: It's funny you bother to bring my rank into this when... 1) Being bronze I still know how to deal with a champ like Tryndamere. 2) You seem to show a great bias against Pantheon without supporting argument. Panth is a champ who thrives or withers based on his match-up, so I am going to assume you are salty he counters your favorite top. 3) You acknowledge Shaco is a shadow of the terror he used to be capable of but somehow still think he is a problem to play against. My Bronze opinion is you haven't given real thought to champion kits on a whole and are crying about snowball champs you lose to and don't know how to deal with when there are some truly toxic champ designs out there.
you want an argument against pantheon. here you go. pantheon has two point and click abilities, range harass in a melee matchup that has basically zero counterplay. if you are a melee into pantheon he just Q's you until he can all in you. smart players know this so they just surrender the early game and try to survive. tryndamere's only real counterplay is to cc him during his ult or have mobility to get away and even then it can be very hard to deal with him. his kit lends itself to snowballing but also due to the nature of being able to not die for 5 seconds he can just afk farm back into the game against weaker opponents. both are very binary, very awful in their design. they aren't op. this post isnt about whats op. these champs usually get gutted or hammered down to not be oppressive.
: Shaco is nowhere near his past days of murderous mayhem. Akali is in an unhealthy place for anyone playing her more than against. The Twitch Bitching is getting out of hand considering how squishy he is. Panth? Wut? Tryn? Dude, CC ruins his ult. This is a poor list. You leave out the toxic infinite stacking Nasus and Veigar, the memelord that is Garen, and the "doesn't matter if you beat me up, now I have ult and kill" Zed. Down voting.
you are entitled to your bronze 3 opinion, but I strongly disagree with it. pantheon deserves to be on this list. shaco is only not as bad because he's been gutted. the only people who play the champ now are those that just enjoy shaco's playstyle. shaco basically went from toxic ad assassin, to an ap burst cheese assassin, to a tiamat tank bruiser build. and all of those builds have been gutted at one point or another. he needs a rework and badly.
Rioter Comments
: You won't _kill her_ because she's going to run away with her mobility, but that doesn't mean that she is gonna kill you. Her damage just doesn't feel high enough to do anything meaningful unless she's fed.
her damage is very high with jsut gunblade in the mid game. she doesnt need to be snow balled to kill you. she needs to be snowball and win the game off her mid game though since she cant kill an adc late game.
: > [{quoted}](name=Charlie Tilts U,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=P5yX8nbq,comment-id=0015,timestamp=2017-09-21T16:08:39.796+0000) > > well they reworked it to be a good combo with liandry's. so a rylais/liandrys champ cna do well with it. > > Malz, Brand, and I don't play them much but I'm sure Aurelion Sol and Karthus probably could build rylais well. > > but thats very few champions. I Think they pushed its niche too far. Personally I would rather it get even weaker stats and a stronger slow. so you pay for a strong utility. > > like bring back the 40% slow, but make it only 60 ap so you are sacrficing a lot for that slow. > > the item isn't terrible, but it's just not appealing to a wide array of champions. reworked it? I always though it was a good combo with Liandry's regardless of it's iteration. There is a slight complication with your proposal. While sacrificing Damage for utility sounds like fair trade off, it's bound to get abused by champs, who never cared about stats to begin with. (I.E. Supports) And while 2600 gold is quite a bit compared to most support items, it's not completely out of their budget range. Crystal scepter is pretty much going to be a niche item, but until we decide which niche it should fill, we can't really pick a direction for it. At the moment, it's sitting between a slot ineffecent APC item, and a somewhat expensive support item.
i cant think of many supports who could abuse it. nami isn't going to build this over locket/redemption/ardent. neither is sona or any other enchanter. so i don't see it being abused by supports. and as for being built on champs who don't even want the damage anyway, whats wrong with that? the item needs a niche, and right now it doesn't really have one besides being built on DOT champions who also build liandrys. (who don't already have a slow in their kit)
: Rylai is no longer built on Mordekaiser otps
well they reworked it to be a good combo with liandry's. so a rylais/liandrys champ cna do well with it. Malz, Brand, and I don't play them much but I'm sure Aurelion Sol and Karthus probably could build rylais well. but thats very few champions. I Think they pushed its niche too far. Personally I would rather it get even weaker stats and a stronger slow. so you pay for a strong utility. like bring back the 40% slow, but make it only 60 ap so you are sacrficing a lot for that slow. the item isn't terrible, but it's just not appealing to a wide array of champions.
: do protect the kog comps exist anymore?
kog is a problem in general. now that he's returned to get massive free % health on his damage, and rageblade exists, he's just too good built with cheap on hit items and rageblade. rageblade needs to be reworked so kog can't do the insane dmg that he currently does. he was fine when people were still building him trinity (albeit a bit weak) after his rework revert. but once they realized you could still go rageblade it was all over. he is a hyper carry with a one item spike. its busted. no hyper carry should spike at one item. between kog, trist, and twitch there's not much reason to play anyone else. I'm a Lucian, Ezreal, MF player with a bit of trist and its pretty miserable right now. I either pick trist or put my team at a disadvantage. they need to look at nerfing trist E further, getting rid of phantom hit on rageblade and replacing it with something else, and reworking twitch to not be as cancer as he is. because twitch is pretty weak in lane, but in a meta where lane bullies often aren't worth it, he gets to scale up. and that means he either is oppressive like he is now or completley unplayable.
Yenn (NA)
: One sided games and intentional feeding grows exponentially as you approach Diamond V
eh plat 2- d5 is just the true elo hell of league for everyone if you aren't good enough to be d4 or better. thats lal there is to it. players are good enough to snowball their leads to shit and dont dick around. they close out games. there are still some throws but they are few and far between. usually dying twice in lane to anyone is gg for that lane and if your jungle is incompetent its gg even if all 3 lanes win usually becuase your jungler will be out pressured, lose all objectives and you get shit on. that said just keep grinding. if you deserve to climb out to d5 you will. its annoying that the games are pub stompy once you hit high plat, but thats just part of the game. i tilt sometimes too. take a break.
: Twitch has been terrorizing solo queue all season and has an amazing winrate in pros
anyone who thinks Kalista isn't fundamentally a problem has not played against her in solo queue in higher elos. in the hands of a player who has actualy invested time into the champ and has good mechanics shes a nightmare. her laning is actually really hard to deal with due to the fact rend makes her win pretty much any extended trade. she has the mobility to force fights and chase you down like lucian only its not gated by a cooldown so you have to respect her short hop engage range. outside of lane shes awful for melee champs to kill. like unless you got ranged siege/aoe she is gonna have a field day with your t eam. and even though she technically falls off late game in dps it doesnt matter because shes almost impossible to kill when she gets QSS, enough lifesteal to drain tank, and has the peel from locket/redemption that other adcs get on top of their support and front line to play behind. I played a game recently where we stomped her in lane, but once she got QSS no one on my team could catch her and she just had a field day in team fights. she needs a rework. specifically aimed at her passive. her passive is fun to play with but that it has no cooldown, is not gated by a ramp up or anything means she is just so hard to catch. on top of having the ability to save a support and engage with a support is nuts. she also has best in class objective taking
: Thanks for making this thread OP. As a 600k MF main, its nice to feel the love for our fav champ! Here's hoping they give her a look during the pre-season or sooner. They had some attack speed related changes a while back that got pulled off the PTR. I think they should consider giving {{champion:21}} tools to help love tap work better in lane. Things like bonus attack range, move speed, attack speed for short duration after love tapping an enemy champ. This would help her live the fantasy of target swapping frequently. They should also consider having love tap benefit from crit, which would solidify crit as the way to go.
move speed after love tap would be interesting as well. I also like the idea of bonus range on an un love tapped target. interesting! if a target that didn't have love tap could give you pseudo extra range on that target only (and other targets who don't have love tap applied) than that would be cool. a decent alternative to my idea for sure. the only downside to this I feel is that there would be no downtime on her increased range so long as she is swapping targets. which might be op. she could in theory have 100% uptime with my suggestion too, but thats not until she is 3 items. which is ok then i Feel. having massively increased range in lane would make her a MASSIVE bully since she can get rid of love tap on an enemy very quickly by hitting a minion. and in lane she'd almost always have the move speed boost. her laning isn't really a problem right now as she is still a big bully. its just that with 550 range she doesn't do much outside of lane against a lot of comps. and her sustained damage is total dick. Love tap already does too much damage to benefit from much else to be honest. it has a 100% ad ratio which basically gives you a free crit on your first auto. and then if you crit on top of that its like a 350% auto damage crit. thats pretty absurd. if your shiv procs thats up to another 400 magic damage. its just really unhealthy. I think they need a new passive or to nerf the ratio. someone here suggested to bring back impure shots and put it on her passive in place of love shots and then fix her ad scaling. I like this idea the best. as long as it doesnt deal magic damage of course.
: AD Crit leblanc kills ppl faster than full AP burst leblanc
your point? you can kill anyone late game with multiplicative scaling items. nothing will scale harder than items that multiply their own damage off of each other. and crit chance, crit damage, attack speed, and attack damage all do this. try killing a leblanc 1 v 1 before 3/4 items. you aren't going to.
: So I just tested a new build for Mordekaiser and then it hit me...
wouldnt a rylais instead of steraks be too good to pass up. sure you sacrifice the shield, but the rylais/liandry's burn on ult is insanely good considering how long it lasts.
: They're cheap because crit chance is a weak stat if you don't have Infinity Edge. Which is their most expensive item.
its actually not. IE/ER are 200 gold cheaper than BT now.
: Remove Mordekaiser's W XP passive
the problem is not the exp or the ability to fight adcs. adcs have the range but if that melee finds a way on top of the adc they are pretty much donezo. its why cheese lanes still do work. its that no other class can really take objectives quickly AND safely. besides ziggs there really isn't anyone who can. I heard wildapsona does sona with lich bane to take towers pretty quick, but beyond that I haven't seen anything rival adc dps. and evne then im sure those champs dont rival adc dps on baron/drag. what they need to do is make adcs scale less hard late game but have a better early game to round out their power curve. and then give other forms of objective taking to other classes. whether it be huge burst to major objectives, the new demolisher type runes, or introducing new dps mages/melees into the game who have some way of taking towers safely from range.
: Could Soraka's sweetspot ever come back?
champion is just total cancer to lane against. Q is way too easy to land. personally I'd be ok if the heal was tied solely to the sweet spot. either that or the heal you get from not landing in the sweet spot is super weak. right now its just too easy to land a Q on people.
Rioter Comments
Jharr (NA)
: > is Janna dangerously close to becoming Not an ADC, just close to becoming one. Lol, scary thought though isn't it? You're brain won't allow you to even consider that she is like 1 step away from being an ADC. Imagine her Q with AD scaling or her new passive dealing %HP damage base on bonus MS instead of a flat amount :)
shes not even close to becoming one. read my post. i explained why with logic and reason. she is not a few changes. she would systematically have to be reworked. its not that my brain wont allow it to consider it. its that I've thought about it and its not even close. you are really stretching here. good try though.
Jharr (NA)
: About Janna, is it just me...
no. just no. stop and think. janna will have 550 auto range and no ad scalings on any of her abilities. no attack speed steroids either. 550 range is VAYNE range which is really short effective dps range. vayne is actually trash because of this despite the fact she is absolutely busted in terms of dps/mobility and even she has a form of self peel (condemn) Janna is not "dangerously close" to being an adc. if you want self peel you would go tristana who is mobile, has resets, burst damage, longer range, attack speed steroids, her abilities scale with ad, and some of the best self peel for adcs in the game. or xayah who also attack speed, damage steroids, untargetability, wave clear, poke, and burst damage. the only enchanter who could theoretically be close to being an adc is lulu and thats because she has an attack speed steroid and an auto enhancer in pix. her W can also be used offensively in a 1 v 1 to win that as well. however, lulu only has 500 range, even less than Vayne and zero abilities that scale with AD that she can use to harass with or even team fight with. which means her team fight and laning effective threat range is 500. which is trash. thats lucian without the mobility or damage. no. just....no.
: i would rather have cait ivern karma back then this heal barrier ardent shit
no thanks. both suck. hyper carry metas mean lane bullies have no place. and thats REALLY bad. lane bullies who cant bully. so useless champs? got it. Ivern at his peak was absolute cancer to play against. and cait/karma in bot was basically an auto loss if the jungler didn't show up early to make them respect him. Cait in general is a cancerous design. hopefully the 30 second duration traps make her lane phase less oppressive now that she's getting a full revert. but let's not pretend all that meta was better. they both fucking sucked. hyper carries should never ever be the meta without at least being able to be punished by lane bullies. I mean there aren't really any lane bullies left in bot. lucian gutted so hard he is a mid laner only now, MF is super bad vs tanks, and Jhin is also super bad vs tanks.
iLBGAMing (EUW)
: Champions that ACTUALLY need a rework
i see skarner as a niche pick and mundo is always played due to his simplicity. mundo needs a rework more because of how easy it is to counter his kit. either he's oppressive cuz grievous wounds can't stop him, or he's useless cuz grievous wounds can. he's just outdated. and aatrox is literally has a gameplay update coming up similar to xin zhao but apparently more in depth. just be patient there. its coming.
: Nasus's Q change wasn't too bad, but the veigar one means we're heading in a direction I don't like
games are not decided in the first 15 minutes as hard as you lead on. if so you would only see lane bullies, especially in bot lane like Lucian/MF/Jhin. but they aren't meta? why because games average aroudn 30-35 minutes. we just aren't in the 40-45 minute metas of season 5 which were honestly cancer. it was stall and wave clear forever. azir vs viktor in pro play. was awful. what they need to do with some of these champs is give them a better lane phase that isn't good or even remotely strong, but not completely fucking atrocious either. then they have a chance at scaling up. currently veigar's lane is so fucking bad he cannot lane safely really against competent opponents. vayne has this problem. nasus has this problem (still) and cho gath even still has this problem. the only time you see these champions get picked is when they are hideously broken when they scale. cho is pick or ban right now and nasus is even seeing pro play as a niche counterpick to tanks. I don't like the direction they are going but its clear they just want these scaling champs to scale insanely hard. i wish they would make them scale less hard and give them better early games. like vayne doesn't need a reset on her ult. Veigar doesn't need a super low cooldown meteor shower. they need a chance to scale up. and fight in lane phase.
: Yup Lucian definitely need some **budding**.
> [{quoted}](name=The Deckowner,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=XpJNRAcE,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2017-09-13T14:03:05.087+0000) > > Yup Lucian definitely need some **budding**. eks dee
: > [{quoted}](name=Charlie Tilts U,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=XpJNRAcE,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2017-09-13T09:57:14.307+0000) > > its not even a matter of him not being meta. he wasn't meta until bork was a thing. he was out of the meta for a LONG time. once bork got reworked he came back. > > like I said in the original post. crit lucian has been balanced for a long time or at least isn't oppressive. right now crit lucian is undertuned in the mid game which is his strongest point. his late game is nasty but due to his short range and lack of utility Lucian isn't a champ that wants to go to the late game. its a conflicting thing. > > I'm not suggesting you buff him to the point where he's a monster again. he's already pretty good. but he's just not good in bot lane due to how he scales. he has to pubstomp which in this meta vs sustain/shield supps its very hard to punish the enemy bot lane hard enough to justify picking lucian over any other better scaling adc. > > He should still be a crit based champion as I feel almost all adcs should have this as their primary build with other builds being an "option" but not mandatory. > > Right now Lucian is balanced around the old ghostblade/cleaver build which was gutted. and now bork/cleaver. > > He's just not good with crit because of it. he's still playable, but at this point you are only playing him because you enjoy him, not because he can compete in this meta. > > in an ideal world all the adcs will bring some form of strength to the table. Lucian, MF, and Jhin are so far out of the meta that its not even worth picking them most of the time. and its not because they are necessarily heavily undertuned, they just have very conflicting identities. (mainly MF/Lucian) both those champs only scale well with crit but if you go the bork/cleaver build you will do absolutely dick to tanks at 3 items which is absolutely necessary in this meta for adcs in the bot lane. > > in the mid lane lucian can get away with it because he's not the primary adc, but in bot lane he better close out the game and fast if he goes bork/cleaver. Jhin and mf both strong picks with options and are doing ok in this meta, Mf in low elo especially. In the adc meta where hypercarries are more popular due to more protection, tanks peeling, ardent censor and support that sheild bot or heal the adc, and i.e./shiv is the powerspike for ad's. Lucian is a lane bully but he can't effectively bully the carry since supports now negate most or not entirely all his harass this goes for cait aswell whose recently been gutted into trash tier. Jhin and mf (draven but still perms banned) are good lane bullies to the extent because they can still zone out the carries farm, poke AND bring utility they can shut down a hypercarry early game especially mf with her Q and poke function. But I agree with your idea.
mf and jhin are not ok in this meta. they only have decent win rates higher up because the players who play them know the games they can play them. the games they can play them they can perform well, but in this meta they are bad. and you can never blind pick them. both are so bad into tanks that if you first pick jhin or MF and they stack tanky champions (2 or 3) you are fucked. you will do nothing that game.
: > [{quoted}](name=Charlie Tilts U,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=IYhLnHdk,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2017-09-13T10:00:37.378+0000) > > his kit may be toxic, but if you wanna have fun, play akali into him. burst him down to like 5% health, when he pops ult you pop your shroud and you just stay in it. the vast majority of trynda's damage are in his auto attacks obviously and your shroud lasts longer than his ultimate. he can't pink ward it and he can't target you even if sweeper. just stay in it and make him run away. if he is dumb enough to try to wait you out you will out last his ult and you can just burst him. if he tries to spin away last second just dash after him since you are akali. > > if he brings ignite to get true sight (likely you can also run cleanse to instantly cleanse his ignite and then shroud and he still can't see you. > > I'm not sure if its a true counter, but I had fun playing Akali into trynda. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dm6j6ExmWfI
i mean you killed her level 1 before she even got her shroud. that akali is terrible. she just had to give up cs early and let you push her into her tower and farm up to 6. once she gets to 6 there isn't anything trynda can do really. especially if she is smart and goes something like tabi or armguard early.
: tryndamere is more frustrating then yasuo
his kit may be toxic, but if you wanna have fun, play akali into him. burst him down to like 5% health, when he pops ult you pop your shroud and you just stay in it. the vast majority of trynda's damage are in his auto attacks obviously and your shroud lasts longer than his ultimate. he can't pink ward it and he can't target you even if sweeper. just stay in it and make him run away. if he is dumb enough to try to wait you out you will out last his ult and you can just burst him. if he tries to spin away last second just dash after him since you are akali. if he brings ignite to get true sight (likely you can also run cleanse to instantly cleanse his ignite and then shroud and he still can't see you. I'm not sure if its a true counter, but I had fun playing Akali into trynda.
Thalía (NA)
: How about instead of that we just don't buff Lucian at all *and* nerf him for mid lane. He's basically been meta for years, we could use a damn break.
its not even a matter of him not being meta. he wasn't meta until bork was a thing. he was out of the meta for a LONG time. once bork got reworked he came back. like I said in the original post. crit lucian has been balanced for a long time or at least isn't oppressive. right now crit lucian is undertuned in the mid game which is his strongest point. his late game is nasty but due to his short range and lack of utility Lucian isn't a champ that wants to go to the late game. its a conflicting thing. I'm not suggesting you buff him to the point where he's a monster again. he's already pretty good. but he's just not good in bot lane due to how he scales. he has to pubstomp which in this meta vs sustain/shield supps its very hard to punish the enemy bot lane hard enough to justify picking lucian over any other better scaling adc. He should still be a crit based champion as I feel almost all adcs should have this as their primary build with other builds being an "option" but not mandatory. Right now Lucian is balanced around the old ghostblade/cleaver build which was gutted. and now bork/cleaver. He's just not good with crit because of it. he's still playable, but at this point you are only playing him because you enjoy him, not because he can compete in this meta. in an ideal world all the adcs will bring some form of strength to the table. Lucian, MF, and Jhin are so far out of the meta that its not even worth picking them most of the time. and its not because they are necessarily heavily undertuned, they just have very conflicting identities. (mainly MF/Lucian) both those champs only scale well with crit but if you go the bork/cleaver build you will do absolutely dick to tanks at 3 items which is absolutely necessary in this meta for adcs in the bot lane. in the mid lane lucian can get away with it because he's not the primary adc, but in bot lane he better close out the game and fast if he goes bork/cleaver.
: on its own i like it but theres such a heavy focus on crit rn i really dont want to see even more until they tone that back
crit is tuned fine, the problem is the support itemization is busted making crit adcs the only ones worth it since supports can get you through lane phase and outscale in the mid and late game. a lane bully would have to CRUSH lane to be viable right now and with how nerfed the lane bullies are they just aren't worth it. Jhin might be the only one who can bully still besides MF but both of them build lethality and both are terrible at taking down tanks even with crit builds.
: > [{quoted}](name=Charlie Tilts U,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=oxLkv87E,comment-id=0021000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-09-12T22:52:19.293+0000) > > Your remaining 3 members? If you have double split push and pace it properly even if the enemy team groups they either have to dive and clean wipe the remaining 3 or back off because they will lose both side lanes. Literally the dumbest thing to respond with. Like, your whole team is squishy. You opt for a split push in TWO lanes and you don't think that an enemy team won't just dive your turret and obliterate your mid lane, forcing your split pushers to scramble back to mid lane? All the enemy has to do is threaten a game over quick enough and your cute little idea's finished. If a 1-3-1 split works as a long term strategy, you were going to win in the first place if you just grouped.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtf7g7I8MnM yeah man, a team with all squishies could never deal with a team that has a front line. season 4 worlds. omg vs shr. they split the fuck out of shr who had a clear team fight comp and would fuck them if they could get a clean 5 v 5. 1 3 1 IS a thing and it works if done properly. it just isn't done well by most people.
Rioter Comments
: Oh really? Then WHO holds the mid lane from the enemy's divers and tanks while you split push?
Your remaining 3 members? If you have double split push and pace it properly even if the enemy team groups they either have to dive and clean wipe the remaining 3 or back off because they will lose both side lanes. You take your wave clear mid and stall. Assuming the split pushers know how to do it properly (back off at right times, can actually 1v1 anyone on the enemy team) then it's a very difficult strat to deal with.
: ADCS ARE PLAYED IN EVERY LANE AND IM DONE PLAYING
the real issue is that adcs are really the only sustained damage champions in the entire game which makes them 100% necessary. if there were more sustained damage mages who were also good at taking towers/objectives. then we would see more diversity in bot lane. ziggs is good at taking towers but has terrible sustained dps compared to a mage. hes still viable bot but very rarely picked anymore now that adcs are good. cassiopeia has sustained dps, good neutral objective taking, but not so good at taking towers. azir used to be good at everything an adc is but is gutted. if he wasn't really easy to abuse by other adcs he'd be a good example of all the requirements you would need from a mage in bot lane. regardless your team needs a sustained physical damage threat to force a tank to build armor as well. so in a sense adcs will probably always be necessary or tanks would reign supreme and be scary as fuck .
: That's not a feasible plan of action in solo queue unless your champ pick is flexible enough to fit most situations. Example: Nearly any team needs a marksman, so if you're just really good at Lucian, even if he's not meta, you could basically "just pick Lucian" since you're always gonna need a marksman anyway. Bad example: In a team that has no tank, going up against a decently tanky team, it's a bad idea to pick multiple assassins. You won't beat that front line and your team fight's gonna be horrible. The moment the game goes even or close to it in the mid game is the moment your swan song begins.
nope. you can play any comp into any comp as long as you understand your champions win conditions. a team with no front line cannot team fight a team with a front line but they can split push them to death.
: Xin Zhao Gameplay Update - To the Arena!
uh that ultimate seems an AWFUL lot like old poppy ultimate which was heavily problematic. how big is the guard area? hopefully its decently sized
: When you're challenger-tier, you can cheese people out just cause you're THAT good at the game. Doesn't mean your argument is correct, though. Champion picks always matter. ALWAYS.
thats exactly the point. being able to be good enough to where champion picks don't matter shows that champion picks don't matter.... in solo queue anyway. you just have to get good enough.
: Maybe you can help me - I wanna get better with Miss Fortune I find I am never doing enough damage during sustained fights, I keep autoing minions inbetween in order to keep applying passive on enemy champs and restack my W faster but I always seem to be outclassed in terms of damage can you give me any hints and tips you use?
MF is just straight up outclassed in terms of sustained damage by literally every other adc. depending on the game if you want to maximize your potential dps you need to run standard adc runes and run 18/12/0 masteries run fervor, the ad per level (with 2 flat at level 1) and the attack speed (like normal) in the middle tree (cunning) you run the merciless mastery to maximize your potential dps. from there you build a normal standard adc build. Infinity Edge > Berserker Greaves > Shiv > Essence Reaver > Pen item > bork or BT (depending on how many tanks they have) fervor is a must or your dps is totally dick. even with fervor your scaling ad is jsut super duper bad and after the first auto you jsut deal significantly less damage. Essence Reaver is essentially to lowering the cooldown of your W so you have more uptime in team fights with it.
: >horrible sustained damage on a single target, basically does no damage after her first auto and Q, especially early She used to have better sustained damage because her W would add more magic on hit damage for each time you attacked the target. I wish riot would bring that back.
Impure Shots would've been a fine mechanic if it dealt bonus physical damage, but it didn't. so it was rather janky in terms of effectiveness. hence why she never really felt good until her rework.
Rioter Comments
Zed genius (EUNE)
: Difference between playing off meta and trolling
people are so delusional in league that they genuinely believe the champion picks really determine the out comes of their games. Have a friend who was low challenger last season, and when we duo together on one of my smurfs he plays intentionally off meta shit that is really hard to challenge himself to win with it. Nami jungle, xerath jungle, frozen heart rush corki top, tank tf mid, etc. and he's shown me that it legit doesn't matter what you play as long as you understand the game and try to win. if someone is playing off meta, maybe they really think its fun. and hey more power to em. but in this game people are so caught up in winning and losing that they tilt even seeing something they think might possibly lower their chances of winning rather than just concern themselves with their OWN play. I have a lulu ADC only account (I'm a plat 2 adc main and the account is much lower) and when I manage to not get lulu banned from me by my own team, the support usually goes mf "support" and takes some or all the cs they can which basically fucks the game because they are legitimately trolling at that point. I wouldn't mind an MF support or an adc support. but don't pick an adc because you don't like my off meta adc pick and then troll me ruining the game for sure. people are so afraid of losing they will troll YOU and GUARANTEE the loss. it makes ZERO sense. Just let people play what they want, worry about yourself, and have fun. People are gonna go stupid ass picks, people are gonna troll. there isnt ANYTHING you can do about it. the only person in every one of your games that you can control the play of is yourself.
: Responding to two different sentiments somewhat quickly: 1) Re: Premade vs Solo: **In Short: As a solo player, you can get whichever of the two rewards you prefer, without ever entering a premade. ** The goal of the mission layout was to actually make you feel like you had a clear/ reasonable path to rewards as a Solo Player. That said, looks like the way they're displayed is throwing people off (You don't see the full flowchart), so that's something we'll talk about going forward There's 6 missions total: 3 of them should require a premade (Get an S and the two team comps) and 3 don't (Beat base, Win as all 3 roles, Get an A). If one of those in the second set isn't unlocking as a solo, that's a bug: Please let me know and we'll try to sort it out as quickly as possible (There is some update lag we're seeing: Once you win the game, if your mission isn't updating, try leaving the EoG, then Close + Re-open mission tab) Both "Sets" of missions give a total of 4 tokens. So as a solo player, completing every mission gets you one of your choice. The 3 missions we chose required premades because for the team compositions, we wanted to avoid as much champ select tension as reasonably possible ("Hey guys don't pick ADC. Oh, you did? I'm dodging"). The S was because we didn't realistically think you could do it without being coordinated, and didn't want to set the expectation you should. 2) re: Difficulty. Uh... yeah :) You're right, these missions, particularly the premade ones, are hard. This is the first time we've experimented with missions like this ("Do something hard" vs "Participate with these conditionals"), so we are definitely curious how they'll go, and any feedback is appreciated. In this particular case, we wanted it to be additional goals to strive for once you have beaten the mode. The missions were made for those who really enjoy the mode and are interested in mastering it, and for them, we wanted some additional commemoration, but also just fun objectives/ "Achievements" to aim for.
feedback on difficulty. difficulty is good for die hard gamers like myself but many of my lower skilled friends found it very frustrating. so I think there should be basic rewards that are simple for easy to do quests that can be done in the easier mode. (not onslaught) whereas ones done in onslaught should grant the better rewards. but the key here is the better reward shouldn't be something exclusive like a skin, ward skin. because that feels bad. everyone wants limited time stuff. thats what makes it exciting. so putting it behind high difficulty is kind of bad. its cool in one degree of highly skilled players who put in the time to beat the modes challenges on hard will have a sign of showing "hey I did this, and not everyone did". but it will feel bad for everyone else. and that's not a good trade off. I think the rewards for the hard difficulty should be a consumable award like a premium chest that contains one of the new star guardian skin shards (and corresponding border icon). and the other hard difficulty quests grant up to 3 key fragments that form a "star guardian key". so those that want a free star guardian skin gotta grind like fucking crazy on this hard as fuck mode multiple times through many challenges just to get one skin. and those that can't do it or find it too frustrating aren't going to lose out on anything "limited".
: Riot Loading Border Shenanigans!
i mean its a throw away. the borders really aren't that big of a deal. if you really care that much you will pay and they know that. skins are their primary source of money, and they are going to milk them for every dollar they can. and they honestly should as a business. its just good business. if you don't want the border or icon then don't pay the extra 3.50 ish in RP. think about it like buying a special edition of a game. a company releases a special edition of a game like Uncharted 4. they could have thrown in the small extras for free for those who buy the game on release. they could. or they could be smart and charge you and extra amount of money. only the die hards want it anyway so they usually will pay whatever for it. the ones who aren't willing to pay the money honestly don't really care about the special edition anyway. unless that edition is priced obscenely and unfairly. the borders are fairly priced since you get an icon with it and most of the icons are pretty cute. the border isn't anything special to be honest. if you want it, get it. if you don't value it at a few bucks then don't do it.
: im speaking about the long path you need to follow while North Korea's anti air is trying to shoot you down
that is the "escape" level. if the RNG spawns the 6 or so vel koz at the very end you are basically fucked. you will have a VERY hard time getting to the end of that one. I've done it only one time out of like many tries vs vel koz in that level. at least its good dodging practice though.
: R laser isn't the issue. The 12-16 normal vel's shooting a billion normal shots with infinite range is much more of a problem. I'm fine with the boss versions being where they are. The normal shot range needs to be reduced to 1.5 -2x ordinary Vel range through.
i mean the R laser vel koz's can be an issue if you get unlucky RNG and like 6 of them spawn at once and you have literally nowhere you can walk without being hit by a laser. happened to me a few times. its like they spawn and they are spread out. so you just look and go "im fucked? im fucked."
GigglesO (NA)
: "You shouldn't be allowed to win fights by pure stats"
adcs are a pure stat check class. that's what they do. they have reliable ranged DPS that is insane in exchange for fragility. their fragility though is in question right now because support itemization is busted. once thats fixed I think ADCs will be finally healthy as they won't be too weak like earlier this year but they won't be everywhere like they are now.
: Why is everyone flipping their shit over this Lee Sin buff?
i mean its a buff to the health of his clear since he will be using it on cooldown. taking less damage means healthier clears. its probably not going to push him into the meta, but it might make him a viable niche pick at worlds if it makes his clears healthy enough to where he can have stronger ganks/invades.
: taric needs a shirtless skin, especially considering the fat man can have his gut showing all game long. in addition to malphite and galios rock hard abs.
GripaAviara (EUNE)
: Seriously, that Lucian is not ok
please stop. he's already being gutted more. 4 more seconds on his E cooldown which means until level 10 its gonna be VERY long. he's pretty much trash in bot lane right now. Lucian is my favorite adc but they just keep nerfing him over and over.
: I Think my aram matches last as long as my SR matches
ARAM only feels more balanced because you have teams of wildly different skill level and many people get champs that are "op" but have no idea how to play them. I play a lot of ARAM to de tilt or chill out. and its not balanced in the slightest. there are some champs that are basically an auto win if the person builds properly like Sona, and then there are times where the comps just are such a big counter to the other its laughable. like 4 juggernauts and a janna vs 3 poke, 1 tank to peel the poke, and an adc to take down the towers quickly. many games I've played result in sub 10 minute wins because one team literally can't do anything but either try to fight when they know they'll lose or just lose all their towers super fast. its a fun mode, and there are some spicy aram games, but rift is not only more balanced, but has just as many comeback wins. its just we remember the 15 minute pub stomps more on rift cuz they sting pretty bad.
: "Oh am adc is low"
that shield is big enough to absorb more than an entire rumble ulti. potentially two rumble ultis. the locket/stoneplate interaction needs to be fixed.
: It's always been who can kill the enemy ADC first.
my argument isn't against ADC's in general. my argument is that ADCs are too hard to kill right now. awhile back when sterak's/maw stacked we had that as a meta and we had unkillable adcs taking over there who were tanky. a EFFECTIVELY tanky high dps class that is RANGED is never going to be healthy. ADC should be a skill based class that rewards good positioning. right now it's way too easy to buff/protect an adc.
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Charlie Tilts U

Level 30 (NA)
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