: [Gameplay] Aery Shield proc by being healed by an ally
: Kleptomancy Improvements
Bump. I'm good with this. How about "Using an ability generate a stack of Kleptomancy (5 second cool down, max 3 stacks.)" as a mechanic? This makes it less potent on low CD champs like GP/Ezreal, while still keeping the flow of "Use spell, then attack". Perhaps make it such that the spell has to hit a champion in order to generate a stack if need be so people don't just spell spam in fountain. Also, double the effect for melee champs since it's so hard for them to apply it.
: Summon Aery AKA diet comet
I don't like how it procs off auto attacks. Even ADC's are taking it just for the free lv 1 damage it gives.
Jerzey (NA)
: its 2018 and ADC's are still not being peeled for
Hard to peel for your ADC when they're face tanking a tower.
Twlnkle (NA)
: Is there a champion that is meant to counter CC?
Morganq is the anti-cc champ. Failing that play Ali and out CC them. Though you should have been able to heal past their damage as Soraka. Taric+Leona don't have much dps beyond their initial burst. ADC could have brought Cleanse as well.
: Lets talk "mid" brand
They don't need to increase his base damages. This will only make bot lane Brand stronger. They need to give him better AP ratios so that gold has actual value for him.
: That was put in to lock Redemption in as an Enchanter item. Otherwise we'd go right back to early season 7 when everyone and their mother bought Redemption and healed their team for a ton of HP.
It still heals for a ton of HP, and the hyper heal scaling only makes it even worse. I don't want to buffed in exchange for the +healing removal. I just want the +healing bonus flat out gone. I do not think Redemption is healthy for the game as it currently is. Even just healing one single person is more enough to make it gold effective. A five man heal is just obscene if you think about the numbers. Everyone bought it because it was, and still is, far too stong.
: Did you seriously just pitch me some kind of ridiculous conspiracy theory that Meddler only nerfs female champions while simultaneously demanding serious discussion on your listed topics?? We've talked about this before, Miku. I'm going to bed now.
I don't blame you at all. Sleep is a far more productive activity than arguing with someone who seems determined to be vindicated at all costs.
: Bro I just had two plat 5 feeders on my team vs all golds. It's not any better. http://prntscr.com/i0h91o
That's just depressing. The Vegar "support" could have been a lot more helpful had they played an Enchanter or a Warden and brought some real utility to the team. Such as an Ali or Tahm to peel for the Tristana against Malphite/Nocturne double whammy.
: Zeal Upgrades & Heal/Shield Power
Rather than Healing power I think Redemption is what is in need of nerfing. Remove the "Gets 3x the bonus from +healing." so that it isn't so ridiculous.
: Why are tanks are busted?
I'm sorry, but if Tahm kills you in a 1v3 when you were Vayne and had Thresh+Jax to peel for you? That just means you're bad. Unless you can upload the replay I'm just going to have to assume the worst out of the situation. 1. You made no effort to dodge his Q. 2. You made no effort to avoid letting Tahm get three stacks on you for Devour. 3. You did not properly kite him with R+Q or your E. 4. You outright went AFK mid fight. We'll need more info if you want to prove otherwise. Edit: I looked up the match in question and everyone on you team, other than the Malphite who farmed all game, was so far behind that a wet fart could have soloed them.
Mimr (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Done25,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZALVBrdQ,comment-id=00100003,timestamp=2018-01-14T18:04:32.160+0000) > > I call bullshit. You know who else kills tanks? Fighters do. > Udyr. Nasus. Trundle. Yi. Jarvan. Mundo. Olaf. They have too much sustain/durability for a tank to 1v1. Whatever tank with a brain lets himself get caught in a 1v1 post laning phase? The only ones out of that list that are able to hurt a tank in a teamfight are Trundle (simply by putting his ult on them so they're easier to kill for his teammates) and Yi when he comes in as the cleanup crew after most CC has been blown with his true damage.
Now you're moving the goal posts. The original post was "who else can kill tanks?". Not "who can kill tanks the fastest". Which is what you seem to be asking. In which case yea. Trundle and Yi specialize in taking out durable targets. Tanks are literally made for 5v5 team fights. They're they best class in the game when it comes to that kind of setting. It's what they do.
: you must have 2 armor /hp items or 1 full armor above 80 armor item and a full hp item if thats all you taking
I pretty much consider Randuin's Omen to be manditory thanks to the "-10% crotch damage" yea.
: Like i said it should have been on its own item as one of the few people who took thronmails every game before its change that loss is jarring. they took away 70% of the items damageversus and hardly comensated with better armor scaling for the damage maybe 10% more armor scaling . this made it less effective versus adcs as now they dont get hurt nearly as much and the thornmails cant even damage through their lifesteal any more even with the reduced healing. none the less soraka when soraka has to kill herself to heal anyone and should be focused before the adc any if you brawling or is useless if you burst the adc. soraka and other enchaters as far as i have seen have never been busted despite community reactions its just that since season 4 started enchanters have only been helping adcs and dont help anyone else and adcs are tuned to not need help for cases when they dont have enchanters
Oh don't worry. I fully agree with you. Another +10% armor to Thornmail's damage would be great. Especially after Sunfire's damage got gutted. Just don't forget they added Cold Steel while they were at it. (-15% attack speed upon being hit.) Life Steal in general could probably use some kind of rework as well. I don't think anyone likes to see Jhin heal for 400 HP off a single minion.
: Im not saying that adc items are not too cheap but i dont that is the problem. i think the problem is that they are too effective compared to other roles when fighters want to be doing the same thing that adcs do but cant because 4 auto attacks 3 of them being crits will shred them and thus are forced to build no ad and go full tank with the black cleaver passive to shred for the adc
Yea. It's not fun getting nailed with a critical IE+Shiv hit and losing a good fourth of your HP.
: It shouldnt be on thormails either that should be on its own item as they just used that to nerf thornmails itself
It has to be. Otherwise tanks have no counter to a Marksman being pumped with 4000 HP by Soraka/Redemption/Heal.
: I agree except i dont this was true when 1 {{item:3076}} didnt exist (who even asked for that secret buff to adcs taking away the 15% damage reflection from {{item:3075}} ) and 2 fighters were allowed to build lifesteal instead of off tank allowing them to outsustain in trades. but this build path is gone for everyone that isnt fiora yasuo and riven. and the build path is gone because of the uptime of mages spells and the reliablity of critical chance
Yea, Bramble Vest shouldn't have the anti-heal attribute. That should be reserved for the Thornmail upgrade. Bramble Vest should be the equivalent of Bami's Cinder. It's a cheap item that tanks can buy to clear faster in the jungle. Though I suppose it's not that bad unless your name is Warwick, Olaf, or Mundo since you have to auto attack them in order to suffer the Wounds.
: But unlike adcs tanks and fighters have a reason for that with Crit from adcs doing so much damage you have to itemize against it because while some mages can miss their skills even though its only realistic versus another mage or adc and not against a tank and fighter who has to walk toward you to have any use at all adcs cant miss their crits attack with attack speed boost ad boost and other modifiers so building armor has much more agency even more so because armor items have horrible stats as sole armor items which fighters need to be able to do to effectively contribute past early game.
Yea. Crit, especially the Zeal items, is just way too cheap and it's out scaling everything at 20 min. Gloves need to be 100 gold more and the Zeal items need to be an additional 100 gold to finish.
FNC Jinx (NA)
: Cause you tell me: **What's the only class that can truly kill those busted tanks that also deal damage while having 9K HP and solo mages and fighters???** Only an ADC can truly kill those tanks that ruin the game. If you don't nerf those toxic tanks, you then need a class that can kill them, resulting in that class also becoming Toxic to anything else, and resulting the meta you see today. Who's gonna kill a 9K HP monster if it's not Vayne or Twitch??? Now, if tanks weren't busted, then suddenly other champions get a chance to shine, and all Crit Strike items would be nerfed for sure. You think it's a coincidence that Jhin is garbage right now even if you build him full crit?? Cause he can't kill tanks. Riot's way to fix it: Make ADCs damage so high so they're able to kill those 9K HP damage dealing walls. And the squishy champions? Mages? Fighters?... of course they just explode with 2 auto attacks. They just buffed Tanks by the way, and I ask again: **What's the only class that can deal with them realistically??** Yeah, ADCs aren't the problem, but a symptom of the problem: **Overpowered Tanks** Wake up people.
I call bullshit. You know who else kills tanks? Fighters do. Udyr. Nasus. Trundle. Yi. Jarvan. Mundo. Olaf. They have too much sustain/durability for a tank to 1v1.
CoffeeMug (EUNE)
: I use it tbh If I play Soraka I usually build {{item:2302}} + {{item:3117}} +{{item:3222}} +{{item:3504}} +{{item:3107}} +{{item:3174}} (combined with Transcendence) make the healing fcking amazing. Sometimes tho I also switch an item for either {{item:3190}} or even {{item:3089}} (rarely tho)
I think that speaks more of how badly designed Redemption's healing is. They really didn't need to add the "+Healing bonuses are tripled" clause to it. You're not really playing Soraka by that point. You're just the person holding Redemption. :P Tl;Dr Mikael's is good **only** when used with Redemption.
CoffeeMug (EUNE)
: Huge would be an understatement. Even Mikael's will get reduced to 15%
CoffeeMug (EUNE)
: As long as my Soraka,Janna and Nami benefit from it I'm all for the changes :D
The +20% healing would be a huge boon for them yea. :D
: I want this, but I don't want non-Supports to have this :/
I don't think it'll be that huge an issue. Coin is useless to non-supports. Targon needs a partner and is being nerfed for ranged champs. T1/T2 Frost Fang could lose some AP in exchange for more damage on the passive to stop mid laners from buying it.
CoffeeMug (EUNE)
: Hasnt healing and shielding power been nerfed by quite a bit? 20% seems like much
> [{quoted}](name=CoffeeMug,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zoQbjrb4,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-01-13T10:32:50.855+0000) > > Hasnt healing and shielding power been nerfed by quite a bit? 20% seems like much Yea, but that's pretty much all the item gains for being upgraded. Health and Mana regeneration aren't exactly the most impactfull stats in a fight. Don't forget that it's also losing the "coin drop on enemy champ death" bit for completing it's quest. Just like how Targon is losing that 1000+ gold value shield.
: thes changes would make Frost fang and targon line too attractive for non support roles.
> [{quoted}](name=ChaddyFantome,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zoQbjrb4,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-01-13T08:30:44.369+0000) > > thes changes would make Frost fang and targon line too attractive for non support roles. They're still worse than morellonomicon and warmogs in the end. The Targon line is also being nerfed for ranged champs by halfing the healing on the PBE.
Sirthael (EUW)
: Yeah i'm already using an ingenious hunter + ruby sightstone on supports, redemption/mikael's and so on goes down to 48seconds, now it'll be 72s, it's a pretty big difference :/
> [{quoted}](name=Sirthael,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zoQbjrb4,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2018-01-13T05:06:14.664+0000) > > Yeah i'm already using an ingenious hunter + ruby sightstone on supports, redemption/mikael's and so on goes down to 48seconds, now it'll be 72s, it's a pretty big difference :/ They might actually be wanting to remove Ruby Sightstone for this very reason. Stacking the CDR with Ing. Hunter is just too strong. Redemption being up that often basically means you never have to worry about being low on hp before a fight. It's basically Soraka's ult in item format.
Kaìju (NA)
: I like the Nunu buffs
Lulu used to give AP, but she'd just use it on herself. This is probably a big reason why supports can't buff AP. Riot is probably giving it a try on Nunu since he doesn't normally go full AP.
Skias (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Done25,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zoQbjrb4,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-01-12T22:43:00.763+0000) > > Thank youuuu. This would also be a great chance to put +Heal/Shield on the gold coin line, which I've wanted for a long time. This would let it be more than just "the item that gives you gold". Since gold is useless once you fill all six slots. Yeah. These items are awful. They actually hurt you to finish. The gold you spend to complete the item is nearly negative in value. They didn't help supports. You're just taking an 800g loan against your final build value.
> [{quoted}](name=Skias,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zoQbjrb4,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-12T23:02:20.942+0000) > > Yeah. These items are awful. They actually hurt you to finish. The gold you spend to complete the item is nearly negative in value. They didn't help supports. You're just taking an 800g loan against your final build value. Yea. No idea why they just brute force a ruby crystal into all the different items either. I mean really, couldn't you at least use an Amp Tomb for the AP item?
: ***
> [{quoted}](name=Fluffy Pikachu,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=fqj73jUG,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-01-12T21:06:22.771+0000) > > Supports are rarely full build anyway For an AP enchanter like Soraka or Janna Eye of Oasis 1.9k Ionian Boots 1k Soul Stealer 1.5k (Rack up those assists) Redemption 2.1k Ardent Censer 2.3k Control Ward slot 450 gold (Let's say you buy 6 pinks per match) ------------------------------ About 9.25k for a full build. Not that hard to get if the match goes past 20 min. A tank support would probably be closer to 12k or so, but it's still not really all **that** much.
: ***
> [{quoted}](name=Fluffy Pikachu,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=fqj73jUG,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-01-12T21:06:22.771+0000) > > Supports are rarely full build anyway Even if they're not completely full build a support's inventory fill up very quickly. Especially if they're holding onto pink wards. Supports are the most item slot intensive role in the game.
Skias (NA)
: This is a good suggestion if we have lose the utility from these items. Good idea! These items as they are on the PBE are not worth building. Good idea!
> [{quoted}](name=Skias,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zoQbjrb4,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-01-12T22:19:43.432+0000) > > This is a good suggestion if we have lose the utility from these items. Good idea! These items as they are on the PBE are not worth building. Good idea! Thank youuuu. This would also be a great chance to put +Heal/Shield on the gold coin line, which I've wanted for a long time. This would let it be more than just "the item that gives you gold". Since gold is useless once you fill all six slots.
: What if Towers gained Resists base don how many champions were near/around it?
+20 armor/MR per nearby allied champ would be nice. Stops the enemy team from just smashing the tower down in front of you.
Rioter Comments
: I'm actually terrified of Nunu top if these changes go through
It's not "for free". He has to build AP to get any sort of benefit out of it.
Eedat (NA)
: You said: > Slot Efficiency is the biggest problem with new support items. How is it that in the worst case scenario the item takes up an equal amount of slots the biggest problem?
> [{quoted}](name=Eedat,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=fqj73jUG,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-12T19:47:15.960+0000) > > You said: > > How is it that in the worst case scenario the item takes up an equal amount of slots the biggest problem? Because the item lost power in exchange for becoming cheaper. Now the items are only 1500~1900 gold when fully upgraded. That's about the cost of a BFS for the Gold Coin line. TBH I'll just keep them at T2 and then sell them for a **real** item later on. To put things in perspective. Eye of the Equinox lost Shield Battery in exchange for being 400 gold cheaper. At lv 18, assuming no +shield power, SB was worth 340 HP. That's just a hair under the 380 HP that a Giant's Belt gives you. A **1000** gold item. This is assuming you don't recharge the shield at all. 1000 gold > 400 gold Edit: Hey Skias. You inspired me to go make a threat about this issue. Come check it out! :) https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/zoQbjrb4-a-suggested-change-to-the-upcoming-support-items-change-more-slot-efficiency
Thilmer (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Done25,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=fzx0XV9i,comment-id=00030001,timestamp=2018-01-12T01:12:09.567+0000) > > It's not that Tanks do too much damage. Take any Tank that isn't Rammus and see how long they last against a geared Udyr. > > The Problem is that people build 0 MR and go "Why is this magic damage and burst heavy champion kicking my frail ass so hard?" You know, magic damage is not a real problem since you can basically counter all magic damage with a single MR ítem. Now try to counter AD damage with armour; it does almost nothing.
> [{quoted}](name=Thilmer,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=fzx0XV9i,comment-id=000300010001,timestamp=2018-01-12T14:55:18.656+0000) > > You know, magic damage is not a real problem since you can basically counter all magic damage with a single MR ítem. Now try to counter AD damage with armour; it does almost nothing. How many ADC'S actually build MR though? Especially now that MR blues are gone. The usual path is IE, Boots, Stattik, ER, RFC, LW/GA. And that's 6 items. No room for Maw or Merc Scrim. And building Merc Treads is hard to justify in bottom lane unless they have a lot of magic damage. And armor being paper is really the fault of how grossly overturned Last Whisper is. In addition to ADCs scaling way too hard and far too quickly due to their items getting lowered in cost.
Invidie (NA)
: have you seen full tank ornn? maokai???
> [{quoted}](name=I L0ve Senna,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=fzx0XV9i,comment-id=000300010000,timestamp=2018-01-12T04:17:38.075+0000) > > have you seen full tank ornn? maokai??? Yea. They deal primarily magic damage, 'cept for Orrn Q, and ADCs don't have crap for magic resist outside of Maw or Merc Scrim.
: Who is ready for Azir/Kayle APC bot lane?
You know what will be even worse? Trying to out run a Blood Boiled Annie who has been AFK farming for the first 20 min of the game. Enjoy the incoming QWR incineration. <3
: > [{quoted}](name=Done25,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Awg8XE2W,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-01-12T01:31:24.791+0000) > > Nunu is not a Tank. He is an AP/magic damage Fighter like Mundo. Which is why he has no hard CC. > > I for one am looking forward to there being some kind of buff that is useful to more than just the ADC. Nunu is a Warden. Mundo is a Juggernaut. Nunu performs his support by standing in front of his adc to prevent the enemy assassin/diver from getting in, Mundo chases people down with cleavers while facetanking damage like it's nothing. The two are nothing alike.
> [{quoted}](name=PopcornBunni,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Awg8XE2W,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2018-01-12T02:42:42.123+0000) > > Nunu is a Warden. Mundo is a Juggernaut. Nunu performs his support by standing in front of his adc to prevent the enemy assassin/diver from getting in, Mundo chases people down with cleavers while facetanking damage like it&#x27;s nothing. > > The two are nothing alike. You...are you nuts? Nunu is nothing like a Warden. Riot smokes way too many different drugs when assigning classes. Nunu has zero hard CC or active peel. The best he can do is try and slow someone with E or R while boosting his ally with W. In which case you might as well call Trundle a Warden. Alistar is a Warden. Thresh is a Warden. Taric is a Warden. They can all actively protect and peel for their team. Nunu can't hold a candle to them. Wardens are Tanks. Nunu is not a Tank. He's just really beefy with great sustain and high damage. Aka. A Fighter. Just like Xin, Warwick, Mundo, etc. And Juggernaut Shmuggernaut. Saying something's a Juggernaut is just a fancy way of saying "A Fighter who makes up for having no dashes or blinks with extra durability". And here's a little "test" for you claiming that Nunu is there to stop people from diving his ADC. Jarvin E-Q-Rs in onto your back line. What are you going to do about it? How about Nocturne? Can you pull him off your ADC before they die?
: Nunu giving AP, boards: "riot is opening the meta"
Personally I'm pretty happy how the up to 25% AP on hit ratio on his Q will reward Nunu for having attack speed a bit more. Right now, unless you build a Wit's End, Nunu's auto attacks hit like a wet noodle. Now that AP is more heavily rewarded on him you might see the a Nunu throw some AP into his build. Such as via Runic Echo's or Protobelt.
: Sighstone Removed. Why?
It wasn't too bad for tanks, but being forced to invest in a ruby crystal was painful for AP supports. Tl:Dr - No one wants to have to invest 800~1650 gold just to be allowed to play the game. Usually with the "reward" of them getting to be the ADC's personal ~~slave~~ servant.
Wuq (NA)
: Why is Lane Nunu trash again though?
> [{quoted}](name=Wuq,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=tREWBAEn,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-01-12T01:02:42.778+0000) > > Why is Lane Nunu trash again though? Blood Boil used to give a lot more stats and his Q used to heal for a lot more. So he was quite a bit harder to kick out of top lane.
: If that is true, Nunu needs more damage. More importantly, Mundo doesn't need to build AP to be effective. Nunu can't deal a ton of magic damage without AP, unless his opponents are garbage. If Nunu is supposed to be an AP fighter, he needs to rely less on Absolute Zero. I suppose these changes help that somewhat, but they encourage Nunu to build AP, which makes him squishier and results in him dying more frequently...and he's still not a particularly sticky champion.
> [{quoted}](name=The Yetii Rider,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Awg8XE2W,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-01-12T02:10:39.845+0000) > > If that is true, Nunu needs more damage. > > More importantly, Mundo doesn&#x27;t need to build AP to be effective. Nunu can&#x27;t deal a ton of magic damage without AP, unless his opponents are garbage. If Nunu is supposed to be an AP fighter, he needs to rely less on Absolute Zero. > > I suppose these changes help that somewhat, but they encourage Nunu to build AP, which makes him squishier and results in him dying more frequently...and he&#x27;s still not a particularly sticky champion. "not a particularly sticky champion" +Long duration self speed boost +Long duration targeted slow He has trouble getting to people yes, but once he's there he sticks like glue. (Assuming you get 40% cdr) And tbh Mundo is an **old** champ back from when the game was very different. As seen by the fact that Riot keeps trying to tweak him. Used to be that AP fighter champs like Nunu, Mundo, and WW would get items like Abyssal Scepter and/or Wit's End to boost their magic damage by shredding the enemy's MR. Now Scepter has Mana, which is a bit of a waste on Mundo, and Wit's End is a frail ghost of its former self. Also, it's not like Mundo doesn't have spots where they could stick AP ratios. Q and R specifically. Something like (+10% max HP per 100 AP) for his R would be great.
A Nunu (NA)
: Nunu is going to be a playable champion now.. Oh god.. They're going to ban/pick him from me. {{sticker:zombie-nunu-tears}}
> [{quoted}](name=A Nunu,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MHTnxG8z,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-01-12T01:44:03.325+0000) > > Nunu is going to be a playable champion now.. > Oh god.. They&#x27;re going to ban/pick him from me. > {{sticker:zombie-nunu-tears}} Yea. Shouldn't be too hard to dip in around 300 AP to get the full AP bonus by late game. He'll actually be a real damage threat instead of just a slow bot.
: The Nunu Changes
Nunu is not a Tank. He is an AP/magic damage Fighter like Mundo. Which is why he has no hard CC. I for one am looking forward to there being some kind of buff that is useful to more than just the ADC.
Eedat (NA)
: >*Blood Boil (W) [New Effect] Now additionally increases AP by 40% for both targets Max: 40/60/80/100/120 AP {{champion:268}} EHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEEHEHH
> [{quoted}](name=Eedat,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MHTnxG8z,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-01-12T01:09:56.402+0000) > > [New Effect] Now additionally increases AP by 40% for both targets > Max: 40/60/80/100/120 AP > > {{champion:268}} EHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEEHEHH Oh ye gods. I didn't even think about that. How horrifying. Would go well with a Jax who splashes some AP in too.
Invidie (NA)
: great post, but dont think Riot's balancing team is intelligent enough to realize that tanks does too much damage, crit items are too dam cheap
> [{quoted}](name=I L0ve Senna,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=fzx0XV9i,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-01-11T21:20:48.696+0000) > > great post, but dont think Riot&#x27;s balancing team is intelligent enough to realize that tanks does too much damage, crit items are too dam cheap It's not that Tanks do too much damage. Take any Tank that isn't Rammus and see how long they last against a geared Udyr. The Problem is that people build 0 MR and go "Why is this magic damage and burst heavy champion kicking my frail ass so hard?"
Rioter Comments
CoffeeMug (EUNE)
: I can see why Taric would cone to mind ( heal and shield) ,but way Naut and WW?
> [{quoted}](name=CoffeeMug,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qB6miQlb,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-17T20:16:44.174+0000) > > I can see why Taric would cone to mind ( heal and shield) ,but way Naut and WW? It affects self-targeted healing/shielding as well.
CoffeeMug (EUNE)
: MB. Was in a hurry and left out the part where Soraka's highest winrate comes with maxing Q(building RoA) ,while Janna's is with her W(going Rabadons,Void,Liadras ,lich bane and sorcery shoes). Like people on the boards agree that damage is too high,yet suddenly everyone is better of building damage XD Revitalize seems like it should be something you want to take on a support that has 2 healing and/or shielding abilities.
> [{quoted}](name=CoffeeMug,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qB6miQlb,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2017-11-17T14:05:14.018+0000) > > MB. Was in a hurry and left out the part where Soraka&#x27;s highest winrate comes with maxing Q(building RoA) ,while Janna&#x27;s is with her W(going Rabadons,Void,Liadras ,lich bane and sorcery shoes). Like people on the boards agree that damage is too high,yet suddenly everyone is better of building damage XD > Revitalize seems like it should be something you want to take on a support that has 2 healing and/or shielding abilities. Actually, I'd argue that revitalize is for tanky sustain champs. Such as Warwick, Nautilus, or Taric to name a few.
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Done25

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