: Champion Update: Fiora
I love the changes. It means Quinn is gonna wreck her now. >:} She is heavily reliant on auto attacking at this point, so Quinn's blind will actually do something. It always felt wrong when I blind Fiora and she just ults me and does crap tons of damage while being untargetable. Her ult had zero counter-play. At least now her ult requires a bit of skill to pull off completely. Before it was just right click and press R and you win the fight.
: so what rito is telling us is that {{champion:76}} can pole dance but {{champion:104}} can had a cigar
You guys know they are pulling a Coke move like where Coke made new Coke and people hated it, then they switched to Coke Classic and people loved it even more. They are gonna bring back Graves with a huge cigar and people are gonna go bananas.
: Can Quinn Be Relevant Again, @Rito?
Quinn main here with 1000+ games on her: Yeah I'm still only like 50% win rate on her but I'm Gold if that matters at all... I literally *only* play Quinn so some games are a lot more rough than others. From all the games I've played I can tell you without a doubt that you cannot slack off during the first 6 levels of play. Those are Quinn's most important levels by far. You need to get KILLS by level 6 or at least crush lane so hard that your opponent is severely set back. You need to get your enemy to pop a health pot by level 2. Seriously. Quinn snowballs hard but if you just do average in lane, Quinn falls off and can NEVER catch up... no matter how much you farm. You have to dominate early and then just run with it. This advice is mainly for the solo lanes. For ADC, you need to play SUPER SAFE until level 6 and then set up an ult wombo combo with support and/or jungle and wreck bot lane. From there you can start roaming and being more effective. For the most part, Quinn is going to lose bot lane matchups pre-6 because of her abysmal range and the fact that none of her skills really pass through minions. Quinn can win probably 85% of lane matchups and win hard. The other 15% you really need to give up lane and roam. I'm talking about: 1. Fighting a smart Nasus... just give up lane. If they are dumb you can zone them and keep them from getting stacks, and that makes you relevant... but if you are going even with a Nasus, just leave lane 2. Malphite. Nope, not even once. Just give up lane or dodge this matchup. He counters Quinn so stupidly hard and without effort that it's pointless to struggle in this fight There are a few other matchups that are ridiculously hard but I won't cover them all.
dEAdbUs (EUW)
: Can we get harder punishment in higher elo?
Playing with teammates who are worse than you can be extremely rage inducing. 1. They constantly make stupid mistakes that you keep warning them about but they don't listen 2. The enemy team realizes you're the only hope for your team so they focus you nonstop the whole match, this results in you getting a lot of deaths... which leads to... 3. The same worse teammates will then complain about how badly you're doing, even though it's the direct result of them being so bad that the enemy isn't even concerned with them and instead focuses 100% on you Trust me, I've been on both sides, so I'm not just complaining here. If I see one good person on the enemy team, they are getting focused down first in fights. I'm less concerned about the rest of their team who is doing nothing to me. So yeah, bad teammates + them blaming YOU + enemy team focusing you = rage inducing and causes a lot of toxicity. It's hard to keep my cool when I have 4 bumbling idiots for teammates who don't know how to play, and they are all telling me that *I* don't know how to play because their too bad at the game to realize they are wrong. Ah well. :P
: Thats what you get for playing Quinn top This is exactly how most top laners feel when they have to face you as Quinn. You arent supposed to beat every lane, Malphite is a direct counter to you once he gets some armor, thats his job. The reason he is doing damage to you is because you are a squishy with zero defensive items. Malp is supposed to have decent bases because he builds full tank.
> [{quoted}](name=Matezoide,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Qe3XLABH,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2015-06-30T07:29:12.081+0000) > > Thats what you get for playing Quinn top > > > This is exactly how most top laners feel when they have to face you as Quinn. You arent supposed to beat every lane, Malphite is a direct counter to you once he gets some armor, thats his job. > > The reason he is doing damage to you is because you are a squishy with zero defensive items. Malp is supposed to have decent bases because he builds full tank. Oh okay, I wasn't aware counter meant "better defense AND attack and easy targeted abilities", wow you're so right... that's what I get for playing a champ you disapprove of in top lane. Quinn has counters in the form of CC and champs that don't rely on autos. Why does she need a counter that literally is stronger than her in every way? That's not even a counter, that's just unfair. Even the worst Malphite player can run toward me and press Q and win lane against me. At least Quinn has to be smart about how she plays. That's why I enjoy playing her. It's not my fault that top lane is usually comprised of people who want to be both tanky and do tons of damage and complain about any ranged champ that slows down that process. I can handle myself fine in the majority of mid matchups as Quinn. Against Zed, Ahri, Annie, etc... I play smart and even though they have the edge, I can win. I can't do ANYTHING against Malphite. Other than give up lane and roam the whole time.
Rioter Comments
: I love the analogy you use. Ha, that is definitely the way I see it happen most often. I actually did mean someone stomping the hell out of a team and then being a d bag about it though. In that case they were right about it being easy, but the complaint isn't bc you're a sore loser it is that they are a douche. Sore loser is the one who complains about their team holding them back even when the people beating them aren't being rude about it. Also maybe my math is wrong, but that's like going into high school age right? I was always more academics than sports in high school so I only benched like 150-180 depending on the year it was in high school. Bench 240-250 currently if I have t been slacking a bunch. 240-180 is 60, and yeah 240 isn't an impressive bench or anything, but it's not super weak, and it's a really big difference from 150 if we're talking generous with the difference.
> [{quoted}](name=T RexHasTinyArms,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EZoylYcJ,comment-id=00000000000200010000,timestamp=2015-06-02T21:44:15.866+0000) > > I love the analogy you use. Ha, that is definitely the way I see it happen most often. I actually did mean someone stomping the hell out of a team and then being a d bag about it though. In that case they were right about it being easy, but the complaint isn't bc you're a sore loser it is that they are a douche. Sore loser is the one who complains about their team holding them back even when the people beating them aren't being rude about it. > > Also maybe my math is wrong, but that's like going into high school age right? I was always more academics than sports in high school so I only benched like 150-180 depending on the year it was in high school. Bench 240-250 currently if I have t been slacking a bunch. 240-180 is 60, and yeah 240 isn't an impressive bench or anything, but it's not super weak, and it's a really big difference from 150 if we're talking generous with the difference. Lol... no... 13 is like 7th grade middle school. At 13 a kid is checking out the peach fuzz hairs growing on their upper lip. No way you should be 23 and only benching 60 pounds more than a 13 year old. Unless that 13 year old is freakishly strong and into weight lifting. At 23 you should be benching the 13 year old while they are benching 120 pounds. :p
: Might as well ban people for spam dance when you die since you're such a sore loser.
> [{quoted}](name=Volibear Is OP,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=9qqFA3ZN,comment-id=0068000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-06-03T01:21:24.949+0000) > > Might as well ban people for spam dance when you die since you're such a sore loser. Maybe I wouldn't feel so sore if the player that beat me wasn't rubbing salt in my wounds. I guess being a sore loser is worse than being a poor sport winner?
Okoon (NA)
: Vote to Kick System *END TROLLING IN CHAMP SELECT*
As a Quinn main I would get kicked out of precisely 100% of champ selects, just for picking Quinn. So I'm gonna go ahead and vote no to your dumb idea that has been already thought of 500 times before and still nobody has come up with a way to prevent abuse. Maybe next time just search the boards first before posting this old idea. Better yet, stop acting like your post is going to finally be the post that gets this idea implemented, without making any effort at all to solve the abuse problems this would inevitably cause. Because it WILL be abused and to think it wouldn't is just naive. It would be abused by a vast majority of players because it's simply too convenient to get out of bad team comps or situations where your team doesn't feel like they have an edge. It would make getting into an actual match about 10x longer due to so many vote dodges, and it would breed even more animosity between players as they try to figure out who is the weakest link in their team EVERY champ select so they can decide if the person is weak enough (in their mind) to deserve a vote kick.
: In sports after the game there are many times where players gloat and celebrate right in front of the losing team in order to get under their skin. No one forces them to shake after the game. That's why the shake BEFORE the match. Poor sportsmanship isn't something that should be punishable. If you don't like what someone has to say you should utilize a resource given to you called "Mute." BTW there are many people (and I'm sure you're probably guilty of this) who spam laugh or dance at the end when your team is taking the nexus or after killing an enemy. I guess we should ban people for doing this as well, huh?
> [{quoted}](name=Volibear Is OP,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=9qqFA3ZN,comment-id=00130002,timestamp=2015-05-29T01:34:02.108+0000) > > In sports after the game there are many times where players gloat and celebrate right in front of the losing team in order to get under their skin. No one forces them to shake after the game. That's why the shake BEFORE the match. Poor sportsmanship isn't something that should be punishable. If you don't like what someone has to say you should utilize a resource given to you called "Mute." > > BTW there are many people (and I'm sure you're probably guilty of this) who spam laugh or dance at the end when your team is taking the nexus or after killing an enemy. I guess we should ban people for doing this as well, huh? So basically you advocate bullying. Oh yeah, just ignore them, no big deal. Just stop having emotions. Easier said than done. Poor sportsmanship shouldn't be punishable?!? WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? Since when did we start defending people who act like d***s? This is ridiculous. It's like you are arguing for the sake of arguing. Who could possibly sit here and advocate poor sportsmanship and bullying, and actually believe in what they are saying? Next you're gonna say women should ignore guys who sexually harass them because it's just words. Everyone should be robots with an emotion switch they can turn off when people say upsetting things, apparently. Words hold weight. Words literally shaped society as we know it. To sit here and act like words mean nothing and you can just plug your ears your entire life to not hear unpleasant things is not only naive, it's outright dangerous.
: I never said that Solo Q was the LCS. LCS = League of legends and if Riot allows trash talk in LCS, which is their game, then why shouldn't they in Solo q? So someone should be punished because you're insulted. Grow up. There are going to be hundreds of things in this world that will insult you. Being insulted is inevitable. There's a big difference between actually being verbally abused by things such as racial slurs and trash talk such as "ggez." In a competitive environment trash talk is bound to happen. Let me ask you, why exactly does the mute button even exist? Why have Riot included this feature in their game when you can just report someone for saying literally anything and they will get punished. Even if it's not anything meant to be insulting you can still report them and they will get punished. The system is extremely flawed. If you're so butt hurt over something so small, then maybe you need to grow a pair.
> [{quoted}](name=Volibear Is OP,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=9qqFA3ZN,comment-id=00680000000000000000,timestamp=2015-05-29T01:28:49.739+0000) > > Grow up. > butt hurt > grow a pair. You sound like a very empathetic person.... lol. No need to even read the rest of your post or listen to your opinion... You summed it all up nicely in 3 phrases. There's a reason I report people like you. It's not just the "gg ez", it's your entire attitude. Your lack of sympathy toward people, your "grow a pair" attitude toward anyone who gets upset over anything. You don't deserve to play a game with other human beings if you can't even give them an ounce of respect. It's my freedom to report you for whatever I feel is verbal abuse to me. It's Riot's freedom to decide whether my report holds weight. So you shouldn't worry if you think you're in the clear. Is the world a cruel place? Sure. That doesn't mean we have to perpetuate it when playing an online game for fun and relaxation. Just be a nice person for crying out loud.
: Uninstall for the love of god. jesus Christ. The damed trinket upgrade isn't for YOU. it's for your team and they DO need it. Knowing when that enemy wanders out alone to ward. Knowing when they go for your buffs. Knowing when they are running as a team fighting train towards your lane. Knowing you can push a lane safely cause they are all derping at gromp. You're really upsetting me.
> [{quoted}](name=MacDthree,realm=NA,application-id=WEuoGbmp,discussion-id=B1B1lKuM,comment-id=00020006,timestamp=2015-05-29T18:47:11.135+0000) > > Uninstall for the love of god. > jesus Christ. > The damed trinket upgrade isn't for YOU. > it's for your team and they DO need it. Knowing when that enemy wanders out alone to ward. Knowing when they go for your buffs. Knowing when they are running as a team fighting train towards your lane. Knowing you can push a lane safely cause they are all derping at gromp. > You're really upsetting me. Yeah... gonna go ahead and report your post for the "uninstall" comment. People need to stop throwing this word around like candy. You can participate in a debate without telling people to uninstall the game. The trinket upgrade isn't for me and it isn't for my team... because guess what... if you are silver/gold level and thinking your team is actually going to use their minimap, you're gonna have a bad time. Why bother upgrading my trinket when teammates don't look at the minimap anyway? It's a waste of gold. Maybe at plat level and higher it might be more crucial... but low Elo 90% of people are constant tunnel vision mode anyway. The 250 gold would be better spent by saving it for a completed item.
: There's a difference between being a sore loser (assuming that's what you meant) and thinking someone is a prick because they're being a jerk. If I beat a 13 year old at basketball when I'm watching over my little cousin while his folks are out of town I don't give him shit for being bad at basketball. I've got a decade of experience on the kid, and out weigh him by 50-60 lbs, as well as benching 50-100 lbs more than his max. If I don't beat him I'd be surprised, so why brag. In lol, I don't brag when I win a fight that's 5v4 bc the enemy had a DC, or when I crush someone in a team fight who did well all laning phase, but I was 8-0 from the jungle and my lane feeding me. Besides, some people are really new while others have played for 4 or 5 years. If you've played for years, there are a ton of players in this game you should be beating hands down because you've had more time to practice, and you know the game better. Why would you brag about being able to do what you should be able to do? That's like talking smack at work because you came in wearing your pants put on the right way, it's just stupid.
> [{quoted}](name=T RexHasTinyArms,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EZoylYcJ,comment-id=000000000002,timestamp=2015-06-02T13:49:58.136+0000) > I've got a decade of experience on the kid, and out weigh him by 50-60 lbs, as well as benching 50-100 lbs more than his max. If I don't beat him I'd be surprised, so why brag. You definitely shouldn't be bragging if you're 23 and can only bench 50 lbs more than a 13 year old. lol :p Edit: Also this isn't necessarily about "why brag when it was an easy win by saying 'gg ez'"... I've had opponents say "gg ez" to me when I was crushing them all game and they only won because they got hard carried. Your example would be more fitting if you were playing 3 on 3 basketball against 2 little kids and Kobe Bryant, and it was just you and 2 friends... and when the little kids win they say "gg ez" to you. That's more along the lines of what happens in most league games. Long story short... unless you were the one who hard carried in your game and you're like 20-1-10 and the enemy team surrendered at 20 because you were just dumping on them... you don't get the right to say "gg ez", and even then it's still a d-bag thing to do, and deserves a temp ban for verbal abuse.
: Ok so you play exclusively Quinn and in your most recent game you bought a Sightstone for 800 instead of a trinket for 250?
> [{quoted}](name=The Lexer,realm=NA,application-id=WEuoGbmp,discussion-id=B1B1lKuM,comment-id=00020002,timestamp=2015-05-28T22:38:06.461+0000) > > Ok so you play exclusively Quinn and in your most recent game you bought a Sightstone for 800 instead of a trinket for 250? I was support
: In the LCS there is plenty of trash talk allowed by Rito themselves, but you think saying "Ggez" is report worthy? K loser
> [{quoted}](name=Volibear Is OP,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=9qqFA3ZN,comment-id=006800000000,timestamp=2015-05-25T15:29:04.531+0000) > > In the LCS there is plenty of trash talk allowed by Rito themselves, but you think saying "Ggez" is report worthy? K loser Solo Q isn't the LCS... Also, "GG EZ" is report worthy because there is literally no definition of that phrase that isn't meant to be insulting to the opposing team. You are literally just outright insulting them at the worst possible moment which just increases the weight of the insult overall. It's rubbing salt in the wounds. Also, you've called multiple people in this thread "loser"... I'm not exactly sure you should be the guy who gets to decide what is worthy of being an insult or not. Even if "gg ez" is only 4 letters and seems rather "tame". It's the context and timing. You are outright disrespecting the entire enemy team, you are making a lot of statements with those 4 letters. People who lost a game do not want to hear "gg ez" from their opponent as it will only upset them more than just losing would do alone. You know this, that is why you probably say it. What other reason is there to say this? It's only purpose is to insult.
: Let Me Share A Story With You
So the lesson here is that if you're a jungler, help a losing lane? Pretty sure that flies in the face of every other piece of jungling advice ever given. Seems like this is an exception to the rule. Generally you don't want to bother with a feeding lane because the teammate doing badly will most likely continue to do bad... and as you said, just be worth more when they die.
: Save a life for 250g
I'm either far ahead and don't even need it... or I'm far behind and I need to spend that 250 toward something to help me catch up.
: Tank META In A Nutshell
Tank Meta = Both players right click each other's champion and then they go take naps.
Konidias (NA)
: I can't stop my team from doing stupid things, and it's frustrating
I think honestly the thing that bugs me most about LoL is that I want to have quality games with competent teammates, but in order to do that, I need to get to a specific rank. Ranking is 100% based on your W/L ratio, and of course, your W/L can be heavily influenced by your team since this is a team game. Therefore, I may never get a chance to play at a level I would have fun at, because of how the game is set up. I'm tired of hearing people tell me to "get good" and "carry harder" when I complain about being stuck in low ELO. Now with the individual champion performance grades at the end of each match, it's more clear than ever that I'm in ELO hell. I almost always get at least S rank with the rare A or B rank thrown in. It's such a contradicting system. "GOOD JOB! S+ RANK! BUT YOU LOST THE MATCH, SO GET DEMOTED" It would be like getting an A+ on a test only to have it turn into a D because the teacher then factors in 4 random people's grades and averages them with yours. "GREAT JOB A+ ON THE TEST! BUT THESE 4 OTHER PEOPLE GOT Fs, SO YOU FAIL!"
Konidias (NA)
: I can't stop my team from doing stupid things, and it's frustrating
The worst part is that when I try to split push and my team wipes, they all report me after the game. I mean it's like the icing on the crap cake. They just mindlessly rush into fights, die, and then scan all over the minimap to find the farthest away teammate to blame for not being there to help.
: Try playing ranked 5v5 with skype/teamspeak/mumble?
> [{quoted}](name=BLU Medic,realm=NA,application-id=mNBeEEkI,discussion-id=7AsNV7u1,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-05-19T17:57:59.663+0000) > > Try playing ranked 5v5 with skype/teamspeak/mumble? My timing window to play the game is too sporadic to try and coordinate a 5 man on teamspeak or something. I just play in short bursts randomly so that really wouldn't work. I can only do solo and sometimes duo.
: > [{quoted}](name=Konidias,realm=NA,application-id=mNBeEEkI,discussion-id=EYZs0mjK,comment-id=000900000000,timestamp=2015-05-19T17:40:50.045+0000) > > Oh yeah, you got me man... I never thought to roam from lane after 1000+ quinn games. I'm just so dumb. Move along. 1000+ Quinn games and you're still silver. Yah I'd say you're doing something wrong my friend. I had a mid to high gold Quinn only account before it got banned, what's your excuse?
> [{quoted}](name=Maya Fey,realm=NA,application-id=mNBeEEkI,discussion-id=EYZs0mjK,comment-id=0009000000000000,timestamp=2015-05-19T17:41:39.729+0000) > > 1000+ Quinn games and you're still silver. Yah I'd say you're doing something wrong my friend. > > I had a mid to high gold Quinn only account before it got banned, what's your excuse? I've been Gold 3 Quinn... so please go away. I'm "still silver" because Quinn cannot carry the majority of games... especially in this tank meta. She's pretty useless when the enemy team has 3 tanks. I play Quinn literally every game... and she doesn't always work with every comp and against every comp, so I take hits for that. I lose games because our comp needs to dominate early to win and that usually doesn't happen if any of my other lanes feeds. I consistently score S+ to A with Quinn, and I win my lane all the time and try to roam and help other lanes, but I cannot win every game by myself. It's a team game and some games you just can't win. Especially with comps that work against you. But I'm really tired of explaining myself... I have 1000 games on one champ that doesn't mean I should be Challenger level on them. I don't play normals, so literally all of my learning of the game and of how to play Quinn came from ranked games... Meaning I lost a lot of games due to still learning the game... unlike other people who play 1000 normal games and then start playing ranked. I've spent the past 1000 games learning how to win every 1v1 situation, and learning how to better ward or gank or learning jungler timing windows, or trying new strategies, etc. I've tried different builds, different skill level orders, etc... All in ranked and all on Quinn. So yeah, my ranking is going to take a hit because of that. Normals are a waste of my time in my opinion.
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=Konidias,realm=NA,application-id=mNBeEEkI,discussion-id=EYZs0mjK,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2015-05-19T17:33:32.222+0000) > > I want to add how frustrating it can be to play Quinn. Like it's the absolute worst... Because you can feel so good about winning lane, and then the rest of your team spaghetti's on themselves and you lose the match. This is because you have 0 sense of when to leave your lane. You sitting top lane forever while your team dies is a good way to never climb. Quinn has one of the best roams with her ult and can shit on lanes more easily than top lane Rengar, why wouldn't you take advantage of that?
> [{quoted}](name=Maya Fey,realm=NA,application-id=mNBeEEkI,discussion-id=EYZs0mjK,comment-id=00090000,timestamp=2015-05-19T17:35:26.916+0000) > > This is because you have 0 sense of when to leave your lane. You sitting top lane forever while your team dies is a good way to never climb. Quinn has one of the best roams with her ult and can shit on lanes more easily than top lane Rengar, why wouldn't you take advantage of that? Oh yeah, you got me man... I never thought to roam from lane after 1000+ quinn games. I'm just so dumb. Move along.
: Apparently, Quinn top has a 55% win rate, the highest of any champ in a specific role
I want to add how frustrating it can be to play Quinn. Like it's the absolute worst... Because you can feel so good about winning lane, and then the rest of your team spaghetti's on themselves and you lose the match. Quinn is literally one of the few champs where you can win lane super hard and still lose the game super hard because of bad teammates. It's pretty rage inducing. You feel like you did extremely well, and yet you still lose game after game. I'm pretty much at the mercy of my teammates. If they do decently, I win 100% of the time. If they do badly... my chances of winning drop to about 5%. Which is why I'm stuck in Silver. Believe me, I try to help my team... but I can't gank mid when my mid laner is nearly dead and the enemy mid laner is 100% HP... my mid laner will just try to greedily go in and get the kill and then just get destroyed right before I kill the enemy mid. I will have tele up in 10 seconds and before I can even teleport to bot lane, both of my bot laners are about to die and the enemy team is at 80% hp or something... like TPing in would just be suicide. It's really frustrating. In fact, I was watching imaqtpie play Quinn yesterday, and he basically stated what I've felt all along about Quinn. Which is that she can win lane hard and still lose. She is cursed to lose and it feels like when you play Quinn, your teammates play their worst. He laughed about it a lot because it's really true and really sad.
: > [{quoted}](name=Shadow Merchant,realm=NA,application-id=mNBeEEkI,discussion-id=EYZs0mjK,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-05-19T02:12:52.248+0000) > > You play her top? What do you build on her? I've been wanting to try it out as she's my favorite adc but no idea what to build. Play her more as an ad assasin then a normal build. her kit fits that way better. Early brutalizer for the cdr and go for tryforce/botrk. try to catch people with your ult if you cant solokill your laneopponent for whatever reason. Cdr boots are great on her. The key to winning your lane is eing the enemy in the worst possible szenario and learn to fight in your minions. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dKNGY13OPk
> [{quoted}](name=Shikyo Seikou,realm=EUW,application-id=mNBeEEkI,discussion-id=EYZs0mjK,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2015-05-19T02:17:52.297+0000) > > Play her more as an ad assasin then a normal build. her kit fits that way better. > Early brutalizer for the cdr and go for tryforce/botrk. try to catch people with your ult if you cant solokill your laneopponent for whatever reason. Cdr boots are great on her. The key to winning your lane is eing the enemy in the worst possible szenario and learn to fight in your minions. > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dKNGY13OPk Are you just reiterating a guide you read somewhere? Brutalizer is garbage on Quinn now. It only builds into Youmuu's and it's not a great item for her anymore. What you described *USED* to be the best Quinn build, but now it's sub-par. As for her win rate... it's not due to her winning lane match ups... I can attest to that. I am a Quinn main and I win nearly every lane match up but that doesn't really matter unless I can roll that into some sort of benefit to my other lanes. It can be quite hard when bot lane is feeding and mid is struggling. Sure I can gank mid, but if enemy mid plays safe, I'm sort of screwed. This is why I take teleport top now... It seems like a bad summoner for Quinn, but I've learned match ups good enough to not need ignite... and I'd rather have the ability to instantly be across the map and help my struggling team. Even with TP and my ult, I can't be everywhere at once... and I find myself losing games where I dominated lane because Quinn just isn't very strong in the current tank meta and she struggles against teams with a lot of tankiness or CC. It's funny how one game I can get 25 kills and be 3-4 levels above the enemy team, and another game I can barely get a positive KDA because the enemy comp is just so anti-Quinn. A good enemy jungler is Quinn's kryptonite.
: > [{quoted}](name=Konidias,realm=NA,application-id=WEuoGbmp,discussion-id=HXiImb5O,comment-id=003800000000,timestamp=2015-05-11T22:31:17.543+0000) > > Thanks for the feedback. I actually play Quinn mostly mid. I try to play her wherever I can fit her. I play her top, mid, adc... even jungle and support at times. I know the easier way to climb would be to learn all the top tier champs at the moment and then just pick whatever is best for the comp, but I love Quinn and honestly just enjoy playing her exclusively. Maybe it's just the fate of being a Quinn only player... I'm gonna get games where I am heavily disadvantaged due to team comps. I guess my best bet in the future is to just dodge those games. > > I find I do much better in games where the enemy team has few tanks. Like in my last game. I disagree. The best way to climb is usually to main a couple champions you're comfortable on and play the hell out of them. I did roughly the same thing you did on Quinn, except I did it on Hecarim and Cho'Gath. You don't have to dodge or anything of the sort. You could reach Challenger doing exactly what you're doing now, provided you play well enough. But that's just it - you have to play well enough. The only way you can play well enough is by improving on an individual level, and being fixated on how your team is "holding you back" most definitely is not conducive to efficient learning. Basically, stick with what you're doing if it's what you enjoy. But stop fooling yourself into thinking your teams are holding you back. Focus on improving your own play.
> [{quoted}](name=deadturtle,realm=NA,application-id=WEuoGbmp,discussion-id=HXiImb5O,comment-id=0038000000000000,timestamp=2015-05-11T22:35:35.865+0000) > > I disagree. The best way to climb is usually to main a couple champions you're comfortable on and play the hell out of them. > I did roughly the same thing you did on Quinn, except I did it on Hecarim and Cho'Gath. You don't have to dodge or anything of the sort. You could reach Challenger doing exactly what you're doing now, provided you play well enough. But that's just it - you have to play well enough. The only way you can play well enough is by improving on an individual level, and being fixated on how your team is "holding you back" most definitely is not conducive to efficient learning. > > Basically, stick with what you're doing if it's what you enjoy. But stop fooling yourself into thinking your teams are holding you back. Focus on improving your own play. What do I need to improve? I usually end up with most CS out of everyone (or top 3 in CS)... so I'm definitely farming properly. I usually win lane... so I'm laning properly. I try my best to roam and help other lanes but I cannot prevent my teammates from dying every time. I have started taking teleport every game because it lets me rush in to save a bad situation and I honestly feel like I don't even need ignite or heal anymore because I can win most fights without them. So what am I doing wrong? Didn't you just say Quinn suffers in team fights and has little to no CC? I can't really do much late game when my team wants to group for team fights. (which at my ELO, that's all they know how to do) I know I would be most effective if I split push when I'm strong... but my team is too dense to understand this. Honestly I don't know what else I can do at this point. I try to organize my team for objectives, but they do what they want. Should I be warding more often? It's probably the weakest aspect of my game, but I honestly can't see the benefit when my team doesn't even look at their minimap. I find that my team panics when they see me split pushing... I get constant warning pings from them if I venture out "too far" even though as Quinn I know I'm safe... and I know where the enemies are so I know when to back out. If my team is so busy watching me they aren't doing anything else... and that frustrates me a lot. I try to build the right items for the right situations... I rush to take any unguarded objective. I've gotten so aggressive that I will literally push all the lanes by myself with ult and teleport and yet my team is just running around and somehow I'm supposed to be EVEN BETTER than I currently am? I know for you it's easy to say, but to me I just can't see where I'm faulting SO badly that I can't climb out of this ELO where I'm obviously outperforming over half of the players in the match all the time.
: > [{quoted}](name=Konidias,realm=NA,application-id=WEuoGbmp,discussion-id=HXiImb5O,comment-id=0038,timestamp=2015-05-11T19:38:03.591+0000) > > 1. What are your opinions on Quinn? > > 2. What rank did you start at? > > 3. Do you think you got lucky along the way to climb to Challenger? What I mean is that do you feel you ever got carried in certain games that allowed you to win series or promos? > > 4. Would you say it's easier or harder to win games the higher your ranking? For example, I find it harder to win games at lower ELO due to my team being extremely incompetent. At mid Gold/Plat ELO it feels like my team at least has basic understanding of when to group, when to take objectives, etc. > > 5. Do you think a player who is getting consistent S ranks at low Gold ELO would be able to hold his own at diamond or master level if he has a strong team? Or is there some major disparity that would keep him from being viable at that level? > > I guess what I'm asking is do you think there is really much skill gap between a player who is better than 60% of all playerbase and a player who is better than 90%? Do you think luck ever plays a big enough factor? (bad teammates consistently, throwing huge leads that you've helped your team get, etc) > > I honestly just feel like I don't belong in my ELO and I'm stuck here due to the roll of the dice with my teammates. 1. Strong splitpush and assassination. She can succeed, but you need to be actually good at her to succeed. 2. I was silver in season 3 iirc. 3. Yes. But you get unlucky games to balance them out. You always fluctuate a bit above or below your actual ELO based on how your recent games have gone. It's not important in the long run. 4. To an extent yes, I know what you mean. But, I mean, for the most part you should still end up winning frequently enough on an individual level that you shouldn't have much trouble climbing at an ELO under yours. 5. I think you're over-thinking how inaccurate ranks are. Unless you haven't played many ranked games yet and the sample size is small, then your rank is roughly where you belong. *** You have a fair number of ranked games played. I'm going to be very blunt here. I'm sorry if you take this as rudeness, but I think you need to face reality. You are where you belong, and you need to accept that so you can start making progress. You've got to stop thinking about stupid things like how your teammates are holding you back and focus on how YOU are holding yourself back. I used to see these kinds of comments a lot back from Renekton players in S4. They'd come griping about things like "win lane, lose game." You know what? Renekton was made to win lane, and then continues to scale downward. Makes no sense to expect to win games just because you win lane on a lane-dominant champion. It's a similar thing for you. Quinn top is a nightmare for melees. She naturally wins top lane against basically every melee simply because her kit gives her a free pass. However, picking her every single game comes with its corresponding disadvantages. She brings almost no teamfight CC and tankiness, so picking her top every game without considering your team composition can put you at a severe late-game disadvantage. Not to mention you're picking Quinn top WITHOUT FAIL, likely pushing other people out of the position. I'm not saying you have to fill and play meta tanks, but consider the ways in which you are hurting your teams. You can choose to ignore what I'm saying - I've never seen you play, and I'm no one to you. But this is my honest opinion, judging from your stats and words. I have little reason for bias here - how well you do in ranked doesn't impact me, only you. You are deluding yourself, and it is harming your ability to learn and climb. Open your eyes and take a step back.
> [{quoted}](name=deadturtle,realm=NA,application-id=WEuoGbmp,discussion-id=HXiImb5O,comment-id=00380000,timestamp=2015-05-11T22:15:44.740+0000) > > 1. Strong splitpush and assassination. She can succeed, but you need to be actually good at her to succeed. > > 2. I was silver in season 3 iirc. > > 3. Yes. But you get unlucky games to balance them out. You always fluctuate a bit above or below your actual ELO based on how your recent games have gone. It's not important in the long run. > > 4. To an extent yes, I know what you mean. But, I mean, for the most part you should still end up winning frequently enough on an individual level that you shouldn't have much trouble climbing at an ELO under yours. > > 5. I think you're over-thinking how inaccurate ranks are. Unless you haven't played many ranked games yet and the sample size is small, then your rank is roughly where you belong. > > *** > > You have a fair number of ranked games played. I'm going to be very blunt here. I'm sorry if you take this as rudeness, but I think you need to face reality. You are where you belong, and you need to accept that so you can start making progress. You've got to stop thinking about stupid things like how your teammates are holding you back and focus on how YOU are holding yourself back. > > I used to see these kinds of comments a lot back from Renekton players in S4. They'd come griping about things like "win lane, lose game." You know what? Renekton was made to win lane, and then continues to scale downward. Makes no sense to expect to win games just because you win lane on a lane-dominant champion. It's a similar thing for you. Quinn top is a nightmare for melees. She naturally wins top lane against basically every melee simply because her kit gives her a free pass. However, picking her every single game comes with its corresponding disadvantages. She brings almost no teamfight CC and tankiness, so picking her top every game without considering your team composition can put you at a severe late-game disadvantage. Not to mention you're picking Quinn top WITHOUT FAIL, likely pushing other people out of the position. I'm not saying you have to fill and play meta tanks, but consider the ways in which you are hurting your teams. > > You can choose to ignore what I'm saying - I've never seen you play, and I'm no one to you. But this is my honest opinion, judging from your stats and words. I have little reason for bias here - how well you do in ranked doesn't impact me, only you. You are deluding yourself, and it is harming your ability to learn and climb. Open your eyes and take a step back. Thanks for the feedback. I actually play Quinn mostly mid. I try to play her wherever I can fit her. I play her top, mid, adc... even jungle and support at times. I know the easier way to climb would be to learn all the top tier champs at the moment and then just pick whatever is best for the comp, but I love Quinn and honestly just enjoy playing her exclusively. Maybe it's just the fate of being a Quinn only player... I'm gonna get games where I am heavily disadvantaged due to team comps. I guess my best bet in the future is to just dodge those games. I find I do much better in games where the enemy team has few tanks. Like in my last game.
Smendric (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Konidias,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=VELolYKj,comment-id=0052,timestamp=2015-05-11T16:51:16.690+0000) > > My speculation on his time manipulation ability: > > It will be an ultimate that effects a radius. So he triggers the start time with R, and then he gets x amount of seconds that he can press R again to trigger. > > So essentially what it does is rewinds anything that was inside the radius of the skill. Not the entire map... just within the radius. This makes more sense because "contained" time control wouldn't be as OP. If it only effects a certain radius around him then I can see it working. So for example, since he is most likely melee, he could dive into a team fight, hit R to "bookmark" the time point, then fight it out and if the fight goes bad, he hits R again and everyone returns to their original positions and original HP/MP, etc... from when he first hit R. > > Different from Zilean because it doesn't just reverse damage done to one person, it's reversing everything in a radius. Including damage done to enemies. The only thing is that Ekko possibly takes some residual damage from it anyway... (if he took damage) > > So it's kind of interesting... it would allow for him to be extremely reckless in 1v1's... Like press R, go absolute HAM on your enemy laner... if things go bad, hit R and be like "just playing" and back off. :^) > > Both people will still have all of their HP/MP/Cooldowns exactly as they were before the fight started, except Ekko has taken a % of damage from the "fight that never happened". Basically gives him the ability to make risky plays with the reward being a kill, and the penalty being he takes some damage and the enemy goes back to normal. The problem with a localized or area effect type time manipulation is it creates problems if/when people enter or leave the area of effect. Great idea though.
> [{quoted}](name=Smendric,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=VELolYKj,comment-id=00520000,timestamp=2015-05-11T20:58:12.986+0000) > > The problem with a localized or area effect type time manipulation is it creates problems if/when people enter or leave the area of effect. Great idea though. Maybe it's not so much an AoE type situation but possibly a targeted thing? Like Ekko and whoever he targets for his ultimate will be affected by the time alteration. This would at least make him a really strong 1v1 melee... So basically when his ultimate gets activated it records the current HP/MP/position/etc of him and his target. Then if he triggers the ult again, it will reset to that exact same saved information except he will take a % of HP damage based on whatever damage he took during that skirmish. So even if other people intervene, it wouldn't matter. Say he targets Teemo and uses his ultimate on him. Maybe for the next 10 seconds the Ult is ticking down. Ekko and Teemo duke it out, maybe Jinx fires her ult at Ekko and nails him for a big chunk of damage. He realizes he's about to die, so he presses R... and then Ekko and Teemo "rewind" back to their original states, except Ekko has now taken some % damage from the fight he "remembers". Had he actually killed Teemo and survived, he wouldn't need to finish using his Ult. It's basically like a safety net or "get out of bad engage free" card. Which is pretty much exactly what the video shows. Him 1v1 at melee range and constantly rewinding time while taking mild injuries from each rewind. I can see it working and not being broken in the game this way. The opponent gets everything back if he rewinds.
EsoEs (NA)
: Why I Like the Season 5 Meta
I don't get why people are so happy about this meta just because it is no longer about adc or assassins... Now it's just about tanks. That's not a solution, it's just focusing everything on the most neglected champ type. So great... all the tanks are rejoicing and saying "best season ever!" and gloating about assassins and adcs crying, etc... But I'm crying because this game is still heavily imbalanced to favor a specific champ type. I don't believe the "now you have to have *real* teamfights" nonsense. It's essentially now team fights just last longer because tanks last longer... It doesn't change teamfights for the better just to make them last longer. Especially when you have essentially made the choice of what to play a no brainer. You pick tank, you win. Your only downside in the current meta is MAYBE you have a weak early game as a tank. BOO HOO you are not a demi-god for the first 4-5 levels that last all of 8 minutes. Nobody is winning a game in 8 minutes, so you're pretty safe come 15+ minutes into the game. Winners are decided now by who has the most tank and most CC. That's all. Don't have those things? Good luck.
: Just had a team of 3 tanks, a Fizz and an ADC. Easy win right? Nope. Got rekt by Darius of all champs. Reason? If both ADCs are zoned from the fight by enemy bruisers/assassins/tanks - not killed, just zoned by their presence - then the battle is decided by who has more sustained damage in their frontline and mid laner. Turns out that Wukong and Darius have WAY more damage than straight tanks while still being pretty tanky and having utility, while Fizz is really really bad against bruisers that can knock him away from the ADC.
> [{quoted}](name=BluePolarizer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=pzPcBZ2E,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2015-05-11T19:59:11.252+0000) > > Just had a team of 3 tanks, a Fizz and an ADC. > > Easy win right? I can't really conclude anything without knowing what the enemy team comp was. I mean, you only mention they had Darius, who I would classify as "tanky". He might not be 100% tank but he is still naturally tanky. What were your 3 tanks doing in team fights? They should have been barreling down the front and preventing anyone from touching squishies. Fizz is an exception because he is squishy melee... so I'm not really sure he fits in at all in the tank meta... You can't shred tanks with Fizz and you're pretty much sentencing yourself to death if you engage on multiple tanks at once. Even with all of Fizz's escapse, if he gets CC chained by 2-4 tanks and surrounded, he is done.
: Hi, I'm Challenger. Open Q&A thread for anyone looking for advice.
1. What are your opinions on Quinn? 2. What rank did you start at? 3. Do you think you got lucky along the way to climb to Challenger? What I mean is that do you feel you ever got carried in certain games that allowed you to win series or promos? 4. Would you say it's easier or harder to win games the higher your ranking? For example, I find it harder to win games at lower ELO due to my team being extremely incompetent. At mid Gold/Plat ELO it feels like my team at least has basic understanding of when to group, when to take objectives, etc. 5. Do you think a player who is getting consistent S ranks at low Gold ELO would be able to hold his own at diamond or master level if he has a strong team? Or is there some major disparity that would keep him from being viable at that level? I guess what I'm asking is do you think there is really much skill gap between a player who is better than 60% of all playerbase and a player who is better than 90%? Do you think luck ever plays a big enough factor? (bad teammates consistently, throwing huge leads that you've helped your team get, etc) I honestly just feel like I don't belong in my ELO and I'm stuck here due to the roll of the dice with my teammates.
EsoEs (NA)
: Why I Like the Season 5 Meta
The meta is fine until you get 3-4 tanks on one team, and then you see just how broken tanks have become. They just soak up all the damage and then deal out way more, plus all the CC. A full team of tanks is near unstoppable right now, imho. You can't be a full damage build anymore and fall behind a tank for even a moment. If they get ahead, you're done. You never get to catch up to them. Whenever I'm AD facing a tank in a solo lane, it's like... I sit there pelting them with pebbles for 5 minutes and do maybe 20% damage to them. They unleash one combo of skills on me and I drop 40% HP instantly. If I make a mistake and get ganked and die to my tank laner, I'm done for. I can't ever come back. I do less and less damage as the game progresses and the tank does more and more. Tank mechanics require zero skill. You get Cinderhulk, you get thornmail, you get sunfire cape... Then you just walk into an enemy and CC them and you win the fight. There is no need to ever dodge anything... or worry about making mistakes... If you get double teamed you just walk away to a turret and laugh as 2 people only manage to do 40% damage to you in the span of 10 seconds.
: There shouldn't be such a thing as "too much faith in the community". One time of people ganging up like this is very likely not even a gang up, rather a coincidence of them all thinking "I think this person cost me this game". And admittedly if 4 complete strangers thought this then probably some combination of your ignorance of what you did wrong in the game or their ignorance of them being at fault as well led to you being reported by 4 people and getting a ban. Now if you've had this happened more than once or twice then I'm only likely to believe that you deserved the reports cause that is the rare situation here rather than believe the community is that ignorant. And if it really is then you just have had bad luck in finding those people in such quantities. If this was just a one time thing then it was probably just that, a one time event. Being a better player in both skill and ability to work with people in a team will likely stop that from happening again. But you have to bear in mind that working with people in a team doesn't just mean not getting mad at them you have to learn how they communicate or not communicate and try and help the out accordingly.
> [{quoted}](name=The Red Goat,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OnqHGFrU,comment-id=001700000001,timestamp=2015-05-10T06:16:09.370+0000) > > There shouldn't be such a thing as "too much faith in the community". One time of people ganging up like this is very likely not even a gang up, rather a coincidence of them all thinking "I think this person cost me this game". And admittedly if 4 complete strangers thought this then probably some combination of your ignorance of what you did wrong in the game or their ignorance of them being at fault as well led to you being reported by 4 people and getting a ban. > > Now if you've had this happened more than once or twice then I'm only likely to believe that you deserved the reports cause that is the rare situation here rather than believe the community is that ignorant. And if it really is then you just have had bad luck in finding those people in such quantities. > > If this was just a one time thing then it was probably just that, a one time event. Being a better player in both skill and ability to work with people in a team will likely stop that from happening again. But you have to bear in mind that working with people in a team doesn't just mean not getting mad at them you have to learn how they communicate or not communicate and try and help the out accordingly. You don't seem to have much faith in me and I'm part of the community. So you're kind of hurting your argument here. You keep trying to put the blame on me... and again, this is exactly the kind of thing that happens to me in the game. People want someone to blame. "Why not the guy who picked off meta? He must be the reason we lost. We are all negative KDA because of that one guy in top lane who picked off meta." It makes people feel better about their own failure. I am a Quinn main with 1000+ games on her. I've seen some things. Lately I've been having better games, even got some +Teamworks and whatnot... Everyone is fine with me when I hard carry for them, but when I do average or I'm getting focused a lot, all of the sudden I'm the one to blame for everyone doing poorly and it's all due to my off-meta Quinn pick. Every. Single. Time. I'm the easy scapegoat. I've seen it so much that I can see the people who are already setting up to blame me even from champ select. It's whatever person is already giving me crap about my pick. He's loading the ammunition so that if he does poorly he can use that ammo later. "see I told you we'd lose because this guy picked Quinn" It's the same people who are like "Y DIDNT U BAN LEBLANC GG WE LOSE" and then the team does terribly and loses, and the enemy LB only does average and the guy is all "I TOLD U 2 BAN LEBLANC THIS IS WHY WE LOST", and not because that same guy went 1/8/2 as ADC
Rioter Comments
: Add an explanation for the grade you received?
I pretty much get S every game but I've had a few A+ A and the rare S+ :)
Sharjo (EUW)
: Ekko: The Boy who Shattered Time
TLDR: His ult will allow him to be reckless/go ham/etc with the cost being that if the fight doesn't go his way, he can rewind time but take %HP damage. It doesn't necessarily "undo a good enemy engage" because either way, if you win a fight against Ekko, he's either dead, or he loses his ult and takes some damage while you lose NOTHING in the process. So just win the fight against him and you would come out on top. :) I see some funny LCS "big plays" with it though. Some player decides to make a bold move on Ekko, the fight ensues... Ekko is about to die, "I'VE MADE A TERRIBLE MISTAKE". Uses his ult to rewind to before the fight. Takes %HP damage... Enemy is like "better luck next time kid 8^)" and the casters get to rave about that full ham fight where nobody died but egos were bruised.
Sharjo (EUW)
: Ekko: The Boy who Shattered Time
My speculation on his time manipulation ability: It will be an ultimate that effects a radius. So he triggers the start time with R, and then he gets x amount of seconds that he can press R again to trigger. So essentially what it does is rewinds anything that was inside the radius of the skill. Not the entire map... just within the radius. This makes more sense because "contained" time control wouldn't be as OP. If it only effects a certain radius around him then I can see it working. So for example, since he is most likely melee, he could dive into a team fight, hit R to "bookmark" the time point, then fight it out and if the fight goes bad, he hits R again and everyone returns to their original positions and original HP/MP, etc... from when he first hit R. Different from Zilean because it doesn't just reverse damage done to one person, it's reversing everything in a radius. Including damage done to enemies. The only thing is that Ekko possibly takes some residual damage from it anyway... (if he took damage) So it's kind of interesting... it would allow for him to be extremely reckless in 1v1's... Like press R, go absolute HAM on your enemy laner... if things go bad, hit R and be like "just playing" and back off. :^) Both people will still have all of their HP/MP/Cooldowns exactly as they were before the fight started, except Ekko has taken a % of damage from the "fight that never happened". Basically gives him the ability to make risky plays with the reward being a kill, and the penalty being he takes some damage and the enemy goes back to normal.
: It's time riot, to update the death recap.
I'm always extremely confused when I look at the death recap and it only shows me 3 people who did like 20% damage to me. That's not useful at all. Upvoted.
iainB85 (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Konidias,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OnqHGFrU,comment-id=00170000,timestamp=2015-05-08T21:15:23.277+0000) > > You have too much faith in the community then. I've had all 4 teammates report me for not playing a meta pick AFTER the game. Even though it was their own fault we lost, somehow I get reported. > > So you honestly think people aren't going to vote yes to potentially get a teammate that they think will be better than the one trying to play an off meta champ? > > I mean there is literally no reason not to vote yes in that case. There's no punishment for it other than having to wait for another queue to pop... and that doesn't take long at all. Just keep voting out anyone who doesn't fit your meta, and eventually get the game of your dreams. It would be abused to death. I've played thousands of League of Legends games over the years, most of them ranked, and I've never had all four people report me for playing a certain champion. One, possibly two? Sure.. you can get a couple of asshats here and there, but four complete strangers completely gang up on you? That is either very rare, or you are doing more than simply picking a champion to piss people off.
> [{quoted}](name=iainB85,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OnqHGFrU,comment-id=001700000000,timestamp=2015-05-08T21:24:25.180+0000) > > I've played thousands of League of Legends games over the years, most of them ranked, and I've never had all four people report me for playing a certain champion. One, possibly two? Sure.. you can get a couple of asshats here and there, but four complete strangers completely gang up on you? That is either very rare, or you are doing more than simply picking a champion to piss people off. I guess you don't play much Quinn then. There is an intense burning hatred for Quinn, for some reason. All it takes is 1 or 2 people complaining to the team about me playing Quinn, and by the end of the match, the whole team is in agreement that I should be reported for "causing us to lose". Even if I do decently. I've had an ADC whine about us needing a tanky top laner 5 minutes into the game when he got killed in bot lane. People are so consumed with the meta that if you make any off-meta picks, they will legit get angry at you like they think you are just trolling them and keeping them in elo hell.
Ixlin (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Konidias,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OnqHGFrU,comment-id=000800000000,timestamp=2015-05-08T21:17:09.148+0000) > > It isn't the team's decision on what a person should play. That is so extremely dumb. Why bother playing at all if you can't even make your own decisions? Wait, you're going to tell me it's "teamwork". No. It's straight up _bullying_. I've had to dodge one, and been dodged in another, for wanting to play heim top. When someone tells me that they'll feed due to my completely viable choice, I dodge. So for saving my team the 20 minutes minimum it would take to surrender, I'm punished. So yeah, agreed. It is bullying. I'll stand up to it, and take the hit, but I can only justify doing that for so long, before I just don't want to play anymore.
> [{quoted}](name=Ixlin,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OnqHGFrU,comment-id=0008000000000000,timestamp=2015-05-08T21:25:58.190+0000) > > I've had to dodge one, and been dodged in another, for wanting to play heim top. > When someone tells me that they'll feed due to my completely viable choice, I dodge. So for saving my team the 20 minutes minimum it would take to surrender, I'm punished. > > So yeah, agreed. It is bullying. I'll stand up to it, and take the hit, but I can only justify doing that for so long, before I just don't want to play anymore. Same. I call Quinn mid and then someone under me will go take like Lux ADC because they think I'm trolling and now they are going to do the same. I've even picked Quinn adc and my support picks Anivia and tells me they don't "trust me" to carry, so they tried to build a full damage Anivia support and we end up not having enough tank, and the enemy destroyed us late game. Of course, the Anivia continued to blame me, even though I did really well during the match and the Anivia got a couple of kills but also died a lot and didn't get many assists... essentially she was a 2nd tier mid laner and we had no real support.
: > [{quoted}](name=Konidias,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OnqHGFrU,comment-id=000800000000,timestamp=2015-05-08T21:17:09.148+0000) > > It isn't the team's decision on what a person should play. Um, of course it is. Do soccer players make their own decisions or does the team agree on a strategy?
> [{quoted}](name=Fury and Emperor,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OnqHGFrU,comment-id=0008000000000001,timestamp=2015-05-08T21:28:14.559+0000) > > Um, of course it is. Do soccer players make their own decisions or does the team agree on a strategy? Pretty sure the coach makes the strategies... League is completely different. In ranked solo queue, you're being teamed with 4 random people. In soccer, I would assume you're part of a team you chose to be part of, and you actually semi-respect their opinions. I don't respect ANY of my teammate's opinions in LoL, because 9 times out of 10, their opinions are wrong anyway. I lost a game last night where I was split pushing and my team was grouped as 4. My team kept getting caught and wiped, and every time they did this, they would blame ME for not grouping. Even though I made no indication that I was going to group. My team kept overextending, tempting fate, and eventually getting caught. They could do this over and over, because they knew they could always just place all of the blame on me. Would it have helped if I was there? Not really. They got aced without getting a single kill. They played carelessly when they enemy team knew it was 5v4. My team did not respect MY request to not play so wrecklessly and remember they are in a 4v5. So why should I respect THEIR request to join with the group when I don't think it's the best decision? Four random people on the internet are not going to outweigh my own instincts and decision making. Sorry but that's just how it is. Is that bad teamwork? No. I will help my team when I can, and I will try to group when I feel grouping is necessary. But I'm not going to just do what my team says merely because of 1 or 2 vocal players demanding things from me while they CONTINUOUSLY make mistakes themselves.
: > [{quoted}](name=Dengeden,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OnqHGFrU,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2015-05-08T12:04:51.192+0000) > > The simplest solution (and probably what you're asking for) would be a vote to kick a player. If they get kicked often enough, they're suspended or banned. Great! Now most Bard players will get banned, joy is me! I do enjoy not being able to play my pocket picks. Perhaps you should not pick Bard when 4 out of 4 teammates don't want you to.
> [{quoted}](name=Fury and Emperor,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OnqHGFrU,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2015-05-08T20:53:59.954+0000) > > Perhaps you should not pick Bard when 4 out of 4 teammates don't want you to. It isn't the team's decision on what a person should play. That is so extremely dumb. Why bother playing at all if you can't even make your own decisions? Wait, you're going to tell me it's "teamwork". No. It's straight up _bullying_.
iainB85 (NA)
: 100% agree with OP. Most common retort: "But muh off-meta picks" It's ENTIRELY possible that 4 people could gang up on someone for picking a wonky pick that they didn't like. Is it LIKELY that all four people will be asshats and vote yes to someone who is going to try, but didn't pick the strongest meta champ? I'm willing to wager no. Therefore, I truly believe that a vote kick system would do FAR more good than harm. Just because it is POSSIBLE that someone could get wrongfully kicked, the being kick penalty should be light -- a 5 minute queue penalty and no loss of LP. If someone is repeatedly getting kicked, Riot can monitor that and take action -- as they are clearly doing something more wrong than trying to play an off-meta champion. That compromise to me is a hell of a lot better than the current "troll wins no matter what" scenario we have going on today (i.e. he forces the dodge, or forces people to play a minimum of 20 minutes in a game where he trolls it up as much as he wants to).
> [{quoted}](name=iainB85,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OnqHGFrU,comment-id=0017,timestamp=2015-05-08T20:31:21.615+0000) > > Is it LIKELY that all four people will be asshats and vote yes to someone who is going to try, but didn't pick the strongest meta champ? I'm willing to wager no. You have too much faith in the community then. I've had all 4 teammates report me for not playing a meta pick AFTER the game. Even though it was their own fault we lost, somehow I get reported. So you honestly think people aren't going to vote yes to potentially get a teammate that they think will be better than the one trying to play an off meta champ? I mean there is literally no reason not to vote yes in that case. There's no punishment for it other than having to wait for another queue to pop... and that doesn't take long at all. Just keep voting out anyone who doesn't fit your meta, and eventually get the game of your dreams. It would be abused to death.
Kodda (NA)
: Towers feel underwhelming
Honestly I think the turrets are fine. They are decent protection early game, and by mid-late game, you need to be protecting THEM. It's a nice switch. Making them too strong will make all games take 10+ minutes longer which is just unnecessary. Making them weaker will make them absolutely moot. I get that it's annoying when the enemy team tower dives... but you should be cautious of enemies at all times... There shouldn't be a 100% safe zone you can stand in where enemies will get shredded if they attack you. Turrets just add supplementary damage... Think of them like that, and you won't be so mad when you die to a tower dive. Too often I see my teammates standing under tower getting dived and they don't react... they just hope the tower does all the damage to kill the enemy. They don't bother to try and disengage the enemy or CC them or anything... or even bother to try and run or dodge skillshots... They just stand there and hope the tower does damage. I think there is a bit too much dependence on towers.
: Why can people still Troll in Champ select and not get punished for it...
1. Someone picking a champ you don't think works with the comp is not trolling. 2. Your report idea is dumb. It would basically allow the majority to dictate what champs are playable and can lead to ganging up on a person. Not to mention the threats of being kicked. 3. It would not do anything to deter trolls. They would just not make the trolling as obvious in champ select. If they are just trolling to get someone to dodge what they feel is a bad match for them, then there is a different issue we need to tackle. 4. Let me just emphasize number 2 again. Your idea would literally cause some champs to NEVER get played. The least popular champs would just get votekicked out by the majority of players who are so obsessed with meta and team composition that they aren't going to allow for variety or thinking outside the box. You either pick the most popular "OP" champs for whichever role you are assigned, or you get kicked. This is nonsense and this is the sole reason such a system is not being implemented. I just want to make one last thing clear: I do not want close-minded people dictating this game. By that I mean people who assume other players are "trolling" because they choose off-meta picks.... or they choose not to jungle as last pick when the team "needs" a jungler. So what? There is no clearly defined rule stating a person HAS to jungle. It's just the way the meta has been formed. You can't report the guy for trolling just for not taking smite. You also cannot report people for "refusing to communicate" when you demand they do things during a match and they don't do what you demand. You don't get to be a dictator for 30+ minutes while everyone else does your bidding. That is not teamwork in the slightest. People need to get this "majority rules" mindset out of their heads. Even if all 4 players say "go play this role and this champ" the 5th player is not obligated to listen to them. It doesn't mean the 5th player doesn't want to work as a team, they just don't agree with the other players. It happens. Teamwork is making the best of 5 random people playing together. If you think it's about majority voting and whatever is popular is right, then you should just uninstall this game.
: New Black Cleaver on solo lane Quinn
No. It was decent before it got changed. Now it's garbage for Quinn. Build BotRK + IE + LW + Phantom/Shiv in most situations. If the enemy has heavy AP I rush a Maw and a Merc Scim... those 2 items vs like 3 AP enemies = GG. Easiest game of my life.
: She is a midlane god IMHO, she is basically an Anti assassin, i've played her a lot lately and my kills with her have been high, the only person i've struggled against is swain because of his stun, which a more skilled player could avoid with E.
> [{quoted}](name=MasterCorgi,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=x7xRQl44,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2015-04-08T16:06:12.204+0000) > > She is a midlane god IMHO, she is basically an Anti assassin, i've played her a lot lately and my kills with her have been high, the only person i've struggled against is swain because of his stun, which a more skilled player could avoid with E. She absolutely poops on Zed. I love those mid match-ups vs Zed because the Zed player always underestimates me and I get early first blood. :) In this tank focused meta, Quinn struggles more than she ever has. But if you take advantage of her strengths, it shouldn't matter. When playing Quinn, you need to be 110% aggressive all game. Literally. All. Game. Whenever I go Quinn top on red side, I ward the enemy top jungle after minions spawn (right near gromp) and usually I can throw a couple of blinds at the jungler as he starts Gromp. This can set the jungler back SO MUCH. He misses a couple of autos on gromp and takes my Q damage. I can also try to hit my top laner who is leashing for their jungler too. Once in lane I play super aggressive and push lane hard. I get level 2 first and I am relentless with Quinn. Every time passive procs on the enemy I am charging at them to land my AA. I push them off the wave, zone them, make them lose farm... keep outleveling and outfarming them... and I keep an extra cautious eye out for ganks as I know I'm going to attract attention. Do this with the intent on attracting the enemy jungler, back off when they come... then rinse and repeat. You will oppress the enemy top laner, take top tower early, put them WAY behind, and then you can roam around freely and help other lanes. Again, you have to GO HARD. But one thing I discourage is trying to all-in fight the enemy right away. You want to make sure you are poking them down a lot before an all in fight to ensure your win. If the enemy comes at you aggressive, just counter it with a bit of defense and then counter-aggression when the enemy backs off. No enemy will keep charging at you when you are out trading them. Anyway, I would put her at a 7 overall. If she had a few tweaks she'd be extremely viable at all times. But due to her massive fall off late game, she gets a 7. She just can't do much late game vs 2-3 tanks on the enemy team. A full build level 18 Quinn is so weak against full build tanks.. Even when you build anti-tank like BotRK + Black Cleaver + LW. She just gets crapped on by all the CC and it takes her too long to kill anything... plus she can't get to the squishes through 2-3 tanks. Her assassination potential is only viable if the enemy squishies keep going out alone. If they stick to their support, Quinn is neutered. Oh, and take teleport on Quinn if you play her top and mid lane. This meshes well with my strategy. It lets you get back to lane fast to keep your lead on the opponent and it lets you also teleport anywhere on the map to win team fights or do surprise ganks. It's also extremely useful late game for split pushing... I just find that heal isn't needed as you shouldn't be in situations that require it, and ignite is overused and your enemy plays more cautiously when you have it. There is still some cheese tactic with ignite but honestly I've been doing better with the aggression + TP than anything else.
Xonra (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=LeeDark,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HeQUYxNN,comment-id=000a000000000000,timestamp=2015-05-08T05:12:55.684+0000) > > I got quite a lot of points doing well in a losing game. Maybe you just sucked. One of many reasons Riot and the community won't care about this in a few months. Even things with the best of intentions end up turning into a pissing contest because of people like this. - Honor system turned into a pissing contest over who had ribbons, people insulting others because they didn't - New ranked system and people insulting anyone below them in rank, the term "bronzy" etc. Good intentions, salty people turned it into something negative. - Already people insulting others (I've seen it plenty) for getting anything but an A at the end of a game, insulting someone for doing "worse" grade wise, etc. This is...quite literally...why we can't have nice things.
> [{quoted}](name=Xonra,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HeQUYxNN,comment-id=000a0000000000000000,timestamp=2015-05-08T05:20:12.654+0000) > > - Already people insulting others (I've seen it plenty) for getting anything but an A at the end of a game, insulting someone for doing "worse" grade wise, etc. You've seen it plenty, eh? **_EXCEPT YOU CANNOT SEE OTHER PEOPLE'S GRADES._** Get out of here with your propaganda BS. Dude I have no idea why you're trying to stir up crap for no reason. This is the absolute worst lie I've ever seen on these forums just for the sake of being dramatic about something.
: 1. I mentioned in the long run, it should balance out. While it is hard to say what the long run is, I doubt it's more than 200 games for most people. 2. Again, you go through promos enough times, you should be able to get through. 3. The number of undesirables vastly outnumbers the number of actual smurfs to the point of insignificance.
> [{quoted}](name=Daedalus871,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FMJAH5lj,comment-id=000200020000,timestamp=2015-05-06T23:23:35.095+0000) > > 1. I mentioned in the long run, it should balance out. While it is hard to say what the long run is, I doubt it's more than 200 games for most people. > > 2. Again, you go through promos enough times, you should be able to get through. > > 3. The number of undesirables vastly outnumbers the number of actual smurfs to the point of insignificance. 1. We need actual numbers. Why spit out all these numbers and equations when proving your odds and then forget the part where variance comes in to play? Again, the math does not matter if you leave out crucial pieces of information. "I doubt it's more than 200 games" is not mathematical evidence 2. How many times? Few enough to be reasonable? I don't want to hear "should" I want to hear "will" 3. Proof? Records showing number of smurfs per game vs number of trolls/afks/unskilled? All I keep seeing is "well this basic math says you should win more than lose if you are good enough" but I fail to see anyone explaining the variance and estimated number of games you have to play for the math to work. There is MUCH more to factor into each match-up. You need to not only look at the odds of your team getting undesirable players vs the opposing team, but also your team vs their team getting a smurf, your team vs their team getting someone around your own skill level, etc. If I get matched up against another team and both sides don't have any undesirable players, but I'm leagues better than the rest of my team... and they have a single person who is leagues better than the rest of their team, then the match boils down to which one of us gets fed harder... and that can be tough considering we don't know which of us is actually most skilled until it's too late. Maybe that Nidalee jungle on the opposing team is an equal match to me, but my team fed her 5 kills before I realized how good she was... Now I have to get 5 kills to catch up, or their team is at a significant advantage. I was just dominating top lane and maybe killed the top laner once or twice, but Nidalee roamed around and got multiple successful ganks. So I lose this game because of dumb luck, and it was actually a game I could have potentially won had I known who to look out for. Then maybe next game I get an AFK.. 2 losses in a row. Then next game I get 2 people arguing all match and they do poorly and we lose. 3 losses in a row. The way people talk, you would think the next 4 games I should easily win... but that is never the case. Maybe I easy win 5-6 games in a row and get to series, and then I get the AFK/trolls 2 games straight and lose my series. Yay, now I have to win 5-6 more games just to potentially have the same thing happen. This does not prove ANYTHING about my skill level at all. It just proves I'm unlucky. It's an unnecessary grind. Put me with players at my level please. That's all I want. Because to me, most every game feels like the game is trying to handicap me by giving me the worst teammates while the enemy team seems to be at least semi-organized and competent. The few games I win are just total stomps where the enemy team gets steamrolled.
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Konidias

Level 30 (NA)
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