: Currently, Shen is in the worst state that he's been post-rework since launch. The idea is to keep him balanced around pro play. His post rework kit is centered around teamwork and coordination with nerfs to his solo laning. Creating a very lackluster experience when playing him top. Early levels in his q is still insufficient to farm under tower, the idea of his empowered Q autos is a neat mechanic the problem with it is having to constantly reposition it to make use of it which leads to being at risk of being out of position, you can be punished by the enemy top laner as well as getting caught by the enemy jungler trying to reposition your sword. With his high Q cooldown early game you have to either use it to trade with an enemy laner when they go in for harass or use it to kill minions to farm effectively due to Shen's low base damage. This ability currently suffers from very low reward for what it's supposed to do. Shen in the top lane, suffers from many bad match ups usually resulting in him getting shoved under tower. Leaving Shen to scrap up what he can and wait until 6 to make a play elsewhere on the map. The problem with this, due to the current meta of tower plating, the enemy top laner will just take free plates resulting in Shen being even further behind. His W, is very powerful when going for an Ult play to save an ally, and comes in handy to mitigate damage in a team fight, again in Solo queue the lack of coordination can cause this ability to not be used to its greatest potential but has a ridiculously long cooldown as well. His E has always been extremely satisfying to use, landing a taunt on multiple people can change the fight entirely, but also has a long cooldown. His ult has been standard, nerfed at times, but a lower cooldown teleport at 3 minutes and 20 seconds at level 6, and 2 minutes and 40 seconds at level 16. Pre-rework Shen was ultimately more satisfying to use. his in lane sustain with vorpal blades, the on hit heal, as well as his old passive ki strike which made shen a decent duelist as he built more health. The most important thing that made pre-rework Shen enjoying to play was his build diversity, ranging from Tank, bruiser, on-hit, as well as Ap off-tank. As opposed to current Shen's cookie cutter build Tiamat/Sunfire, and the non-AD ratios make building any sort of AD useless on Shen. Shen is supposed to be Zed's counterpart; a kickass ninja fighting in the name of balance, his current abilities doesn't fit that thematic. It's to the point where playing Shen is a constant frustration, he's just not fun to play in his current state. Shen is considered a tank but with one of the lowest base tank stats in the game, even below some mages and marksman. Shen is a champion that relies on two items because his wave clear is one of the worst, if not the worst clears in the game. Tiamat and sunfire. His Q damage to minion is so low that he has to pre hit minions under tower. The Shen community has been struggling playing this champion with a dropping winrate. We'd love to have a small sejuani/ezreal rework treatment done to his kit, or at the very least number changes like CD reductions or swapping out those useless AP ratios that shen never builds AP for, into AD or HP scaling. I'm stuck playing Shen as support because he has better utility there. No worrying about farming or having 2x-3x longer ability cooldowns than most top laners. Copypasta from the Sad Shen Bois
Shen gets picked in pro-play sometimes for his ult, therefore he must be bad forever. Sorry!
Meddler (NA)
: Direction being kicked around yesterday was increased damage to dragons to buff her as a jungler in particular. Ongoing topic of discussion as to whether that was the best way to go or not for 9.2 though. I'll follow up on scaling off Elder Dragons taken, hadn't realized that wasn't already in, not immediately seeing any reason it shouldn't be regardless of what else we do.
Another dragon-specific buff? It seems to be a common sentiment among her playerbase that forcing her passive to revolve around Dragon essentially created a feast-or-famine situation for her ,where she could either take drags and snowball or get denied dragons and basically have no passive. Instead of trying to make her more one-dimensional, with a more narrow win-condition, why not give her a passive that has value in general? Something like doing additional damage to neutral _and_ enemy monsters, to encourage invades. Or bonus resistances that scale up the lower her health gets, to emphasize her roles as a duelist early game and a diver late-game? She could possibly ult the enemy team late game and _not_ instantly explode with something like that. Regardless, I don't get this fixation on balancing around just one objective. It makes her predictable and, by extension, binary.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 9
Ahhh yes. New season, new around-the-clock, back-to-back-to-back nerfs for Cassiopeia. When you guys gut her into unplayability this season, please do me a favor and just never buff her again. At least that way I won't get fooled into thinking that maybe this time it's okay for her to not be a troll-pick for anyone below challenger.
Gall (NA)
: Moving Brand from Support to the Midlane.
One of the biggest issues, that was left out, is that Brand also only has a single base ability that can go through the minion wave (his W). That means that his only reliable harass is also his only form of wave clear. With a 8 second CD and 100 mana cost at rank 5 that makes it pretty much impossible to keep up any lane pressure. He can't spam it without going oom and he's extremely vulnerable to all-ins or bad trades when it's on CD. The only way to make Brand viable mid would be to actually change the way his kit functions. As he's currently designed there are no number tweaks that could make him a viable pick outside of bot lane.
GripaAviara (EUNE)
: Can we stop please with "because high ELO" arguments and look at the bigger picture?
There is no sport in history that is balanced around the unskilled majority.
Blåsigt (NA)
: Katarina, um?
53% win rate, 5% play-rate. She's completely fine and requires zero attention from Riot beyond at best some minor quality of life touch ups to her animations and what-not. Easily the most successful project from the assassin rework.
Fízz v2 (EUW)
: >Fizz receiving beneficial reverts not imo, his kit is even shittier now and they just buffed his numbers until he was viable LUL Also I dont really understand kat mains tbh, they are actually begging for buffs as if Kat was completely unplayable. But her win rate is solid everywhere except in low elo, and there is even a Kat onetrick in Korean challenger.
Maybe you'd understand them if you actually took the time to read the post you're responding too. It explicitly addresses your point.
: I don't think "boring" champions are a problem or should be changed just because they're "boring".
You failed to provide any sort of argument whatsoever to support your assertion, and your statement is based on a false premise (that champions are reworked because they're "boring"). Trying to change your mind would therefore be a waste of time, as your understanding of the game is obviously emotion-based rather then logic-based. Gameplay+ can't come soon enough.
Vlada Cut (EUNE)
: > [{quoted}](name=Larriet,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=00dAaQeA,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-08-18T22:20:36.115+0000) > > Other than the "evolution" mechanic (which really doesn't do much, mechanically, on 2/3 of her abilities), Kai'Sa is very simple, too. > Aatrox is slightly weird, but is he really complex? His W is the strangest thing and it's not hard to understand. 1st off, Kai'Sa is medium in both skil and learning curve for a reason. Her spells evolve at any time in any order, so understand that part of her evolutionary passive is important. If you don't, you'll end up losinf because none of spells were evolved, or because you didn't focus on straight up evolving one spell but spread the evolving with multiple spells at knce with a little gold you had. Her W needs practise, even I still have free kills with it but miss because of minions blocking my way. Her ultimate is the most strategic spell in her kit, cast it on the wrong place and wrong time and you screw your teammates up completely. So, overall: **_"One Mistake is all it takes" - Kai'Sa_** Aatrox has a hard skill cealing but surpriaingly, easy learning curve(usually kits are easy-medium or medium-hard), his kit provides no mediocrity. At first you won't be even able to land your Q's, not even on minioms, you'd find his W useless, but as the time passes by you'll realize than two dashes aren't enough for 3 Q's, so you'd understand and learn how to Q W Q(E) Q E passive AA and melt enemy laner in a single rotatiom, the learn how to manage minion waves so you can sucessfully W them simce doesn't go through minions~~(which is BS since Illaoi's E can snipe you through them)~~, then you'd learn how to bit with the edges of youQ and center of you last Q since they critically strike, then learn WHEN to use your Q's, and of course, how to kite enemies out with Q E combo's and how to prolerly manage and use your ultimate. I'm telling you this as I'm a both {{champion:145}} and {{champion:266}} main. ~~I can teach you how to get guarantee'd 1st 3 melee minions evsry single time too.~~
Having gameplay elements to consider when playing does not make a champion difficult. Literally all champions have some gimmick(s) to their kits that you have to factor when playing them.
: Getting tired of seeing Brand every other game
7% play rate is "every other game"? Fiddle is played more bot then brand despite being nerfed recently lmao
: Scarra's thoughts on the current state of the game
: Katarina Nerfs - 2 long years.
52%wr on a 6% play rate is very strong. Riot, ignore these people. Katarina is fine.
: Unpopular Opinion: Revert Malzahar
Unpopular but better opinion: remove Malzahar His kit was bullshit to deal with before and it's bullshit to deal with now.
: I remember they hotfixed Aatrox and people complained only WEEKS after he was said to be directly touched via non-hotfix patch notes. He had around 40% winrate. Now he has 52-53% winrate, **highest being in mid.** I can't take this thread seriously.
Aatrox also has a >1% play rate mid. I can't take your grasp of statistics seriously.
: Akali has a 38% winrate mid
If god is real and merciful she'll stay at a 38%wr for the duration of the game's lifespan.
GigglesO (NA)
: We could just lower champion damage... it would make diving towers riskier, it would make make towers sturdier, it would make towers safer to be under. We would also decrease the anger of this one shot meta, while also making objectives like dragon and baron more contestable. (Almost) Everything that is being complained about can be solved with lowering damage. I’m not sure why we can’t just talk about this...
"We could just" Do you think that Riot can just press a button and all damage in the game is decreased by just the right amount to make champions still viable while doing "just enough" damage? Lowering damage across the board would he THEE most resource intensive change in the game's history. It would make the marksmen overhaul look like nothing.
BigFBear (EUW)
: I would like to see reducing damage in general (a bit) and making armor/MR viable again (by reducing true dmg for example). Not just buffing specific tanks. I mean, there are other champs who are played as dmg-soakers. Does it mean they can be shredded in seconds just because they aren't tanks per definition? I, for example, play Volibear (surprise!). I KNOW(!) he is not a tank per definition, more a Juggernaut, but i (and the majority of players) play him full tank. That means resolve tree and only tank items. Should we continue to be melted in seconds cause of 40% true damage in death recap?
Yes, because when Volly is even slightly good he becomes overbearing stat ball cancer, just like Udyr.
SirPurrr (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=FurorDivinus27,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=P4eh9Or5,comment-id=00b70000,timestamp=2018-08-04T03:11:13.961+0000) > > The power of LC$. Because they're good in competitive they are kept trash in casual play. You probably are not going to get an answer out of them on either one of them, Sejuani or Zac. It's not because they're good in LCS exactly. It's because champion balance has to be done for when someone plays that champion really well or what's the point? You balance for what that champion can be close to its maximum potential or the game would be super unfair and get worse and worse as you play better players.
If that were the case then they would balance around high plat and diamond as well, since those ELO's cover about the top 10% best players in the world. But they don't. Even champs who are sitting in 48% and below WRs in high ELO still get nerfed if they're too good in pro play.
: A lot of people are so upset about how this affects lane but they literally said a lot of this was jungle focused didn't they? You'd hardly be the first laner to get shoved into the jungle by balance changes. Graves, Taliyah, etc
What changes here do you see making Leona, Nautilus and Tahm junglers?
: Why are you guys forgetting about Shen still? All he's gotten are nerfs since his release and as someone who loves Shen I would be so happy so finally see a buff on him. Are you guys planning on reworking him again soon? Is that why he's consistently ignored? Or do you guys just hate him and throw darts at a board with his splash art taped to it? Please do mah boi justice :c
They aren't forgetting about Shen. Shen is deliberately kept weak in solo Q because he's insanely strong in professional play. Sucks I know but that's the reason. Riot balances around proplay.
: Tank changes for 8.16
Riot, I feel like you guys are setting Leona up to get Sejuani'd. She's already received several targeted nerfs to her early game between pre-season to now, AND you've nerfed support item income AND early game sustain (with the health pots reduction). Now you want to weaken her early game power even more in exchange for some slight scaling durability. I think this is a mistake and is relying too much on aftershock to keep her afloat in the early game. Not only are you running the risk of her being over-nerfed in the event that aftershock is changed, but it also seems to me that you aren't taking into consideration her kit and the overall state of the game. For one, I don't think "late game" exists enough in the current League climate for a champion with support income to afford enough armor items to make her W scaling matter; on average she doesn't even get a second armor item until 28 minutes into the game, according to Lolalytics. So with 100 base armor and a locket that's about 220 armor altogether when her W is up. That's 33 more bonus armor then she'd get in that situation right now. It's not bad, but it's not really great either. I would absolutely say that it's not worth nerfing her early game (again). Leona is fundamentally an early to mid-game champ, and slightly better durability later in the match isn't enough to make her a late-game champ, so I think it'd be best to either find a way to keep her early game intact while buffing her late game (I think the W CD change is a decent compromise) or just leave her as-is. At bare minimum can I just ask that we please not balance her around aftershock? I know it's the strongest keystone on her but, please.
Rexxiee (NA)
: How is quinn allowed to have the highest winrate in 3 different roles at the same time?
She has a >1% play-rate in two of those roles. Google "sample size", learn2statiatics.
: Summoner Spell "Fortify" Would Fit Into this Meta.
> [{quoted}](name=Best Fiddle,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3mB7GZwX,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-07-23T11:50:18.328+0000) > Doesn't that sound like it would fit into this meta quite well? No, as Riot specifically wants pro matches to be shorter, not longer. People forget that games being 20 minute snowballs where objectives fall like dominos is a feature, not a bug. You don't have to agree with it (I'm on the fence personally), but Riot has zero interest in making games longer and enabling more comebacks.
: Please Revert The Shield Changes
> [{quoted}](name=Breezey Boy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=t6Awse8X,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-07-21T20:06:52.358+0000) > > Ever since this nerf, Enchanters have significantly fallen in win rate, with many of them, not counting Sona, having the lowest win rates they've ever had. This is a good thing, not a bad thing. Enchanters are a blight on the game.
: Brand should have its base damage nerfed and its scalings buffed
There are two ways to spot a person who doesn't understand League game design: 1. "Make Brand a scaling champion! :D " 2. "Brand should go mid! :D " Brand can not function with high ratios/low base stats because his damage is too unsafe. He literally has the highest average deaths of all champs in the game, because late game he pops like a balloon while having no mobility and mediocre range (for a mage). His kit functions right now because he can bully marksmen and tank supports before they scale up. Brand can not function mid lane because his kit is shit for solo laning. He has a single ability that can trade through minions- it costs an assload of mana and is also his only decent wave clear. With below average wave clear, below average trading ability and zero sustain he's a free lane against mid-lane mages and assassins. His kit functions right now because he can bully marksmen and tank supports before they scale up. TL;DR- until Brand gets a gameplay UPDATE and his actual kit is changed Brand will never work as a mid laner or as a late game champion. I'd actually respect people more if they just outright suggested that his numbers be gutted and he be left in the trash until they give him an update- that's vindictive but at least logically consistent. Instead every 3 weeks we get a new "change Brand's numbers and put him mid!" thread and it's a clear case of people not understanding why champions go into the roles that they're in.
: Can we talk about Morgana's Shield??
ITT: durrr i hate context Shields were nerfed because they provided flat damage reduction. Black shield is useless against AD which makes it a situationally strong pick, versus normal shields that are universally useful in every scenario, even if they don't grant CC immunity.
: No Context on Why Syndra is Left in This State/Debunking ''Syndra being too Sensitive to Buffs''
When Syndra is good she's a lane bully that scales into a one-shot burst mage. She deserves to be shit until they can rework her abilities to be less oppressive in lane.
: > [{quoted}](name=Hayaishi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=o9Kfl3lE,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-07-12T22:28:58.863+0000) > > Just gut them both into the ground until they are reworked. > > Nobody should have to deal with this BS. > > Getting instagibbed before you blink shouldn't be a thing in season 8. This game has come to far for this to still be a thing. You literally have the worst opinion and it's an extremist one at that. Wukong is like garbage over diamond 5 and you want him nerfed yet he fails to preform in elos where better players reside. Let that sink in.
> [{quoted}](name=litterlyfe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=o9Kfl3lE,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2018-07-13T03:19:09.502+0000) > > You literally have the worst opinion and it's an extremist one at that. Wukong is like garbage over diamond 5 and you want him nerfed yet he fails to preform in elos where better players reside. Let that sink in. What do you have to gain from lying on the internet? Do you really think it woild be hard for someone to take 5 seconds out of their day to do a google search and prove you wrong? https://lolalytics.com/ranked/worldwide/diamond/plus/champion/MonkeyKing/master/
KnifeCat (OCE)
: Riot, brushing off the boards complaints is not a good idea.
Brushing off the board's complaints is perfectly valid because the boards never agree on anything. You think "this time is different" because you're biased and you have no self-awareness. The point of the boards is for people to complain and feel better about themselves after having done so. Riot has actual data to go off of for on-game decisions.
: Is the viewers experience more important than the players experience ?
Riot has said on more then one occasion that, yes, muh views in pro play is more important to them then the player base. Makes me glad the pro play scene is slowly dying, honestly. E-sports has destroyed every game its ever touched.
: So Rickle's Twitter changes amount to Nothing for Karma.
Literally nothing you're asking for can be accomplished with just numbers changes, which is all Riot can do right now with VGUs and new heroes taking up most of their resources. They've already stated that she's in line for a rework, so why are you whining? That she's receiving buffs at all is miraculous considering how absolutely bullshit her kit is to play against already.
: Just a reminder that the skill disparity in silver and gold is disgusting
All ELO' s below around mid-plat are basically the same.
: The meta is good* and can finally improve
It is still based around who has the better ADC, the list of playable ADCs just dropped from like 15 to 4. Anyone who says that there is a greater diversity in bot lane hasn't looked at statistics. There is no increased diversity, just increased troll-picks.
: Apply the same standards of "playability" to other lanes/roles. How many jungle tanks are playable? How many support enchanters? How many top lane battle mages? They all have only a handful of top tier representatives if any of them are even seen above 3% play rate at any given point.
> [{quoted}](name=Hemulen Magi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RqcldXMz,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-06-30T22:33:43.565+0000) > > Apply the same standards of "playability" to other lanes/roles. How many jungle tanks are playable? How many support enchanters? How many top lane battle mages? They all have only a handful of top tier representatives if any of them are even seen above 3% play rate at any given point. "Champion balance is shit in other pools so it should be shit in this one too!" lmao.
: Why do I feel like champions popularity affects balance ?
Because you're under the effect of something called "confirmation bias". There are a ton of champions who are hugely popular that have also been junk for long periods of time. Zed who is the most popular mid-laner was in the 46-48%wr bracket for almost a year. Lucian who was the #1 most played ADC has deliberately been kept in the dumpster since Worlds last year. Thresh who was the most picked support in the game has been underperforming for pretty much this entire year. The problem is that you're drawing your conclusions from your emotions and anecdotes like a fool instead of from data and trends like an intelligent person.
: Old Aatrox auto atacking and healing is unfun to play against...but mundo is fine?
Mundo is on the VGU list you clown. Obviously he isn't in an acceptable place for Riot.
: Gold funneling in 3v3
3v3 is a meme bonus mode that only exists because its not even worth the effort needed to remove it. Its fun sometimes, but also pain stakingly obvious that it means nothing in regards to Riot's gameplay decisions.
: > [{quoted}](name= Król Wilk Sam,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bN1UdvBa,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2018-06-24T19:28:24.080+0000) > > That quote before Runes Reforged, which combined the old Runes and Masteries system. > > Then, you got your pure stats from runes, while the mastery system was more effect based. > > Stop misleading people by posting something that has no relation to the current game state. no correlation? yes the quote was before runes reforged... how the hell does that make a difference? damage creep is absurd. as a player who uses the domination tree ON MY MAIN. it does NOT needs buffs. just because your a mod doesn't mean you have to kiss riots ass. damage NEEDS to be lowered.. there are no "IF's AND's or BUT's" it is TOO HIGH. and MOST of that damage creep is caused from the new masteries riot is calling "runes" the next worst perpetrator is the item damage creep and then "buffing" weaker champs to become as broken as everyone else. i like this game.. i have played it for 5 years. and i dont give a fuck about what anyone things of my posts what mods or riots think of my posts, DAMAGE IS TOO HIGH. riot NEEDS to know this. and as a mod you should care about making the game good and improving it, giving riot good info keeping the forums clean from trolls... not sucking riot off when they're making shit decisions, just because they picked you. i LOVE this game.. i do NOT want to stop playing it.. and i do NOT want riot to RUIN it or make it worse. i CARE about this game. and riot need CONSTRUCTIVE feedback. they NEED people to go out and say "no, DONT DO THAT!!! the idea is horrible!!!" and they need to see what is wrong and stop IMMEDIATELY.. not do the shit they did in season 6 with dynamic boost. your a MOD. give riot the feedback they NEED to IMPROVE the game and make it BETTER, stop sucking up to them every time they make a bad decision.
> [{quoted}](name=SwiftKitten88,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bN1UdvBa,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2018-06-24T19:40:07.561+0000) > damage creep is absurd. as a player who uses the domination tree ON MY MAIN. it does NOT needs buffs. "My gold 4 adventures hold more weight then the aggregate data of literally thousands of games!" Take your meds.
Rexxiee (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Jamaree,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MAgijO9p,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2018-06-25T05:33:19.175+0000) > > Because he is a squishy, non mobile, skill shot reliant, no sustain of any kind burst caster. He gets stupid amounts of damage because that is literally all he has. He doesn't get to skitter around the battlefield like Ahri, all his damage is upfront and no constant damage like Vlad or Swain, he is skillshot reliant and no, just because two of his abilities are point and click doesn't mean he isn't, every Brand knows that if you don't land your pillar, you are HEAVILY hampering your DPS, and also squishy. He has clear defined flaws that showcase why he has the upsides he has. Go look at his wr and pick rate bro The champ just destroys everything that goes bot lane now, so much hes even being picked as an "adc".
How does he "destroy everything" when he has a negative win rate against almost every poke mage in the game? You mean "he destroys every tank" right? Because he's helpless against any champion that can trade through minions.
: Nope, not until they make him viable in mid again
The ONLY way Brand will ever be viable mid is by making his Q go through the minion wave. Is that really what you want?
Malak (NA)
: Ignite and Electrocute Together is BS
Why exactly is this an issue? You list the damage numbers and then act like its self-evident that this is harming the game. Support your conclusions.
: I'm really sick of this game and how it keep judging my performance in solo queue on others
"Im so sick of team performance being the deciding factor in this team game!" Go play Street Fighter then.
koshkyra (NA)
: The 1/4 level 6 brand misses his skillshots then presses ER ignite on me for 900 damage
Let's see... Ignite at level 6 does 200 damage, so he did 700 damage woth his E and ult. Assuming he's leveling W first and has a spell thief's, his E is doing about 80 damage and his ult is doing about 130 per bounce. Even if we assume that it hit you three times that's about 400 damage for a total of 480. Where is the other 200 damage coming from? Oh right, you're lying. Learn to play, no one is impressed by your exaggerations.
: everything will be reworked and suck, when you have medium to long length games you CAN close out early by showing skill with an early game comp, or you can end with scaling or a mix etc...with forced short games you just fuck up mostly everything. i don't know why they're pushing so hard to shorten the games it just feels awful to play now because what you get is games that are way over by 15 minutes but people drag them out to 30-40 minutes anyway and you just sit there miserable even longer that's not really fun
They're shortening games because game length is a massive issue in pro play. No one wants to watch hour+ long matches with only 5 deaths on each side, so Riot has been alowly making the game more snowbally.
Ahris (NA)
: https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/8t776a/dopas_thoughts_on_current_meta/ DOPA'S thought for current meta: "The reason why current patch feels so sloppy is because ADC's are not popping out all the time and we are seeing double brusier compositions. But honestly, i think playing ADC is better than double bruiser compositions. Lucian and Kaisa especially are better than double bruiser compositions. If you are going for double bruiser compositions bottom, play something like Ryze or Vlad. Yasuo bottom is just bad. The problem is that when your team loses to double bruiser composition bottom, then your team thinks they lost because their bottom played ADC + support. But the current double brusier composition works because ADCs were overpowered before and now they are weaker, but that doesnt mean double bruiser is better. Now everybody is talking about meta this, meta that but unless you are top 20 in Korean solo queue, meta doesnt mean anything. You can win regardless of meta if you play well. They blame the meta if they lose but honestly its because you played bad, not because of meta. If i ask you what the meta is, most of you probably have no idea what the meta even is. If you are going to complain about the meta, open your notepad and write down "what has changed this patch? what has become good as a result of this patch? What picks are good? Why is it so good? Is it good regardless of composition? Can you first pick it?" Think about these things and analyze it before you complain about the meta because the meta really has not changed that much. I admit Irelia at the current state is OP, but shes going to get nerfed next patch and master yi + taric/ nunu karthus has been nerfed, and ADCs are getting small buffs. Regardless of this patch, double bruiser bottom is a fad. It's only going to become popular for 1-2 months before everything reverts back to ADC + Support. We are seeing double bruisers not because bruisers have been buffed but because ADCs have been nerfed. Double bruiser bottom is only temporary. The bigger problem is not ADC nerfs but the Master Yi + Taric / Karthus + Nunu. This isnt because those champions suddenly got buffs but it was discovered this patch that the combination was good. It could have happened on previous patches but it was discovered right around the time when ADCs got nerfs so this patch feels sloppy. Anyways, i like this patch because ADCs were too overpowered. Before, if your bottom won, you won the game. The game is more balanced now. Now if your top wins lane, your top has a chance to carry the game. Now its important to get your top fed, previously it didnt matter if your top won lane or lost lane. Now getting your top and jungle ahead is more important than getting your bottom fed. Even in Solo queue i win more games when top and jungle are ahead compared to when our bottom is winning. Previously it was like playing a lottery every game, whenever you hear double kill in bottom, the game was decided at that moment. Then all top, mid, jungle has to do was to camp the winning bottom lane and then you win the game. Even in losing bottom lane, top , mid, and jungle tries to cover for the losing bottom lane but end up losing regardless. The game was heavily centered around bot but now everyone has equal footing. Anyways, i dont like to talk about the meta so much but looking at chat is so fustrating because everytime the chat is filled with meta this meta that. Meta doesnt matter, its just solo queue, play whatever you are good at and you will win."
And as usual Dopa says nothing of value. "The meta feels weird because ADCs were nerfed" "Kaisa and Lucian are really good though!" "Marksmen are getting buffed" Wow thanks for those amazing insights Dopa. As expected from the man who claimed that matches are decided by whichever jungler kills the most chickens over the course of the game.
: I mean... I'm not winning against Fiora/Irelia top lane as "whoever I want." Don't get too ignorant yet.
> [{quoted}](name=LatetotheRace,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MPjwoVlA,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2018-06-23T01:31:53.950+0000) > > I mean... I'm not winning against Fiora/Irelia top lane as "whoever I want." > Don't get too ignorant yet. Because you arent good enough at the game yet. If you're playing below diamond then your opponents aren't good enough for match-ups to matter a whole lot. If you have a strong grasp of how League actually works you can win games regardless of the picks. Pros and high-level players do it all the time with smurphs. Fiora "counters" Irelia but do you think a D1 Irelia player would feed to a silver Fiora?
: I oddly enjoy this broken meta
If you're below diamond the meta hasn't changed since like S3. Just play what you want and have fun.
: Laning is boring as hell in HotS, you just try not to die and stay in XP range. Some heroes are insanely strong laners and you can't even go near them. No one would complain about Yasuo if they had to lane against a Cho'Gall or Zagara.
If you just sit under towers and farm (in itself not a good protection as HotS towers are significantly weaker then LoL towers are and thus it's easy to poke or dive) you're giving up map control as he's just going to roam. Objectives actually matter in HotS unlike in League so have fun wave clearing while your laning opponent is off collecting nukes or killing the immortal. At least actually play the games you try to criticize.
: Hello Meddler! ZYRA! We need. What about Zyra today? Help for her solo lane. Her extremely unstable situation on a solo lane - suppresses her faith as a mage. In her game, there were always 2 big weaknesses against: mobile assassins and high range champions, now there are more counterplayes around her, almost all the melee champions are not caught in her E, for her are dangerous. That's just terrible. Can I look at it, not only as a support? She's a mage, a controlle mage, but she's had a huge burst mage and phenomenal damage in the past. Perhaps the revert would be a good start, how to help her become a full-fledged mage. (for example: back old passive and Q , back the change of plants from W( plants health,damage), leave the current passive on W on and the buffs E) I just wanted to see her as an excellent mage for a solo lane.
Shes a fucking monster bot lane right now. The only thing Zyra potentially needs is nerfs.
: I cannot fathom how nothing was done for Karma right now on the PBE. You had two weeks to adjust to the changes and every single one of you said she was going to need small term buffs. I am not trying to throw any of you under the bus, but what is with the blatant hate with Karma? I mean you ruin her identity and take everything away from her in the VGU, to do absolutely nothing for 5 1/2 years. You don't comment about Karma at all and you guys are so delusional with your work ethic on her. The kit is not working, the art assets are not completed and working, the lore is not working, and the identity you gave her is not working. How much and how long does this community have to fight with you guys to do anything positive on this champion? It's the same with Morde, Liss and so many other champions. How does the community have a better sense of your game than you guys do? Did you seriously think prioritizing work on Lux, Ryze Azir 2 times and Ahri for the past year was worth it? Do you think working on popular champions over the ones that have been waiting years now, was a fair and honest use of your time? No it wasn't. You ignored requests, discussions, and feedback on so many champions to work on the same garbage champions that get updates and VU every year, because God forbid they drop one or two points in their paly and win rates. Got to make sure they are always meta relevant in the game and have completed art assets. Seriously Meddler . . . I wonder why you still have a job sometimes. This is me not trying to be mean but this is me trying to make sense that you prioritize a hotfix for a garbage and annoying champion like Yasuo, but Karma is going to have to wait 5 weeks now for a small buff . . . and almost 4 months for a kit rework that is going to buff her shields again. You better be doing something meaningful with these Karma changes because the community on the boards and Reddit will come after you if you don't. Do the work that was supposed to be done 5 1/2 years ago and show us you care about all of your champions. It's annoying how you guys work.
The hate for Karma is that her kit is cancerous shit but because there's already a line for reworks she can't get any comprehensive changes. So she's allowed to be shit for as long as her kit is problematic. The real question is why you fools take it personally when there have been plenty of champs in states as bad or worse. Syndra has been bad for almost as long as Karma has been if not longer. So has Caitlyn and Azir.
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Attticus Finch

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