: One Change for each Champion
Favorite: {{champion:62}} - going off the PBE changes that were up, let his decoy move a short distance in an area to increase it's deceptiveness. Least favorite: {{champion:92}} - Resource bar. As the bar fills up, she gains use of her Q and W CCs (we'll say at 50% of the bar), as well as her E dash range increasing slightly at a max bar. AA'ing increases the bar by a small margin, Taking damage or being out of combat lowers the bar and Ulting fills the bar half way. Random: {{champion:432}} - every time he collects enough chimes to gain an extra meep, he doots
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: July 19
Honestly I don't believe any plans thought up will fix prestige skins. The whole idea of the skins is being a white and gold/yellow versions of another skin that already exists, but most of the time the existing skin already looks better and isn't worth the effort to try to get either way. They seem to only exist to satisfy this notion of "once it's gone, it's gone. so get it while supplies last". IMO, the work done on Prestige skins should just be shifted back to getting at least one more skin per champ each patch (especially as the roster increases, we will need to have more champs per skin release cycle to keep up) or at the very least, spent working on Ultimate skins which honestly I have been concerned about since the beginning of the year may have been scrapped for prestige skins (weather or not this is the case would be nice to find out straight from a Rioter). If the issue is making exclusive skins, we already have those in the form of Victorious skins, gemstone skins to a certain degree and a few other one off skins like Urfwick. we do not need an exclusive skin to be released every patch. one or two exclusive skins a year is fine, but EVERY patch takes up time that could be spent on a skin for another champ who could REALLY use a skin. especially since the work on prestige skins has had to increase to make it more then a white and gold chroma of the related skin.
: Psst, Riot: WE GET IT.
**Riot**: How are {{champion:103}} and {{champion:62}} related in their lores? guess you'll have to find out :^) _Inb4 it turns out they just passed by each other in a market one day and were like "oh hey, a Vastaya. neat."_
Sillae (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Blue Moon Wolf,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=HiYpQwXL,comment-id=00050000000000010000,timestamp=2019-07-16T23:48:13.673+0000) > > When you have a wolf face, tail and legs, going around tearing people up like a wild animal. I'm pretty sure that takes you out of "just deformed"... Not necessarily, and these lines seem arbitrary. Wolf face? Hypertrichosis, aka "Werewolf Disease." Tail? The human's tail is usually absorbed during fetal development.. but sometimes that doesn't happen and people are born with tails. Legs? Deformity of the legs is common. Tearing people up like a wild animal? You know humans can go feral too, right? Just curious, do you consider the stock kind of werewolves to be human? You know, the by day a normal person by night a savage monster?
I consider Werewolves fiction to be honest.-. Though to seriously answer the question, I consider Werewolf to be Humans that become monsters at night when the moon is full... maybe at the smell of blood in the air if there are any stories like that. I don't believe things like werewolves can be so cut and dry as to call them one or the other. the idea of "a monster" doesn't really exist in real life outside of people who are considered monsters based on their horrendous actions, which violently ripping people apart to eat them... *kind of* puts a person in that category. It makes it even harder to say one or the other when you think about all the forms of fiction they show up in, varying from "human but covered in hair" to "wolf on two legs" to even "I hardly even recognize that as a werewolf, why is that even listed as one?". with most works of fiction, the interpretation tends to be left up to the person designing the story, then the person experiencing the story if it is left up to them to decide.
Sillae (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Blue Moon Wolf,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=HiYpQwXL,comment-id=000500000000,timestamp=2019-07-16T21:01:33.080+0000) > > Yea, he's NOT a human in the normal universe. he WAS. You can't call Warwick human anymore. that's like saying a giant dog walking on two legs is still human because his ID card says so. The lore is there to give a reason to why he's a monster, not to define him as a human. You take the lore away you are not calling him a human. This kinda goes into the philosophical territory of "what measure is a human" and whatnot. I mean his form is the result of a mad scientist's experimentation and while his body has been desiccated beyond recognition, I don't think the brain has been replaced, though it is heavily influenced by chemicals. If we judge a person's "personhood" based on their form, what exactly is the line? Do people with horrific body changing diseases, such as the ever delightful "skin turns to bone" (FOP) disease get considered inhuman because at the end of their lives they are essentially living statues? What of Joseph Merrick, the real life famous "Elephant Man" with deformities so extensive some people didn't even recognize him as a human but as a monster or beast?
When you have a wolf face, tail and legs, going around tearing people up like a wild animal. I'm pretty sure that takes you out of "just deformed"... Besides, the argument is apparently only humans can have a project skin which APPARENTLY isn't the case for Program which is in the same universe yet doesn't follow any rules like this as 2 humans HAVE been used on them. If it's all human, then what is the supposed cut off for Program? It's not just "non-humans" so what rule does it follow and why didn't the humans that are in that skin line get project skins?
PotPye (NA)
: He's a human in PROJECT and since this is the PROJECT skin line is doesn't matter what he may be in the normal universe.
That is the point I'm trying to make for the other champs. what he was saying is that because he was human in the normal universe that it means he's allowed to have a project skin while other champs are not which isn't the case. Project is it's own universe with it's own rules, the humanity of a character in the normal lore is not a deciding factor for the skins. Hell, Pyke confirmed Program to be in the universe and that has TWO humans in the normal lore. if human in the normal lore was the deciding factor, then what is the supposed deciding factor of what champs are program?
: Riot has confirmed that Warwick isn't changing the human only rule, and that he is human in that universe. Also, another requirement is that PROJECTs have to have a significant weapon. Xerath isn't a human, and he has no weapon. Thus, no PROJECT skin. Program, though? Definitely.
Yea, he's NOT a human in the normal universe. he WAS. You can't call Warwick human anymore. that's like saying a giant dog walking on two legs is still human because his ID card says so. The lore is there to give a reason to why he's a monster, not to define him as a human. You take the lore away you are not calling him a human.
: The fact that PROJECTs need to have a significant weapon is what's stopping Xerath. As for the others, Riot confirmed that the human only rule is still in place, and that its not changing.
That is NOT confirmed and Warwick doesn't prove it in any way. he is pretty much the farthest thing from human you can get without him not being born human. The fact is you hate the idea and you are making up rules to suit your needs. Yea, Riot showed a face under there. All THAT confirms is that Riot needs at least some way to make them human before their transformation. Pretty much any champ can and likely WILL fit under that rule so long as Riot can fix it that way, which they WILL once they run out of human popular champs to throw into that line, cause GOD FOR BID if they started using unpopular ones.
: Riot has stated that Warwick doesn't change that rule, and Warwick is actually human in his skin(you can see his face in his recall), and that the lore will explain it.
Wukong can easily be made a human who got a tail with cybernetic implants in this lore. Pretty much every Vastaya can be counted as even IN THE LORE, they are all part human as their distant ancestors had children with humans to make the Vastaya. Vastaya have human genetics in their veins. What's more, If we are only counting characters who were human once and became monstrous more along the lines of Warwick (as someone who was human before), then what is to stop Nasus, Azir or even Xerath from getting a Project skin? They were ALL human before they ascended. Realistically, they could easily make them part of the skin line as volunteers to become projects for various reasons. I don't see why you are so hard focused on limiting skins to certain groups, especially when Riot is just going to turn around and change the rules to make sure all their popular champs can fit.
Jakra (EUW)
: Can we take a sec to appreciate WW's new skin? Especially when they show the fact that he's human?
I don't care what anyone says, this SHOWS the skin line isn't 100% human only. you can say he WAS human till the cows come home but the fact remains that you would not call THIS --> {{champion:19}} a human anymore. Anyone who is at least humanoid could get a project skin, Even from looking at {{champion:555}} recall gives an idea that even a monstrous looking champ could fit in the skin line so long as they were are human with a bit a monster robotic suit fused with them. they could even make a skin like "Project {{champion:101}} " So long as they talk about him being human before then becoming some kind of energy cyborg.
: Prestige edition skins are...
Don't forget how at least so far they have pretty much replaced the 1 Ultimate skin per year. Why make a skin with tons of bells and whistles selling for 30 bucks when you can release multiple gold and white chromas of cheaper skins that bring in more money right?
: project jinx is honestly very disappointing
Don't worry, not like she won't get another skin in like 8 months or so :L
: So from now every skin line will contain prestige? Pls no...
Sadly, that's the case now. I even remember the guy who did the "State of skins" video saying "I know how you all like prestige skins" like it was a joke to him... and here we are...
: Seriously, they could have solved a lot of this by going with a "Virus" or "Malware" group as a sort of antithesis to Program. Champions like Twitch, Cassiopeia, Singed, Teemo, Warwick; anything that shows itself as broken, corrupted, or with the intent to cause such statuses. Even Jinx would fit in nicely with said aesthetic.
ah, that sounds amazing. could even have a reverse color scheme with sort of buggy looking particle effects similar to Program, but more like broken code.
Meritas (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Blue Moon Wolf,realm=NA,application-id=Ir7ZrJjF,discussion-id=QRmELGdm,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-07-14T18:35:29.621+0000) > > I don't think you understand the concept of "this champ gets 2 skins 6 months apart from each other while this one's going on 4 years". Popularity isn't the problem, it's them spaming popular champs as hard as they do. When does the money and time spend on popular champs trickle down to the unpopular ones? Or is this trend just going to keep increasing as Riot loses more money to the point that only 5 champs get skins? So, when a popular champion's player base buys enough skins to fund another release, Riot should instead spend it on Project Orn?
In a snarky manor of speaking, yes. Riot shouldn't be spending ALL their resources on 15 champs when they have 140, each with players hoping to get SOMETHING for their main. Shouldn't be spinning Riots wheel of forgotten skins, then spinning the wheel of lesser champs and slapping the results of both of them together into some random mess just so say "we released something for you", once every 3-4 years. It's not like the mains of those champs don't give ideas of what they want. Rioters are on social media, they see concept posts and fan art of skins that people want for their mains (and in a lot of cases, not mains but the mains showing a lot of support for the idea). It's not asking for a lot for Riot to see those and make a skin similar to what those mains are enjoying concepts for.
: > [{quoted}](name=Blue Moon Wolf,realm=NA,application-id=Ir7ZrJjF,discussion-id=QRmELGdm,comment-id=000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-14T20:27:09.952+0000) > > I'm saying that being iconic means more then being someone like Ivern who was MADE (as Riot mentioned for his creation) to be "niche", resulting in skins no one one wanted after a long wait. It's why Garen get's nice skins even though he'll never be in LC$, it's why Jayce gets a spot in Riots new Battle Academy skin even though he's pretty much on the side lines these days. To Riot this is "charity" to unpopular champs. But do you REALLY think Garen counts as unpopular? > > Mr. Spin-to-win, bush master, face of demacia himself? He's an easy sell for skins cause he's easily recognizable. Shaco is pretty much the games Joker. I won't say he's popular now cause he's not. But using him as an example of Riot giving unpopular champs good skins is a poor example. Show me the good skins for {{champion:38}} who is YEARS away from any kind of rework if he's even getting one, THEN I'll start believing Riot is spreading the wealth. while i can agree with this in garens case this doesn't really apply to jayce or shaco. Garen is and will most likely stay the face of demacia. The face of one of the biggest most iconic factions. shaco barely has lore, isn't part of a franchise and had to wait 4 years for a skin, the fact that he has some notoriety didn't help him. i'm not too familiar with jayce, but his previous skin was literally a 750 in 2016. i think he deserved some love? > The point is NOT accepting it. Jhin getting one within 6 months of each other is dumb too. Saying "oh well" and saying it's okay for it to keep happening isn't the right way to go about it. This trend gets worse and we are looking at the same champs getting skins 3 months apart. Meanwhile Riot ISN'T increasing how many skins they are making, which is another point of context. If they were making more skins for more champs it wouldn't be an issue but they aren't. In fact they are pretty much remaking the same skin for one champ twice and spending remaining resources on alternate colors for those same skins. So if they are decreasing the time frame between popular champs getting skins and not increasing how many skins go out, where does that leave unpopular champs? I'd be fine with that if the boards complained about this stuff equally, but they don't so i don't see why i should. i have no idea how many skins are made a year so i'm not gonna get into that. nor do i know a damned thing about running a big company so idk how easily they could just hire an extra skins team. > It's not just me on that one by far. the majority of people (not just on the boards mind you) didn't like it. In fact it's you likeing the skin that doesn't factor into this. He was hated by a majority of players. Honestly when I first heard about it I got the lanky body thing and honestly thought of that one guy from Fosters Home for Imaginary Friends. But the majority of people were complaining about him not a "dunk" of some kind (there were requests to rename it to something like Point guard Ivern or something) and from the mains they just disliked waiting as long as they did only to get a skin they had no interest in. > > The meme is what made it happen, and that was after years and years and YEARS of asking. Possibly since his release, I wouldn't know cause I wasn't around that far back, but everyone had been asking for that skin for a very long time before it finally became a thing. So we have a skin noone asked for that didn't do too well because of it's name, and a skin that was heavily requested that still didn't do well. It's almost as if riot can't guarantee everyone likes it. them putting kai'sa in the spotlight but it being stolen by akali is another example of that. They don't control the reception of a skin. and let's not mention some of the genuinly impossible requests some ivern mains had. > I will give you that, 1 perfect year isn't something you can always expect. But I will say it wouldn't have been too much of a stretch if they waited like 2 months to make the skins. Like, these skins come out every 2 weeks. We know they have skins that are at least close to being done by the time of another skins release. they couldn't have slowed down work on one skin line and increased work on others that they know will be coming anyway (aside from obviously holiday skins and such for more obvious reasons)? In the long run what's the point of that? and then you're gonna have the same groups every time. > But he's not the only evilish, knife wielding champ in the game that works. {{champion:91}} being the big one people have brought up as a good one for the skin, {{champion:36}} could have been pretty interesting as it would be a HUGE change from how we normally see him as a goofy doctor man, {{champion:56}} would be interesting, {{champion:6}} basically fits this new batch of Project skins as well as Warwick, and {{champion:2}} would have made for a great option. There ARE good options if Riot looked for them, but they never do. but he's the only one who genuinly had his mind altered in the lore, which is important in PROJECT. "Captains told me to kill fish, fish told me to kill captains" can easily be adapted to the project setting with him being a rogue unit and that's basically his whole lore summed up. Talon is heavily requested, i don't see why aside from his parkour fitting the setting. He'd function much easier in a position similar to either zed or jhin in the universe. Mundo idk how even. Nocturn strays too far from a human and would most likely end up as a program(i'm aware of ww, i'll get to that with urgot). Olaf could work, but not more than the current line up. Now urgot is a different case, i personally had an idea for both Urgot and WW based around a project scientist singed concept. The main reasoning behind that is that they're quite humanoid for monsters and already augmented with chemtech. And it seems riot has the same idea with WW atleast, he got it urgot didn't.
>i'm not too familiar with jayce, but his previous skin was literally a 750 in 2016. i think he deserved some love? Hold up, his last skin was THAT long ago? and it was only a 750 skin to boot? Yea, I can see why people were okay with him getting that skin now. Though tbf I think that should have qualified him for the 1820 RP skin instead of the slightly cheaper one without new voice lines .-. >Talon is heavily requested, i don't see why aside from his parkour fitting the setting. He'd function much easier in a position similar to either zed or jhin in the universe. From what I gather, exactly the reason Zed or Jhin are in it. Plus he doesn't have a cybernetic type skin yet which... well, looking at all the robotic/cybernetic skin lines (battlecast, Program, Mecha, Project, Lancer, Cyberpop technically, maybe some others that escape my knowledge atm) It's very popular concept for people, likely cause as gamers we tend to have an affinity to technology based things (but that's going into a whole other topic @_@). >Now urgot is a different case, i personally had an idea for both Urgot and WW based around a project scientist singed concept. The main reasoning behind that is that they're quite humanoid for monsters and already augmented with chemtech. And it seems riot has the same idea with WW atleast, he got it urgot didn't. Well, kind of hope next time they do include Urgot in the future. Honestly I used him as a quick example but the more I think about it the more I wish he had a Project skin >_>
Rylalei (EUNE)
: Valve just released 2 sets for Drow Ranger in the Collector's Cache treasures, not even a month between the two treasure released, and those are limited quality, so get them now or never have them deal and Drow is currently a very popular hero, so..... I think your point just fell.
Not really, that's one example from Dota. Smite, Warframe, even Overwatch have a much larger time gap between releases and none of those rosters even amount to Leagues (I'd give more examples, but most of the games that I play have nowhere near the same structure to compare). For a lot of those games they could be forgiven for releasing a few skins and such close together since some of them only have like 40+ characters. If they release 5 skins for 40 champs and spread them out evenly, that'd only be about 8 months before all the characters got a skin. League has over 140... There is far less room to say "it's okay that 10 champs get skins all the time".
: > [{quoted}](name=Blue Moon Wolf,realm=NA,application-id=Ir7ZrJjF,discussion-id=QRmELGdm,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-14T19:20:07.746+0000) > > Dude, that's one out of how many skins this year? Meanwhile we see Dunkmaster Ivern which hardly anyone wanted When people have been spam Dunkmaster Illoai for who knows how long. Not to mention Shaco is iconic. He isn't popular, but we all know the jester champ who throws a dagger at your back when you least expect it. A lot of people may not play him a lot but he does get used decently and when he's good he's used all the time. Saying Shaco is proof riot gives skins to less popular champs is like saying "The fire fighters put out most of the fire" meanwhile the fire just spread over to the buildings next to it. > You are trying to justify Riot releasing skins for popular champs 6 months between each other with "they made a skin for one unpopular champ that had been waiting **4**". So you're showing shaco isn't allowed in the neglected champs club as usual. Usually i don't accept 6 month spans, but since jhin was allowed to have this happen i don't see why others shouldn't be allowed to have that. Even then they could be skipped next year, like jhin was which made his spree perfectly acceptable as he evens out at 1skin/year. So if he's good he's played alot, not really. when he's busted he's played alot, because a shaco being good often depends on the player quite a bit. And the same could be said about plenty other champs. when rek sai is busted she sees a bunch of play, when wu is busted he sees a bunch of play, tham right now sees play cuz he's busted not popular. ivern was given a skin, you not liking it isn't a factor in this. fuck i played jinx without skins until slayer got released and didn't use a different one until odyssey was released because i simply think the others are worse than her base skin. but i'm not out here saying she didn't get anything, and SG is plenty popular. I actually liked dunkmaster ivern, it fit just fine with his lanky body. and baker pantheon wasn't that popular while it was heavily requested. > I'll be honest, even 1 year for popular champs and 3 for unpopular champs is technically fair. but SIX MONTHS?. And this is coming from someone who LIKES Irelia. I like the champ and all and I'm happy to see her get skins. But by no means does she need one when her last one was 10 months ago. warwick, jinx and irelia are all on a yearly skin cycle atm, which is perfectly fair and is never gonna be a perfect 1 year time period between them. irelia and warwick had previously not been receiving that treatment, while jinx has been for the last few years and overall comes out at 1skin/year since release. akali had her skin quite a bit early but if she has to wait till somewhere late next year again she doesn't deviate from the 1 year cycle. Pyke is simply a case of being a perfect fit the way it only made sense for the main female academy character to be lux if ezreal is the main male one, unfortunate but chances are he'll see a year without skin. none of this changes the fact that ezreal and lux skins are what the playerbase is asking for. ma guy has 33% playrate while being trash.
> So you're showing shaco isn't allowed in the neglected champs club as usual I'm saying that being iconic means more then being someone like Ivern who was MADE (as Riot mentioned for his creation) to be "niche", resulting in skins no one one wanted after a long wait. It's why Garen get's nice skins even though he'll never be in LC$, it's why Jayce gets a spot in Riots new Battle Academy skin even though he's pretty much on the side lines these days. To Riot this is "charity" to unpopular champs. But do you REALLY think Garen counts as unpopular? Mr. Spin-to-win, bush master, face of demacia himself? He's an easy sell for skins cause he's easily recognizable. Shaco is pretty much the games Joker. I won't say he's popular now cause he's not. But using him as an example of Riot giving unpopular champs good skins is a poor example. Show me the good skins for {{champion:38}} who is YEARS away from any kind of rework if he's even getting one, THEN I'll start believing Riot is spreading the wealth. > Usually i don't accept 6 month spans, but since jhin was allowed to have this happen i don't see why others shouldn't be allowed to have that. The point is NOT accepting it. Jhin getting one within 6 months of each other is dumb too. Saying "oh well" and saying it's okay for it to keep happening isn't the right way to go about it. This trend gets worse and we are looking at the same champs getting skins 3 months apart. Meanwhile Riot ISN'T increasing how many skins they are making, which is another point of context. If they were making more skins for more champs it wouldn't be an issue but they aren't. In fact they are pretty much remaking the same skin for one champ twice and spending remaining resources on alternate colors for those same skins. So if they are decreasing the time frame between popular champs getting skins and not increasing how many skins go out, where does that leave unpopular champs? >ivern was given a skin, you not liking it isn't a factor in this. fuck i played jinx without skins until slayer got released and didn't use a different one until odyssey was released because i simply think the others are worse than her base skin. but i'm not out here saying she didn't get anything, and SG is plenty popular. I actually liked dunkmaster ivern, it fit just fine with his lanky body. It's not just me on that one by far. the majority of people (not just on the boards mind you) didn't like it. In fact it's you likeing the skin that doesn't factor into this. He was hated by a majority of players. Honestly when I first heard about it I got the lanky body thing and honestly thought of that one guy from Fosters Home for Imaginary Friends. But the majority of people were complaining about him not a "dunk" of some kind (there were requests to rename it to something like Point guard Ivern or something) and from the mains they just disliked waiting as long as they did only to get a skin they had no interest in. >and baker pantheon wasn't that popular while it was heavily requested. The meme is what made it happen, and that was after years and years and YEARS of asking. Possibly since his release, I wouldn't know cause I wasn't around that far back, but everyone had been asking for that skin for a very long time before it finally became a thing. >warwick, jinx and irelia are all on a yearly skin cycle atm, which is perfectly fair and is never gonna be a perfect 1 year time period between them. I will give you that, 1 perfect year isn't something you can always expect. But I will say it wouldn't have been too much of a stretch if they waited like 2 months to make the skins. Like, these skins come out every 2 weeks. We know they have skins that are at least close to being done by the time of another skins release. they couldn't have slowed down work on one skin line and increased work on others that they know will be coming anyway (aside from obviously holiday skins and such for more obvious reasons)? >Pyke is simply a case of being a perfect fit the way it only made sense for the main female academy character to be lux if ezreal is the main male one, unfortunate but chances are he'll see a year without skin. But he's not the only evilish, knife wielding champ in the game that works. {{champion:91}} being the big one people have brought up as a good one for the skin, {{champion:36}} could have been pretty interesting as it would be a HUGE change from how we normally see him as a goofy doctor man, {{champion:56}} would be interesting, {{champion:6}} basically fits this new batch of Project skins as well as Warwick, and {{champion:2}} would have made for a great option. There ARE good options if Riot looked for them, but they never do.
: > [{quoted}](name=Blue Moon Wolf,realm=NA,application-id=Ir7ZrJjF,discussion-id=QRmELGdm,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-07-14T18:35:29.621+0000) > > I don't think you understand the concept of "this champ gets 2 skins 6 months apart from each other while this one's going on 4 years". Popularity isn't the problem, it's them spaming popular champs as hard as they do. i like how shaco just got a new skin after 4 years but y'all easily forgot about that real quick. or when jhin got 3 skins in 1 year and noone had an issue with that. but there's no way the boards also show favouritism right? still the majority of the playerbase doesn't give a damn about who gets a skin as long as their champ gets one, and when a champ is popular there's a bigger part of the playerbase asking it. this meme woulda been decent if you had atleast just swapped playerbase with the boards.
Dude, that's one out of how many skins this year? Meanwhile we see Dunkmaster Ivern which hardly anyone wanted When people have been spam Dunkmaster Illoai for who knows how long. Not to mention Shaco is iconic. He isn't popular, but we all know the jester champ who throws a dagger at your back when you least expect it. A lot of people may not play him a lot but he does get used decently and when he's good he's used all the time. Saying Shaco is proof riot gives skins to less popular champs is like saying "The fire fighters put out most of the fire" meanwhile the fire just spread over to the buildings next to it. You are trying to justify Riot releasing skins for popular champs 6 months between each other with "they made a skin for one unpopular champ that had been waiting **4**". I'll be honest, even 1 year for popular champs and 3 for unpopular champs is technically fair. but SIX MONTHS?. And this is coming from someone who LIKES Irelia. I like the champ and all and I'm happy to see her get skins (This project one also looks pretty nice from what I've seen from the teaser). But by no means does she need one when her last one was 10 months ago.
: i don't think you understand the concept of either "popular" or "playerbase"
I don't think you understand the concept of "this champ gets 2 skins 6 months apart from each other while this one's going on 4 years". Popularity isn't the problem, it's them spaming popular champs as hard as they do. When does the money and time spend on popular champs trickle down to the unpopular ones? Or is this trend just going to keep increasing as Riot loses more money to the point that only 5 champs get skins?
: My take/issue with the new PROJECT reveal
I've been feeling this for the past few years now. Every time people have just said "popular champs sell more so get over it" but I have NEVER seen a company focus this hard on popular champs. I can't think of one game, let alone a MOBA that would spam skins this hard on popular champs. But for some reason it's fine cause Riot's making money cause of it. It would be fine if the money was going back into making something nice for the less popular champs. New lore, nice videos with unpopular champs in them, something. But it's not. the money goes right back into making more stuff for the popular champs. the rich get richer, the poor get poorer. Riot is pretty much beyond the point of redemption in the skin department. They are going to make skins for popular champs and while everyone will make excuses about thematics and such, what it really boils down to is money. Riot wants it, so they will squeeze as much as possible out of the community as possible. If you like an unpopular champ, then your out of luck cause that champ doesn't bring in any money.
: So do anybody know when Riot will make another Rek'sai skin, or any other skin in general?
Likely when the current popular champs aren't popular anymore. I wish I was kidding, but sad thing that I've just come to realize is Riot won't give decent skins for less popular champs anymore. They decided all they care about is money from popular champs and putting them into popular skin lines to make even more money. Any unpopular champ is just going to get a throw away skin so they can say they did something for them, about 3 years down the line. If you want skins for unpopular characters, sadly you'll have to play a game like Smite that releases so many skins that pretty much everyone gets something.
Rioter Comments
Sukishoo (NA)
: True. Some of the releases this year, Cait, already got a PP skin anyway so they had to milk her somewhere else. Then we've seen things like Yasuo, Kai'sa, Sivir, Pyke (who gets two skins this year), and others that could have probably worked well in the theme. PP K/DA crossover... so like the "K/DA On Vacation" idea from the fake leak, got it XD
After "Pajama Party Star Guardian", I wouldn't put it past Riot to try it sadly .__.
Sukishoo (NA)
: Doesn't look like there will be a pool party this year considering we had Arcade and now Project already. Star Guardian is probably up next after Project. We do have till September when following the summer season but could be another year without one.
of course there isn't pool party this year, all the popular champs who they could make tons of money off of them have already been used this year. We'll have to tune in next year for the Pool Party KD/A cross over skin :^)
Arcade Lulu (EUNE)
: Still better than Project Kai'sa {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-popcorn}} I don't really understand why Jinx would get a project skin. But pyke is a good candidate imo
Because Riot reserves the good skins for their premium champs that I'm sure they'd force you to pay RP for if they could. At this point I feel like Riot has doubled down so hard on their notion of popular skins for popular champs that we have to hope for unpopular skin lines to be made JUST so unpopular champs can get something :L
: I cannot comprehend the favouritism Riot has about Pyke. Not only is he always overbuffed, but he is also getting ANOTHER SKIN AFTER HE GOT BLOODMOON IN JANUARY THIS YEAR? But it's alright. I'll wait untill 2087 for the new Xerath chroma.
Don't forget Jinx. This will now be the 3rd big skin line she'll be in, not counting holiday skins (counting them it's 6)... meanwhile you can't even ask Riot to give a decent skin to a majority of the lesser champs in Riots hierarchy. Seriously I understand "popular champs sell". People can scream that to the ends of the earth, but it doesn't change the fact that less popular champs can't ever get anything because of this crap.
man of tin (EUNE)
: Could be Nocturne, his ult pretty much does some sort of blackout thing.
If it is, then I think that would be the most deserving champ out of the group for it tbh... also kills the idea people have in their heads that it's a human only skin line which I'd be all for.
: how is TK on the popular side. He literally got nerfed out of support so hard that he fell to top lane.
... read it again... I'm literally saying he's not popular and because of that, we won't be seeing him in any cool videos...
usul1202 (NA)
: What's your 'it happened in a dream' skin?
**Arcade** {{champion:62}} For one thing I'm a big fan of the arcade design and would make SO MUCH SENSE on him. There could be famous video game ape references (Donkey Kong, Super Monkey Ball, Ape Escape, etc.) as well as references to the fact that Wukong is in so many other games. Could be both hilarious and cool visually with his cloud leaving a rainbow pixel trail behind it, Q could have a sort of power up on him and a debuff symbol on enemies, decoy could vanish like an extra life and his Ult could rack up 100 points for every enemy champ hit then play some fanfare at 500. I made a concept for Arcade Wukong once a while ago but I just didn't do the concept justice. I'm hoping soon I may be able to go back to the drawing board and improve it.
: Thing is they might b afraid that some concepts will just read as chroma. Pixely is probably one of the most complex things u could try honestly. Well lemme tell u as animator (not sure if u are) that a 3d pixelated squishy thing like Zac would be very complex 2 animate if u want 2 do it justice. With Zac u either go ALL OUT or u do nothing. There's not enough going for him to be worth it. He's a vanguard right? Tanks usually don't get attention that's something Riot has 2 fix.
Na, for one thing since they are sticking with 1350 RP skins all of them will have unique things like recalls and home guard animations. Then for a few 1350 RP skins they end up giving champs new lines to go along with them, sounds like a smart thing to do for a champ who can be pretty limited design wise. Then if that's not enough there are some minor changes they can add to a model that will give them a different look. I do understand the pixelated thing would be pretty complex (not an animator, but did take a class or two on 3d modeling), but I feel like molten or sort of a ghost like/ semi-transparent skin would be manageable. Molten would have lava like texture and could add some spike like points on the shoulders and legs as well as a flaming head(maybe a lava rock mask over his mouth), while the ghost one... could have some kind of... spectral... floaty thing... (I didn't think that far ahead on that concept tbh).
: Zac is one of the more difficult champions 2 do skins for tho with his unique squishy physique and animations he's kinda complex, dont get me wrong sure the fact that he's not popular doesn't help, but the way he IS just adds another reason.
There are a few simpler concepts that would be great for him. Molten, Underworld where he's sort of a ghost blob...thing, Arcade (sort of make him all pixely and rainbow colored), Candy.
: Ahri gets like, one skin a year. It's a lot but there's a lot more egregious champs.
Not many. Riot tends to wait at least a year before releases outside of special cases here and there (don't believe they count LCS skins seeing as they are chosen by players), normally because when they do they get hit with a ton of backlash. Even their attempt to give Star Guardians a 2nd skin line saying "it's not a full fledged skin line, don't worry" got people ticked off. If you are a champ who gets a yearly skin you are part of the favorites list. Hell, Wukong would almost qualify if it weren't for him getting one every 2 years. I assume that's a level champs are at when they are considered "popular" in only one region, but unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any other champ to compare that too (only one to my knowledge who gets a skin every 2 years like clock work .-.).
: > [{quoted}](name=Blue Moon Wolf,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ThssZX5E,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2019-07-11T06:46:19.136+0000) > > Don't forget the favorites get all the skins, lore and videos. Vice skins? better give them to iconic champs like {{champion:86}} and popular champs like {{champion:236}}. garen is a champion who existed since before season 1, and he got his legendary 8 years later, when some like darius already have two legendaries, and a mythic skin, and some others have legendaries and an ultimate. calm your tits. kaisa got what? 3 or 4 skins already since her release and she isnt even out two years?
Wasn't saying Garen doesn't deserve a few skins or that he was a bad choice for the new skin line (meant to write that in there but sort of just got going ._.) , just that he's a champ that "makes sense" from a Riot perspective to use for a new skin line due to his iconic status. He's likely one of the most recognizable champs in the game with some of the oldest memes being tied to him. Not criticizing the choice of Garen, but rather that they will use him as an example of their charity to giving less popular champs decent skins. To them, he's what is considered "unpopular" just cause he's considered a starter champ and doesn't show up in LC$. Meanwhile there are tons of other champs that are far less popular and don't get in Riot's radar because they haven't or wont reach an iconic status like Garen has and aren't popular enough to end up being used by a majority of the players. They just sort of get Iverned, waiting ages for a skin just to get handed a skin randomly selected from Riot's wheel of lesser skin lines (I.E. anything that doesn't get made into a spectacle with events and videos and such all tying to that skin line) and expected to enjoy it.
: Nothing feels worse than loving a champion who isn't on Riot's favorite list
Don't forget the favorites get all the skins, lore and videos. Vice skins? better give them to iconic champs like {{champion:86}} and popular champs like {{champion:236}}. We need a big lore thing? better make it about {{champion:157}} and {{champion:92}}. New high quality video for this season? Who's that I see blowing wind in the background? Ain't {{champion:40}}, that's for sure. It's because of how hard Riot focuses on favorites we'll never get to see things like {{champion:62}}, {{champion:427}} and {{champion:38}} taking on {{champion:223}}, {{champion:6}} and {{champion:90}} in a "New Dawn" like video. We won't get a big lore even focusing on {{champion:36}} and his exploits. Only skins {{champion:77}} or {{champion:101}} will get are skins that Riot would consider safe and "thematic". Meanwhile forcing players to pay 100+ bucks for a chroma of KDA {{champion:103}} just cause they know people will pay for it. To make things worse, that money doesn't go toward giving decent skins to less fortunate champs. That goes right into the NEXT {{champion:103}} skin seeing as they can get away with saying "she didn't get a skin, the prestige skin doesn't count".
: They didn't remove it from her because they thought it was too strong. But because Irelia was absolutely overloaded with effects and they had to cut stuff away from her kit. They also removed: Magic damage reduction from her W, disarm from her R Irelia just had way too much stuff in her kit and definitely didn't need so many features to succeed.
They specifically said that the mechanic was too strong... and that doesn't go into the fact they still ended up putting a stronger version on a champ who REALLY didn't need it either with his 2 dashes, manaless kit, healing, AOE attacks and stun.... the instant shield burst going on his stun ability no less.
: Renekton's shield-breaking W is basically a giant "fuck you"
I feel we really need to keep reminding Riot that they removed a similar mechanic from {{champion:39}} BECAUSE even they thought it was too strong, cause apparently they completely forgot about doing that. Worse part is with Irelia at least it was only a damage boost against shields, this delete shields in a single W is ridiculous by comparison .-.
: Please Riot, these Renek and Kled changes are terrible for toplane. What are u doing?
I'm still confused as to why {{champion:58}} and {{champion:53}} are both getting instant shield breaking mechanics when Riot literally removed the bonus damage to shields at max stacks for {{champion:39}} because "it was unhealthy". No matter how I look at it, only doing bonus damage over time to shields sounds MUCH healthier then instantly blowing up a shield, one by just building fury which he can sit on IIRC, and the other just by activating his Ult. I won't say weather or not it was needed on Irelia, but then to go back and do this? When they specificity said it wasn't healthy? THEN on top of that, make it an instant shield buster instead of just increased damage? It's changes like this that make people think the balance team doesn't know what they are doing.
D357R0Y3R (EUW)
: 9.14 changes according to Riot Repertoir (Blitzcrank, Leona, Akali, Lux, Tahm kench)
Riot: Irelia was too strong with her being able to do bonus damage to shields at max stacks, so we removed it *adds instant shield breaking mechanics to {{champion:53}} and {{champion:58}} * {{sticker:zombie-brand-mindblown}}
Park Eun (NA)
: Wukong rework?
It's not ready yet. They got to do a few balance passes, change some things based on feedback they got on the changes and give his new effects new assets( The PBE one used {{item:3193}} active for the new Stone plate and I'm pretty sure his Crushing blows will be using something flashier then the red rings). Meddler even said they may be giving him some new animations. All this work will also have to be done in between larger projects as those of course take priority. Over all it will at least take a few months to get finished.
: Why is Wukong rework not live
https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/EbZiPqnj-quick-gameplay-thoughts-june-28 Meddler explains most of it there but long story short the PBE one isn't the one we will be seeing. that one hasn't been balanced for live yet nor has it gotten any assets for the new stuff yet (his new Stone skin alone used the {{item:3193}} active effect and he may be even getting a few new animations). They need to do some more work to it before it's ready for live, likely going to be a few months as they need to find artists to work on the new effects who are between work at the moment.
: So any hints to what this years ultimate skin is gonna be?
If we get one, it's going to be a champ who's already got WAY too many skins to begin with and Riot is trying to milk said champ for everything they are worth. Though with Prestige skins still coming out and costing about over 3 times as much as an Ultimate skin to get while at the most only half the cost to produce, odds are they are scrapping the Ultimate skin this year for more prestige skins... either way it's not going to be any champ who's in need of a skin :L
Pyrosan (NA)
: Would you like to see new champions stop being made and others improved on quality?
Very much so. The fact Riot decided to cut back on reworks to increase new champ production was extremely disheartening to hear, especially when I was around when Riot decided to slow down on new champs to start reworking ones that were lacking and needed updated. To me it sounded like they learned nothing from the past and are looking to make the same mistakes they did before.
Manxxom (NA)
: What laughing fish drinks during his games.
I for one prefer the smooth refreshing taste of a Blue Moon Belgian white ale (tm) :^) http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-r8zjKp90FXI/UTz5VcfiouI/AAAAAAAAABw/eTZMAe4fDPc/s1600/BlueMoonBelgianWhite.png
Sancre (EUW)
: Arcade Core Xerath, Glitched Boss Mordekaiser and Arcade Master Udyr
Arcade Wukong: Donkey Kong/Diddy Kong esque giant power gloves wii remote like controllers on the ends of his staff gold coin for his one pauldron
: Probably a hard nope on that one. Pets are buggy enough. Pets that are champions are even worse. Seeing as they removed it from Yorick already and now have removed it from Mordekaiser as well, it's safe to say they've realized that's not the kind of ability that fits into this game.
They said that they kept it in for months and only removed it cause they couldn't make it feel good in his new kit.
: Simple answer: because they are often so outdated that the way they play doesn't fit in the game. That, or they have a kit that can't be balanced around its core mechanic. I've said this to other people on other threads, but reworks are not for the people who _like_ the outdated/bug-riddled/unbalanceable champions they're based on. And this Mord is far more akin to the REAL Mordekaiser, not this sham that you newer players have always known.
I do hope they bring back his Current Ult one day. Maybe for a dark support champ who doesn't so much "support" as "has others do the fighting for them".
Sonný (NA)
: Wukong New Skin Release Recommendation
Going by his general skin release schedule ( one of the few champs who gets a skin every 2 years like clock work), odds are he won't be getting one this year, especially with Riot focusing so hard on popular champs (Project Jhin 2.0). On top of that, I don't believe Wukong will be getting any other "robotic" skins after getting his lancer skin. Riot does tend to try and stay away from releasing skins for champs with a similar theme (Unless your {{champion:103}} who gets literally the same skin concept twice cause they know they will be releasing yet another skin for her the following year), so it's a slim chance now that they'll go back and go "oh yea, he should get another robotic skin". Hope I'm wrong about that, Project Wukong would be by far a better skin and could even be his Legendary skin (matching Master Yi's Project skin, maybe even update Yi's so they can have some banter back and forth), but I just don't see it happening sadly.
: Maybe a potential VU for Ahri in sight ? by Zeronis
I'll put it this way. They give her a VU any time soon, they are officially saying they only care about profits. There are SO many champs who need one YEARS before her and that's not even saying that she doesn't need it. I've seen the tails. But we are still in a game where Amumu and Udyr look as they do (Insert "the VU was the ultimate skin joke" here), and that's assuming Riot even DOES end up doing any solo VUs. All I heard from them is that they are cutting back on VGUs and increasing champ production. the last I heard of them doing VUs, they decided it wasn't worth the effort.
: >-A bit overtuned Don't worry, they only care about the 'feel' of the kit for this round of public testing, his numbers and VFX aren't finalized. >-He's not Kled. As in he should have the same staying power if he's going to be moved more into a bruiser direction? >-His q does magic damage making it harder to itemize against him Interesting, I thought that was intended as a nerf (less gains from armour shred and lethality). >-He can't run or chase anyone and doesn't do enough damage to one shot anyone unless he gets fed. I think the former is an issue whilst the latter is intended. Can you still "press S to outplay" your opponents, and if so, is it as fun to do as the live version? What do you think Wu needs to have some 'stickiness', and what could he stand giving up for it? Do you think it might be a way of Riot dissuading the old 'lethality cleaver" build and telling us to build mallet/BotRK, or are there issues w/ the current gameplay even if that were to be the case? What builds have you been trying on him?
The magic damage is an exploitation of trying to unbind Wukong from Lethality but still giving him a way to counter building early armor against him according to Meddler. He also made it sound like Wukong's Q is going to be one of, if not the most heavily experimented part of his kit as far as what changes they are going to try out. He's mentioned that he is willing to look into things like CC, Hybrid Physical/Magic damage, etc. https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/8aAAV7wu-prototype-wukong-changes-on-pbe-context?comment=001d0001 This version specifically is one he wanted to test without AD.
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Blue Moon Wolf

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