: Yes yes yes, would give a better reason to augment it sooner if playing against an assassin.
A tactical decision? I love it!
Wuks (NA)
: How many Boards posts do you have?
>Hey IcyPepper, you have a total of 14374 posts on the North American League of Legends Boards! Boy, I sure post too much.
: Ask me to make a concept
Can you make a concept, please?
Krotux (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=SatomiKun,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=5uGfkW50,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2018-07-15T23:27:33.300+0000) > > Aftershock is that basically... aftershock does damage...and requires you to immobi..not all champs have cc btw
Tanks generally have cc. If you're referring to juggernauts, wouldn't they prefer Grasp or an offensive keystone if they have no crowd control?
SatomiKun (EUW)
: Yes, your top lane has the advantage of being 2v1, meanwhile your own bot laner has the disadvantage of being 1v2. Result: you completely ruin the game experience of 2 players, one of your team and one of the enemy team. It sucks for both sides. It's not about ADCs, hell, ADCs aren't even a thing anymore. You are just creating 2 lanes with extremely high snowball potential. So if your bot laner keeps dying and dying, feeding the enemy beyond earth, you better don't dare to blame him.
Or you could just communicate, you know? Or grab a premade so the 1v2 laner is using a champion that can play relatively safe and the duo are a highly aggressive and/or roaming lane? I'm getting the vibe that you want to strictly enforce a meta, which I get. It's fine if that's your opinion, it's just that mine is that we should be able to be a little more strategically flexible with our team compositions and lane strategy. It doesn't necessarily mean it has to ruin someone's game: you kind of forgot that lane swaps *do* exist if the enemy team is willing to adapt to the situation (and if they're not, do they really deserve to win?)
: Bot lane is starting to replace heal by teleport
Well, considering how long heal has been mandatory... it's nice to have options?
: Don't tell internet people to "go to bed."
I don't know, when I'm rambling about conspiracy theories and the intricacies and origins of the English Lexicon, I *need* someone to tell me to go to bed at that point.
: >15k vs 17k jee i dont know maybe thats because i was forced to go defensive while ALSO being a control mage. >More kp. Wow surprise there ?I was forced to play safe in fear of getting fucking blasted by a duskblade user. Actually just looked it back up, 5k 7a vs 7k 5a ***MORE KP ECKSDEEEEEEEEEEE*** Right because he's so easy to kill when he rushes hexdrinker duskblade. Your bias is showing
>Right because he's so easy to kill when he rushes hexdrinker duskblade. {{item:3147}} has no defensive stats... You sure your bias isn't showing?
: > [{quoted}](name=Wolf and Gun,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VKTBGH4u,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2018-07-14T19:47:19.365+0000) > > I'd love to separate the idea of support belonging to ADC's. > > Supports should be free to choose who they support. Actually you could that in a normal game. But the ADC is going to be alone vs 2 on bot lane. And probably you are going to be reported for trolling
>But the ADC is going to be alone vs 2 on bot lane Yet, by that logic, shouldn't top lane have the advantage of being the 2v1 then? >but the ADC Or is this what you're really talking about? That the support role *has to* revolve around ADC's.
saltran (EUW)
: Just bring the toplaner to bot replacing the adc.
Why tho. Get an early tower then swap to bot for dragon?
: *That's exactly my point* Pyke was made to be a support, and that's why they were able to load him up with more utility in exchange for less damage. You can't do that with a true solo lane assassin.
I don't think OP is suggesting we give assassins lots of CC. That'd be a nightmare! D: Rather, I don't think OP mentioned Pyke's crowd control at all.
: Most assassins don't come with a bunch of CC. If you tried to make an actual solo lane assassin with the kind of kit Pyke has, they would be horribly unbalanced.
I think OP's point is that Pyke isn't like most assassins ;) but he is very much so still an assassin
: Okay, so what about teleport, shen and TF ult?
Do those abilities *move* you by any chance? They must have something in common.
: so i can disrupt some channels but not other channels.
Funny thing: root disrupts *movement* which some abilities have. Kind of like how Teemo's blind will keep you from landing autoattacks, but you can still cast spells. Bonus info: Soraka's E can cause a headache for Riven players as both versions counter her Q and E: can't cast during the silence, and you can't move during the root.
: Dude, no amount of adapting will change cold hard facts. MR and Armor are useless on ADCs; they do not scale well with it, they do not passively gain a large amount if it throughout the game, and they're so squishy that a tiny amount against two mages isn't going to help. I know because I built Merc treads first item against a double mage bot lane and was still getting shoved and poked out and eventually died. It doesn't matter either if you're getting zoned off CS; you're wasting what little gold you're getting on a defensive item that *will not matter*. You're clearly some idiot who doesn't play ADC or Marksmen and are trying to tell people how to build a class of champions they know more about than you.
What. >I know because I built Merc treads first item against a double mage bot lane and was still getting shoved and poked out and eventually died. Yes because 25 MR is enough to counter two mages and thus proves that all resists on marksman is useless? People don't always build a defensive item to "scale," that's not the point of defense: you buy some defense to *survive.* You aren't presenting facts, you're presenting an anecdote to support a broad complaint because you want certain annoying champions to be nerfed instead of examining your own play. Yes, hard carry champions tend to build glass cannon, but even they have some defensive builds they dip into if necessary. Besides, you can always buy some lifesteal if you intend on being aggressive in return... {{item:3072}} against squishies or {{item:3153}} against bruisers can go a long way... not to mention in your game https://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/2823194147/228066420?tab=overview I'm pretty sure their armor+AP items helped secure their lead. Honestly, I'd chock that game up to a bad match-up and team comp more than what you're talking about. Building crit ADC Jinx on a team with only Garen as a frontline against the likes of Mundo where you *know* you're going to need {{item:3123}} is just not a good situation for you. Move on, dude. Focus on the mistakes you've made and stop worrying about a few bad match-ups. It's a waste of energy when you can improve.
: Genuine question for the champ designers, don't worry it's not mean.
>people complain about lulu because of this reason, yet she's remained in pro play for quite some time. Pros have to play to win since it's their job. If a champion is unhealthy but strong, they might use it in order to win. Not bashing you or pros, just pointing out that pro play does not always mean the champion is healthy.
Ralanr (NA)
: Yes. I know. And I know health stacking is a lot weaker than it used to be. You’re not going to ever outright counter it. All you can do is reduce it.
>You’re not going to ever outright **conquer** it. Someone had to do it.
Leyruh (EUW)
: Even though I sided with God-King Darius, I'm gonna upvote this one. Your argument for siding with God-Kind Garen is just too cute. I'm weak to cute stuff. {{sticker:sg-janna}}
{{sticker:sg-soraka}} I respect you God-King Darius followers. You are stronger people than I.
Akumu (NA)
: Ya except hes talking about a keystone that no one uses anymore and Duskblade which was nerfed since the time that thread was made.
And? That was the context before. Doesn't change what your thread in the past.
Madsin25 (NA)
: Wow that is a depressing read. Time to just quit league I guess. Riot is ignoring the situation because in their mind there isn't one.
I take it you didn't even read the Rioter's post? >I think upfront burst can be problematic in our game currently (Dark Harvest in tandem with Duskblade feels ridiculous to play against), but don't think either example here is sufficient to prove your argument. A Rioter said that. That upfront burst was a problem. A Rioter.
Akumu (NA)
: Deleting this because its derailing the discussion. You're arguing about Diana as a champion and what she may or may not have done in the clip but thats not the topic at hand. I stand by my comments and believe its utterly absurd that a champion can point and click gap close you while; ignoring their own reset mechanics, being behind in gold, not landing their full combo, not even using {{summoner:14}} and still instantly kill you through {{summoner:21}} with no ability to react. Which is basically the situation that the Rioter said was working as intended. I shouldnt have to build defensive items to avoid getting killed within a single second to champions with 1 item or 2 items, particularly when they dont even land a full combo, arent even 'assassins' AND i have barrier. Not to mention that even WITH defensive itemzation, particularly the meager ones available to Mages, you'll probably still get one shot anyway. That is completely counter to Riots explanation of counterplay and is by definition 'losing to the first punch' which as they say themselves its not fun. The point of my post was to highlight that Riot appears to want damage to be absurdly high despite it completely undermining their own design values, specifically that of counterplay.
Dude, if you facetank Vi's entire combo without armor you're going to take damage. I read the Rioter's response, you are taking their comments out of context and deliberately leaving information out to mislead us. I don't agree with the current state of the game, but this isn't the way to do this. >He also tells me that AP items on Diana are 'useless in any teamfight' and I just need to 'adjust my positioning' Agiainst a champion with an 800 range gap closer when i was 4-0-1 and killed him in lane multiple times. QRR isn't "one-shot" and you had no MR Like, the rioter even said >When you're playing squishy artillery mages, you are vulnerable to assassin burst patterns and need to adjust your positioning accordingly :). Not a problem with that statement... if you want to complain about Diana's range, then that's another issue entirely. >I think upfront burst can be problematic in our game currently (Dark Harvest in tandem with Duskblade feels ridiculous to play against), but don't think either example here is sufficient to prove your argument. Here even the Rioter is saying that he thinks there's a problem but your examples weren't really all that good.
: Why did he say sorry ?
Pessimistic: he was appealing to your better nature to avoid getting reported but didn't actually feel sorry Optimistic: he legitimately has some self-control issues he's working on and apologizing is one of the first steps he's taking to take accountability for it I honestly do not know, but good on you for staying positive
WarWork (NA)
: Can the Ascended reproduce?
Maybe? The offspring would likely be mortal, though, otherwise there'd be a potential overpopulation problem given a couple thousand years. Maybe this is why the Void exists....
: > [{quoted}](name=IcyPepper,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Eef4XUR0,comment-id=000100010000,timestamp=2018-07-08T22:07:11.755+0000) > > How long was the game? What was Darius's KDA? There's a lot of variables here and the only ones we have is the screenshot and what OP has told us in the title. I posted a screenshot of the post game info a few replies up
Pfft you were too fast. I deleted because I realized that just now, but didn't realize you already responded >.> But I stand corrected. He was fed, but not *that* fed. How did he do so much damage? Conqueror is really something....
: Montage of ADCs not using Heal. I'm a salty-support lol
That's when you roam and help other lanes.
: Replying to feedback with replies on a forum =/= giving the players what they ask for in game. E.g. people have been asking for tower buffs for some time, riot does not listen and keeps them weak.
I thought the title of the thread was "Riot isn't responding at all to player feedback," not "Riot isn't giving players what they want." While they do have serious flaws in their balancing measures, not all player suggestions are going to work right off the bat. Things like "nerf damage by 10% across the board!" and "nerf this class of champions!" or even "make URF permanent!" does not always work in a vacuum. Too fast changes (which some players suggest) can cause a lot of chaos and disgruntle players. Look at bot lane right now: people have been wanting ADCs to not be mandatory for *years* and look what happened in one patch. Imagine if they buffed towers and went too far: siege champions and those who excel at taking objectives would become dominant (possibly). Then they would have to nerf towers, buff them again if they're too weak, and become a pendulum of balance if they gave in too quickly to player demand. I'd rather the company be transparent in their decisions (which they could use more of, tbh) than to give into player demand because we're not a hive-minded entity, we're a bunch of people with different opinions. It'd be stupid of Riot to completely ignore us, but they don't. Not completely.
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=IcyPepper,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=H8LWQ6Yu,comment-id=001e,timestamp=2018-07-08T18:43:06.122+0000) > > That's the problem. You assume that only **one** class should be able to bot lane. Most picks in bot lane are still marksman, and some of us are kinda happy they have a wee bit of competition now. Things could be changed for the better (marksman being changed to solo lane more often, for one), but equating "bot=ADC" and having mandatory marksman for each game was a bit tiresome after so many years save for a few niche picks. > > But that data shows that marksman are still relatively dominant and succeeding in bot lane. It's a little tiresome to hear people complain about bot lane not being 100% marksman when it's still about 80% marksman and that the meta is ruined. If you have statistics that show that marksman are not picked most of the time bot lane, by all means go ahead and link the source because I'm seeing that Vlad https://champion.gg/champion/Vladimir/ADC has a 47.56% winrate in Plat+ bot lane with a 2.23% pick rate. Yes, bot lane is ruined and Vlad is steamrolling marksman. I'm gonna concede this point since it was my most flawed "argument". I'm gonna try and restructure what I meant. It's not that ADC's are useless, the are just less favorable due to the game currently being very geared towards early game snowballing, something that bruisers are superior at when you compare them to ADC's as they are simply "safer picks" in that regard. A bruiser can snowball and give out roughly the same damage output without running the risk of getting one-shot by every assassin in the game. I hope this explains better as to why I think ADC's are in a pretty bad spot right now.
: > [{quoted}](name=Davaken,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=H8LWQ6Yu,comment-id=0013,timestamp=2018-07-08T16:28:03.588+0000) > > Can we stop pretending that adcs are unplayable? Take any look at any stats website or any high elo streamer/pro game and you will quickly learn that this is completely untrue. Not unplayable, just unfavorable in the current meta compared to a lot of other picks. Jungle Bard is still "playable" but that does not mean its favorable, get what I mean?
Dude, your Vlad example was terrible https://champion.gg/champion/Vladimir/ADC Vlad is struggling in bot lane and not even all that popular...
: Is League even fun anymore? The current Meta and general state of the game is downright awful
>Toplane: Just cheese your way to victory and generally do nothing until the 20 minute mark at which point you will either push through top cause the enemy laner ran down mid/bot, or you will run down mid/bot yourself. >Midlane: Only characters with massive burst or high mobility allowed, preferably both. If you have neither then what the fuck are you even doing, get out. >Jungle: Unless you can out-duel the damage output of an assassin (AKA, characters that will now one-shot you at level 4) you might as well go afk cause you will lose every single scuttle which will snowball into the enemy jungler dominating the map and your team will flame you into oblivion. >ADC That's the problem. You assume that only **one** class should be able to bot lane. Most picks in bot lane are still marksman, and some of us are kinda happy they have a wee bit of competition now. Things could be changed for the better (marksman being changed to solo lane more often, for one), but equating "bot=ADC" and having mandatory marksman for each game was a bit tiresome after so many years save for a few niche picks. But that data shows that marksman are still relatively dominant and succeeding in bot lane. It's a little tiresome to hear people complain about bot lane not being 100% marksman when it's still about 80% marksman and that the meta is ruined. If you have statistics that show that marksman are not picked most of the time bot lane, by all means go ahead and link the source because I'm seeing that Vlad https://champion.gg/champion/Vladimir/ADC has a 47.56% winrate in Plat+ bot lane with a 2.23% pick rate. Yes, bot lane is ruined and Vlad is steamrolling marksman.
: Someone sitting near me was on Tinder during the movie in the theater
Well, generally you're supposed to meet your date *before* the movie but you do you I guess.
: Why were crit adcs nerfed and not kayle?
Why can't I eat orange peels but apples are fine?
: My predictions for Season 15...
: Riot: well, you've been a nice little boy, after this next game if you're good we'll up your honor! Player: "Hey ez, can you please ward that bush, my trinket is down" Riot: WOW, EZ? you truely aren't ready according to our autofilters, we'll have to hold you in your current honor for another 3 months. ~~god I hope that's not accurate~~
Probably not. The bot thingy detects strings I believe, although I do not have a source other than hearing from Rito that it detects context or some shit. I'm not 100% certain, but "ez" is not going to trip any alarms. Maybe "gg ez" in all chat, but even then you can tell your team privately "this is going to be ez" or some shit I guess. ANd then there's games where you have an Ezreal and everyone says "gg ez" because we're all nerds and that's still hilarious to this day and age.
: So my URF teammate asked me to swap and take his Soraka, and I agreed...
: How to check if your coke is real and not baking soda
For a moment I thought you were talking about Cola and wondering how the hell you would mix up pop and baking soda together...
Relaxxd (NA)
: [EXPOSED] Hidden secret on how to get your support to peel, and protect you all game.
Not gonna lie, I roam when: the marksman is an ass, the marksman does not need me, an ally needs a nudge from me to win their lane. OP has just shown us the way.
: If you're really interested in supporting multiple playstyles of ADCs, remove crit from Runaans
I dunno, I like how it can fit into a crit build but also allow some flexibility. Like, if the enemy team is slightly tanky with a mix of armor and health and your team composition allows a more glass cannon build, you can grab {{item:3153}} {{item:3071}} instead of LDR for stronger teamfighting. If it didn't have crit, you would need to replace your boots with it and I don't think games last long enough for you to build a seventh item. It serves a decent dual-purpose imo.
Toppien (NA)
: now im interested in that jinx source...
I thought that was Jinx's face whenever she shoots guns... *Googles Ayzev's suggestion* Oh dear god, why. {{sticker:sg-ahri-1}}
Naymliss (NA)
: It depends on the context, if I misplay extremely hard and wind up failing completely, sometimes i'll throw out an "ez"
I don't think that's what OP meant by "i'm an 'ez' guy," but I'm pretty sure nobody is going to knock you if you jokingly say "ez" whenever you fail a play. That's being graceful with your mistakes using humor.
Altiverse (EUNE)
: The difference is that you're actually losing resources through the decreased gold efficiency in the case of buying armor. The analogy of "vest vs nothing at all" doesn't really fit here. You'd instead have to say "vest which offers decreased value versus something that doesn't". [Inb4 "Conqueror users also waste resources by opting into Conqueror instead of other Keystones", people seem to forget that it also offers AD worth of 350-1.2k gold]
Not every item needs to be 100% offensive stats. Just grab a {{item:3026}} {{item:3157}} or something with a relatively useful passive you're comfortable with using that compliments your champion's playstyle instead of a cookie cutter build every game. If you want to build glass cannon, go ahead if that's what you're comfortable with. Just consider adapting, as a little bit of defense can go a long way if you play smart.
: > [{quoted}](name=IcyPepper,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=cEYE5tlM,comment-id=000100000001,timestamp=2018-07-07T22:44:28.493+0000) > > It's really getting frustrating when I get downvote bombed and you get upvoted for meming its probably himself on multiple smurphs. dont take it too seriously. hes a known troll aswell. a couple days ago he was asking for garen nerfs just because of his high pickrate because of the skin.
If it were just him, maybe, but I see this behavior a lot since the crit changes (well, it's always been a thing since we're human and all) and I don't know, I lost my temper for a moment. There is a bit of a problem with the crit changes, and I want things to be smoothed out, but people seem to be volatile about it to have an actual discussion about something that almost everyone could agree on if they just *talked to each other* and I'm starting to get frustrated by the lack of progress on anyone's part. It feels like one of those things that could have a solution for everyone but each party wants their extreme rather than a compromise. Or maybe I'm talking out of my ass, if that would require too much resources on Riot's part (the main concern I have for what would essentially be a juggernaut-scale times five rework of an entire class).
Rioter Comments
Rexxiee (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=IcyPepper,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=cEYE5tlM,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-07-07T15:32:17.220+0000) > > ADCs are still the most picked champions in bot lane, even now. They just have competition and a different laning experience like every other class. Ok then, lets make adcs actually viable in mid top then so i can play jinx somewhere if she isnt viable bot. After all DiVeRsItY
Not all champions have more than one popular role, you know, and there's a few marksman who don't frequently bot lane in the first place. It's really hard to have a discussion about this when people frequently go "After all DiVeRsItY" when we reach over the aisle to talk about it. Look up the statistics. Tell me I'm wrong. Tell me that you marksman are not the most played class in bot lane currently several days after the crit changes. Tell me that Graves is not currently the most played jungler in Plat+ with a positive winrate, with Kindred not lagging too far behind. Teemo top, Quinn top... That nine out of ten of the most played champions in bot lane are marksman, and four out of nine of them have a positive winrate with the highest being ~53% and the lowest being 47%. It's really getting frustrating when I get downvote bombed and you get upvoted for meming when I'm putting in twice the effort you are. I agree, the crit changes and marksman diversity could use some work here, but you are acting like an entitled brat. I really hate the term "circlejerk," but it seems like a vocal crowd of marksman mains are looking for an echo chamber so they can tantrum their way back to the status quo of "one marksman per team mandatory bot lane every game" instead of "let's make changes so marksman have essentially the same treatment as the other classes!" Not every marksman will be able to solo lane, just as not every champion in the other classes can duo lane (like I said, marksman are **still** played most of the time in bot lane right now for good reason). Jinx mid/top probably won't happen without a lot of work, as she lacks hard cc and mobility without her passive, but you could make a strong case for champions like Miss Fortune or Tristana. The thing is, I agree with your comment here, but you're focused on mocking anyone who doesn't just supply an echo chamber for you when I'm trying to reach out and actually have a fucking discussion about something that we probably would have found a consensus on.
Rexxiee (NA)
: Adcs being replaced by mages bot lane
ADCs are still the most picked champions in bot lane, even now. They just have competition and a different laning experience like every other class.
: Can you imagine being so butthurt over criticism that you end up ruining your life?
> [{quoted}](name=IAintDarius,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=BAoBlyNZ,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-07-07T02:42:28.242+0000) > > Can you imagine being so butthurt over criticism that you end up ruining your life? Well, I don't have to imagine any longer.
: Yes but you can skip 34.
> [{quoted}](name=IAintDarius,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=bYuUXr1K,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-07-05T23:23:07.704+0000) > > Yes but you can skip 34. But that was the best one!!!
: This too. :/ They made heal's cool down longer and then to add insult to injury, they buffed ignite's damage. Just what do they want ADC's to take as a secondary defensive sum?
{{summoner:21}} for survival, I guess? Problem with heal is that it can heal two people and provides a short MS boost; it would be unhealthy for it to counter ignite with that level of power. Mages have been taking it as a defensive measure against assassins, don't see why marksman can't. Usually, as a support main I prefer the bot laner (not just ADC) to take heal, but you can take barrier I guess if survival is more important. I'd probably nab heal (if it's a defensive lane) or ignite (if it's an aggressive lane versus an aggressive lane since they'll likely target you).
: > [{quoted}](name=SweetRainTv,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=XEv4v8m0,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-07-04T23:50:24.079+0000) > > On July 4, 1776 . so Its only been 242 years you are fake news ###
> [{quoted}](name=BlueVestGuy,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=XEv4v8m0,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2018-07-04T23:54:01.797+0000) > > you are fake news ### I mean technically the Americas have been here since continental drift tore Pangaea apart.
: FACT that mobility is a better defensive steroid than **anything **else. That's not true. Range still is an even better defenseive tool than mobillity
Maybe in consistency, but mobility does give powerful windows of opportunity on the offensive side of things that range can't always beat.
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IcyPepper

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