Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: May 25
Completely gut every interesting Champion, then go do something else. Classic Riot.
Meddler (NA)
: We're pulling both the Ryze and Azir changes. We're not confident enough they'll come together quickly enough/won't need a fair bit of followup. Putting time elsewhere instead as a result.
I'll give you props for not ruining them further, but that doesn't change the fact that their current state is unacceptable. I hope that the people responsible for it manage to start actually balancing the game one day. Until then I'll spend my money and time somewhere else.
: Waveclear work for 8.6 or later
Farming already is tedious busywork. You get gold for it, so yay, but while I think that it is acceptable to be able to get gold leads if you manage to kill more monions than your opponent, I also think that it is the most boring way possible to express your skill at a game. I'm all for a more interactive laning phase, but I worry that simply making minions harder to kill in general will further increase the gap between those Champions who can easily clear and those who can't and make the game less enjoyable for everyone since good waveclear will feel shittier and bad waveclear will still force you to last-hit under tower against stronger pushers. I don't think nerfing and buffing extremes later will fix such a systemic problem.
: Sorry if I won't quote point by point, but it's a bit boring to do it on phone. After reading this last comment I have to agree with everything you said. I can't stress much about how Viktor has to pay to unlock a functioning kit and it was kinda convenient by me to just leave out he fact that Ryze has to pay to unlock that combo. And sometimes it's good to have the certainty that something you plan will go that way, it's good to have moments where people can't do much about something happening, because if a champ hasn't a defining strenght that makes him annoying to have against but fun to play he will probably be a failure of a design. I really hope they find the way to push him in soloQ and keeping him viable but not pick or ban in competitive, even though I can't see how without some kit overhaul. I don't know if numbers will be enough, but this nerf won't certainly make his life better in SoloQ and it's really sad. Anyway I'm sorry for the misconception in the first comments, I am open to discussions and my comment was probably too rude and dismissing.
Thank you for your understanding answer and kind words. :) May the fickle gods of balance buff your favourite Champion.
: I can kinda agree to leave the interaction in Zhonya, but it's undeniable that it has no counterplay compared to other interactions. Imagine if TF could do that. Or think about other Zhonya interactions, Swain ult you walk out, Asol you walk in, Ryze just goes away and get a free out of jail card if he makes a mistake, it's an ekko that can decide where to teleport when he makes mistakes. And I can feel your frustration about Ryze's state (I used to main Viktor and he's my fav champ), don't get me wrong, but that interaction wasn't an healthy way to keep him balanced. I just hope they can make him work in other aspects of his gameplay to make him work for us and competitive as well. Plus I can't see where I was uneducate, maybe a bit rude, but I was just pointing out things.
> Plus I can't see where I was uneducate, maybe a bit rude, but I was just pointing out things. The way you talked about the Zhonya's combo being uninteractive and uncounterable _without_ elaborating further (and showing that you actually know what you're talking about) really rubbed me the wrong way. I may have overreacted there somewhat, sorry about that. But my point is that Zhonya's _itself_ is uninteractive. Sure, uninteractive moments can be frustrating (fuck Windwall, for example), but that is not in itself a reason to remove them. The problem comes from them being abused to create "no counterplay"-moments. And (_this is the important part)_ here is where something _Riot themselves said_ comes in that I only grudgingly agree with because it justifies Veigar's existence: **No counterplay, high payoff moments can become acceptable if there is a high enough cost to them. ** > I can kinda agree to leave the interaction in Zhonya, but it's undeniable that it has no counterplay compared to other interactions. Imagine if TF could do that. Or think about other Zhonya interactions, Swain ult you walk out, Asol you walk in, Ryze just goes away and get a free out of jail card if he makes a mistake, it's an ekko that can decide where to teleport when he makes mistakes.I can kinda agree to leave the interaction in Zhonya, but it's undeniable that it has no counterplay compared to other interactions. Imagine if TF could do that. Or think about other Zhonya interactions, Swain ult you walk out, Asol you walk in, Ryze just goes away and get a free out of jail card if he makes a mistake, it's an ekko that can decide where to teleport when he makes mistakes. The Realm Warp + Zhonya's combo is **not** free. Ryze pays for his "Get-out-of-jail-free-card" with a high cooldown **ultimate **_and_ a high cooldown active item. You need level 11 to have significant ult range and a 2900 gold item that either can only built late into the game or delays your other already expensive and high-priority scaling items. The only way to make this more expensive is to also have to blow Summoner Spells. Stopwatch complicates things, but it is just a single use item. Removing the interaction for Stopwatch would be fine, but killing the Zhonya's interaction because Stopwatch is OP is simply a kick in the teeth, nothing more. It doesn't fix _shit_. It's a dick move Riot made out of desperation because Ryze is a high priority pick in pro play even though he is weak in solo queue and they don't know how else to change his strength in pro play other than by directly nerfing Ryze. The most tragic thing is that that interaction actually matters more for solo queue than for pro play. > And I can feel your frustration about Ryze's state (I used to main Viktor and he's my fav champ), don't get me wrong, but that interaction wasn't an healthy way to keep him balanced. I just hope they can make him work in other aspects of his gameplay to make him work for us and competitive as well. Sure, that would be nice. But Riot won't do that. You read it youself in the original post: _After taking out his strongest move, they're still looking to **nerf** Ryze further in 8.5_. Ryze wasn't balanced before the removal of Zhonya's, he was just barely playable; _somewhat_ playable if mastered. He had an ace up his sleeve, sure, but... Look, I don't want to bore you with stories of how hard it has been to make Ryze work for the past months. Taking out the Realm Warp + Zhonya's combo didn't suddenly fix Ryze's problems. It wasn't even a step in the right direction since his solo queue strength was hit harder than his strength in pro play, _meaning that they are still going to continue nerfing him_. Don't take what I say too personal, I'm just really pissed at Riot's imbalance team at the moment.
: The completely pointless removal of an uninteractive and uncounterable combo. If that was the only thing keeping the champ viable or the only thing you enjoyed, there’s an undeniable problem.
> an uninteractive and uncounterable combo. As if Ryze was the only Champion that has shit like that. If you use it in such a reductionist and short-sighted way, "no counterplay" is basically just a meme. The combo was deemed acceptable in the first place because it requires a huge investment, and the only thing that changed is Stopwatch. A single use item which they nerfed right after, because Ryze is by far not the only Stopwatch abuser. The strongest one, sure. Take out the interaction with Stopwatch, I don't care. But Zhonya's? That's actually a bigger nerf to solo queue than to competitive. It is absolutely not the only thing I enjoy about playing Ryze, and not the only thing making him viable. It's just his greatest strength, his last defining feature. He'll still be played in LCS and he will continue to be nerfed because of it until he is completely unplayable. If you are not capable of compassion, whatever. But please keep your shallow and uneducated opinions to yourself.
Gabifel (EUW)
: its not about reducing fun, its about nerfing what is to strong in pro play. atm these three are the best mid laners so nerfs are fair
If direct nerf are the only solution Riot can think of to change their dominance in pro play, this game is utterly and truly fucked.
: y Galio and Azir tho {{sticker:zombie-nunu-bummed}}
So you're fine with Ryze being nerfed? :P They're all in the same boat: they work best with coordinated teams, making them pick/ban in pro play as long as they are viable.
MilamberZ (EUW)
: Why nerfing Azir/galio exactly, can you explain the reasons? Pro play? I don't watch pro scene so i'm asking. I mean they are not doing great on the game that everyone play...
: Hello Meddler! I'm really surprised to see, that ryze gets nerved another time. Seeing how the stopwatch mechanic isn't anymore and half of his spells now pull minion aggro, it's surprising to see him being strong enough for a nerv. His ult is used really rarely due to the removal of the stopwatch combo making it a really weak spell. So far even, that you dont level it at level 6 sometimes. If there will be a nerv to him, i don't see any benefit as to why i should pick him over another champ. I would love to get some insight into the decision making for another nerv. Another thing i wanted to know was how his "Ult-Update" is going.
There is no "decision making" involved. As long as Ryze continues to be picked in pro play (which he should because he is the perfect midlaner), Riot will continue to nerf him. Until he becomes actually unplayable. They don't know how else to change the fact that pros want to play a Champion like Ryze. I'm pretty sure Riot decided not to change his Ult some time ago.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: February 16
Azir, Ryze _and_ Galio? Again? Seriously? :( Have you ever considered maybe changing your balance philosophy instead of simply gutting every single fun, challenging and rewarding Champion as soon as they become viable? League is a fun game, I don't understand why you guys put in _so much effort_ into changing that.
: And galio... We can finally have fun with an actual ap bruiser and they will just nerf this guy again for no reason at all... He's not even such a high priority pick in pro play if i recall correctly.
Same. The new Swain is pretty good though. Or Singed if you play top. Singed has a really unique and fun playstyle, and I love watching the Ryliandry's effect.
ƒrostγ (EUNE)
: I really feel bad for every single Azir and Ryze main out there. :(
Much appreciated. I love all three of those Champions dearly, and I've gone from angry to sad to depressed about their treatment. What is even the point of practicing them if every time they become even slightly viable, the imbalance team is instantly there to "fix it"? Ryze recently became my most played Champion (100k+ Mastery Points, yay), but after the completely pointless removal of R+Zhonya's, I don't even feel like playing him any more.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: February 14
Any comment on Ryze? 20% more CDR on Archangel's looks promising, but that has been the only good thing that happened to him for _months_. Even Stopwatch, which seemed like a blessing at first, turned out to be a curse, costing him his last remaining defining strength.
: about why killing Ryze's Zhonya but keeping Ryze's Guardian angel and allied bard ult
Because Ryze is OP and has to be nerfed but coding is hard. /s
: Patch Chat with the Playtest Team - 8.3
Who the f*ck thought removing Realm Warp and Zhonya's was a good idea? (Trying really hard to keep a civil tone, but that nerf felt like a kick in the teeth.) Sure, Stopwatch is broken, but it just got nerfed and it is a one time use item. Everything that led to the combo being allowed in the first place is still true. And I could be wrong, but I don't remember "on the fence" reflecting the sentiments written in the patch notes on this matter at the time; it rather seemed to me like "concerned, but confident". The only new thing is that there now exists one single use item that everyone else is abusing too. Ryze admittedly profits the most from it due to Realm Warp, but taking "the Ryze Combo" away just because Stopwatch exists seems a tad excessive. Yeah, pros still pick him. Doesn't change the fact that he is barely playable until you're a god with him, and even then you need your team to play around you to succeeed.
Meddler (NA)
: Looking for topics for Friday's post
For when have you scheduled the next rework after ruining Ryze yet again? Less salty version: Could you please talk about Riot's take on the current state of Ryze? Sure, he is used in pro play for various reasons I don't need explained to me, but his overall state is undeniably bad. The statement in the patch notes was way too wishy washy and didn't acknowledge that at all. The changes to Archangel's Staff look promising, but I'm certain that I speak for all Ryze mains when I say that we'd like to know what Riots plans are for Ryze after breaking him yet again, abandoning him for months and then suddenly taking his biggest remaining strength away.
Wobly (NA)
: Topic: Champs with huge pro play / solo Q performance splits A lot of the reworks and new champs that have come out in the last few years have been pick/ban in pro play while being balanced or even undertuned in soloQ. See: Ryze, Azir, Zoe. Why do we think this is happening, and what can we do about it?
Very short answers: It is happening because those Champions have high skill ceilings and profit from team play, allowing coordinated professionals to do "OP stuff" with them that can't be replicated reliably in solo queue. The easiest solution is to just officially balance around pro play. Dota already demonstrated that it works. The better question is why, knowing all this, Riot still decides to keep pro play and solo queue together to the detriment of both.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 31
Can you please not ruin Azir _again_? Particularly while simultaneously doing the same thing to Ryze? I know it's difficult to balance League, but you're about to repeat the exact same mistake from before their reworks by simply overnerfing the Champions instead of addressing the issues in the meta that make them staple picks. Reducing their numbers bit by bit until they are not viable anywhere or completely removing key strengths will not fix anything.
Viator (NA)
: Maybe starting a new thread on the board on gameplay might help, but I doubt it will be any help. Just let them completely ruin Azir and then rework him again.lol
Also known as the Ryze method. Doesn't work, the balance team will just go and ruin the rework as well.
Porocles (NA)
: 5/3/2017 - "1/4" Screen & DirectX Error Issues
The bug is back and the suggested solutions don't work.
: Why not disable Stopwatch+ULT combo but keep Zonyas+ULT combo, I don't even play Ryze but I think it's sad to see changes like that. It somewhat reminds me about the latest change to Ornn's W... Personally I'm not a fan :)
It's more than sad, it's f*cking tragic. Ryze nerfs are nothing new; usually they get a "not again" or "what are they runinig this time"? But I have never seen r/RyzeMains as agitated as when the mentioned change was confirmed intentional. Granted, I just started lurking there recently, so it might have been similar before prior reworks, but this change is clearly too much. Way to kick someone when he's down, Riot.
: When the only way Ryze could do this was via Zhonya's it meant he had to make substantial trade-offs (far less mana), or else it was a 3rd or 4th item purchase at which point him using it when caught in a tight spot was a more interesting interaction. You're not wrong that stopwatch has tipped our hand in that this interaction makes it so Ryze has one get-out-of-fail free card which has a chilling effect on mid lane for anyone hoping to be able to get an early advantage. No word on whether Syndra or Ahri atm.
Please don't take away Realm Warp + Zhonya's. You already took much of his early safety (movespeed, shields, E cooldown) and a lot of his lategame (he now even gets outscaled by Corki, ffs). Ryze requires a disproportionate amount of effort to succeed with, and even if you are insanely good on him, that is just enough to reach the same level of effectiveness comparable mages get for free. This nerf is a kick in the teeth, especially mentally. This is too much. Please stop killing my favourite Champions.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 24
On top of all the indirect nerfs to Ryze lately, Zhonya's now cancels Realm Warp on PBE. Why don't you just remove him while you're at it? {{sticker:darius-angry}} I've seen many beloved Champions nerfed into oblivion because they are stronger in skilled hands (which should be a goal, not a fear), but if this goes live, my grudging annoyance towards the balance team (I mean it when I say they gutted *many* of my beloved champions) is going to turn into actual hatred. Don't do this. Not like this, not now.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: December 15
Please don't break Azir again.
: Is that really what Olaf needs?
No, but it is what he deserves.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: December 13
> and won't spawn in terrible places like directly under enemy towers. Instead, they'll spawn directly in front of them. Just inside the range. Just a few Teemos away in distance, yet in acquirability, so far. Beckoning. Taunting. Baiting me into certain death.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: December 8
I like the idea of getting HP _and_ Adaptive Force from Resolve.
: > [{quoted}](name=Riot Cactopus,realm=NA,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=BQed8FWz,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-11-22T18:54:43.810+0000) > > The only things more glorious than our capsules are our charts. False. Are you calling Mecha Zero Sion a liar when he says, "THERE ARE NONE MORE RIGHTEOUS _OR_ MORE GLORIOUS THAN ME!" when he purchases Righteous Glory? Your charts can have second place.
Feels like heresy to post this response as a Sion main, but the memes must go on: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VEDLpD6VoM
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 17
I don't think Lethal Tempo is weak. It feels great on Azir, for example. It is, however, unreliable. Uncapped attack speed on demand might be too strong, but what about letting it build up like Fervor/Press the Attack? Boring, sure, but it works for AD, right?
Vekkna (NA)
: Your "point" is that {{item:3020}} + {{item:3136}} is enough flat pen for every mage in the game, and anyone who suggests otherwise is "taking the piss." Riot made boots unique because stacking sorcs would be too strong, not because they share your opinion that double sorcs is stupid and inefficient. They have never forcibly prevented players from buying trap items. Items are restircted when they're too strong or abusable, and that's why we're seeing unique boots after 7 seasons. As expected, you haven't posted a single thing of value. "Herpaderp Guise lul" is not an argument.
Your rebuttal would come across as stronger if you didn't completely flub the reuse of my opening and actually thought about what I wrote instead of getting triggered by my ridiculing tone. Sorcs and Guise are all the flat pen that is currently available, but no, that is not my point. I'll address this anyways: You have percent pen from Void Staff, which reduces the efficiency of flat pen. You have MR items on the enemy team, which make flat pen even weaker. If the squishies are too dumb to buy it, that's their problem. Actual AP also does the trick in that case. I will repeat myself one last time. Gold efficiency and slot efficiency are **real ** and make stacking boots a "noob trap" (sadly, I don't know a less offensive term I could use here, don't take it too hard). **That ** is my point. I don't doubt that stacking pen is good vs squishies. I also accept that you might momentarily do more damage with two boots than if you build AP for the equal gold value. Thing is, other people exist, and the game doesn't stop there. So why don't you join the rest of us and complain about the state of AP items in general? I'd also **love** more flat pen items. Lastly, I am **absolutely ** certain that Riot wasn't scared of Zyra becoming overpowered through the abuse of footwear. Maybe this isn't all about you. Maybe they just didn't want to deal with the problems that would arise from having a Predator user buy multiple boots. If you still don't get it, please don't bother replying. I **really** don't care.
Vekkna (NA)
: You've never played a ranked game on Zyra ever, and the two normal you played you used AP quints. You have no idea what you're talking about. The point is that {{item:3020}} {{item:3151}} {{item:3135}} {{item:3020}} is stronger and more efficient than {{item:3020}} {{item:3151}} {{item:3135}} {{item:1058}} against any target with more than 73 MR. That's math, not my imagination. It's not an opinion you can disagree with.
As expected, you _completely_ missed my point. However, Riot seems to share my opinion, so it doesn't actually matter. Go on, mourn your double boots.
Vekkna (NA)
: Why were boots made unique? There's a whole thread over on Zyramains sub talking about buying a second pair of sorcs to function properly. And yet boots are unique now for the first time ever. First off, there's a problem when there's any situation where building two pairs of boots is an idea anyone would consider, let alone be a top damage option. It's even worse when you create that situation and then don't even allow the champs desperate enough to buy 2x boots to *actually buy* 2x boots. After the last 4 months of mpen crusading being completely ignored, this is really just the "fuck you" cherry on top.
You're taking the piss, right? Two boots to "function properly"? While I agree that mage items are in desperate need of an overhaul, gold efficiency and slot efficiency are things that DO in fact exist. Don't be stupid and buy {{item:3136}} like sane people do.
: We played it a bunch. Predator in general isn't something that is optimal on many characters IMO, but we called out Rammus and Hecarim specifically as doing nasty things to people with Predator.
Full AD/Lethality Murderpony is already a thing people do.
: I do agree that Predator is probably the weakest of the Domination keystones in Jungle right now. That being said I think it's still good for Juggernaut type Junglers who lack a gap-closer and can make use of it to increase gank access and engage. Skarner and Volibear are the 2 examples of this we found the most success with.
Can you say anything about Predator on Warwick?
Fyzyqs (NA)
: Go back to the old system, this one is just straight trash. You can read about it by other players over a lot of social media. This update is not good...
: The problem with infinite scaling on champions is it's so unanswerable. If I pick Veigar, eventually I am just stronger than you no matter what. By making it equally available to everyone, balancing it becomes much easier. If you're playing Ahri into Veigar, but you're worried it's going to go to super late game, pick up GS so you can continue scaling post-full build too. He'll still outscale you, but your damage will also continue to get terrifying, so you can potentially insta-kill him and turn the fight anyway.
> [{quoted}](name=Kerithil,realm=NA,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=HwyQtLAE,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2017-11-06T22:30:06.079+0000) >so you can potentially insta-kill him and turn the fight anyway. Unless he builds tank items. And he will obviously still have more AP than you anyways, because ~~unspeakablecursewords~~ Veigar.
: I hate to criticize it before even getting to try it, but i felt this had to be said. Celestial body is terrible. Who would EVER take this? WHY would you ever take this? It feels like a "noob trap" like the old tier 1 runes. Sacrificing 10% (TEN PERCENT) damage for TEN minutes in return for 100 health? At least make it, like, scaling health - or even % max HP! 100 health in return for 10% reduced damage is absurd!
> [{quoted}](name=Frontline Fury,realm=EUW,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=HwyQtLAE,comment-id=001a,timestamp=2017-11-06T22:22:41.746+0000) > >Who would EVER take this? Nasus? That's about it tho, and even he can make good use of the other options. % max HP is a good thought imo.
Meddler (NA)
: The main issue with the old Press the Attack was how heavily it shared space with Lethal Tempo. Both were increased auto attack damage, over a sustained period of time. That meant that, with some exceptions, which to take was too often just a mathematical optimization. Secondary benefits we saw to this change also include making the Precision tree more accessible to non marksmen/skirmishers (the team damage amp helping a lot with that) and addressing some edge cases with split pushers getting the prior Press the Attack to enormous stacking AD/AP values.
I'd love to see Azir being able to use a Precision keystone once you guys are done adjusting them.
TomiMan7 (EUNE)
: yep i meant the W ap ratio. I dont know if they wanted to change anything more about him
I saw Meddler answer a question about possible Ryze changes, but nothing since. Probably resource changes, like with the rumored Yasuo stuff that never happened.
TomiMan7 (EUNE)
: already buffed.
You mean the better W scaling? That may be enough for him to be picked at worlds occasionally, but it had no significant impact on his statistical performance in solo queue. Let's hope the new runes and AP items have a bigger impact.
Meddler (NA)
: What about these changes pushes him even further away from old Galio in your eyes? One of the things that interested us in giving him more reward for building AP and more specialization against magic damage was that it could get a bit more old Galio feel back.
I only played the old Galio the day before the rework, and I really liked everything about his abilities and his autoattacks. I personally think that the new Galio is too different in too many aspects to recreate the old Galio feel. That Galio is gone. But we have a new one, and he's pretty cool as well. I think that making him work well with AP and MR is a good direction. I'd hate to see yet another fun and rewarding champion nerfed into the ground because he's disproportionally strong in pro play.
Galiö (NA)
: Sigh... Galio is more and more different from the original every time he is touched. I wish as an old galio player i had a voice. Tbh i highly dislike that rework team other than how they made yorick and eve look. Both of them are awkward meh champs... but they look nice. Wish i can say the same foe the backbrace/injury statue of liber...demacia.
The only interesting thing about old Eve was her passive, and Yorick... no, just no. They WERE awkward meh champs, but now they work well and are actually fun to play. I personally love the reworks. While I do enjoy the new Galio a lot, I have to say that even though I only played the old Galio for a few hours before the rework went live, his abilities as well as auto-attack animation and sound are the ones I miss the most. They were great.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 13
What happened to the planned Ryze changes?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 13
Scout-Approved is great and all, but [THIS](https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/b/b4/LoL_Facebook_Icon_23.png/revision/latest?cb=20161029214109) is objectively the best {{champion:17}} emote and NEEDS to be in the game.
: Patch Chat with the Playtest Team - 7.20
Scout-Approved is great and all, but [Victorious Teemo](https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/b/b4/LoL_Facebook_Icon_23.png/revision/latest?cb=20161029214109) is objectively the best {{champion:17}} emote and NEEDS to be in the game.
Vekkna (NA)
: YAAAAAAS! Total brush control.
No more setting up traps in sight. {{item:3070}} {{item:3649}}{{item:3070}}
Vekkna (NA)
: That's a super cool idea. My idea for Teemo is some unique ward trinkets only accessible to those who have mastered advanced scouting techniques. For example: 1) Paper Airplane that floats around the rift like a random hawkshot 2) Paper Machet Scout that appears on the minimap as a champion portrait when visible by an enemy ward 3) Doomsday Survival Rations that act like on-use honeyfruit 4) Tripline that places an invisible line between two walls and pings ! when an unseen enemy walks through it (like mandrake ward for a jungle entrance)
Three words: permanent oracle passive.
Ender L (NA)
: Don't think we have plans for Teemo in the near future, but I have played some games of him on Runes Reforged. There are definitely some new runes you should try out. The Ultimate Hat can be pretty fun with full AP builds and if you're a fan of the on-hit style, Glacial Augment gives you a Frozen-mallet like slow effect at level 1. As for your rework idea, like a lot of our older champions, Teemo needs to have a clear identity defined. Right now he's the Swift Scout, but what does that really mean? If you're theorizing changes to his abilities, you should think about that aspect too and try to find something that could define him a little bit more. Right now, I think both Teemo's W and E are pretty lackluster. It might be interesting to move his W to his passive rather than the E and make his stealth a a more strategic basic ability. What do you think? Always love me some Teemo Talk ;)
To me, the core of Teemo's identity is his map presence / control, represented in game by (1) obviously his shrooms and (2) invisibility (brush shenanigans included). Being able to see "beaten tracks" sounds awesome and fits that theme really well.
Adalvar (EUW)
: {{champion:79}} {{champion:42}} {{champion:8}} {{champion:40}} None of these guys need *VGUs*...they may require *visual updates*, but none of them have the gameplay issues that justify the resource investment that a full *Visual and Gameplay Update* entails.
What {{champion:42}} and {{champion:79}} need are an audio update. Any pro game with them in (which in recent history sadly means most of them) is REALLY hard on the ears.
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skillshotsRcool

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