gets to free farm and harass me endlessly for 10-20 minutes
I agree that isn't fun, but don't expect any changes - top lane has basically been this since the start of the season with ranged top laners into melee match ups.
Rioter Comments
: He's kind of weak actually, though admittedly not terrible. I wouldn't characterize him as being in a good spot
> [{quoted}](name=kingDeDeDarius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RbXjoGKF,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-04-21T02:25:41.393+0000) > > He's kind of weak actually, though admittedly not terrible. I wouldn't characterize him as being in a good spot For sure, you can tell the people who have actually played the champion into most of the top lane matchups and realised how he's failing both early and in teamfights.
: That's not a QoL, that's a straight-up buff. And it removes a lot of chance people have to get out of it.
> [{quoted}](name=DuskDaUmbreon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RbXjoGKF,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-04-21T03:56:13.810+0000) > > That's not a QoL, that's a straight-up buff. And it removes a lot of chance people have to get out of it. In higher elo you tend to use Q on a target you've just hooked or used W on so they're massively slown - so 9/10 they don't get out of it anyways. Unless they have a dash... in which case this small buff isn't going to change anything since they'll still dash out of it the moment they see wind up.
: Darius is in a good spot right now I don't think bluffing him would be right.
> [{quoted}](name=7ckngMad,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RbXjoGKF,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-04-21T00:46:08.557+0000) > > Darius is in a good spot right now I don't think bluffing him would be right. He has a 47.4 win rate overall. 50% win rate before 20 min (on an EARLY game champ!?) - for reference the most late game champion IN THIS GAME (kayle) has a 50% win rate before 20 min too except she gets to 58% win rate at 30 minutes. His win rate has consistently been dropping patch after patch too.
Moody P (NA)
: Darius should have power moved away from dunk burst
Darius doesn't do well I higher elo because he dies before he can even get a Q off and his ult doesn't even need a nerf 900 true damage for 5 stacks vs a Cho'Gath with over 1K and health scaling true damage and doesn't stack anything? Okay. Darius has to work for that burst, if they do reduce ult damage they have to bring back instant Q. Edit: follow up, also why nerf a kiteable melee champion when you have ranged champions abusing top lane? Like Viktor, kennen, karma, neeko - can we fix that shit first?
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: The counter strategy, get this, isn't to build against it. It's to *play* against it. Fiora without her ult is the easiest example, you just need to actively keep your weakest side away from her. Even when she Ults, you can deny her a single vital just by standing in a wall. Vayne's a little trickier, because her play around isn't in 1v1s, especially since both Fiora and Vayne are duelists. Her play around is in teamfights, where you need to get her to switch targets, or where you can abuse her short range to lock her down. The main thing Rageblade does, which is the problem, is that it lowers the time it takes for Vayne to proc her things. This gives her a better late game, but it's because she has less of a window to force her to switch targets before she gets that damage. I think that's where the problem lays, that Vayne has lost some of the 'play around' she should have because of RageBlade.
> [{quoted}](name=Academy Kayn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FA4TR7xv,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2019-03-27T15:22:34.556+0000) > > The counter strategy, get this, isn't to build against it. It's to *play* against it. Fiora without her ult is the easiest example, you just need to actively keep your weakest side away from her. Even when she Ults, you can deny her a single vital just by standing in a wall. Vayne's a little trickier, because her play around isn't in 1v1s, especially since both Fiora and Vayne are duelists. Her play around is in teamfights, where you need to get her to switch targets, or where you can abuse her short range to lock her down. > > The main thing Rageblade does, which is the problem, is that it lowers the time it takes for Vayne to proc her things. This gives her a better late game, but it's because she has less of a window to force her to switch targets before she gets that damage. I think that's where the problem lays, that Vayne has lost some of the 'play around' she should have because of RageBlade. Lmao "play against it". Have you actually tried keeping your "weak side" away from a 2.5 sec dash? Or are you just repeating regurgitated nonsense?
: Agreed. But people screech “tank meta tank meta” if at any point tanks are playable, so pretty sure it’s just here to stay forever.
> [{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FA4TR7xv,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-03-27T15:03:52.790+0000) > > Agreed. But people screech “tank meta tank meta” if at any point tanks are playable, so pretty sure it’s just here to stay forever. This is what really annoys me about people - the moment tanks ACTUALLY TANK it's "waaah tank meta" but the moment you've got 200 armour and you blink and you're dead, that's okay? No "Waaah assassin/adc meta" just "Yeah this is normal." Explain????????
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: make it scale to 100 lol
100 would be much too excessive loool. Though, I wouldn't complain, others would though
Rioter Comments
: Q max over E is the optimal skill order for garen. I already explained why. Plenty of other actual high level garen players can confrim this. champion.gg takes into account all players, not just the best garens.
It might be different at high elo, but for Gold (my elo) at least taking E is definitely the better option (just for the additional damage) I used to max Q over E, but ever since the juggernaut rework I never did. Mainly because silence duration increased with Q max. But either way, lets hope whatever changes they bring to Garen benefits the mains across all elos and not just "high end play" because lets be honest he's under-performing in all Elos. Edit: instead of a 25% armour reduction I would much rather welcome a passive change or buff, because as it stands right now it doesn't really do what it says on the tin, that is "persevere". He gets pushed out of lane like any other champ.
: > [{quoted}](name=Meddler,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NrIimRFN,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2016-11-28T23:23:02.212+0000) > > There are a few things we're hoping to accomplish by adding a shred to Garen's E: > > 1. We want to buff Garen moderately. He's underperforming, and has been for a while. At the same time though when he's strong his kit leaves some opponents feeling unable to deal with him. He's certainly not unique in that regard, he is one of the tankier champions to have that trait though, with a really reliable combat pattern in those match ups. A moderate, rather than large, buff is our target for a single patch as a result. > > 2. We want Garen to be more impactful on team compositions. We want champions in general to have a moderate degree of impact on which champions you pick alongside them. Garen at present's pretty soft in that regard, with a low degree of team power contribution (as opposed to personal power). Adding an Armor Shred, rather than just increasing his own damage, makes it more attractive to pair him with multiple other champions with significant physical damage. It also means that Garen getting a lot of kills, as he can be prone to do with his ult in particular, feels like a better use of those kills than at present - the items and XP he'll be getting from them should at least somewhat improve his ability to keep that shred up. > > 3. We want to increase the impact playing well as Garen and playing well against Garen has. The shred comes all at once after 4 E hits, rather than gradually stacking, to both slightly reward good Garen play and good play against Garen more (clear success/fail cases). > > 4. We'd like Garen to be a bit more target agnostic. When ahead Q/E/R can burst squishies pretty hard. When behind though he can really struggle to have any impact of note on tankier enemy champs. A % armor shred evens that out a bit. > > > In terms of listening to Garen mains we always want to get some understanding of how the most frequent players of a champion feel about that champ's current state. That can offer some really good insights. At the same time though listening to mains doesn't necessarily mean doing what's asked. Some players do a great job of separating out personal feelings from suggested changes and offer really nuanced feedback that solves problems. Others however will push for buffs to their favorite champs until those champs are the strongest, or close to strongest, members of their class, without regard for the impact on other champs or the game as a whole. Hi meddler. I'm one of the high elo garen mains on the NA server. Feedback on this Change : I agree largely with points 3 and 4. For point 2, I disagree that Garen isn't impactful when getting the kills - but this mostly stems from what Garen players choose to build on him. I personally play a much more aggressive style opting for items like Ghostblade, Edge of Night, or crit items. I honestly believe Garen is pitched at being tanky a little too much - a more offensive build really tanks advantage of the damage output he has. His unique ability to crit with his spin means he can build snowball items like Infinity Edge and really run people down, at the cost of being less tanky. Seeing as how killing is his job, it's a shame riot does not encourage Garen players to build slightly more offensively than they currently do. Cleaver rush is a straight up noob trap in most games, where as ghostblade enables him to do his job (hunt carries) significantly better. The point of all this I guess is - Garen should be encourage to only build as tanky as he needs to survive and dump the rest of his resources into damage. Also garen players would love to see more items that can enable effective crit builds on melee heros like garen (atma's crit, + ghostblade crit + infinity edge + triforce were all great crit items for bruisers at one time, now only IE remains and its situationally useful on melees at best - garen/yasuo/trynd/yi/etc) What's Missing from this change : Garen's real weak point is his early game. It's horrid. It's been bad since the update. This won't do anything to change that. Also, E should be garen's encouraged first skill but Q max is his best skill order since juggernaut update. Q gains movespeed duration which is central to the anti-kite he needs, and the damage gained per rank in Q and E are very very similar - early on Q is actually superior unless you get multiple isolated spins on an enemy. Therefore - garen's best damage and utility skill is his Q from level 1 to 10-13~. It's only around 10 that Spin becomes strong enough to want to stay in range for its full duration in trades regularly, and only by 13 does the damage from spin really make it feel like your primary damage skill. The iteration of this change where the %shred scaled gave me a reason to want to max E first again, but now that its 25% flat once more - I have no reason to max E first again. Without making Q weaker (it's his best ability right now and the only one I can really count on early) will there ever be changes to E to make it his primary skill once more? thanks
I'm sorry, I have to disagree with your comments about Q. Especially "E" not being a skill that gets maxed, E is quite a decent damage skill at the moment and thus it is the MOST POPULAR skill to max. Here are even the statistics: http://champion.gg/champion/Garen/Top Q is just not a strong skill right now, the movespeed is too weak. The damage is negligible and the only thing that ranks up with points in Q is the duration the movespeed lasts (not the actual movespeed bonus itself). It seems like you maxing Q is a rarity amongst even Garen players.
Meddler (NA)
: There are a few things we're hoping to accomplish by adding a shred to Garen's E: 1. We want to buff Garen moderately. He's underperforming, and has been for a while. At the same time though when he's strong his kit leaves some opponents feeling unable to deal with him. He's certainly not unique in that regard, he is one of the tankier champions to have that trait though, with a really reliable combat pattern in those match ups. A moderate, rather than large, buff is our target for a single patch as a result. 2. We want Garen to be more impactful on team compositions. We want champions in general to have a moderate degree of impact on which champions you pick alongside them. Garen at present's pretty soft in that regard, with a low degree of team power contribution (as opposed to personal power). Adding an Armor Shred, rather than just increasing his own damage, makes it more attractive to pair him with multiple other champions with significant physical damage. It also means that Garen getting a lot of kills, as he can be prone to do with his ult in particular, feels like a better use of those kills than at present - the items and XP he'll be getting from them should at least somewhat improve his ability to keep that shred up. 3. We want to increase the impact playing well as Garen and playing well against Garen has. The shred comes all at once after 4 E hits, rather than gradually stacking, to both slightly reward good Garen play and good play against Garen more (clear success/fail cases). 4. We'd like Garen to be a bit more target agnostic. When ahead Q/E/R can burst squishies pretty hard. When behind though he can really struggle to have any impact of note on tankier enemy champs. A % armor shred evens that out a bit. In terms of listening to Garen mains we always want to get some understanding of how the most frequent players of a champion feel about that champ's current state. That can offer some really good insights. At the same time though listening to mains doesn't necessarily mean doing what's asked. Some players do a great job of separating out personal feelings from suggested changes and offer really nuanced feedback that solves problems. Others however will push for buffs to their favorite champs until those champs are the strongest, or close to strongest, members of their class, without regard for the impact on other champs or the game as a whole.
I'm a Garen main myself, I would have to disagree with the latter part of your final point "When behind though he can really struggle to have any impact of note on tankier enemy champs." because of the way his ult scales Garen doesn't ever really "fall" off, he can fall behind but scoring a kill is always well within the realms of possibility. To use a recent example, my game crashed and I was away for 10m, I came back into lane vs a level 9 nasus as a level 3 Garen, I got to 6 - my jungler ganked and I just ulted the Nasus (and played it smart so Nasus wouldn't get me) from there on I manage to cruise my way back into the game (even out farming my bot lane and ending on a higher level than them lol) So the main things you distinguished were "personal power" and "team power". Well for personal power, Garen is usually pretty solid - he can get you low and instagib you with his ult. His passive is alright early on for the extra sustain but nothing too great - it's more for late game (which is odd considering he was supposed to be early game focused), Trundle has a far superior sustain passive (being that it works in-combat too). Team power, well Garen is sort of played like an "assassin" as in his goal in team fights is to destroy the villain, that's what he brings to team fights. This is where his play style is sort of contradictory, he targets a specific champ and takes them out - like assassins do, except he's really tank, has no form of disruption (so counter-intuitive to a tank) and he has no reliable way to get to the Villain. This % armour shred, while I welcome the change just doesn't seem too effective at what you're trying to achieve, he's so susceptible to CC (especially with the removal of the tenacity on W active!) so he would just end up spinning and now more people will be like "avoid that it shreds armour" they'll just well, CC him and he won't ever get the 4 spins off. If you argue "He can attack from a dynamic angle, something unsuspecting, like the jungle" that defeats the purpose of a front line tank. So Garen is left with two options, run in and risk not getting CC'd (which is hard with no tenacity on W and no gap closer - the movespeed on Q is pretty weak too), or stay with his carries and protect them by deterring assassins (which is a role I think he's much much better for with the silence - so you should really be catering to this sort of approach imo, thematically it makes sense too - he's all about justice and honour and he comes across as a "protector" of sorts) and so here are just my personal opinions on what could help out his "team power" would be things along the lines of: - % movespeed while charging towards the Villain. - bring back tenacity on W ACTIVE. - a new mechanic to deter people from engaging (rather than focus on Garen engaging, since no gapcloser it's likely not going to be rewarding even trying to engage). - a stacking shred (but perhaps weaker values for balance purposes - maybe 4%?) that way even if he gets two or three hits, he's still remotely useful - which is more likely. *footnote: Obviously don't add all changes, that would be crazy - just suggesting them as a guideline of things to potentially focus on. That's just my two-cents as someone who plays Garen a lot, he was also the first champion I ever picked up - been with him since season 4. So through quite a lot of ups and downs (I did welcome the juggernaut update, they were good). I appreciate it if you took the time to read through all this, I just hope you do... JUSTICE to Garen ;)
: Mid Year Mage Updates - Malzahar Direction
You could turn Malzahar into more of a "Summoner" type champion then with the voidlings. Make it something like this maybe? Passive: Malzahars voidlings damage scales with (20% of total AD and 10% AP) (+ a base value). Voidlings gain critical strike based on malzahars AD, up to 50% critical strike chance. Voidling attacks apply a 3 seconds DoT that deals damage equal to 20% of Malzahars AP. (This way AP builds get the DoT and a stronger one, and AD builds get crit on voidlings to keep them relevant) Voidlings will attack the opponent malzahar last dealt damage to, unless Malzahar has specifically told the voidlings which champion to target. Q: Malzahar summons one (1) voidling to his side, to aid him in battle. Voidlings last 30 seconds before disappearing. Malzahar can summon up to 4 voidlings int total. Summoning a voidling ontop of an enemy will deal 60/105/140/175/210(+60% AP) damage to them. (This skill will have all the voidling stuff attached to it like there Defence and HP, putting points into this will increase their durability and lower the skill cooldown) -this will act sort of like a syndra Q, except voidlings can move around, they're an independent summon- W: Malzahar commands his voidlings to attack a chosen enemy, the first attack by each voidling summoned will apply a 10% slow (stacks up to 4 times). E: Malzahar ruptures the ground causing a rift of void energy to open up for 5 seconds, enemies standing on this void will take 15/25/35/45/55 (+50% AP) magic damage per second. While voidlings are standing on this they gain 20/30/40/50/60% bonus attack speed. R: Malzahar fires out a tether to damage an enemy for 100/250/400 (+80% AP) magic damage over the course of 4 seconds. Throughout this time the opponent is also slowed, the slow initially starts at 40/50/60% and scales up to 99%. The opponent may move out of the range of the tether, breaking it, however if the opponent fails to break from the tether, after the 4 seconds are up they will further be rooted in place for 1.25 seconds. Malzahar may use skills while he is tethering with the opponent, he may also move around but his movement will be impaired by 30% scaling up to 66% over the duration of the spell. (makes him vulnerable while using it, but NOT as vulnerable as he used to be before). *R could use some work, but this was just a rough idea. Thanks for taking the time to talk to your community, Riot! :)
: I know it's probably one of the most iconic "Brand" things, but I honestly have no attachment whatsoever to his ult and would have zero problem with it being completely removed and replaced with something different. It's just not compelling at all to me. A big bouncing fireball? Why would a fireball bounce anyway? And it's annoyingly RNG sometimes too. I always thought that Brand's ultimate should be like, some huge ass aoe fire that he starts that really encapsulates "set the world on fire". Dunno what I would have it do really, but it would be flipping huge and hella metal and we can run from there.
How about they have Brand scream out and smash his hands into the ground and it erupts lava out of the ground in a line (sort of like a Nautilus ult) and upon reaching the target it'll explode and leave a pool of lava behind dealing DoT to any enemies within the pool. So people still run away from the ulted target, except it'll be easier to follow where the ult is an how much time you have to GTFO

TheMoobile

Level 192 (EUW)
Lifetime Upvotes
Create a Discussion