Herethicc (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=0001000400010000,timestamp=2019-11-21T21:08:31.977+0000) > > But Ahri is not allowed to one shot people lategame just because ADC builds qss :) Yes she is, who tf builds qss for ahri alone?
> [{quoted}](name=Herethicc,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=00010004000100000000,timestamp=2019-12-12T05:44:49.086+0000) > > Yes she is, who tf builds qss for ahri alone? Apparently smart people :)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: December 13
Would Ahri see any changes to have a true identity? Ahri as a mage suffers from weak early, and weak late, for an average midgame, and I feel that is extremely bad distribution of power. Also, will Ahri be getting any W or R changes? I personally do not find Ahri at all fun or satisfying to play. Champs like Veigar who does big number damage is fun, but Ahri has no big damage despite lacking significant amount of damage, AOE damage, and also lacking reliability of like even Veigar. I feel if a champ lacks reliability, that champ should do damage. Missing charm means Ahri is disqualified from fight, but landing it does not guarantee a kill either. Will Ahri ever be looked at? Her model is also very old, and noticeable. Thanks.
: I'd probably add a survival mechanic to his passive. Something along the lines of, when Kog reaches 1 hp, he gets 3 secs of invulnerability and if he gets a kill (not an assist) he revives with 10% max hp
> [{quoted}](name=Spicy Rice,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=2zm2QQ9l,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-12-09T16:14:02.527+0000) > > I'd probably add a survival mechanic to his passive. > > Something along the lines of, when Kog reaches 1 hp, he gets 3 secs of invulnerability and if he gets a kill (not an assist) he revives with 10% max hp That is broken. The point of Kog is that he is supposed to be easilt bursted in exchange for broken damage. If anything, I will remove the armor and mr shred from his Q and add it to his passive but apply stacks. Then add some maybe lifesteal(both for magic and ad) to the target he qs for X second.
Stashek (EUNE)
: >If you are playing for fun, play normals, and ignore about other champ's. It is not the champ's fault that you do not want to learn how to beat them. So you're telling me they're less obnoxious and less annoying to play against in normals than they're in ranked? Well, just played a normal game against Akali and she is as powerful there as she is in ranked and as obnoxious to play. They took an assassin, gave her insane mobility and removed her only flaw, which is squishyness by applying the true stealth shroud. And you know, I can just ban Akali every game, like the pros on Worlds do and just climb to Diamond that way, just so I can cry the same way I've been crying about balance now, just with higher elo, so people cannot discredit me based on that. {{sticker:sg-lulu}}
> [{quoted}](name=Stashek,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=M5AoKe45,comment-id=000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-08T16:25:24.102+0000) > > So you're telling me they're less obnoxious and less annoying to play against in normals than they're in ranked? Well, just played a normal game against Akali and she is as powerful there as she is in ranked and as obnoxious to play. They took an assassin, gave her insane mobility and removed her only flaw, which is squishyness by applying the true stealth shroud. > > And you know, I can just ban Akali every game, like the pros on Worlds do and just climb to Diamond that way, just so I can cry the same way I've been crying about balance now, just with higher elo, so people cannot discredit me based on that. {{sticker:sg-lulu}} Then why does Akali have a trash winrate?
Stashek (EUNE)
: >Its not right for a champ who is full of weaknesses to be nerfed because lowelos cant play against the champ. >If a champ is trash in highelo, but strong in lowelo, why should the champ get nerfed? >Having such champ makes improvement bars for people. So being able to outplay Akali automatically makes me a player that deserves a higher elo than I'm in? Alright, I'm gonna start playing Lee Sin top in order to counter her shroud with True Vision, I guess that will help me become a challenger. /s On a more serious note, not everybody is playing just to climb, you have to remember that. There are some of us that play this game for fun, but the lack of fun modes force us to play normal games, in which we don't necessarily want to improve that much, we just want to have fun playing the game.
> [{quoted}](name=Stashek,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=M5AoKe45,comment-id=0000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-06T00:49:20.608+0000) > > So being able to outplay Akali automatically makes me a player that deserves a higher elo than I'm in? Alright, I'm gonna start playing Lee Sin top in order to counter her shroud with True Vision, I guess that will help me become a challenger. /s > > On a more serious note, not everybody is playing just to climb, you have to remember that. There are some of us that play this game for fun, but the lack of fun modes force us to play normal games, in which we don't necessarily want to improve that much, we just want to have fun playing the game. You need to beat lowelo gate champs(Akali is freelo lane opponent if opponent has no clue of what they are doing, aka lowelo). Those champ is irrelevant in highelo, and only playable in lowelo, but many lowelo struggle against them. If you can say those gate champs are trash, then you are in highelo logic and prob can climb to Diamond with time. If you are playing for fun, play normals, and ignore about other champ's. It is not the champ's fault that you do not want to learn how to beat them.
: Caitlyn Much Needed Change Riot Read!
Caitlyn needs nerf, not even a neutral or QOL buff.
Stashek (EUNE)
: >That is what matters the most though. Every other tier is lowelo, and barely understands the game. Does not make sense to balance the game around people who doesnt care about the game. I don't think you understand what 'caring about the game' means. I guess we'd have to define what a game is in the first place, because it's not something that only a slight percent of the playerbase should enjoy. Games are there to have fun, that's the first thing that should come to your mind. Sure, PvP games are fun, they provide the means to actually compete against other players, so your instincts can kick in and make it even more fun than just playing against AI. But does casual play or lower skill play mean you do not care about the game and should not be listened to? Now imagine nobody aside from Challenger tier players buys RP for skins, champions, passes and all that other stuff. How long do you think the servers would run for? Maybe a year before they'd decide that they either need to make the game Pay-to-Play or shut it down completely. That's why balance should also be related to us, lower skill players, because just because we will never compete on your level, doesn't mean we don't want to compete equally on our level as well. And if that's not what you wanna do, then hell, give us 'casuals' or 'noobs' more fun modes to play with. ARAM gets boring once you get stomped by better teamcomp enough times, Dominion got removed and there are no rotating game modes anymore, what are we supposed to do? Watch in awe as high elo players enjoy their struggle to prove whose online phallus is bigger?
> [{quoted}](name=Stashek,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=M5AoKe45,comment-id=00000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-05T19:21:51.627+0000) > > I don't think you understand what 'caring about the game' means. I guess we'd have to define what a game is in the first place, because it's not something that only a slight percent of the playerbase should enjoy. Games are there to have fun, that's the first thing that should come to your mind. Sure, PvP games are fun, they provide the means to actually compete against other players, so your instincts can kick in and make it even more fun than just playing against AI. > But does casual play or lower skill play mean you do not care about the game and should not be listened to? Now imagine nobody aside from Challenger tier players buys RP for skins, champions, passes and all that other stuff. How long do you think the servers would run for? Maybe a year before they'd decide that they either need to make the game Pay-to-Play or shut it down completely. > That's why balance should also be related to us, lower skill players, because just because we will never compete on your level, doesn't mean we don't want to compete equally on our level as well. > And if that's not what you wanna do, then hell, give us 'casuals' or 'noobs' more fun modes to play with. ARAM gets boring once you get stomped by better teamcomp enough times, Dominion got removed and there are no rotating game modes anymore, what are we supposed to do? Watch in awe as high elo players enjoy their struggle to prove whose online phallus is bigger? Its not right for a champ who is full of weaknesses to be nerfed because lowelos cant play against the champ. If a champ is trash in highelo, but strong in lowelo, why should the champ get nerfed? Having such champ makes improvement bars for people.
Sillae (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=M5AoKe45,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-05T15:17:58.722+0000) > > That is what matters the most though. Every other tier is lowelo, and barely understands the game. Does not make sense to balance the game around people who doesnt care about the game. Aren't you below master? Are you saying you barely understand the game? If you believe you, yourself, are incompetent to make valid decisions with league, what makes you think you are right in this regard? And you are ignoring that not all people enjoy ranked. Not all people have high end computers and 5 ms. You don't even have to personally be mechanically skilled to understand the numbers and what skill does what effect.
> [{quoted}](name=Sillae,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=M5AoKe45,comment-id=00000000000000000001,timestamp=2019-12-05T19:59:21.152+0000) > > Aren't you below master? Are you saying you barely understand the game? If you believe you, yourself, are incompetent to make valid decisions with league, what makes you think you are right in this regard? Uh, i am incompetent as well. Have to listen to challenger player's opinion.
Sillae (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Worst JG Wins,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=M5AoKe45,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-12-05T02:55:05.136+0000) > > Akali is 70% presence with 52% win rate in Master tier. She is just broken if you can play her well. She isn't a nerfed cause good in Pro champ. > > Not like these nerfs mean literally anything anyways she is still just busted with the new conq lets balance around the top .1% of players couldnt we just get rid of new conq
> [{quoted}](name=Sillae,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=M5AoKe45,comment-id=000000000001,timestamp=2019-12-05T14:09:04.817+0000) > > lets balance around the top .01% of players > > > couldnt we just get rid of new conq The top % matters. Just because people who play the game does not care to counter or improve, why should champ's get nerfed for it? Doesnt make sense to balance the champ with lowelo when they dont even understand the game.
: How about we touch her insane ratios, or touch her insane base damages, or hit her base hp, or hit her hp regen, or make her Q cost not scale down, or give gunblade the nerf it very much deserves? Any single one would be helpful. No, I'm not suggesting to do them all.
> [{quoted}](name=WoonStruck,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=M5AoKe45,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-12-05T04:17:39.115+0000) > > How about we touch her insane ratios, or touch her insane base damages, or hit her base hp, or hit her hp regen, or make her Q cost not scale down, or give gunblade the nerf it very much deserves? > > Any single one would be helpful. > > No, I'm not suggesting to do them all. Vlad needs nerf before gunblade.
STEG0 (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Worst JG Wins,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=M5AoKe45,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-12-05T02:55:05.136+0000) > > Akali is 70% presence with 52% win rate in Master tier. She is just broken if you can play her well. She isn't a nerfed cause good in Pro champ. > > Not like these nerfs mean literally anything anyways she is still just busted with the new conq I think those stats you mentioned are only in challenger tier, everything else is much lower. Not that it matters for the discussion.
> [{quoted}](name=STEG0,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=M5AoKe45,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-05T03:29:50.996+0000) > > I think those stats you mentioned are only in challenger tier, everything else is much lower. Not that it matters for the discussion. That is what matters the most though. Every other tier is lowelo, and barely understands the game. Does not make sense to balance the game around people who doesnt care about the game.
: Please rethink what bust damage is supposed to be and should do in game.
This boards believe Caitlyn is okay to one shot with a right click, with ONE AA. So, not sure what you guys want.
Bultz (NA)
: I'm honestly very glad Aphelios can out so fast after Senna
: I'm not a midlaner but I believe Jungle/sup has become "lose and HARD feed" position.
Junglers have already a huge impact with objectives. Riot needs to nerf objectives if you want the lvls. Sup botlane was too strong, that is why Riot nerfed them.
: Ryze is much, much stronger atm. Vlad's laning is insanely weak and youre a fool not to punish it. The only champs he beats early destroy him level 6-12, or outscale entirely.
> [{quoted}](name=WoonStruck,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hPUG2sEh,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-11-24T01:12:36.552+0000) > > Ryze is much, much stronger atm. > > Vlad's laning is insanely weak and youre a fool not to punish it. The only champs he beats early destroy him level 6-12, or outscale entirely. I played Ahri, got vlad to like 1/6, that one kill not from me, and he just destroyed my team with just like 2/3 items. As Ahri, I couldnt burst him anymore, and he offered way more damage than I could. How is it fair when he got completely stomped in lane and still be able to come back becaue he got X items? Honestly,Vlad is broken. He should not deal tha much damage while being tanky. They need to remove that tanky passive, and require him to build health. That way more fair. The fact that my team had to run because he is vlad, despite feeding like crazy, is ridiculous. As ahri, who also has a weak early, who is also outscaled for no reason, clearly it is not fair.
: With that teamcomp malph and naut should have ulted her followed by MF. Misplay.
> [{quoted}](name=Linna Excel,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-11-23T02:38:00.131+0000) > > With that teamcomp malph and naut should have ulted her followed by MF. Misplay. Uhh, the point is, Cait one shotting lategame eith 1742 damage with right click is NOT BALANCED
Jamaree (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=000200010000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-22T20:46:02.387+0000) > > In the video, Cait was same lvl as Ahri, and ahri had MR to block static shiv. So some defense. Ah yeah man, being able to stop the magic part of her kit is what I meant clearly, because it was CLEARLY the magic part of an ATTACK DAMAGE carry that makes them do damage, flawless logic. > So Ahri should also kill someone with w r r r midgame without being fed and being same lvl to a squishy who built no defensive item designed for mage champ(armor/hp items dont count). > > If you agree then das good. In the video, Cait was same lvl as Ahri, so if I agree with you, then what Cait did was completely wrong. No, it's fine because you again chose to play a squishy champion, not have armor or health, you deserved to be one shot.
> [{quoted}](name=Jamaree,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=0002000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-23T01:01:52.672+0000) > > Ah yeah man, being able to stop the magic part of her kit is what I meant clearly, because it was CLEARLY the magic part of an ATTACK DAMAGE carry that makes them do damage, flawless logic. > > No, it's fine because you again chose to play a squishy champion, not have armor or health, you deserved to be one shot. So, Ahri should kill someone with just W R R R midgame against anyone same lvl as her(who built no mr)?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 22
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=000200000001000000000000000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-22T20:49:21.699+0000) > > Show me a clip of Ahri killing a squishy adc midgame with just w r r r against a same lvl adc. Unfortunately i dont have enough diskspace to wantonly save clips as a i please so i dont have one <.< Furthermore, you´d have to have screwed up pretty badly as a sololaner to be even with the enemy ADC in EXP m8. But it doesnt take a lot of math to prove that an a lvl 15 Ahri can indeed delete a lvl 13 Cait with the build i suggested provided Ahri has Luden and electrolute ready to go. Since Cait only has 35 base MR&about 1530 HP at that point meaning Ahri deals true damage with her flat pen if using the build. Well it might take 2 W´s but that late it only has 3 seconds cooldown so it should be fine enough, as long as you avoid the Cait E at that point she has no way to kill you.
> [{quoted}](name=Thefrostyviking,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=0002000000010000000000000001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-22T21:29:34.893+0000) > > Unfortunately i dont have enough diskspace to wantonly save clips as a i please so i dont have one <.< > > Furthermore, you´d have to have screwed up pretty badly as a sololaner to be even with the enemy ADC in EXP m8. > > > But it doesnt take a lot of math to prove that an a lvl 15 Ahri can indeed delete a lvl 13 Cait with the build i suggested provided Ahri has Luden and electrolute ready to go. > > Since Cait only has 35 base MR&about 1530 HP at that point meaning Ahri deals true damage with her flat pen if using the build. > > > Well it might take 2 W´s but that late it only has 3 seconds cooldown so it should be fine enough, as long as you avoid the Cait E at that point she has no way to kill you. But Cait can kill with just one right click. 3 sec cd is way too long to kill. Cait didnt even use electrocute, or any damage runes. Not sure why a champ who used no damage runes can do more damage than someone who did.
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=0002000000010000000000000001000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-21T21:46:43.103+0000) > > So Ahri should one shot in midgame with w and r if the enemy is glass cannon right? Yes depending on builds and target, since Glass cannons are supposed to explode pretty much instantly if hit but base stats vary between the glass cannons. Just a difference of 10 mr can do a lot. > Also, Caitlyn is an ADC, why does she not need to auto squishies 5 times to kill them? Or at least use their entire kit for the kill? Afterall they are ADCs. ADC literally just means attack damage carry, more aptly defined is that she pumps out tons of AD damage once she gets rolling to carry her team in that department, and as a markswoman she is unfortunately not reliant on abilities as much as items and passives, or abilities that enhance her autos. The only classes designed to take that and survive such abuse repeatedly, for a long or short time are tanks and other melee. If you as Ahri manage to gapclose on her in say the midgame while having ....{{item:3020}} {{item:3285}} {{item:3165}} and {{item:3089}} while she sits on {{item:3006}} {{item:3031}} {{item:3508}} and a {{item:3086}} or something then it´s likely that you can actually kill her with just R-W-R-R if she is isolated. As a matter of fact i actually know this works as i have tried it myself, and i´ve been on the receiving end too .....since i play both those champs. You land a charmcombo on Cait? She dies, right from the time you get luden and even later if she doesnt get help. Cait hits you while fully prepared late? You die provided you havent gotten any armor by then.
> [{quoted}](name=Thefrostyviking,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=00020000000100000000000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-22T09:08:07.259+0000) > > Yes depending on builds and target, since Glass cannons are supposed to explode pretty much instantly if hit but base stats vary between the glass cannons. > > Just a difference of 10 mr can do a lot. > > ADC literally just means attack damage carry, more aptly defined is that she pumps out tons of AD damage once she gets rolling to carry her team in that department, and as a markswoman she is unfortunately not reliant on abilities as much as items and passives, or abilities that enhance her autos. > > The only classes designed to take that and survive such abuse repeatedly, for a long or short time are tanks and other melee. > > > If you as Ahri manage to gapclose on her in say the midgame while having ....{{item:3020}} {{item:3285}} {{item:3165}} and {{item:3089}} while she sits on {{item:3006}} {{item:3031}} {{item:3508}} and a {{item:3086}} or something then it´s likely that you can actually kill her with just R-W-R-R if she is isolated. > > As a matter of fact i actually know this works as i have tried it myself, and i´ve been on the receiving end too .....since i play both those champs. > > > You land a charmcombo on Cait? She dies, right from the time you get luden and even later if she doesnt get help. > > Cait hits you while fully prepared late? You die provided you havent gotten any armor by then. Show me a clip of Ahri killing a squishy adc midgame with just w r r r against a same lvl adc.
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=d5td3vMw,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-11-21T17:20:15.291+0000) > > Junglers are supposed to be like supports, never the one actually the strong one. > > Junglers decide who wins by nature of being about take objectives An ahri main would compare junglers to supports.
> [{quoted}](name=dªydream,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=d5td3vMw,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2019-11-22T05:16:52.407+0000) > > An ahri main would compare junglers to supports. Jungle is a support for top and mid lane. They arent supposed to be as strong as laners.
: Considering you are weaker than every other champion for the first 35 minutes of a game that only lasts about 40 minutes, YES ADCS ARE WEAK. Seriously, can you name any other role that loses to a support in the first 25 minutes?
> [{quoted}](name=Shabada64,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=0002000000010002,timestamp=2019-11-22T15:20:39.851+0000) > > Considering you are weaker than every other champion for the first 35 minutes of a game that only lasts about 40 minutes, YES ADCS ARE WEAK. > Seriously, can you name any other role that loses to a support in the first 25 minutes? Ahri is weaker than every other champ in the game early and average midgame. Yes, Ahri is WEAK. Ahri can lose to a support pre lvl 25. Pyke who dodges her charm can kill her. Etc.
Jamaree (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=0002000100000000,timestamp=2019-11-22T03:55:47.113+0000) > > So, you are also saying that an Ahri killing a squishy with lower lvl than her is fine(with w and r) > > So, you will agree her W should do damage again then right? Only if you agree that squishy champions who build not a single piece of defenses while also being lower level then the opponent should get popped.
> [{quoted}](name=Jamaree,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=00020001000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-22T04:24:44.613+0000) > > Only if you agree that squishy champions who build not a single piece of defenses while also being lower level then the opponent should get popped. In the video, Cait was same lvl as Ahri, and ahri had MR to block static shiv. So some defense. So Ahri should also kill someone with w r r r midgame without being fed and being same lvl to a squishy who built no defensive item designed for mage champ(armor/hp items dont count). If you agree then das good. In the video, Cait was same lvl as Ahri, so if I agree with you, then what Cait did was completely wrong.
Jamaree (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=00020001,timestamp=2019-11-21T21:03:20.233+0000) > > Not sure how this means anything. Ahri killed someone with dfg w r r r before and she was gutted as result. How is this anything fair? At least dfg w r r r took more time, and she had to come close and they built no mr. > > So how is it fair that an ADC late game who is DPS champ can one shot squishies with a rightclick? It is not, which shows biases. Because you choose not to have any health or defenses at all, and she was fed, and had levels on you. So what, you should be able to play a squishy champion, have no defenses and tank someone who is fed is what you are saying?
> [{quoted}](name=Jamaree,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=000200010000,timestamp=2019-11-22T00:41:39.484+0000) > > Because you choose not to have any health or defenses at all, and she was fed, and had levels on you. > > So what, you should be able to play a squishy champion, have no defenses and tank someone who is fed is what you are saying? So, you are also saying that an Ahri killing a squishy with lower lvl than her is fine(with w and r) So, you will agree her W should do damage again then right?
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=00020000000100000000000000010000,timestamp=2019-11-21T21:15:54.956+0000) > > But when ahri killed someone with w r r r as midgame assassin it is a problem right? Ahri is a hybrid mage, she is supposed to hit at least one actual skillshot to kill someone even as an assassin if she isnt very damn fed. And even assassins build flat and % penetration. > Edit: Cait is lategame so ok to one shot eight click with 0 counterplay. Ok, ahri is midgame, so she can one shot with 0 counterplay too? Cait does not oneshot for shit unless the target is a pureglass cannon while Cait is fed, has a high AD&Critbuild (expensive) build and also likely Baron/elder ontop that. Heck i wouldnt be surprised if it was like 50 minutes in and she had gathering storm too.
> [{quoted}](name=Thefrostyviking,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=000200000001000000000000000100000000,timestamp=2019-11-21T21:31:45.220+0000) > > Ahri is a hybrid mage, she is supposed to hit at least one actual skillshot to kill someone even as an assassin if she isnt very damn fed. > > And even assassins build flat and % penetration. > > Cait does not oneshot for shit unless the target is a pureglass cannon while Cait is fed, has a high AD&Critbuild (expensive) build and also likely Baron/elder ontop that. > > Heck i wouldnt be surprised if it was like 50 minutes in and she had gathering storm too. So Ahri should one shot in midgame with w and r if the enemy is glass cannon right? Also, Caitlyn is an ADC, why does she not need to auto squishies 5 times to kill them? Or at least use their entire kit for the kill? Afterall they are ADCs.
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=0001000400000000,timestamp=2019-11-21T21:10:21.131+0000) > > One shot is not about dieing easily, it is not right. Ahri cannot kill people with just W and a R lategame. So why can adc one shot with ONE rightclick? Ahri is stronger mid game Ahri is safer Ahri has reliable CC
> [{quoted}](name=Its Yuu and Mi,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=00010004000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-21T21:19:07.796+0000) > > Ahri is stronger mid game > Ahri is safer > Ahri has reliable CC Ahri is an assassin, and her w and r makes her go closer than Caitlyn, so that is not safe. Caitlyn has reliable cc(E into W) and range. Caitlyn also has ZERO cds right clicks Caitlyn does not need to land skill shots. And? Ahri is a midgame assassin, why cant she one shot with w and r?
Rioter Comments
: if you let caitlyn headshot you 50 minutes into the game, it's your fault for not ending the game.
> [{quoted}](name=ZackTheWaffleMan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=0002000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-21T18:16:25.432+0000) > > if you let caitlyn headshot you 50 minutes into the game, it's your fault for not ending the game. If Ahri one shots you with W r r r midgame, it is your fault for not ending the game. But ya, ahri who is an midgame assassin was gutted because her w and r did damage. Why? Because it was targetted. Cait is targetted, not sure why she is ok to do that damage.
: > [{quoted}](name=Xavanic,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=000200000001000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-21T18:11:15.599+0000) > > but when a full build assassin one shots an defenseless squishy its a problem and needs to be addressed asap right? No it is not, if the carry has made no effort to grab resistances it´s not a problem, period. Issue is when they do even if the marksmen/mages do that as it indicates a lack of counterplay.
> [{quoted}](name=Thefrostyviking,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=0002000000010000000000000001,timestamp=2019-11-21T20:52:29.005+0000) > > No it is not, if the carry has made no effort to grab resistances it´s not a problem, period. > > > Issue is when they do even if the marksmen/mages do that as it indicates a lack of counterplay. But when ahri killed someone with w r r r as midgame assassin it is a problem right? Edit: Cait is lategame so ok to one shot eight click with 0 counterplay. Ok, ahri is midgame, so she can one shot with 0 counterplay too?
: He’s referring to a full build Caitlyn with 3rd (old) elder drake, 3rd baron buff, and 50 minute gathering storm one/two tapping an Ahri with not a single smidge of extra armor anywhere. That’s not an issue.
> [{quoted}](name=Wulf Helhammer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=00020000000100000000,timestamp=2019-11-21T17:53:28.255+0000) > > He’s referring to a full build Caitlyn with 3rd (old) elder drake, 3rd baron buff, and 50 minute gathering storm one/two tapping an Ahri with not a single smidge of extra armor anywhere. That’s not an issue. But if ahri kills people with w r r r it is a problem when she is a midgame assassin and enemy built no mr. Okay.
KorboKuin (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=vaG0gRbU,comment-id=005c,timestamp=2019-11-15T20:51:59.492+0000) > > Will Ahri ever be made viable in highelo or competitive? > > Is it possible to make Ahri not only for lowelo players to play against other lowelo players? > > Can Ahri have a more skill expression rather than having a kit completely nullified by players who can abuse her weakness? > > Can Ahri become a high impact champ in teamfights, and have a presence even after missing charm? > > Can Ahri's kit have a big high moment? > > I just feel there is no reason to pick Ahri over any other midlaner if you are a good player in general. Much better off playing other midlaners who rewards you for your skills and actually hard carry games. Ahri's kit is too reliant on enemy being extremely bad, and super reliant on her team for damage as an APC who is supposed to be a play making mage. > > Ahri used to be this playmaking champ, any chance to bring that Ahri back? Ahri has a 51.5% WR with an 8% play rate according to op.gg, in what way is she underpowered compared to the 25 or so mages that have lower winrates than her?
> [{quoted}](name=KorboKuin,realm=EUW,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=vaG0gRbU,comment-id=005c0000,timestamp=2019-11-15T21:57:52.260+0000) > > Ahri has a 51.5% WR with an 8% play rate according to op.gg, in what way is she underpowered compared to the 25 or so mages that have lower winrates than her? Winrate absolutely has no connection with champ strength. Those 25 or so mages is most likely much better than Ahri by far.
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=dMAnQoEV,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2019-11-16T17:03:17.783+0000) > > The reason why exhaust was nerfed was because it was extremely unfun to play against. As ahri for example, you auccessfuly landed your charm. Yelp, exhaust her and she does nothing, and for the rest of the fight she is completely useless. > > Defensive summoner spells should all together be removed. It isnt fair for someone to do all their combos but to be denied because of defensive summoner spell. When someone says something that implies that doing lots of damage and securing kills is the only/most fun thing int he game. It's hard to take them seriously.
> [{quoted}](name=Whisper87,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=dMAnQoEV,comment-id=000b0000,timestamp=2019-11-16T23:03:01.811+0000) > > When someone says something that implies that doing lots of damage and securing kills is the only/most fun thing int he game. It's hard to take them seriously. What is the point of assassins if Exhaust was powerful? Might as well use adcs and poke champs if coming close means nothing.
: > [{quoted}](name=XJ99999999999999,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=00010004,timestamp=2019-11-18T18:08:44.787+0000) > > imagine building tank when its a damage meta That line of thought is precisely the reason so may people think this is a “damage meta”. If you aren’t building defensive items, **you are going to die easily.**
> [{quoted}](name=Wulf Helhammer,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=000100040000,timestamp=2019-11-18T18:16:18.280+0000) > > That line of thought is precisely the reason so may people think this is a “damage meta”. > > If you aren’t building defensive items, **you are going to die easily.** One shot is not about dieing easily, it is not right. Ahri cannot kill people with just W and a R lategame. So why can adc one shot with ONE rightclick?
Herethicc (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=XJ99999999999999,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=00010004,timestamp=2019-11-18T18:08:44.787+0000) > > imagine building tank when its a damage meta So opting for {{item:2138}} instead of {{item:2139}} is a bad idea? At that point in game you already one shot everybody, 1 or 2 defensive stats might help you live with 1 hp. I remember to this day the kayle that escaped me with 1 hp. HP/lvl seals op, op.
> [{quoted}](name=Herethicc,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=000100040001,timestamp=2019-11-19T00:52:19.646+0000) > > So opting for {{item:2138}} instead of {{item:2139}} is a bad idea? At that point in game you already one shot everybody, 1 or 2 defensive stats might help you live with 1 hp. I remember to this day the kayle that escaped me with 1 hp. HP/lvl seals op, op. But Ahri is not allowed to one shot people lategame just because ADC builds qss :)
: > [{quoted}](name=Hypochondria9,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-11-18T15:29:20.011+0000) > > Riot should have removed critical hits for the same reason they removed dodge. Instead they buffed the shit out of it, so ADCs can kill tanks and pop squishies like a mage. This is also a *full* build Caitlyn, with the 3rd Baron Buff of the game, the 3rd Elder Drake of the game, and a 50 minute Gathering Storm giving her 72 AD... allllll of this, against an Ahri that didn't have a single scrap of extra armor _*anywhere*_, not even in bringing the armor stat shard from Runes. This is the furthest thing from a problem possible. This is at 53 minutes into the game. If Caitlyn *wasn't* able to drop a squishy fast, that would be the problem.
> [{quoted}](name=Wulf Helhammer,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-11-18T15:46:31.811+0000) > > This is also a *full* build Caitlyn, with the 3rd Baron Buff of the game, the 3rd Elder Drake of the game, and a 50 minute Gathering Storm giving her 72 AD... > > allllll of this, against an Ahri that didn't have a single scrap of extra armor _*anywhere*_, not even in bringing the armor stat shard from Runes. > > This is the furthest thing from a problem possible. This is at 53 minutes into the game. If Caitlyn *wasn't* able to drop a squishy fast, that would be the problem. How is fair that a DPS champ can one shot squishies? So, ADCs are assassins as well? With zero counterplay? Ahri used to kill people with dfg w r r r, but that wa gutted because adc mains complained. Ahri is an assassin, midgame assassin, and that is all she has, but that wa gutted. So how is it fair for ADC to one shot lategame? If Ahri was nerfed becaue of her w and r auto target, ADC needs the nerfs as well. What is the point of Caitlyn's abilities?
Herethicc (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahri Baka,realm=EUNE,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=00010003,timestamp=2019-11-18T15:02:29.865+0000) > > If you build Zhonia against Cait then you are trolling and report worthy , you MUST NEVER use Zhonia when Cait exists , because she will guanratee a headshot + Root which is guarnateed death. Ah yes, trolling for building zhonyas for the armor stat. I'm report worthy. I should never build armor/hp, or give up sorcs for tabis to survive. You're damn right my shiny grey friend!
> [{quoted}](name=Herethicc,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=000100030001,timestamp=2019-11-19T00:44:31.954+0000) > > Ah yes, trolling for building zhonyas for the armor stat. I'm report worthy. I should never build armor/hp, or give up sorcs for tabis to survive. You're damn right my shiny grey friend! I mean, Ahri was gutted because adc mains complained that her W and R did damage when ADCs built no mr item.
Herethicc (EUW)
: Now: Imagine building a zhonyas, crazy right? It give armor against caitlyn? Woah! Imagine building DMP {{item:3742}} last item by selling boots, Wow it gives armor and HP! Crazy right? ADCs need buffs indeed, but they need the movespeed nerfed from their items. Main game issue is movespeed, thus why cloud drake got full rework from the ground in s10.
> [{quoted}](name=Herethicc,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-11-18T09:38:17.278+0000) > > Now: Imagine building a zhonyas, crazy right? It give armor against caitlyn? Woah! > > Imagine building DMP {{item:3742}} last item by selling boots, Wow it gives armor and HP! Crazy right? > > ADCs need buffs indeed, but they need the movespeed nerfed from their items. Main game issue is movespeed, thus why cloud drake got full rework from the ground in s10. Ahri used to kill people with dfg w r r r when they built no mr, and she was gutted. How is it fair that ADC who is DPS can one shot squihies with ONE RIGHT CLICK, and zero counterplay and from so far?
Jamaree (NA)
: This just in, a 15/4 ADC is able to one shot a mage who literally didn't have a single piece of health or armor, in other news, the sky continues to be blue and grass green, more at 11.
> [{quoted}](name=Jamaree,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=AEualb8n,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-11-18T10:21:17.021+0000) > > This just in, a 15/4 ADC is able to one shot a mage who literally didn't have a single piece of health or armor, in other news, the sky continues to be blue and grass green, more at 11. Not sure how this means anything. Ahri killed someone with dfg w r r r before and she was gutted as result. How is this anything fair? At least dfg w r r r took more time, and she had to come close and they built no mr. So how is it fair that an ADC late game who is DPS champ can one shot squishies with a rightclick? It is not, which shows biases.
Xavanic (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Ashe mage AD,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-11-21T16:34:21.365+0000) > > I'll focus on things I enjoy for the moment, like the new support items but I agree, I don't like the item and I hope it sees nerfs soon. On the other hand it makes me want to play top cuz split pushing should be viable using that item. its the only decent assassin item now....besides maybe youmuus, duskblade has been overnerfed to the point of literal garbage, the rest of the assassin items added are literal garbo (50 ad 10 lethality...really....what shit is this) meanwhile adc items got overbuffed (really, 360 dmg energized proc....wtf on top of already having so much dmg as it is) maybe we should be looking more into the op adc itemization and nerfing that
> [{quoted}](name=Xavanic,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xrj5ho1r,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2019-11-21T17:12:17.295+0000) > > its the only decent assassin item now....besides maybe youmuus, duskblade has been overnerfed to the point of literal garbage, the rest of the assassin items added are literal garbo (50 ad 10 lethality...really....what shit is this) meanwhile adc items got overbuffed (really, 360 dmg energized proc....wtf on top of already having so much dmg as it is) maybe we should be looking more into the op adc itemization and nerfing that Riot loves ADC A LOT I noticed. Caitlyn critting for 1742 damage one shot with right click is MOST DEF NOT WEAK. But ADC players always cry that they are weak. Ridiculous.
Yenn (NA)
: Jungle EXP really needs to be revisited
Junglers are supposed to be like supports, never the one actually the strong one. Junglers decide who wins by nature of being about take objectives
Rioter Comments
: I saw this I was like DAMN YOU RIGHT WHY ISN'T THIS A THING YET?
: Exhaust Needs a buff in preseason
The reason why exhaust was nerfed was because it was extremely unfun to play against. As ahri for example, you auccessfuly landed your charm. Yelp, exhaust her and she does nothing, and for the rest of the fight she is completely useless. Defensive summoner spells should all together be removed. It isnt fair for someone to do all their combos but to be denied because of defensive summoner spell.
: Exhaust Needs a buff in preseason
Ignite wasnt buffed though, was changed and actually is weaker if you fall behind. Overall a nerf.
: I don´t think is about her being strong or weak, it´s about her feeling nice and smooth when you play with her. Right now she feels clunky, specialy her Q, and her passive feels so outdated and handicapped for just a MS boost, maybe moving her actual passive to her R and give her a new passive that gives her some form of AOE to clear/push the lane. Some adjustments to her W + E mana cost/CD so you can use it more in TF can make her feels better to play. I would like her to recover her personality as a roam mage with consistent DMG, not a crappy burst mage jungle, and be able to play her again in mid, where she belongs.
> [{quoted}](name=YoRHa SoulZerg,realm=EUW,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=vaG0gRbU,comment-id=000300000004,timestamp=2019-11-16T15:48:03.782+0000) > > I don´t think is about her being strong or weak, it´s about her feeling nice and smooth when you play with her. > Right now she feels clunky, specialy her Q, and her passive feels so outdated and handicapped for just a MS boost, maybe moving her actual passive to her R and give her a new passive that gives her some form of AOE to clear/push the lane. > Some adjustments to her W + E mana cost/CD so you can use it more in TF can make her feels better to play. > I would like her to recover her personality as a roam mage with consistent DMG, not a crappy burst mage jungle, and be able to play her again in mid, where she belongs. So much other champs need help before Tali. Even Ahri needs it more because she has a W which is not an ability, or a passive. And has no identity and have many conttadicting parts in her kit which makes her clunky and weak. Her burst is also extremely weak for being a burst mage, and offers no aoe damage as a mage.
KorboKuin (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Ahris,realm=NA,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=vaG0gRbU,comment-id=005c,timestamp=2019-11-15T20:51:59.492+0000) > > Will Ahri ever be made viable in highelo or competitive? > > Is it possible to make Ahri not only for lowelo players to play against other lowelo players? > > Can Ahri have a more skill expression rather than having a kit completely nullified by players who can abuse her weakness? > > Can Ahri become a high impact champ in teamfights, and have a presence even after missing charm? > > Can Ahri's kit have a big high moment? > > I just feel there is no reason to pick Ahri over any other midlaner if you are a good player in general. Much better off playing other midlaners who rewards you for your skills and actually hard carry games. Ahri's kit is too reliant on enemy being extremely bad, and super reliant on her team for damage as an APC who is supposed to be a play making mage. > > Ahri used to be this playmaking champ, any chance to bring that Ahri back? Ahri has a 51.5% WR with an 8% play rate according to op.gg, in what way is she underpowered compared to the 25 or so mages that have lower winrates than her?
> [{quoted}](name=KorboKuin,realm=EUW,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=vaG0gRbU,comment-id=005c0000,timestamp=2019-11-15T21:57:52.260+0000) > > Ahri has a 51.5% WR with an 8% play rate according to op.gg, in what way is she underpowered compared to the 25 or so mages that have lower winrates than her? Winrate is a bad indicator to say she is good or bad. Qiyana has like 46% winrate and she is the best midlaner in game.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 15
Will Ahri ever be made viable in highelo or competitive? Is it possible to make Ahri not only for lowelo players to play against other lowelo players? Can Ahri have a more skill expression rather than having a kit completely nullified by players who can abuse her weakness? Can Ahri become a high impact champ in teamfights, and have a presence even after missing charm? Can Ahri's kit have a big high moment? I just feel there is no reason to pick Ahri over any other midlaner if you are a good player in general. Much better off playing other midlaners who rewards you for your skills and actually hard carry games. Ahri's kit is too reliant on enemy being extremely bad, and super reliant on her team for damage as an APC who is supposed to be a play making mage. Ahri used to be this playmaking champ, any chance to bring that Ahri back?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 15
> Going forward there are two things in particular we're keeping in mind for the next time we get a situation with incompatible group needs like that. The first is to try and identify cases where we've missed the mark for existing players quickly and then, if feasible/appropriate, adjust things before a significant player group become attached to the new form of the champion. Reverts like with Kog, LB and Rengar are examples of where that overall went well in our eyes since they happened comparatively quickly. The second is to avoid splitting audiences again if at all possible. Trying to serve two distinct audiences is tough already, adding a third direction to the mix makes it much harder again and all but guarantees we’'ll be leaving a lot of players unhappy. Does this apply to Ahri from her rework in season 4, 5, and 8? Her identity as a burst mage was removed, and she turned into a kiting mage, which was then removed to be a safe mage(neither burst mage or kite mage). Is Ahri EVER going to be fixed? Her kit's abilities, like W and passive is extremely weak, and her ulti has no meaning for its damage for how low its range is, when her EWQ combo forces you to stay around 720 range since no need to come close, but the damage on ulti forces you to go into melee range with almost no spell, and to spam that ability for damage, if you want to do damage. Which is very inconsistent with the design of her kit. Will Ahri be identified? Her identity was never a safe mage who is also outscaled, who also have no powerspikes throughout the game except for maybe midgame, when her powerspike midgame is not even that big. Can Ahri lose her safety for damage? That was the purpose of season 8 rework, but that was completely scrapped. When Ahri was really bad, you guys buffed her utility rather than her damage. : /
Lost R (NA)
: I'm seeing something consistent in all the games that are lost.
The fact that junglers control such objectives while also providing map wide pressure is wht makes junglers the most broken role in game.
: Buff tenacity
Tenacity shouldnt exist. Why should you be not punished by getting hit by cc? Mages for example, will get bursted and killed by tanks if cc had no effect on them, no counterplay of kiting can exist. Basically olaf ulti running to you. The stats have to be very much lowered if you take tenacity then, but if that happens yall will complain that it is too weak to build.
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Ahris

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