Atgo (EUW)
: Nice post Bio! Since the "Sea myths"(Pyke, Nautilus, Fizz and TK) were alredy mentioned, I think that GP's bio would be better placed right after Down Among Dead Man and Illaoi's bio(together with the trial minigame) right before Shadow and Foturne, so I'm curious: Why did you place them in those positions? Again, nice post! For a long time I was thinking in something similiar to Shuriman lore, but I never really shared it in a post like this one. Maybe you gave me the motivation to do so...
> [{quoted}](name=Atgo,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=idaBsEQv,comment-id=0018,timestamp=2018-11-11T16:51:59.741+0000) > > Nice post Bio! Since the "Sea myths"(Pyke, Nautilus, Fizz and TK) were alredy mentioned, I think that GP's bio would be better placed right after Down Among Dead Man and Illaoi's bio(together with the trial minigame) right before Shadow and Foturne, so I'm curious: Why did you place them in those positions? > Again, nice post! For a long time I was thinking in something similiar to Shuriman lore, but I never really shared it in a post like this one. > Maybe you gave me the motivation to do so... It was a tricky choice, some of the placements. Having Illaoi's color story, The Burden, before the Epilogue of Burning Tides, works chronologically, but 'ruins' the surprise of Shadow and Fortune introducing Illaoi for the first time. Then if I were to place Illaoi's bio and mini-game immediately following, would (in my opinion) be too much of Illaoi testing captains all at once. But that's all it is here - my opinion. I'd tried to keep as much of Illaoi's mystery intact, without breaking the chronological order of events, as I could. As for the Gangplank bio - again, it's down to opinion rather than a definitively right or wrong answer. My intention was that, the last few lines of Gangplank's bio speaks to the return of the Reaver King, the threat of his rise - and that's still to come, rather than detailed in Shadow and Fortune or the related pieces. Glad you liked it, Atgo!
Grau (NA)
: Thank you so much! This is such a useful page to have and I have a few friends I will be sending it to. Is there any relevant Pyke stuff to add to this since he is one of the major players in the current story arc for bilgewater? Or will that wait until we have a few more answers?
> [{quoted}](name=Grau,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=idaBsEQv,comment-id=0016,timestamp=2018-11-10T13:24:32.857+0000) > > Thank you so much! This is such a useful page to have and I have a few friends I will be sending it to. > Is there any relevant Pyke stuff to add to this since he is one of the major players in the current story arc for bilgewater? > Or will that wait until we have a few more answers? I think we may need to wait until we have a few more connective pieces - including Pyke (and Fizz, Nautilus, and ol' Kenchy) would be a bit of a disconnected jump at the moment. Like issues of a comic before the crossover episode :)
: I see what you're saying but in my opinion Dark Souls has the best lore in all of video games because it asks you to delve deeper and explore. Makes you feel like an archaeologist, like your putting together this giant conspiracy if you know what I'm saying. Course there is something to be said for linear story telling A-B-C-D in order But I like that one person can go A-C-D-B and another D-B-C-A and it might work either way, like your having your own unique experience digging through the lore.
> [{quoted}](name=mrmeddyman,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=idaBsEQv,comment-id=00000000000000010002,timestamp=2018-11-10T05:36:13.672+0000) > > I see what you're saying but in my opinion Dark Souls has the best lore in all of video games because it asks you to delve deeper and explore. Makes you feel like an archaeologist, like your putting together this giant conspiracy if you know what I'm saying. Course there is something to be said for linear story telling A-B-C-D in order > > But I like that one person can go A-C-D-B and another D-B-C-A and it might work either way, like your having your own unique experience digging through the lore. Oooh we gonna talk about narrative delivery methods in games? Because I am all over that. I think that, for many games, the non-linear, asynchronous, storytelling is excellent for certain types of narrative information - Dark Souls, like you say, does well for giving you information about the world, and some limited information about relationships between characters. I believe that the VO lines for champs in League, for example, excel in non-linearly building up an understanding of a character, and the character's relationships with other champions. And it does so in a way that doesn't require breaking out of the game experience, which is great and highly accessible. Even Dark Souls, for all its wonderfulness, generally requires you to go into a menu screen (or rather, the inventory) to read background text for the items, to start your learning process. (Obviously later, you can use those clues to gain information in the world - such as where an item was found and its relationship to other items and characters - but that's only really useful _after_ you've read the descriptions.) The position of those objects is environmental storytelling - another wonderfully immersive method of conveying story, and one that doesn't require you to break out of the game and shift into a different mode. For example, The Return of the Obra Dinn is pretty much 'environmental storytelling: the game' - where the placement of objects, people, and the contents of them, conveys the narrative of what went on in that location. It's like reading a crime scene. Many many games (some of which I've worked on) have used this to deepen the sense of immersion of the player - the most basic form of which is usually a trail of blood leading away from a trap or hazard in a horror game. Even League experiments with some environmental storytelling, even though Summoner's Rift isn't 'canon' to Runeterra at the moment. The stories its telling, however, are the stories of both the history of the game (finding old, retired, items hiding in the jungle, or in the goods of the shopkeepers) or the stories of the Rift - such as the cracks emanating from the Baron Pit showing the corruption, or even the wear marks on the lanes implying an age to the entire location. For games, there are usually some storytelling methods that are more appropriate than others. Your typical linear single-player shooter or RPG for example, is often best served by dialogue, environmental narrative, sometimes playable flashbacks, and some will have cutscenes; how you feel about those can vary from person to person. Asking the player of a typical shooter game to stop and read will break up the tempo of the game, and they'll likely avoid doing so if possible. Other games, such as say, League, find ways to convey information in a way that won't interrupt your experience, too. The loading screen tips, the VO lines, the animations, champ models, even the mechanics (if you're a fan of ludonarrative resonance - you couldn't think I wouldn't drop the old buzzwords with this much of a wall of text, could you?), all help convey character and relationships narratives. What it fails at spectacularly at is linear storytelling. Or, maybe that's unfair. What it has failed at so far, is linear storytelling. One could argue, if you were especially contrary (and what are designers if not contrary), that if you zoom out far enough, there is a linear story being played out on the Rift. That the release or update of champions, in sync with the stories that exist outside of the game (bios, color stories, short stories, etc.) convey a progression. The easiest example would be someone who saw Gangplank before Burning Tides, played the game during his 'death', and then saw him post-Update. That could be considered a linear story, conveyed through the experience of playing the game. And of course, that brings us to the player-narrative. Every match is a story that the players create - one with highs and lows (too many lows) with villains and heroes and twists and turns and big finishes. Then there's the narrative of a player's promos, or of the season. Or their entire experience with League of Legends. I know that those player-narratives aren't what we generally talk about, but they are critical to the game and in fact work in concert with the more conventional champion narratives we try to convey. You are experiencing and enacting the narrative of a match with 9 other players, and with 10 champions as your agents. Like 10 actors on a stage, playing 10 different improvisation characters. The characters have relationships, quirks, and abilities - a range of expression that molds the player story. Ok, I've written enough nonsense to choke a goat now. I just get very excited when talking about narrative methods in games, and even though I've wittered on here incessantly, I've only talked about maybe 1% of the fun awesome methods and styles. PS - As an example of where Dark Soul's method was perhaps unexpectedly used, Destiny had a similar out-of-the-game method of gathering story together in their online Grimoire cards. While some players really enjoyed digging through that as a method of learning about the world, many players chose not to interact with something so disconnected from the game experience. Sounds familiar to me.
Nylisa (EUW)
: But... Earthquake is shaking or trembling of the *Earth* (Volcanic or Tectonic). is it still earthquakes when we are not on earth? we all know Runeterra is another planet! Jokes aside i just wonder how events such as these are perceived in a place like Runettera.for example 500 years ago a lightning and thunder was sign of a god's wrath on earth. but now it's just... air. I wonder about the strangest things! like how often vikings use to take bath. (they were obsessed with it it seems)
> [{quoted}](name=Nylisa,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=kjL9wGzg,comment-id=0003000400000000,timestamp=2018-11-10T03:22:39.513+0000) > > But... Earthquake is shaking or trembling of the *Earth* (Volcanic or Tectonic). is it still earthquakes when we are not on earth? we all know Runeterra is another planet! > > Jokes aside i just wonder how events such as these are perceived in a place like Runettera.for example 500 years ago a lightning and thunder was sign of a god's wrath on earth. but now it's just... air. > > I wonder about the strangest things! like how often vikings use to take bath. (they were obsessed with it it seems) And of course there's the extra complication that, there really might be gods in Runeterra causing the thunder and lightning. How does something like the scientific method hold up in these sorts of circumstances? (Hypothetical - no need for a reply. I too wonder about strange things.)
Nylisa (EUW)
: What would a Demacian calls an Earthquake? Runneteraquake? Jarvan's anger? Demacia's sneeze?
> [{quoted}](name=Nylisa,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=kjL9wGzg,comment-id=00030004,timestamp=2018-11-09T23:01:15.209+0000) > > What would a Demacian calls an Earthquake? Runneteraquake? Jarvan's anger? Demacia's sneeze? https://universe.leagueoflegends.com/en_US/story/lux-color-story/
: > [{quoted}](name=Ozzie Storm,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=idaBsEQv,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-11-09T02:12:29.704+0000) > > i second this! > I'm very intrigued in the lore but it feels too much to the point i don't know where to start. Bilgewater is a good start because it's the only region that feels complete. All the pieces are set up and story can only move forward. After that do Shurima and Icathia because that's also pretty complete after this years Void and Darkin updates Azir Xerath Sivir Taliyah story Nasus The story where they all together Then learn the history with Fall of Icathia, followed by the Darkin story (forget its name) Aatrox Varus Kayn + Rhaast Then use Kayn to pivot into Ionia OR Noxus Tbh just read about whatever makes you interested. Everything is connected so reading one story will make you want to read another maybe sometimes in a different region. Just explore
I agree with the idea that folks should read what interests them and go from there, but sometimes we've made it hard to know if there IS something that leads on from it. Bit of dropping the ball there. {{sticker:zombie-brand-facepalm}} Us lore-heads may know that Sivir at the watering hole in "Water" follows the Rise of the Ascended, but what I'm attempting to do with this (these?) is lay out a known path. Otherwise you might listen to Rise of the Ascended, and check to see what Azir is up to now on his Champion page on Universe, and find nothing (yet). A few dead ends, and you might give up. Shurima seems a good candidate for a guide, Noxus too. Some of the other regions have lots of content, but lack a clear through-line of connected story, and work better as more of a scavenger hunt than a playlist, imo.
: Wouldnt a great majority who linger to SA&S be the type who's fully equipped at finding these stories, and sufficiently familiar with Bilgewater's content and even any lore. **Like I fully support the intention here but is the boards the best place to promote more 'accessible' lore?** The majority of SA&S are the niche circle of already hooked people, we don't really benefit from a thread like this but **it's those elsewhere that need this guidance. Yet the thread has a day at best to be discovered**, so long as this isn't pined by moderators, which it hasn't so far.
Well, I could pin it myself (I have phenomenal cosmic powers) but I want to see if it will, ahem, sink or swim on its own merit first. I also want to see if folks have suggestions for improvement - consider this a 0.1 release. I also will be keeping a link to this handy so that if I see another inquiring thread in the future, I should be able to direct them to it. I agree this is a little 'preaching to the converted', but even here we have folks who have been here for a while, but for whom this is a splash art discussion Board. I'd be super interested to hear the experiences of people who haven't read all these stories, the way we have.
  Rioter Comments
: What I Appreciate Most About The Expanded Lore And Universe
This makes me happy. {{sticker:sg-ahri-2}} What sort of things would help you even more, do you think? No promises, just checking for unexpected ideas that we've not considered yet.
: Map is Busted
Can you post if you're on mac, pc, mobile, laptop, etc. what browser you're using, and if you've got your hardware acceleration turned on? This is the (short) FAQ page, to help with the accelleration thing, and testing that you have WebGL https://support.riotgames.com/hc/en-us/articles/360001672968 If that doesn't help, all the infoz above will help the map team's QA lovely-person to track down replication steps, and ultimately get it fixed.
: I'm Starting to Appreciate Graves more
Have you read Burning Tides? He features quite a bit in it, and I know it made me appreciate him a lot more - might do the same for others. It's one of our longer stories, but it's broken into nice manageable chunks if you don't have a lot of time all at once. https://universe.leagueoflegends.com/en_US/story/bilgewater-story/ {{champion:104}} {{champion:4}} {{champion:21}} {{champion:41}} (Ignore the weird pink chapter indications - it's a bug I think was introduced a little while ago, but the team have been made aware. I blame Odyssey ;) )
: No need to be short about it. Sorry, had to take the pun shot. Is that the measure because of the glamour?
> [{quoted}](name=Imperial Pandaa,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=7VbaRfcM,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-11-01T19:42:47.690+0000) > > No need to be short about it. > > Sorry, had to take the pun shot. > > Is that the measure because of the glamour? Aw I thought you might be referencing Veigar. I had so much fun with his glamoured height in his color story :D But no - the average height listed does not take perceived glamour into account.
: Answer My Question About Yordles Riot or Riot
By my measure, the average height of our current roster of Yordle champions is 84.7cm, or 2ft 9in. No, I probably won't be able to answer any more height questions, before anyone asks!
Ifneth (NA)
: Raptor Knights
I was that Rioter and I'm still impressed. For those less familiar with the Demacian Raptors and their Knights, you can see a pin about them [on the map](http://universe-map.s3-website-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/), NNE of the capital in Demacia. Here's one of the images: http://universe-map.s3-website-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/src/assets/images/slides/demacia_raptors_01.jpg https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/d/dc/Demacia_warrior_concept_05.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20170922165902
Zapzya (OCE)
: Would you be able to give us some hints on the supply lines part and how each region would deal with supplying their army? I would assume Demacia has no shortage of supplies, which combined with their small numbers and possible use of raptors for transportation would mean they have very little trouble supplying their army. How would Shurima fair in this regard? Low supplies because of desert agriculture? Use of dormun to carry said supplies? Bonus question, how is the political stability in Demacia and Shurima?
> [{quoted}](name=Zapzya,realm=OCE,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=pXQ33Gyv,comment-id=00030001,timestamp=2018-10-24T23:41:22.443+0000) > > Would you be able to give us some hints on the supply lines part and how each region would deal with supplying their army? I would assume Demacia has no shortage of supplies, which combined with their small numbers and possible use of raptors for transportation would mean they have very little trouble supplying their army. How would Shurima fair in this regard? Low supplies because of desert agriculture? Use of dormun to carry said supplies? > > Bonus question, how is the political stability in Demacia and Shurima? I can't say for certain, but I would not expect raptors to be much use for transporting anything heavier than their rider - it'd be like expecting to use a thoroughbred racehorse to haul logs. And you're likely right - Demacia probably has excellent sources of food, but their preservation technology (for transporting it) might be questionable, having not needed to transport it far away for long periods of time, for much of their history. (Noxus and Bilgewater are probably at the cutting edge of food preservation tech.) Pretty sure Demacians aren't trained for desert warfare, either - and their standard operating behavior (usually in friendly or near-friendly territory) might completely fail them. You can just imagine them running out of water, failing to predict or avoid sandstorms, or being subject to pretty horrific sunstroke. It's yet to be seen how Dormun would fare in lands other than Shurima - it's possible they'd get hoof rot, or just get sick and die from the cold and humidity. It's very likely that Shuriman soldiers would also have to find clothing and equipment that would better serve them in those foreign lands too - and that wouldn't be difficult on the individual basis, but equipping entire armies would require, for example, huge sources of cloth to just clothe them. Foods that they might be used to keeping dried, might rot in record breaking time, wounds that would otherwise be ok, could get infected much faster than they'd expect, and even the methods that they use for navigating (the sun and stars) might be covered by perpetual clouds for days or weeks on end. They'd all be out of their element, so the 'home territory' advantage would be astronomical.
: Shurima vs Demacia
Why are they at war? What are they fighting over? Where do individual battles take place? In what season? How are their supply lines?
: Where can i find the worlds spawn music full version?
Here you go! Rioter Iceburrg pointed me to the link today. https://soundcloud.com/leagueoflegends/rise-ft-the-glitch-mob-mako?in=leagueoflegends/sets/rise-ft-the-glitch-mob-mako-and-the-word-alive-worlds-2018-league-of-legends
Seba7290 (EUNE)
: Are any actually good fanfictions about the lore?
You would be far more likely to get responses in the [Concepts & Creations board](https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/skin-champion-concepts), I suspect, but if you're interested in flash fiction (very short) there were two unofficial competitions I ran a few years ago that had some pretty good entries! Tall Tales of Bilgewater (set in the aftermath of Burning Tides): https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/fancreations/5AiMAFN0-fan-fic-micro-competition-tall-tales-of-bilgewater The Last Shuriman Sunset (regarding the fall of Shurima): https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/skin-champion-concepts/GGYEUcJc-fan-fic-micro-competition-the-last-shuriman-sunset
: She dipped her bullets in a mix she made “Every one’s been dipped in Myron’s Dark,” probably referencing impure shots, and her guns have a reloading mechanism "She twisted the wheel-lock on each pistol and ingenious mechanisms within reloaded each one." And for the recoil maybe shes just strong ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
> [{quoted}](name=Choke Me Chun Li,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=tEFzAF66,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2018-10-21T00:50:44.108+0000) > > She dipped her bullets in a mix she made “Every one’s been dipped in Myron’s Dark,” probably referencing impure shots, and her guns have a reloading mechanism "She twisted the wheel-lock on each pistol and ingenious mechanisms within reloaded each one." And for the recoil maybe shes just strong ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. Myron's Dark is a brand of rum, actually. Hence the spirits comment. >_“Every one’s been dipped in Myron’s Dark,” she said, loud enough for every one of her thirty-strong company to hear. “If the dead want a fight, we’ll meet them with spirits of our own.”_
Terozu (NA)
: Another fun fact, as they are the daughters of a general in a military run nation, this makes them socially equivalent to royalty. They are essentially princesses.
> [{quoted}](name=Terozu,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZAn8AiTB,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2018-10-19T20:47:54.956+0000) > > Another fun fact, as they are the daughters of a general in a military run nation, this makes them socially equivalent to royalty. > > They are essentially princesses. {{champion:429}} **As Kalista was the niece of the Ruined King, by some measurements, she is a princess.**
Rasta (EUNE)
: League of Facts #1
Here's a less well known one - {{champion:104}} **Malcolm Graves was in prison when his mother died.** It's very sad.
: MF Voice Line Experimentation
> -- Come on, Fate. **I could use a right-hand man**, and you know you can do better than Graves. Oh I _know_ you didn't just backhandedly diss Rafen.
: [Discussion] I wanted to ask something regarding character appeal to players
Something I find interesting is that in some regions, a champion being described as "unique" in theme or appearance is highly valued, while in others it is actually considered a bit of a downside. Many of the champs you've listed would come under the monster/unique descriptor for their appearances, imo. You and Marshbouy both described Rek'Sai as unique - and from your tone, that was considered a positive. Some folks value other traits above 'uniqueness', which might factor in. (For example, they might value cuteness, or being relatable, or how sexy they find them, etc. more highly.)
MS exceI (EUNE)
: The real answer I've been waiting for!!!! Seriously, do you think you will ever be satisfied with every single bio to the point you guys don't want to rewrite them? Is it an achievable goal?
> [{quoted}](name=MS exceI,realm=EUNE,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=EvxG0dR8,comment-id=000e0002,timestamp=2018-10-10T06:14:22.769+0000) > > The real answer I've been waiting for!!!! > > Seriously, do you think you will ever be satisfied with every single bio to the point you guys don't want to rewrite them? Is it an achievable goal? I'd defer to Skathlocke's answer there - he's far more involved than I am. I'd just be so happy to reach that milestone that baked goods would have to happen.
: please don't rename kumungu. think about the possibilities... :(
> [{quoted}](name=JonnyBoyy,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=EvxG0dR8,comment-id=000e0000,timestamp=2018-10-10T05:33:08.709+0000) > > please don't rename kumungu. think about the possibilities... :( I feel like I've been identified as the baddie for the name Kumungu. I was just going by what I'd heard people discussing these last few years. I guess we'll see! :)
MS exceI (EUNE)
: What happens once every champ got an updated bio?
I'll probably bring in cakes that day, I think.
d00mface (EUW)
: To the narrative team...
I'm no expert on the matter, but there have been two similar kinds of questions asked and answered in previous Ask Riot posts. I'll link em below. > **How can I become a writer at Riot?** https://nexus.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/2017/02/ask-riot-malzahar-kills-the-lady/ > **What does Riot look for in narrative and world building writers?** https://nexus.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/2017/04/ask-riot-snowdown-showdown-and-pro-kills/ Does that help at all?
Lordk0z (NA)
: Sorry to poke at you randomly here, but has there ever been thoughts of creating a "Noxian Immigrant" of sorts? Someone who starts out as an Ionian, Demacian, Freljordic (I dunno what's the correct term there) or what have you, and joins Noxus? Come to think of it, was Sion originally a Freljordic man himself? (Given his barbarian-like design).
> [{quoted}](name=Lordk0z,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=iPH8QJss,comment-id=0003000100000001,timestamp=2018-10-01T05:08:44.016+0000) > > Sorry to poke at you randomly here, but has there ever been thoughts of creating a "Noxian Immigrant" of sorts? Someone who starts out as an Ionian, Demacian, Freljordic (I dunno what's the correct term there) or what have you, and joins Noxus? Come to think of it, was Sion originally a Freljordic man himself? (Given his barbarian-like design). I'm guessing that Kled doesn't count for your question? :) Bandle -> Noxus.
SSmotzer (NA)
: Religions of Runeterra
There's the Grey Lady, also, in Zaun. Not sure if the tally-men of Kindred are a religion, or just a job that needs to be done without any religious connections.
: Alas I lose this round. I based it off her chibi icon mostly lol, as it was the best image of her default skin's eyes I could find. https://i.imgur.com/26f7YUp.png[/img] Though you are right Captain Fortune clearly has blue eyes and that is just her in the Bilgewater event (so, it is canon), so yeah that pretty well settles her eyes being blue.
> [{quoted}](name=Laughing Fish,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=iPH8QJss,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2018-09-28T02:05:24.438+0000) > > Alas I lose this round. I based it off her chibi icon mostly lol, as it was the best image of her default skin's eyes I could find. > > https://i.imgur.com/26f7YUp.png[/img] > > Though you are right Captain Fortune clearly has blue eyes and that is just her in the Bilgewater event (so, it is canon), so yeah that pretty well settles her eyes being blue. It was a good guess, Laughing Fish! We don't make it easy, and sometimes we even get it wrong ourselves. I'm actually working on something to help us (Riot) be a little more consistent, so hopefully it won't be so difficult in the future!
: > [{quoted}](name=Bioluminescence,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=iPH8QJss,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-09-27T22:53:26.068+0000) > > I would say pale blue, based on the concept art from the Art of League book, her Captain Fortune splash, her CG model from the Ryze CG, her merch figure, and the Fortune Smiles comic. Admittedly, the lighting in a few of these could make it easy to confuse it with green. You respond to THIS post of all things?? Fortnite's devs are killing you guys on feedback and you guys wonder why we're always complaining its because we hope to god that one day one of you will scroll by and accidently click on the post when you were trying to answer Susie Q's post about what Zileans favorite type of jellybean is.
> [{quoted}](name=AMADEUSdotEXE,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=iPH8QJss,comment-id=00030001,timestamp=2018-09-28T04:06:18.838+0000) > > You respond to THIS post of all things?? Fortnite's devs are killing you guys on feedback and you guys wonder why we're always complaining its because we hope to god that one day one of you will scroll by and accidently click on the post when you were trying to answer Susie Q's post about what Zileans favorite type of jellybean is. Story, Art, & Sound is the Board I pretty much call home. I'm not on the League balance team or anything, nor do I have influence over any gameplay decisions on the MOBA. I chill here - talking to fellow lore-heads about lore stuff. Mostly maps, but sometimes other things. It wouldn't be my place, nor would I be at all informed enough to answer the threads you're probably referring to. But if you wanna talk story, setting, and lore - I'm here!
: @ Rito, What's Miss Fortune's official eye color?
I would say pale blue, based on the concept art from the Art of League book, her Captain Fortune splash, her CG model from the Ryze CG, her merch figure, and the Fortune Smiles comic. Admittedly, the lighting in a few of these could make it easy to confuse it with green.
: My Favorite Kind Of Character Arch Type In Media
Larriet (NA)
: Honestly, imagining how Piltover and Zaun work is extremely difficult for me, even with all the pictures we've seen. There are images like you've shown where both cities are define by very tall and thin towers with many bridges, but we clearly see/read about locations with much more horizontal space. Images on Piltover's page look like they could be on solid ground, but NONE of Piltover should actually work that way, right?
> [{quoted}](name=Larriet,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=8yWnAs10,comment-id=0002000000010004,timestamp=2018-09-22T15:50:45.675+0000) > > Honestly, imagining how Piltover and Zaun work is extremely difficult for me, even with all the pictures we've seen. There are images like you've shown where both cities are define by very tall and thin towers with many bridges, but we clearly see/read about locations with much more horizontal space. Images on Piltover's page look like they could be on solid ground, but NONE of Piltover should actually work that way, right? No a fair bit of Piltover would be on solid, flatter, ground. It is very confusing, I agree. Here's my working theory: The isthmus where Piltover and Zaun are, is unusual in that sea level is different on either side of it. This is unusual, but not unheard of, even on Earth. The height difference is fairly pronounced, however. So when it was just Zaun, the settlement would have been built on the easiest, most convenient, part of the land to build on - coasts, riverbanks, the narrowest parts, and crossroads. The higher altitude, more difficult/less convenient parts to build on, might have had some proto-Piltover districts, but mostly they wouldn't have been especially desirable. When the OG Progress Day went down, several of the areas that were high density collapsed/sunk into sink-hole like chasms - effectively taking a lot of Zaun down there. The previously undesirable areas of high, but flat, land, suddenly became highly desirable real estate, and new developments for the wealthy cropped up. These areas are probably Piltover now. If anyone remembers the plot to Superman: The Movie, it's like the San Andreas fault snapped off and now there's newly desirable coastline where there wasn't before. The analogy is a little off, but you get the idea, maybe?
Terozu (NA)
: I would love this, maybe start with a few layered topdown maps to get a feel for location then 3d sculpt it? That would take _ages_ though.
> [{quoted}](name=Terozu,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=8yWnAs10,comment-id=0002000000010001,timestamp=2018-09-21T19:14:53.946+0000) > > I would love this, maybe start with a few layered topdown maps to get a feel for location then 3d sculpt it? > > That would take _ages_ though. Due to my background, my instinct is to 3d model it, like a videogame level, but how to display such a thing would be difficult as well as potentially being hella overkill. Still open to suggestions.
Atgo (EUW)
: Reality really likes to contradicts me. After I said this I just tried to look at the map and it worked. Sorry for make you worried. Btw, the map wasnt working in Chrome for me for a looooooooooooong time, even with Hardware Acelleration enabled. I think that the map isn't working in my cellphone too, but as I said this reality likes to contradicts me so I not gonna states that.
> [{quoted}](name=Atgo,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=8yWnAs10,comment-id=00020000000000000000,timestamp=2018-09-21T17:46:25.619+0000) > > Reality really likes to contradicts me. > After I said this I just tried to look at the map and it worked. > Sorry for make you worried. > Btw, the map wasnt working in Chrome for me for a looooooooooooong time, even with Hardware Acelleration enabled. > I think that the map isn't working in my cellphone too, but as I said this reality likes to contradicts me so I not gonna states that. Oh I know that feel. As a designer, in the games industry, if I find a bug or a problem with what I'm doing, there's a better than evens chance that a 100% replication rate crash or something, if I bring an engineer over to my desk to take a look, it will immediately start working. I end up sitting at my desk, saying "No really - it was broken a minute ago. I swear. No I didn't do anything different!!" It's like they have an aura. Or the universe is out to make you look daft. So I totally get you. Anyway - I'm glad it works now!
: I keep saying this but you gotta put this image on the universe pages or the map. also I was looking at the map, and its interesting, it seems to depict zaun as this closed area, like a huge pod or something, with its 3 different levels. Wasn't sure what to make of it. And then there's another image on the map that shows an overhead view of piltover, but I can't really see zaun anywhere
> [{quoted}](name=EROTIC RAID BOSS,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=8yWnAs10,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2018-09-21T16:24:17.542+0000) > > I keep saying this but you gotta put this image on the universe pages or the map. > > > also I was looking at the map, and its interesting, it seems to depict zaun as this closed area, like a huge pod or something, with its 3 different levels. Wasn't sure what to make of it. And then there's another image on the map that shows an overhead view of piltover, but I can't really see zaun anywhere The image is on the map - if you click on Piltover/Zaun, then the 'Connected Cities' link that comes in from the side will show you it. As for the enclosed pod thing - are you referring to the cutaway images showing the Promenade Level, the Entresol Level, and the Sump Levels? It can be a little tricky to interpret, because the 'solid' parts aren't shown, but the top of the Promenade Level is exposed to air, peeking through the gaps in the chasms in Piltover. One of the best images, I think, so show their integration is in the "Below the Surface" tab in Zaun on the map. https://lolstatic-a.akamaihd.net/frontpage/apps/prod/universe-map/en_US/8b7d14ee6fc37ebb2f42cfc0732d45f5173bf6b9/assets/src/assets/images/slides/zaun_environment_01.jpg This one shows the bridged chasms within Piltover where Zaun has fallen. I realize I might get into trouble for this, but one of the nerdy projects that would fascinate and terrify me the most would be to make a comprehensive map of Piltover and Zaun. Like, it's a very difficult problem. Would folks here want to see such a thing? And if so, does anyone have any revolutionary ideas for how it might be represented? The cities are VERY 3d, so a traditional flat, topdown, map wouldn't cut it, imo.
Atgo (EUW)
: I think that this image already is in the map, but the map isn't working to me so I can't say for sure.
> [{quoted}](name=Atgo,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=8yWnAs10,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2018-09-21T16:25:52.424+0000) > > I think that this image already is in the map, but the map isn't working to me so I can't say for sure. Wait wait wait. The map isn't working for you? How can I help fix this?? Do you mind if we try some troubleshooting? What browser are you using, and platform/machine?
: A few questions
This image: https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/2/2b/Piltover_Zaun_Connected_Cities.jpg Is lovely for showing a cross-section of Piltover and Zaun, if that helps. (Same image as from the background of the old [Piltover and Zaun mini-site](https://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/featured/piltover) .)
: ok, but aren't the icathians the one's who unleashed the void on runeterra?
> [{quoted}](name=JoeAnarchy,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=6uP0Q5ng,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-09-18T23:38:49.464+0000) > > ok, but aren't the icathians the one's who unleashed the void on runeterra? It was only that one time and it was ages ago. Geez.
TBSkyen (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Bioluminescence,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=2FHdjGUr,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-09-11T04:03:07.029+0000) > > I watched this video this morning - pretty grim viewing :/ Folks here (and the OP, Noies) seem to be be the kind of players who have thought about this deeply - what do you all suggest for the future? > > Of course, we cannot change the past, and flip-flopping back would likely be the worst of all possible worlds. What do folks here think would be the best path ahead? > > I know this will probably turn into a "Yeah but I want to talk about how bad the past was!" discussion, but there is literally no time machine available (not even for poor Zilean or Ekko) - so what's your solution-orientated future? If you just want to rant at someone at Riot, I'm happy to take that on the chin though :) > > {{sticker:galio-happy}} > > Totally cool if you don't have suggestions - it's not incumbent on you to do so, after all, but I wanted to hear from folks who might have opinions and want to share them. ... I mean, I have some THOUGHTS to be sure...
Pff - who are YOU to have any... oh. Oh it's TBSkyen. Oh. Well. Hi. Your video seemed quite fair.
: Yes, but in those surveys some 80-90% of people vote almost exclusively for their mains, no? So naturally stronger champions and ones with good/new visuals will come out on top. I can't help but think Riot's caught in a bit of a feedback loop when it comes to champion popularity, and despite numerous people going out of their way to request lore on the boards, some hidden gems might never get a chance...
Not necessarily. There are champs that are strong that people aren't into the lore for, and other champs that are weak that people are interested in. Then, more weirdly, we find some champs are well understood, but the desire for more lore is very low - and other champs that are poorly understood and for some the desire for lore is very high, and others its low. Of course, there are some champs that are strong, have great theme, up to date kit and art, and are super popular - these things aren't completely disconnected. That's just natural. But the data isn't quite as cut and dried as it might initially seem.
: How can you tell which champion is popular by lore?
> [{quoted}](name=Chromatic Eagle,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=2FHdjGUr,comment-id=0005000800010001,timestamp=2018-09-11T21:02:54.323+0000) > > How can you tell which champion is popular by lore? We do a LOT of surveys, worldwide, of all kinds of players. We specifically ask whether players know about the lore of a champ, if they like the lore of the champ, if they'd like to learn more about the lore of a champ - all those kind of things. Its a frankly terrifying amount of data, and we have folks who very masterfully wrangle it into useful tables and charts to consume, but it's not the whole picture and we need to take into account other things too - but it's definitely one way to check if a champion is 'popular by lore'. :)
Zapzya (OCE)
: Also, have you considered marking champions on the Universe as "to be reworked"? A lot of the time I see "why bother reading when it could change at any time?" If people knew what was getting reworked and what wasn't, this kind of solves that problem. If you have, are there a few specific reasons you haven't done this?
To circle back (ha! buzzwords) on this, I checked in with Laurie/Scathlocke on this today, and apparently it IS something that's being discussed. The plan, I hear, would be to see about adding the little [fist-wrench/spanner symbol](https://cdn.segmentnext.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/League-of-Legends-Honor-Rework-Teaser.jpg) that we sometimes use to show that something is a work in progress. Apparently the idea was floated a little while ago, but he's going to prod people again to get some movement on it. I suspect it fell through the cracks with other things going on. So yay! Great minds think alike, or something :D
: Why not have the Institute of War be a Targonian thing? They are supposedly LIGHT YEARS above and beyond most mortal things on Runeterra, so Why not have it be a sort of Entertainment for them? This way very little really has to change in Runeterra except maybe a few champs (mostly Targon based). Hmmm, i think I may have worded it weird; hopefully my point comes across.
> [{quoted}](name=nosafterburn,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=2FHdjGUr,comment-id=0005000f,timestamp=2018-09-11T20:07:50.444+0000) > > Why not have the Institute of War be a Targonian thing? They are supposedly LIGHT YEARS above and beyond most mortal things on Runeterra, so Why not have it be a sort of Entertainment for them? This way very little really has to change in Runeterra except maybe a few champs (mostly Targon based). > Hmmm, i think I may have worded it weird; hopefully my point comes across. I dont think it's worded weird - but I'm not sure it solves the problems that people are talking about. Either the Targonians are using (fake/imitation) Champions to fight on the Rift for entertainment and there is no consequence, OR the Targonians teleport real Champions to fight for their entertainment and we have the problems of characters who aren't in control of their own destinies, meeting characters that might be in hiding, and learning about all their powers even if they've been trying to hide them (like seeing Swain transform, or knowing that Gangplank isn't dead).
: Yay, Sona main \o/ Excited about the new Odyssey skin? EDIT: sad about the poster with sticker, though :s That would be cool, if we could see it.
> [{quoted}](name=DeathBurs7,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=2FHdjGUr,comment-id=000500010000000200000000,timestamp=2018-09-11T20:08:41.699+0000) > > Yay, Sona main \o/ > Excited about the new Odyssey skin? > > EDIT: sad about the poster with sticker, though :s That would be cool, if we could see it. Somewhat excited! I think the skin is pretty cool, but the lore behind her in the Odyssey universe is what's got me properly excited. Been trying to catch up with it (reading the Universe site, and story, etc.) but today's been kinda busy :)
: I don't feel like you're putting words in my mouth, for sure! Good points, good questions. You may be right that I'm overstating it's significance. It's easy, as a player, to fall into the classic "passion trap." I think it's less about "meaning" and more about "context" for me. The game was happening within the story in a way that made that transition so smooth and interesting. I mean, not *every game* was literally part of a larger narrative, but the *structure* of the game was. I could rationalize, based on what I knew about the actual League of Legends and Runeterra, a reason why Dr. Mundo and Rek'Sai would be ganking this Renekton in the top lane. Maybe it was silly, maybe it felt contrived to the writers, but it was *unique.* Losing that might be a trade-off that I have to live with; it's not like I abandoned the game, after all. But it costs so much in terms of champion interaction. I mean, Aatrox has all these cool taunts for other champs. In the old lore, you could imagine him using those! Now, it's a long shot that Aatrox would even *meet* those champions in the canon. If Garen and Darius, for instance, *actually* met in the lore, one of them is likely to die. That makes it hard to write compelling stories about them. *But*, if they met on the Fields of Justice, they could debate politics and military strategy while tearing each other's limbs off. And after one of them dies, they just come back and continue the argument! That's badass! So yeah, the old League of Legends was a bit contrived. But the new lore is restrictive in a whole new way by limiting interaction between champions! Where will Garen and Kata get to play out their romance? How many times can Lucian realistically expect to fight Thresh before one of them actually wins that fight for good? When is Zilean supposed to comment on how ridiculous Volibear looks? All these questions don't have good answers now, because the champions are spread out across the world. Like yeah, Ryze can meet all them because he travels (and that cinematic was *killer*), but it's a poor substitute for the IoW so far. I want our arena of champions back. They can still interact off the Fields of Justice, too, and have cool story arcs. I *love* the improvements to story telling that Riot made. But, I don't understand why we can't have that *and* put SR in the context of Runeterra.
Sorry to sound like a broken record, but I think there are still multiple angles here :) You start out saying that it's about context - and I get that. You want to be able to rationalize that Dr. Mundo and Rek'Sai are fighting on the same side, and that it _could_ have greater meaning. Then, however, you talk about wanting the champ interactions to be 'real' - that Thresh has near infinite opportunities to taunt Lucian about the fate of Senna, because they really are meeting each other's real selves in a game. This one seems like there may be more to unpack. I could, for example, totally get it if the underlying desire was to see champs interacting more often. I'd totally get that. Our champs in the 'canon' lore haven't done as much interacting as I'd like to see - not by a long shot. So if the urge is that seeing them interacting through the medium of the game gives almost endless opportunities to explore the personality clashes and conflicts, then I'd get that. I'm not sure it is the right way to solve that urge, but I'd get it. My worry would be that, after the eleventybillionth time Thresh has taunted Lucian about his wife, it might get a bit old. Of course, that could get mitigated if we argued that, in 'real canon' lore, there are only a handful of matches of Runeterra League that are ever actually played - then we could do some exploration that doesn't outstay its welcome. The game then, would be "not a real match" but a "what if" match. Your match would still 'not matter', but it would look similar to a match that did matter. A bit like wargamers playing out the Battle of Waterloo, or Custers Last Stand, on their big diorama tables. It's not the real Battle of Waterloo - it may even have a different outcome - but it's a re-enactment of a real thing. Is that the sort of way you imagine it? The questions about 'how many times can Lucian realistically expect to fight Thresh before one of them actually wins that fight for good?' is a fine question - but the opposite is also true. How many times are Lucian and Thresh realistically supposed to face off in enforced, never-ending, battle, before one or the other loses his mind or just shuts down? That's why I think there would need to be more (but different) constraints on what the game would have to be, if it became 'real' in Runeterra. Then, it's a question of - does this toothless version still satisfy the needs that we're identifying, or does it do so more poorly than other solutions might be able to. To be clear, after all my rambling - I am in no way discounting the player pain that's being felt. I'm trying to separate the needs from the solution, to ensure that it's the best solution, and not just the most familiar one. Tricky to do!
: > [{quoted}](name=Bioluminescence,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=2FHdjGUr,comment-id=000500090000,timestamp=2018-09-11T16:17:08.444+0000) > > I think the difficulty of finding them has affected Rioters too, in the past. Some might not have known a specific one existed (unforgivable, but possible with documentation getting lost/deleted, etc.) or believing that so few people knew about them that what was contained within was more trouble than it's worth (also possible, though not very charitable). Hopefully we're getting better at ensuring our documentation is without gaps, so the former should be less likely to occur. Whether or not it's more trouble than its worth is a brutal but honest question, really. Writers are under a great many constraints and sometimes discarding one or two that are particularly binding feels like it's the only way to really improve the quality of a characterization. I hope that with their accessibility increasing, writers will have more time to let the details settle in their head and the puzzle pieces will fit together more elegantly, but that's on an individual basis (champ and writer). Whether it's worth it or not is a fair question, though one that I'd argue has a somewhat simple answer, too. The people who care about things being drastically changed, are likely also the ones who are most into the lore at the first place. Lore is a somewhat niche thing when it comes to games, as a lot of people tend to focus on gameplay alone, or only briefly skim the backstory of whatever champion they happen to play the most. Assuming this is the case, and assuming that doing the lore update has 'worth' in the first place, wouldn't it also stand to reason that the greater worth would be the satisfy the people who both know the most about the lore overall, rather than striving for some deadline set to get lore out to everyone by a certain time, even if the majority of them don't really care about it in the first place? I'd argue that there's a difference between various deadlines in game design, and how firmly one should adhere to them. Game breaking bug? Yeah, that needs to be fixed, and quickly too. Reworks for champions? Well a lot of people are probably waiting for more exciting gameplay for champions who either rarely see play, or are just painfully in need of new kits. But background lore? I'd argue that's the sorta thing you can take far longer with, and have more fluid deadlines, given that the people who care the most about such things, are likely more willing to wait for things that fit the story they've gotten used to, rather than having something -now- that may not fit at all. That aside, if you actually are going through the effort of documenting things that have been hard to find, what are the chances of going through some of the reworks you've made already, and changing a few things to make them fit with what was either forgotten or ignored? Taking as an example the old Observation/Reflection story for Vayne; it'd take rather little for the memory presented there to fit into her reworked lore. All that'd have to be changed was her actually being present when her parents were killed, and perhaps a bit younger when it happened.
I agree with you that certain fixes are clearer than others - from a game dev background, I'm familiar with Class A/1 Crit Path Blockers, all the way down to Priority 6 Suggestions (which, alas, traditionally get benched for the sequel, maybe). And it can be easy to prioritize the ones that stop games from happening, or have an impact on many players simultaneously. It's also easier to say "Well if we change this number from 1.2 to 1.25, sentiment goes up by 0.4pts." - thus, it might be something to look into doing. It's much harder to evaluate whether updating a bio in a divergent way (breaking/new/etc.) from the old bio would be considered a good thing or a bad thing. There's lots of arguments to be made about whether an original fantasy was too niche, and that finding a new angle might actually result in more people excited by and drawn to the champion than the original direction could reach. (Which would be the counter to your suggestion that the very people most effected by lore updates are the ones who value the old lore - I think you're right, but it's a not unreasonable counter argument.) Lots of stuff to argue about from that angle - but thankfully that argument has been made and settled. And the side that it settled on was that we do not want to diverge from the original fantasy of a champion any more. That's the intention, but the execution hasn't been perfect so far (quite a few missteps and experiments so far).
: Any chance you could share this list with us once it’s been updated, Bio? There are some champions who are in a weird place at the moment where their lore has been brought up to date with the modern world but they’re still on the list for major VGUs in the future, which could potentially alter their themes in big ways and therefore their narratives and place in the story. As a result, it’s a bit unclear whether their lore is here to stay or if it will get changed again — Quinn, Skarner, Mordekaiser, and Shyvana are all good examples of this.
I was just going to start with the champs that are yet to be properly updated (folks who only have short bios - like my main, Sona) and then check to see what's on the docket for major updates, etc. If I uncovered information not yet player facing, it wouldn't really be my place to make it player facing :( It's possible that it would reveal (or suggest!) future update plans that we've not talked about yet. So, I don't know. :/
: Thank you for taking the time to respond and listen to my points. It's very good to hear that people on Riot's end are noticing how simplified the world is becoming, and I'm hoping there will be paths taken to correct it. I do agree that some elements can be tied together and still be functional (like I mentioned, the Watchers and Void fit pretty well), so I'm not against it, I'm just against doing that for everything. Like if the Shadow Isles and the Blessed Waters somehow become related to the Aspects of Targon, I think I'll be really pissed. I'll look forward to seeing how Scathelocke will be moving forward with keeping the consistencies of characters intact. I'm not terribly reassured considering how poorly the Lissandra bio turned out, but I'll not lose hope. In that vein, regarding the slip ups, I would rather there be _no release at all if a deadline is being pushed and there's not quality work_ rather than poor quality work be released just to satiate a deadline. In terms of lore, there will always be some other time to release it, so I just want to emphasize that I would prefer quality, even it takes longer, than quantity.
>I would rather there be no release at all if a deadline is being pushed and there's not quality work rather than poor quality work be released just to satiate a deadline. QFE. I would be super interested to know if we have more data on whether yours is a common sentiment on this. I mean, it's hard to say I suppose, because quality and expediency are both analogue and their importance varies with every player. Is "pretty good" + "now" good enough? What if the next window was 6 months from now? Does that make "pretty good" + "now" good enough?? Horrible questions to ask and I don't know what the answer is. Ideally all content would be the best it possibly can be before releasing - and I don't know if it's like this for writers (I am a game designer by trade) but I know that eventually you reach diminishing returns and just have to ship. Especially if delaying for an extra percentage of improvement is delaying something else. Ugh. I hate even having these as things that are considered. I'd rather everything was released great, or not at all, myself too! However, I think it would be _very_ powerful to find out if that's a growing sentiment (or not growing - already popular!) with other lore-invested players. The calssic Shigeru Miyamoto quote seems very relevant here.
Show more

Bioluminescence

Level 44 (NA)
Lifetime Upvotes
Create a Discussion