: Acrtually no, the team that is behind grants less gold to the team that is ahead, which means if one person on the losing team is ahead, he wont have a bounty. Or at least, the bounty will be reduced, depending on how far behind his team is. Go check the wiki before saying something like this which is clearly objectively wrong
> [{quoted}](name=Aatrox Airlines,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=THxE1LuN,comment-id=000200020000,timestamp=2019-08-05T12:23:30.585+0000) > > Acrtually no, the team that is behind grants less gold to the team that is ahead, which means if one person on the losing team is ahead, he wont have a bounty. Or at least, the bounty will be reduced, depending on how far behind his team is. Go check the wiki before saying something like this which is clearly objectively wrong Lol I run around when a bounty all the time while my entire team is losing. As far as I know, it only takes they into account for cs bounty calculations, which account for less, which you would be clearly seeing in game of you were winning early often, which you clearly aren't.
: I'm just gonna point out some things that I noticed while I read through this. > get that the purpose for gold bounties was to allow an enemy team a chance to come back in a game, but that mechanic was already in the game. The more people died the less they were worth, effectively rewarding snowballing enemies less for their opponent's bad play, and giving the losing team a chance to make up the gold difference. This is not a comeback mechanic. This is an anti-snowball mechanic, which while effective, does nothing to help the opposing team get **back** into the game. > However now if you die with a 700 gold bounty on you the enemy who killed you essentially got a tripled kill INCLUDING first blood for ONE solitary kill. If you had a bounty of 700 gold, you are already absurdly far ahead of the other team, so killing you should be worth far more, because you should be far harder to kill. If you get shut down, while being that far ahead, it's either because the other team is being really good at focusing, or you made a really bad play and got killed. I'm not entirely sure how many kills you'd need to get to be worth 700 gold in a bounty, but I imagine it's worth more than a triple kill of gold. > I have seen games where pro adc's like Rekkles were worth 1000g with a score of 0/0/0, simply because of his good cs. That has been nerfed since but still exists. These kind's of mechanics are not healthy for gameplay. The person who is playing well should be rewarded for it rather than having the feeling that somehow they're giving the enemy more of a chance. The person playing well's reward, is to have a lot of gold, and be able to kill other people easier and faster than they can kill them. That's the reward for playing well. They shouldn't be dying. If the other team get's their shit together to take you out, despite your snowball, then they deserve to be rewarded for it. It's your fault for blowing such a huge lead. > The bounty system is even worse for tanks. Tanks and supports are the members of the team that aren't supposed to get kills and since assist gold is practically pocket change at this point they miss out on the entire paycheck of bounties Tanks and Supports already function with lower budget complimented with lower cost items. If they get the bounty, then they can support their team all the better now, which means the carries are able to do their jobs safer. ________________________________________ I'm not going to deny that there is more gold in the game than there was before, but that's because of pacing and game length, an already debated topic. The bounty system is not where this problem you're having lies, and it sounds more like you're upset that you got shutdown with a big bounty than about other gold income and game pacing. Just because you're ahead, does not mean you deserve to stay ahead no matter what happens. By getting fed, you've actively earned gold for yourself, and denied the enemies gold. If you're a fan of snowballing, that probably sounds fine to you, but I'm not a personal fan of "whoever gets fed first wins", and then the game is over at that point.
> [{quoted}](name=Academy Kayn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=THxE1LuN,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-08-04T23:17:41.549+0000) > > I'm just gonna point out some things that I noticed while I read through this. > > This is not a comeback mechanic. This is an anti-snowball mechanic, which while effective, does nothing to help the opposing team get **back** into the game. > > If you had a bounty of 700 gold, you are already absurdly far ahead of the other team, so killing you should be worth far more, because you should be far harder to kill. If you get shut down, while being that far ahead, it's either because the other team is being really good at focusing, or you made a really bad play and got killed. I'm not entirely sure how many kills you'd need to get to be worth 700 gold in a bounty, but I imagine it's worth more than a triple kill of gold. > > The person playing well's reward, is to have a lot of gold, and be able to kill other people easier and faster than they can kill them. That's the reward for playing well. They shouldn't be dying. If the other team get's their shit together to take you out, despite your snowball, then they deserve to be rewarded for it. It's your fault for blowing such a huge lead. > > Tanks and Supports already function with lower budget complimented with lower cost items. If they get the bounty, then they can support their team all the better now, which means the carries are able to do their jobs safer. > > ________________________________________ > > I'm not going to deny that there is more gold in the game than there was before, but that's because of pacing and game length, an already debated topic. The bounty system is not where this problem you're having lies, and it sounds more like you're upset that you got shutdown with a big bounty than about other gold income and game pacing. > > Just because you're ahead, does not mean you deserve to stay ahead no matter what happens. By getting fed, you've actively earned gold for yourself, and denied the enemies gold. If you're a fan of snowballing, that probably sounds fine to you, but I'm not a personal fan of "whoever gets fed first wins", and then the game is over at that point. Hilarious. That entire wall of text just to parrot hire the mechanics currently work "You shouldn't be dying." LOL. Especially in videogame, purple make mistakes, die, etc. Handing Winston's a huge pile of gold because someone *finally scores a single lol against someone owning match is hilarious. They should get rewarded more??? No! They should l2p and get the early lead themselves THEMSELVES. If the lose the early game, they should be having an uphill battle, what else could possibly make sense? Honestly though, you should know better still, that's not how it actually works. Two or three players will mostly call all the bounties each game, snowballing further, turning endgame into "A Few Fed Champs Fighting to Win with Some Other Side Guys Barely Able To Contribute." Nobody really likes that.
: I guess truthfully i miss the fact he used to be much easier to play, he used to be my sit back and relax kinda champ, there was nothing complicated, he was fun to play, the reworked WW is okay and hes not exactly difficult but he doesnt feel like WW in imo, i have to read paragraphs to understand him.
> [{quoted}](name=Astraeus Nix,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=seu7L2P1,comment-id=00070001000000000001000000010000,timestamp=2019-07-24T10:07:15.177+0000) > > I guess truthfully i miss the fact he used to be much easier to play, he used to be my sit back and relax kinda champ, there was nothing complicated, he was fun to play, the reworked WW is okay and hes not exactly difficult but he doesnt feel like WW in imo, i have to read paragraphs to understand him. I main Warwick from the old days. At first I was like "wtf no-one of his kit works until someone at half health..." After some practice I did him insanely fun. Using Q to switch sides and cut off enemy escape routes is great, but even on top of that, nothing is more satisfying then the good Q-rides - where you stay gripped on through flash or an escape skill. Pro-tip - you can hold q and stay attached much longer than you would expect judging by the animation. I've ridden people across a quarter of the map. I take ghost instead of flash, and I usually flash more times per match then any two players.
stoyo8 (NA)
: being autofilled jungle is miserable
Jungle is broken af. There are many many great arguments for why this is, I have seen Riot address exactly zero of them. Crippled xp gains Crippled gold gains Crippled summoner spell choice, one is mandatory, so jg only gets one summoner. Crippled item slots, 100% required starting item, so jg only gets five item slots. The crippled item curse: Supports get a quest to finish which upgrades item, jg gets a curse they have to remove? WTF! Crippled Champ Choice: Starting blue side of jg you cannot hit lvl 3 without crossing into anther quadrant of the map, this mostly limits junglers realistically to jgs that start red(Fighters, aoe skill champs) Riot looks at jg complaints and says "well a good player can carry from jg" so decides to make role weaker, but doesn't consider any of the context. In jg, when you win hard, it's pretty much by making good decisions and predicting what players will do well, I.e. Actually knowing what you're doing. It's a complex game and a complex role with a lot more decision making variance then the lanes have. You can screw it up as easily and heartily as you can win it. Jg is such a complex role that Riot still doesn't have a jungle cpu player, they clearly can't figure out how to boil it down to an workable algorithm. Jungle is potentially a strong role for a good player, not innately a strong role for anyone who tries it, as is evidenced by this post reaching up the upvotes. I was going to see how I placed on a new account without the MMR lock, but finally got bored of being flamed in some recent games for 'not doing enough' when I'm the only winning champ on the team. It's a dumb, crippled, thankless role, and I'm having much more fun playing Path of Exile at the moment, it's no shock people abandoning the role in hordes.
Yoirkie (NA)
: Why limited to 2 rune pages?
New accounts get three pages now.
: Am I the only one that feels like Wit's End has become a Irelia only item?
I one trick Warwick.. People trying to tell me how good it is all the time, it always feels like trash. Old Wit's End was amazing, it actually lay me get back into a losing game against fed AP monsters(like when Amu is on a roll killing everyone). That aren't even similar items, I don't know why they killed one to make the other. Give both or revert.
: See you think you are so much better than your rank but youre not. You think that going for baron at 25 min is a bad play. There are plenty of times you can go for baron at 25 min and even sometimes at 20 min. You just have to be able to spot when a good baron opportunity becomes available.. Judging from what you wrote, I can infer that you cant tell when to baron. Looking at your match history I can already see you average 3.8 cs per min on kayle overall. Which is not "great" as you put it.. It's pretty bad. Now since Im a jg main and there's a significant rank difference between us, I instead looked up some silver 4 players to compare you to, to see if you could compete in silver 4. From what I found, silver 4 laners average around 5 cs per min which is not great but relatively speaking much better than 3.8. For comparison high elo laners average around 8 depending on champion and role. You still have a lot to learn and practice before you get out bronze, but there are plenty of helpful guides online that are very useful. For starters i definitely recommend you google what "wave manipulation" is and "how to catch sidewaves". It'll help you a lot in your csing as im more than certain nobody in bronze understands these concepts.
> [{quoted}](name=ChrisBrownze,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=0tBFkPEy,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-06-17T05:37:34.324+0000) > > See you think you are so much better than your rank but youre not. You think that going for baron at 25 min is a bad play. There are plenty of times you can go for baron at 25 min and even sometimes at 20 min. You just have to be able to spot when a good baron opportunity becomes available.. Judging from what you wrote, I can infer that you cant tell when to baron. > > Looking at your match history I can already see you average 3.8 cs per min on kayle overall. Which is not "great" as you put it.. It's pretty bad. Now since Im a jg main and there's a significant rank difference between us, I instead looked up some silver 4 players to compare you to, to see if you could compete in silver 4. From what I found, silver 4 laners average around 5 cs per min which is not great but relatively speaking much better than 3.8. For comparison high elo laners average around 8 depending on champion and role. > > You still have a lot to learn and practice before you get out bronze, but there are plenty of helpful guides online that are very useful. For starters i definitely recommend you google what "wave manipulation" is and "how to catch sidewaves". It'll help you a lot in your csing as im more than certain nobody in bronze understands these concepts. I was also wondering about this 25 min baron comment? 20 is a terrible time, it had just spawned and can get choose to wiping a whole team, sometimes one enemy gets there kills whole team. At 25 though? Pot down virgin and control, and either take baron or let ambush of you are winning, no problem.
: Honestly, I only play this game because I love the toxic community. If you can't handle the flame you should probably not play. It's my favorite part of the game flame and get flamed back, it's great.
> [{quoted}](name=Godly Jie,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=QAlVYBHJ,comment-id=0015,timestamp=2019-06-18T13:18:08.308+0000) > > Honestly, I only play this game because I love the toxic community. If you can't handle the flame you should probably not play. It's my favorite part of the game flame and get flamed back, it's great. Trash taking with opponents = good times Trash talking your own team = wtf where did this come from. Surely no-one from my generation thinks this is ever ok.
Hippodog (NA)
: I would agree that's not ban worthy behavior, but chill out. Just take your loss, or try to carry dude. Stop typing in chat. It goes nowhere.
> [{quoted}](name=Hippodog,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=QAlVYBHJ,comment-id=001e,timestamp=2019-06-18T15:05:36.226+0000) > > I would agree that's not ban worthy behavior, but chill out. Just take your loss, or try to carry dude. Stop typing in chat. It goes nowhere. Dude he started from the queue....
ooshawn (NA)
: To be honest i agree with him. There are people too childish to use chat in game and they should simply be muted. Now he will just make a new account and be more angry than before. I'm tired of my friends getting banned and then I have to play garbage norms for a month because he isn't even level 30. I think riot needs to rethink this multiple account garbage and realize that it just leads to increased disconnect to the game and your account in general. Now he has even less reason to hold back from calling people r%%%%% etc etc .. if you throw out a punishment like a permanent ban that easily over words, nobody is gonna have a deep commitment to any one particular account and obviously that's the case. Nobody in league has less than 2-4 accounts after you play for awhile
> [{quoted}](name=ooshawn,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=QAlVYBHJ,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2019-06-18T07:16:39.792+0000) > > To be honest i agree with him. There are people too childish to use chat in game and they should simply be muted. Now he will just make a new account and be more angry than before. I'm tired of my friends getting banned and then I have to play garbage norms for a month because he isn't even level 30. I think riot needs to rethink this multiple account garbage and realize that it just leads to increased disconnect to the game and your account in general. Now he has even less reason to hold back from calling people r%%%%% etc etc .. if you throw out a punishment like a permanent ban that easily over words, nobody is gonna have a deep commitment to any one particular account and obviously that's the case. Nobody in league has less than 2-4 accounts after you play for awhile Dude, honestly, Riot and the kids that think like you are the children. This dude got banned this time, and he should, but the Riot threshold for what is bannable/reportable is so ridiculously low it's the source of toxicity in this game. The MAJORITY of matches have a player like this at this point, often from queue. When I read the stuff they approve, it makes me cringe. If you were to go 5% as far in real life as it goes in match, people would be fighting in real life anywhere outside of California! Banning teammate picks, pinging items or a Champs have over and over, the general flaming, for anyone without a broken high school leftover attitude, all that is incomprehensible. I bet anything the guys that started Riot barely finished high school before starting on this, they don't have a clue how far they never grew up.
: Played two games where my support decided to do a smite, river support thing.
: Give Blind Pick role selection
This would solve a lot of problems. I say let people queue for a role AND pick their champion before queuing, THAT would be a blind mode where everyone gets what they want,, and new players are encouraged to pick a role, because we all know the roles are now set in stone.
: Why are we attacking Riot for the whole Nightblue3 thing?
It's easy for people to pick on Riot because their decisions are always driven by people chasing more profit since the Tencent purchase. The state of the game in the long-term really isn't important to them as long as they are making money TODAY.
: Lets start a list of terrible decisions Riot has made, comment to add
Never seen a jungle change I liked. Jg item being required for xp, smite required for jg item, crippled out of summoner spell choice, crippled into buying and upgrading jg item, more crippled xp reductions, crippled late game, scuttle time change makes blue start optionless... Bunch of stupid stuff.
Weensw (NA)
: Out of every single champion, who can give the best leash?
The first time I saw a shaco start the buff with all the boxes outmy eyeballs shot out of my head. Anyone saying a different champ hasn't seen Shaco lay three boxes before the buff comes out. You blink and it's gone.
: Monster Hunter debuff is still ugly "band-aid" that must go.
> [{quoted}](name=True Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=oEB3vT24,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-06-14T00:37:58.922+0000) > > Monster Hunter debuff is still ugly "band-aid" that must go. The whole mandatory jungle item and summoner spell is a trash idea in the first place. I should be taking smite because smite itself is ideal, not because I have to take smite to take the jungle item I have to take to be able to level up...
: Make Remake Automatic
Never once seen your supposed examples happen in real life.
Rioter Comments
: WWs Q
When you get good with Warwick's Q, you will be flashing more times per match then any other two champs combined, and you don't need flash I your summ to do it. It's Brutal. Edit: Rode a Yuumi dashing to her adc the other day to finish murdering him faster then she could heal, it was hilarious.
: I truly think lane rengar is just too oppressive
I always use glacial augment in my builds. Rengar is one of the hilarious GA victims. As long as you auto him when he bush jumps, *he doesn't get to run back to bush and jump for free damage again*. He pretty squishy early game.
: I Am A Support Main and When ADC Bans My Champ
I have not seen this mentioned here, but let's forget morals and talk practicality here. This game is about weighing risks, taking good ones, avoiding bad ones. Banning your teammates hover carries a ridiculous risk for the game. They may have to pay a champ they aren't good,, they may go apeshit and take all your cs. They may support an entirely different lane. Outs a stupid risk, and no rational person would do it.
: SO you seem to make fun of leagues high damage and quick matches by calling them call of league, yet you complain about not oneshotting things?
> [{quoted}](name=Whyskered Wyrm,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=eAUER1z2,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-06-08T02:57:01.793+0000) > > SO you seem to make fun of leagues high damage and quick matches by calling them call of league, yet you complain about not oneshotting things? It's sarcasm???
: Instead of trolling the game which can get you punished why not try an off-meta champion? They banned your yuumi? Try out jarvan support. Maybe TF support would be fun. Heck even draven support would be funny. The best thing is your ADC will think twice before they ban someone's champ next time and you get to try out new champs. Hell maybe you'll find a fun support. And this isn't griefing, trolling or inting, you're simply trying off-meta picks which is completely allowed!
> [{quoted}](name=Shadowbyte,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=PkVAmmOI,comment-id=000c,timestamp=2019-06-07T17:57:10.646+0000) > > Instead of trolling the game which can get you punished why not try an off-meta champion? They banned your yuumi? Try out jarvan support. Maybe TF support would be fun. Heck even draven support would be funny. The best thing is your ADC will think twice before they ban someone's champ next time and you get to try out new champs. Hell maybe you'll find a fun support. And this isn't griefing, trolling or inting, you're simply trying off-meta picks which is completely allowed! My main is great for this while learning support. ADC bans my Yuumi? I become Second Jungle and grab ol trusty Warwick. Start with all the cs I can from bot lane, then roam back and forth from jg to lane for cs. The amount of champs that can last hit faster than Warwick after level 3 is zero. Each of these games end with team flaming adc for feeding while I crush everyone across the map because I don't have to worry about dragon, Herald, baron, avoiding lane cs, etc. Pile of laughs every time.
: Banning your teammates holded champ is a dick move But **trolling a game is worse** He doesn't go to full roam because he thinks it's good for the team, otherwise he would do it all games right? He only does that when his ADC is a dick That marks that he does it as a childish way to punish his adc by costing all the team chances of winning a game because going full roam and letting your ADC on a constant 2vs1 is **never** an optimal decision
> [{quoted}](name=Sir Saltarin,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=PkVAmmOI,comment-id=000400000000,timestamp=2019-06-07T10:42:58.623+0000) > > Banning your teammates holded champ is a dick move > > But **trolling a game is worse** > > He doesn't go to full roam because he thinks it's good for the team, otherwise he would do it all games right? > > He only does that when his ADC is a dick > > That marks that he does it as a childish way to punish his adc by costing all the team chances of winning a game because going full roam and letting your ADC on a constant 2vs1 is **never** an optimal decision Play support for a while. I just picked it up. The ADCs that do this hover ban are trash almost 99% of the time, look them up each time. Always low win rates,, high deaths in matches. I've tried supporting these fools and it IS better to just leave them under tower and help elsewhere. If they are good, they safely hug tower and farm.
: So...since an asshole banned your champ you are gonna troll the game so the 3 teammates that did nothing lose too ? That's not very clever
> [{quoted}](name=Sir Saltarin,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=PkVAmmOI,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-06-07T08:50:27.594+0000) > > So...since an asshole banned your champ you are gonna troll the game so the 3 teammates that did nothing lose too ? > > That's not very clever If you think on macro scale, it certainly IS better NOT to cooperate. It's ridiculously juvenile what Riot will allow when it comes to obviously negative behavior, like banning champs your team has hovered. It's the opposite of teamwork. People troll from the queue sometimes, that's a fact, and the same players thing this almost always turn out to be total trash when the game starts up. Riot should add a report and dodge to queue: I would happily take a five or even ten minute dodge as long as I could report juvenile players trying to force dodge me. People also do this all the time trying to steal teammates roles, then force a dodge when you refuse to switch. If Riot wants to allow this Stupid Petty Crap because they never developed pay high school, I'll happily drag their game to the bottom of hell like they want. It's not players' job to cooperate with trolls, it's Riot's job to give people an out when trolling starts before a potentially 35 minute matchup starts for ten players, if they care at all about the future of their game.
: Logical Explanation of The Snowbally Burst Meta.
You didn't touch on bounties. If you take a look at how bounties pay out on the wiki page, they are largely responsible for snowballing. Gaining a level has an average guild efficiency of 580g. The bounties all pay in favor of killer too heavily compared to level reward.
Jamaree (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Mal the Red,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3Y4E2Lzs,comment-id=000000010000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-06-05T04:41:16.257+0000) > > Instead of arguing against my point, you resort to conjecture. > > You have already lost. When your entire argument is "nuh uh, you are wrong." no real option anymore besides being truthful. You are bad, you are worst then you think you are, you have no idea what you are talking about and you are a perfect showcase on why Riot doesn't look to the forums when it comes to balance.
> [{quoted}](name=Mal the Red,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3Y4E2Lzs,comment-id=00000001000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-06-05T07:06:22.096+0000) > > And your entire argument amounts to little more than "You're bad." > > You have no leg to stand on. Do you wiggle when you walk around? Not trying to offend, but been practicing support past couple of weeks, it seems to be the players who don't dodge around before the skill shots that seem to have a hard time dodging them. The harder your position is to guess before firing, the easier it is to dodge.
: Can I just offer a response to junglers? If a 10+ minion wave is literally right in front of my turret and there's a fucking cannon and I have the mana for EITHER a W or an E as Nasus, I'm not going to help with your gank. It doesn't matter if it'd get a kill - you're going to end up taking it and we'll both burn summs for it, whereas I'll get more gold and stacks off of the CS right in front of me and won't lose a huge chunk of health from turret. Also, if I'm starting to fall behind, yes that Draven/Naut might be a better gank and yes you might be a carry jg but it's also quite literally part of your job to help me stop falling behind. I don't mean carry my lane for me if I'm incompetent, I mean give me the boost I need to be able to win. This is especially true if I'm a late-game champion against a lane bully. You don't even need to get a kill or burn summs, nor do you need to give me the kill, just get the opposing laner off my ass so that I can actually farm a wave and not have to lose half of it to Darius's E simply existing. And trust your laner when they ping you off of the gank. I've been paying more attention to my opponent than you have, and I know my own champion far better than you do. If I ping you off, **back off** unless you're absolutely certain you can handle a 1v1, and assume it's a 1v2 if you don't see their jungler. I'm not fucking up the strategy I need to use to get ahead to do practically nothing, and I might not have the mana or items to even be able to participate in the fight. I might be able to throw *an* ability at them to help but I'm not risking that much on a gank I'm not ready to deal with. Work with your laner just as much as you expect them to work with you.
> [{quoted}](name=DuskDaUmbreon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=P731uotQ,comment-id=000f,timestamp=2019-06-05T15:16:18.823+0000) > > Can I just offer a response to junglers? > > If a 10+ minion wave is literally right in front of my turret and there's a fucking cannon and I have the mana for EITHER a W or an E as Nasus, I'm not going to help with your gank. It doesn't matter if it'd get a kill - you're going to end up taking it and we'll both burn summs for it, whereas I'll get more gold and stacks off of the CS right in front of me and won't lose a huge chunk of health from turret. > > Also, if I'm starting to fall behind, yes that Draven/Naut might be a better gank and yes you might be a carry jg but it's also quite literally part of your job to help me stop falling behind. I don't mean carry my lane for me if I'm incompetent, I mean give me the boost I need to be able to win. This is especially true if I'm a late-game champion against a lane bully. You don't even need to get a kill or burn summs, nor do you need to give me the kill, just get the opposing laner off my ass so that I can actually farm a wave and not have to lose half of it to Darius's E simply existing. > > And trust your laner when they ping you off of the gank. I've been paying more attention to my opponent than you have, and I know my own champion far better than you do. If I ping you off, **back off** unless you're absolutely certain you can handle a 1v1, and assume it's a 1v2 if you don't see their jungler. I'm not fucking up the strategy I need to use to get ahead to do practically nothing, and I might not have the mana or items to even be able to participate in the fight. I might be able to throw *an* ability at them to help but I'm not risking that much on a gank I'm not ready to deal with. > > Work with your laner just as much as you expect them to work with you. Bro try the other way, where you trust your jg and show up when they ping. Think about all the things you ping jg for, from Dragon to baron to ganks, counter ganks, pushes. The jungle is managing the* entire game board.* Answer when they ping for you, everything across the entire map goes smoother. Put your macro cap on bro.
TehNACHO (NA)
: Ahh, just gonna hop on that last comment. Pixel brush is nice against Aggro Junglers but the REALLY great wards are a deep ward on the enemy Raptor or Blue around the 1:00 mark. Just one of the two will give you a pretty good idea of what the enemy Jungler is gonna do. Having both tells you exactly what kind of Route the enemy Jungler is taking, and their entire early game plan. They're a little risky, so it's best either to a) ward the topside of the map (enemy Raptor if Blue Team, enemy Blue if Red team), b) go ward as a 2-3 man squad, and c) avoid the hell out of level 1 monsters like Braum or Aatrox. However, as I said, even one is a lot and two would be perfect.
> [{quoted}](name=TehNACHO,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=P731uotQ,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2019-06-05T06:22:12.992+0000) > > Ahh, just gonna hop on that last comment. > > Pixel brush is nice against Aggro Junglers but the REALLY great wards are a deep ward on the enemy Raptor or Blue around the 1:00 mark. Just one of the two will give you a pretty good idea of what the enemy Jungler is gonna do. Having both tells you exactly what kind of Route the enemy Jungler is taking, and their entire early game plan. They're a little risky, so it's best either to a) ward the topside of the map (enemy Raptor if Blue Team, enemy Blue if Red team), b) go ward as a 2-3 man squad, and c) avoid the hell out of level 1 monsters like Braum or Aatrox. However, as I said, even one is a lot and two would be perfect. Those deep wards you are talking about are pointless and risky. If you watch the map and know your champs,, you doubt need to see the jg start to know where he is. Also, if you even get seen dropping that ward, the enemies are more likely to ward jg at start, making it very risky to go vertical even if enemy jg is elsewhere. You cut off half the available map dropping that ward! You should know that if you playe jungle and know invading...
: I never really understood letting top lane get bullied out of lane. If top is losing but isn't feeding then getting them a kill or even having jungle presence might be enough to turn it around. Some junglers acknowledge that top is looking rough but has no presence on the map. I don't think anyone is asking for the jungler to win their lane but you're supposed to be a wild card to give your laners an advantage randomly. A losing lane and a feeding lane is different. I won't gank a lane that fed 4 kills before 10 mins.
> [{quoted}](name=AetherFlow,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=PlE6H2zs,comment-id=000f,timestamp=2019-06-04T23:20:50.968+0000) > > I never really understood letting top lane get bullied out of lane. If top is losing but isn't feeding then getting them a kill or even having jungle presence might be enough to turn it around. Some junglers acknowledge that top is looking rough but has no presence on the map. > > I don't think anyone is asking for the jungler to win their lane but you're supposed to be a wild card to give your laners an advantage randomly. A losing lane and a feeding lane is different. I won't gank a lane that fed 4 kills before 10 mins. Honest to god, the players that haven't played jungle have literally no clue, and there is almost no way to tell which ones do or don't have a clue. Every gank attempt, even ones that could be ridiculously simple, are BIG RISKS. We often show up and initiate obvious easy ganks, pinging and even typing out plans fully in advance for thirty seconds to a minute, only to watch a laner stand around getting that last cs five feet away watching is die. It's insane, and you won't believe it until you have played jg. Now that we have a handicap(our cs is handicapped), we just can't risk anything other than overwhelming obvious ganks *where we can also escape if you turn out to be a potato and not move." If the overwhelming accepted concept in this community was: "Your jg helps all over the map, and gets more time to watch the map then any other lane(almost constantly!), listen to your jg!" you would get the smooth ganks you want. It's not though, it's "Jungle has to carry every lane through hardship, and be at every battle. Oh, I died! Better jungle wins!"
xAcidik (NA)
: Here's What I've Learned From Practicing Jungle...
This is a really good post, laners can put it into play or keep wondering why things don't work out for them. Especially what he said about mid,a helpful roaming mid laner is the absolute best. When they are helpful to the jungle. Not so much roaming to lanes except special circumstances.
: I wish RIOT would bring back a seperate version of the old RAGEBLADE..... but still keep the new one
Wish I could have the old Wit's End back! The new one is NOTHING like the old one, much preferred the old one for situational.
iPrawn (NA)
: Udyr is literally the most tilting champion in the game.......... for the person who is playing him.
Brah, in gonna tell you a "secret," and if you take this secret back to the jungle, you can enjoy Ud again. The secret to good kills when you are melee jg is *being in position before the enemy gets where there going.* Learn pathing well and enemies will walk right up to you in the bushes. You don't have to chase them down, you go to the right bush at the right time and wait ten seconds. Profit.
Amni (NA)
: Can we please stop crying about Yuumi
It's good to have a solid backup champ fur meant situations, I love my boy WW. If one of my teammates bans my hover, I tell them if they don't dodge, they will never see any cs, be lowest leveled by end of game, and probably be reported by all. Then I choose Warwick, legendary last hitting machine. I had a mid lane Lux that did this yesterday, and was dumb enough not to dodge after she saw WW. Ate all her cs after level 3, roamed map as I pleased with no responsibility at all, destroyed everywhere I went with his lame cs lead. She had the one kill I got her at beginning, and I had 15+ and brought us victory. Also reported. Banning your teammates pick IS griefing, I've reported people for it and seen results. Riot can't expect to sell new champs if people can't play them, it's about money.
: 6 vs 6 ranked
You can already do this with a mic and premades. For solo queue? You can be 20/0/20 in game and people still won't listen to you, don't know why you would expect any of these street urchins to listen to a coach. ;)
Velasan (NA)
: It doesn't work that way because having an instant cast animation would make Nunu significantly stronger, both in combat and for objective taking. Nunu Q can do more than smite in the later levels and is on a shorter cool down. You can Q chomp at much higher levels of HP than your enemy can smite an objective. Also, you have the advantage of being able to use both smite and Q at the same time.
> [{quoted}](name=Velasan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Al32UdHt,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-06-04T16:23:28.999+0000) > > It doesn't work that way because having an instant cast animation would make Nunu significantly stronger, both in combat and for objective taking. > > Nunu Q can do more than smite in the later levels and is on a shorter cool down. You can Q chomp at much higher levels of HP than your enemy can smite an objective. Also, you have the advantage of being able to use both smite and Q at the same time. smite at the same time as your largest attack(I assume q here) is the way to do it.
Madjack01 (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Ambitious Minnow,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=V2bNAxuE,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2019-06-03T07:55:37.950+0000) > > I've been having success in some matches doing this with Yuumi with Magical Travelers boots aha teleport. If you mess up the timing in any way changing lanes, you can end up one to two levels down in xp. When done right, I'm bagging assists and tower plating across the map. In new to support entirely, but have gotten some 30 - 40 assist games this way. Good times. That's pretty neat. Are you premade with your team? Or do you communicate a lot beforehand? I can imagine that this strategy leads to some saltiness from time to time.
> [{quoted}](name=Madjack01,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=V2bNAxuE,comment-id=00090000,timestamp=2019-06-03T13:00:44.098+0000) > > That's pretty neat. > Are you premade with your team? Or do you communicate a lot beforehand? > > I can imagine that this strategy leads to some saltiness from time to time. I stay with bot lane exclusively until at least level 6, and don't leave until my adc is in pretty good shape(or if the adc absolutey refuses to poke at all and keeps dying because of it, I've been abandoning them, lol, no point in helping someone who can't point there gun at enemies)
nelogis (EUW)
: What is this Warwick buff on the PBE?
2 million mastery on Warwick here... 1. I say all the time, W is not bugged. It's fine, learn to use it correctly. 2. This change is disappointing like everyone says, you must build tank items on WW, I've tried everything, he has nothing to escape a fight with unless willing to ult out, 90% of your fights are all in. AP Warwick is not a good plan. 3. I would much rather have seen a buff to the passive then this change and the Q change. The passive isn't near as good as it used to be, and really falls off late in game. This, or just some base stat increase would be better. His movement speed is fucking terrible for someone who can't dash put of a battle.
Madjack01 (EUW)
: Supports: cut them loose from bot lane.
I've been having success in some matches doing this with Yuumi with Magical Travelers boots aha teleport. If you mess up the timing in any way changing lanes, you can end up one to two levels down in xp. When done right, I'm bagging assists and tower plating across the map. In new to support entirely, but have gotten some 30 - 40 assist games this way. Good times.
: You can easily justify elo: every other system is worse. No system will ever be suitable for a 5 v 5 moba. You just have to take the best of many flawed systems.
> [{quoted}](name=haaaaaaalp,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ILr8RYfP,comment-id=00000001000000000000,timestamp=2019-05-31T03:13:52.681+0000) > > You can easily justify elo: every other system is worse. No system will ever be suitable for a 5 v 5 moba. You just have to take the best of many flawed systems. No?
: as I said previously MMR is relative to other players. It would feel really shitty to be "plat" one day and then not play for a week and when you log in again you are gold because everyone else, say, kept playing and increased their MMR. It almost never happens unless you are diamond that you will be placed with players 2 divisions above you. Please show me the game where that happened
> [{quoted}](name=DeadUnborn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ILr8RYfP,comment-id=000a0000000000000000,timestamp=2019-05-31T21:17:54.418+0000) > > as I said previously MMR is relative to other players. It would feel really shitty to be "plat" one day and then not play for a week and when you log in again you are gold because everyone else, say, kept playing and increased their MMR. It almost never happens unless you are diamond that you will be placed with players 2 divisions above you. Please show me the game where that happened The current system, that's the one that feels really shitty.
: > [{quoted}](name=AetherFlow,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=FNNG7Fpu,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-05-29T19:40:20.132+0000) > > The people that get paid to play the game discover new tactics that work and with math and strategy behind it. Average Joe that wants to go aftershock jinx has no real idea as to why it's viable or isn't viable. Also the average Joe is doing that nonsense in games where people aren't trying to practice builds or have the skill capable of overcoming the shortcomings or weakness of doing a bad build. > > To you or anyone like you the meta is annoying but there's a meta for a reason and going against the meta doesn't really help you much in some cases it can help with odd picks or picks people don't or match against often. More often than not a champion out of Meta is for a particular reason. I'd have to disagree. I'm a Mastery 7 Nami and I do all sorts of experiments despite not being a pro. Ever tried the on-hit Hail of Blades E max setup? Though I wouldn't recommend taking it mid, I managed a 60% WR with it in mid - it's got some serious hidden power. But it'd be too troll, cause a Korean pro player hasn't discovered it yet. Don't take people who go against the meta lightly. Some of them, sure, are just jerking around cause they forgot to change their runes in that last game and thought they were stomping when they were just getting lucky. But some of us have our craft too.
> [{quoted}](name=ChaosReyn,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=FNNG7Fpu,comment-id=00000002,timestamp=2019-05-29T20:16:34.309+0000) > > I'd have to disagree. I'm a Mastery 7 Nami and I do all sorts of experiments despite not being a pro. Ever tried the on-hit Hail of Blades E max setup? Though I wouldn't recommend taking it mid, I managed a 60% WR with it in mid - it's got some serious hidden power. But it'd be too troll, cause a Korean pro player hasn't discovered it yet. > > Don't take people who go against the meta lightly. Some of them, sure, are just jerking around cause they forgot to change their runes in that last game and thought they were stomping when they were just getting lucky. > > But some of us have our craft too. "But some of us have our craft too." Nicely said.
: Wunder's {{champion:102}} build. start {{item:1028}} build into {{item:3067}} then build a {{item:3108}} . Then complete {{item:3161}} , and then using the codex finish{{item:3905}} . Then build {{item:3116}} and fill your build with tank items depending on whos the strongest. If i saw someone going this i would assume they are trolling, but i've seen this excel too much for it to be a fluke.
> [{quoted}](name=Pendergast891,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=FNNG7Fpu,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-05-29T20:05:21.735+0000) > > Wunder's {{champion:102}} build. start {{item:1028}} build into {{item:3067}} then build a {{item:3108}} . Then complete {{item:3161}} , and then using the codex finish{{item:3905}} . Then build {{item:3116}} and fill your build with tank items depending on whos the strongest. > > If i saw someone going this i would assume they are trolling, but i've seen this excel too much for it to be a fluke. I have a ridiculous Yuumi build that looks like this right now with a bunch of mid level pieces before anything completes.. Everyone is all freaked out until the bodies start dropping everywhere and I'm everywhere I need to be on map, then all of a sudden it's 3 GG's at end of game. LOL, people are ridiculous.
: People tend to gloss over that detail. Its a bit old. ELO works with 1v1 based scenarios (It was created for Chess, so let that sink in), we need a different system.
> [{quoted}](name=Ragnaveil,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ILr8RYfP,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2019-05-30T15:39:08.169+0000) > > People tend to gloss over that detail. Its a bit old. ELO works with 1v1 based scenarios (It was created for Chess, so let that sink in), we need a different system. You are the only decently informed person in this thread so far. The Elo(lower case, it's named after a person) system is designed to provide a fair accounting of someone's skill level... to determine starting placement in tournaments. That's it! It doesn't affect how fast or slow people move up a ladder, in any way shape or form. There is nothing even close to people placing well and then getting increased points for wins, lol. In any chess tournament, the point gains and losses for win, draw, or tie are identical. Throughout the tournament, players are matched based on how many points they have accumulated in the tournament(not their Elo rank, again, that's only for starting positions aka seeding). The Elo system isn't designed in any way to measure skill in a team game, and the way these gaming companies use it has literally nothing to do with the way it's used professionally and what it's designed for. You can't justify the MMR system without talking in circles, every time someone points out one of it's many failings, people just default back to the tired line of how it's adjusting. ?? Nope, it's just not suitable for the purpose it's being used for.
rujitra (NA)
: 1. Riot did not put you in losses. Riot matched you with teams of your skill level against teams of your skill level. The other players and you lost the games. 2. You were not punished for losing games, but for your behavior. 3. You constantly argued, commented on how you were giving up and didn't want to be playing... etc.
> [{quoted}](name=rujitra,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=LAWrefE7,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-05-30T00:15:50.560+0000) > > 1. Riot did not put you in losses. Riot matched you with teams of your skill level against teams of your skill level. The other players and you lost the games. > > 2. You were not punished for losing games, but for your behavior. > > 3. You constantly argued, commented on how you were giving up and didn't want to be playing... etc. I'm not here to justify any questionable behaviour, but to your statement I say: Yawn. Matchmaking is not good.
Saezio (EUNE)
: What if 1million players decided to join that chess tournament at the same time, with skills ranging from people that have played chess for 1 month to people that do it professionally for decades? (Also, doesn't online chess match you with players near your ELO? Is it irrelevant? So, someone could be matched with people double or half their ELO for example? I'd be shocked if that's the case.) You are comparing different things. What I am saying is that a player with 2000 MMR _can't be worse_ than a player with 1500 MMR and can't be better than a player with 2500 MMR. Sure, if the difference is 2000 to 1980 it means fuck all about their skill difference. I said it was an _indicator_ . How do you suppose people should be matched against each other then? Name a team online game that has a good match making system so I can understand. I am saying I prefer the ranking system of seasons 1-2, because at least back then, the MMR that determined who you are matched against also indicated the match's skill level. Right now, a gold 1 player can be consistently be pitted against more skillfull opponent's than a plat 4 player (again I am using MMR as an indicator of skill because riot is doing the same) which I feel is dumb.
> [{quoted}](name=Saezio,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=H3We4Rjp,comment-id=00000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-05-30T10:53:41.239+0000) > > What if 1million players decided to join that chess tournament at the same time, with skills ranging from people that have played chess for 1 month to people that do it professionally for decades? (Also, doesn't online chess match you with players near your ELO? Is it irrelevant? So, someone could be matched with people double or half their ELO for example? I'd be shocked if that's the case.) > You are comparing different things. > > > What I am saying is that a player with 2000 MMR _can't be worse_ than a player with 1500 MMR and can't be better than a player with 2500 MMR. Sure, if the difference is 2000 to 1980 it means fuck all about their skill difference. > I said it was an _indicator_ . > > How do you suppose people should be matched against each other then? > Name a team online game that has a good match making system so I can understand. > > I am saying I prefer the ranking system of seasons 1-2, because at least back then, the MMR that determined who you are matched against also indicated the match's skill level. Right now, a gold 1 player can be consistently be pitted against more skillfull opponent's than a plat 4 player (again I am using MMR as an indicator of skill because riot is doing the same) which I feel is dumb. Did you even bother reading the wikipedia link? If 1 million players join that chess tournament, most likely a Swiss system would be employed. Player ratings would determine which players face each other first,, but that's it except for tie breaking. *The amount of points distributed for a win, loss, or draw remains the sane throughout the tournament.* Our current system is like one big ongoing tournament, except it's a tournament where players who have done well in the beginning gain more points then other players, or the reverse happens. Does this system give us fair matches, or reward us fairly? If it's giving you even matches, *the lp gain should always be the same, shouldn't it?* If the LP gains are different, doesn't that mean you're not getting fair matches? The system is about as close to useless as possible.
Kazekiba (NA)
: The ultra low health is because she only takes damage if she has to or wants to. Yuumi effectively has two health bars and can operate from a safe distance, not to mention the shield and Missing health amp on her heal. Champions have base stats balanced around their kits all the time, its why you get things like Sion having less HP at level 6 than most mages and Kled having the overall lowest Health in the game, even though these champions are juggernauts (and Thresh having an absolute joke of an armor stat, as well as never gaining any from levels alone.) > [{quoted}](name=Saezio,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AlcXh2wz,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-05-30T12:29:24.526+0000) > > I'd like movement commands to cause detaching as well. It's a simple QoL change but would help many players I feel. This, I agree with.
> [{quoted}](name=Kazekiba,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AlcXh2wz,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-05-30T13:00:30.091+0000) > > The ultra low health is because she only takes damage if she has to or wants to. Yuumi effectively has two health bars and can operate from a safe distance, not to mention the shield and Missing health amp on her heal. > > Champions have base stats balanced around their kits all the time, its why you get things like Sion having less HP at level 6 than most mages and Kled having the overall lowest Health in the game, even though these champions are juggernauts (and Thresh having an absolute joke of an armor stat, as well as never gaining any from levels alone.) > > This, I agree with. This really is very unfair to the ADCs of you think about it, and will always contribute to the ADCs complaining about being solo thing. Her kit is balanced around w already with low scaling, low damage, and all around low stats even though the skills are cool. Having a normal amount of life would go a long way for her.
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=Haze97,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=X57hVEPF,comment-id=000900020000,timestamp=2019-05-30T00:01:11.849+0000) > > That's exactly his point, silly. He said he gets auto filled out of JG every 4 games. He legit never gets auto filled out of JG. Nobody does, JG is like instant Q at all Elos even if you Q support secondary. That's not his "point" that him lying
> [{quoted}](name=BestPudgeNA,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=X57hVEPF,comment-id=0009000200000000,timestamp=2019-05-30T05:30:24.170+0000) > > He said he gets auto filled out of JG every 4 games. He legit never gets auto filled out of JG. Nobody does, JG is like instant Q at all Elos even if you Q support secondary. That's not his "point" that him lying I haven't been autofilled out of jungle in over 800 games. 8. Hundred. Games. My queue is rarely more than 45 seconds. Summoner Agent Heavy Wolf... 800 games, zero autofill anywhere else, I never have to dodge either.
: > [{quoted}](name=Ambitious Minnow,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vj8vTriL,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2019-05-29T18:20:13.567+0000) > > While I doubt think matchmaking is good(I think the MMR system is one of the dumbest things ever invented), I no longer put the majority of blame on this with matchmaking. > > Look at bounty rewards vs. level rewards for kills. Gaining a level has an average guild efficiency of 580g, so you can compare the level gains from kills with bounty gains. The bounty gains are so slanted in favor of last hit it's insane. The bounty system just keeps creating bigger and bigger piles of gold that mostly trade back and forth between each team's current carry. It makes 2 or 3 players fed, while leaving the other 7 - 8 way behind and ineffective. It is THE reason for the crazy snowballing you see now. That's actually a very good point (about the bounty snowball carry) that I hadn't thought of before. Thanks. It explain why I carry much much easier this season when playing... carry. Support or jungle is useless (unless you play like Karthus or Yi). You have to rely on your carry, even more than before. And giving them the advantage as a supp or jungle is useless ... if enemy carry is better, he will just grab the shutdown gold eventually and actually carry. So... in s9, plat a carry (or duo queue with a carry) if you want to feel less useless
> [{quoted}](name=Ir Sun,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vj8vTriL,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2019-05-29T18:59:51.404+0000) > > That's actually a very good point (about the bounty snowball carry) that I hadn't thought of before. Thanks. > It explain why I carry much much easier this season when playing... carry. Support or jungle is useless (unless you play like Karthus or Yi). You have to rely on your carry, even more than before. And giving them the advantage as a supp or jungle is useless ... if enemy carry is better, he will just grab the shutdown gold eventually and actually carry. > > So... in s9, plat a carry (or duo queue with a carry) if you want to feel less useless I was looking at it all on a spreadsheet, then was like "Fuck me, it's obvious!" I have a better breakdown in another post, there's more than I mentioned here. Even though the level reward isn't as good as a decent bounty, it's ALSO split evenly, which the bounty is not. It's terribly unbalanced in favor of feeding carries.
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Ambitious Minnow

Level 112 (NA)
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