Kai Guy (NA)
: Playing for kills Does not = Playing to win. Just sayin.
There is a difference between playing for kills and nearly losing because of it and literally being the only threat on the team and nearly losing because of it.
: Around 280 rankeds and a negative winrate, it's not about one game man.
You know what, you're right. Not like this happens all the time. https://imgur.com/a/LgSQiz9
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: either you didn't play at the time, or forgot, But i think sometime around runes reforged (think before, but not sure) there was a time when there were literally 5 adc vs 5 adc games. it was fun at first but quickly got annoying.
Valðr (NA)
: Not really one to comment on these type of discussions, but no ADC meta? Either you don't remember or you didn't play when an IE+Stattik Shiv+ Rapid Firecannon Vayne would ult, then Q, and crit you for 70% of your hp.
That wasn't an ADC meta. That was a Vayne being able to abuse crit meta. The closest to an ADC meta we've had was Ardent meta, and that wasn't the ADC being busted, but the item used on them. Edit: Vayne Q crit abuse was the same as Caitlyn passive crit abuse. It wasn't meta defining, just overpowered.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: It should have a 2 second cool down I think. In the patch it reads like it was straight buffed, but I've found myself getting significantly less gold and items from it than I used to, so I've kinda stopped using it. I'm not sure if it's bugged in some way or not.
I've been using it on Lucian, and he can get the two procs off easily, and I end up with massive amounts of gold by the end of the game. But if you go in with a full E-Q-W rotation, you only get the money from the first two autos and get nothing from the rest.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: please god not the lethality meta. anything but the lethality meta. Ashe + Varus meta pls
Ashe and Varus meta is even more garbage than Lethality meta. The only reason they become meta is to let other lanes play less CC focused champions, which makes for an even worse experience for an adc. You press R, and then you auto until another lane inevitably pops you.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: https://media.tenor.com/images/9d128554bf3825d75c48e302976ef2a4/tenor.gif
Oh shit, the lord has graced me with his presence. I'm not prepared...SOMEONE GET MY KNEELING SLACKS. PLEASE.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: So Hyped for the New Runes!
I'm excited to run Draven with ignite early game and then switch it to heal or barrier late. My mid Draven will rise once more
: How can a nerf be both overboard and change nothing? If it was overboard, it would have a drastic change on him. If it changed nothing.... well then it changed nothing.
When I say change nothing, I mean that they didn't add anything meaningful to combat his power. Draven NEEDS his passive to be useful, so his "counterplay" was just throw as many bodies as it takes until he dies. After the nerf, you still just throw bodies at him until he dies, but now you do it once or twice and he's just done. So instead of adding some actual skill based counterplay, they just made him...worse. I've always disliked his passive execution (pun intended) wise. I like the idea, but the way it's implemented is pretty boring and cancerous
Rioter Comments
MysterQ (NA)
: Except now people are super scared if they get "reported" once.
Is that something you've seen? Because I see people actively laugh at the thought of being reported, probably even moreso than before
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Atanchan (NA)
: You say that, but there's literally three times the champions that have silences compared to those that have grounded.
Isn't grounded relatively new though? I think it started with Cass minirework right?
Atanchan (NA)
: ... How the hell can grounded be the _most_ toxic CC, even with that logic? Did you forget that silences exist and do exactly what grounded does, but for _every ability_?
Most champions have lost their silence though, save a couple here and there
: how dare those who build lethality actually...be lethal. assassins are counters to super safe champs like cait. the way lethality is now is fine.
If an assassin is doing their job, that's fine. When a non-assassin can do that job better and safer, that's not fine.
Rioter Comments
: I've seen Dravens deliberately skipping axe catching to avoid skillshots.
Then you waited too long to catch him. If he has 2 axes spinning and another one waiting off CD, then you can't fight him. He has all the tools now, and you have to wait for him to lose them. He was given too much time to get his axes rolling, which his damage is pretty sad without
: > [{quoted}](name=Naramiel,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3IxYE3PI,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2017-07-08T22:04:15.308+0000) > > It's entirely reasonable for levels to take a while to get... but I do think they're sabotaging their own system a bit by not having _any_ visible progress. Humans need to get pellets now and again or they won't keep pushing the lever. if u cant be honorable without seeing a reward... you're not honorable to begin with.
But everyone being honorable from the start means that none of this would be required. The system is both mean to give rewards to those that already are great and then incentivise those that aren't to be a bit nicer.
Megagon (NA)
: Nothing can stop a tryndamere player from pressing the r key successfully.
: For a marksman that uses an Ammo system, Graves doesn't feel like it impacts him that much
I actually wish that Rito would experiment with moving all the Marksmen to an ammo system of some sort, suited directly to each of them. Then they could make unique items that can interact with that ammo differently (charging the last shot fired, speeding up the reload, adding/subtracting rounds, etc.) Idk, I think it could be cool. Could also suck.
Rioter Comments
: I'm not falsely implying anything, nor am I saying God teir is all one can play. I'm saying playing a champion that provides literally nothing that a roll requires places an undue hardship on your team who now has to account for such a handicap. Ezreal can't duel effectively against strong counter junglers, which means Elise/Lee/Xin/etc can freely invade and take what they want from your jungle, including killing you. This means your team now has to constantly be baby sitting you to protect you from those counter junglers. Ezreal can't win a smite war against the likes of Elise/Lee/Kha/Nunu/etc who all bring very strong objective control. This means your team now has to provide strong zoning of objectives so the enemy can't compete with your smite because otherwise you simply lose the smite war. Ezreal does not provide utility in the jungle the way literally any other jungler who is not Master Yi does. This means your team now has to provide much stronger utility elsewhere on the map or risk not having enough CC, and peeling for what will now be a double adc comp. I could go on but if you possess even the slightest of braincells and are actually looking to learning as oppose to wanting to stubbornly insist on playing what you want your teammates be damned you should be getting the point. Yes you are placing an undue hardship on your team and your win/loss record doesn't mean jack.
Then you can go on living your life, while I continue winning with Ezreal jungle, proving its effectiveness. And should we meet in a game someday on opposing teams, then good luck to you sir. You shall require it. Kappa
: So much to address so little time. I could address that you have 19 games with EZ jungle, 2 of which where remakes, which makes it 17 and are 10/7 putting you just barely above 50% in terms of "I win." I could address your whole "meta slave" crap even though it doesn't apply since I have already mentioned there are acceptable off meta picks, 2 of which you have acknowledged to knowing and being able to play well. I could address your whole "meta forces you to a champ you don't play" non-sense even though my previous posts have addressed the variety of ways you could adapt to account for that. No what I think I will address here is one simple thing you don't get and it's why you think you can justify something like Ez jungle in ranked games. **_It does not matter if you win if you are placing an undue hardship on your team_** Read that line...good? Now reread it...got it? Now one more time...sinking it? You can literally win with anything in this game, that doesn't mean you where not a burden for your team. I personally have won with a freaking Ultimate Courage build that had me building AP tanky Draven that doesn't mean it's viable or that I should be spamming it in my ranked games. I've seen support Tryn crush people, mid lane Sona go on a rampage, top lane Kog'maw dominate games it doesn't mean any of those are acceptable to bring into a serious game. Why? Because in each case they put a serious burden on their team to account for their weaknesses. Support Tryn won because his ADC was a god dodge a ton of damage and out played the opposing bot lane to a sick degree, Mid lane Sona and top lane Kog won because their junglers baby sat the living hell out of them ensuring they couldn't be turret dove and repeatedly destroyed over and over again, which sadly resulted in underfarmed/leveled junglers who got to be little else than body guards. Sure those 3 players had a blast with their off meta picks, but how much fun do you think there teammates had dealing with the extra pressure? The ADC had to play damn near perfect to make plays happen, and the junglers had to sacrifice their own power spikes and scaling just to prevent the enemy team solo laners getting crazy fed. Winning does not justify playing something that is out right silly. If you can make an actual justification that Ezreal brings something to the table that other junglers don't than no you don't have an actual justification for playing it in ranked.
It does not matter if you win if you are placing an undue hardship on your team *It does not matter if you win if you are placing an undue hardship on your team* There is no undue hardship. What you are falsely implying is that by playing something OTHER than a god tier jungler, that the game is, in essence, a 4v5 which at no point is that true. Have you played Ezreal in the jungle yet? No?! Well at least it doesn't matter, clearly you know exactly how the game will play out. I mean you clearly know best! You wrote it down on paper (which you actually didn't even do that, you just thought about the concept and then hurled), and then figured it all out! After taking a rough start (Shocking! I didn't pop off as soon as I tried something?!), I have figured out how to efficiently win with the champion. 10 and 7 on a champion, must be terrible. I mean my win/loss is significantly worse on lee sin but that doesn't matter. Because it's not "undue hardship". I should just feed with him and everything will go great!
: Actually that is exactly how this works if you are going to play ranked. Fun fact both To and Kha are acceptable junglers, I even said as much in my post, which another fun fact this means you have zero legit reason to play Ez jungle in ranked aside for wanting to handicap 4 other people because fuck them what you want is more important. You are the one making a selfish argument and you are getting pissy for getting called out on it. This is what we can being entitled and being childish.
I actually have the best reason of all for why I can and will continue to play Ezreal jungle: I win. Ranked does not, in any way, shape, or form, demand that all players conform to the meta. Nor does Riot condemn off meta selections. I can play whatever champion, wherever I please, so long as I do it to win. Which I do. You can call it selfish all you want (Even though it often results in _more_ kill participation than that of your average gold jungler), but I win with it. So I'll keep playing it. You can wait until the meta shifts out of favor, forces you on to a champion you either don't like or aren't good with and then see where that takes you. I couldn't care less
: If you are incapable of playing a champion appropriate to the roll then you shouldn't be queueing up for that roll in ranked. If you are not well versed in a specific champ or roll and wish to practice it again that is what normals is for. I didn't just jump into ranked on Singed when I felt I needed to learn a top laner I played him in normals first for a while and got used to him and then I started playing him in ranked. Also I'm not saying you have to play the God tier champs all the time, hell basic junglers like Yi/Amumu/Shyvana/Mundo are all pretty brain dead easy to play depending on what style you want. Yi is the high damage kill everyone champ, Amumu is your team fight tank, while Shyvana/Mundo are your counter jungle objective control champs who just dive/run head first and tank as much damage as possible. None of those champs require a high skill level or ability to play and can safely be picked up by anyone. If you need to get their clear times down there is the practice tool so you can learn and get used to their paths and builds as well. The excuse "but I can't play another champ" holds zero water, there are a variety of tools to learn those things for ranked and if you refuse to do so simply so you can run the excuse "but I'm not good with X champ" then you are once again telling your other 4 teammates to go fuck themselves, and you deserve everything they give you in return.
But what you're saying is that I have to bend to listen to the meta, not to what works. Not to what I have shown to get results on. You're telling me that I have to stop what I'm doing, stop everything, and play the Golden Boy Lee Sin until I'm Insec. Because otherwise I can't play jungle? That's not how this game works. That's not how any of this works. I can play a number of champions jungle. I like Master Yi. I like Kha Zix. I like Ezreal. I'll play whichever I damn well please.
: If your doing it in normals then who cares, they are there to piss around and have fun anyway so I don't care what you pick. That said it's a completely different story in ranked. You are talking about a mode in which people are playing to challenge themselves to be the best they can be and to attain the highest level they can. If you play something that is intentionally suboptimal without a damn good reason then sorry that is selfish and entitled as you are intentionally making the game harder for 4 other people simply because you like it. That doesn't mean sometimes something stupid off meta can't be used. Hell I've ran Morgana top lane before because at the time I didn't have a top lane champ and because my opponent was playing Yas top, and the Morg/Yas match-up is something I am very familiar with and good at. It worked for the lane as well as for our game and we ended up winning with it. The thing is though you are going to have a hell of a time justfiying Ezreal jungle. "But we need an ADC" well there's Graves and Kindred both of which do the job significantly better than Ezreal does while bringing more to the team via their utility. If you need more damage there are assassins junglers like Kha/Rengar/Vi and hell even Master Yi. Simply put there really isn't a justification beyond "I just wanna" to play Ezreal in the jungle, which as I said if your doing it in normals then whatever have fun and be as silly as you want, but if you are doing it in ranked than frankly you deserve what you get as you are literally telling your 4 other teammates you don't give a damn about them and you are going to do whatever you want. Just so you know that is why you are getting flamed, it isn't because "off meta" it's because by picking Ez jungle you are telling your teammates to go fuck themselves you are going to do what you want.
The justification doesn't have to be "they are OP in X". It doesn't even have to be "They are good at X". Ranked is to win. I play to win. I play Ezreal Jungle, to win. Which, at the end of the day, is what happens. If I were to play Lee Sin, a jungler who I am VERY bad at, and did poorly, I would get yelled at because I played poorly. However, if I play Ezreal jungle, a champion that I have grown very comfortable on in the position, I'm labeled a troll before the game even begins? How is that fair in any respect? If the point is to win, I'm going to play the champion that I will do best on. {{champion:64}} = Loss but whatever, its meta so who cares {{champion:81}} = Win but it isn't meta cuz Graves exists wah 9x report
: Jungler brings solid poke... I'm just gonna go to sleep now. I think I've seen it all.
Good. Hopefully when you awake you won't be so narrow minded. Stay woke fam
: Your gank potential is so ridiculously situational though. You can use your E to engage, but then it's on cooldown and you're vulnerable to CC, and you're going to get fucked over. You can walk into lane, but the enemy will see you coming if they actually know what they're doing, and will be prepared to deal with you. Your kit simply lacks the utility or hypercarry potential a jungler has. Sure, he can be either AP or AD, but why not just learn and AD jungler and an AP jungler and change in champ select? Team builder isn't actually a thing anymore.
A huge number of junglers have situational ganks. Master Yi has even less ganking potential pre 6 and even post 6 it isn't great. Champions like Fiddle also lack any real gank potential pre 6. Yet those 2 junglers aren't considered troll picks or bad picks. And yes, they bring totally different things to the team. Master Yi can split and can go absolutely crazy if he gets fed. Fiddlesticks has absurd team fight potential if he gets a solid ult. And Ezreal brings solid poke and exceptional sticking power. Just because you can't or won't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
: If you're going to play off-meta you need to have more to say than "Oh, he has damage and excels at some things." Your off-meta champ has to actually be able to function in a given role and bring something to the team that a meta champion won't. When I played old Galio, he has his W which was fundamentally broken, and he had an AOE taunt, and was able to perform at a level that was not horrid in all aspects of the support role. Ezreal is completely missing several key things he'd need to be able to do to be a good jungler, and jungling isn't all about damage. A jungler need to have objective control, and the ability to gank in situations where the opponent isn't at the turret. A jungler can be a hyperfarm jungler who just plays PvE for ten minutes, but you'd need to have the ability to actually deal with krugs and raptors. You cannot openly admit that you are missing so many key pieces of a good jungler's kit, then say "Oh, hey, this works, I have damage."
But I can. And I will. And I do. Look mate, if you can't take the idea of Ezreal, who can hit level 3 and gank faster than most other junglers, who can clear every camp with relative ease and health, who can adapt to be either an AP or AD carry depending on the needs of the team composition, as a serious idea on paper, then I can't help you. It works. Well, in fact. So either try it for yourself or wait until you come across one. Maybe you'll crush it. Who knows. That's how things evolve.
: So what you're saying is he is sub-par to a meta jungler in almost every aspect?
Actually what I'm saying is that he is a viable jungler that doesn't excel at everything but does excel at some things. And guess what!? That's okay! Because that's kind of how a champion is supposed to work!
MrHaZeYo (NA)
: You can watch em without adding him. I watched em last night :P Use Lolnexus, click spectate. It'll give you a "file" click Windows+r paste link It goes into spectate mode.
You can also watch my stream. Kappa ;)
: Okay. That doesn't change the fact that he can't gank for shit, contest objectives, is squishy as hell, and has very little mobility for a jungler.
So I will agree with you that he can't contest objectives very well. His steal potential is sub par at best, horrid at worst. However, he has decent ganks. Saying he can't gank because he doesn't have CC is like saying Master Yi can't gank because he lacks CC. It isn't the CC that he brings to that fight, it's the damage. And as for mobility, it isn't the best, but it certainly isn't the worst.
: > [{quoted}](name=SandwitchArtist,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HV6cjw8h,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-05-16T09:58:42.544+0000) > > I recently picked up Ezreal jungle, because Literally stopped right there. If you play Ezreal jungle, then you should be prepared to lose a lot of games and get reported by teammates frequently. Not saying I would report you for playing off-meta, but don't think for a minute I would speak up in your defense to our team and ask them to stop piling on you for being ineffective or useless in games.
Lost the first 3 games getting used to it, won a game (which was where I switched up my build a bit), lost a game, then never looked back. Winning pretty heavily now (give or take a few mishaps. Happens)
: It might have something to do with Ezreal not having any of the tools a good jungler would need. I'm all for off meta picks, I played old Galio support all the time and got mastery 7 doing it, but he has the tools in his kit to be a good support. Ezreal lacks most of the tools a jungler has. Specifically: Clearing speed, Gank Potential, Any way to contest objectives, bulk and sustain, and compared to other meta junglers, his mobility is almost nonexistent. The only thing he has going for him is his ultimate, and even then, it's not great. Sure it will get you an assist or maybe a kill, but then the enemy team knows that you're incredibly easy to deal with and have very little control over the game for the next minute at least. These are important things to look at if you want to play off meta or weird picks. You need to know why a champion is off meta, and what they can potentially bring to a role that a meta champion won't. Ezreal brings his ultimate. And it's not that great, and then he doesn't make up for it with the rest of his kit.
Ezreal actually has really decent clear speed. Raptor and Krugs get annoying as they do on a lot of junglers not named Lee Sin or Vi, but he can still get through it all pretty quick.
MysterQ (NA)
: As I said, do what you want. And I am usually open to trying new and fun things, I personally won't flame you but I certainly won't praise you (unless you break the game). I recently did a 5-man queue. Our jg literally said he only plays mid or Zac jungle, who was reworked. So he decides to queue Fizz jg. I was skeptic, the only thing I said was that is unusual. His statline was fine, but I still 100% believe we lost that game because of him. He was a fine Fizz, but he wasn't a jungler. He didn't build jg. He never ganked for us (although he ganked other lanes). At the end, I didn't flame him or anything, but I certainly don't want to play with him on FIzz Jg in ranked again. And his statline was only fine because he was literally only their for cleanup assassinations, which is what Fizz wants to do but that doesn't help the team much. (Same time, I have had poor games with premade 4s and I am sure they have thought the same about me). Learn the champion. I will say hopefully in normals, because people who want to climb want to actually climb. Communicate with your team. You say your level 3 gank is beastly, let them know you will gank x Lane at level 3 and be prepared. Otherwise just say I am going to afk farm or whatever and let them adjust heir playstyle too. If you just pick jg Ez without communication though. I probably would report you.
" I personally won't flame you but I certainly won't praise you" THERE. THAT. THAT RIGHT THERE. That exact quote is what this thread is about. THIS is what it should be. You wanna report the off meta because he either fed, or maybe he didn't feed but he didn't really shine so you lost, sure. That is totally fine and within your right. What isn't in anyone's right is to go into the game with a toxic attitude and start barraging a player before the game has even started. That's straight up against the Summoner's Code and is a legitimately bannable offence, yet some people think that they are justified solely because "it isn't a real X". If you have an issue with it, open a discussion. Don't open mid, spam GG, and ping "X - Alive/ X - Dead" all game.
Show more

Big Ol Idiot Man

Level 179 (NA)
Lifetime Upvotes
Create a Discussion