Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: February 13
Are there any potential changes to Talon? I understand that his winrate among players with a lot of games is quite high, and his gameplay patterns are pretty oppressive, but his overall performance puts him lower than many AD assassins, he's heavily reliant on his level 2 all-in, he falls off harder than almost any other assassin, and as of patch 9.3, his winrate has plummeted a fair amount. Since the crit item changes, he's been even lower than Zed, an AD assassin some consider much worse. This, probably due to the PD bubble, and the fact that Talon has just enough damage to kill most AD's, but operates on longer CD's than other assassins, meaning a failure is an actual failure, unlike people like Fizz, Zed, or Kha'Zix. It feels like he's been left in the dust, with even his new kit feeling clunky, on par with much, much older champions, and his lore being at the exact same point it was when he was released. It's frustrating playing a champion that feels like the guy Riot would kill in the lore simply because there's nothing to do with him. You can't advance his story or appearance even without making his name feel out of place. The reason I'm concerned is because it seems you have an AD assassin coming down the pipe, and unless it's the General, Talon will not only never get more lore, but will probably be left in the dust in terms of kit design, his rework being a slightly flawed attempt at keeping the old failed play patterns while updating them slightly.
: Please take a look at Xerath. His Q bugs out sometimes during the match, getting him stuck in the animation channel without being able to cast the spell. His abilities mana costs are too high. Either buff his mana pool and mana growth or decrease his mana costs Mage itemization needs a overall rework and give clear item paths for the AP champions to choose depending on the class of the champion. Sorceress shoes needs to be nerfed back to 10 Magic Penetration. No AP champion should have a easy access to the highest magic penetration item by only 1100 gold and so early in the game. Support items are abused by other laners the same way Kleptomancy is. Making them only be triggered when allies are nearby was a good idea, but Kleptomancy also needs to be a more Support Keystone only, than a exploitable rune.
Definitely not a real fix, but with Xerath Q, you can simply repress the ability and it should cast. I've been getting it too, and that seems to work for me.
Rioter Comments
: Yes every insult is hurtful to someone, that's kinda the goal of an insult. Fa**ot doesn't have the same impact because there are alternatives without the degrading connotation attached. Autistic doesn't have that, except for possibly "falls on the spectrum". It's disgusting that you want autistic to become a derogatory term. I don't know how you can live with yourself wanting being autistic to be synonymous with less than human. If you really want that to happen, it's sad and you need help.
1. Autistic already is. 2. Retard used to be the word. Then we moved on to nicer words, which in turn became insults. Like autistic, there wasn't another word. 3. I don't "want autistic to become a derogatory term." I want people to use whatever words however they want. You're the one that has a problem, which means it's your bad. If you're not offended, then so what? If you are, then it's serving its purpose, which is be to an asshole.
: It does if it legitimately hurts your feelings. If it doesn't, then you shouldn't care.
If it really hurts your feelings, then it gives me leverage over you. If it doesn't, I'm proving my own point.
: Tank Fizz has the durability of a tank, the damage of a bruiser, and the mobility of an Assassin.
Fizz is bullshit. That said, he doesn't have the durability of a tank.
: 1) It was what I meant. 2) There is no correlation between referring to new insulting words and autism. 3) If I am autistic, I hope to get cured one day. 4) If I am autistic, does that give you argumentative leverage over me?
It does if it legitimately hurts your feelings. If it doesn't, then you shouldn't care.
: Exactly my point. They evolved into the derogatory state they are in today. As of now, the term autistic is in the beginning stages of that evolution to become derogatory. I hope you share my sentiment of not wanting that to happen. For other insults i listed off, it is too late to do anything about those being considered a derogatory term. But we can fight to make sure autism/autistic doesn't join that list.
I don't share your sentiment. Every insult is hurtful to someone, and being autistic doesn't provide special treatment. Just like everyone else, you should learn to deal with it. If %%%got doesn't bother you, neither should autistic.
: The abilities are very Moba-esque, like Zarya's ult bringing in the enemy team for her's to follow up on, similar to Orianna.
And Moba abilities are very RTS-esque, but the two genres couldn't be more different.
: To be frank WoW had it in the very early days. I am talking about the days before they remade IronForge cause people kept getting lost.
It didn't matter much in WoW, and in the early days, I recall servers shunning people completely for being toxic waste-bags.
Overwatch is fun, but it's not a replacement for a game that you can spend hours in. I get too frustrated with Overwatch too quickly for it to replace games like LoL and Diablo that can soak up hours a day for days on end.
: '' Bye bye league of legends im done with it '' ..
This thread is as bad or worse. You care enough that other people aren't enjoying the game anymore that you make a thread about it, when it doesn't affect you at all.
: The words are the same. Fa**ot's origins are of a derogatory manor, while autistic's are of the psychological community use to describe someone with a serious disability. it's like the difference in calling someone black and a ni**er. Idiots use ni**ger all the time to try to get under your skin, but if you suddenly use a word that implies that its disgraceful to be a part of that group, that's when i will take issue.
%%%got wasn't originally a derogatory term. Hundreds of years ago, %%%%%% wasn't either. Words become offensive by people implying that there's something negative about it. Like retard.
: Actually, that is exactly what I meant.
Lol no it isn't, you're trying to save face. If that's what you actually meant, then you're just autistic.
: you dont get the point of this post everything is offensive to someone but autistic (used as an insult) is HURTFUL to some people.
You don't get the point of what I'm saying. EVERYTHING is hurtful to someone. You're just so selfish and inconsiderate that you only have a problem when it's something you take personally. There are people who are just not smart. Calling someone stupid is hurtful to them. If I call you retarded, it's hurtful to people who are retarded. If I call you ANYTHING, there is a group of people who are actually like that, and it's hurtful to them. Stop thinking of only yourself.
: I've never seen anyone spell it "Calista."
But if people had to for a thread like this to make sense, we wouldn't get hilarious memes XD 90% of the memes and games threads have situations that never happen.
: Oh look- someone downvoted me for my opinion despite the majority of people on Reddit and Youtube complained about Inferno Diana being bland. If you disagree with me (not to you 4Noxious whom I appreciate the feedback from) then least address why you think she isn't bland otherwise please.
You got 3 downvotes. Chill out dude.
: When someone uses fa**ot it just makes them seem stupid rather then attempting to offend someone. TBH i was just listing off common insults i hear while playing.
It's the same as the word autist. You don't feel a biting offense when being called %%%got, so instead of causing offense, it only makes you realize they are stupid. Same for autist and MOST people. It's all the same, and the only difference is your own position interfering with your judgement.
: "how about nothing NEW" stupid isnt new.
It's not saying new words never been used. It's implying something new relative to your use of autistic. You still don't understand the point of what I'm saying either. I'm saying EVERYTHING is offensive to someone and autistic is no different.
: theres already plenty to choose from without autism in the pool
No, see, you don't understand. No matter what people use, it's offensive to someone. Saying that you shouldn't use anything in lieu of autist implies that you don't want anyone calling someone anything, meaning you ARE trying to fight the use of all offensive vocabulary. If you're only trying to get autism removed because it hurts you personally, but you don't care about literally every other insult, then you are selfish.
Kinetika (NA)
: Not to diminish your point, but what insult/derogatory remark is acceptable? People are jerks, and that's gonna happen. The problem is much larger than any single word, or even group of words.
It's like jokes. A joke might be out of bounds to you, but you can't get mad about the specific joke, as there's SOMEONE equally offended at yours.
: How about to nothing new?
"It's not trying to fight the use of all offensive vocabulary." Well then this statement is false.
Unicky (NA)
: PSA: Calling Someone "Autistic" Isn't Cool, It's Just Offensive And Dumb
PSA: Calling Someone ANYTHING Isn't Cool, It's Just Offensive And Dumb. There is literally no insult not offensive to someone.
Aazzlano (NA)
: My point was that it is effectively extra health in a fight vs a magic damage champion. If you continue damaging them while they have the shield, then its EXTRA HEALTH. If you have to stun them during it, and you keep damaging them, its still EXTRA HEALTH. If you cannot stun them when it pops, and you have to fight them, it is EXTRA HEALTH. If you have to back off when it pops, because you cannot kill them through it, then it forced you to lose the kill, because of their EXTRA HEALTH. If you are so fed that you can burst through the shield and still kill them, it was still EXTRA HEALTH. If you waited and held your CDs, and couldn't kill them until the shield wore off and you bursted them after, then it was a FIVE SECOND ZHONYA'S that let them MOVE and ATTACK YOU BACK, but you could not attack them or it would just get wasted. For DOUBLE the duration of the actual Zhonya's which you can't do ANYTHING in. So in EVERY situation its either bonus health, or invulnerability for the duration if you couldn't pierce it. Not to mention Maw gives you more free stats when it pops too, which doesn't wear off until they are completely out of combat. So since it is basically extra bonus health (but better since it can't increase % current/max health damage or factored in for additional % missing health execute damage) it should be treated as such in gold efficiency calculations. YOU know nothing. That's why you have under a 50% winrate on Zed, who is your second most played, and one of the abusers of Hexdrinker/Maw. That says a LOT considering how broken Zed is.
"If you have to stun them during it, and you keep damaging them, " You stun them and back off you dumb nerd. "YOU know nothing. That's why you have under a 50% winrate on Zed, who is your second most played, and one of the abusers of Hexdrinker/Maw. That says a LOT considering how broken Zed is." No, I have under a 50% winrate with Zed because I'm bad at AD assassins, and play him because I enjoy him. I also haven't played the game since October until just around last week, so every single Zed game was before "how broken Zed is." And you're still missing the biggest thing about Maw that isn't a weakness with Seekers. IT'S ON A COOLDOWN. You just like to be mad.
Aazzlano (NA)
: Yeah no. In a fight if an AP champion gets a target low, that means that they are either chasing them, or they are fighting them. If they are chasing them, they cannot pull back for 5 seconds and wait for it to drop, then continue. If they are fighting them, they cannot just disengage for 5 seconds then go back in. Either the target is getting away, or the AP champ is getting killed, if they do one of those things. They have to push through the shield which means it is in all relevant situations vs magic damage, bonus health that is unaffected by % health damage. And if it were so simple as just pulling back and waiting for it to fall off, is that not basically a 5 second Zhonya where the target can still move, still fight back etc. but your opponent cannot affect you? Because that's basically what you are saying.
Do you have a stun? Then yes you can just pull back. Yeah, I guess 100% invulnerability is the same as a decent bubble that I can still go through when I'm fed. "on a CD" Stop complaining, you know nothing.
Aazzlano (NA)
: What? Health only matters when you would die. If you have 0 or 3000 bonus health in items it makes no difference until you would have died without the bonus health. It's a FIVE SECOND shield (that is not a short time) and you can still attack while it protects you, unlike Zhonya's. Also, Hexdrinker costs 1300 gold and is perfectly gold efficient WITHOUT the passive and it self scales very hard. It is also very slot efficient in that it upgrades into an item that is even more broken than Hexdrinker itself. Where as you don't get Zhonya's until 3k gold in and it locks you in place, unable to reposition or attack, or do anything. AND it's not even gold efficient. And it doesn't self scale. And it doesn't give you a second passive when you use it which enhances your combat stats even more, without a duration, until out of combat. The build path for Maw is 10x better than Zhonya's, and the item itself is also much better. Hexdrinker is incredibly impactful and Seeker's is ignorable with a Serrated, which actually also builds into Maw. Convenient! I did the calculations and at level 6, a Brand (extremely high damaging combo mage) needs over 400 AP to burst a level 6 Talon through his Hexdrinker (with no other items) from 100-0, with a perfect combo landing and 6 seconds of passive ticking. That's over 9000 gold in AP required. The item completely invalidates an entire class of champions while being incredibly efficient and buildable in any game they have any kind of magic damage. Hexdrinker alone at level 6 gives 150 gold less of health/MR than a Spectre's Cowl, A FULL DEFENSIVE ITEM. AND it gives 700 gold in AD. AND the shield completely ignores % health damage, meaning it effectively gives you even MORE survivability vs any kind of % damage. Balanced! I recently faced a Master/Challenger jungler smurf in one of my Ranked games, who was playing Evelynn. He was 6/0, but I told my team to build Hexdrinkers (I was doing extremely well so I just bought one first item after my jungle item) and our Yasuo and Jinx built it right away. The Evelynn was completely invalidated, he might as well have been AFK. Didn't matter how fed he was, instantly he could not duel or kill any of us. He ended 7/5 from that great start because his champion happened to deal magic damage. Balanced!
Gives health on a CD, and it's health you can just pull back and wait to fall off.
Knoyle (NA)
: It's not a horrible idea to practice on bots before going into pvp.
Even if I don't know a champion, bot games get insanely boring after 10 minutes, and you can still not even understand how the champ works and beat them.
: I dont understnad why we dont get 10 bans
You could ban Cait/MF/Varus/Graves/Twitch and likely ban out the ADC's the other team is comfortable with.
Mártir (EUW)
: Please Riot, enable "Penta-Assists" in the game. :]
Every teamfight, there would be like, 4 penta assists. I vote no.
Aazzlano (NA)
: Make it so you have to stack Hexdrinker
Let me just build tons of health while not sacrificing any offensive capabilities at all while still having insane utility on every item. Oh wait, I can't, because I'm AD.
: I'm going to defend this rework to the very end, because if it wasn't for it, 1) My fun reserves would be so much lower. 2)This wouldn't have happened to my elo from when 6.9 hit onwards: git gud people Yes, the straight upwards one consists of nothing but Vlad, Taric (with the bloodstone skin so I can pretend I'm playing Vlad anyway) and the occassional Karma for when Vlad is ban.
: Yep that one stab got lux to rage then more and more people raged then he gets gutted then riot released zed a champion who does everything Talon does but for no mana and has better escapes
Yeah but Talon wins more.
: At any rate getting pentakills as Master Yi shouldn't really count Source: I've gotten two pentakills in the last two days on Master Yi
> [{quoted}](name=vfactor95,realm=NA,application-id=mNBeEEkI,discussion-id=yyFBQP31,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2016-05-20T05:52:55.620+0000) > > At any rate getting pentakills as Master Yi shouldn't really count > > Source: I've gotten two pentakills in the last two days on Master Yi I got 3 pentakills in an aram with him in the same game :P Never got an SR Penta though.
: Name one thing the entire Rogue class can do against N'zoth.
I thought this was WoW and not Hearthstone, and was so confused.
: I'm calling you out laughing fish.
I can't download fek on my phone or at work, so I'm stuck with 90% memes and games on the front page. I hate the new forums. I miss the old forums.
: i think nocturnes q has the potential to be the best spell ever thematically
Kensue (NA)
: ***
Drain tank is nice. If they have more than a few squishies, standard is alright even in higher elos.
: The Board's most influential memers in a nutshell.
And all equally annoying :P Hooray for blacklist. Oh except for MM.
: > [{quoted}](name=L0RD AZIR,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=GX1kX9Tc,comment-id=000600000000,timestamp=2016-05-18T03:34:21.180+0000) > > Azir has never received a buff. He's bad bug fixes and QoL changes but other than that its been nerf after nerf. You wanna know why hes strong as shit right now? Think back 2 months ago in the NA LCS. Teams were running tripple marksman comps. Graves / kindred jg, corki mid, and a adc bot lane. Imortals even went so far as to run Lucian top. All these champioms have burst and sustain damage. > > Azir does everything an adc does except he has no crits, or sustain and is a little harder to play than just right click a champion. The problem is with sustained dmg. Who are the top 3 OP mages right now? Aurelion Sol =57% winrate in solo queue, Ryze 100% pick ban at MSI, and Azir is basically the same story. All sustained dmg dealers with decent burst. > > Adcs are mandatory in every game for their broken sustained dmg. The 3 champs i mentioned are the same. That's the thing, sustained damage mages have always been a nightmare to balance because basically they burst squishies and dps down tanks, the same an ADC would do. But the big difference is, they're mages and have utility and strong CC that ADCs not named Ashe and Sivir can't dream of matching (and Ashe and Sivir do considerably less damage than other ADCs). Kindred too but her damage falls off late game.
That's an understatement. For all the crying over Kayle in S4, she wasn't even as strong as the sleeper that was AS/AP Kayle in S3. She's one of the most complained about champions. In a few months here, she'll get good again, and it's all you'll see on the forums.
: > [{quoted}](name=HateDaddy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=GX1kX9Tc,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2016-05-18T03:17:15.647+0000) > > I think he's pretty flashy.. Hes also not consistently good and loses a lot of matches till higher elo. Zed stomps bronze and silver people like no tomorrow, meanwhile azir feeds in their games. 90% of the community is bronze or silver, ofc they will start hating zed instead of azir.
Azir is insanely flashy. Zed also hovers around a 47-48% winrate in bronze-silver. From what I can find, Azir actually wins more often in bronze and silver.
: The amount of keys to chests is almost always disproportional and essence costs are high. If you really want to be unlocking things with hextech they expect you to be paying which is where the cash grab comes in. They wouldn't have implemented this system if they didn't think it would increase their profits.
I've gotten 5 free skins, 1 of which I would have bought and 2 others I will use. I get that you can use money to make it better, but it's overall free stuff. Selling skins is worse, and they're already doing it, so I see no reason to get upset.
: What are you talking about? {{champion:266}} {{champion:122}} Also, just give any AD champion {{item:1053}} , compare with vlad who heals more on minion. Vlad sustain nerf was just ridiculous. Even aatrox doesn't use up 40% of max hp on his combo.
You better not be factoring in a full HP W use in that "combo."
: Actually they dont expect more as every Citizen of Demacia has to undergo military training serve time in the Army and is a Reserve member of the Demacian army. Demacia is a developed Mt Targon tribe.
Lots of countries have mandatory military service. Every citizen of America is a reserve member of the army. That's why you register for the draft. The higher ups have more expected of them. Lux was basically forced into a life of espionage and violence because she's from a well off house. Regular people basically learn to fight and then live their lives.
Xonra (NA)
: This is a dumb response, like that fact or not. How is zed going to have a higher win rate, or be "more popular" when he is banned so much? Did you even think before posting this response? "Zed is banned, people don't want to play against him. He needs a nerf" "Yeah well Lucian is played more so he deserves the ban more" "You mean the guy who is rarely banned is played more than the guy not available to play?" "Yeah! You understand my argument!" <_< Think before you post ------------- What's more sad is some people upvoted your response.
The point isn't that he WOULD be popular. The point is that, according to Riot, a higher pickrate equals lower winrate. If Zed WERE to be picked more, his winrate wouldn't compare to Lucian's. Lucian has a higher winrate with a higher pickrate. Zed being banned means people prefer not to play vs. him, not that he is stronger than Lucian. Lucian is a meta defining champion, and is incredibly broken.
Xonra (NA)
: Where are you even getting that assumption? Because that is all it is; an assumption. Especially since your assumption is contradictory to even Riot's who felt Zed needed some nerfs about a month ago (was at least two different red posts that stated it very clearly). He has not been nerfed since, has been indirectly buffed by the qss nerfs, and his ban rate has gone UP since (about 5% at least). Not to mention squishy mages are very popular right now, which are easy targets for Zed, but since he is banned so much, you won't see him against them usually. So with your baseless assumption, and mine based on clear evidence and statements by Riot, I'm more likely to be correct than you are here.
"Especially since your assumption is contradictory to even Riot's who felt Zed needed some nerfs about a month ago (was at least two different red posts that stated it very clearly)." Nok it isn't. I didn't say anything wrong. I also didn't say Zed doesn't need nerfs, as he does. I'm not talking about the state of Zed currently, I'm comparing Zed to Lucian. "So with your baseless assumption, and mine based on clear evidence and statements by Riot, I'm more likely to be correct than you are here." You sound like a massive geek.
: Champions that do not synergize with {{item:3157}} nor have any built-in mechanisms that protect them from zed's ult can't deal with the champion by themselves. I know riot nerfed qss to push for more "teamwork" in regards to dealing with the zed but for a solo queue player, this is ridiculous. I don't know what the lucian nerfs are but the whole reason behind him doing so well with {{item:3142}} {{item:3071}} is due to not only his kit synergizing with these items but the fact that they're so gold efficient. In my opinion, they should honestly target the items, specifically {{item:3142}} by making it more expensive or making the build path less gold efficient.
That's not true. His kit synergy 100%. If they were THAT gold efficient, Nocturne would be a problem, because he actually does have synergy with them.
: > [{quoted}](name=AvantelWings,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EAloqhcv,comment-id=000000000001,timestamp=2016-05-17T23:26:00.397+0000) > > And then there was the time when you spammed about 7 Draven threads that absolutely no one agreed with you on, and pointed out multiple areas where you were doing wrong. > > And Lucian isn&#x27;t a decent ADC that outshines the others because they are bad, Lucian is one of the best ADCs who outshines the others for simply that fact. Why pick MF, Corki, or Vayne when Lucian is a stronger lane bully, mid game carry, and late game powerhouse then all three, while having more safety? > > And nerfing a cooldown by 2 seconds at max rank in a champion that has *at least* 30% CDR isn&#x27;t gutting. Neither is minor range nerfs, one of which was a spell that really didn&#x27;t do much anyway. > > This is the first day of the new cycle. Riot said that they would be monitoring Zed after the QSS changes and would be making the appropriate balance changes if and when they were required. Lucian's late game isn't nearly as good as Vayne's. His late game isn't even particularly good as far as ADCs go.
Vayne can shred tanks better, but Lucian can kill squishies twice as fast.
Woook3r (NA)
: do you think it really matters? lucian isnt particularly overpowered. he is unbalance-able and has a fucked up kit. zed is broken and op.
"Do you think it matters that my statistics are misleading and straight up lying when I'm RIGHT?!" You'd make a good Mormon or politician.
: It's mathematically impossible for Zed to have a higher pick rate than Lucian, because Zed's ban rate is higher than Lucian's pickrate. Lucian has a P/B percentage of 40.68% Zed has a P/B percentage of 87.27% That means that Zed is more than twice as likely to picked or banned in Champion select than Lucian.
Which is irrelevant. The important factor is that the higher the pickrate, the lower the winrate is. It's known by the community, even Riot acknowledges that. If Zed weren't banned, it's more than likely his winrate would plummet.
: thats because lucian has clear counterplay and work arounds, hes a well designed champion and sees tons of play because he actually does his job as an adc where other adcs are lacking, not that lucian SHOULD be nerfed, (thats for everyone to decide) but rather thats what all champions should strive to be like. zed on the other hand is just a big ball of mess that cant be dealt with so instead of forcing us to counterpick against him we simply ban him out.
Uncatchable as a melee, and dominating in lane as ADC. Yeah, perfectly well designed. That's why Lucian hasn't been balanced since release. He is either broken or garbage. How does that factor into your well designed argument?
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