: Also {{champion:50}} {{champion:6}} and {{champion:80}} were all pretty solid too. A lot of the CertaintyT type reworks and new champs are in balance limbo. Edit: I mean thematically and on paper. People are whining because they're not as fla$hy and overtuned like the other reworks. Could they use some buffs? Sure. Least Swain and Urgot, I still see some panth players pop off.
> [{quoted}](name=Burns Master,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0AuRtGb5,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2020-01-24T07:36:48.345+0000) > > Also {{champion:50}} {{champion:6}} and {{champion:80}} were all pretty solid too. > > A lot of the CertaintyT type reworks and new champs are in balance limbo. How the fuck is swain SOLID? Absolutely nothing from him remains. Unique gameplay thrown into the trash compactor for another generic hit long range skillshot-->burst burst mage. Dont even talk about his looks and personality. And the worst part is him being viable for like a month before gutted into nothingness where now when he used to be a good top and midlaner his best role now is FUCKIN SUPPORT. Yeah pretty solid rework. Also: Alienating pretty much all his playerbase to a point he now has a lower playerbase than before. Htis rework is atrocious and a fuckin insult to the community.
Janakin (EUNE)
: It would be perfectly OK if they didn't listen to those 99% incompetent folks. But the thing is, they don't listen even to the remaining 1% of the competent ones.
> [{quoted}](name=Janakin,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6q55TfoX,comment-id=00020002,timestamp=2020-01-23T21:58:53.025+0000) > > It would be perfectly OK if they didn't listen to those 99% incompetent folks. But the thing is, they don't listen even to the remaining 1% of the competent ones. Ye that's the actual issue. Trying to keep low elo satisfied while making pro play entertaining has turned this game into a shitshow when it should be top 1% of soloQ balanced around and pro play being the peak of league gameplay which we had when the game was most popular like five years back then but being the most popular wasnt good enough. We needed to lose half the playerbase. for reasons.
GFREEMEN (NA)
: They are deleting more and more Gameplay posts and Banning people for posting negative gameplay posts that are not violating any of the forum rules. Its like Riot is a Dictatorship.
> [{quoted}](name=GFREEMEN,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6q55TfoX,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2020-01-23T20:19:16.852+0000) > > They are deleting more and more Gameplay posts and Banning people for posting negative gameplay posts that are not violating any of the forum rules. > > Its like Riot is a Dictatorship. Can confirm actually. Had already three posts that were somewhat reasonable from my perspective with a rant here and there sprinkled in removed. they go full chinese now. Soon we will be collecting social points to show how much we love our regi... eh riot.
: After like 3 years, I've Finally had a 50 minutes match
Same. Had one 55 minute game not too long on irelia. Twas fuckin intense, i was complete done after that game but it was really fun and glorious i miss those games. I'd rather play 3-4 of these intense 35-50+ minutes games a day where my skill actually matters and i can do stuff. Than 8 or 9 games where jungle diff or bot diff decides the game in 10 minutes and i'm basically a bystander just watching the enemy and begging that they release me and just finally end it.
: Sure. Once we bring bruiser items in line along side them.
Bringing the worst items in the game up to the level of brokeness mage and adc items posses? Count me in. Steraks now 2600 gold. Death dance 3000. Trinity 3400. Hydra items at 3000. Black cleaver 2650 like void staff and reduces armor up to 50% because there is more armor than MR in the game. GA down to 2 mins cooldown like zhonyas. Steraks now on demand shield like archangel. Death's dance gives 20% cdr cuz why not. Steraks now also gives 10% CDR like mage items cuz why not. Tiamat also gives 10% CDR cuz why not like mage item counterpart lost chapter. Jaurims fist gives AD and MR just like seekers and builds into something whatever doesn't matter. Should also be 150% gold efficient. Not sure you wanna live in a world where bruisers are an actual class and not a trollpick anymore.
: Imo, stat checks are worse. There's fewer levels to mess with for balance, and they're always the "feast of famine" champs that either shit all over everything, or get shat on by everything, with literally no in between. Look at Sylas: he was overloaded AF on release. Now he's barely playable since they flipped so many levers. But Koreans are running Augment and adapting builds around him to still make him halfway useful. Or Akali: they turned off like 75% of her rework's power, and shes still a scary competitor when played correctly. If they hit Morde in the stats right now, NOONE will play him cause he'll have too simple of a kit, AND no stats behind it. If they hit Tryndaqueef right now, he'll be useless, cause his stats are his life. Etc...
No one played sylas when he finally got removed from the game. Same as how no one plays kalista for a super duper skill kit. No one would play akali if she wasn't still broken as fuck.
: If you kite, it's not a statcheck, because you prevent the enemy from just using their offensive stats. A real statcheck would be 2 olafs beating each other and the one with better stats wins. They check each others offensive stats vs defensive stats.
XDDDDDDDD Holy fuck man. way to go you mastered the art of bullshitting around in the ghostcrawler way. But just an attempt to try to clarify for you: You literally statcheck THEIR offensive stats vs the melee defensive stats who needs to get into range again. Like oh boy. Do you realize the game is as shit as it is BECAUSE it is balanced entirely around the perspective of a pure zero gameplay ranged statcheck? Who can infinitely kite and statcheck you to death and the only gameplay involved is: Get into range and STATCHECK HIM TO DEATH or get kited to death. That's literally the entire games problem which is almost as old as the game itself thanks to ghostcrawler and his goonsquad. And then you actually give one of the most skill intensive matchups as an example i can think of to ruin your own "argument". Try to statcheck, standing still and beating another olaf to death who dodges your Qs, hits his Qs AND picks his own axe up. Who knows exactly when to use his W and how to use his E in the most efficient way to maximize his DPS. Now let's look at these very skill intensive non statcheck adcs fighting each other at first. Either you have lower range and he kites you to death and beats you with his SUPERIOR STATS (range is a stat too btw) OR they run at each other and autoattack each other to death in a totally non statcheck way because they are ranged or something. Now again just to make it clear let's look at the perspective of a ranged vs melee matchup taking jax as an example. I walk up to caitlyn, she starts to not statcheck me with her auto attacks. I jump at her, Q auto W Titanic proc and she died. Then again i jump at her now she Es away, slows me and keeps autoattacking me and kills me. THEN i jump at her in a third example, she Es away and i keep walking up to her until i got my Q again or in range and finally kill her. So either i have MORE STATS THAN HER and kill her. I have LOWER STATS and she autoattacks me to death before i get into range OR in the third case i have MORE STATS THAN HER and survive her damage until i get into range of her again. And because i'm really nice let's look at a melee vs melee matchup compared to the adc vs adc matchup. Let's stick with olaf and jax. Olaf Qs me, picks it up, Qs me again, i have to fight him use my counterstrike but i was too low he kills me now. Next time i dodge both axes he runs into me we fight, i counterstrike and nearly get him suddenly he activates his W and heals up and kills me. The next time dodge one Q but get hit by the other he runs in and attacks me. We fight i hold my E until he activates his W now i eat all his autoattacks with my counterstrike and beat the shit out of him. And i can give u infinite examples of this because this fight can go entirely different every single time we attempt to fight each other. Sounds like real statchecks right? We only walk onto each other and calculate each others stats and the one with lower stats loses right? And it's funny because both of them are among the oldest designed champions and have WAY more gameplay and less stat checkyness than your beloved adcs fighting each other or adcs fighting melee champions. And believe me i do hate champs like nasus who are so overstatted and have zero gameplay they LITERALLY (he is one of the actual statcheck zero gameplay examples melees have to offer) just beat you by the mere fact they have better stats. On the other hand opposed to someone like darius he doesn't have the tools necessary to really stop me as a fed jax and loses because now i have more stats than him. Whereas the darius can pull me to stop my engage, slow me to kite my ult out and then beat me even if he is behind. Now if you after this visualization still believe adcs aren't "statchecks" i will have to put you onto the r word list because you are a lost case.
: I mean the problem with bruiser items is it's so fucking expensive to buy them and the components are trash for how much they cost. Bruiser builds are more expensive then adc mage and tank builds.
And they also scale the worst out of all classes *clownface*
: Thanks I didn't remember it. So that's why the other day I took it and saw it increased my base AD by 53...
Not base AD. That was OLD STERAKS. New shitty steraks only amplifies BONUS AD. And trinity works off of base AD and NOT BONUS ad.
SoarinJC (NA)
: If you're using Thresh as an example of an overloaded champion, I'm not entirely certain that you understand what overloaded means. He is strong, yes, but definitely not overloaded. He has distinct weaknesses that can be played around given correct positioning, team comp, and mechanics. He has long CDs on abilities, making him poor at extended trades that don't last until he has his hook back up. (20+ seconds usually, 10 if he hits you which is still a good amount of time) His tankiness is sufficiently dependent on laning phase through souls, meaning that if you can bully and deny him souls then he doubly loses out on a ton of stats in early and mid game. Building even further off of this, he has no sustain in his kit which makes him double susceptible to bullying. The strongest and most unique part of his kit, in my opinion, is his lantern. However even this has a very long cd, can only save 1 person, and can be blocked if the enemy has enough situational awareness. If you think about Thresh as his component parts, he can be summed up as : * Pseudo-tank scaling * A long range cc drag * A long range conditional rescue (isn't effective if the ally is behind him, on him, or if the lantern's blocked) * A short range aoe cc effect * A small on hit steroid * A pseudo aoe damage/slow Overall he has a few good abilities, but he definitely can't do everything. On the contrary, I would consider Pyke overloaded: * Built in sustain that gives **significant** healing, and which he can consistently proc even during extended fights * Long range cc pull * Invis/speed boost * A dash and an aoe stun * An aoe execute that can be activated as many times as there are enemies on the map provided that you get kills with it (which isn't that hard considering the generous execute threshold, the fact that his damage and scaling numbers are wildly strong, and he builds full damage and lethality anyways) and which gives an extra 300 gold to everyone involved with any of the kills (which is ridiculous in itself, considering they removed klepto because of how much gold it was giving) All of his abilities also have a relatively short cd and can be used multiple times per fight.
He is not overloaded? Riot literally removed half his kit and stats to make him seem somewhat "balanced" yet he is still overpowered and one of the top supports literally every season.
: Your definitions of stat check/overloaded in all honesty make no sense. PS: probably because both are terms that salty players made up, because they didn't want to say "overpowered" Yasuo is as much of a stat check as he is overloaded. Overloaded with item synergy which makes him a stat check... or something like that. Kinda hard to have a discussion when you throw around these vague terms. Seems pointless.
It's just crazy acting like a game where 90% of items give nothing but more stats has "statcheck champs" and "non statcheck champs". It's a term made up by riot to justify their hatred for bruiser and that's it. Melee champions by default have more gameplay than adcs for example. Yet no one EVER talks about marksman being statchecks despite them LITERALLY be based on uncounterable AUTOATTACKS FROM RANGE who ONLY buy items that AMPLIFY SAID AUTOATTACKS.
Keiaga (NA)
: Stat check champ. Losing to a tryndamere who just autos you and occasionally spins even though you were playing your champion correctly feels hopeless. Losing to a Senna or whichever other champion you consider over loaded still allows for the feeling of being outplayed if you aren't just immature.
Yeah i feel really outplayed when akali with her four gapclosers, slow, stealth, MS boost avoids me and bursts me down at the same time. Jumping forth and back before my champion even finishes his auto attack animation. Or just getting poked out of lane for trying to CS. Tryndamere on the other hand is really terrible. We enter lane, the game calculates both our stats and when he has more the game closes and tryndamere won the match because he is a statcheck champion. So the game checked our stats, if i had less i lost the game. Absolutely zero gameplay involved unlike akali for example. Same with nasus. Often i find myself in lane trying to engage, then again the game calculates our stats for a few seconds until it decides that nasus early game is terrible and makes him blow up. That's what he gets for being a statcheck tho. Finally i got my brain right to be on par with boards members. Only took me acid and a few litre of jack daniels.
: nerf damage bruiser items
Steraks does NOT amplify trinity anymore for 1 1/2 years now. But this is what gets traction on these boards. Brusaaa baaad. Jungle guuuuud. Mage guuuuud. Asasin baaad. Shadow ninja veri baaaaad. Katana man supaaaaa baaaaaaad.
Rioter Comments
: support is a joke role right now they turned it into yet another uninteresting burst/assassin role, play champs like pyke or lose.
Except the top support champs have been nautilus, leona, thresh for a longer time now.
: While true its not Unique 3 entire classes of champions Exist like that While Illaoi just happens to be in one sub class of champions like that for her class. Darius Mordekaiser Garen all have the same play pattern top dont interact with just farm and pray they get bored with the lane and leave before realizing they can dive you at level 4 and you are level 2
That's not even remotely true. Darius has a plethora of counterplay and that narrative how he beats every melee is just plain wrong. Garen is just a joke that becomes annyoing in teamfights when he randomly Rs you for 1k true damage.
Arammus (EUW)
: sure. but you need to do that on lolreddit, the only place where riot sometimes listens. OH WAIT SHIT! the lol reddit community is a bunch of riot suckers, so your thread will be downvoted into abyss. too bad sorry. nice attempt tho
It's not any different here. Except that it's a few people here that only want their narrative and bot downvote anything that doesn't support it, even boards moderation support it.
: That line of argumentation is really bad for the game as a whole. Aphelios has a banrate that can be basicly translated as, every game he is not banned gets dodged or remaked. When this happens in silver it is not big a deal even though most players are in this elo, because a champion doing that in this elo can simply have a weakness that can not be abused by bad players, or needs good fundamentels to be dealt with accordingly. The skill of the people playing the character is what decides the outcome. Now if this happens in Challenger korea, which i think we can all agree is the highest level of SoloQ play we have, then that means that their exists a champion that is so overloaded/overtuned/overstat, that the best in the world can not find an answer to it. So as far as we know, their does not exists an answer to beating this champion in the game, just by picking Aphelios u present ur opponent with a problem that has no answer. Ur actual skill as a player get dimished as a deciding gamefactor. This means that when he gets picked in lower elos, u get a problem. U will find players spamming Aphelios, getting into elos they simply are not good enough to be in, just because their champion can shut down better players. Then Aphelios gets banned and they become an absolute deadweight, basicly destroying every game they can not pick their insanly overpowered character. A Champion like that is not just a problem for the best of the best, it screwes over lower elo games too, just because these players arent good enough to recognize why they lose, doent mean the reasons dissapears into thin air. That is the same problem every overloaded champion has. They screw the ladder an create massiv frustration within the playersbase because suddenly people in the same bracket have insanly different levels of fundamental gameplay. Its fine if silverplayers just play their game and dont care if something is too strong or not, in fact playing like that will bring u much more happiness inside the game. But at the end of the day this game lives through his proscene and when we have a game that is simply not fair then we can not call it competetiv. Just imagin a rule in football/soccer that says: "Yeah team A starts with 3 goals more" Would anyone come to u and say "If u are good enough u win anyway?" Hell no! Would anyone watch? Why would they? The winner most of the times is decided at the start so why bother watching. This blantent imbalance allows people insanly high end of draft prediction rates without even a basic understanding of competetiv games. When u see one team with Aphelios, u already know that botlane will decide how this goes. Jungle cant permasit u for the whole game? U cant end before he finishes 1 item? Well to bad then, u were simply not good enough to win i guess. {{sticker:slayer-jinx-unamused}}
It's even worse if you consider that challenger players rarely ban at all. If you watch any stream you often have 4,5 "ban none" options because they want to play against anything and learn to fight it. Not with akali and aphelios tho. No one wants to play against that shit.
: Don't even want to hear it. The "Old Aatrox" wasnt even the original Aatrox. That champion received so many kit changes before his rework it was literally worse then how many sylas and akali have gotten combined. The only mistake that Riot made was not nerfing Aatrox before his rework.
: Because mages have cooldowns. If you used all your spells, and your enemy is still alive, you lost. Also, Taliyah is as "control mage" as she was on release. Anivia is a better example of area control mage. Other non-burst mages are Azir, Karthus, Lissandra, Heimer and Ziggs.
Or maybe instead of making mages broken oneshotting pieces of shit mages just learn to space properly and wait for their cooldowns? That's originally their design weakness? They drop their load and become useless and vulnerable for a time? But that doesnt exist in the new league of legends anymore i guess.
: Man those 200 plus years of experience made this game experience not a every growing nightmare. Then again I'm a guy on a island starving for cs every match if I'm counterpicked.
> [{quoted}](name=CRIMSONFKR,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=leRH4cWE,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2020-01-11T04:54:11.029+0000) > > Man those 200 plus years of experience made this game experience not a every growing nightmare. > > Then again I'm a guy on a island starving for cs every match if I'm counterpicked. 200 years of game design tell riot it's fun, balanced and healthy that kennen can stand in melee range of every bruiser ever and auto them to death. And cass, ryze, quinn, tristana, lucian and all the other 20 abominations running around in this game. All while they also outscale and have cheaper items. Fuckin clown company. Best part is if you read further into the comments were one player is concerned that wukong might end up as another trash unfun rengo copy that has zero interaction and just brush/trade until he won lane and that idiot be like "just ward the brush 4Head".
: Called it a month ago, everyone losing games is pissed about jungle agency over the game
Yeaaah only NOW jungle is the most important role. Jungle has been broken since season 6 and jungle being the only deciding role has been the case since s7 thanks to riot fearless. Isnt it strange how jungle being weak means its the "most important" but that doesnt apply to literally every other lane? Also i'm glad boards moderation is totally not biased and manipulating these boards allowing three jungle rant threads per day while everything else gets removed. Way to go riot boards moderation i wonder why this place is such a joke.
Bevdog101 (OCE)
: Late game top laners to suggest
If you enjoy melee champs there are none unfortunately. Jax and Camille might be better lategame than OTHER MELEE BRUISERS but compared to the rest of the map they are better midgame champions. I'd advise u to not play toplane at all tho.
: Hashinshin is that you?
What a smart and highly intellectual reply by another boards smurf. Here truly the league of legends elite gathers to share their wisdom.
Rioter Comments
: Excuse me? I hit D1 peak last season. If that isn't high elo to you idk what else is mate. His healing isn't Vlad bonkers, and people can 1v1 him in his ult, it isn't a free instant win for Morde regardless of who he ults. Like, if he ults Udyr, that Udyr will rape him. If he ults Darius, he's asking to get 5 stacked into a dunk reset that kills his team.
Eedat (NA)
: Jungle is gutted while mid and top are buffed to being hands down the strongest roles and somehow top is still weak and jungle needs more nerfs? Blows my mind
Maybe because you three junglers here on boards that let all hell loose because they are unable to play the best role in the game aren't what happens in reality? Legit the same three people controling the entire boards. Hope riot actually goes for it and nerfs jungle some more once everyone realizes jungle is still as broken as before.
: Only reason supports get so much attention is because Riot still can't figure out how to balance 4 income streams with 5 champions. So supports get strong cheap items update - everyone else abuses the items because they're strong and cheap - Supports get an item nerf update. Repeat in perpetuity. That's *not* the kind of attention any class wants. Bruisers included. RiP Dawngate, who actually managed to solve this problem (Or close to).
Supports are very overpowered, for a "reason" but still, i doubt you want to be in a bruiser shoes and ACTUALLY get pushed out of the game where every other class does your own job better until you don't function as a class anymore.
Rioter Comments
: 3 reason why nobody plays Jungle and riot needs to do something about it!
Poor oppressed junglers meanwhile toplaners don't even get a thread through for anyone to listen because you are immediately downvote brigaded by jungle mains who make five threads a day for a role that is completely fine.
: > [{quoted}](name=oOPhrozenOo,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=BlJbBlil,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2020-01-06T20:17:45.936+0000) > > I mean jungle isn't even the most autofilled role but whatever, jungle mains man. Have become worse than adc mains since riot has pandered towards jungle for just sooo long. Every single game is jungle diff but somehow jungle is gutted and ruined. Still see junglers just run down a solo lane repeatedly without losing anything for it but it's so hard to carry on jungle :/ > Truth is, bad players stay bad and blame the changes when junglers still carry perfectly fine. > > The most autofilled role going into plat+ is toplane btw. Like you know the elos that actually matter. First off I doubt top is the most auto filled role in any ELO. Still even if you are right you are speaking to 90% of the playerbase and saying the quality oftheir gameplay experience doesn't matter. The more auto fill in any ELO is a problem that should be addressed. Balancing the popularity of the roles should matter.
I'd agree with you if this wasn't or atleast used to be an "esport" and a "competitive" game. You don't balance a competitive game around bad people and this is one of the reasons that got us into that mess we are in nowadays. Riots desperate attempt to make pro play "great" (it isnT it's actually shit because most of their changes achieved the opposite of what they intented) while simultaneously letting low elo have some fun and enjoyment too. This comes at the cost of high elo which in riots eyes is plat+, not mine but riots view where toplane IS the most autofilled role. Now i do agree that if big issues exist in low elo they can or should be adressed too don't get me wrong but what we are talking about right now is changing a role that is perfectly fine and actually still the best role to win games with together with midlane because bad players refuse to adapt. Guess what you can't just afk farm the jungle anymore and win off of it. Adapt to the change or get eaten. Why should an entire role be changed and buffed because bad players refuse to get better? It makes no sense. Just so we are back to 10 junglers taking the top spots of challenger and even pro play only coming down to jungle difference? Make 8 players lives miserable because they are at the mercy of their jungler just so that bad players can keep playing bad? If u just play normals and for fun it doesn't even matter anyways if a role is good or not. If you are a ranked player you should strive to get better. Look at me i'm a toplane main who is sick of riots ignorance and we've had it far worse because toplane since s4/s5 has been getting progressively worse and continuously nerfed to a point where no one wants to play it anymore. Like look how many toplane threads you find a week on boards and reddit compared to jungle adc or midlane. That's because most toplane mains simply left the game. While jungle gets three to four threads here DAILY.
: > [{quoted}](name=Magnesium14,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0sL9FKEj,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2020-01-06T21:50:55.681+0000) > > 1: Support is literally the worst role in the game right now! > > 2: Jungle isn't anywhere near as bad as you claim so. Jungle is on the bad side of things right now, but this over-exaggeration is an insult to people who actually come to the boards for quality content. No wonder Riot never listens. The police aren't going to take you seriously if you claim a $5 robbery as a multi-million robbery when it wasn't. No it isn't lol. As support, your one responsibility is to get your ADC farmed up and peeled for. Nobody else but you, your adc, and your jungle can int your opponent. It's all in your control to dictate how lane goes. As jungle, you're not only fighting the enemy jungle across the map, but 3 lanes who can int into your enemy jungle. You are responsible for far more things that are outside your control. Can't secure scuttles, xp lead loss, leads to invades from jungler who outlevels you thanks to lost scuttles. Can't get dragons without a winning bot or mid lane. Top side snowballed, have fun losing your top side jungle to his invades all game long, setting you further behind in levels without being able to do anything about it. Get lanes spam ping you and curse you out for trying to make the xp and gold deficit on side lanes, when most junglers have awful waveclear.
If you think a support only needs to stay in lane and get his adc farmed up you have absolutely no idea what it means to play support . Every support worth his salt will roam into midlane/enemy jungle provide vision, gank, invade with his jungler/laner. Some even come toplane for a gank and then go bot again. Not commenting on the rest since i agree with some of the stuff just saying support is long gone from only sitting on their adcs ass.
BigFBear (EUW)
: Most difficult and complex role and most blamed and flamed role in LoL right now. You need to be tiltproof as fuck if you wanna be successful because you get harassed almost every game. It was always like that but this preseason it's insane!
Man junglers actually believing that crap. Jungle is so difficult and complex literally every laner swaps to jungle if they've had enough and just want to climb. You haven't experienced a legitimate hard jungle and even back then junglers were lane rejects who weren't good enough for solo lanes and didn't have the mechanics for ADC.
: Omfg it's sad they downvoted you. You're actually the one person who remembers real jungle. Yes. {{item:1039}} is pure godly compared to Season 6 or before. Season 5 (Put into game) V5.22 Added Item cost: Gold 350 Grants +150% base mana regeneration while in the jungle Unique Passive - Tooth: Damaging a monster applies HEALTH DRAIN, which deals 20 magic damage over 5 seconds while restoring as much health. Killing large monsters grants 15 bonus experience. vs now: UNIQUE – TOOTH: Damaging a monster by any means set it aflame, dealing an additional 60 magic damage over 5 seconds while causing you to restore 6 health per second for every enemy you're burning. While in the jungle or river, regenerate 0 − 8 (based on missing mana) mana per second. UNIQUE – MONSTER HUNTER: Killing large or epic monsters grants +50 bonus experience. The first large monster killed grants +165 bonus experience. If your gold from minions is greater than half your gold from monsters, lane minion kills will grant 10 less gold. This penalty is removed upon completion of an enchantment on a Skirmishers Sabre item Skirmisher's Sabre or Stalkers Blade. -------------- Difference? Tooth heal: Season 5: 4 per second. Season 10: 6 per second (50% increase) Tooth damage: Season 5: 20 per 5 Season 10: 60 per 5 (300% as MUCH!) Large Monsters: Season 5: 15 XP Season 10: 50 XP (Over 3 times as MUCH) These people have no clue what jungling is. (Jungle used to soley be auto attacker territory only with {{item:1041}} )
Yeah i've been here from the start. Started to learn the game season 1 and started ranked at season 2 since then i've binge played this game. Ofc i get downvoted i don't follow the narrative of jungle being ruined and junglers brigading boards and reddit and downvoting everyone with smurfs to keep their narrative alive how jungle is "ruined". Yes, i believe it's one of the reasons jungle is so broken is the sustain. How often does a jungler come into my lane gets his ass kicked then go into his jungle, farm and regank NEARLY FULL HEALTH AGAIN. It's ridiculous how the jungle actually HEALS you. If riot would stop believing every champ should be able to jungle we could make jungle actually hurt again in mana and health and THEN we can give them some more resources into camps back because then a gank would be a legitimate choice and also slow down the slaughterfest that league currently is. Instead i go 2/0/1 with a 40 Cs lead on syndra just so that the aftershock nunu literally and i mean literally runs down mid every 20 seconds aftershock is up again until i lost lane, yasuo gets full plating+fb tower and equalized the CS lead. Nunu solo won the game with 80% Kill participation but somehow the jungle is ruined. This only comes from players who just cannot play their role and joined so late they don't even know how hard jungle used to be when you had to know all camp timers AND dragon timers, you HAD to invade and fight with the jungler over resources giving laners room to breath. Now ever since the damn scuttle crab junglers can just go to the other side of the map if they are invaded and vertical jungle all game. If you look at my profile i already play with d4 players and still kick their ass, i used to be a camille/kled main hovering d2/d1 when d1/d2 where actual elos and not season 9 plat 5 cringefest. Now i migrated to midlane cuz i'm sick and tired of losing games on toplane i hard carry on a mage from midlane and so i kinda know what jungle and the game is about. Every game is decided by one jungler afking the other ganking the really interesting games are like my last game where BOTH junglers actually play the game and a lot of stuff happens on the map. I don't think current junglers even take into account the power of the objectives alone they have. ONe of the two games i lost on this account was due to my jungler losing baron AND elder drake despite me both times oneshotting the shyvana both times. baron got stolen by malphite and elder i don't even know anymore. That's the power of a jungler even in lategame the match stands and falls with the jungler. I believe even riot doesn't take that power into account. So i'm for tuning the jungle up, make it hurt more reduce the sustain for mana and hp. Yes maybe then only the likes of xin, rek'sai, lee sin, elise can jungle then instead of talijah, ekko and idk what other weird shit but atleast the game has some agency for laners back and in return junglers can get more resources on their camps when they are actually hard to take down again.
: > [{quoted}](name=oOPhrozenOo,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=BlJbBlil,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2020-01-06T20:17:45.936+0000) > > I mean jungle isn't even the most autofilled role but whatever, jungle mains man. Have become worse than adc mains since riot has pandered towards jungle for just sooo long. Every single game is jungle diff but somehow jungle is gutted and ruined. Still see junglers just run down a solo lane repeatedly without losing anything for it but it's so hard to carry on jungle :/ > Truth is, bad players stay bad and blame the changes when junglers still carry perfectly fine. > > The most autofilled role going into plat+ is toplane btw. Like you know the elos that actually matter. enjoy getting autofilled to jungle. No one wants to play, for a reason.
Only thing i get autofilled to is toplane.
: That would just be fought over more gold= stat boost
Thank god cloud, infernal and mountain drake aren't stat boosts amirite? Hello? Twitch chat? Amirite?
: Riot and Kass players want Kass to be strong at 16/late game Considering his laning is average, his roaming is eh, and doesn’t start rolling til 11+, nerfing his early game more will significantly do more than reducing his late game power. 5 ms does matter, especially since Riftwalk can be punished early game. Move speed nerfs are 2nd most significant, aside from range nerfs.
Then maybe riot shouldnt have permabuffed his early game the last 2 years. He's at a point where he just beats everyone early, can easily trade into melee assassins like zed early on and beat them- I see many kassa mains going electrocute with ignite into mage matchups. He has just been overbuffed to a point where he has an absurd winrate. An unhealthy champion like kassadin should never have a winrate above 49% winrate, why? He is supposed to be the anti mage e.g. a counterpick in specific scenarios but he is more than that even against lanebully mages like syndra he does very well actually and syndra will be oom before she can seriously push him out of lane and after 6 u just jump on her anyways and trade her. Then he is supposed to be the hardest scaling assassins meaning the hypercarry assassin which many of us know what that means. So riot really needs to wrap their heads around what they actually want from kassadin. To be the anti mage and beat mages in lane? Fine but then he can't scale as ridiculous as he does OR he is the lategame hypercarry assassin fine but then he can't be so good early many player actually go VERY aggressive in their build on him to win early and become unstoppable from there on. -5MS is a placebo nerf nothing else. Riot loves kassadin for some reason. Every year now he got buffed and buffed multiple times. Always small buffs ofc because riot is cautious about buffing him but same as ekko they now managed to break him.
: Support was the role I mained for the longest time and I'd say still my best role, all I can read in your post is extreme bias and hate towards junglers. A laner can easily die 3 times in a row and still be fine, catching up rather easily by farming under-tower, staying in EXP range, backing off tower dive with good warding and care, hell maybe go roam and get some kills on other lanes. A jungle that dies 3 times in a row is dead and won't comeback if the opposing Jungler knows the basics, it's so easy to shutdown a Jungler to the point of no return. > 80% of your jungle is spent in non-encounters, easy farming, with reliable chunks of gold from a single target. Huuuuh, reliable ? Single target ? non-encounters ? In most games if it's not the opposing jungler you encounter it's gonna be a laner, most of the time when I play top, if I got a good enough lead, I ward blue and look to go a take it when I push under-tower or I ward river to got a steal more camps while looking out for potential midlane roams. You can do that on every role, the worse part is if your toplaner doesn't believe in protection and playing safe, gets behind and blames you for his short coming, you're topside jungle is often gone 'cause they'll take that shit while your busy playing around Mid/Bot because Dragons are so important you might as well delete the topside of the map and make it spawn at 20 when Baron shows up. 50% of your jungle time should be farming, either in your or enemy jungle and in both cases you're not 100% safe, there is no tower protection you and you can't always count on your laners, they're either busy farming, pushing, fighting, roaming elsewhere etc. The other 50% of your jungle time is spent taking objectives, helping laners with ganks, pressure, counter-ganking, giving vision, push lanes and fighting the other jungle you encounter on that scuttle you didn't notice spawn on the map 'cause you were busy making sure Dragon isn't being done right now by the enemy missing botlane. And yet, laners is also hard in it's own way that you point out in a fair matter : You need a lot more minions to get the same gold a jungle camp gets, yet you don't have to fear it being stolen by the enemy, in as a very short respawn time, with good manipulation of the wave you can farm safe, away from most pokes and dive potential. You also got to look out for Missing enemies, junglers, lane priorities, warding, helping your jungler if the enemy jungler is here and so much more. The main difference is that Jungle can get delete out of the game by a better jungler, the "BeTtEr JuNgLeR wInS" meme is a half-truth, in a pure 1v1 scenario where the team doesn't help, yes, because the better jungler can make it a 4v5 by starving the other of camps, yet the jungler helps everyone else on the map by ganking and all the other things I said so that his team helps him not starve. I hate this "Jungler vs Laner" mentality that a lot of people got, both are got their share of complexity, in my opinion jungle is High-risk High-reward but only in an elo where people don't understand how to help the jungle. In an average elo, both Jungler and Laner are equals, it's annoying saying Junglers whines about their laners and laners blaming the jungle, over-used meme being thrown left and right. Also, supports can totally carry a botlane, a good support with a bellow average ADC can still crush it depending on the support you play. You're not gonna do much if playing Janna, Soraka, Lulu and Nami, playing these champ is litteraly telling your ADC "You got this bud" being Enchanters who Enchants their allies.
Lol maybe in fantasialand but not in reality land where the majority of players live. If you are a toplaner who died three times i guarantee you you are not safe under turret and you won't live long enough to farm anything. You will be down 50-80 CS depending on how long laning goes and die an additional 5 times against any competent player assuming the enemy jungle doesn't interfere and win the lane for his shitcan toplaner. See no point in even further talking when you say 50% of your time should be spent farming
: Explain WTF you mean by > Riot, you've put in a lot of effort turning Support into an entertaining, fulfilling, and satisfying role for the community. It's not fun lmfao. Half the time you are outright shut down/have to play passive/no income/pulled along by the fate/skill of the REST of your team. If you feel that everyone's harassing you, you probably aren't doing your "job" as often as you should. Developing that opinion takes some history of afk farming. Also, if you think Jungle is a job, you've obviously never been a successful laner. 80% of your jungle is spent in non-encounters, easy farming, with reliable chunks of gold from a single target. Lanes you have to secure 6-8 minions just to get the same gold, and you have to last hit all of them while under duress of poke. Whut? Jungle a job? You're obviously playing the wrong role/game.
Junglers are just way too delusional at this point. It has been too broken and too easy to play for way to long. Even when jungle was legitimately hard because you played on a ward supports budget, had to track ALL the timers, constantly fight and invade with the enemy jungle all while you are permanently half health and mana while clearing the jungle EVEN BACK THEN junglers were lane rejects who weren't good enough mechanically to play a lane and memorize all matchups, how much dmg you deal and can take, how much the enemy deals, what powerspikes the enemy has etc. Now after three years of being able to afk farm and come out the jungle with three items and 5 levels ahead they are demanded to actually play the damn game AND GANK and invade and jungle is "ruined and gutted" when the top players are still junglers and every game boils down to jungle difference. Question mark
: Auto fill doesnt work that way. If you are getting placed as jungle 80% of the time, then you have jungle selected as your secondary or primary role. Auto fill takes place when it puts you in a role that you DONT have selected. After that, you are auto fill protected for several games. Stop picking jungle if you dont want to play it.
I mean jungle isn't even the most autofilled role but whatever, jungle mains man. Have become worse than adc mains since riot has pandered towards jungle for just sooo long. Every single game is jungle diff but somehow jungle is gutted and ruined. Still see junglers just run down a solo lane repeatedly without losing anything for it but it's so hard to carry on jungle :/ Truth is, bad players stay bad and blame the changes when junglers still carry perfectly fine. The most autofilled role going into plat+ is toplane btw. Like you know the elos that actually matter.

oOPhrozenOo

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