Arketsu (NA)
: Intersting Climbing Tip For Players Who Tilt
Now I can reach enlightenment.
: So is climbing based on skill or is based on whom you get as team mates?
The shorter queue times adjustments that Riot did has made matchmaking far more volatile and random. In addition to snowballing being way easier in this day and age, and damage being king, and turrets falling with ease, you have so much random stuff against you that it feels like you're playing Fortnite or Pubg. There's skill expression, but in the end, a lot of your success depends on the dice. The trick to climbing then doesn't come from how good you are, but what strat you use to optimize a random environment. That's why strats such as Tryn splitpushing is popular. You take hold of the game winning condition more selfishly, and let you grind past all the usual team fighting, objective, vision fighting, mechanics of the game since we're not in competitive so no one will ever counter you.
: @RiotGames Please Do something About this
I am also for displaying MMR. I never agreed with it being hidden away. Hell, I remember when we had both mmr and rank visible. When you reached a certain MMR value, you became gold, plat, diamond. That's how it use to be anyway. If we return to that, we'd get a lot more fairness in how games are lined up. BUT, I have a feeling Riot doesn't want too much visibility for business sake. It would reveal a few things they don't want to the public.
: > [{quoted}](name=Cdore,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=0050,timestamp=2019-05-08T16:07:10.858+0000) > > I think what is being left out here is that Riot has "short wait times" in their design philosophy. So they sacrifice matching you with the most even skilled teams they can for the sake of getting you into games quicker. There is no doubt about this, which is why I believe OP's concerns are valid. It is true that we do want to keep queue times as short as we can. However, we do monitor the within-team and between-team MMR differences very closely to ensure that the games are still even. Let's take Gold 2 as an example, the average within-team MMR difference in NA is 40 MMR and between-team difference is 3 MMR. For context, the entirety of the MMR difference in Gold 2 is 81 MMR
> [{quoted}](name=Riot MoreChrono,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=00500000,timestamp=2019-05-08T16:48:29.882+0000) > > It is true that we do want to keep queue times as short as we can. However, we do monitor the within-team and between-team MMR differences very closely to ensure that the games are still even. Let's take Gold 2 as an example, the average within-team MMR difference in NA is 40 MMR and between-team difference is 3 MMR. For context, the entirety of the MMR difference in Gold 2 is 81 MMR I respect your response, but I feel like there's a lot of information that needs to be addressed in order to understand the context of why MMR difference matters specifically just in Gold 2. [](https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/59af2189c534a58c97bd63b3/1555348895999-MV37603ZAHK81Z2SZHJ1/league+of+legends+rank+distribution+April+2019.jpg?content-type=image%2Fjpeg) Using our topic creator as an example, he was wondering why there is a Plat in his matchmaking. The general answer is that the plat is there to even out elo averages between both teams, but to understand where that flaw comes from, we have to understand why he is there to begin with. You've already pinpointed that you guys strive for short wait times. And you gave your response to show that the difference between matchmade teams tend to be small. But you leave out, not a fault of your own, the problem of tier distribution, duos, and the way the endpoints of each rank tend to work out in solo queue. If you will stay with me for a moment, and if OP is reading, let me explain where the problem comes from. I'll just put on my data science glasses before I do. {{champion:74}} The highest amount of League's playerbase in ranked sits in Silver. The second highest is in Gold. The third highest is in bronze. Fourth is plat. What we can already conclude based on just raw numbers is that silver, gold, and bronze will always have the most lucrative queue times and possible team permutations due to what roles people choose. It's why currently from Diamond 1 to Challenger, they have the most autofills. It's just basic population. In this respect, we can already see that the ranks where you'll have the biggest discrepancies of matchmaking is Plat and onward based on sheer population. In order to balance out wait times, naturally, Bronze, Iron, and Plat+ have to draw closer to the median pool of the ranked queue. You will have plats or silvers in Gold games. And the closer you get to Plat 4, your matchmaking starts to have Gold 2s, Gold 1s, Plats 4, and Plats 3, and sometimes Plat 2s. This is very important because suddenly, you have a major jump in variance. This variance can be explained by two things: the willingness to have short queue times and the nature of the two two tiers of every rank. Silver 1, Gold 1, and every 1 tier after has the lowest amount of people in it. Why? Cause the variance is so strong here between both ranks that Tier 1 is just a transitional period. You will either rise to the next rank or fall back to Tier 2 simply due to being stuck between two major skill variances. All of this information comes together to explain why OP feels the way he does, and I feel like you know already why this is the case. **The mmr system does not line up with the noise that is Tier 1-Tier 4 of next rank relationship, the presence of duos, the forcing of quick matchmaking times, and the natural median of the playerbase.** LP gains care about one thing: whether your team won or loss. For each person, it seems to take into account amount of games you played and that's about it. This kind of system would be fine in a game where your individual performance was ranked or the above issues in bold were not present. But since Riot has chosen to use a 1v1 mmr system for a team based game, ShirleyG's complaints are very real. In an ideal world, you will have no more than two tiers of difference, and that should be an exception, of the players on your team. Everyone should always be at the same tier as you to make matchmaking truly fair. I don't think it's **true fairness**, but in the context of this system, it makes the most sense. But that also assumes, what you already know, that we always have people only and that all ranks have a large enough playerbase who each all play various roles to never have to autofill. But as we know, autofill exists BECAUSE the roles of this game are disproportionately represented. Supports are the least played role while mid/ adc are the most played. These vary based on rank, but overall, this has been the general case of where most of Riot's design decisions came from sense before Season 1. I was there around the boards when Rioters specifically made cases about this proportion representation of the playerbase, and why certain classes are more popular. That's fine, that's the nature of a video game. Some people play different roles. Unfortunately, I feel like Riot screwed up things when they attempted to upset the natural order of this to force quicker matchmaking. And thus, you have irons in Silver games, you have silvers in gold games, you have golds in plat games, and you plats in diamond games, and you have diamonds in master, GM, and Challenger. I actually thought dynamic queue was better in the sense that if you had a long wait time on your role, you would change to another simply to have quicker matchmaking on your own decision. This is a much better way to do it than forcing people into matchmaking simply to keep people from getting bored. @ShirleyG: You are in gold. You are good at the game. You are where only the second amount of people are. You are within the top 30% of the players of the game. You are not bad enough where you are in silver, bronze, or iron, which is where the amateurs and casuals sit. You are above them. You know the game on a higher level and you're good at the role you do. Based on all that I have written, I am going to give you an answer that is more realistic with how solo queue works and League of Legends. I've been gold since season 4, and have been playing since 2010. I follow the competitive scene and yet never got to Plat or above, though I've nearly gotten to Plat last and this season. I am not a pro, but most people in solo queue aren't except for the elite at Diamond 1 and above. But I'm not stupid either. Solo queue is a magical land that goes against the fundamentals of 5v5s. You do not have communication, you do not have a set team, you do not have practiced routines with four others over and over like competitive, you never met any of the people you queue with, and sometimes you run into smurfs from other ranks or you run into duos who are using the advantage of better communication and coordination. These facts of solo queue show that there is a distinct way of "carrying" that will win you games faster and higher in wr than others. Supports are among one of the worst roles to climb with. They depend too much on the team, and it explains why Brand, Zyra, and Pyke are among the favorite supports to carry with: cause they focus on killing people rather than the support duties of bodyguarding, getting vision, removing vision, and other utility functions. In this respect, utility playstyles and champs are the worst ways to climb in solo queue. Now let's look at how smurfs climb. They choose champs that can 1v5, splitpush hard, and or do things that has little dependency from their own team. They choose Draven, they choose Irelia, they choose Riven, they choose Lee Sin, they choose Ahri, they choose any champ that can make a play on their own or draw huge team pressure for little risk. In this respect, solo queue is a game about who can carry the hardest by abusing all the issues that solo queue brings vs being in a competitive game. You being in gold doesn't mean you are bad at the game. It means that your playstyle and champ pool are currently not meta enough to get you higher. I'm not going to tell you to settle for gold, but I will tell you that climbing involves playing to win, and that means learning the game in a completely different matter to what anyone else has told you. tl;dr: Play the game as if your team will always be irrelevant. Play the game knowing that the variance toward higher tiers causes harder games. Not for your own fault, but because the system doesn't gradually push you into higher ranked games. For instance, promo games intentionally team mixmatch players. This has been a fact no one can deny. The real way to do promos is to just keep matching the player up like normal. Let them slide themselves into plat or whatever rank is next rather than throwing them into the middle of the sea and hoping the RNG gods give them all that they need.
: @RiotGames Please Do something About this
I think what is being left out here is that Riot has "short wait times" in their design philosophy. So they sacrifice matching you with the most even skilled teams they can for the sake of getting you into games quicker. There is no doubt about this, which is why I believe OP's concerns are valid.
: Conqueror is a result of the same kind of oversight in design logic that created 4.20 Weedwick.
I'm just tired of having to fight the rune more than the champion. It seems today, matchups are more about what rune is taken rather than what champ you take. Conq bruiser is a different ballgame compared to say a PTA or Lethal Tempo bruiser. The least threatening bruiser would be someone who takes comet or something not synergizing. It's annoying.
: Old Riot balance team vs New Riot balance team. #Shojin
URF destroyed this game. Riot saw how successful it was and integrated aspects of it into their normal game. Less mana costs, less cooldowns (this is the only time in Leeg history where I've seen max cdr and 45% cdr, I remember when cdr was a luxury).
: Why games are more coin flip than ever.
There is a lot of coinflip in the game at the moment. Solo queue defies the normal way of playing league by placing a huge onus on players to carry themselves. It's easy to do in theory, as we see high elo smurfs level a new account up in diamond. But I challenge a high elo player to be given a seasoned account with a set mmr and 300+ games on it in ranked to try to climb as fast as they did on new account. I argue it wouldn't be as easy. Current cases of rng: * Dragons * What players or enemy players you get * Each player's state of mind * What champs are your team and enemy team * Connection issues or whether an outage will happen In most multiplayer games, the last four are a constant thing to worry about. However, a good multiplayer game would rank you more on your individual skill rather than the skill of the team you currently have. This has been a flaw in the solo queue ranked system that I have criticized for a long time. I don't accept solo queue as a legit competitive gauge, but clearly Riot has invested resources into putting it on a high pedestal, thus they are subject to any critique to the system we give. League does not seem to care much how good you are individually. For all the little systems in place to measure your performance, none of it is used to decide LP gain or even team placement. A missed move on Riot's part, and have me feeling no one on the design or even director team either knows how to make a legitimate ranked system or doesn't care to for other reasons.
: It is because the majority of players in low elo don't suffer from overaggression but rather underaggression. They will never be a factor in their games because they choose to just "sit back and not feed". The players who are super aggressive and either got 8/0 or 0/8 will always be the deciding factor in your game then. And guess what? Their overall skill level will still be silver, they just aren't as consistent. You _can_ be a deciding factor in all your games, but that's only if you're willing to go into every game with a carry mentality. Not this "I'm 10 cs up, 1 kill, and now I'm just trading waves with my laner". When you get an advantage you should look to shove it so far down the enemy's throat that they're crying for ff 15. And maybe you feed while trying, but at least you're actually improving at the game for it.
> [{quoted}](name=Disembark,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0csZvBM4,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-04-17T12:08:37.763+0000) > > It is because the majority of players in low elo don't suffer from overaggression but rather underaggression. They will never be a factor in their games because they choose to just "sit back and not feed". > > The players who are super aggressive and either got 8/0 or 0/8 will always be the deciding factor in your game then. And guess what? Their overall skill level will still be silver, they just aren't as consistent. > > You _can_ be a deciding factor in all your games, but that's only if you're willing to go into every game with a carry mentality. Not this "I'm 10 cs up, 1 kill, and now I'm just trading waves with my laner". When you get an advantage you should look to shove it so far down the enemy's throat that they're crying for ff 15. > > And maybe you feed while trying, but at least you're actually improving at the game for it. You say they sit back and not feed, but then you say the 0/8 guy is going to be deciding the game. You have a point, but I think you're not giving it fair due to point out that the reason people are underaggressive cause of the fact games can run away real fast with a fed player or two. It's a matter of not wanting to be that person to cause it. It is a good argument to say people should be more risky, but that's the genius of the coinflip argument. Riot has made playing aggressive harder due to nerfing vision and incentizing river aggression, making jungle roaming more likely. In addition to camp spawn times being long, the jungler will always be around to turn a fight around to their favor more likely than not. This is where the heart of the situation lies. Riot has forced players to gamble in their aggression with the odds not in their favor unless you are really coordinated with your team.
: Enable voice chat for those with high honor
Open voice chat to all. No matter what honor someone has, you can mute them if you have to, just like in chat. But we 100% need voice chat. In every game out there, voice chat has saved countless team based play. Why Riot won't do it with it being 2019 is something beyond my understanding.
: > [{quoted}](name=Cdore,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KiN5b5jZ,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2019-04-11T18:02:23.182+0000) > > I think the cooldown point is very important. I use to giggle back during the patch when Riot added cdr to more items. I never knew this would be the end result. Everyone can reach 40 and now 45 cdr with ease. Thresh is throwing hooks every 5 seconds. And spells are being dished out rapidly with no mana resource being wasted. No current tank can weather that kind of damage. I feel like everyone wants to have 40% cool down reduction or the build is not even considered. Cool down is very accessible and easy to build, there is little reason to build items that do not have cool down reduction but have more raw stats... Actually I think it might be harder to achieve having a full build without cool down reduction at all.
> [{quoted}](name=KnivingDude,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KiN5b5jZ,comment-id=00090000,timestamp=2019-04-11T18:06:00.706+0000) > > I feel like everyone wants to have 40% cool down reduction or the build is not even considered. Cool down is very accessible and easy to build, there is little reason to build items that do not have cool down reduction but have more raw stats... Actually I think it might be harder to achieve having a full build without cool down reduction at all. Ironically, only tanks can go without ever building cdr cause riot didn't add cdr to ANY OF OUR CORE ITEMS. Let me give you a common scenario as Shen or Poppy, especially when I need to get heavy stats real fast against hard hitting carries. {{item:3068}} {{item:3143}} {{item:3047}} {{item:3111}} {{item:3194}} {{item:3075}} {{item:3193}} NEITHER of these items give cdr. If I go trinity force or iceborn gauntlet, I can get 20% cdr, sure, but there's a lot of games where I have to be the raw stat tank or I will die. {{item:3800}} this item is the only cdr armor health option we have, but it lacks another important stat: mr. The only tank mr items we have is helm and {{item:3001}} , and abyssal mask is not an optimal tank path save for more mage like tanks like amumu, maokai, and chogath. But even chogath wants helm. The other option we have is {{item:3065}} BUT there's a twist with this item. Riot has been nerfing hp regen and this item also counts on you having some kind of self or ally healing. If you have neither that or good hp regen, getting this item is a waste, especially on tank income. EDIT: I just realized Helm gives cdr, which threw me off cause it doesn't build from any cdr component. EDIT2: Forgot about {{item:3083}} . But again, just a massive health item and no resistances at all. I almost feel like Stoneplate should have gotten CDR. It feels like the magnum opus of tank items. So unfortunately, tanks don't get the same benefit of high cdr like every other class's items did. I will say that the only other class that lacks cdr is adcs, whose only item is getting Essence Reaver for CDR, but then {{item:3071}} comes into the picture. It's just a sad state of affairs for tanks right now. Ah, I forgot {{item:3110}} . Too bad that with all the true damage right now, having no health is a death sentence.
Cdore (NA)
: Crowd Control Invalidates Tanks
I think the cooldown point is very important. I use to giggle back during the patch when Riot added cdr to more items. I never knew this would be the end result. Everyone can reach 40 and now 45 cdr with ease. Thresh is throwing hooks every 5 seconds. And spells are being dished out rapidly with no mana resource being wasted. No current tank can weather that kind of damage.
: If they are CCing you that gives the rest of your team, who does damage, to go in and finish them off. I get what you mean in your post but doesn't CC just do that to every champion, if they waste CC on the tank then your assassins and carries can just pick them off. Are you referring to the laning phase mainly or just in general? If your talking about too many champs having CC I can agree with you there. There really doesn't need to be a CC ability on every character they add into the game.
> [{quoted}](name=CaptainxBear,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KiN5b5jZ,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-04-11T16:00:27.251+0000) > > If they are CCing you that gives the rest of your team, who does damage, to go in and finish them off. I get what you mean in your post but doesn't CC just do that to every champion, if they waste CC on the tank then your assassins and carries can just pick them off. Are you referring to the laning phase mainly or just in general? If your talking about too many champs having CC I can agree with you there. There really doesn't need to be a CC ability on every character they add into the game. Mostly after laning phase and the CC being on everybody. What sucks the most is that carries are getting damage items way faster than I can build against them, so my mid game power is made obselete and late game comes so much faster, I'm dated by then. I've nearly started building support items now cause that's as useful as I can be choosing a tank, which gimps the team.
: Your second paragraph had something that I believe to be the true issue tanks are facing- damage is just too high right now. Crowd control, by itself, is simply used to peel threats off of your team or yourself. In teamfights crowd control is used to disable priority targets. In years past I’ve played many games where the tank was one of the last to die. Crowd control on the tank was seen as a waste yet, somewhere along the way, the spike in burst damage happened. When you add the spike damage with crowd control that even has tanks dying too quickly I can understand your frustration. Crowd control isn’t the primary issue however, it’s the surplus of damage that is practically devouring health bars faster than Cho’gath when he uses his R.
> [{quoted}](name=Boltonator,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KiN5b5jZ,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-04-11T15:44:10.692+0000) > > Your second paragraph had something that I believe to be the true issue tanks are facing- damage is just too high right now. Crowd control, by itself, is simply used to peel threats off of your team or yourself. In teamfights crowd control is used to disable priority targets. In years past I’ve played many games where the tank was one of the last to die. Crowd control on the tank was seen as a waste yet, somewhere along the way, the spike in burst damage happened. When you add the spike damage with crowd control that even has tanks dying too quickly I can understand your frustration. > > Crowd control isn’t the primary issue however, it’s the surplus of damage that is practically devouring health bars faster than Cho’gath when he uses his R. You're right. When I just got done typing my post, I realized the issue is that CC hasn't really changed much. But the damage definitely has rose. I wish items like Levianthan and so came back to at least help temper the storm. Riot could easily buff tanks, but they're choosing not to.
Rioter Comments
FSRER (EUNE)
: Welp, it depends on the adc. {{champion:119}} {{champion:67}} {{champion:236}}{{champion:51}} : the adcs that if they get 5 kills and know what they are doing is a ff game (vibes from season 6 lb here) and getting kills with em is more than easy. The other adcs...well....about that
> [{quoted}](name=FSRER,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9PwwTyuv,comment-id=000d,timestamp=2019-03-14T16:26:54.188+0000) > > Welp, it depends on the adc. > {{champion:119}} {{champion:67}} {{champion:236}}{{champion:51}} : the adcs that if they get 5 kills and know what they are doing is a ff game (vibes from season 6 lb here) and getting kills with em is more than easy. The other adcs...well....about that I can vouch for lucian. I played him in a couple of games and had no idea what I was doing. I was making sloppy positioning, then realized I was deleting champ health like it was nothing. Then the game was over. Broken champs.
: "A late game class of champions do a lot of damage and control late game" holy shit you've cracked the code, pack it up boys they solved jt
> [{quoted}](name=Atmosphere,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9PwwTyuv,comment-id=000000000001,timestamp=2019-03-14T08:31:04.469+0000) > > "A late game class of champions do a lot of damage and control late game" holy shit you've cracked the code, pack it up boys they solved jt Unsaid here, and should be clarified, is that late game class gets their items faster than other classes.
: Riot Repertoir lies about how broken Riven is.
She generates income for them. Enough said. When champs are money makers, they go up. When they are not, their effectiveness is dropped. Money drives this game more than integral game design.
: If they want to be inclusive - sure There is a way to be inclusive without denying " certain genders and certain skin pigments" access until 2pm Since a lot of Riots revenue is from China & Korea ( both countries don't give a fuck about SJW values) they won't go out of business since that sector is largely unaware of the crazy shit going on over here.
> [{quoted}](name=Mordepool,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=BVKB4Phh,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-03-03T06:53:19.844+0000) > > If they want to be inclusive - sure > There is a way to be inclusive without denying " certain genders and certain skin pigments" access until 2pm > > > Since a lot of Riots revenue is from China & Korea ( both countries don't give a fuck about SJW values) they won't go out of business since that sector is largely unaware of the crazy shit going on over here. The word "baizuo" was invented primarily in china and is used constantly. They don't care about sjw values, but they definitely will react negatively if it affects the game.
: Riot Games hires its first Chief Diversity Officer
There's three things Riot should do if they want to fix all their problems. They likely won't take this advice, but I say this out of love of a game I've played for too many years, back since beta. 1. Buy back your company from Tencent. Back then, I saw what Tencent was going to do to this company just like they've done to everyone else. And now we live in the nightmare I expected. I'm not surprised. Disappointed. Buy back your company pronto. They will bleed your legacy dry. 2. Relocate away from California. I know exactly why this hire happened. California, and a lot of other industry centers, act as enforcers of their culture. If your company doesn't follow it, you get held hostage with lawsuits and bad PR. Get out of those political prisons. Come to Texas. They won't hold a scythe over your head for not following the bandwagon. 3. Invest in your hardcore fanbase again. League started out as a game where you had to learn spell ranges, and wasn't spoonfed everything since its origins were Dota. But as you have now found out, Riot, when you invest only in the casual fanbase, they don't stay interested for long and will always chase the next new fad (PUBG, Fortnite, Apex). You can never gain them as a permanent fanbase. But what you can gain is a loyal fanbase that enjoys deeper and more strategic gameplay, which you use to have for league. The turning away of pros to other games should be proof that you might want to swing back the pendulum before it's too late. There's a lot more I could add, but these are the three major changes I'd like to see from them.
Snowman Arc (EUNE)
: Are people even trying to win ranked games anymore?
So, I can explain what is going on at the moment. Firstly, positional ranked has screwed up a lot. It has created a new level of emergence that Riot never prepared for. In addition, LP gains have been absolutely whack. These two alone may cause this system to be reverted, but we're not done there. The game currently is about high damage, high rng. Add random players to the mix, in addition to the chaotic nature of positional ranking, and you have more wild games than before. Now, you have less of a chance of influencing if you win games or not. It shows mostly if you watch pro streams of people smurfing or simply trying to climb through diamond. The game can be over by the weakest link rather than by the strongest carry. This is perhaps the flaw of solo queue, and why I've said for years now that either solo queue be removed, or Riot simply focus all their balance and design decisions on competitive play. Cause at the game's current state, they are not capable of delivering a stable experience or foundation that the game can stand on. I could write all day all the changes they could do to make the game more stable again, but like all the people before me, it's useless in the face of Riot trucking forward and doing things like small incremental stat changes to their champions, forgetting to nerf certain ones, buffing random ones, and just outright having to guess most of their design decisions. One last thing, I wish we had the old design team back. They knew some semblance of how to balance things.
: PSA: the spell thief's change isn't as bad as it seems.
My problem with the change is that it's a solution to a problem caused by another solution made caused by another problem.... It keeps adding on with no fix to the source of all these fixes. This is just going to cause another set of problems like it always does.
: Honestly the entire item system would be easier to balance if they were just grouped by class. Not every champion needs to have access to every item for the game to work. Soraka doesn't need access to items like Tiamat, and Fiora doesn't need access to items like Spellthief's Edge. If each class had it's own group of items, and a list of generic items that everyone can use, balancing the items would become so much easier. Just like marksman items, support items are constantly having to be balanced around the fact that someone outside of their intended role might use them, and that's a really lousy metric to balance against. Imagine how good you could make tank MR items if champions like LeBlanc couldnt take them. Imagine how much easier it would be to balance gold income items if only support champions could get them. The feature of everyone having access to every item isn't worth balancing around, especially when Riot is going to intercede anyways when stuff like Tank Ekko or Top Viktor spout up. I just want to be able to play support with items that are cleanly tailored for the role, outside of the shield items please.
> [{quoted}](name=ixi Josh Sand,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=d1wKf7Ex,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-02-12T19:45:38.211+0000) > > Honestly the entire item system would be easier to balance if they were just grouped by class. Not every champion needs to have access to every item for the game to work. Soraka doesn't need access to items like Tiamat, and Fiora doesn't need access to items like Spellthief's Edge. > > If each class had it's own group of items, and a list of generic items that everyone can use, balancing the items would become so much easier. > > Just like marksman items, support items are constantly having to be balanced around the fact that someone outside of their intended role might use them, and that's a really lousy metric to balance against. > > Imagine how good you could make tank MR items if champions like LeBlanc couldnt take them. Imagine how much easier it would be to balance gold income items if only support champions could get them. > > The feature of everyone having access to every item isn't worth balancing around, especially when Riot is going to intercede anyways when stuff like Tank Ekko or Top Viktor spout up. > > I just want to be able to play support with items that are cleanly tailored for the role, outside of the shield items please. You're barking up a tree I sort of hinted at a while back: Go the Heroes of the Storm Route. Make everyone have no items, but individual power ups. The odyssey mode was a good way to do talent-based system, too.
: [How to make a game addictive ](http://www.cracked.com/article_18461_5-creepy-ways-video-games-are-trying-to-get-you-addicted.html) Its the old Make the Rat pull a Leaver even when it hurts him.
> [{quoted}](name=XXXMurderPenguin,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=czN2EGlj,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2019-02-10T02:49:10.680+0000) > > [How to make a game addictive ](http://www.cracked.com/article_18461_5-creepy-ways-video-games-are-trying-to-get-you-addicted.html) > > Its the old Make the Rat pull a Leaver even when it hurts him. I've been studying League for a while for academic purposes of how they string their players along with monetization and buying champs, etc, and that was a good read to help me. Promos and this new positional ranked are all catering to that very notion of "just a little more." Evil but genius.
: Phreak on Champion Base Stats
I would love to see a game mode where no items can be built, but everyone was given automatic boots to see how the game plays out base stat wise. Items essentially make base stats irrelevant after a certain point in the game, so whenever I see stat changes in patch notes, I raise an eyebrow.
Vanic998 (NA)
: I would suggest swapping lanes with someone on your team. Something similar happened on my team once. I was playing mid and my top laner, who was melee, did not want to face a ranged top laner so he asked if we could swap and we did. It worked well. I got fed and he was able to play safe.
> [{quoted}](name=Vanic998,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7KhkiF8d,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-02-06T05:44:43.832+0000) > > I would suggest swapping lanes with someone on your team. Something similar happened on my team once. I was playing mid and my top laner, who was melee, did not want to face a ranged top laner so he asked if we could swap and we did. It worked well. I got fed and he was able to play safe. You cant swap if its ranked. Riots new system punishes you for it by giving or taking lp from yout most used lane in game. Its stupid.
: > [{quoted}](name=GoryRage,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEyynp2A,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-02-06T01:23:16.515+0000) > - Switching positions works against you now because you arent earning LP for your main role Experienced this one today, seriously pissed me off to no end. I was in my promos with 1 lose and 1 win. My team's first pick was Yasuo (TOP), their team picked Riven (TOP) and Taliyah (MID). I decided to pick Malphite (MID) and was going to simply build AP Malphite. I have done it several times in the past and squishy midlaners like Taliyah simply can't deal with Malphite's post-6 burst. However, Yasuo asked to swap because Yasuo versus Taliyah is a really good matchup and Malphite versus Riven is also a good matchup. I agreed and just built armor against Riven. Got several solo kills and was able to make a few roam plays for Yasuo, so both lanes won; overall the entire game was a pretty solid stomp and everyone on my team were great teammates. Once the game ends.... no promotion... instead I received 59 LP for my first top lane placement match. Pissed off I start up my next game as midlaner, get into champ select and immediately Kayle jungle demands that our top go AD top. I make the suggestion/request that our top laner simply play something they are comfortable with, because I would rather have everyone on a comfortable champ that they know how to play instead of picking something they don't know how to play for "team comp". Top lane decides to (in his own words) "F**K YOU GUYS! FIRST TIME YORICK!!" Champ select and the entire game only gets more and more toxic and we eventually get stomped with the game being pretty much over at the 12 minute mark. Our team refuses to surrender and we lose at 20:00 minutes anyways. Failed promos!! Being a team player, and doing what is best for the team completely punished me and cost me my promos!! Good work Riot! Great system!
> [{quoted}](name=Fallsmyer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEyynp2A,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-02-06T10:33:36.844+0000) > > Experienced this one today, seriously pissed me off to no end. I was in my promos with 1 lose and 1 win. My team's first pick was Yasuo (TOP), their team picked Riven (TOP) and Taliyah (MID). I decided to pick Malphite (MID) and was going to simply build AP Malphite. I have done it several times in the past and squishy midlaners like Taliyah simply can't deal with Malphite's post-6 burst. However, Yasuo asked to swap because Yasuo versus Taliyah is a really good matchup and Malphite versus Riven is also a good matchup. I agreed and just built armor against Riven. Got several solo kills and was able to make a few roam plays for Yasuo, so both lanes won; overall the entire game was a pretty solid stomp and everyone on my team were great teammates. Once the game ends.... no promotion... instead I received 59 LP for my first top lane placement match. > > Pissed off I start up my next game as midlaner, get into champ select and immediately Kayle jungle demands that our top go AD top. I make the suggestion/request that our top laner simply play something they are comfortable with, because I would rather have everyone on a comfortable champ that they know how to play instead of picking something they don't know how to play for "team comp". Top lane decides to (in his own words) "F**K YOU GUYS! FIRST TIME YORICK!!" Champ select and the entire game only gets more and more toxic and we eventually get stomped with the game being pretty much over at the 12 minute mark. Our team refuses to surrender and we lose at 20:00 minutes anyways. Failed promos!! > > Being a team player, and doing what is best for the team completely punished me and cost me my promos!! Good work Riot! Great system! I called this months ago. The new system destroys variable play and lane adaption. Riot's designers don't take all consequences into consideration. And if they do, they intentionally ignored it cause tencent told them to make this a new thing so ppl have to grind five times instead of one.
: What tank is doing this? Jesus christ I wish every tank I mained dealt as much damage that is always being complained about.
> [{quoted}](name=Pandemic Punch,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Xo0Wmi9k,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-01-26T18:23:24.269+0000) > > What tank is doing this? Jesus christ I wish every tank I mained dealt as much damage that is always being complained about. This. I think people are confused about tank damage and forget that champs like Jax, Riven, and others exist in the game that do far worse.
drash79 (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Dunk and Dine,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=PXbt5qWZ,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-01-24T12:32:43.302+0000) > > They are probably removing conquerer so tanks will go back to being overpowered like the last 3 seasons. I dont think tanks should be buffed until they get a class rework and makes them more skilled and fun to play against. At least in toplane idk too much about the state of support tanks. Make it so tanks can be punished in the early game, like adc. Because its really no joke about how hard a tank auto wins for being unkillable. They need to be flawed in some way to compensate for their god like late game.
> [{quoted}](name=drash79,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=PXbt5qWZ,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-01-24T15:49:22.412+0000) > > Make it so tanks can be punished in the early game, like adc. Because its really no joke about how hard a tank auto wins for being unkillable. > > > They need to be flawed in some way to compensate for their god like late game. You say that, but then a Jax, Yi, Riven, or anyone else bursts you down in a second or two. It's funny when a tank is withering you away and yet you're giving a pass to literal cancers like those above.
: I know Yi is not op, but plss
Technically, Dr Mundo is an anti mage character more than an anti AD champ. Rammus and Jax are Yi's most effective counters. Then hard cc after that.
: i miss the times when u could get lv.3 without having to clear 700 camps. But Riot thinks that junglers have too much pressure :) (totally NOT because people don't even know the existence of wards)
> [{quoted}](name=Wolf Of The Dawn,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=c9QKQ8bF,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-01-25T12:55:09.401+0000) > > i miss the times when u could get lv.3 without having to clear 700 camps. But Riot thinks that junglers have too much pressure :) (totally NOT because people don't even know the existence of wards) Riot nerfed wards to only running for 90 seconds early game, and you dont get your second trinket ward until two and half minutes later. If you want to blame lack of vision, blame it on Riot.
Moody P (NA)
: Counterplay is team play if you can't win the 1v1
> [{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=JntuNgMf,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-01-25T11:58:39.237+0000) > > Counterplay is team play if you can't win the 1v1 More people need to realize this. INCLUDING Riot. I miss point and click abilities because they are counters to the sheer amount of mobility in this game. And the counter to point and click is team play. Where did we go wrong.
: It differs by rank. Late game champions are better in lower elos where they can reach their stride, while higher elos are more focused on early game threats. Both cases have similar kinds of trends though Top is ran by splitpushers across various elos - {{champion:23}} {{champion:24}} {{champion:75}} {{champion:14}} Jungle is dominated largely by level 2 duelists - {{champion:5}} {{champion:254}} {{champion:77}} {{champion:120}} Mid is the land of Assassins and adjacent friends - {{champion:238}} {{champion:91}} {{champion:39}} {{champion:84}} Bot is whatever the pros were seen using three months ago Support at least right now is APCs - {{champion:1}} {{champion:63}} {{champion:143}} {{champion:161}}
> [{quoted}](name=PopcornBunni,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EGEmz81T,comment-id=00230000,timestamp=2019-01-25T01:45:51.618+0000) > > It differs by rank. Late game champions are better in lower elos where they can reach their stride, while higher elos are more focused on early game threats. > > Both cases have similar kinds of trends though > > Top is ran by splitpushers across various elos - {{champion:23}} {{champion:24}} {{champion:75}} {{champion:14}} > Jungle is dominated largely by level 2 duelists - {{champion:5}} {{champion:254}} {{champion:77}} {{champion:120}} > Mid is the land of Assassins and adjacent friends - {{champion:238}} {{champion:91}} {{champion:39}} {{champion:84}} > Bot is whatever the pros were seen using three months ago > Support at least right now is APCs - {{champion:1}} {{champion:63}} {{champion:143}} {{champion:161}} What I am seeing that at my current elo of silver/ gold, games either run too long or they are 15 min stomps. For someone who is competitive, this pattern is annoying af to get down. If I play an early game champ, if I do not close quickly or my team just can't decide to stay on the same page, I fall off and have to depend on them. If I get a late game champ, as you can see what happens, you never reach your stride, or the game is happening so fast that you dont even have time to farm. So at my elo, it's a coin flip to the point I actually have to pick champs who are viable no matter how early or late the game goes. It's just a matter of figuring out what those champs are.
: The "Forever unusable in Solo Queue because they're broken in competitive" Club
Can we get a list of the most reliable solo queue champions and have it range to the least reliable?
: Fuckin bring it {{champion:126}}{{champion:78}} {{champion:14}} better yet {{champion:516}} {{summoner:14}} {{item:2012}} come fucking get me out of lane
> [{quoted}](name=Hammermancer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dip1ftQh,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-01-24T00:32:27.346+0000) > > Fuckin bring it {{champion:126}}{{champion:78}} {{champion:14}} > > better yet > > {{champion:516}} {{summoner:14}} {{item:2012}} come fucking get me out of lane We're both each other's spirit animals.
Antenora (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Cdore,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HLil7QqG,comment-id=00010000000000010000,timestamp=2019-01-14T16:19:38.251+0000) > > Botrk is HP%, which you build to synergize with resists. Since a lot of your effective health gets neutralized, Botrk makes it worse. BoTRK isn't even a broken item. Not even close.
> [{quoted}](name=Antenora,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HLil7QqG,comment-id=000100000000000100000000,timestamp=2019-01-14T17:18:22.331+0000) > > BoTRK isn't even a broken item. Not even close. Except it makes it irrelevant to build health cause that means adcs will always be able to knock you down in chunks of percentages. Since arm pen is ripe and plenty in the game, as well, tanks get over 3K value of their items minimum made irrelevant.
: This game isn't fun anymore, its a gamble in each game still. Always onesided.
There's a reason for this. Riot and tencent want the game to be a monetization mobile game. Gamble on everything and spend more money.
Antenora (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=DeceasedL0ved0ne,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HLil7QqG,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2019-01-14T11:41:35.164+0000) > > Conqueror, infinity edge, Guinsoo's, a buffed bork. There's oddly plenty to ignore armor now-- after they nerfed tank items to rely more on their armor than HP. Conqueror is possibly getting nerfed in 9.2 Infinity Edge is being reverted with a weaker crit damage % amplifier. BOTRK is Physical damage so armor reduces it.
> [{quoted}](name=Antenora,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HLil7QqG,comment-id=0001000000000001,timestamp=2019-01-14T12:00:18.100+0000) > > Conqueror is possibly getting nerfed in 9.2 > > Infinity Edge is being reverted with a weaker crit damage % amplifier. > > BOTRK is Physical damage so armor reduces it. Botrk is HP%, which you build to synergize with resists. Since a lot of your effective health gets neutralized, Botrk makes it worse.
: Thoughts On The Current Ranked System & Some Suggested Changes
Here's a hard truth most of the solo queue fanbase do not know: solo queue ranked exists both as an achievement ladder and a novelty. Riot designs a lot of their business decisions around that ladder, including monetary and designs. In fact, the positional ranked coming exists only to increase this so players have to keep playing to achieve a standard. Always look where the money is. It shows most when you notice that Riot officials post mostly on reddit these days. They don't even visit here. I remember a time when Red posts were very common.
: A serious question to the "live design team".
Riot use to talk design stuff with the boards back on the old format of Riot Boards. These days, their design decisions are player independent. They answer to Tencent and Tencent only. Their goal right now is just keeping the game in the esports scene and popular in China. If you're like me, I suggest you get ready to leave or hope a new competitor rises.
: In the above example, 64% armor penetration is misleading. 400 armor is 80% damage reduction and 147 is 60% damage reduction. This means that Rengar doubled his damage, but the number of damage that he is doubling is almost nothing. Twice 100 damage is still only 200 damage and Poppy likely has over 4k health. Now if Poppy hadn't built all that armor, Rengar would reduce 130 armor to 13. 130 is 57% reduction and 13 is 12%. This means that Rengar would go from 215 damage to 443 damage. Rengar more than doubled his damage on a damage number that was already higher on the Poppy who didn't build armor. The Poppy with armor takes less than half the damage of the Poppy without armor. Assuming Rengar is doing an average of 500 pre mitigated damage per attack, 400 armor Poppy would survive for 20 hits (not including regen and shields) and the Poppy who only built health items would last for 10 hits. If you then factor in that the one lasting 20 hits has more time to stun Rengar, shield herself, and regenerate health she would last probably 3x longer than the one who did not build armor. Explain to me how Poppy is wasting gold by building armor against a Rengar.
> [{quoted}](name=AlienPrimate,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lfsWj1Jo,comment-id=00020000000300000000,timestamp=2019-01-07T07:52:37.349+0000) > > In the above example, 64% armor penetration is misleading. 400 armor is 80% damage reduction and 147 is 60% damage reduction. This means that Rengar doubled his damage, but the number of damage that he is doubling is almost nothing. Twice 100 damage is still only 200 damage and Poppy likely has over 4k health. Now if Poppy hadn't built all that armor, Rengar would reduce 130 armor to 13. 130 is 57% reduction and 13 is 12%. This means that Rengar would go from 215 damage to 443 damage. Rengar more than doubled his damage on a damage number that was already higher on the Poppy who didn't build armor. The Poppy with armor takes less than half the damage of the Poppy without armor. > > Assuming Rengar is doing an average of 500 pre mitigated damage per attack, 400 armor Poppy would survive for 20 hits (not including regen and shields) and the Poppy who only built health items would last for 10 hits. If you then factor in that the one lasting 20 hits has more time to stun Rengar, shield herself, and regenerate health she would last probably 3x longer than the one who did not build armor. Explain to me how Poppy is wasting gold by building armor against a Rengar. Getting melted by the non assassins on the enemy team.
Antenora (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lfsWj1Jo,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2019-01-06T01:05:01.938+0000) > > Black cleaver is in every game - 24% > Lord dominiks - 35% > A large chunk of champions have natural pen ranging from 25%-30% > Then add in flat pen from lethality items and runes. > > Not to mention conversions from conquerer They don't stack additively. I'm gonna try my hand at some math here.   Let's say for the purpose of this math we have the following A 6 item {{champion:78}} with approximately 400 armor A 6 item {{champion:107}} with {{item:3142}} {{item:3147}} {{item:3071}} {{item:3036}} {{item:3047}} {{item:3026}}   When attacking, armor penetration and armor reduction are considered in the following order: > Armor reduction, flat -> Armor reduction, percentage -> Armor penetration, percentage -> Lethality. So if a Level 18 Rengar uses ult and engages on a 400 armor poppy I believe the math would look something like this   The flat Armor reduction from Rengar's ultimate is applied first so it's 400 - 24 = 376 armor. Then Black Cleaver stacks are applied to that 376 armor. To work out the shred do 376 x 0.24 which is 90.24 At this point Poppy has 285.76 armor. Lord Dominiks then applies to that 285.76 armor. To work this out it's 285 x 0.35 which is 99.75 At this point Poppy has 186.01 armor. Then at level 18 Rengar has 39 lethality from Duskblade and Ghostblade. So deduct 39 from 186.01 which leaves 147.01 armor. 147.01 is 36.75% of 400.... That build removes 63.25% of Poppy's armor.
> [{quoted}](name=Antenora,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lfsWj1Jo,comment-id=000200000003,timestamp=2019-01-06T14:45:55.273+0000) > > They don't stack additively. > > > I'm gonna try my hand at some math here. > > >   > > Let's say for the purpose of this math we have the following > > A 6 item {{champion:78}} with approximately 400 armor > A 6 item {{champion:107}} with {{item:3142}} {{item:3147}} {{item:3071}} {{item:3036}} {{item:3047}} {{item:3026}} > >   > > When attacking, armor penetration and armor reduction are considered in the following order: > > So if a Level 18 Rengar uses ult and engages on a 400 armor poppy I believe the math would look something like this > >   > > The flat Armor reduction from Rengar's ultimate is applied first so it's 400 - 24 = 376 armor. > > Then Black Cleaver stacks are applied to that 376 armor. To work out the shred do 376 x 0.24 which is 90.24 > > > At this point Poppy has 285.76 armor. > > Lord Dominiks then applies to that 285.76 armor. To work this out it's 285 x 0.35 which is 99.75 > > At this point Poppy has 186.01 armor. > > Then at level 18 Rengar has 39 lethality from Duskblade and Ghostblade. > > So deduct 39 from 186.01 which leaves 147.01 armor. > > > 147.01 is 36.75% of 400.... > > > So almost 64% armor penetration... lol I did math similar to this a month ago. Tanks are practically wasting over 4K gold on tank items.
: > [{quoted}](name=Cdore,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qAeELfWm,comment-id=001d0000,timestamp=2018-12-14T23:27:00.020+0000) > > Capitalism isn't the reason this happens. Your anger is justified, but it's directed at the wrong entity. The design team, or whoever brought the game to this state, is responsible for this. Saying capitalism sucks is basically you saying that the government is the only ones who can make the game better. You're misinformed on what capitalism is. > > With capitalism, it means someone else can rise and take over the space that Riot is retreating from. All of their actions will have market consequences, much like any market in history. And believe me, if someone smells money, they will produce it. My point is that the market is deciding RIGHT NOW. And right now, the decision is "one shot meta is good actually". People are voting with their dollars, and they're voting FOR this meta. Worlds wildly popular. Skins selling like hotcakes. Queue pops instantly. HoTS went in the complete opposite direction from League, with a huge company and massively popular franchises behind it. It's _dead_. I have never gotten oneshotted playing HOTS. EVER. Even the assassins can only 2 shot you if you're already chunked. And yet it's dead. The alternative you mention ALREADY EXISTED. And it's dead. You can say your or mine tastes are superior or more refined, but the market thinks otherwise. Especially in a globalized market where even if the NA players who have been in the game since the beginning all die off, they can just focus on Asia and still bring in shitloads of profits. Is it selling out? of course it is! That's the point! Riot exists to make money for Tencent, and what makes money for Tencent = this meta. You can leave, or you can stay, but the consumer base that prefers the one-shot meta is bigger than the one that hates it; the latter just complains more about it, because people who hate a product change complain about it, while people who like a product change *don't* complain about it (btw this is not commenting on the legitimacy of said complaints). If this meta was losing Riot money, they'd change it back.
> [{quoted}](name=Unironic SJW,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qAeELfWm,comment-id=001d00000000,timestamp=2018-12-14T23:34:01.508+0000) > > My point is that the market is deciding RIGHT NOW. And right now, the decision is "one shot meta is good actually". People are voting with their dollars, and they're voting FOR this meta. Worlds wildly popular. Skins selling like hotcakes. Queue pops instantly. > > HoTS went in the complete opposite direction from League, with a huge company and massively popular franchises behind it. It's _dead_. I have never gotten oneshotted playing HOTS. EVER. Even the assassins can only 2 shot you if you're already chunked. And yet it's dead. The alternative you mention ALREADY EXISTED. And it's dead. > > You can say your or mine tastes are superior or more refined, but the market thinks otherwise. Especially in a globalized market where even if the NA players who have been in the game since the beginning all die off, they can just focus on Asia and still bring in shitloads of profits. Is it selling out? of course it is! That's the point! Riot exists to make money for Tencent, and what makes money for Tencent = this meta. You can leave, or you can stay, but the consumer base that prefers the one-shot meta is bigger than the one that hates it; the latter just complains more about it, because people who hate a product change complain about it, while people who like a product change *don't* complain about it (btw this is not commenting on the legitimacy of said complaints). If this meta was losing Riot money, they'd change it back. The one thing to understand is that no matter how much anyone praises or dislike what Riot or Blizzard is doing, their game is a product in the end. The pain most will have to go through is having a favorite game of theirs become shit, and that's hard to swallow and accept. So people naturally will complain at the target company for things to get better. But as they complain, the company doesn't listen cause they found a new set of reliable consumers. The answer to this, for any consumer, is to find something else. Which is hard to do because making a video game like League is hard and takes a lot of money. And we all know this, so I can see why people become attached as this is the only game scratching that itch. And it sucks. But I just commented to show that capitalism is your only chance of getting something better. If we assume that Fortnite, for instance, is taking away all their fanbase, then Riot has three choices: return to the core base that built this game with more strategic gameplay, double down on the monetization effect (which they are doing right now) cause the BAs in their company only understand the dollar, OR Riot dies. We can't make this decision for them, but we can certainly influence it.
: trick question. Boards, or even Reddit, isn't their playerbase. We can complain all they want, but numbers don't lie. League is more popular and profitable than ever, even in the wake of a massive sex scandal, and the game that is the polar opposite of the current damage meta, HoTS, just keeled over, while DoTA 2 is barely keeping pace. Riot is a business, and the point of a business is to make money. Even if League goes into steady decline ala WoW, corporations don't think in the long term anyway. Don't like it? capitalism sucks.
> [{quoted}](name=Unironic SJW,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qAeELfWm,comment-id=001d,timestamp=2018-12-14T23:09:05.532+0000) > > trick question. Boards, or even Reddit, isn't their playerbase. We can complain all they want, but numbers don't lie. League is more popular and profitable than ever, even in the wake of a massive sex scandal, and the game that is the polar opposite of the current damage meta, HoTS, just keeled over, while DoTA 2 is barely keeping pace. > > Riot is a business, and the point of a business is to make money. Even if League goes into steady decline ala WoW, corporations don't think in the long term anyway. Don't like it? capitalism sucks. Capitalism isn't the reason this happens. Your anger is justified, but it's directed at the wrong entity. The design team, or whoever brought the game to this state, is responsible for this. Saying capitalism sucks is basically you saying that the government is the only ones who can make the game better. You're misinformed on what capitalism is. With capitalism, it means someone else can rise and take over the space that Riot is retreating from. All of their actions will have market consequences, much like any market in history. And believe me, if someone smells money, they will produce it.
: I don't think all of the additions are bad. RNG dragons are an interesting concept, but I feel like they are implemented totally wrong. They should be something to mix up games without feeling too random. I think that they would function better if the dragon order was decided and shown to players before the character select started so picks and bans could be made accordingly. Have a start with 3 internals? Might be good to ban a champ like Karthus that heavily benefits. Rift harold just adds to the trade equation. I don't think its that terrible of an addition. The addition simply makes another mid game contested objective that usually give you more map control by giving you a strong chance of getting a tower. I actually think it's a great addition overall. I think the biggest problem is that games are becoming faster and two staples of the game can't keep up very well. The first being tanks, and the second being adcs.
> [{quoted}](name=A treespook nest,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qkeook0L,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-12-07T06:23:39.363+0000) > > I don't think all of the additions are bad. > > RNG dragons are an interesting concept, but I feel like they are implemented totally wrong. They should be something to mix up games without feeling too random. I think that they would function better if the dragon order was decided and shown to players before the character select started so picks and bans could be made accordingly. Have a start with 3 internals? Might be good to ban a champ like Karthus that heavily benefits. > > Rift harold just adds to the trade equation. I don't think its that terrible of an addition. The addition simply makes another mid game contested objective that usually give you more map control by giving you a strong chance of getting a tower. I actually think it's a great addition overall. > > I think the biggest problem is that games are becoming faster and two staples of the game can't keep up very well. The first being tanks, and the second being adcs. That's interesting. A game where tanks and adcs are not meta. No wonder bruisers, mages, and sins are running wild.
Rioter Comments
: probably tomorrow when snow events start
> [{quoted}](name=Still Virgiñ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vQp2Lz52,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-12-05T15:54:05.869+0000) > > probably tomorrow when snow events start Hope so.
Rioter Comments
darkdill (NA)
: There needs to be some sort of comeback mechanics pertaining to vision
I propose either the return of clairvoyance, adding clairvoyance to the SpellBook list, or a rune that gives some kind of vision argumentation. Unfortunately, I doubt Riot will listen to us. They have been nerfing vision for a reason. They don't like games being safe, as they like to call it. They want risk and games to be action packed for their esport scene.
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Cdore

Level 182 (NA)
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