Fegone (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Anthony0603,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=NHhXxjdF,comment-id=0003000000010000,timestamp=2018-03-08T21:02:26.395+0000) > > Right so in 7 years... I had one bad streak. It would be different if I had been playing for 2 years and that happened. But 7 years? It's clear I'm not a toxic player, but I just had a bad streak in life. If i was a toxic player I would have been banned or warned somewhere along those first 5 years... again, whether something is permaban worthy or not isn't up for me to decide... that's why I am attempting to contact a real human being, so that they can review what a bot decided. I get that there's hundreds of these types of posts, and that most of the people truly are toxic. Trust me I have been playing for 7+ years, I have seen the depths of toxicity in this community. And that is not me. You clearly already have your mind made up over what type of person/player I am, and there is no way for me to convince you otherwise. OK, so now we've gone down from consistently non toxic for 7 years to nontoxic for 5 years. Initially you'd just omit the fact that you were toxic after 5 and claimed you were good for 7? That already shows your shady side and doesn't put yourself in a good light - at all. Also: Why don't you just post the damn chat logs? If you get permabanned , they give you the chat logs. Post them so we can see them and things will clear up. 99% of the time when people don't post the chat log is because they know how immensely offensive and toxic and whatnot they were, and don't want to admit to the community that they deserve their punishment. If you really believe what you said is not worth a permaban, post your logs.
> [{quoted}](name=Fegone,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=NHhXxjdF,comment-id=00030000000100000000,timestamp=2018-03-09T00:14:54.376+0000) > > OK, so now we've gone down from consistently non toxic for 7 years to nontoxic for 5 years. > Initially you'd just omit the fact that you were toxic after 5 and claimed you were good for 7? That already shows your shady side and doesn't put yourself in a good light - at all. > > Also: Why don't you just post the damn chat logs? If you get permabanned , they give you the chat logs. Post them so we can see them and things will clear up. > 99% of the time when people don't post the chat log is because they know how immensely offensive and toxic and whatnot they were, and don't want to admit to the community that they deserve their punishment. If you really believe what you said is not worth a permaban, post your logs. Dude no, this shows that you would rather argue semantics than argue the point at hand, I'm pretty sure that's a fallacy, but ya know, whatever. I was consistently non-toxic for 7 years. There isn't a single player in league who has actually NEVER... NOT ONCE... argued with their team in any manner. They don't exist, so trying to nit-pick at my use of "consistently" on your part is kinda sad. I did have a few hiccups from about 2 years ago until about 9 months ago when I quit to get my life together. (I'm not sure if you are literally asking for my entire life story to somehow prove that I'm not "shady"?) At which I came back about 3 months ago and was actually entirely non toxic, until I watched my step mom die in front of me, in which case I failed to handle the regular toxicity that I experience in games and have gotten good at brushing off, and proceeded to respond with toxicity of my own. I literally said in my OP that I was toxic in the last game before ban. They did give me a chat log and it definitely was punishment worthy. That's not what I'm saying at all if you had actually read my posts. I will not post it here though, because people like you will automatically assume that every game I play goes like that... Which is literally 8 million miles from the truth. What I am saying is that perma-bans should be for players who are non-stop toxic, not players who occasionally have life smack them in the face. I am saying I deserve punishment for making a mistake, but not a perma-ban. And quite honestly you sound like the toxic one, nit-picking at my every word, trying to push buttons to get me to say something negative, making accusations that I obviously can't disprove to a random stranger over the internet. So I will do what I should have done way more often in game and /mute Fegone. Enjoy whatever you get out of attacking people on the internet with no proof or reason. And have a nice day.
Raeyxx (NA)
: One little problem with this argument. Riot doesn't let the bot hand out Permanent suspensions. All permabans are done by a real live person (barring security locks). Which means it was a Riot employee DID look at your account and DID deem you unfit to play with other people. Secondly, Riot doesn't care if you spend millions of dollar and hundreds of hours. The fact was: you were toxic enough to warrant the review that got it permanently banned in the first place. Real-life issues aside, you chose to inflict your personal problems onto other players. The permanent suspension was placed on the account the drive home the point of how inappropriate that behavior was. If they lifted it, it would cheapen just how harsh the punishment is supposed to be.
> [{quoted}](name=Raeyxx,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=NHhXxjdF,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2018-03-07T07:33:52.806+0000) > > One little problem with this argument. Riot doesn't let the bot hand out Permanent suspensions. All permabans are done by a real live person (barring security locks). Which means it was a Riot employee DID look at your account and DID deem you unfit to play with other people. > > Secondly, Riot doesn't care if you spend millions of dollar and hundreds of hours. The fact was: you were toxic enough to warrant the review that got it permanently banned in the first place. Real-life issues aside, you chose to inflict your personal problems onto other players. The permanent suspension was placed on the account the drive home the point of how inappropriate that behavior was. If they lifted it, it would cheapen just how harsh the punishment is supposed to be. This is actually impossible. Because I had a game where I know I got reported, hadn't been reported recently at all. After that specific game, 2 minutes of q and into the next champ select I was kicked out of game. Hence, it took a total of 2 minutes 30 seconds for a riot employee to review my entire case and hand out a perma-ban? I'm sorry but that just seems a little unlikely... And I wasn't saying they should care how much money or time I've spent, I was simply saying that I have no intention of starting over to prove what I already know to be true.
Fegone (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Anthony0603,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=NHhXxjdF,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2018-03-07T06:59:01.616+0000) > > I understand your skepticism. And apologize for bringing anything real or life related in front of this community. Riot didn't deem me unfit to play with other people. A bot did. And while I enjoy being able to support riot monetarily I have no interest in building up a new account. I have invested a ridiculous amount of time and money into an account that I have consistently been non-toxic on for 7 years. A bad spell in life bleeding into my league play is unacceptable yes, but not perma-ban worthy. I am not asking for anything indefinitely, simply that a human being review a case that was closed by an automated bot. That isn't a handout, that is asking for fair trial. Ehm.... _an account that I have consistently been non-toxic on for 7 years_ And in your original post you write: _A year or two back I was having a really rough time, I was not a pleasant person. I received some warnings for being toxic in league that were very well deserved. I was a dick and deserved the **chat restrictions as well as one temporary ban** that I received._ So much for consistently non toxic. B.s. you were toxic before, got your fair warning. You continued to be toxic, you get served the consequences. And now you don't like the dish in front of you, so you're asking for a handout. Name it by what it is. Riot (or the IFS if you want) caught you using words that obviously aren't acceptable. You had this fair chance that you are asking for when they gave you a temp. ban. You ignored this warning, now deal with the consequences. And whether something is permaban worthy is not up to you to decide, you don't make the rules. Riot does. And you accepted the rules. Remember?
> [{quoted}](name=Fegone,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=NHhXxjdF,comment-id=000300000001,timestamp=2018-03-07T15:52:08.014+0000) > > Ehm.... > _an account that I have consistently been non-toxic on for 7 years_ > > And in your original post you write: > > _A year or two back I was having a really rough time, I was not a pleasant person. I received some warnings for being toxic in league that were very well deserved. I was a dick and deserved the **chat restrictions as well as one temporary ban** that I received._ > > So much for consistently non toxic. B.s. you were toxic before, got your fair warning. > You continued to be toxic, you get served the consequences. And now you don't like the dish in front of you, so you're asking for a handout. Name it by what it is. Riot (or the IFS if you want) caught you using words that obviously aren't acceptable. You had this fair chance that you are asking for when they gave you a temp. ban. You ignored this warning, now deal with the consequences. And whether something is permaban worthy is not up to you to decide, you don't make the rules. Riot does. And you accepted the rules. Remember? Right so in 7 years... I had one bad streak. It would be different if I had been playing for 2 years and that happened. But 7 years? It's clear I'm not a toxic player, but I just had a bad streak in life. If i was a toxic player I would have been banned or warned somewhere along those first 5 years... again, whether something is permaban worthy or not isn't up for me to decide... that's why I am attempting to contact a real human being, so that they can review what a bot decided. I get that there's hundreds of these types of posts, and that most of the people truly are toxic. Trust me I have been playing for 7+ years, I have seen the depths of toxicity in this community. And that is not me. You clearly already have your mind made up over what type of person/player I am, and there is no way for me to convince you otherwise.
Fegone (NA)
: _I'm not asking for handouts.._ That's exactly what you're doing. Not trying to be insensitive or anything, but look: This is the internet. Anyone can spin up a tragic story and try to justify being so toxic, Riot deems you as a person unfit to play with other people, and therefore removes you from the game forcefully. The only fact in this entire story that can be proven to be true is that you were very toxic, and you admit to it. That's all there needs to be said. No unban, this account ruined the game for probably 9 other people, and should not be allowed back in the game. Now, if you truly mean what you said, and want to show how well you reformed and you're not a non toxic individual, make another account and prove yourself. Level it up and show other player how to play in a nontoxic way, even when you're having a bad day , bad team, or bad mood.
I understand your skepticism. And apologize for bringing anything real or life related in front of this community. Riot didn't deem me unfit to play with other people. A bot did. And while I enjoy being able to support riot monetarily I have no interest in building up a new account. I have invested a ridiculous amount of time and money into an account that I have consistently been non-toxic on for 7 years. A bad spell in life bleeding into my league play is unacceptable yes, but not perma-ban worthy. I am not asking for anything indefinitely, simply that a human being review a case that was closed by an automated bot. That isn't a handout, that is asking for fair trial.
Rioter Comments
: Matchmaking is broken
My question is how this post gets a positive like/dislike ratio and every post I've done on this same topic gets wrecked with dislikes/deleted... on another account I had 5 straight games today where I had an S or S+, won the crap outta my lane. Even attempted to shot call in the last 3 only to watch my team blatantly ignore everything I had to say to do things like chase a shaco through the jungle instead of push a lane, or dive the enemy turret at level two. I mean I understand mistakes, but if rank is supposed to be an indicator of your skill level. Why am I so baffled at the lack of game knowledge my teammates have in gold? Why do I have to remind my rammus to look at his map before charging headfirst into a disadvantaged 3v5? Why do I have to remind my katarina to not 1v1 the enemy akali, because her champ is more built for aoe damage over single target. I mean... these are things I learned when climbing out of bronze. I'm not perfect, and in no way am trying to blame everyone else for my mistakes. I have a lot of departments of my play where I can improve. But it's pretty clear from game to game that I am levels above the people I am matched with. Maybe its just a streak of bad luck idk. But it's getting a little out of hand.
Paroe (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Anthony0603,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VPsEjPha,comment-id=00040000000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-18T02:10:29.432+0000) > > No dude, it's just extremely frustrating when the opposing argument starts and ends with an insult to your intelligence each and every time. It does not encourage friendly discussion or debate and will generally constitute the exact response I have given you. Youve given me no indication you understand hit boxes despite saying you do is the thing. Your entire argument hinges on "BUT IT MISSED" when clearly it didnt - hit boxes still collided. A quick google search provides several reasons why it connected, none of them being "THRESH HOOKBOX TO BIG RITO". You know what those reasons are? 1) Vayne hitbox is larger than it should be in comparison to model size 2) Tumble hit box might not move until vayne completes the tumble ( Vaynes hit box being larger than it should be is plausible. Tumbles hit box not moving with vayne is old, but also fairly probable although i wouldnt put stock in it.) I can say i understand how plasma happens all i want, but if i insist that i can make plasma with an unprepared marshmallow and a standard consumer microwave people are going to question whether or not i understand plasma.
> [{quoted}](name=Paroe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VPsEjPha,comment-id=000400000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-18T02:21:41.141+0000) > > Youve given me no indication you understand hit boxes despite saying you do is the thing. > Your entire argument hinges on "BUT IT MISSED" when clearly it didnt - hit boxes still collided. A quick google search provides several reasons why it connected, none of them being "THRESH HOOKBOX TO BIG RITO". > You know what those reasons are? > 1) Vayne hitbox is larger than it should be in comparison to model size > 2) Tumble hit box might not move until vayne completes the tumble > ( Vaynes hit box being larger than it should be is plausible. Tumbles hit box not moving with vayne is old, but also fairly probable although i wouldnt put stock in it.) > > I can say i understand how plasma happens all i want, but if i insist that i can make plasma with an unprepared marshmallow and a standard consumer microwave people are going to question whether or not i understand plasma. You have given me no proof that you understand hit boxes either in that regard. If you automatically distrust anything I have to say then why ask in the first place? I never said "it missed" I said multiple times it wasn't the fact that it just missed visually, it was the distance that it missed by that was my issue. Had my character been maybe 15-20 units to the right, it still would've missed visually, but I wouldn't be bringing it to the forums, due to my understanding of hit-boxes. My qualm was with the extent that it missed by, not just the fact that "it missed." And re-reading your post, I guess you assumed I was like a 5 year old? or what? (Idk if this is it, I kind of assume everyone is an idiot too, but I at least give them a chance, maybe you should try the same). I obviously see that it "technically collided with hit-box," or else it wouldn't of landed and I wouldn't of died a miserable death to Miss Fortune ult. And I will say, you very well may be right on that, it might be a matter of Vayne's tumble not properly registering her hit box's movement in sync with gameplay. It could also be that the specific soulstealer skin I was using had a faulty hit box. Or Vayne having an extremely large hit-box. Though it just seems odd that I can have over 2 million mastery points with Vayne on 3 different accounts and have never seen anything this absurd hit me. I realize that it could be one of many things, and in that light, I was wrong to immediately mention Thresh hook being the problem. I think I did it to relate to this post. But you are right in that regard, it probably isn't the Thresh hook that's the problem at all. But while I can't pinpoint the catalyst with the resources available to me, I can at least deduce that there is a problem. And that's all I really wanted to point out initially. I see you are a practical person, so let's take your analogy about plasma and actually apply it to this situation correctly. Lets say you have no idea what phosphor is or how a plasma affects it. Let's say you then buy a plasma screen TV, a month later you notice an image has left a "mark" commonly known as a "burn-in" or "screen burn." Did you really need an extensive knowledge of what plasma was or how it works, or how it reacts with the luminescent phosphor molecules in your TV to understand that something is wrong? Probably not, unless you were blind. Your analogy didn't work because I am simply stating there is a problem. Not claiming to know the solution. And also the word "understand" leaves a little room for ambiguity. I may not know how to code a game as complex as League of Legends, and therefore my understanding of hit-boxes is limited to an understanding of what they are and the basics of how they function (making a set of dimensions 2d or 3d and setting conditions based upon whether an ability enters those dimensions or not). But that doesn't mean I can't pinpoint an issue if I see one.
Paroe (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Anthony0603,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VPsEjPha,comment-id=000400000000,timestamp=2017-11-18T01:58:29.652+0000) > > OK HOLY CRAP. I feel like i'm arguing with a right or left wing extremist. Things are not so black and white. OBVIOUSLY.... im not saying "omg, it didn't look like it hit me, so it shouldn't of hit me." If you can quote me saying that or something like that, I will stop thinking you have clearly adopted the use of fallacies in your everyday arguments. Anyways idk how many different ways i can say that I CLEARLY understand that hit boxes are invisible and extend out slightly from the model of the character or ability. Should I say it again? or did you understand it that time? So... moving on... hopefully.... With that in mind, does that mean that if they extended the hit box out 4000 units so that you could hook someone in the dragon pit by throwing your hook at bottom t2 tower that would be ok. Because hit boxes extend out from the models and are not directly relative to the size of the visual you are seeing. OK im pretty sure we can both agree a definite NO on that one. That said, imagine that my argument is like that but on a reasonable level. The hit box from either the thresh hook, or my character model is clearly extending out TOO far from the model. You could fit an entire extra hook in between me and that hook that hit me. A hit box should not be 200% of the size of the visual. I think we can agree on that. or maybe. idk tbh after hearing some of your attempts at logical discussion. Ya know what. If you want to prove youre right, why dont you? Instead of insulting someone who doesnt agree with you. Go grab a script that shows you hit boxes. Do some tests with it. Prove your point. Because honestly - i dont know hit boxes (hidden information as it is). Google says that Vayne has a larger than average hit box and her tumble hit box only moves when it ends, but those are old posts so im not sure of their reliability.
> [{quoted}](name=Paroe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VPsEjPha,comment-id=0004000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-18T02:06:27.747+0000) > > Ya know what. > If you want to prove youre right, why dont you? Instead of insulting someone who doesnt agree with you. > Go grab a script that shows you hit boxes. Do some tests with it. Prove your point. Because honestly - i dont know hit boxes (hidden information as it is). Google says that Vayne has a larger than average hit box and her tumble hit box only moves when it ends, but those are old posts so im not sure of their reliability. No dude, it's just extremely frustrating when the opposing argument starts and ends with an insult to your intelligence each and every time. It does not encourage friendly discussion or debate and will generally constitute the exact response I have given you.
Paroe (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Anthony0603,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VPsEjPha,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2017-11-18T01:05:10.784+0000) > > Ah, I realize I didn't specify. The hook going down the middle of the lane is the hook the Thresh threw. That is an image of the exact frame that the hook is starting to disappear and reappear roughly 20-35 units to the left of where the hit-box should've ended. My character was clearly WAYYY outside the hitbox, even to the standards of OP's second image. I could go into paint and draw a little square around it like OP did and it would maybe be more clear how far away from the actual hook I was when I was hit by it. You still dont seem to understand the concept of hit boxes. Collision works on everything that collides... Including champions. The collision box of the hook nicked the collision box of the karma, which results in a successful hook. Your situation is not one of "hitbox to big rito!" its one of collision boxes being JUST wide enough to make the models look like they dont hit. Keyword there; the MODELS were far enough away that in your mind it was "close but safe" - the hit boxes, invisible as they are, were JUST close enough that they touched.
> [{quoted}](name=Paroe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VPsEjPha,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-18T01:21:00.093+0000) > > You still dont seem to understand the concept of hit boxes. > Collision works on everything that collides... Including champions. The collision box of the hook nicked the collision box of the karma, which results in a successful hook. > Your situation is not one of "hitbox to big rito!" its one of collision boxes being JUST wide enough to make the models look like they dont hit. Keyword there; the MODELS were far enough away that in your mind it was "close but safe" - the hit boxes, invisible as they are, were JUST close enough that they touched. I understand exactly what you are saying. I'm saying that first of all, I'm playing vayne. Not karma or gnar. Please don't tell me that I don't know how hit-boxes work. I understand exactly how hitboxes work, and I also understand that since i was actively moving in the opposite direction my hit-box probably registered a few units closer to that hook. But even with all that in mind, the distance between the character and the hook is absolutely too great. Just because "it is" doesn't mean "its right." Just because they were close enough that they touched doesn't mean that's a proper hit box. I don't really understand what you are even trying to argue anymore. That hit box, whether it is Vayne having a static hitbox shortly after tumbling, or thresh hook having too large a hit box, needs to be looked at. https://puu.sh/wQRrT/9727c2e921.jpg here is a similar picture posted a while ago when they reduced the hit box on lux ult. The character that got hit (can't tell who the character is) was roughly the same distance from that beam, that I am from the hook. And I'm sure you would've said the same thing "you dont understand blah blah, the invisible hit boxes connected blah blah" well yep you would've been right. The invisible hitboxes did connect, and ya know what, low and behold the invisible hitbox was too big. So again, idk what you are trying to argue, if anything you are helping me make my point.
Tentaku (EUNE)
: It won't happen. Ranking algorithm can be played around (i.e. it's super-easy to get S with rare shit, like AP Alistar top), so we wouldn't want it to affect players MMR. Also LoL is supposed to be a team game, including personal performance grade in MMR goes directly against that.
> [{quoted}](name=dont stop Niisan,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=cVbhZUWF,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-11-18T01:01:12.811+0000) > > It won't happen. Ranking algorithm can be played around (i.e. it's super-easy to get S with rare shit, like AP Alistar top), so we wouldn't want it to affect players MMR. Also LoL is supposed to be a team game, including personal performance grade in MMR goes directly against that. Damn, no you are absolutely right, this is something I hadn't considered off meta picks have a higher chance of ranking higher. Although, I didn't want this to affect a players MMR, just a slight increase or decrease in LP gains. MMR can still be related to win/loss. As far as it being a team game. I absolutely agree. Though, there are some factors to note. For instance, Faker's contract has him making MUCH more money than the rest of the members on SKT1. If the team aspect were all that mattered, why is he being rewarded for personal performance? Why are single players plucked out of challenger q's more often than full teams? Even in other sports similar concepts can be shown. Why are single players drafted for "team sports?" I'm not trying to say it should be a huge factor by any means. I believe what makes a player effective as an individual is a mixture of their personal play, and being able to implement their abilities in a team setting. I think what people forget is that a "team" is actually just a group of "individuals." If instead, you were to think of those individuals as numbers representing their impact on the game, then games could become a simple formula. say 10, 15, 15, 10, 45 (95) against 20, 25, 20, 25, 20 (110). In this scenario technically team two is the better "team." In your theory that's all that matters, though is that the fault of the player on team one who was clearly very talented and brought as much as they could to their team. Or is that the fault of matchmaking? I guess that's an entirely new discussion in itself really. But yea, your first point is really solid, and a very good point. That would be pretty tough to work around unless the algorithm was somehow updated to take that into account.
Paroe (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Anthony0603,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VPsEjPha,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2017-11-18T00:34:58.581+0000) > > So call me the gravedigger, but no one seems to care about my post on thresh broken hit-box. Idk if it was this bad back then, but to currently answer your question. it is neither. Take picture two, and multiply it by two. > http://s648.photobucket.com/user/chuvachuva603/media/Thresh%20Hook%202%20lol_1.png.html?sort=3&o=3 You dont seem to understand that it is, in fact, a BOX. Its not called a hitbox because it follows the model perfectly, its called a hitbox becuase theres a collision box around the model. In the image you just posted the Gnar would get hit because the corner of the hit box JUST nicked him. Its very important to have good collision boxes that are bigger (slightly) than the model, otherwise you run into the shen problem of it being extremely hard to land and requireing over compensation to use.
> [{quoted}](name=Paroe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VPsEjPha,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2017-11-18T00:40:33.829+0000) > > You dont seem to understand that it is, in fact, a BOX. > Its not called a hitbox because it follows the model perfectly, its called a hitbox becuase theres a collision box around the model. > > In the image you just posted the Gnar would get hit because the corner of the hit box JUST nicked him. > Its very important to have good collision boxes that are bigger (slightly) than the model, otherwise you run into the shen problem of it being extremely hard to land and requireing over compensation to use. Ah, I realize I didn't specify. The hook going down the middle of the lane is the hook the Thresh threw. That is an image of the exact frame that the hook is starting to disappear and reappear roughly 20-35 units to the left of where the hit-box should've ended. My character was clearly WAYYY outside the hitbox, even to the standards of OP's second image. I could go into paint and draw a little square around it like OP did and it would maybe be more clear how far away from the actual hook I was when I was hit by it.
Paroe (NA)
: An LP thread...? Why not an essence thread? LP protection for good play would definitely be nice but with the ultra snowball meta going on it would just make people ultra safe and turtle when behind.
> [{quoted}](name=Paroe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=cVbhZUWF,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-11-18T00:36:40.865+0000) > > An LP thread...? > Why not an essence thread? > > LP protection for good play would definitely be nice but with the ultra snowball meta going on it would just make people ultra safe and turtle when behind. Yea you are right, I should've named this thread something completely unrelated to league altogether or something about the new blue essence for more successful click-bait lol. Hmm that's an interesting thought, though is that a bad thing? What I see a lot of, is people losing their lane, giving up with the thought "I lost lane, the game is lost, I'm losing LP anyways" so they proceed to repeatedly die to their lane in frustration. They may have been right, and in the end they will lose the same amount of LP as if they had died once to lane, realized they were outmatched, farmed safely under tower and still lost game. If this system gives players an incentive to not tilt so hard in lane. And rather play hyper safe, farming under tower. Then so be it, I honestly wish more people would do that in a lost lane. And as far as the 5v5 scale of that, If you are down two inhibs. You can A) give up, and charge 1 by 1 into the enemy team handing them the game. B) Surrender. or C) Play ultra-safe, keep objectives warded as much as possible, and turtle. Option C is the only choice with a chance to lead to victory. So yea, you bring up a decent point, but I would argue that it's not really a bad thing.
: The Thresh hook. Which one is correct? Look at picture.
So call me the gravedigger, but no one seems to care about my post on thresh broken hit-box. Idk if it was this bad back then, but to currently answer your question. it is neither. Take picture two, and multiply it by two. http://s648.photobucket.com/user/chuvachuva603/media/Thresh%20Hook%202%20lol_1.png.html?sort=3&o=3
Rioter Comments
: Thresh Hook Hitbox (screenshots included)
I guess the boards are full of Thresh mains
: sadly muting your team is considered refusing to communicate and can get you reported as well... i agree 100% that riot needs to change the way they handle toxic behavior and the best way to do this IMO is to stop having a computer decide punishments and have a real person read chatlogs and issue punishments to the ones in the game that deserve it.. no point in punishing someone for being toxic in a game when their whole team is flaming them from the get go and than proceed to report them for something they said while not recieving any punishment for the things they said
> [{quoted}](name=Loki Naelos,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vgx9aNE5,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-11-16T22:35:09.317+0000) > > sadly muting your team is considered refusing to communicate and can get you reported as well... i agree 100% that riot needs to change the way they handle toxic behavior and the best way to do this IMO is to stop having a computer decide punishments and have a real person read chatlogs and issue punishments to the ones in the game that deserve it.. no point in punishing someone for being toxic in a game when their whole team is flaming them from the get go and than proceed to report them for something they said while not recieving any punishment for the things they said I'm pretty sure trolls/feeders have already expressed their lack of desire to communicate. And honestly this is a game, I don't log on league to teach angry spoiled 12 year old kids how to communicate properly. I do find it hard to believe that riot would give us a mute option then issue bans over using said mute button. I can maybe understand if someone was insta-muting their entire team at the beginning of every match, but that's not really what I'm talking about here. I'm saying that if someone says something offensive or undesirable, you hit the mute button and the problem is gone. If someone is feeding excessively, you hit your head against the wall for 15-30 minutes waiting for the punishment to be over. I'm saying one has a simple quick solution, while the other doesn't. And yea as someone else said, I think having a human read each and every report is a little unrealistic, though as an alternative I presented an idea in my above comment about allowing the computer to use your letter rankings after each match to possible auto-warning/auto-drop your rating.
Aterpater (EUNE)
: I think, one of the problems about this is, that you can easily filter verbal toxicity by automated processes. You just make a huge database with all the offensive phrases and words on many languages and when a guy is reported, jut check how many of these are in the chatlog and if it's enough, automatically apply some punishment. On the other hand, you can't do this with nonverbal toxic behaviour, especially that LoL players just report each other out of anger after every lost match without a real reason (imho it's silly...), like they were thinking it's a proper way to show somebody wasn't good enough to win the match for them or picked some champ what they just don't fancy. So, if it isn't some obvious 0/30/0 feeding or going afk (what is detected) you can't simply rely on the report but you have to go and watch the match to decide was it really toxic behaviour on purpose or somebody just simply bad at the game or had a bad day or made some silly decisions (what you shouldn't ban, obviously). And if you think about how many LoL matches are played in every hour, from the US to Estonia and from Sydney to the PC bangs of Korea, you can see that spectating every single report isn't an option. What's your idea, how should they filter these kind of toxicity without giving players a tool to just ban each other without real reasons?
> [{quoted}](name=Aterpater,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vgx9aNE5,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-11-16T22:27:59.535+0000) > > I think, one of the problems about this is, that you can easily filter verbal toxicity by automated processes. You just make a huge database with all the offensive phrases and words on many languages and when a guy is reported, jut check how many of these are in the chatlog and if it's enough, automatically apply some punishment. > On the other hand, you can't do this with nonverbal toxic behaviour, especially that LoL players just report each other out of anger after every lost match without a real reason (imho it's silly...), like they were thinking it's a proper way to show somebody wasn't good enough to win the match for them or picked some champ what they just don't fancy. So, if it isn't some obvious 0/30/0 feeding or going afk (what is detected) you can't simply rely on the report but you have to go and watch the match to decide was it really toxic behaviour on purpose or somebody just simply bad at the game or had a bad day or made some silly decisions (what you shouldn't ban, obviously). > And if you think about how many LoL matches are played in every hour, from the US to Estonia and from Sydney to the PC bangs of Korea, you can see that spectating every single report isn't an option. > > What's your idea, how should they filter these kind of toxicity without giving players a tool to just ban each other without real reasons? You bring up some really great points. We currently have a system where the game can give you a rating based on how you played. It takes things like skill shot hit percentage, farm, kda, etc. and mashes them up to give you a rating. If you score a D (I actually don't even know if D exists, never scored below C-), it should be a warning. With multiple warnings you could be demoted a full rank or something like that. Rather than "chat banning" just make their rank suffer. If they are consistently scoring less than C there is something wrong (trust me, the games I have got a C or C- I was either wasted drunk, or so ridiculously tilted that I probably shouldn't have been within 100 feet of a competitive game). Either they don't belong in the elo they are at, or they are trolling/feeding. Tanking their rating would help with either one. Also, having 6 tears in your inventory, or having not a single item in your inventory, should be an auto ban/lp drop. That's just one idea, I'm sure there are other possible solutions as well.
Rioter Comments
: Thresh Hook Hitbox (screenshots included)
Bump... I mean I know this is old news to a lot of us. But I still think it's an important issue...
: Most Fun Champions for Each Role?
top:{{champion:67}} mid{{champion:103}} {{champion:13}} jungle{{champion:67}} support{{champion:267}} {{champion:53}} bottom{{champion:67}}
: Riot would rather punish someone who said a bad word than afks and trolls. It's a fuckin joke.
> [{quoted}](name=Genocide Victim,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=5hxzjKMp,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-09-23T22:54:32.944+0000) > > Riot would rather punish someone who said a bad word than afks and trolls. It's a fuckin joke. This ^^ Just experienced it first hand.
: Ranked Flex+Reporting
@Kei143 I mean, based on responses I have gotten so far, I know what I did wrong. I used two curse words later in the match after I found out my team was basically teaming up on me, and said that it was bronze logic to completely troll your team based on the fact that someone chose to not ban anyone. So if the system works by seeing a report then searching for "key words" then yea, i can definitely understand where it came from. I don't expect the tribunal to sit and watch every game, but I do wish some context was taken. I should've just muted Diana immediately, and the rest of the team the moment I realized they were 4 grouped. And will be doing that in the future.
: Ranked Flex+Reporting
@NegativityLL @ZombieGerbil Both really good advice, that I think honestly deep down. I know. lol. Sometimes it just gets really frustrating, I've been doing really good lately, not gonna lie this game definitely got to me more than some others. But either way, muting and just playing seems like the best option. And @NegativityLL I actually didn't know there wasn't a mob rule on that, I'm really glad to hear that. So in future I will try to just shut up and take it then report them after game.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: Morellonomicon...
I've been off the forums for a while. The point is that grievous wounds itself should be something you go out of your way to buy as a counter pick. Not something that's provided on a core item. Yes, a lot of top laners were going Black Cleaver, except black cleaver provided a nice stat boost, and a little gradual armor shred, Which is beneficial no matter what team comp you are going against. You build Ardent Censer for the increased heals/shields and attack speed boost it provides, which is beneficial no matter what team comp you are going against. On the other hand, you build zhonya's for the ability to survive certain possibly unavoidable situations, based on the enemy team comp, (though it is core on a select few champs). You build warmogs if you have a large amount of health and are working more for map control, rather than constant 5v5 pushing, aka also based on the enemy team comp as well as your own. Then you look at morellos, you buy it for the AP and CDR. The fact that is has grievous wounds on it might or might not matter in your current matchup, but either way you are buying morellos. I feel like grievous wounds should be something you strategically build into based on matchup. Not something that's just handed to you in your core item.
Rioter Comments
Wolfbook (NA)
: Warmogs Armor, the SLEEPER OP ITEM.
yea... to all the people talking about "countering" this item. Yea just focus the guy with 5k health. Avoid the carries. It's basically the idea that they can continually apply map pressure. They can poke in and out of a fight and return full health without backing. They can hard tank a full fight then walk straight in to tank baron at full health. Part of the reason Riot took "mana potions" out of the game was to stop this kind of endless madness. To allow counterplay. But honestly there is no counterplay to warmogs, besides %health damage and even then, it requires focus on a champ you really shouldn't be focusing. It's a counterintuitive item. I'd be fine with a decent amount of regen, but to regen a LARGE % of max health is pretty ridiculous. Make it a flat amount and much less and it would still be useful. As it is, it is not healthy whatsoever.
: Can we make Tristana more engaging to play against please...
http://www.gamesoflegends.com/champion/stats.php?id=93&season=ALL&tournament=NA%20LCS%20Summer%202017 http://champion.gg/champion/Tristana/ADC http://champion.gg/champion/Vayne/ADC ill just leave those there. Tristana has a 70% win rate in LCS right now, as a hyper carry in games that average 30 minutes because LCS encourages LCS players to not drag games out more then necessary. She has an overall not bad win rate overall but notice how first of all her win rate has spiked massively within recent patches. Also notice how both Tristana and Vayne are "hyper carries" except Vaynes "win rate by match length" actually shows that she is a hyper carry. Tristana's "win rate by match length" literally is completely even across the board. Carries with an extremely strong late game like she and Vayne have, should suffer for it in the early game. And it just doesnt show based on statistics, as well as personal experience.
Rakahz (NA)
: Champion mastery rank 4 required for ranked?
yea idk about mastery lvl 4. maybe mastery lvl 1 or 2. But people should NOT be able to first time a champ in ranked, thats ridiculous. And goes into the category of "unlucky" elo loss. I'm absolutely ok losing games due to my team getting outplayed, but when i lose a game partially due to someone spending 20% of the game tabbed out looking up their build, the rest of the game feeding because they don't understand anything about the champ let alone the intricacies, such as certain lvl/item power spikes. I mean ranked SHOULD be taken a little seriously. I get it's just a game, but in a competitive environment when you have half the players with a great desire to win, and the other half just playing whoever the heck they feel like treating ranked no different then they would a normal, I think that breeds a lot of really avoidable toxicity. And I get there is a PBE and all, but is it really too much to ask a player to prove their worth on a new champion with a few normal matches. I see so many wasted bans on new champs just so THEIR OWN TEAM won't play them. And this already creates a toxic environment. Someone got their champ banned, and some teammates already assume the guy is a troll because they wanted to play the new champ in ranked an hour and a half after release. And to one other persons comment about trading, have trading be something specified during ban phase, it would then allow you to pick from the other players pool of champions, and then allow them to pick from yours. then it would auto trade once pick phase is over. A really simple fix, that honestly solves another problem of "afk i forgot to trade" as well as many times riot has said they like trading as a "tactical" option available. But needing to "own" the champs takes away a lot of that, so often the first/last picks dont have each others champs and it takes away that "tactical" option. So allowing a trade to be specified in ban phase, and choosing from each others champ pools would also solve this problem as well, making trading an actual "tactical" option, as it is meant to be.
: She's not that safe. her jump has a delay on it to which you can stop her jump with a knock back or movement displacement. A lot of champs can stop that and it's not entirely impossible to do it albeit not that easy either. But you see this happen often enough in higher rank that Trist just isn't a great pick unless you have the team that can peel and commit to peeling you. Whereas champs like MF doesn't necessarily rely on the strength of her support early as much as Trist does. MF can bully the lane with just about any champion though a support that can keep targets in place for MF's ult is ideal. Trist on the other hand is treated like a typical hyper carry. Her early game is weak; if your ADC is trading 1v1, where is the support and why is the support not engaging against Trist? Trist has an extremly weak early game in that she loses to a lot of lane bullies throughout early and mid game. And if she did indeed lose out like she was supposed to early and mid, that means the opposing ADC is pretty big and has delayed/denied the threat of Trist's late power. Realistically though Trist gets a power spike at 6.
> [{quoted}](name=Eevee In A Jar,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vxn9REzt,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-07-11T20:01:58.330+0000) > > She's not that safe. her jump has a delay on it to which you can stop her jump with a knock back or movement displacement. A lot of champs can stop that and it's not entirely impossible to do it albeit not that easy either. But you see this happen often enough in higher rank that Trist just isn't a great pick unless you have the team that can peel and commit to peeling you. Whereas champs like MF doesn't necessarily rely on the strength of her support early as much as Trist does. MF can bully the lane with just about any champion though a support that can keep targets in place for MF's ult is ideal. Trist on the other hand is treated like a typical hyper carry. Her early game is weak; if your ADC is trading 1v1, where is the support and why is the support not engaging against Trist? Trist has an extremly weak early game in that she loses to a lot of lane bullies throughout early and mid game. And if she did indeed lose out like she was supposed to early and mid, that means the opposing ADC is pretty big and has delayed/denied the threat of Trist's late power. Realistically though Trist gets a power spike at 6. I mean, if you look at LCS statistics, Tristana has is tied for the lowest average deaths for any champion. I mean that alone for a HYPER CARRY. Should be enough to prove a point that she is a ridiculously safe champion to play. Granted, yes every adc needs some sort of peels to be useful. Go through the entire list of champions, and name one champion that has a longer jump then Tristana. Zac, and he has to stop in place to charge it up. I guess you could consider WW ult a jump too but thats an ultimate. She has one of the longest jumps in game. She doesn't rely on her support as much as you say, she doesnt even have to use abilities to destroy entire waves, being able to save a single target point and click to outrade most early game lane bullies. If any other adc wants to clear as fast as Tristana they have to burn mana and use abilities to clear the wave, therefore there's a tradeoff, not only do they burn mana, but they burn cd's allowing for counterplay. Trist on the other hand can save all her cd's while still obliterating waves.
meowwow7 (NA)
: i hate to sound like a stickler but you picked vayne in that match against trist. grant both of you are late game champs but she has better objective control while you have better dueling potential but since her passive grants her range per a level you have to shut her down earlier. in this case though since you didn't have a pick champ that singles out enemies for your team you couldn't destroy her during the team fight, and she had an ori with her if she did jump into your team ori would have just ulted from her
> [{quoted}](name=meowwow7,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vxn9REzt,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-07-11T20:11:39.127+0000) > > i hate to sound like a stickler but you picked vayne in that match against trist. grant both of you are late game champs but she has better objective control while you have better dueling potential but since her passive grants her range per a level you have to shut her down earlier. in this case though since you didn't have a pick champ that singles out enemies for your team you couldn't destroy her during the team fight, and she had an ori with her if she did jump into your team ori would have just ulted from her thats the thing though, as a duelist, I can outplay people like caitlyn, varus, mf, jhin, ashe by avoiding their damage while putting out damage of my own. With trist, you cant do that because she just points and clicks. It just seems like an impossible matchup. I main Vayne, and I would much rather go against a Draven, or a Caitlyn, or any of her other hard counters. I can at least avoid dying to Draven, and know i outscale him, and I know his only way to get to me is either flash or a movespeed boost. Caitlyn, i just survive lane and farm best i can because i outscale. Trist wins lane, wins teamfights, and i can never 1v1 her, she outpushes, outharrasses, out ranges, outscales. The only thing she lacks is consistent mobility, that's where Vayne beats her, except that's a useless advantage when Trist is all point and click.
Rioter Comments
: Caitlyn Discussion: Annoying or Overpowered?
I would like to say. Name one ADC that doesn't have these weaknesses? Syndra/lux/zed one shot all adcs. Caitlyn, along with few other adcs actually have a dash to avoid the initial lockdown though. Every adc can be shut down in lane. Shut down a draven and watch him tilt to oblivion. Shut down a vayne and watch her shoot wet noodles at your team getting one shot repeatedly before she even catches a glimpse of late game. Caitlyn gets outscaled by maybe... 3 adcs. Vayne, Tristana, and Twitch. She happens to be a hard lane counter to all 3. So a good caitlyn will avoid being outscaled by just stomping lane. Her net cd... it's a gap closer/escape tool/cc/burst. The fact its cd is that low is crazy enough as is. Play ANY single adc in the entirety of league and lemme know how you feel about cc lock... caitlyn can trap, net to peel for herself unlike many other adcs. But at the end of the day, cc will shut any squishy adc down. Runs out of mana quickly... I mean... barely. as long as you aren't spamming rank 1 peacemakers you should be fine, her base regen is pretty nice and her traps cost next to nothing. That said, take any adc that has poke mechanics and we could say the same thing. Heck if i spam auto/tumble/condemn combo with vayne in lane ill run outta mana too. Caitlyn is one of the few ADC's who can do well vs sustain lanes. She has the tools to auto attack poke without receiving any punishment. Take a shorter range carry that has to trade damage and watch it get healed back up. Caitlyn can give damage without trading it, so even if it gets healed up she hasn't really lost anything. She actually deals really well with sustain lanes compared to other adcs. Not to mention she has one of the highest burst combos of any adc if you land your full combo. Pair that with a support that has cc, and no amount of healing is really gonna matter... Hmm she has 3 traps at rank 1 spell 5 at max rank, a net, possible cleanse/qss, flash, heal. just as many safety tools if not more then the next adc. I'm pretty sure you engage a varus without a flash and he's going to cry, since that happens to be his ONLY safety tool. I feel these aren't even Caitlyn specific weaknesses, let alone weaknesses at all. If I had to name a weakness for Cait, I'd say its tanks. Caitlyn is inherently reliant on burst and crits. when a lot of defenses are built, her strengths become less effective. It's one of the main reasons I don't play much Caitlyn. You can stomp lane, then spend 3 hours (obviously exaggerating) trying to kill their front line. Even that though, isnt a complete weakness, because of her range she is able to stay far enough back while still whittling those tanks down. Making her extremely hard to punish in teamfights if she is on her game. I think it should go back to Caitlyn having to lay a single trap. or... mayyyybe 2. But having 5 traps lined across the front of your turret as she sieges away from an already difficult distance to reach, its just not right. No other adc can control an entire lane like that. Jhin has to ult to do it, and even then he has to be aware of his positioning and aim his abilities. She is pretty broken right now and is perma banned from me, she isn't fun to play against whatsoever. I've missed enough farm just trying to weave my way in and out of her trap minefield, praying to the autopathing gods that it lets me walk "in between" minions instead of around them. Take away her peacemaker or something, make her give up waveclear for being able to control your position in wave or something. Make it like a skill shot single target snipe, same range as peacemaker but that can't go through minions. She could still hit you with it in traps, still snipe you with it over walls, but it would give SOME room for counterplay rather then dancing through minions praying for autopathing to bless you hoping your support brought 8000 potions to eat the traps for you. She is not in a healthy spot right now at all, and I can't wait til I can actually focus my bans back on backline divers/cc gods rather then wasting it on a Caitlyn that shouldnt be as strong as she is.
: http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/2304176872/233464453?tab=overview This can't be normal. I went 24/5/14, 179 CS, Most gold earned. 15 wards placed, 12 killstreak and got an A+. However Annie got an S. Not an S-, an S.
I am going to just throw something out there. I may or may not be correct, but from looking at those stats. Your Vayne fed to hell. Annie, I'm assuming, was support. So it may be taking into account that Annie was still able to have a really solid game, even with a Vayne trying to ruin everyones day with that serious 14 death feed. Also if she hit a few good multi stuns with her ult/w that can definitely boost their chances for an S.
: How does one get S rank?
OP says he got the question answered, though doesn't specify. So idk. But I will add a few of my own thoughts. Just recently had a Varus game where I went 10/9/17 and got an S-. Now just looking at KDA, that game was pretty bad. I myself wondered how I got an S at all for that game. I then had a Vayne game where I went 9/1/12 I got an A+ for that one. That Vayne game, I had a couple just really lame condemns where the target would end up a unit or two from the wall. I may have hit a total of 2 condemns all game. My farm was pretty weak, 147 in a 21 minute game. and my one death was to a tower being overly aggressive. The Varus game, I hit every single ult, I missed maybe 2 Q's all game, my teamfight prescence was just about all it could be under the circumstances. And my deaths were to a freakin heavy heavy dive composition ignoring my whole team and diving me. Not to mention I had about 270 farm in 30 minutes. So those games (as well as many others I haven't listed here) tell me a few things. It takes into account your accuracy and use of your abilities. If you are blitzcrank and you go 3/0/20 but have a 12% hook accuracy, you probably won't get an S. It takes into account the effectiveness of your abilities I believe too, for instance as Sejuani, are you detonating your frozen targets? or just using abilities and running away. It absolutely takes into account your farm, more so for mid/top/adc. I "think" it takes into account "how" you died. Did you die to enemy dive tanks/assassins with your whole team surrounding you unable to peel? Or are you dying by yourself extended with no wards trying to kill enemy gromp? I think "key" stats also play a factor. For assassins kills/assists would be important, not as much OVERALL damage, but if they were bursting right targets. For adc overall damage and farm are two biggest factors. For support its deaths, gold per minute, ability accuracy. Mid, ability accuracy and farm. Tank, damage taken, ability accuracy, %kill participation. Lastly but definitely not least, I believe that the overall average for game plays a part. Let's take a bronze game for example. One guy might have 35 farm by 20 minutes, the other guy has 60. The guy with 60 farm at 20 minutes has 9 deaths, and is the lowest deaths on his team by a large margin. While in a game with normal people, 60 cs and 9 deaths at 20 minutes is gonna guarantee you DONT get an S. In this case though, this person is actually likely got get an S because for their level of play, they are playing "above average". While some aspects of the system seem somewhat flawed (it's hard to account for feeders, afks, and trolls) , when truly thinking about all the games I have gotten S I feel they were deserved in some way or another. All the games where I didn't get S, there was a valid reason for it. Maybe my farm was slacking slightly, maybe I played teamfights a little too scared, maybe I got caught in dumb positions.
: Whats the point of 10 placement matches?
Placement games in general are pointless. I've seen people go 1-9 in placements and get placed in gold. On the other side of the spectrum I've seen people go 8-2 in placements and get placed in bronze. Point being, you are already placed within one or two tiers within a ranking before you even start your placements. So it absolutely is a waste of time. It's to create an illusion that you have some say in where you get placed. When truly those 10 games mean literally nothing. If someone's mmr was around silver 3. if they went 8-2 they might get placed silver 2 or 1. If they go 2-8 they might get placed silver 4 or silver 5... big fucking whoop. It's a broken system, especially since most people have to go through a bit of a learning curve before they start figuring the game out. I literally make alt accounts often on games like these because first account I'm learning game so my mmr is lower, second account I always place higher and save myself the pain and struggle of trying to climb out of hell. It would be nice if we didn't have to exploit a broken system. edit: I realize i committed one of my pet peeves here, stated a problem without even attempting a solution. Soooo. How about just making everyone start in bronze 5 and climb up. Cuz lets be honest here. I'm not the only one who does some off the wall stuff in normals... AP varus, AD lulu, Vayne top, etc. stuff I wouldn't do in ranked. That should have no effect on my mmr whatsoever. I think normals is the place you should be able to do stuff like that without fear of tanking your mmr. But as it stands, you almost have to take normals as serious as you do ranked, which doesn't help the already toxic as is environment that mobas can create.
: Jesus fuck this was posted 2 years ago... how did you even comment on this lol
Lol, I guess some issues never die :P didn't even notice it was 2 years ago, that's crazy haha
Rioter Comments
: Maybe you shouldn't post angry, accusatory posts if you don't understand the system. MMR is an an "Elo-like" rating system. These types of rating systems require that ranking gains and losses be balanced -- for one person to go up in rank, someone else has to go down. Consider a game where a 4v5 team wins (or where a player is absent for a while, then comes back and they manage to win). The losing team loses MMR, the winning team gains MMR. If the player who left *also* loses MMR, then 6 players lost rating and only 4 gained rating. Over time this would "deflate" ratings, which causes all kinds of weird problems with the Ranked ladder.
> [{quoted}](name=Matthias9119,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wsAuQlXx,comment-id=00090000,timestamp=2015-03-05T05:10:55.407+0000) > > Consider a game where a 4v5 team wins (or where a player is absent for a while, then comes back and they manage to win). The losing team loses MMR, the winning team gains MMR. If the player who left *also* loses MMR, then 6 players lost rating and only 4 gained rating. Over time this would "deflate" ratings, which causes all kinds of weird problems with the Ranked ladder. http://www.leagueofgraphs.com/rankings/rank-distribution... ok then so the fact that 60-70% of all playerbase is already in the lowest rankings makes me question where you people believe these players are going to deflate to? (I get this issue has been somewhat resolved, im just wondering where this broken logic is coming from)
gremgar (NA)
: maokai support broken what the **** was the balance team thinking?
It's not the damage that makes him scary... I mean, yea that's broken too. I do believe building damage, someone should do damage, that's absolutely fair. But being a tank to begin with should mean lower base damage. But, like I said, its not the damage that makes him broken. It's the mixture. Generally, champions have weaknesses. Like, sona is absolutely annoying, but she is easily blown up. For her to make any real "offensive" impact, she has to put herself relatively close to other champions, and therefore there is some sort of risk reward. Zyra is same thing, very squishy and not a "huge" range on her abilities, so she has to think of when and where to use them. With Maokai, there is no such questions to ask yourself. Your super saplings can do about 50% of an adc's health with one damage item. And the speed the saplings travel is ridiculous, without boots, you aren't really getting away from one unless you kite it through your minions. which means... you are gonna be pushed under your tower consistently. which also means more time to setup bushes with more saplings. Sure I guess a gank could work. But if a gank is literally the only counter to a champion I'd say that's a little messed up. When I think of other tanks, they have actual mechanics to performing. Sion has to hit a minion back into someone to slow them, then aim and charge an ability to stun them, and if he misses he can be punished. Braum has to be within adc auto range to get his slow off, and he has to aim it, if missed can be punished. Leona has to aim half of her abilities, 3/4 if you count her shield detonation positioning, and if those miss or don't finish the job, she can be easily punished. Maokai has the tankiness and engage of a leona, with the poke of a zyra. So a good portion of his damage cant even be traded, against a decent adc you will lose every 2v2 against them because maokai has more cc then 4 tanks put together, and the ability to zone you without even putting himself in a dangerous position. If he does decide its time to engage though. He has a snare the size of a lane, a targetted snare which can then be combod with a knockback into a slow. There isnt a single one of maokai's moves that doesnt cc. Add onto that the fact that he can put out insane amounts of damage. It's not balanced. Look at Lissandra for instance. She is even a MAGE not a tank, so it makes this even more relevant. Lissandra has a boatload of cc, therefore she has to have lower base damage on her abilities to make up for her utility. They figured that out real quick after that short period where she was OP. (tbh its sad it even had to happen in the first place i feel like this is common sense game design). Anyways I will just leave you with this http://champion.gg/champion/Maokai/Support clearly people are catching on to this trend. So before you downvote me, go downvote all these people exploiting the broken nature of the changes in most recent patch.
: Zed's laning phase has to be good, it's a compensation for having a shit tier mid game and late game due to his teamfight presence being weak if the enemy has a QSS and zhonyas on the same team. Also I play talon, he doesn't run out of mana that fast; it's pretty manageable.
Yea holy crap, where did this comment come from. Though I will say this is all common sense. I'm still proud of you for not filling this entire post with condescending nonsense to make yourself look like a troubled 12 year old emo girl. I truly am proud of you for trying to use actual reasoning and conversation. Good job kid, you are learning... maybe.
: > [{quoted}](name=MLDzXnRRR,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=W3VEtLqd,comment-id=0000000100000001000000000000,timestamp=2015-08-16T07:59:02.058+0000) > > Talon can't kill tanks. Zed kills everything that moves on the map. Talon kills towers slower. Talon gets screwed by pink wards. Talon gets screwed by Warmog - he doesn't get BORK and the bonus hp gives you enough hp to survive the burst combo (unless he is overfed). Talon has shitty laning. Yes he can, Zed might be slightly better at killing tanks, but both of them can, but that doesn't even matter, since their job is to assassinate carries first. Talon is better than Zed. Talon doesn't have shitty laning. Talon kills turrets faster than Zed. You are clueless, I play both of them at high elo diamond.
Just saying I hope you get hit by a bus. "yes he can" "Talon is" "Talon doesnt" "Talon kills" "You are" "I play" wtf you want someone to refute your ideas. If you truly believe that you are right, simply because you are diamond, then there's no reason for anyone to refute anything. So literally a challenger player could come in here and say that neither one is better and you should just play league in your underwear. Boom problem solved. As long as he tells me he's challenger, he must be strong, intelligent, and competent. He also must know the secrets to the universe, he has transcended humanity, and reached something much greater....... Soooo, if all you wanna do is tell people your rating and that you are right, find a wall or another inanimate object, I'm sure they won't argue with your lack of logic.
: > [{quoted}](name=ApexlnTheCircle,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=W3VEtLqd,comment-id=000000010000000100000003000100000000,timestamp=2015-08-16T09:34:00.707+0000) > > And here I thought your ego was only attached to this game. Sounds to me like you're just a terrible person with minimal friends and some superiority complex because "MA DIAMOND ELO LOL LOOK AT MA E-PEEN TIS BIGGER THAN YOURS HERPA A DUR" You may be a good player but you're a shitty person. To bad for you, that being plat 1 doesn't net you shit in the real world bud. > > > Have fun listening to nickel-back and kicking puppies mister plat 1 super star. What does real life have to do with League of Legends? You are on a boards for League of Legends, not real life. I don't care about what fools think of me, I only befriend the strong, intelligent and competent, the weak disgust me.
"What does real life have to do with league of legends?" Then goes on to say "I only befriend the strong, intelligent, and competent". So logically lets get this straight, how can you measure strength, intelligence, or competence simply by looking at someones rating? or does league of legends and life actually coincide? Idk, but one thing is for sure, the weak disgust me as well. And I have spent literally the past 30 minutes replying to your sad comments because of how disgusted your weakness and incompetence has made me.
: I was typing to something else, but I got something else you can reply to. I will also go back and read your other statements on Talon as an extra way to show I'm willing to talk to you man to man. I'll be Roughly ~8 mins
You can't talk to a child, man-to-man. I'm sure this ended well...
: Are you going to refute my statement and arguments regarding why Talon is better than Zed or are you going to keep spamming nonsense? I don't care about your opinion about me, you are not my equal. I told you, I only befriend and care about the opinions of the strong, intelligent and competent. Your rank reflects that you are neither when it comes to this game.
Lol the issue here is you are comparing in game efficiency to this strong, intelligent, competent idea. Being one, does not mean you possess the other. Literally, look at yourself, you may be decent at league, but you are clearly not strong, intelligent, or competent. But you are good at a game, so keep jacking your dick and claiming that that makes you "better" then others. It's actually quite funny. Because that point in itself proves your incompetence, trying to compare two completely unrelated things like that.
: > [{quoted}](name=ApexlnTheCircle,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=W3VEtLqd,comment-id=00000001000000010000000300000000000100000000,timestamp=2015-08-16T09:26:04.960+0000) > > Having a competitive attitude and being a total dick is 2 completely different things. And I don't play ranked for the reason I stated, plus it's a huge waste of time IMO because you'll never be in a professional team nor will you make money int he e-sports scene. the only thing ranked play does is breed this piss-poor Holier-than-thou attitude that you obviously seem to possess. And you kept saying you're high diamond elo but your lolking says you're plat-1. Sounds to me like you need to either relearn your colors or stop having delusions of grandeur. 1. Saying facts isn't being a dick, saying I am better than you and know more about you when it comes to Talon and Zed, isn't being a dick, it is a fact. 2. You looked me up but didn't notice the winrate and KDA and that this is an obvious smurf account, which shows just how clueless you are when it comes to this game.
Feeds like shit, claims to be a smurf trying to move down. Hey i've actually done that one before. I was really really drunk, and my excuse for playing so bad, was that I was a smurf trying to lose rating. Which shows just how clueless you are on common sense. That's not a smurf, you just like to jack your dick and have people clap for you. When truth is, no one actually gives a shit. Most people with this common sense that you claim to have (for some reason, not sure where you get the idea you have any effectiveness whatsoever in this field) can see right through your transparent bull shit.
: > [{quoted}](name=ApexlnTheCircle,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=W3VEtLqd,comment-id=000000010000000100000003000000000001,timestamp=2015-08-16T08:55:51.936+0000) > > Wow that superiority complex though. For one I don't ranked because I find it droll since it breeds the exact attitude you have. > secondly just because someone doesn't play ranked doesn't mean they don't have a main. Talon is my 2nd highest played champion, followed in first closely by Anivia. I've mained Talon since season 3 when I first picked him up as a curiosity. And lastly your attitude leaves alot to be desired, the fact of the matter still stands Zed's lane phase does not mimic that of the rest of the assassin champion pool. His ability to completely play it safe and stay in lane as long as he wants is a problem and has been a problem rather you like it or not. You don't like competitive attitude and competition because you know you get rekt by players better than you. There is no superiority complex, it is a fact that I am better than you at this game. You play Talon since season 3 and you still don't know what you are talking about, lol. I don't care what you have to say about Zed and his laning phase, I have a problem with nonsense, you said Zed is better than Talon and that is not true, at the moment, Talon is the stronger Assassin. Want do a 1v1? I'll play Talon and you play Zed, show me how OP Zed is :^)
Should I post your talon and zed records again? you seem to have gotten nothing but wrekt in 2015 and then last 2 games you go 8/19/3 then 1/7/3. Looks like you got wrekt so bad you cried home to mommy and quit the game... Anyways, glad to have blatant hypocrites like you in this world to talk shit to. Really makes my life more interesting being able to point out how stupid you really are. You just make it so easy...
: > [{quoted}](name=ApexlnTheCircle,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=W3VEtLqd,comment-id=0000000100000001000000030000,timestamp=2015-08-16T08:04:09.471+0000) > > Btw I'll have you know I didn't downvote you, but if you want to continue being a dick and bringing personal attacks into this by all means child go ahead. And just because I haven't played any of them in the past 10 games doesn't mean I don't play them at all. but I guess asking you to use your brain under any circumstances is fruitless. Not being a dick, I am being realistic. This is reality: 1. You don't play Talon and Zed in ranked, I DO. 2. You don't play Talon and Zed as your main champs, I DO. 3. You are silver 3, I am high elo diamond. 4. You don't know what you are talking about when it comes to Talon and Zed, I DO. When I say Talon is better than Zed, my statement has more value than yours, because it comes with experience and data and mastery over these champions, at least a lot more relative to what you have.
WELLL, since we are all about bringing other people down to make our own points. I guess this is your supposed "non fallacious" way of arguing. Your recent games of 1/7/3 Talon 8/19/3 Talon 3/10/1 Talon 3/6/3 Talon 7/14/6 Talon And here's one looks like you got carried. 10/10/9 Talon hey you almost went positive. Good thing we have a Talon master here to teach us what kind of balancing these champions need. Thanks for your time, experience, and expertise. Now proceed to kill yourself and rid us of your lack of common sense and overly large ego to make that lack of common sense so clear to all those around you.
: Competent Talon and Zed players farm with auto attacks and save their abilities for possible poke. As for safety, what does safety have to do with who is the better Assassin? If safety is what defines an Assassin, then Xerath and Varus are amazing Assassins. No, what matters is Assassination potential. Talon has faster damage, more reliable damage and better AoE damage. Zed is weaker in all those 3 things, but he has more safety than Talon. Is that safety that effective? It used to be pretty good, but they nerfed his W speed and put a 1 sec delay on R swap, the current "safety" Zed has, doesn't matter much. I'd rather get 1-2 kills when I engage with Talon and actually Assassinate my kill target and add some AoE damage to other targets and let my team clean up, even if I die in the process, instead of going in with Zed, failing to assassinate anything and swapping out with R saying "well atleast I got away!". Now, both champions can Assassinate effectively when FED, but in normal circumstances, Talon has stronger Assassination potential. Zed **was** the overal stronger champion, because he had more versatility than Talon. His previous safety, before the W speed and R swap delay nerfs, was good and paired with his splitpushing ability before they nerfed his Attack Speed, made him stronger. But now? He can't team fight and he can't splitpush effectively. Talon can team fight better, assassinate better and his splitpushing is some what equal to that of zed (better damage and faster turret destroying than zed, but can't escape like Zed if collapsed on). If they give back Zed his attack speed and his instant R swap, I will agree that Zed is the stronger champion and that his less effective Assassination potential is outshined by the other bonuses he has. But that is not the case currently, so Talon is the better Assassin.
HAHAHAHAH i love this because you literally just came full circle to the opinions you were fighting so hard against. scroll up and see how everything you say in this post was said by the other guy you were talking to. These points back then were called "hurr durr" so. "hurr durr" yourself to retardation. Holy shit you are dumb. Talon has a better teamfight, zed is more about getting picks. Next you are gonna start talking about shacos teamfight. oh wait, he's more of a split pusher, and small skirmish picks assassin. Oh wait... holy crap, so different champions serve different purposes? Not every champion is the exact same??? Wait, what is this black magic?
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Anthony0603

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