: > [{quoted}](name=FlameHalbrdOkido,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=x419E12T,comment-id=000400000001000000010001,timestamp=2019-06-10T00:03:40.301+0000) > > The issue is the FOCUS of the design. I think alot of people who bring up Kass and Malz (who by the way are super old and don't stand up to leagues current design standards) as counter arguments are missing the point. In either case is the focus of the design in how good they look or how unaffected they are by the void? No, in Malz case the focus is on his use of the Void energy, in Kass case it's his suit. No one cares about how good they look, or thier muscles or skin cause that's not the focus. In Kai'sas case it's very clear that how hot she looked was the focus rather than showing that she fights almost every moment for her life or for food for the past 10 years in alien infested tunnles, tunnels, somehow due to her strengths and mastery of a void suit is still alive. if them looking good didn't matter why did the artists take their time to draw abs? just give em a flat tummy then. But they did, because why not. Idk why that's allowed on males but not females. Based on what is kai'sa being good looking the goal? in that case plenty characters are focused on looking good. Idk why malz and kass get a pass with such things but not kai'sa, maybe you missed the bigass missile launching void things on her shoulders? or the void skin opening? or ya kno her void guns? Not to mention she's the only champ where you can cover up the cleavage if you so wish.
The point I make about kass, malz being old crusty designs still stands in this case. But just for the sake of it, its bc abs signals strength primarily. Sure u could say people will find that hot, but that claim doesn't allign with any other aspect of the design. And again its not the focus, its not the main thing being put on display, in both cases the focus is on thier hands, face (void corruption vs cool helmet) and use of void energy. The use of design to communicate attractiveness relies primarily on a attractive face and secondarily on muscle at least for men. If u want to talk use of Abs to communicate attractiveness look no further than 5th Age Armor taric where the focus is clearly on the face and revealed chest area...I don't think its a coincidence that Kai'sa is almost the same. The difference is that there's focus on her right hand gun, but due to the brightness of her skin compared to the rest of the image, her face and chest pop out much more than normal, not to mention she also has a deep v-line, a feature used in dresses when some people want to show off thier attractiveness. Nothing wrong with that but the focus is in the wrong place when it should be more like Kass and Malz's set up: hands, face, use of Void energy. She's not here to be hot, she's here to bust Void butt. She uses energy guns to do that which should be the main focus instead. U can put on the helmet and cover everything up, but that should be the base, not the alt. Those cannons are also not in focus for how important they are. One is half way out of the shot, and the other is partially covered by her hair when they should be front and center. In both Malz and Kass cases thier weapons are front and center, clearly and fully in focus. Nothing is covering them up, they are the brightest things on the screen, drawing ur attention to them 1st and everything else 2nd. U see the point I'm trying to make when that's not the case for Kai? One of her guns isnt even firing and the other is muted in the background, why? Bc it would detract from her face/skin being the one of the brighter things on screen and thus the focus, not even mentioning the fact that her face/chest is much closer to the center line of the screen, another signifier of where they want the focus to be as opposed to Kass. The void skin opening serves the same spot as kass abs, background, not the focus.
: Looking at the current kit, there are a couple basic combos I can see. - Spore Pod inter Cord to fling a bunch of exploding nodes over the heads of the enemies. This is quick poke damage that can also set up to roll out into the enemies, and attempt to detonate the spore pod, if you feel like engaging after the poke. - Set up your spore pod, wait for the enemy to try and clear it, then W your ally and Q right into them, while attempting to detonate your spore pod. This is probably the more intended version of the engage, and the spore pods look like they can be used like pseudo-wards. Also looks to me like her passive more or less pulls them "behind" her, in the same way at Kat or Yi jumps "behind" their target - basically on top of her, but just behind her model from a hitbox aspect. Meaning her passive can still pull allies slightly too far behind her with her as well. Seems decent from the view of a melee support. Her E in particular seems a bit clunky, and more or less completely takes focus off of the enemy in favor of trying to blow up the pod. I think it's going to be really difficult to use it in its current state. I think it'd be best to give it some other requisite of exploding - something like "Q will detonate this instantly" or "W will make this explode after a delay" so that you can continue to focus on your target instead of trying to make that mechanic work. I still think that mechanic should exist, but I don't think it should be the only thing you have to proc the pod with.
Great insights here. Maybe for the E allied AA mark them causing E to explode towards them after a short delay like Illaois W
: And this is why I kept it around her physique. But it’s like trying to reason with a crowd with pitchforks and torches.
And now I'm getting downvoted for some reason? I think the issue is ur 1st post which starts out really negatively and is practically begging for downvotes, I'd also argue that its flawed in terms of ur personality analysis. Kai'sa is only more likable to you bc she's meant to play the hero and not the villain, additional there's not much to hate when there isn't a whole lot of personality to begin with, she's very muted. Qiyana's personality actually has more intesive depth and shows room for growth, whereas Kai is a bit of a Mary sue. It doesn't surprise me now that they downvoted all ur posts even if one makes sense, (no a Voidling isn't wasting precious energy on making "D.Va cosplay make up") I'm as dissatisfied with Kai'Sas design as the next person who understands wat gud design is. Come on people let's get reasonable. Riot WILL make attractive champions unless its the MAIN goal to make them unattractive. We can have strong designs that are attractive, and bc Kai'sas design is supposed to be void SUIT champion making her look over-corrupted or taken over by the suit is a disservice to the CORE theme of the design and blurs the lines, makes it less clear, it's practically the same thing as making her hot for no reason; it's not the FOCUS. Would I mind it if they made her theme void corrupted human? No I wouldn't. Would I mind it if they made her corrupted but still void suit themed? No, it works with the overall void theme, but then blurs the line btwn suit and human 2 much. Her personality is another discussion, but her face they definitely got wrong.
: Fair point, but why does it always have to be a dash? Just feels lazy.
Cause she's an assassin, mobility is kinda their thing right? Also she gets bonuses from being near the target elements so getting a boost to get closer to it faster is helpful. Would u rather it just be a point and click? Again u kinda need a "lazy" ability on a kit like this when there's so much to memorize. There's something called burden of knowledge: the more stuff there is to remember for the player AND opponents the more detrimental it can become to design and gameplay
: Pls give her passive a small channel that Grants the target ally a 200 unit dash towards her if thier next Move command is towards her. This would stop trolls
I also like that she's designed to help out Melee carries that's cool. What's her intended combo or game play loop?
J Eevo (EUNE)
: Champion Concept: Ma'Jah, Mother of many (unconventional Icathian support)
Pls give her passive a small channel that Grants the target ally a 200 unit dash towards her if thier next Move command is towards her. This would stop trolls
: > [{quoted}](name=FlameHalbrdOkido,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=GzJwvnWE,comment-id=000800010000000000000001,timestamp=2019-06-08T08:14:09.767+0000) > > its less about people wanting her to be scarred/disfigured and more of them having a problem with unaffected, she looks after surviving, and fighting in voidborn infested caves for 1o years. Why does she look ready for a photo shoot with perfect skin (not a SPEC of dirt on her), lip gloss, and lil purple marks on her face that make a nice orderly pattern like they were painted on. Her visuals aren't selling her story. Because she's wearing a suit that covers her whole body. The marks on her face are void corruption, and she's got a case of man face, not to mention mentally she's pretty messed up. It's supposed to be a new take on what "damaged by the void" means. > Even tho both Malz and Kass are old - At least Malz has glowing eyes, and an actual third eye, Kassadin has blue skin: in both cases they show with at LEAST ONE detail that theres some corruption going on. This is Void we are talking about, when u bring it up Corruption is the 1st thing people think about, whether u have a suit to protect you or not, something gets in, because the Void is connected to corruption. And she is corrupted, like the marks you mentioned.
The suit covers her whole body...except her cleavage and face, two areas that would be exposed for a model photoshoot, but probably shouldn't be exposed on someone who fights monsters all day. The mark's on her face don't read as corruption, they read like make up like D.Va, because they are too clean uniform and symmetrical. They are a weal attempt at corruption bc it is very clear they wanted her face to be seen as beautiful. If they actually wanted those marks to read as corruption they would glow, have ragged edges, strains/veins, and probably be have popping veins. Or they coulda been mini Vel'koz rifts that reveal leaking void energy underneath. Its not even the lack of corruption I'm worried about, its about the designs focus being on the wrong thing.
Mogarl (NA)
: Yeah the makeup thing is a bit of a stretch, and definitely just there to sell the champion to people who don't care about the lore. I myself think they could have designed Kai'sa better, although not because she isn't scarred and dirty. I think the lack of dirt and scars moreso goes to show that she's doing well. Any scars she's gotten have disappeared or are covered by the suit, and she doesn't look malnourished because she isn't malnourished. I just think we should have gotten more power armor Samus and less Zero suit Samus. Though I'm sure they we're also concerned with keeping her silhouette indicative of a squishy agile marksman. (even if it also allowed them to sell her as a sexy athletic female.) I like the idea of the void growth as she empowers her abilities though. Although I don't know if the implication of her slowly losing herself to the voidborn is what Riot wants. I had never read about the symbolism of her v-neck though so that's good to know. (also kind of funny to say)
I can see ur points, they all make sense. Galaxy Slayer Zed recolored would read as a void symbiot suit while still maintaining a non tanky look, a design like that skin would be perfect
: Ixtal's cultural connections already teased by Ezreal
: > [{quoted}](name=YaraUwU,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=x419E12T,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-06-08T17:18:41.214+0000) > > Riot managed to turn a character that goes to the void and comes back basically unscathed and is kassadins daughter dull. Idk how they did it but they did. > > Its a human and a void creature mixed together and they made that boring. HOW THE FUCK DO YOU DO THAT. Like her ult could have been the void creature talking over and her going berserk. If she had to be sexy then dont give her the body suit just leave her naked make her skin look like its been molded with a void creature and have carapace (the bone looking stuff on Velkoz) cover the "important" bits. Hell give the fucking void monster a voice in your head. There was no reason for this champion to be this dull. > > But instead we got a fucking counting simulator in a budget samus aran zero suit with a personality the depth of a puddle and a kit so massively thematicly uninspired it looks like an old concept they pulled out of recycle bin from 6 years ago and were told "make it purple" > > Shes the biggest missed opportunity to date and riots gonna have to try really hard to fucking beat the disappointment she is. I'm so sick of the "went to the void and came back unscathed" argument. Kai'sa is top tier. Her mind is strong. Maybe YOUR mind might get crushed by the void, but she is a LEGEND. The game is called League of LEGENDS. There has to be one (or more) characters that can handle the void. Traumatic events and terrible things do happen. There are those who crumple like paper, and there are those who are tempered by adversity. :P Just because you think (and are wrong) that everyone should be broken beyond repair doesn't mean your opinion is worth anything. My guess is you have a major turn on for the void and are angry that it didn't swallow and spit her up. Or maybe you don't look further into characters or their nuances. Either way your opinion is a dime a dozen, and I feel quite incorrect. Haven't looked at the new champion yet, but by your gross miss representation of Kai'sa I'd have to assume she's amazing since you seem to be the most kind of wrong. But hey, let's not get hurt feelings over anything. This is just a video game after all, just stating my opinion here too. (though I am right)
You kno what's funny? Kai didn't go to the Void, she lived in Void infested caves, which means it's highly likely that her mind would have been razed away if she did just like, Malz, Kass, the Ascended who fought at the edge of Void rifts, Iceborn who simply look upon creatures from the Void trapped in Ice at the bottom of the howling abyss and basically everyone else who gets involved with the Void. This is why people get mad about Kai'sa bc its almost an unwritten rule they anyone involved with the Void gets messed up somehow, but she's somehow the exception and they don't even explicitly explain it, and they don't even try to make that a focus of her lore, vo, or her design. People get mad about Kai'sa because they actually really dont focus on her adversaries and how she overcame them and was molded by them. She's completely unaffected. And for some reason they decided to focus on how attractive she looks. They dont focus at all on her power fantasy or how awesome she's supposed to be, she literally blows up Voidlings with massive firepower for breakfast with a Voidling suit that she's mastered and adapted to after 10 years of living and fighting in Void infested caves. This is super cool, but they don't focus on that, and they don't focus on her struggles of growing up isolated in a hostile environment. There's no point in rooting for someone who supposedly struggled and overcame when they don't show it, when they make it seem like they breezed through it. But wat might be worse is in fact she wasn't in the Void. I agree with most of ur points, but they are hurt both by the fact that she was only in caves and that her design isnt focused on the things u point out.
Aimléss (NA)
: I think they're both great designs and I love them both. You're not gonna like every champion but some people will. Stop forcing your opinions on everyone.
Qiyana's design is fine, the OP is simply saying that her design while not very interesting is much better than Kai'Sas. Bc Kai'sas design ISNT gud; it's at odds with her lore, and the design focus on the wrong thing: how gud she looks rather than the fact that she blows Voidlings up with massive firepower of a void suit and eats them for breakfast after surviving void caves for 10 years. She is literally beating mofos with another mofo, but they'd rather sell how hot she is instead. This is disappointing and a BAD design decision. I'm not saying we can't have an attractive Laura Croft type design, but that's not what we have, she doesn't have a spec of dirt on her perfect skin. We got some cosplayer farming for likes on Instagram, not someone who survived the Void caves.
Leetri (EUW)
: Because they've painted up this impossible view of the Void that Riot never intended and they're butthurt reality doesn't fit it. Also a ton of misconceptions and people who don't even bother reading up on her. Like people still believe she fell into the actual Void, when she's just in a cave infested by void creatures.
No its bc Riot has nvr clarified what the void is and how it works. But that's part of the point the Void is unknowable. However we do kno that who ever gets involved with the void gets messed up in some way. The fact that Kai'sa is the exception doesn't make sense. The reason people still believe she fell into the Void was because Riot initially sold her as "the girl who came back" from the void, they sold her fantasy as the girl who survived the Void. Then in her Bio they explained the real situation, that she was only in caves. But many don't read the lore. So they still believed the fake fantasy Riot accidentally initiated. But here's the thing, its her fans and people who do kno her real story that should be upset. She's was just in voidling caves since she was a child right? Why then does she act and speak almost like a normal person, completely unfazed by her past without an ounce of PTSD or anything? Why is there a focus on her design on how good she looks rather than how mentally and physically strong she is to spend near every moment fighting to survive and eat, blasting Voidlings to death for breakfast with massive fire power and adaptive fighting skills? The fact that she was "just void infested caves" shouldn't be ur explanation for why she is the way she is. It should be ur incredulous war cry. Why? Bc it is a thematic and power lv NERF. It shouldn't be the answer u give to the people u see don't like her design and leave it at that, it's a weak answer that only serves as an excuse for a weak design and worse it makes HER weak - weaker than they actually tried sell her to be. It means she's not going to be an actual void hunter bc she doesn't have the mental fortitude to fight the REAL void monstrosities that drove the Ascended crazy when they fought a void rift. This means the monsters she's fought in the cave aren't big threats to the world she only fought the Void equivalent of bears and weaker. She's not a void survivor, and now she's not even a void hunter. She's basically the equivalent of a house cat that keeps the rats out of the basement. Yea she was only in caves infested by Void creatures and that should make u very sad.
Naramiel (NA)
: Don't forget they also gave Kai'Sa a super-boring voice. It's like they told the actress 'try it again, but remove any hint that you care.'
Would have been cool if that was an effect of PTSD...if they were trying to sell that angle at all and not make her a Mary sue
: She didn't go into the void though. She's in the Void Caverns that exist under Shurima.
People bring this up often. On one hand its gud so that people can understand her better and be less mad since they kno she wasnt in the void and thus is still at least sane. On the other hand this fact should piss everyone off bc it also nerfs her. They are saying she's not mentally strong enough to hold on to at least a shred of her humanity which also means she would be worthless against the REAL void monstrosities that the Ascended fought. This is massively dropping her power lv against the void which is supposed to be her main selling point as a void hunter. Speaking about selling points they actually said she survived the void when teasing her... and then went back on it when her bio came out. They SOLD her fantasy as a void survivor, then put her in the Void toddler room. This is a nerf to her power fantasy. So it's a counter argument, but a weak one that weakens her, bc they either DIDNT want to mar how hot she is, physically or mentally, or they couldn't find a gud solution to how she could actually survive the real void completely unscathed...and that is a shame bc any human related to the Void in some way comes out scathed, trying to make her the exception makes her flat and simultaneously weakens the Void...but then again it weakens her the most bc she's basically a house cat that keeps the rats out, not a very exciting fantasy when it stops there.
: Agreed kaisa could've been such a good champ but they just had to make her personality and design go directly against her lore, and her lore is also bad. Kaisa is just straight up an idiot who doesn't realize that she could have some impact against the void by warning people. Instead she stays there and tries to kill the void creatures that likely reproduce way faster than she kills them
And let's not forget that the writers were probably told NOT to have her go in the Void bc it would probably drive her crazy. In doing so they nerfed her and her legend. She doesn't have any of the strengths the Ascendeds did when they fought the Void monstrosities that drove them insane. And that means that all the Voidling she's fought are the equivalent of bears or weaker, which means she herself isn't that strong against the Void, and that means she can't really be Runeterras solution to the Void if she isn't mentally of physically prepared the way she should be. She's the equivalent of 10 shuriman soldiers, power wise she's nothing and that means she can't do her supposed job, what's the point of being a Void hunter if ur nothing better than a house cat who keeps the rats out?
: > [{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=x419E12T,comment-id=0004000000010000000300000000,timestamp=2019-06-09T11:53:28.152+0000) > > Except it doesn't do that when fighting voidlings. Check the comic. > > And she probably doesn't need the helmet up on Summoner's Rift. > > Yeah, you could argue it's stupid we even have the option to take it off. And I certainly think it should be ON by default, not off, but you're just arguing she shouldn't be attractive. I wanted 1 of the things for kai`sa ingame either 1. make her have scars or not just pirstine looking or 2. make the symbiote void suit actually look intimidating in some way, as it stands if you don't read the lore and you see her ingame it just looks like she's wearing a spandex suit, honestly the suit is my biggest disappointment, it just looks boring
A female Galaxy Slayer Zed skin is what we should have got, he accomplishes what Kai'sas supposed to be better in every way.
: Except it doesn't do that when fighting voidlings. Check the comic. And she probably doesn't need the helmet up on Summoner's Rift. Yeah, you could argue it's stupid we even have the option to take it off. And I certainly think it should be ON by default, not off, but you're just arguing she shouldn't be attractive.
There's nothing wrong with her being attractive, but there was a clear effort in her design that focus on how hot she looks, they drew attention specifically to that. But in doing so they missed the point of her power fantasy with her design, this is what people are upset about. We don't care that she's attractive we care that the focus on how gud she looks detracts from where the focus should be: the fact that survives in a hellscape of void infested tunnels and literally eats Voidlings for breakfast after pummeling them with massive firepower. I dont care that she's hot, and I don't like that for some reason the designers thought for some reason that her looks should be the focus instead, we CAN have a Laura Croft character, she can be strong and attractive, but that's not wat we got: we got a model in cosplay who is HOT 1st and foremost and tough 2nd, she doesn't have a spec of dirt on her.
Mogarl (NA)
: Perhaps it went off of a subconcious image Kai'Sa herself had, or has just taken care to make sure she matures properly? The voidsuit was just kind of like "So what does one of the human things look like in prime condition? The body is trying to grow these chest lump,s what are they for... Yeah these things are useful to store excess energy in." She has makeup because one day the voidsuit decided she should. "The host keeps trying to interact with others of her kind. Unknown for what purpose, but other humans frequently run away or attack. Host believes looking _friendlier_ would help" All the skin showing is actually the easiest to defend though. Void creatures frequently use some kind of energy based weapons. To defend against them the suit would need to be a pretty good insulator, however that could also cook the host without proper ventilation. So when not in combat mode the suit leaves her chest and head open so Kai'sa doesn't cook.
Expending limited resources on things that don't increase survival chances like beauty or make isn't something that makes sense for the Voidling. Riot themselves explained the deep v-neck: it's to show there's a clear separation between her and the suit, to clearly show where the suit stops and she begins, to clearly show she wears the suit and not that suit is her actual skin. To which I would say is a mistake as it reads MORE like the void if they ARE becoming one. And additionally reads like like Kayn (who's theme they were trying to avoid) if they work together. If u WANT 2 sell the fact that she wears a void skin and has normal human skin, then have her show more human skin all around, mostly at her extremities, such as her forearms and lower legs/feet, bc those can be replaced by Void growth, as the game progresses have the suit cover more of her up like and shift as needed for abilities like Galaxy Slayer Zed. Look i commend u for your valiant effort to validate Kai'sas poor design, but, its doesn't hold up. I will say how ever that ur point for the "chest lumps" (lol) does make sense to a certain degree. However u fail to consider the fact that the Voidling would have no idea what a prime human looks like...sure u COULD argue that it was in her head, but then why does her design sell how Hot she is rather than how Athletic she is? She wasn't designed to be friendly either, they designed her to look very attractive.
: > [{quoted}](name=hhaavviikk,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=x419E12T,comment-id=0004000000010000,timestamp=2019-06-08T21:26:02.595+0000) > > guess the void symbiote decided she needed cleavage and make-up to be in tiptop condition to hunt i mean kassadin got all that crazy equipment but still decided to jump into the void shirtless. Guess it runs in the family.
The issue is the FOCUS of the design. I think alot of people who bring up Kass and Malz (who by the way are super old and don't stand up to leagues current design standards) as counter arguments are missing the point. In either case is the focus of the design in how good they look or how unaffected they are by the void? No, in Malz case the focus is on his use of the Void energy, in Kass case it's his suit. No one cares about how good they look, or thier muscles or skin cause that's not the focus. In Kai'sas case it's very clear that how hot she looked was the focus rather than showing that she fights almost every moment for her life or for food for the past 10 years in alien infested tunnles, tunnels, somehow due to her strengths and mastery of a void suit is still alive.
: Which part of: _"The Void symbiont makes her healthy and in shape because it needs her to hunt down stuff at tip top conditions"_ did you miss? Nor Mal nor Kassadin have a void-pal to keep them fit, one is just corrupted by the overflowing Void energies while the other turned himself into Darth Vader in order to survive his Riftwalks.
Look this guy isn't wrong guys. Its just that she shouldn't be looking like model. She can be attractive, but what's wrong is that they CLEARLY focused on making her look hot, and in doing so missed the ENTIRE point of her character, she should look strong and confident, like she just woke up, battled a void creature with massive firepower and consumed its essence for breakfast. She shouldn't look like she's her for her photo shoot cosplaying female Cho-gath for Twitter upvotes and likes
YaraUwU (NA)
: Just a quick thought for anyone that thinks Qiyana is the dullest champion to date. Kai'sa exists.
I'd agree with most of ur points but let's try to be as civil as possible ok? I'm annoyed as the next person with how Kai'sa turned out, and I know for a fact that eventually they will have to rework her. She's in the same spot as old Irelia and Kindred in that they miss the mark. There's a few things to point out and explain with how and why she turned out as she did. 1.) They aren't going to give the Voidling suit a voice. She came out right around the time Kayn did, they didn't want her stepping in his design space. They also weren't trying to make a Venom copy. They make riffs on established tropes not straight up copies 2.) Ur kinda right about the "thematicly uninspired kit from an old recycled concept" Kai'sa and Camille were created from a cancelled concept called H.I.V.E who was a Zaunite secret agent with a mech suit...so it makes a lot of sense doesn't it that her kit reads more like a mech suit than a Void symbiot? 3.) Her theme and personality dont accomplish much bc it seems her designers were split on her key reference inspiration: Kerrigan, Laura Croft, and Samsus. Again we have ANOTHER mech suit as source material. But it seems they got stuck between the different directions and couldn't get anywhere interesting. 4.) She was never in the Void. They made the big mistake of accidentally selling her as someone who lived in the Void. For people who don't read the lore they don't kno that they fixed that: she only lived in Void infested caverns. But the fact still remains that Void related things are connected to corruption, not beauty. 5.) If they wanted to do beautiful, then they needed to play up the Void aspect in equal, make it so we can barely tell the difference between where she stops and the void begins. Again Riot decided that they DIDN'T want to do that they wanted to make it CLEAR she was wearing a suit hence the v-neck. They coulda made the suit ACT like a biological weapon and have it grow over her over the course of the game, like Galaxy Slayer Zed who actually accomplished her theme better than her in EVERY WAY. Dude starts out topples (hot if u like that) and becomes a monster. They coulda made her crazy, or made her a monster underneath her skin and have it show cracks, but no... 6.) The biggest issue is her lore and design disconnect. Her design is selling her beauty/hotness instead of her physical strength/willpower/ firepower/adaptability. Basically the focus her design isnt on what her whole power fantasy is supposed to be: what drove her to survive. But what's worse is her Lore itself. She's supposed to be this Void hunter, but she can't take out Void creatures that threaten humanity bc that would put her on the lv of Ascended. And we kno she's not that strong. She can only take out the Void equivalent of Bears, and a group of 10 highly skilled shurimans can handle that. Her main claim to fame is surviving the Void toddler room for 10 years and adapting to using a Void skin. Look that is an AMAZING feat, and she could probably exist in the actual Void now with the suit. But when everything else about her has been either a lie or blown out of proportion she becomes a massive disappointment. Imma stop here I could vent all day, they took the wrong path with Kai in pretty much every way.
: God her E looks so uninspired, but the rest of her kit looks really interesting. Also, what's with the weird quality control of champion reveals? https://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/featured/champion-reveal-neeko Look at Neeko's, then look at Qiyana's. It's not even called the same thing, Reveal vs Rundown. Let's try and keep it consistent guys
E is simple bc theres so much more to keep track of with the rest of the kit, not every ability has to be 10/10
: > [{quoted}](name=Leetri,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=GzJwvnWE,comment-id=0008000100000000,timestamp=2019-06-07T12:56:38.210+0000) > > Even now, Malzahar only has glowing eyes and Kassadin is just blue with rippling hot abs. Why aren't people complaining that Kassadin isn't scarred and horribly disfigured? He's been down there too, and he didn't have the benefit of an exosuit impervious to the Void's influence. I said pre-rework. New Malz is, iirc, supposed to just be someone who heard the void and gave in to it. Old Malz seemed to walk in and out of the void town of Icathia, and was filled with void essence. Kassadin has gear that delays him from being corrupted, it's slowing the process but not preventing it. People seem to accept these just fine but don't seem to accept that Kai'Sa has a full suit to stop the void from corrupting her and saving her from being horribly scarred/disfigured.
its less about people wanting her to be scarred/disfigured and more of them having a problem with unaffected, she looks after surviving, and fighting in voidborn infested caves for 1o years. Why does she look ready for a photo shoot with perfect skin (not a SPEC of dirt on her), lip gloss, and lil purple marks on her face that make a nice orderly pattern like they were painted on. Her visuals aren't selling her story. Even tho both Malz and Kass are old - At least Malz has glowing eyes, and an actual third eye, Kassadin has blue skin: in both cases they show with at LEAST ONE detail that theres some corruption going on. This is Void we are talking about, when u bring it up Corruption is the 1st thing people think about, whether u have a suit to protect you or not, something gets in, because the Void is connected to corruption.
: > [{quoted}](name=Jhins Girlfriend,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=GzJwvnWE,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2019-06-07T02:16:44.514+0000) > > That doesn't explain where she learned to do a perfect face of makeup while in the void, lol That's not make up on her face those purple marks are void corruption She's got a man face
even that "male version" of kai'sa makes more sense and looks better, also she has lip gloss on and her face is perfect, there's not a bit of dirt, nor scrape on it, she doesn't even have glowing eyes, if they actually wanted to make the purple marks look like void corruption and not some D.va make-up copy they would give them some asymmetry, make them look more like scars and possibly add some popping veins to them, they don't look like void corruption they look like stylized makeup applied to her perfectly immaculate skin
Kelg (NA)
: I like how my brother described Sylas: "Dude in jeans" And yeah Kayle's redesign is tragic, old one was much better.
lets keep in mind they needed to slim Kayle down to match her gameplay, old Kayle looks like a tank, but the new Kayle just went TOO far in reducing the armor, they just needed to make the armor look more sleek,
Naalith (NA)
: I expect the boards will be filled with large amounts of civil Qiyana discussion.
People don't like the splash bc they dont understand it. Riot gave her the title: Empress and people had assumptions based of that. But empress is a title she gave herself, because she's audacious and THINKS she should rule the jungle. But she actually doesn't and that explains the generic dress/jewelry/crown, shes just a normal jungle resident who has a cool weapon. How ever i am VERY wary of the amount of CC they gave this assassin which is a class that CC is supposed to hard to come-by. But upon closer inspection her CC is highly situational. The AoE knockback is on the ult, and it serves to help set up the stun sure its a double whammy but its gated by the Ult's CD. it is FURTHER gated by the area its used. If ur not in an area where the knockback puts u near a wall/brush/river then u won't get stunned and the River and Wall stuns have to travel AFTER the initial shock wave so they can still be avoided (unless u get knock back INTO a wall). I think the bush stun might be instant tho. The root is probably the one i like the least, i think it should be a slow, BUT she still has to have Water stored up from using W, (meaning she would either have to be in the river or not have used Q any time b4) and Q is also a skill shot. Keep in mind if she goes for the CC with Q she's giving up stealth or execute dmg. Basically if u fight her in wide open areas like lanes/bases she isn't that strong, and if u bait her Q and she misses it she just lost a big part of her kit and her options will be limited.
Falrein (EUW)
: Forget that Empress, there can only be one true Sovereign
Ur accessment is correct, its been confirmed by Rioters she isn't royalty at all. She doesn't look like an empress bc she only calls herself that. Her crown is a fraud as well because she only THINKS she's worthy of a real crown
: This is a call to practice your own Taric play. He *can* be in every match of League of Legends, if you *want* him to be. It's not as though you're gonna have trouble queueing for support.
Jungle Taric is also viable as well, u can support carry a team if u work together
: The only part that I find disappointing about Kai'Sa is her VO. Her visuals are fine, and her story is fine (seriously, she did *not* survive in the Void itself. Not sure why people keep getting angry that she survived in the void when she never even entered the void). Her voice over is boring, but overall she is a fine champion though
the issue was that Riot made the mistake of initially SELLING that exact point: that She survived void and came back. Then her lore came out and they went back on that...probably because they realized that its almost impossible for a young human (girl or boy) to survive the actual void. But lots of people don't read the lore so they still thought that she survived the Void
: Me whenever people talk about Kai’Sa’s visuals. Although usually with much more annoyance.
its less about the design alone and more along the lines of: the lore and theme of void are at almost at total odds with the visual design. Nothing wrong with how she looks if we ignore how the void is supposed to work and her story. The root of the problem is honestly that they cannibalized an old concept and split it into Camille and Kai'sa only they didn't seem to fully escape the old design, thus she ends up looking/acting more like a mech suit champion than a void symbiote champion. I understand both sides of the argument. Add to that the desire of the designers to follow too many different routes of inspiration: Kerrigan, Tomb Raider, Samsus ect which ended up leading more nowhere than anywhere. There are people who just like how she looks, and there are people who like that she looks attractive. Theres nothing wrong with that, we can have attractive, cute, and sexualized champions. The issue arises then the design is no longer matching the intended theme, then u end up getting something like the Old Irelia design. Its nice sure, but it ends up missing the mark and not reaching its full potential, it doesn't fulfill the theme. Kai'sa's design space CAN walk the tight rope, but with the current result it has slipped off a bit too far to the wrong side. Kai'sa kinda leaves a mar on Riots history bc of that and thus people are gonna tend to get more mad than they should for future releases. For example Neeko tho, her design is fine, and now Qiyanna, who's design i'd also say is fine sure it may not be the most exciting/unique, but it WORKS it fits her lore, it makes sense. Do i wish they had given her more interesting hair/dress/jewelry? Yes I do, but at the end of the day it still works/and fits her lore, the design is solid and reaches a nice middle ground in terms of potential.
: [Champion Concept] Vionan, the Storm Smith
When u gave the champion the title storm smith, i was expecting them to either craft storms, or craft weapons/armor with storm related effects, or have some weapon/armor related stuff in the kit, but this is basically a lightning elemental like Xerath/Kennen so the title is kinda miss leading and the kit theme itself kinda one dimensional and flat. The mechanics themselves are kinda interesting and work well together, but theres been many lightning themed concepts that tack on the storm title, something more unique would be nice.
: Ugh, these are some of my favorite weapons! Does that say something about me? {{sticker:sg-shisa}}
yes u are a wrathful being LOL JK, ur fine these are just weapons thats people have done research on and thought to be best fitting, they dont REALLY mean anything, but the research does explain why they are fitting. Has nothing to do with personal preference.
Parznip (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=FlameHalbrdOkido,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=T2AKc2cI,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-06-02T18:24:05.234+0000) > > However they do it ik they will find a way to make Fiddle unqiue from Shaco and Noct, so im kinda wary of having him take a certain joy out scaring people since thats kinda close to Shaco laughing at killing people? IDK what do u think they can do to make Fiddle unique from Noct and Shaco? I think Shaco's enjoys the kill, and finds sick humor in what he does. Fiddlesticks, on the other hand, I think prefers the chase. He relishes his victims' fear. Nocturne, unfortunately, finds himself in a really similar trope. He and Fiddle compete for the same space I think. They both occupy the role of a terrorizing entity that enjoys inflicting fear. Nocturne is a demonic being that feeds on it, whereas Fiddle is likely just some sort of malicious poltergeist who finds it fun. I think it's almost unavoidable to have some overlap, but they could just be done as different ways of approaching the trope. Nocturne, for instance, could be calculating and terrifyingly derranged in his intelligence. He could plan and play with his victims, crafting nightmares to strike them in the heart. His version of terrifying could be subtle, sinister, and devious. Fiddle on the otherhand could be total chaos. He still wants to scare his victims, but doesn't plan everything out. He could just BE as scary as he needs to be, and literally just try to shock them to death instead of feeding off of slow, creeping dread. So instead of intelligent and sinister, he could be sporadic, insane, and just delights in causing fear and chaos.
> [{quoted}](name=Parznip,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=T2AKc2cI,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2019-06-02T21:58:59.245+0000) > > I think Shaco's enjoys the kill, and finds sick humor in what he does. > > Fiddlesticks, on the other hand, I think prefers the chase. He relishes his victims' fear. I would agree with how u have characterized the difference between Shaco and Fiddlesticks. Shaco = derives a specific sick humor from killing, thinks murder is hilarious. Fiddlesticks = a currently unexplored/unexplained drive to scare and chase people. > Nocturne, unfortunately, finds himself in a really similar trope. He and Fiddle compete for the same space I think. They both occupy the role of a terrorizing entity that enjoys inflicting fear. Nocturne is a demonic being that feeds on it, whereas Fiddle is likely just some sort of malicious poltergeist who finds it fun. I think the big difference is that Nocturn needs to feed on peoples fear, he sustains his existence off of it, theres also the idea that he causes paranoia, and additionally that his targets must be asleep for him to be most effective. I think the biggest difference however is that Nocturn is currently very serious, its not about fun for him, its not so much that he enjoys inflicting fear so much that he is driven by a primal hunger to subject his targets to as much fear as possible in order to sustain himself. While i could see Fiddlesticks fussily setting up traps, and the situation for his quarry so he can either enjoy the best set of jumps scares with each wrong step his targets takes, or so he can enjoy chasing them while they crap their pants as they run...I can only see Nocturn going straight in for the kill once the conditions have been met to terrorize his target as much as possible. Where Fiddle wants may want to stretch out the fun, Nocturn wants as much potent fear as possible. > I think it's almost unavoidable to have some overlap, but they could just be done as different ways of approaching the trope. Nocturne, for instance, could be calculating and terrifyingly derranged in his intelligence. He could plan and play with his victims, crafting nightmares to strike them in the heart. His version of terrifying could be subtle, sinister, and devious. Fiddle on the otherhand could be total chaos. He still wants to scare his victims, but doesn't plan everything out. He could just BE as scary as he needs to be, and literally just try to shock them to death instead of feeding off of slow, creeping dread. So instead of intelligent and sinister, he could be sporadic, insane, and just delights in causing fear and chaos. I can definitely see that. Or another idea is that you spec more into the elements related with sleep for Nocturn, maybe he has ways to make people lazy, or sleepy. On the other hand he could do other things with dreams such has giving them really sweet nice dreams at first and then makes them slowly turn into creepy nightmares as they progress.
: I did think about making his E a skill shot, but I decided that wouldn't necessarily be an improvement, especially considering that Shaco would be able to gap-close and then cast a skill shot ability at point-blank anyways, thereby removing any opportunity to dodge it. A skill shot on Shaco would become more of a test of a player's ping and knowledge of a particular combo, sort of like Rengar's bola is often used in a way that it is not reasonably possible to dodge. In my opinion, a timing dependent ability really works better in the case of Shaco. Abilities that require specific timing, especially where that timing is apparent to both the attacker and defender, are skill shots in a sense. They are skill shots that require aiming not necessarily at a specific spacial location but at a specific point of time, and then the defender must break the attacker's timing to 'dodge' the timing-based skill-shot. For the Shaco E example, the defender can fight back, CC Shaco, heal themselves, call in help from allies, or flee in an attempt to prevent Shaco from delivering the second shiv or to reduce the damage from it by forcing shaco to apply it before the first poison duration has worn off. If Shaco's E were decided to be too reliable, maybe it would be reasonable to make it easier to 'dodge' by adding the following conditions: 1) Casting E breaks stealth from Q. 2) Juggling has a 0.25 second cast-time/uninterruptible-animation before Shaco can basic attack. 3) Hard CC'ing Shaco while he is juggling causes him to drop his shivs, canceling any unthrown shivs. By the way, If we consider a timing based abilities skill-shots then we can also say that Shaco already has a skill shot via his traps. Though because they can be placed in the fog of war, they're arguably the same situation as other skill shots delivered from fog of war which does make them very difficult to 'dodge'. However, boxes can be cleared by gaining visibility of them, so I would say they are 'dodge-able' in some senses but they sometimes require prediction on the defender's side.
I wouldn't consider timing based ability skill shots because by nature of the NAME of the type of ability nothing HAS to be "shot" But i DO think they have the ability to make assassin engages more healthy as they allow opponents a chance to respond and extend the combat time. Something Like Camille's Q or Eve's W for example works. I think Casting E should most definitely break stealth since he can use it right after its cast, if it has a cast time then maybe it shouldn't break stealth until he uses the enhanced AA. I do not think CC'ing shaco should cause him to cancel the E, as that might be too punishing on an ability that isn't currently actively damaging champions - Its not like Sol's stars.
: Fair enough, though I'm still in belief that Fiddle, Noct, and Shaco will be "retconned" into demons, though not necessarily as I've stated. The 7 deadly sins was just the closest thing in our world that translates well to the other demons, but doesn't have to fit 1:1. That just begs the question of exactly what direction Riot will take the two of them lore wise, because they certainly have a little overlap, which isn't inherently a bad thing. (Nautilus and Puke come to mind.)
Im sure there is a pretty gud chance that both may in up as "demons" in someway or another even if I want Fiddle to end up as something slightly different. So if they as u say both end up as demons, then it would actually be a very bad idea to continue the 7 deadly sins trope, because even IF Tahm and eve were being counted (tho that would just be a misunderstanding by shoving their nuances under the carpet), they take up Lust and Greed/Gluttony, and that leaves Envy, Pride, and Wrath, and niether Fiddle nor Noct fit into those theme, there are other champions who would actually fit better rather than trying to shoehorn Fiddle or Noct into those themes. Nautilus and Pyke (lol can't believe u said Puke) actually have a situation that makes the reason why their lores are similar believable. They are both from Bilgwater a location that is known for having cut-throat people regularly sail out on ships together. In that type of society its actually pretty believable that people dying out at sea at the hands of others cutting their chains/lines/ropes and leaving them to die. Heck people dying out at sea in the times of our OWN world during the age of Whaling or Pirates (the types of times Bilgewater is kinda reminiscent of) was a common occurrence. Its just the fact Runeterra has magic that has allowed a few like Naut and Pyke to come back. But funnily enough even though their lore is similar you would find it a bit harder to confuse their theme or role in the game, compared to Noct and Fiddle. This is why getting Noct and Fiddle's theme right is MUCH more important, because in the lore we don't know their origin that well, they are both enigmas, and they both can play the game in similar roles as ambushing junglers. The fact that one is AP and the other is AD isn't enough of a difference. Thus we have to rely on Riot getting their theme and thus their Lore right meaning we need a clear difference.
: ***
Im sure u are as familiar as I am with the kind of backlash Riot gets either for changing the wrong thing or just changing a lot of things in general. B/c Noct is SO tied with with Fear in pretty much every aspect of every part of him, id really like to hear your points as to why Noct should be made into a demon of wrath rather than a demon of fear. Noct is a pretty old champion as in Fiddle, so in both cases their design is basically really bad when compared to their current standard. Noct has those blades because they make it very easy for people using old computers with low graphic specs to tell where the dmg is coming from: the blades are a different color from him, are big, and have a shiny white edge. Also they look cool, and kinda scary if u don't really think about what they mean for design, b/c honestly they don't fit his Lore old or current at all. Also anyone can have blades on them that isn't going to make anyone think they should be affiliated with anything. If you wanted a weapon to represent Wrath well: Nothing says rage like beating someone to near death and causing blunt-force trauma. When someone really wants to hurt someone else and has the ability to overpower their enemy u can bet they will throw away most other weapons that will get the job done too quickly and start pounding away with their bare fist, or if there’s a blunt object handy, maybe a lead pipe or a very big very heavy wrench. Do some research on the Aztecs and why they used the macuahuitls, it has something to do with fearing their patron god anger and war. It was a weapon not for ending the fight quickly but for causing the opponent as much pain and bleeding as possible. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hu%C4%ABtzil%C5%8Dp%C5%8Dchtli https://www.quora.com/If-the-seven-deadly-sins-had-weapons-to-represent-them-which-weapons-would-you-choose now look u CAN argue that my research was surface lvl but all I want to say is that if u wanted a weapon that SPECIFICALLY represents wrath there are better weapons than a simple blade, or rather arm mounted blades. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDRaVOx-22M
: Oh the fun it would be if elder dragon became this.
if Shyvana did some of this stuff that would be pretty insane reminds me of this: Shin Godzilla Atomic Fire https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/180/582/df3.gif https://gfycat.com/heartfeltspectacularhapuka would be cool if they had Elder dragon ghost in the background of Morde's ult.
Parznip (NA)
: My Hopes For Fiddlesticks's Rework
However they do it ik they will find a way to make Fiddle unqiue from Shaco and Noct, so im kinda wary of having him take a certain joy out scaring people since thats kinda close to Shaco laughing at killing people? IDK what do u think they can do to make Fiddle unique from Noct and Shaco?
: I believe Nocturne is one of the demons in League, similar to Tahm and Evelynn. If those two represent greed and lust respectively, that leaves room for a demon of fear. However, with Fiddlesticks being a fear champion himself and his update pending, it's hard to say. They've already decided they want to drive Fiddle into a jumpscare, more terrifying version of himself. I'm pretty sure Fiddlesticks is also a demon, and most likely for fear, especially with him being updated long before Nocturne. But, as nightmares go, I don't think he'd be a bad candidate for a demon of wrath, akin to the mild '7 deadly sins' theme going on. I expect he should be a stronger diver, with new tools to scare enemies away from each other so he can single then out and maul them with blades. Just my thoughts on the living nightmare!
Fiddle is more of a backcountry legend than a demon of fear i think, and this really has a lot to do with his current lore and his visuals, while Tahm and Eve both look like organisms, Fiddle really just looks like some spirit took over a scarecrow, as such and very much due to the fact that Noct exist i think a disservice to Noct and Fiddle to make Fiddle a demon of fear rather than a rural legend; the sort of thing that farmers at the edge of civilization bring up when they are talking about someone else disturbing a old burial ground to start a farm. And for Fidd's lore he was accidentally summoned, that also sounds like a potential rural legend, probs something like this: Some Farmer tries to summon a golem to chase off bird or other people but then notices the scarecrow moves on its own when he isn't giving it order or something like that. it should also be pointed out that many confuse Tahm and Eve's purpose or rather what they hunger for/feed on. While Tahm does indeed mostly use human's greed, he feed on their despair, and while Eve uses lust, she feeds on pain. In both of their cases, they use a certain human desire as a vehicle to obtain the MOST despair or pain from a single target. But they are WHOLLY capable of using other means to an end to obtain what they want. This is made evident in one of Tahm's color stories: instead of using Greed he convinces a person to lie as they float down a river, but ultimately their lies cause them to be isolated, and Tahm feeds on their despair in this case. Riot has no intention to remake the 7 deadly sins in league this is just a case of people misunderstanding a few things. Noct isn't going to made into a demon for wrath, if they did Noct players would be in an uproar. Noct is clearly about fear because thats what nightmares are all about. They will find a way to rework Fiddle w/o stepping on Noct's toes. Noct is the living nightmare Fiddlesticks is basically the "experiment" gone horribly wrong.
: This thread seems to be getting a decent amount of upvotes, but could some of you please reply if you support the concept to help this get visibility? Thank you.
While i do think its interesting and could also help with supporting more healthy Assassin game-plays and counterplay by doing things like extending the combat time of an assassin forcing assassins to commit to combat or being closer allowing enemies to dodge an assassins dmg i don't know enough about shaco to truely give reliable feedback. I really like the idea of the Back-stab Indicator I do think that its interesting that you focused on some smaller scale work for Shaco rather than trying to over-haul the whole thing, and adding a lore + origin update too, in this case i think it helps you focus in on some of the smaller and more nuanced issues with Shaco. I will say however that I am pretty unsure if allowing Shaco to maintain mixed damage is the best idea, it would depend on how the entire kit is build. But another discussion brought up two issues with Shaco: His damage is currently un-dodge-able its all unit target which i think for assassins can be a bigger issue than on other champions especially if they can become stealthed theres less or a only a small warning before they begin combat. Im not saying he needs a skillshot, tho if he WAS given one I wouldn't have an issue with it either. Tho the joke exist that most reworks are given skill-shots or rather the traditional straight line skill shots, assassins need damage that enemies can avoid otherwise whats the point of saying that assassins need skill to kill their targets? IDC if u make Two-Shiv Poison a non-locking basic attack that moves towards the target enemy when cast, but do something that isn't an instant guaranteed hit.
: Patch 9.11 notes
Hopfully Riot will revisit these reverted champions, and zero in on why they didn't work and why people didn't like them, and then makes appropriate changes. Zac, LB, Rengar idk who else there are ways that they can be healthy and enjoyed while being unique you just have to find a better middle ground.
: 9.11: Lore Update
Yo rioter Writers you kno how Kindred is supposed to be a pretty big influence on cultures across runeterra? Well because they are supposed to be a root in culture BUT were created much later after much of the Lore was created they are in a wierd spot where they actually AREN'T a root for culture. Anytime that a relatively NEW champion is supposed to a core part of the world's lore, and OLDER champions get the lore updated, u guys should be looking for a chance to insert hints of that NEW impactful champions mythos in. This update for Sion was a perfect chance to insert the "Pride of a death at Wolf's jaw" or something like that since Noxus prefers Wolf to Lamb, and also because Sion's history is old and also important to Noxus. You guys did it for the Story "Principles of Strength" where there's a monument to wolf, so why not here. I would say the same thing for Morde but I think that he thinks he's above death so he probably doesn't care about Kindred. HOWEVER its a VERY nice touch that he has a Kindred tattoo on his back in his Pentakill skin which matches the theme for a heavy metal band since Kindred is Runterra's equivalent of the reaper. I think its important to showing the rich culture and lore of LoL and the connections between everything. Pls don't miss anymore chances like that, I'm sure there are other champions who have a similar status to Kindred as well.
: Pentakill Mordekaiser needs some tweaks before it hits live with the rework
Also Morde should play different songs for his dance, because if all the Penta Kill skins are on the same team...it would be a HUGE shame if they couldn't even play the same song, and I think Yorick plays Lightbringer for his dance.
: Jhin took that to heart huh
lol when no one will upvote anymore because its a Jhin related post and it already has 4 votes. Man i bet Riot nvr knew Jhin liking the #4 would lead to such things
Sirhaian (NA)
: VFX Updates for Amumu, Lulu, Tryndamere and Ziggs
As an hobby animator I gotta say this stuff looks really great, its clear and concise, the VFX look really smooth and very believable and less cartoon-y, really enjoying it, even trynd's ult which is saying something (PLS rework him next after Volibear (yeah IK ur probs not on that team, but pass it along for me wouldja?)) Keep up the great work.
Saezio (EUNE)
: Yuumi Thoughts
I just realized Yuumi kinda creates a Cho'Gall like gameplay from HoTs in LoL. If u cast self affecting Summoners while attached do they affect the ally ur attached to? Can u channle Recall or Teleport while attached?
: Had a game last night with yuumi on my team and I was Darius top lane. Other lanes were getting smashed but I did ok and really rekt their tryndamere top lane. At first I was a little miffed because the enemy kassadi and Tristana were super fed and started reking me in fights through sheer dps and kiting since most of my teammates were really far behind and so weren't being focused. Our cait, who yuumi was attached to for the beginning of the game, was next to useless, and so they both fed. However, yuumi recognized I was the only one who had a fighter's chance and attached to me. Let's just say I went from something like 7/5 or 7/6 to like 16/6 or 16/7, and was absolutely shredding them with yuumi. The enemy team actually surrendered after I rekt them in a fight, never even had to take the two inner towers and only destroyed one outer base tower. Keep in mind that at one point the enemy kass was 9/1 and enemy Tristana was 10/1. Two super fed late game carries who had good peel from a support (don't remember which one actually) and a solid jungler. Suffice to say, yuumi turned me into a super soldier and we basically 2v4 or 2v5 and either won, or did a ton of damage before dying so my other teammates could come cleanup. It was insane. She gave me everything I needed: long range poke projectile that slowed them and allowed me to catch them. Shielding and healing for longer survivability to stack bleed. Speed boost, which with ghost, made me nearly unkitable, more damage, and a fricken aoe root with her ult that just made it super easy to stack and dunk and land q heals in tight situations. All in all, I never had more fun playing Darius since I started in 2013. To sum up my rambling, I totally agree with you OP! Yuumi is a blast, not just for her, but whoever she attaches too
> [{quoted}](name=kingDeDeDarius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=gdXgnKsF,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-05-17T16:08:18.935+0000) > > Had a game last night with yuumi on my team and I was Darius top lane. Other lanes were getting smashed but I did ok and really rekt their tryndamere top lane. At first I was a little miffed because the enemy kassadi and Tristana were super fed and started reking me in fights through sheer dps and kiting since most of my teammates were really far behind and so weren't being focused. > > Our cait, who yuumi was attached to for the beginning of the game, was next to useless, and so they both fed. However, yuumi recognized I was the only one who had a fighter's chance and attached to me. Let's just say I went from something like 7/5 or 7/6 to like 16/6 or 16/7, and was absolutely shredding them with yuumi. The enemy team actually surrendered after I rekt them in a fight, never even had to take the two inner towers and only destroyed one outer base tower. > > Keep in mind that at one point the enemy kass was 9/1 and enemy Tristana was 10/1. Two super fed late game carries who had good peel from a support (don't remember which one actually) and a solid jungler. > > Suffice to say, yuumi turned me into a super soldier and we basically 2v4 or 2v5 and either won, or did a ton of damage before dying so my other teammates could come cleanup. It was insane. > > She gave me everything I needed: long range poke projectile that slowed them and allowed me to catch them. Shielding and healing for longer survivability to stack bleed. Speed boost, which with ghost, made me nearly unkitable, more damage, and a fricken aoe root with her ult that just made it super easy to stack and dunk and land q heals in tight situations. > > All in all, I never had more fun playing Darius since I started in 2013. To sum up my rambling, I totally agree with you OP! Yuumi is a blast, not just for her, but whoever she attaches too You spoke of Ghost: did she have ghost and cast it, and then it affected you? Or did YOU have ghost? see this ONLY works if she attaches to a fed ally who she can give/take Adaptive damage to/from and it gets even better on Juggernauts/Fighters/Divers/Skirmishers because her supportive abilities become more MUCH apparent on them b/c shes giving them EXACTLY wat they want as u explained I've also experienced this as MORDE...basically Yuumi is misplaced if she's trying to help a marksman b/c marksmen aren't going to get as much use out of her stuff, its just not exactly what they need/want the most outside of the Adaptive damage. Also Yuumi is also only going to work well in mid-late game when theres enough AP/AD on allies to use, and thats IF the ally has anything to begin with. So u got lucky with the perfect storm, if u had been unlucky to not do so well...Yuumi wouldn't have helped that much. Darius can quickly turn fights around and with Yuumi's help he's even better, Yuumi just needs to be attached to fighters not Marksmen then she might have more success. But its still not gonna stop me from wishing her Shield was more interesting or that she could do stuff like teleport herself or an ally across the map. It would be cool if she could at least channel Recall and Teleport while attached even if it only takes herself and not the ally. Turning an ally into a super soldier sounds interesting, if only she made it look cool, or had an interesting super soldier mechanic, like W's adaptive damage super charged the ally after X instances of dmg or something and granted MS or something with some VFX. Her W adaptive dmg is kinda hidden power that isn't visually appreciated.
SEKAI (OCE)
: > [{quoted}](name=Kai Guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vB1fjvJr,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-05-17T08:52:58.686+0000) > > Good Abbys soak EXP and don't just sit in base. > > Yuumi is done just fine. but most folks run awfull rune and item build on her currently so shes not gonna look that great. > > This is just fine imo. Leave it be let folks who get the mechanic use her. I don't get how people complain as if they know Yuumi inside out in the FIRST DAY of her release. Even more annoyingly, perhaps more infuriatingly, that Riot actually just kneejerk buffed her. Does the countless champ release disasters directly a result of kneejerk buff right after launch not give Riot enough lessons?
> [{quoted}](name=SEKAI,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vB1fjvJr,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-05-17T13:14:06.204+0000) > > I don't get how people complain as if they know Yuumi inside out in the FIRST DAY of her release. > > Even more annoyingly, perhaps more infuriatingly, that Riot actually just kneejerk buffed her. Does the countless champ release disasters directly a result of kneejerk buff right after launch not give Riot enough lessons? i think ur right but I also think Riot intentionally made her weak b/c they didn't kno how strong or weak the attach mechanic would be, its a pretty big game changer as a single mechanic so I think they were trying to be safe. However weather u buff her numbers or not Yuumi just FEELS really weak and ineffective especially compared to other supports until late-mid game when her scalings come online. And this has more to do with how her kit is designed because it really doesn't do much on its own if we aren't looking at numbers, it doesn't do a very good job of SHOWING what it does, and its not the MOST exciting thing, so even if the attach mechanic IS a game changer...watching her sit on a ally doesn't do a gud job of showing it at all. and then u also run into the issue of a thematic disconnect when u have a champion is very much about teleporting and portals in Lore and then doesn't do that in any way in game, and u get people wishing she did something more along those lines. If anything id love to see her shield buffed in some way that is more interesting, mechanically, skillfully, or numbers wise...Her shield seems like it could be a big focus on the kit, Id love to see her as some sort of shield focused shield battery support, that could be interesting.
: I don't know how Yuumi made release like this.
I think the issue is that she seems like a lot of her power is focused for late game scaling, its not like she's going to transform or anything late game like other champs, but basically she's useless early game and then becomes a proper support thats capable of healing and shielding well LATE game when her allies and herself have a lot of AD/AP for her to make use of. But until then she's very lack luster...the only issue is: U need a gud support B4 u get to late game, otherwise wats the point b/c u might not make it but yes shes VERY boring cause she doesn't bring much to the table, like sure the attach mechanic is cool but its not REALLY that interesting, mean its basically kinda what Rakan's E does without needing to eat up a full ability slot. I would LOVE to see her shield become stronger or more interesting because rn the passive is pretty lame, either seeing more mechanical skill requirements or more mechanically interesting going on with the shield like a stacking mechanic, maybe for each W cast up to a cap. Or maybe we could ACTUALLY get some teleportation/portals in her kit when thats a HUGE part of her lore? Don't sleep on LATE game Yuumi, ive been saved QUITE a few times, but again that ONLY if u get to late game, and both u and Yuumi have strong AD/AP, if u don't get there...its not gonna be fun, and yeah early game Yuumi where lots of people see her...nothing to write home about. The ONLY thing she's got going for her is the attach mechanic, but when u get down to it...its not ALL that interesting and as a SUPPORT: it doesn't do enough
: Maybe I'm spoiled by this point but, the quality feels lower than it should be, more akin to a fan animation and the pacing just being a bit too fast for my liking. This along with the actual skinline, especially the voicelines of Ezreal, I'm really just not feeling it.
> [{quoted}](name=King Braum,realm=EUW,application-id=EBBIvmVK,discussion-id=Vvsyis0g,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2019-05-16T10:49:24.309+0000) > > Maybe I'm spoiled by this point but, the quality feels lower than it should be, more akin to a fan animation and the pacing just being a bit too fast for my liking. This along with the actual skinline, especially the voicelines of Ezreal, I'm really just not feeling it. i believe this is a fan animation, or an collab between Riot and a fan, like they have been doing recently. Can someone confirm?
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FlameHalbrdOkido

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