: Thoughts On Ballancing and why im probalby going to quit leauge soon
> [{quoted}](name=One Dunk Man,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=fYwObt3h,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-09-17T21:58:14.870+0000) > > Y%%%%%u obv. will climb over time if you play good, but as someone who doesnt want to waste hundreds of hours into league just to get a decent rank, this feels very unrewarding. If iam playing good i want to climb, and not play 300 games to winn 170 of them and climb through that. Ideally, "climbing" should be brief and simple. The POINT of climbing should be to get to your proper rank so that you can play "even" (and theoretically "fun"/competitive) games. The problem is that it seems like "climbing" has become an end unto itself, especially since you get a bunch of smurfs that just want to noob-stomp.
Kithráya (EUW)
: What is Riot doing about smurfs ruining games?
Answer: not a damn thing. Next question? (The fact that streamers make "unranked to Challenger" videos ALL THE TIME, shows that they don't care about smurfing)
: > [{quoted}](name=HeeroTX,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hJmRBsZH,comment-id=0015,timestamp=2019-09-18T14:43:49.700+0000) > > All of those champs COMBINED bother me less than {{champion:157}} Gonna have to hard disagree on that one.
You're entitled to your opinion. I literally ban this bastard EVERY GAME unless: a) someone else does first, or b)my team hovers it simply because I know they're going to rage/troll even if they're last pick and won't get him. I think Yasuo was also the first champ I ever bought with literally ZERO intent to ever play simply so I COULD pick him for the toxic idiots that play him so I don't have to play against it.
D357R0Y3R (EUW)
: CertainlyT left league btw
> [{quoted}](name=D357R0Y3R,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hJmRBsZH,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-09-17T18:47:14.758+0000) > > This surprised me, I guess the boards will burst in joy until they remember that he wasn't responsible for {{champion:517}} {{champion:246}} {{champion:555}} {{champion:350}} {{champion:266}} {{champion:39}} {{champion:145}} > All of those champs COMBINED bother me less than {{champion:157}}
Anaphiel (NA)
: Exceedingly well put. Particularly point 4. Jungle is incredibly stressful right now. Low plat jungle player*(Hardstuck gold now. God I miss earlier seasons) Used to OTP Kayle in jungle (Thanks, Shakarez). You cant do that right now. Pressure is impossible to maintain on all but a small subset of the roster. Meta adherence is not simply suggested, but required. Other lanes have niche picks and off-meta picks that can function. Now even if I perform well I have to deaden my heart to my teams screams for aid and hope nobody starts to hard int. This game used to be about finding the champ you fit with, practicing like hell, and climbing while watching your mindset and having fun. Now it's about abusing the top of the garbage heap. Play one style or you are trolling. Dont punish hard inting. Give up after the early game. Flame anyone who had a bad start. This is a GAME. Where is the fun? Why is everyone SO angry now? Community has always had warts, but it wasnt nearly this bad before. Morello nerfed everything that moved, but shit got addressed eventually. This balance team is myopically obsessed with pro play and letting the playerbase burn and die. Now if you'll excuse me I'm gonna learn another role than jungle. This crap is too stressful right now.
> [{quoted}](name=Anaphiel,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3qTdcdXG,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-09-12T14:09:04.749+0000) > > This game used to be about finding the champ you fit with, practicing like hell, and climbing while watching your mindset and having fun. Now it's about abusing the top of the garbage heap. This is so painfully true. Riot needs to stop intentionally overbuffing certain champs. Anyone who says this game is currently "balanced" is insane.
: Kaisa is not an ADC, Pyke is not a support, and Jax is not a fighter
Who ISN'T an assassin currently? I feel like with the "LC$ Big plays" direction Riot has gone, there's only 2 classes of champions now: 1. Champions that have massive burst that can kill you quickly 2. Champions that are barely played
: who in their right minds would ever put on autofill as an option, they would either just pick their role or pick fill, nobody would voluntarily pick autofill
I mean, they could put it on a timer: Pick your two roles, after X time (let's say 3 minutes) you're prompted "Queue times seem long for your selected role, would you rather allow fill?" Y/N, if "Y" you're put fill and should get a game pretty quick, if "N", 3 more minutes, etc. I don't get why it's so hard to separate people that want to prioritize role vs. people that want to prioritize speed.
: There's generally not a good time to initiate with jump and if the enemy team is already low, it isn't really initiating at that point. That's clean up. Someone else has likely initiated and now Tristana is just doing what she does best; cleaning up. Second of all, if you're the one carrying, jumping head first into their team is still *never* a good plan. It isn't worth to give up extra shutdown gold to the enemy team just to kill their one fed person. Now you've given your gold to the fed person's allies, there by allowing them to come back. Third of all, if you acknowledge that my advice is good "rookie" advice, then isn't the advice you're giving to someone who is inquiring about champions they are unfamiliar with in order to best learn if they want to try them out(AKA, someone who is a rookie) really shitty advice? At the end of the day, no, you should not be "initiating" with her jump. You should be looking to clean up with it by waiting for a mage or tank or bruiser to start a fight off *first* and chunk people down. The reset on her jump is intended specifically as a clean up tool. Even the situation you used to try and justify her jumping in is a case of clean up and not a case of initiating. The best and safest way to play Tristana is not to get Lee Sin-drome and try to jump in for every low health individual because you can easily get yourself fucked and is instead to wait for a teammate who is better equipped for engages to start the fight off and then use your resets to reposition through out the majority of the teamfight. The risk vs reward aren't worth it, the risk being that you jump in and horrendously miscalculate(oh the enemy Janna still has Ult, the enemy Kayn was just on the otherside of the unwarded wall, the enemy Maokai was waiting on the flanks with their MF and just engaged on my team, meaning I don't currently have back up) and now die because you have a 22 second CD jump the you used to get in. The only reward is you might, sometimes, get it right and win a kill. Which is less likely, insurmountably, than the risk.
"Initiate" was the wrong word, as that implies "start", that's my bad. "Enter" would have been a better choice. That said, I still disagree, but YMMV. (Altho, to be fair, you should pretty much always "initiate" with E, since jump will add to the stacks there)
TehNACHO (NA)
: Again there's that realized damage statement. It's not theory that immobile ADCs do more damage because bla bla bla protect the puppy, it's real statistics of real games that really happened that say that immobile ADCs tend to outperform in real damage. You and Crescent have got it literally backwards; you are using conjecture to explain why these figures may not matter as much. And as I said with my last post, I'm perfectly willing to concede that particular point, but that wasn't the question this entire discussion. Look let me put it like this. If the question was "who's damage is more valuable in the LCS" or "Who's damage tends to translate well into kills or with safety or reliability", then that's where you and Crescent are entirely correct. However the statement that started this whole discussion is "Xayah, Caitlynn, Kai'sa should do considerably less damage than a Kogmaw, Twitch or Ashe, but they don't.", which is just factually not true.
I'm not sure with Ashe, but I would argue that Kogmaw (at least) has higher "real damage" because the only people that play him are either mains or people who are really comfortable with the team around them (and thus more likely to realize the damage Kog is capable of). I would actually argue part of why the higher mobility adcs are more popular is BECAUSE they can more easily flee from bad situations when they have no faith in their team. Which, to be fair, supports your point, but I'd say it puts many adcs in the "Yasuo" bucket of annoying the piss out of other people because they go beyond their role. If an "average" Kogmaw does 1.25x the damage of an "average" Kaisa, the Kaisa will annoy me more because I'll see 5x more of her and thus more likely remember the 1 "great" Kaisa that does more damage than the Kogmaw, and the other 4 are just generally more frustrating even if they do less damage overall.
: I do not suggest initiating with Tristana's jump. Its her only escape aside from her ult and is a long CD. She can initiate in lane where its a 1v1 or 2v2 or what have you with it because it slows. But in teamfights, her jumping in is just a dumb idea. What do you do now that you've jumped in, for example? You now have a 22 second CD, you're super squishy, and you're surrounded by their team. You die. That's what you do. That said, I agree with everything else you said.
> [{quoted}](name=OtterlyLost,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=oUAiiqrj,comment-id=000b0000,timestamp=2019-09-09T16:45:58.617+0000) > > I do not suggest initiating with Tristana's jump This is good "rookie" advice, but the jump is entirely situational. 1v1 you usually want the extra splash plus slow 2v2 if your support has solid protection or heals, you can wipe 3+ depends entirely on what's going on. If all their squishies are low (and they don't have good lockdown) then a well timed jump can get kills and the reset can get you out. If the enemies are fleeing, a good jump can get your team in position to wipe. If they've got one super carry and 4 noobs, sometimes it's totally worth the risk (even a suicide) if you kill that enemy carry. Of course ALL of those can go incredibly wrong, 1 or 2 cc abilities and you've just gifted a kill, miscalculate the damage, and you're int'ing. But it all depends. Keeping the jump for an escape is the "safe" play and is definitely the right advice to new players or else they're GOING to pick badly on when to initiate. But the damage+slow+reset (on kill) means in the long term you need to THINK about initiating with it, or you're hamstringing yourself.
Bevdog101 (OCE)
: What ADC's are perfect for teamfights?
Based on your two noted examples, I'm going to assume you mean "who can wreck many people in a blob"? In which case MF & Xayah are good picks. To the original question, it really should be EITHER "which adcs can really help the team" (in which case utility like Ashe is really good) or "which adcs NEED the team" (kog). To speak to the noted examples: {{champion:18}} - scales well and has a lot of safety, her ult has decent burst and peel for self or team. Jump is great initiate and escape, so you can ambush well or bait well too. {{champion:51}} - has excellent zone control. Range + traps mean you can control the field exceptionally. With good teamwork enemies get rolled. {{champion:110}}{{champion:202}} - Heavy poke, does well in a teamfight with ult and other kit items but easy to engage on if team doesn't help {{champion:15}} - Good mix of utility and harass, is a solid adc and tough to make irrelevant, but more of a "jack of all trades, master of none" option {{champion:81}} - Super versatile, master of annoyance. Global ult allows for plays all over and high mobility, but very skillshot reliant, so may be a problem if you're more familiar with typical adc gameplay. Also requires "unusual" (for adcs) builds that are usually broken or "blah", depending on Riot's mood this week.
TehNACHO (NA)
: You know what, I will give you all of this. You are right, having more damage is not a good justification for LCS competitiveness if it isn't reliable or bla bla bla. I don't know why you insist on making this topic about the LCS but whatever. Do you mind getting back onto the original discussion that mobile ADCs do in fact do considerably less damage than immobile ones? The more you type the more you are trying to change the subject, and now we're starting an argument over literally nothing only tangentially related to the original topic. EDIT: Also, Malzahar doesn't do that much damage.
The point he was making is that you can make a champ that does a billion dmg with all 4 of its abilities, but if it is melee with a move speed of 5, NO ONE is going to play it because you'll never realize that damage. Kog'maw is #1 for damage, but is rarely played because unless your team blocks well for you he's pretty easy to put way behind. I bet Twitch would also never see the field if you left everything else the same but tripled his damage and removed his invis.
Barkley (NA)
: You wanna hear a joke?
I think at this point you've gotta say Bjerg is not a good TEAM player. Bjerg is obviously skilled purely on the basis of skills, he may be the #1 mid in NA as people claim, but he's a bad teammate, he's too selfish. I assume they traded DLift/Bio for Sven/Mithy because they thought Bjerg would be happier/more comfortable with more Euros. If he's smart, he'll look inside and get out of his solo-q mindset.
: Life of a support "we need wards Taric"
That's just a bad match (enemy team with poke that respects wards, vs... whatever your team was). But mainly wanted to give props for the consistency of rocking the Taric icon. {{sticker:sg-kiko}}
Zullar (NA)
: A Solution...
A better solution is Riot should basically throw up a set of 50-75 champions each week and those are the champs that the pros can play this week, period, no discussion. Then pick/ban proceeds as normal. This would force diversity in picks because each week the options are different. And all the pros should be able to do this because they're supposedly the best at this game and are literally PAID to play it. And if you can't get "balanced" matches out of rotating limited champ pools that Riot selects, then the game is busted all to hell. If you want to make it really sassy, say the pool is always 75 champs and 5-10 of those champs are selected by the actual teams playing (each player can choose 1 champ they want in the pool, which would be +5 if complete overlap to +10 if all different). If players hold some really sneaky pocket picks, they can have those in play all the time and then bust it out when they really need it if it's not banned.
Bugog (NA)
: Are there some champions you just don't understand why they get chosen?
As others have said, {{champion:223}} & {{champion:43}} offer a lot of utility. They're good solo lane picks IF you're not expecting that laner to carry. (ie. if you have Jensen mid and Doublelift bot then putting impact on utility isn't a bad idea because you're not looking for him to kill a lot of people. Yes, you can argue that other champs offer OTHER utility ({{champion:41}} with split push and global damage for example), but it depends on what your team can best work with. TK for example is great for allowing your carry to go super aggro because you can rescue say an Akali who finds themselves outnumbered after diving for a kill, or subject to to CC dump. I also agree that W/L isn't as great at the pro level because lots of guys can have pocket picks that skew things. A champ could be 1-3 after one week of LCS, but the 1 could be godly on the champ. If all the other teams target ban that player after week 2, the champ will have negative winrate, but that one player is super strong on it. Granted, USUALLY these are more "oddball" picks like Aurelion Sol, but it can happen on semi-META champs. If I had to pick one champ, I'd pick NA Jayce. Memes aside, he seems relatively easy to shutdown early, and especially in the current META, that is super hard to recover from. He just seems to be "famine" WAY too often to be worth his "feast or famine" kit.
Barkley (NA)
: Just about had it with this wishy-washy TSM
Bjerg plays like he's in solo-q. They constantly lost at worlds because outside of NA there are strong TEAMS. In the 2017 iteration they literally got a 10k gold lead on SKT and then LOST because they were too tentative and couldn't team fight. Am I the only one that noticed that their ONE good fight in CG v TSM was when Bjerg got caught and focused down and then everyone else on TSM could blow up CG without worrying about him?
: Caster Bias on Full Display in Playoffs
I'd say the bit that BOTH supports and contradicts what you're saying was the premature call at the end of game 2. They basically called the game for CG when they took the first Nexus turret, but then had to backpedal when CG retreated as TSM was respawning. That was a missed call on their parts (albeit understandable) in favor of CG, but OTOH, the call was "where were you when CG went up 2-0 on TSM?" That's kinda condescending for the second game of #4 vs #5 series (not like TSM was #1 and CG #6 or something), especially after CG took game 1 without any major problems. I think the casters favor the big 4 (TSM, C9, TL & CLG) but that's more because those are the biggest brands and thus have the most fans. The fact that you got a strong "TSM" chant in game 3 despite a pretty pathetic game before the baron steal and bad games in all the other games of the series, tells you a lot about the audience/TSM fanbase.
Mr Tyson (NA)
: Its not necessarily about that. Jayce is a lane dominant champion. Teams can put large amounts of resources top lane, get kills/plate/deny exp and get big advantages. If the other team misplays around top, or fails to get an advantage in another part of the map, then there is a large discrepancy. One team is very far ahead and the other team got nothing during that time. That is how games can snowball uncontrollably. Its not that one team is less skilled than the other, its that one got advantages where the other didn't. And because they are skilled, they can choke them out of the game with little fallback for the other team. Think of a game of chess. You have 2 good players. They can have a game where each one takes pieces from the other and eventually one player gets an advantage and closes out the game. In another game, one player blunders early , and the other gets a strong advantage. At that point, the game just might be over, not because he is unskilled, but because one player has a strong advantage and knows how to close out the game. As players get better in skill, it becomes easier to close out games from advantages.
My OPINION, is that the current design leads to a bad game state, but that's just my personal opinion on the matter. What I'm trying to say with the original post is that it ALSO makes games feel "unfair" or radically uneven simply because the mechanics allow for one team to snowball out of control even at the highest level. People "feel" like the game is fair if you have a relatively even game, if you feel like you have as much chance of winning at minute 30 as you had at minute 1. (just to be realistic, let's say you have a window of maybe as much as 5 minutes at the end where you know the game is over it just takes that long to actually enact the finishing touches) I'm saying in a LARGE number of games, the game is basically over (due to enemy being able to snowball) really early AND the result of that is it FEELS like the game was badly matched in champ select (due to unbalanced player selection), but the fact may be that it was perfectly balanced at game start, but 1 or 2 mistakes put 1 or 2 players ahead and the game is deemed irrecoverable and AFTER the fact everyone thinks the player that made the mistakes sucks or was "boosted" or put on my team to "screw" me, but instead the enemy (who is of equal skill) was just able to snowball HARD due to game mechanics. Again, just to add my OPINION, I think it's bad design for someone to be able to snowball THAT hard and that easily in a team based **strategy** game. (I say that largely because my "default" mindset is a defensive one, it's why I like LATE game champs, but I rarely get to benefit from that because early game champs can snowball too easily)
: What if they took a page out of Blitz's? Something like "after x minutes (let's say 50), if the game is not over then both Nexi get up and duke it out in the middle of the map". That would put an hard cap on game length without having to make games this snowbally.
If eSports thinks game length is a problem, then should just match "regular" sports: Game time is X (let's say 45 mins). If you destroy Nexus before 45 mins, you win, period. If neither Nexus is destroyed by 45 mins, most inhibs wins. If score/inhibs are tied at 45 mins, sudden death (ie. play until one team takes an inhib)
Dynikus (NA)
: These were intentional changes to try to avoid the not-that-uncommon hour+ matches that most people hated.
Personally I considered 45 min (the length of the LONGEST Spring 2019 playoffs game) to be the minimum for a GOOD game (as a player, but I also didn't mind watching 45+ min games, your average football game is normally around 3 HOURS of broadcast time). If you think 40-45 mins should be the max (or is "too long") then Riot needs to make NB permanent for people like you.
Mr Tyson (NA)
: A key contributing factor is the skill increase of players. When a team has a gold lead, high skill teams won't allow the enemy back into the game whatsoever. That is Towers/Dragons/Barons. As one team gets an objective, that makes it even more difficult for the enemy to take an objective. Advantages snowball into further advantages. Strategy games tend to operate like this.
Playoffs is the top half of the league in terms of skill, you're talking 6 teams (aka literally just 30 players total). A disparity where one team is basically unable to take even a single turret shouldn't happen at that level in roughly 25% of your games. If you want to say the disparity between #1 and #10 (and you're still talking theoretically the top 50 players in the game) is such that #1 consistently smashes #10, then... ok I guess? But last spring had TWO games in the **semifinals** where the loser didn't take a single turret. And what I'm saying, is that if you're mid-low elo, with a bunch of randos on your team, you're gonna blame all of them for sucking when even at the highest level it's REALLY easy for a game to snowball out of control like that.
Rioter Comments
Nazgul10 (EUNE)
: > [{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vZEwcvEb,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-08-02T19:23:48.147+0000) > > This dramatic ass post lmao > > S9 balance hasn't been anywhere near as bad as some of the travesties of other seasons and you loved the game then, you've just worn out its novelty and the game has been solved so there's not much to do except either play the game the best way or hope Riot unsolves it in preseason Nah, the game will never fix itself unless Riot wakes up and makes URF or NB permanent, which are gamemodes people want.
> [{quoted}](name=Nazgul10,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vZEwcvEb,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2019-08-02T19:38:30.928+0000) > > Nah, the game will never fix itself unless Riot wakes up and makes URF or NB permanent, which are gamemodes people want. I actually 100% agree with this. Riot is balancing the game in a way that is attempting to appease players that love URF and players that DON'T like URF into playing the same game, and frankly that's a recipe for failure.
Slythion (NA)
: > I can't remember a time when there were this many HIGHLY upvoted threads concerning the piss poor state of the game. Dynamic Queue wasn't that long ago, was it?
> [{quoted}](name=Slythion,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vZEwcvEb,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-08-03T00:46:43.911+0000) > > Dynamic Queue wasn't that long ago, was it? Was originally agreeing with OP, but I gotta admit, yeah, DQ days were bad. (altho, TBF, if we're comparing current state to DQ days... that's a bad sign)
: Who are your top 2 champs per position? Please comment
Top: {{champion:78}} Jungle: {{champion:18}} Mid: {{champion:18}} ADC: {{champion:18}} Support: {{champion:37}} (I need to get in some Lulu reps, or just play {{champion:18}} )
: Bear in mind, this type of change would COMPLETELY scare off any players who actually care about teamwork because being a team player would no longer be a valuable skill in this game(since it can't really be measured by an automated system). So... say goodbye to anyone ever being willing to take the backseat for the team. Nope, that's now detrimental for you as a player. The meta would probably shift further towards damage, since it's hard to measure effectiveness of things outside of KDA. You think you'd prefer it. But I assure you... it wouldn't work out the way you're thinking. Not gonna waste much time trying to convince you though. Just... it wouldn't work.
If... IF, I honestly believed NA solo-q had good teamwork even 50% of the time I'd agree with you, but definitely in lower elo you're talking 10% at BEST. I've long thought the ladder should be solo points to get to either Gold or Plat and then team based from then on. But at bare minimum, below plat it's all fiesta as far as teamwork goes. And a few seasons ago, that was WELL ESTABLISHED, the standard advice was (is?) "turn off your chat, git gud and HARD CARRY", so clearly at least 85% of the playerbase (all ranked players below plat) either don't care about teamwork, or absolutely, positively, frustratingly SUCK AT IT. It should also be noted, that Riot has slowly been killing "teamwork" THEMSELVES, just by other means, namely: hard nerfing vision, all but removing tanks (a team oriented class), nerfing most utility supports, etc.; the game as it exists right now is mainly: 1v1 top lane, explosive junglers, explosive burst mids, insane damage bot-laner and burst mage supports, it's all predicated on how quickly can you get 1 or more guy snowballing. Which is the biggest issue people have had with the game lately, it's not "how can I help my TEAM win" it's "who's going to make their team LOSE". EDIT: also, it'd be fairly easy to do a "hybrid" approach, something like: 20 LP is the "base" gain, you get +/-10 for a Win/Loss, and then anywhere from -15 to +15 points for personal performance (the extra 5 pt swing being extreme performance ie: troll level bad or smurf level good, so in a "normal" game it's a -10 to +10 range) Then, if you play well, but the team loses, maybe you get -10 pts (for loss) and +8 (for skill) and only see a net loss of -2 LP, then you have a win where you play well maybe account for +17, and a game you win but you suck maybe only giving +5, etc.
: I love how you think a performance based rank system would make things LESS toxic. As people start intentionally prolonging games to get a better KDA, throwing teammates under the bus because losing a game is now a BETTER outcome for you personally than having bad stats, etc. If you think people wouldn't learn how to game the system to get points without needing to care about winning within a week, you know nothing about people.
I for one would VASTLY prefer this, considering: a) Trolls no longer affect my rank b) dc/afk no longer affect my rank c) Smurfs who are not IN MY LANE have minimal impact on my rank d) Players might not always give up at 10 - 15 mins (yeah, they don't always get the SURRENDER that they want, but they give up) e) Autofill is less of a factor And most importantly, because people have been throwing this idiotic canard out for YEARS f) **Ranked games are ALREADY full of morons that don't care about objectives or the win and chase KDA ANYWAY**
Pxerkza (EUNE)
: yeah difficulty of destroying a turret and difficulty of diving a person under the turret are completely separate things your comment is full of ignorance
TBF, ALL damage has scaled up. Thus, diving under turrets IS easier than it was back in the day. It doesn't matter that towers go from hitting for 150 vs 100 when champs asspound you for 1000. The success case for a turret dive is basically "can I kill you in 1 or less turret shots". The FACT that this is a possibility in more than just 6 item late game is the main issue.
D357R0Y3R (EUW)
: No ADC is building armor penetration, why is this not talked about?
Riot decided "slow" games are boring to watch, ergo ALL damage is insanely high and tanks are basically useless. So, everyone just plays damage dealers and viola: Team Deathmatch League style. Take a look at the guys you linked, quick glance at Rekkles games says yeah, he ain't building armor pen, but guess what he ain't seeing AGAINST himself: Armor. If no one is building armor, then why the hell would you waste money on Armor Pen?
: > [{quoted}](name=Zardo,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wJ0ZEAQW,comment-id=000a0000,timestamp=2019-07-04T23:00:22.924+0000) > > She's not. Unless she has a team comp that supports her any assassin can blow her up right now. I mean for the amount of safety she has, she does way too much damage.
Her mobility is garbage, if you have a gap closer, she's meat.
FkValeRly (EUW)
: yes lets enforce flaming the shit out of someone so they afk :)
People keep saying this, considering the ridiculous level of toxicity we already have, who are the wilting flowers that'd fold under flaming at this point? To be honest, I dig in harder and think "ok, we're all going to hell together" when I get heavy flamed or people making whining dumbass comments. If you're mouthing off 5 mins in I'm gonna vote no on all your surrender requests simply because you clearly need the practice.
: Here is why NA PRO teams struggle against EU teams despite playing better than usual
The main problem is that EVERYONE will tel you that NA solo-q is garbage. That's known and I'm sure there are several reasons for it, but it means our "farm system" is just awful. (as proven by the age of our best team vs all the other top regions) I think in "original" league, NA is better or at least on par with EU, altho worse than Korea and probably China. In "Team Deathmatch League", (that Riot seems to be aiming for now) NA is worse than EU. Where we'd stand vs Korea & China is questionable if we stabilize. I think China will likely be better than us for a variety of reasons and Korea would POSSIBLY be like EU was IF we get over our fear of them. We did badly against Korea at MSI because we wanted to play the Korean style and they're better at it than us. But it'll be interesting to see which playerbases abandon the game first. Right now it looks like NA will be the leader on that, but if the game keeps in this direction Korea could run for the door also.
: The state of NA at Rift Rivals
It's funny, because coming out of MSI people thought that G2 >>>> EU and the NA teams were more "clumped". Rift Rivals shows that at least in international play its the other way around. That said, my one takeaway from this is that had MSI been on this patch Liquid wouldn't have lost to G2 AS badly as they did. (altho either team MIGHT have been eliminated before Finals anyway) I'm not sure about other champs, but Sylas was CLEARLY broken on the MSI patch and Caps was just way too good on that champ on that patch. Or else, we can say Liquid lost at MSI, BUT they also clearly either learned a LOT or else just got a lot of personal instruction from Steve about hitting skillshots. {{sticker:sg-miss-fortune}}
Moody P (NA)
: bro just be fine with mages top clicking you for free damage like Neeko and if you ever try to play aggressively you get snare locked and murdered, just be fine with that just fucking lol at bringing up ADC patch when they were the only class who has NEVER had serious competition in their lane and that shift only lasted for all of like 3 patches before we were back to marksmen being the 99% pick rate bot class
> [{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EjFrjOEw,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-06-27T16:13:43.917+0000) > > that shift only lasted for all of like 3 patches before we were back to marksmen being the 99% pick rate bot class Marksmen are 99% pick because of comfort. Or did you not see how common Sona/Taric is in pro play and Perkz wrecking shop at Rift Rivals. Hell, EU in general is doing all sorts of rando and trashing NA's "META comps".
: > [{quoted}](name=HeeroTX,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=61dMmfLU,comment-id=0002000000010001,timestamp=2019-06-20T20:45:56.048+0000) > > I'd agree, but Yasuo only has 5 skins, if that was the REAL job, they should've made the same champ but given her boobs, THEN they'd sell a ton of skins. That said, Yasuo is the DUMBEST champion for one reason: > I used to ban this champ all the time because either the opponent would be too strong on him OR banning Yasuo makes the player that wanted to play him tilt all to hell and it's "easy win", because all the weeb edgelords go nuts if they can't play fake kenshin. The big problem is when the weeblords are on my team, because if your ally hovers Yasuo you're 90% boned. If he's banned you get exactly what I just detailed. If he's NOT banned, either the enemy team gets him and smashes you or your Yasuo player is somehow a moron that is gonna feed 5 kils and then afk/ragequit because his Naruto fantasy isn't happening. And god help you if your own team bans Yasuo when the edgelord wants to play him (whether they hover it or not) APPARENTLY, that's Kai'sa's job. Seriously look at this whores release date and the amount of skins she has now.
> [{quoted}](name=TengenToppaGnar,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=61dMmfLU,comment-id=00020000000100010000,timestamp=2019-06-21T03:57:34.894+0000) > > APPARENTLY, that's Kai'sa's job. Seriously look at this whores release date and the amount of skins she has now. Nah, Kai'sa is new so she doesn't have a lot of skins (and one of hers is a Team skin, so ... not really applicable IMO). She needs time to prove she's at all like: {{champion:103}} {{champion:84}} {{champion:99}} {{champion:55}}
abca98 (EUW)
: Yeah but his champs sell skins, which is his actual job.
> [{quoted}](name=abca98,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=61dMmfLU,comment-id=000200000001,timestamp=2019-06-20T19:46:02.783+0000) > > Yeah but his champs sell skins, which is his actual job. I'd agree, but Yasuo only has 5 skins, if that was the REAL job, they should've made the same champ but given her boobs, THEN they'd sell a ton of skins. That said, Yasuo is the DUMBEST champion for one reason: I used to ban this champ all the time because either the opponent would be too strong on him OR banning Yasuo makes the player that wanted to play him tilt all to hell and it's "easy win", because all the weeb edgelords go nuts if they can't play fake kenshin. The big problem is when the weeblords are on my team, because if your ally hovers Yasuo you're 90% boned. If he's banned you get exactly what I just detailed. If he's NOT banned, either the enemy team gets him and smashes you or your Yasuo player is somehow a moron that is gonna feed 5 kils and then afk/ragequit because his Naruto fantasy isn't happening. And god help you if your own team bans Yasuo when the edgelord wants to play him (whether they hover it or not)
: Fix your matchmaking
I wanna agree, but blame smurfs. Sometimes you'll get that lvl 40, 0 mastery pt player that hits all their skill shots and has immaculate rotations. I think Riot's matchmaking is garbage, but a decent chunk of it is all the high elo a-holes that wanna noobstomp.
: I like getting slammed with ? pings after a fight I spent running for my life since my team forgot I existed. FeelsGoodMan
What do you mean, all your frontliners ALMOST had that Singed. If only you hadn't died so fast to the Vayne+Akali+Lux combo that flanked through the jungle, they TOTALLY would've caught that guy.
Kai Guy (NA)
: Am I wrong in my opinion that Que times are what ultimately killed Teambuilder?
No, but you WOULD be wrong if you think TeamBuilder players hated the queue times. (TeamBuilder fan that didn't mind the long waits)
: I think a different solution could work better. Turrets would get a protective aura. While under turret you would get a shield, or massive healing so you can farm under turret even against hard counter, and become harder to dive. People would be less punished for being unlucky, and get countered, and laners wouldn't dependent on jungler that much.
> [{quoted}](name=The Kombinator,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=O1yfm10x,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2019-06-12T10:35:58.223+0000) > > I think a different solution could work better. > > Turrets would get a protective aura. While under turret you would get a shield Interestingly, turrets USED to do this, and I agree that they should do so again. At minimum, I think turrets should provide a shield for allied champions while plates are there.
Jamaree (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=QuadraBananas,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UB0b3oUL,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-06-12T01:45:47.886+0000) > > i think most people prefer fairer game, but the reason why they give more priority to faster queue time is high elo. > if we made it more fair and longer queue time, diamond would have to wait 1 hour per game just to have someone decline match and wait another 30 min. > > i think, we should have more fair for lower elo and faster for higher elo. > im sure riot could make it happen Back when there was no autofill, but after rank selection, streamers got hour long waits.
Agreed, but that's an easy fix: Once you get to low Plat(?) (pick an elo I don't care) all the non-Fill options are disabled. So basically once you pass Gold you can't Role select anymore. I thought upper elo is where you're supposed to coordinate more anyway.
ApexRiven (EUW)
: I tihnk i may quite playing toplane honesly. This role suck
> [{quoted}](name=ApexRiven,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yrqBgA0c,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-06-04T16:52:15.140+0000) > > Everygame is same. My botlane go 0/10 at 7 mn 2 v2 while me getting camp by enemy jgl over and over... Seriously how am i suppose to play game and have fun if im getting gank every 30 seconde, My jgl is afk farm and still down in cs compare to enemy jgl how never left topside, My midlaner is dying over and over sol to yasuo and so on ... I main botlane, I have the EXACT SAME EXPERIENCE except change "botlane" to "toplane" (and obviously 2v2 to 1v1). The problem is matchmaking is garbage. Last night was the first time in a very long time that I was most likely the worst player on my team and we lost. Usually if I'm worst I can make myself light enough to be carried, but if I'm BEST on my team, we're screwed because at least 2 if not 3 of my teammates are hot garbage, if not straight trolls.
: Some things. 1. Would you rather have a long boring game with 1 memorable moment or a less boring game with no memorable moments because they're all pretty good. 2. Two things I see right now. A. The game is a bit too snowbally. B I think the next team fight wins it stage does indeed come a bit too soon for my tastes. 3. C9 took 35.25, TL 29.26, CLG 31.55 Optic took 38.49 GG, 28.31 So even though the average was 32 somewhere, the more competitive games took longer. Is the problem the meta itself or that some of the teams, particularly Fox and 100t looked terrible day 1? It did not help things that the marquis matchup, TL vs TSM completely disappointed and didn't turn out to be the rock em sock em robots match from a competitive standpoint it was billed to be. TL dumpstered them. 4. Oh and it's only one day. 5. Let me get this straight. Let us just back up a bit. I seriously need some clarification. You think Titanic was a good movie? :)
> [{quoted}](name=BigBellBrute,realm=NA,application-id=9hBQwnEU,discussion-id=ylWEByMr,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-06-02T18:22:39.949+0000) > > Some things. > 1. Would you rather have a long boring game with 1 memorable moment or a less boring game with no memorable moments because they're all pretty good. This is basically asking which is better: Basketball or Soccer? One has scoring fast and furious all game long and the other has probing and feints, looking for weaknesses to exploit capped with a sudden burst for a score. I know people that hate soccer because it is "boring" and I know people that think it's worthless to watch more than the last 2 minutes of any basketball game because the prior 38 don't really matter. NEITHER of those views is accurate (IMO) and both display that non-fans simply aren't going to bother to build an appreciation for the game on their own. When League is at it's BEST, I feel like a viewer SHOULD be able to appreciate a highlight play and/or the chess-match of strengths against weaknesses. I feel like the current META removes the latter.
: Pretty much never beause 1. Big play lcs 2. Korea and China like it
I can buy that China loves it, but does Korea really? I dunno, maybe the rando, PC bang crowd does, maybe, but Korea's pro decline is pretty much directly correlated to the "Big play LCS" shift. (largely because Korea pioneered the "well-informed, methodical play" style)
: I still feel like waiting 20-60 minutes you'd hit the point where you'd be waiting and just give up and go do something else and not come back. Maybe you just love LoL so much that you wouldn't hit this point... but few others would be standing there with you. Even a lot of pros go play on smurfs when queue times cross 10 minutes just 'cause they'd rather not wait, even if it increases the quality of the game.
NUMEROUS people have made posts requesting the ability to toggle autofill on/off. It seems pretty simple to get the ACTUAL numbers on this, just put in that feature and bam you can clearly see in black and white how many people prioritize what.
Acekill3r (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=HeeroTX,realm=NA,application-id=9hBQwnEU,discussion-id=XNNkQNQL,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-05-19T23:02:46.986+0000) > > I'm proud, but also devastated. I think in the BROAD scheme, Liquid did a great service to the LCS and frankly gave back hope to the region. But in the micro, losing to G2 in the Finals hurts, a LOT, and almost certainly BECAUSE Liquid gave our hope back. I was thinking after the IG win, that this result would be the most painful possible. Had we lost to IG, it would've been "expected" and we'd have been numb to it. But beating them showed what we can do at our absolute best and what we are and should be capable of. I was thinking if SKT got thru and beat us, that loss would sting, but mentally I think NA has conceded defeat to Korea. I hope we win MSI and/or World over them one day, but for now I think most have thought Korea is just better at League than us. But Europe? No matter what the stats and results say, I don't think we want to accept that Europe really is BETTER than NA. MAybe they've beaten us, but we can and will beat them. > > Hopefully this lights a fire for Worlds. I'd love to see NA stomp into World looking to prove NA > EU because while we can make a mound of excuses for why Asian teams have beaten us in the past, damned if we're gonna let the Euros show us up. Congrats to G2, but this one hurts, a LOT. Ok this is fine but one thing I bothers me, you can't let emotions blind you that much, G2 had the best players with the best gameplay performing very good with working pocket picks in every role.. Mmmm, it was kinda expected they would win. Still well played NA, you impressed me and stepped up a lot!
G2 earned their win. They DID have better players, made better plays and were expected to win. But EU v NA is probably the ONLY "Rift Rivalry" where the fans actually CARE. When Korea was the undisputed top of League and LPL was generally viewed as the 2nd and EU v. NA was a fight for third, our regions still CARED which of us was that third. At MSI EU was seen as a possible 2nd and NA was viewed as a clear 4th if not worse, and STILL we wanted to beat EU and split games in the Group stage. I say this NOT out of disrespect for G2 the team, but out of huge respect for the EU v. NA rivalry. Had Liquid lost to IG, NA might've moved towards viewing LoL like the World Cup. An impressive competition which we simply don't care about enough to feel any real passion for. But beating IG reminded us that we can compete at this game, and knowing that, we WANT to beat our rival. And in the LONG term, I think that that's for the best.
GForce9x (NA)
: It was rather disappointing considering how intense both semi-final matches were. G2 essentially did to TL what TL did to IG - shut down their win condition. TL knew that IG's win condition was through mid so they put their focus on trying to shut down Rookie or at least keeping him contained. TL's win condition is primarily through bot lane (not that Jensen isn't capable of carrying, but TL has a hard time winning games when DoubleLift is a non-factor), so G2 focused them hard.
I agree with this. In the end, looking at bans, TL targeted Caps (for good reason) and G2 targeted CoreJJ. (Basically BOTH teams targeted the best player on the other team) The general "net" effect being TL contained 1 guy for two games (they let Caps get Sylas in Game 2 trying to keep Rakan from Mikyx, and gg) and G2 contained 2 guys (since if they mash down CoreJJ, then DL can't really do much either, which isn't to say DL played well, just mathematically it works out better for G2). I think this META just works really well for G2's lineup since Caps clearly likes to play an aggressive style.
: I am A Very Proud NA Fan
I'm proud, but also devastated. I think in the BROAD scheme, Liquid did a great service to the LCS and frankly gave back hope to the region. But in the micro, losing to G2 in the Finals hurts, a LOT, and almost certainly BECAUSE Liquid gave our hope back. I was thinking after the IG win, that this result would be the most painful possible. Had we lost to IG, it would've been "expected" and we'd have been numb to it. But beating them showed what we can do at our absolute best and what we are and should be capable of. I was thinking if SKT got thru and beat us, that loss would sting, but mentally I think NA has conceded defeat to Korea. I hope we win MSI and/or World over them one day, but for now I think most have thought Korea is just better at League than us. But Europe? No matter what the stats and results say, I don't think we want to accept that Europe really is BETTER than NA. MAybe they've beaten us, but we can and will beat them. Hopefully this lights a fire for Worlds. I'd love to see NA stomp into World looking to prove NA > EU because while we can make a mound of excuses for why Asian teams have beaten us in the past, damned if we're gonna let the Euros show us up. Congrats to G2, but this one hurts, a LOT.
: Screw history! Screw narratives!
I admit, I didn't believe. I expected the loss and am THRILLED to be wrong. That said, I've also thought for years that we (as a region) suck at Bo1s and had a much better chance at Bo5s. I don't know what it is, I assume our teams don't wanna spend days researching the other teams before the tourney starts. We generally adjust well, but we come in bad so now that we can adjust to things in-game, that's working!
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HeeroTX

Level 122 (NA)
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