Keyru (NA)
: Boards Moderation Discord Verification
Waitapy (EUNE)
: Thank you , but is there any way i can downoload that on my PC in pdf or txt ... ?
> [{quoted}](name=Waitapy,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=004d,timestamp=2017-11-10T20:33:38.602+0000) > > Thank you , but is there any way i can downoload that on my PC in pdf or txt ... ? If you go to the document and press file in the top left you can download it and convert into pdf, ect.
Shifty52 (NA)
: I'm currently treating this document like the Bible or Mobafire Kappa. Amazing job i never thought about using lethal tempo on Jhin that's brilliant. PS. How does dark harvest work? Does it consume the souls when you hit something or do you need a certain amount for the bonus damage i cant figure it out.
> [{quoted}](name=Shifty52,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0047,timestamp=2017-11-09T20:02:36.528+0000) > > I'm currently treating this document like the Bible or Mobafire Kappa. Amazing job i never thought about using lethal tempo on Jhin that's brilliant. > > PS. How does dark harvest work? Does it consume the souls when you hit something or do you need a certain amount for the bonus damage i cant figure it out. Thanks, though a lot of people are taking fleet of footwork too for kiting potential. Lethal for games where kiting isn't as necessary. In lane both your canon and the enemy canon drop 4 souls each. In jungle each large monster drops 2, including scuttle. Champions drop 6. You have to walk near it to pick it up. Once you absorb stacks your next attack in the next 20 seconds does more damage. After 150 stacks, this duration increases to 5 minutes. This is a late game based rune.
Sabody (EUW)
: The runes are great, the description too. But what if I play something like middlesticks? It's currently even better than jungle sticks
> [{quoted}](name=Sabody,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0044,timestamp=2017-11-09T09:04:44.091+0000) > > The runes are great, the description too. But what if I play something like middlesticks? It's currently even better than jungle sticks Middlesticks could go electrocute pretty well, e w when near enemy minions or more then 1 champ and its an easy proc, and with ult its easy to proc too. If you plan on doing protobelt glacial augment is an idea. Hell you could do kleptomancy since its really good on ranged champs currently. I'd test those ideas out, though I think I would always go into inspiration regardless for perfect timing and magical footwear/future market/approach velocity/summoners insight
Clauś (EUW)
: Where is the Velkoz page tho? :D I think you forgot him ^^
> [{quoted}](name=Godwin92,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0045,timestamp=2017-11-09T16:37:08.442+0000) > > Where is the Velkoz page tho? :D I think you forgot him ^^ Its there, ctrl f koz and it should come up
Anzotrix (EUW)
: Just took a look at the kled one, as i was struggling choosing between press the attack (for the synergy with 2 as you've mentioned), or taking something like aftershock in resolve as the q and ult will give u the resistances and then some damage on top. one thing i didnt like thought was your choice of the second tree. i dont think you need to focus on adaptive stats in the river, cause kled isnt really played in that way from my knowledge. you either bully out lane. or ult mid or bot from a recall, then tp top after. consider domination tree as it gives you ways and benefits of entering fights? such as sudden impact. other than that, nice work ,uch love <3
> [{quoted}](name=NHS Profit,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0041,timestamp=2017-11-08T15:53:19.269+0000) > > Just took a look at the kled one, as i was struggling choosing between press the attack (for the synergy with 2 as you&#x27;ve mentioned), or taking something like aftershock in resolve as the q and ult will give u the resistances and then some damage on top. one thing i didnt like thought was your choice of the second tree. i dont think you need to focus on adaptive stats in the river, cause kled isnt really played in that way from my knowledge. you either bully out lane. or ult mid or bot from a recall, then tp top after. consider domination tree as it gives you ways and benefits of entering fights? such as sudden impact. other than that, nice work ,uch love &lt;3 I think resolve may be better as a primary tree now in general. It synergizes with his passive and yeah I think either grasp or aftershock are great for him too as well as demolish and other hp related runes. I think sorcery is also not that great after playing some games for kled. I'll edit this sooner or later.
: for {{champion:76}} http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/featured/preseason-update/8100-8112?build=10222147 is obvious you can argue to change waterwalking to something else.. but i have done some serious testing and this is BY FAR the best. celerity makes the whole thing work
> [{quoted}](name=SwiftKitten88,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0043,timestamp=2017-11-08T18:30:07.227+0000) > > for {{champion:76}} > > http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/featured/preseason-update/8100-8112?build=10222147 > is obvious > > you can argue to change waterwalking to something else.. but i have done some serious testing and this is BY FAR the best. > celerity makes the whole thing work Yeah thats fine, secondary trees can be changed based on what you vs in pretty much all cases.
Siachi (NA)
: What are your thoughts on either Presence of Mind or Manaflow Band for Sivir? She has pretty costly spells early, so I feel like one or both of these could go a long way to have her keep up the pressure early.
> [{quoted}](name=Siachi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0042,timestamp=2017-11-08T18:27:33.014+0000) > > What are your thoughts on either Presence of Mind or Manaflow Band for Sivir? She has pretty costly spells early, so I feel like one or both of these could go a long way to have her keep up the pressure early. Can work, if you believe there will be constant trades especially. Presence of mind is OK but to be honest triumph and overheal are generally better even on sivir. Sorcery second tree can easily work especially with gathering storm.
: Thanks for responding. The 5% every tick on Malz is crazy. If that is true then this is incredibly op. I read it to mean 5% per dot spell not per tick of dot spell. As for Nocturne, imo he really is a snowball champion. Once games get past the 30 minute mark I find closing a match starts to ramp up in difficulty as he falls off. I understand that Dark Harvest does surpass Electrocute at some point. It just seems to me that the Electrocute damage: 50-220 (.5 Bonus AD) (.3 AP) will hit harder a majority of the first 25 minutes of the match. I know there are many variables involved but have you done any testing on dark harvest to see generally at what point in the game it surpasses Electrocute in damage based off of average jungle farming numbers?
> [{quoted}](name=Seto Ka1ba,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=003f00000000,timestamp=2017-11-07T21:29:38.257+0000) > > Thanks for responding. The 5% every tick on Malz is crazy. If that is true then this is incredibly op. I read it to mean 5% per dot spell not per tick of dot spell. > > As for Nocturne, imo he really is a snowball champion. Once games get past the 30 minute mark I find closing a match starts to ramp up in difficulty as he falls off. I understand that Dark Harvest does surpass Electrocute at some point. It just seems to me that the Electrocute damage: 50-220 (.5 Bonus AD) (.3 AP) will hit harder a majority of the first 25 minutes of the match. I know there are many variables involved but have you done any testing on dark harvest to see generally at what point in the game it surpasses Electrocute in damage based off of average jungle farming numbers? Electrocute is definitely better early game theres no doubt. However, rather then 25 minutes, I think dark harvest is better at 15 minutes which is around 150 soul stacks at least where the duration of soul charged is increased to 300 seconds. This isnt hard to reach because nocturne clears raptors and krugs better then other junglers. Once at 150, which lets say you get at level 9, thats 60+0.25 bonus ad +150 where electrocute is 140+.5 bonus ad. Dark harvest will be up more often as well, but is situational compared to electrocute which is easily proc'd. In general its playstyle based, and I recommend testing it when it hits live in custom or bots games to effectimize your jungle route while playing with dark harvest. The two keystones allow for different play styles basically. Hell you could even take predator for ganks without ult.
: First off this is awesome! Thanks for putting it together. My two best champs in league are Malzahar and Nocturne and I have a question regarding each. For Malz you put that Arcane Comet is great because of the cdr of the comet on dot champs. To me the patch notes seem to say that you get the least amount of cdr on comet for dot abilities. Could you help me understand what I am missing? For Nocturne you put that Dark Harvest is stronger than Electrocute. But when looking at the patch notes it looks as if Electrocute has higher base damage and scaling when compared to Dark Harvest. What am I missing here? Once again this list is awesome! Thank you for doing it and continuing to answer questions and improve it.
> [{quoted}](name=Seto Ka1ba,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=003f,timestamp=2017-11-07T19:20:18.650+0000) > > First off this is awesome! Thanks for putting it together. My two best champs in league are Malzahar and Nocturne and I have a question regarding each. > > For Malz you put that Arcane Comet is great because of the cdr of the comet on dot champs. To me the patch notes seem to say that you get the least amount of cdr on comet for dot abilities. Could you help me understand what I am missing? > > For Nocturne you put that Dark Harvest is stronger than Electrocute. But when looking at the patch notes it looks as if Electrocute has higher base damage and scaling when compared to Dark Harvest. What am I missing here? > > Once again this list is awesome! Thank you for doing it and continuing to answer questions and improve it. For arcane comet on malz, Malzahars E ticks every half second for 4 seconds meaning the cd should be reduced 8 times for 40% with one e. Thats why its really good. Its 5% reduced per tick of damage for dot. Nocturne ganks usually consist of ult into burst, which is why dark harvest does a lot. Dark harvest damage outscales electrocute with enough souls. The formula is here: Bonus damage: 40 - 80 (+0.25 bonus AD) (+0.2 AP) + soul essence collected. The +soul essence collected is the big deal as each soul adds base damage. Champions - 6 soul essence // Monsters - 2 soul essence // Minions - 4 soul essence. This base damage adds up and while its slightly weaker early to electrocute, with the farming until ult is off cd playstyle its really good. If you plan on ganking a lot early or just not farming a whole lot take electrocute.
: I love this so much <3 you are an amazing human being for doing this
> [{quoted}](name=TheEvilQueen135,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=003c,timestamp=2017-11-02T22:58:12.351+0000) > > I love this so much &lt;3 you are an amazing human being for doing this Thanks
Siachi (NA)
: I'm sort of disagreeing with the Rumble build, just because you're underestimating how much of a playmaker Zhonyas is for him. I think he could reasonably run an Inspiration Page with Glacial Augment; The longer you can force them in your Flamespitter, the better! Granted, it has been a long time since I've played Rumble, so I could just be out of the meta. Even if you're not going to make it your main tree, I feel like getting a Zhonyas effect early and perhaps the Approach Velocity effect (You've got slows with your harpoons) can be pretty useful for what Rumble wants to do: Burn everything he can for as long as possible.
> [{quoted}](name=Siachi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0025,timestamp=2017-11-01T22:24:33.470+0000) > > I&#x27;m sort of disagreeing with the Rumble build, just because you&#x27;re underestimating how much of a playmaker Zhonyas is for him. I think he could reasonably run an Inspiration Page with Glacial Augment; The longer you can force them in your Flamespitter, the better! > > Granted, it has been a long time since I&#x27;ve played Rumble, so I could just be out of the meta. Even if you&#x27;re not going to make it your main tree, I feel like getting a Zhonyas effect early and perhaps the Approach Velocity effect (You&#x27;ve got slows with your harpoons) can be pretty useful for what Rumble wants to do: Burn everything he can for as long as possible. Actually I completely forgot about how he uses zhyonas to make plays all the time. That's completely my fault. Glacial augment could be better but to be honest taking it without building something to proc the slowfield is kinda underwhelming. Not just that, but rumble usually gets his full q off anyway in the center of lane, well at least I do. Either way I don't think the slow is really necessary when rumble already has a great slow. Maybe I'm wrong. I will definitely make his second tree inspiration though. Thanks for your input.
: Tossing in my Rek'Sai main hat in here (and tossing the ultimate hat out). I like the Primary tree, but you're wrong about something. No damage amps will increase the E damage, as it's true damage. It does its listed damage, no amps or reductions. Still the right path I'd say. For the secondary, I prefer Domination with Sudden Impact and Relentless Hunter, though I'm the type of person who invades, heavy ganks, and goes for as much blood as possible early. My style is to absolutely take over the game and win before I fall off, so this better suits me. I don't like the situationalness of Waterwalking. I do most of my fighting in lanes or in the enemy jungle, and I don't get much as a result of this. As for the hat I think it takes too long to scale up. By the time you're getting good value from it, the game should be over. Besides, I rarely have the issue of waiting on my ult CD anyway. Warrior > Cleaver gets me 30% CDR and that covers it just fine.
> [{quoted}](name=DarkenedAuras,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0026,timestamp=2017-11-01T22:28:30.659+0000) > > Tossing in my Rek&#x27;Sai main hat in here (and tossing the ultimate hat out). > > I like the Primary tree, but you&#x27;re wrong about something. No damage amps will increase the E damage, as it&#x27;s true damage. It does its listed damage, no amps or reductions. Still the right path I&#x27;d say. > > For the secondary, I prefer Domination with Sudden Impact and Relentless Hunter, though I&#x27;m the type of person who invades, heavy ganks, and goes for as much blood as possible early. My style is to absolutely take over the game and win before I fall off, so this better suits me. I don&#x27;t like the situationalness of Waterwalking. I do most of my fighting in lanes or in the enemy jungle, and I don&#x27;t get much as a result of this. As for the hat I think it takes too long to scale up. By the time you&#x27;re getting good value from it, the game should be over. Besides, I rarely have the issue of waiting on my ult CD anyway. Warrior &gt; Cleaver gets me 30% CDR and that covers it just fine. Don't know how I missed this yesterday, may bad. I'll make it better clarification in the description. I'll definitly include secondary trees could be different depending on what you need. Yeah domination does look better here though I think ravenous hunter could also work too. I agree with hat probably taking too long, as time as gone on more and more people are saying how ultimate hat is very specific to champs that don't build much cdr. Will note that in. Thanks for your input.
: I'll be sure to give your Malzahar page a try since I haven't actually tried Arcane Comet on him myself (though I admit it sounds like the best one on paper). I've mainly been having a ton of fun with the utility setup from Glacial Augment, free Stopwatch, free Magic Boots, the Ultimate Hat, and building Hextech GLP to complement the keystone. Like I said, still haven't tried for a more damage-oriented Rune page, but the I think the utility route is more than viable. Free mini Rylais at level 1 and I outplayed a few times with the unexpected Stopwatch lol. Being in AA range isn't exactly something Malzahar excels at, though, with all his abilities outranging his basics. Otherwise Press the Attack would be pretty fun. 3 AA's for psuedo DFG effect could work well with certain mages like Oriana.
> [{quoted}](name=TheUltimateLife,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0033,timestamp=2017-11-02T08:56:47.788+0000) > > I&#x27;ll be sure to give your Malzahar page a try since I haven&#x27;t actually tried Arcane Comet on him myself (though I admit it sounds like the best one on paper). I&#x27;ve mainly been having a ton of fun with the utility setup from Glacial Augment, free Stopwatch, free Magic Boots, the Ultimate Hat, and building Hextech GLP to complement the keystone. > > Like I said, still haven&#x27;t tried for a more damage-oriented Rune page, but the I think the utility route is more than viable. Free mini Rylais at level 1 and I outplayed a few times with the unexpected Stopwatch lol. Being in AA range isn&#x27;t exactly something Malzahar excels at, though, with all his abilities outranging his basics. Otherwise Press the Attack would be pretty fun. 3 AA&#x27;s for psuedo DFG effect could work well with certain mages like Oriana. Yeah I'm sure theres a lot of options for malz, though press the attack doesn't work on pets to my knowledge (could be wrong). I think malz range is pretty good for glacial augment especially in mid where there are many mid range champs. Glacial augment might be better against mobility-less champs like syndra allowing your w to do a lot more damage.
Mimr (EUW)
: Awesome! Must've taken a lot of time. Some things I don't agree with: - Hecarim: Solid page, but I don't think he needs Predator as a keystone. You're going to reach your target without it anyway. Predators' CD is huge, and Hecarim procs Electrocute really easily anyway (E+Q when you hit your target, then activate W. First tick will proc Electrocute). - Xin: I don't think XZ has enough uptime to go with Tempo. Would personally take Press the Attack. - Nocturne: Would swap Water Walking for Celerity, it's good synergy with his Q. Noc also procs Electrocute very easily (RQE or RE+aa if you miss Q) so depending on which does more damage I'd take Electrocute over Dark Harvest.
> [{quoted}](name=Mimr,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0038,timestamp=2017-11-02T16:35:55.564+0000) > > Awesome! Must&#x27;ve taken a lot of time. Some things I don&#x27;t agree with: > > - Hecarim: Solid page, but I don&#x27;t think he needs Predator as a keystone. You&#x27;re going to reach your target without it anyway. Predators&#x27; CD is huge, and Hecarim procs Electrocute really easily anyway (E+Q when you hit your target, then activate W. First tick will proc Electrocute). > - Xin: I don&#x27;t think XZ has enough uptime to go with Tempo. Would personally take Press the Attack. > - Nocturne: Would swap Water Walking for Celerity, it&#x27;s good synergy with his Q. Noc also procs Electrocute very easily (RQE or RE+aa if you miss Q) so depending on which does more damage I&#x27;d take Electrocute over Dark Harvest. I think predator is a good option because you can go from top to mid or vice versa VERY quickly. The cd is high, however you can take ingenious hunter to fix that, which I should of put. I agree with you though, electrocute is a great option for damage so I will include that in the description. I disagree for xin, xin is a naturally sticky champion meaning he stays on his target in this case because of his e where he can just walk up aa them and e after they burn gapclosers. Xin has really good synergy with attack speed due to his passive, q and making ult last longer. Press the attack isn't as pleasing here because after xin's 3 q's, the damage that follows isn't as big and is harder to follow up on because of less attack speed, if that makes sense. I agree though press the attack is better for team fighting and I would take it if I were going a tankier build. For nocturne, after doing some math yeah celerity IS better mostly because it gives nocturne around 13 extra ms from the 4% as opposed to water walking which is ONLY in the river. The difference is that one is out of combat and one isn't. Nocturne q with his bonus ms grants him a decent amount and works well with his kit so yeah you are definitely right here. Will change this. Thanks for your input.
: For Urgot, wouldn't it be better to go into inspiration? Take glacial augment and you can skip the frozen mallet. though that may result in more of a Tankgot situation.
> [{quoted}](name=Kerrigan 4 Prez,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0035,timestamp=2017-11-02T11:58:23.388+0000) > > For Urgot, wouldn&#x27;t it be better to go into inspiration? Take glacial augment and you can skip the frozen mallet. though that may result in more of a Tankgot situation. I don't recommend taking glacial augment when not using items that proc it unless given special circumstances. While the slow is useful late game, early its a 7 second cd and you don't really need a slow to stay in w range. Even then, Urgot already features a good slow on his q and displacement with e, so I don't believe he needs this. Besides that everything in inspiration isn't very good for him except maybe approach velocity. Press the attack is great because after 1 second you'll do 12% more damage which is more damage overall then adding AD from another tree and works WONDERS in team fights. I know the attack speed probably feels bad but at the very least it will help with csing under tower.
: Looked at your olaf one, I play Olaf a decent bit and lethal tempo is probably the best keystone with overheal bloodline and last stand. Probably secondary would be sorcery with manaflow and whatever you want last. Depends on a lot of things I personally would probably go celerity. If you need an explanation feel free to ask.
> [{quoted}](name=GedweyStenr,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0036,timestamp=2017-11-02T13:32:40.872+0000) > > Looked at your olaf one, I play Olaf a decent bit and lethal tempo is probably the best keystone with overheal bloodline and last stand. Probably secondary would be sorcery with manaflow and whatever you want last. Depends on a lot of things I personally would probably go celerity. > > If you need an explanation feel free to ask. I think if you are going dps olaf yeah thats a good idea, someone else pointed out predator does pretty well for olaf ganks so thats more towards tank olaf. Overall I think your page is best for top lane though it could be used in jungle and I included it, There was another page for tank jungle. Thanks for your input.
Jaspers (EUW)
: This is great, good work. But you didn't take demolish on Nasus or Yorick?
> [{quoted}](name=Antergaton,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0039,timestamp=2017-11-02T16:51:18.353+0000) > > This is great, good work. But you didn&#x27;t take demolish on Nasus or Yorick? Thanks. I mentioned in yoricks description you can take demolish. Nasus CAN take it but he actually destroys towers with aa q's faster then demolish does which does have a decent channel. Its fairly debatable if he should take it. Demolish is more for champs with little damage to towers like say nautilus with a lot of health.
: For an Olaf Jungle page, My opinion is that while building him mostly tanky, he effectively operates as a way to start a fight by sprinting in. Enemies then either have to A- Fight the Olaf with the rest of his team right behind him B- Attempt to engage through the Olaf (usually not a great decision ;) C-Disengage Completely He also clears well and has good early presence and dueling power. So here is what I will run (when I am done having fun with lethal tempo) Domination- Predator- Similar to Hecarim, he is based around his movement speed as it is his gapcloser. So Predator gives him yet another way to gank along with Ghost, Ragnarok, and Rightous Glory Cheap Shot- Cheap, effective early game damage that works after his Axe is thrown, also makes dueling a bit easier. Zombie Ward- I have no clue why, but to me, this seems broken on anyone who gets red ward (i.e. junglers and supports) although I would consider taking Ghost Poro for high invade champions, which Olaf is decently effective at. Ravenous Hunter- Believe it or not, I think any of the three in the bottom tier are usable, however I see less of a need for movement speed with Predator Boots, which means I would rather have additional sustain when I am the one engaging into the entire enemy team. Resolve- Font of Life- Late in the game, Olaf isn't the biggest tank, or the baddest fighter, but he does provide an easy to hit slow for font of life, which means when a team follows him up, they can get some good healing off of a 4 man axe. Overgrowth- I would say that attaining 40 CS per 10 minutes on Olaf is rather easy, which means you can get 1% of your total health per 10 minutes, which on a build which includes Cinderhulk and items potentially like Deadmans, Titanic Hydra, Spirit Visage, ect, you can get some incredible gold value for simply doing what jungler do. Second Option- Precision Precision has some nice stats for an Olaf, Overheal would likely not have much use, as Olaf likes to fight with low health, but Triumph, the Legends stacks (Alacrity, Tenacity, or Bloodline), and especially last stand are good on Olaf, which could be options to look at to replace Resolve, or if you are running Primary Precision for Lethal Tempo.
> [{quoted}](name=Gold Bird Guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=003b,timestamp=2017-11-02T17:36:08.873+0000) > > For an Olaf Jungle page, > My opinion is that while building him mostly tanky, he effectively operates as a way to start a fight by sprinting in. Enemies then either have to > A- Fight the Olaf with the rest of his team right behind him > B- Attempt to engage through the Olaf (usually not a great decision ;) > C-Disengage Completely > He also clears well and has good early presence and dueling power. So here is what I will run (when I am done having fun with lethal tempo) > Domination- > > Predator- Similar to Hecarim, he is based around his movement speed as it is his gapcloser. So Predator gives him yet another way to gank along with Ghost, Ragnarok, and Rightous Glory > > Cheap Shot- Cheap, effective early game damage that works after his Axe is thrown, also makes dueling a bit easier. > > Zombie Ward- I have no clue why, but to me, this seems broken on anyone who gets red ward (i.e. junglers and supports) although I would consider taking Ghost Poro for high invade champions, which Olaf is decently effective at. > > Ravenous Hunter- Believe it or not, I think any of the three in the bottom tier are usable, however I see less of a need for movement speed with Predator Boots, which means I would rather have additional sustain when I am the one engaging into the entire enemy team. > > Resolve- > > Font of Life- Late in the game, Olaf isn&#x27;t the biggest tank, or the baddest fighter, but he does provide an easy to hit slow for font of life, which means when a team follows him up, they can get some good healing off of a 4 man axe. > > Overgrowth- I would say that attaining 40 CS per 10 minutes on Olaf is rather easy, which means you can get 1% of your total health per 10 minutes, which on a build which includes Cinderhulk and items potentially like Deadmans, Titanic Hydra, Spirit Visage, ect, you can get some incredible gold value for simply doing what jungler do. > > Second Option- Precision > Precision has some nice stats for an Olaf, Overheal would likely not have much use, as Olaf likes to fight with low health, but Triumph, the Legends stacks (Alacrity, Tenacity, or Bloodline), and especially last stand are good on Olaf, which could be options to look at to replace Resolve, or if you are running Primary Precision for Lethal Tempo. Noted. The only thing I disagree with here is font of life, with 3k health it only heals 35 hp and thats not nearly as good as iron skins early sustain boost in the jungle IMO. Thanks for writing all this.
: I would like to note that Kleptomancy on bot Ezreal is both hysterical and disgustingly broken. He can literally go to lane with just {{item:1027}} and {{item:1004}} and use all the free health bots from Klepto to sustain yourself until you get enough gold to buy {{item:3070}} and {{item:3057}}. Kleptomancy on Ezreal makes sustain items worthless. There is no reason to get health pots or even lifesteal on it. You hit your midgame at like 10 minutes. Its amazing.
> [{quoted}](name=Centerpoint360,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0032,timestamp=2017-11-02T06:05:18.297+0000) > > I would like to note that Kleptomancy on bot Ezreal is both hysterical and disgustingly broken. He can literally go to lane with just {{item:1027}} and {{item:1004}} and use all the free health bots from Klepto to sustain yourself until you get enough gold to buy {{item:3070}} and {{item:3057}}. > > Kleptomancy on Ezreal makes sustain items worthless. There is no reason to get health pots or even lifesteal on it. You hit your midgame at like 10 minutes. Its amazing. Noted.
Unvictus (NA)
: Big thumbs up for all your hard work! I main {{champion:55}} and I was quite delighted to see that you built the exact same rune page that i've been using on the PBE.
> [{quoted}](name=Unvictus,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=002b,timestamp=2017-11-01T23:49:07.612+0000) > > Big thumbs up for all your hard work! I main {{champion:55}} and I was quite delighted to see that you built the exact same rune page that i&#x27;ve been using on the PBE. Thanks, kat is champ I like to play for fun because of her really cool 1v5 potential. Though my confidence in ranked with her is well, not there.
: You spelled Taliyah wrong :P (But on the D/L you should fix that)
> [{quoted}](name=scribbles782,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=002e,timestamp=2017-11-02T01:03:54.961+0000) > > You spelled Taliyah wrong :P (But on the D/L you should fix that) curse you google auto-correct
EkyonKun (NA)
: I like how you thought outside the box for Annie! Glacial + Protobelt is honestly something I've never thought of before. I assumed you'd just stick Arcane Comet on her and call it a day, but you actually put a bit of thought behind her rune build. I can't speak for the entire list (Who could?) but for Annie, I still believe Unsealed Spellbook is ideal for her. Having more flash engages + the ability to swap ignite for ghost or TP is extremely good for her. Considering how much she can dish out from a flash engage, just the 25% Summoner CDR alone is perfectly suited toward her. Fantastic list by the way.
> [{quoted}](name=EkyonKun,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=002f,timestamp=2017-11-02T02:08:18.503+0000) > > I like how you thought outside the box for Annie! Glacial + Protobelt is honestly something I&#x27;ve never thought of before. I assumed you&#x27;d just stick Arcane Comet on her and call it a day, but you actually put a bit of thought behind her rune build. > > I can&#x27;t speak for the entire list (Who could?) but for Annie, I still believe Unsealed Spellbook is ideal for her. Having more flash engages + the ability to swap ignite for ghost or TP is extremely good for her. Considering how much she can dish out from a flash engage, just the 25% Summoner CDR alone is perfectly suited toward her. Fantastic list by the way. For some games I agree annie could take summoner specialist especially if not building protobelt. I'll edit this in, thanks. I don't WANT to take arcane comet on a lot of these champs, but there's limited opportunities unfortunately. Annie has a better time using inspiration for so many reasons so that feels pretty nice.
: Not every champ has Dark Harvest 2/10 /s Nice stuff dude!
> [{quoted}](name=Sleeper Cell,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0031,timestamp=2017-11-02T04:18:37.606+0000) > > Not every champ has Dark Harvest 2/10 > > /s Nice stuff dude! thanks lol, sorry I'm not vandril
XeroKimo (NA)
: I also did some testing, close range battle mages like Rumble, Karthus and Swain might benefit more from Aery than comet especially in early game, being so close to your target, Aery travels back to you pretty quickly, it's possible to proc it twice within 5 seconds, which deals more total damage than comet Late game, Comet can outdo Aery just because if you constantly hit your spells, you can probably proc is twice within 5 seconds
> [{quoted}](name=XeroKimo,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=001e00000000,timestamp=2017-11-01T23:56:47.384+0000) > > I also did some testing, close range battle mages like Rumble, Karthus and Swain might benefit more from Aery than comet especially in early game, being so close to your target, Aery travels back to you pretty quickly, it&#x27;s possible to proc it twice within 5 seconds, which deals more total damage than comet > > Late game, Comet can outdo Aery just because if you constantly hit your spells, you can probably proc is twice within 5 seconds That's actually really interesting. I never took into account aery's travel time, could be a game changer for those champions. I'll do testing for this over the next couple days. Thanks for the input.
Sparkle (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Lord Dolan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=00160000,timestamp=2017-11-01T23:04:14.680+0000) > > Thanks. Yeah the pages definitely can be changed based on play style, these are more like templates for players to find their preference from. Yeah thanks for putting this together, I'm sure it was a ton of work!
> [{quoted}](name=Riot Sparkle,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=001600000000,timestamp=2017-11-02T00:12:48.599+0000) > > Yeah thanks for putting this together, I&#x27;m sure it was a ton of work! Yep, 5 days of it. I made this reply to someone else but, I didn't plan on releasing it. However, I figured the community would take great benefit of it especially when everyone comes together to identify whats good before the new season. Overall its a fun project so far regardless of a few flame posts here and there.
Aryzyra (NA)
: Just logged in to upvote. Must have spent a ton of time on this.
> [{quoted}](name=Aryzyra,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0029,timestamp=2017-11-01T22:50:57.639+0000) > > Just logged in to upvote. Must have spent a ton of time on this. yeah, about 5 days haha. But it was worth it. I didn't plan on releasing it but I figured the community would take great benefit of it especially when everyone comes together to identify whats good before the new season. Overall its a fun project so far.
: I like it, but I have a couple big (as in, high-level) disagreements. First - you identify stopwatch as a no-brainer in many cases for Zhonya's users because it's 600 free gold (which is a lot more than most other masteries) and helps them get Zhonya's earlier. Yet you don't seem to make the same comment for ANY Gargoyle's Stoneplate users (which, if I'm not mistaken, Gargoyle's Stoneplate will build out of Stopwatch) (you actually mention it once, on Alistar, who you don't recommend it on and he doesn't build Gargoyles consistently as far as I know). E.g. you don't even mention it on Cho'gath. Like MAAAAYBEE that extra 10MS on your end game boots is more important, but I think a 600g stopwatch and earlier stoneplate is better than a 350g boots at 10min about 99% of the time. So in summation, you didn't seem to consider stopwatch on stoneplate users and as a result missed a biggie. Second - you seem to overrate Unseen Predator and underrate Dark Harvest. Maybe I'm biased because I haven't tried the former and love the latter. Maybe I'm wrong because I'm playing on the PBE and matchmaking isn't even so it's nothing for me to get 20 kills per game. Maybe you make much better use of Unseen Predator than I do, give you're higher elo and may know better when to channel it and where to run with the bonus speed. Overall though, my analysis is: - Junglers: Unseen predator requiring a channel gives your enemies time to escape. If you're seen when you start channeling they get away for free. If you notice you've been seen before you start to channel you can choose not to use it and you've just sacrificed a keystone for the gank. The cooldown is insanely long. The ability doesn't help you when you're on the defensive or being engaged on at all. This keystone is only ever useful when you're the one initiating / pressuring AND your team has map control. So it's too situational, doesn't do great damage, and has a huge cooldown. Dark Harvest in contrast stacks up well, is available really often (as often as you can kill a jungle camp, which as the jungler is always), helps you combo it through teamfights (grab a takedown to refresh it) and does better damage than unseen predator pretty quickly (at least on non-glass cannon junglers). - Mid Laners: Unseen predator is useless against your lane opponent. Its sole use is for roaming. If you've got that keystone and you disappear your opponents should be able to take notice and not give you free kills. You'll sacrifice a lot of pressure in your 1v1. Without a damaging keystone I'd imagine most mid laners don't have enough burst damage to be viable. Dark Harvest again is available way more often (every three waves at first, and more often later in the game, especially when you can quickly clear camps), does more damage if you're stacking at a decent click, and helps you in teamfights. To me it's just better. I'm not even considering electrocute here. If Dark Harvest is a lot weaker in balanced matches on live, I still think I'd take electrocute over Predator. Just my thoughts. All in all I really like this. I have taken different stuff every game I've played so far, and overall been happy with a lot of the runes. Not sure what is optimal. E.g. I took a similar Hecarim page, but with Dark Harvest, Transcendence, and Gathering Storm. I love my 40% CDR Hecarim (because playing URF mode when everyone else is in normal mode is OP, and I find myself able to stall out most losing games to 40+ minutes and have already won 2/2 4v5s helpfully thanks to this mastery). However I can see how strong Celerity should be on him and am now feeling tempted to try that. I particularly liked your Fiddle page. I'm also tempted to try that next.
> [{quoted}](name=ValyrianBlade,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0028,timestamp=2017-11-01T22:41:51.050+0000) > > I like it, but I have a couple big (as in, high-level) disagreements. > > First - you identify stopwatch as a no-brainer in many cases for Zhonya&#x27;s users because it&#x27;s 600 free gold (which is a lot more than most other masteries) and helps them get Zhonya&#x27;s earlier. Yet you don&#x27;t seem to make the same comment for ANY Gargoyle&#x27;s Stoneplate users (which, if I&#x27;m not mistaken, Gargoyle&#x27;s Stoneplate will build out of Stopwatch) (you actually mention it once, on Alistar, who you don&#x27;t recommend it on and he doesn&#x27;t build Gargoyles consistently as far as I know). E.g. you don&#x27;t even mention it on Cho&#x27;gath. Like MAAAAYBEE that extra 10MS on your end game boots is more important, but I think a 600g stopwatch and earlier stoneplate is better than a 350g boots at 10min about 99% of the time. So in summation, you didn&#x27;t seem to consider stopwatch on stoneplate users and as a result missed a biggie. > > Second - you seem to overrate Unseen Predator and underrate Dark Harvest. Maybe I&#x27;m biased because I haven&#x27;t tried the former and love the latter. Maybe I&#x27;m wrong because I&#x27;m playing on the PBE and matchmaking isn&#x27;t even so it&#x27;s nothing for me to get 20 kills per game. Maybe you make much better use of Unseen Predator than I do, give you&#x27;re higher elo and may know better when to channel it and where to run with the bonus speed. Overall though, my analysis is: > - Junglers: Unseen predator requiring a channel gives your enemies time to escape. If you&#x27;re seen when you start channeling they get away for free. If you notice you&#x27;ve been seen before you start to channel you can choose not to use it and you&#x27;ve just sacrificed a keystone for the gank. The cooldown is insanely long. The ability doesn&#x27;t help you when you&#x27;re on the defensive or being engaged on at all. This keystone is only ever useful when you&#x27;re the one initiating / pressuring AND your team has map control. So it&#x27;s too situational, doesn&#x27;t do great damage, and has a huge cooldown. Dark Harvest in contrast stacks up well, is available really often (as often as you can kill a jungle camp, which as the jungler is always), helps you combo it through teamfights (grab a takedown to refresh it) and does better damage than unseen predator pretty quickly (at least on non-glass cannon junglers). > - Mid Laners: Unseen predator is useless against your lane opponent. Its sole use is for roaming. If you&#x27;ve got that keystone and you disappear your opponents should be able to take notice and not give you free kills. You&#x27;ll sacrifice a lot of pressure in your 1v1. Without a damaging keystone I&#x27;d imagine most mid laners don&#x27;t have enough burst damage to be viable. Dark Harvest again is available way more often (every three waves at first, and more often later in the game, especially when you can quickly clear camps), does more damage if you&#x27;re stacking at a decent click, and helps you in teamfights. To me it&#x27;s just better. > I&#x27;m not even considering electrocute here. If Dark Harvest is a lot weaker in balanced matches on live, I still think I&#x27;d take electrocute over Predator. > > Just my thoughts. All in all I really like this. I have taken different stuff every game I&#x27;ve played so far, and overall been happy with a lot of the runes. Not sure what is optimal. E.g. I took a similar Hecarim page, but with Dark Harvest, Transcendence, and Gathering Storm. I love my 40% CDR Hecarim (because playing URF mode when everyone else is in normal mode is OP, and I find myself able to stall out most losing games to 40+ minutes and have already won 2/2 4v5s helpfully thanks to this mastery). However I can see how strong Celerity should be on him and am now feeling tempted to try that. > > I particularly liked your Fiddle page. I&#x27;m also tempted to try that next. First of all thanks for all the insight and taking the time to review the pages. Again throwing this together took about a week so its easy to find mistakes. Lets start with your first point. You are DEFINITELY right here I never really mention it for gargoyle users and GA users. I think thats because I don't really know any gargoyle exclusive champs or if its even worth to spec into just for GA stuff, especially as an adc which use fairly specific pages. I'll try to find champs that use gargoyle after the nerf (as someone that likes to abuse chogath, I know Im scum, I don't find myself buying the item anymore) even though I hardly build it myself. I think with more feedback I can improve this more especially tank players that think its necessary. Dark harvest was just nerfed a lot, so I think its really specific to certain classes of top laners and junglers. I don't actually know what junglers would take it besides maybe shyvana and other power junglers. To be honest in general I don't know how good predator is on junglers so with time this will be changed accordingly with the right suggestions. The channel on predator can just be activated in fog of war so that channel isnt an issue. In mid lane its taken specifically FOR roaming yeah, and in ranked roaming ensures other lanes win allowing for a higher chance of winning. Considering how fast you go from river to bot or top with the keystone its really like a tf ult on many ad mid laners. Your points are great, its just that they cover a wide amount of the champs I covered, so as I get corrected more and more we will start to see whats best. Thank you for taking the time to write this man, thats more then I write for my lab reports in college lol.
: As someone who essentially only plays AP Sona, i have to give my input here. Kleptomancy rules. Sona relies heavily on income to scale properly. She often makes risky trades in lane, and does tend to run out of mana pretty quickly. Although it's putting a lot of faith in the luck of the draw, there's next to no champion in the game who can abuse Kleptomancy as hard as Sona does outside of GP and maybe Ezreal. Q+AA, Mana pot. Q+AA, cookie. Q+AA, gold bag, Q+AA, free ward. Q+AA, bonus AP/mana regen for 45 seconds. Q+AA, Minion Dematerializer (i keep stealing cannon minions when i do get one, i won't lie.) It gives me early game sustain, a ridiculous amount of gold, free stats, vision and more. It promotes heavily her lane bully playstyle and rewards her for it, and lets her scale far more quickly. Along with that, i get; Cookies because i ALWAYS build tear, and cookies not only mean mana regen, but also straight up more mana, which is great. Magic Boots because who has time to invest in boots when you can invest in AP? Also, free gold when you sell it, because Sona late game really doesn't give a damn about boots. Cosmic Insight admittedly because there's pretty much nothing there better than free CDR on Sona, imo. Side path is Sorcery, with; Celerity, because Sona's efficiency and survival late game depends on speed, and giving her AP for MS is literally feeding her E extra MS all over again. Which in turns feeds her some more AP. What's not to love? And lastly, Gathering Storm, because i'm a real sucker for those lategame murder fests where everyone is full build and scaled as hell.
> [{quoted}](name=GinoSoldier,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=001c0000,timestamp=2017-11-01T21:01:01.124+0000) > > As someone who essentially only plays AP Sona, i have to give my input here. > > Kleptomancy rules. Sona relies heavily on income to scale properly. She often makes risky trades in lane, and does tend to run out of mana pretty quickly. Although it&#x27;s putting a lot of faith in the luck of the draw, there&#x27;s next to no champion in the game who can abuse Kleptomancy as hard as Sona does outside of GP and maybe Ezreal. > > Q+AA, Mana pot. Q+AA, cookie. Q+AA, gold bag, Q+AA, free ward. Q+AA, bonus AP/mana regen for 45 seconds. Q+AA, Minion Dematerializer (i keep stealing cannon minions when i do get one, i won&#x27;t lie.) > > It gives me early game sustain, a ridiculous amount of gold, free stats, vision and more. It promotes heavily her lane bully playstyle and rewards her for it, and lets her scale far more quickly. > > Along with that, i get; > Cookies because i ALWAYS build tear, and cookies not only mean mana regen, but also straight up more mana, which is great. > Magic Boots because who has time to invest in boots when you can invest in AP? Also, free gold when you sell it, because Sona late game really doesn&#x27;t give a damn about boots. > Cosmic Insight admittedly because there&#x27;s pretty much nothing there better than free CDR on Sona, imo. > > Side path is Sorcery, with; > Celerity, because Sona&#x27;s efficiency and survival late game depends on speed, and giving her AP for MS is literally feeding her E extra MS all over again. Which in turns feeds her some more AP. What&#x27;s not to love? > And lastly, Gathering Storm, because i&#x27;m a real sucker for those lategame murder fests where everyone is full build and scaled as hell. Noted, I'll put this page in after sona's support page. Thanks for typing all this.
: As a Veigar main i would say Summon Aerie is better because it deals the same dmg, isnt a skillshot and it has no cd (if you consider the flight time its about 5-6 seconds). Also i would say Nullifying orb is better than Ultimate Hat (that cdr on ult isnt that required) in ap matchups like Orianna, Kassadin, Fizz (also the toughest champions for Veigar to deal with) and all of them deal magical burst dmg. Absolute Focus isnt that great but if you go morello build its better than others but if you go GLP build Transcendence is way better (you dont always cap out cdr). Now about the Precision tree, i feel like Inspiration tree gives way too much utility for veigar that would be useful for him. For example: Hextech Flashtraption (its so good to get perfect placement for cages) and Cosmic Insight (basically free cdr for everything which means more cages more q's and more stacks), also Magical Footwear is an option. (btw sorry for the long post but i just wanted to share all my thoughts about the page he made.
> [{quoted}](name=Purple Yordle,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0020,timestamp=2017-11-01T20:37:57.871+0000) > > As a Veigar main i would say Summon Aerie is better because it deals the same dmg, isnt a skillshot and it has no cd (if you consider the flight time its about 5-6 seconds). Also i would say Nullifying orb is better than Ultimate Hat (that cdr on ult isnt that required) in ap matchups like Orianna, Kassadin, Fizz (also the toughest champions for Veigar to deal with) and all of them deal magical burst dmg. Absolute Focus isnt that great but if you go morello build its better than others but if you go GLP build Transcendence is way better (you dont always cap out cdr). Now about the Precision tree, i feel like Inspiration tree gives way too much utility for veigar that would be useful for him. For example: Hextech Flashtraption (its so good to get perfect placement for cages) and Cosmic Insight (basically free cdr for everything which means more cages more q&#x27;s and more stacks), also Magical Footwear is an option. (btw sorry for the long post but i just wanted to share all my thoughts about the page he made. Noted in the description, thanks for your input.
XeroKimo (NA)
: Cassiopeia has such an easy level 2 cheese now compared to before, it's not even funny Running the exact same rune page you have set up for her, but if you changed the 2nd rune path to precision and ran presence of mind and coup de grace maybe, you can just all in the moment you hit 2 since you have unlimited mana for 5 seconds, even if you don't kill your target, you have full mana and you can just push and roam, or maybe back
> [{quoted}](name=XeroKimo,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=001e,timestamp=2017-11-01T20:17:44.765+0000) > > Cassiopeia has such an easy level 2 cheese now compared to before, it&#x27;s not even funny > > Running the exact same rune page you have set up for her, but if you changed the 2nd rune path to precision and ran presence of mind and coup de grace maybe, you can just all in the moment you hit 2 since you have unlimited mana for 5 seconds, even if you don&#x27;t kill your target, you have full mana and you can just push and roam, or maybe back Not sure how I overlooked this, I'll add this to the description. Thank you.
: I was looking at a few of my favorite champs and wanted to offer some insight. {{champion:61}} ~ These are the runes I like to take on her: https://i.gyazo.com/f1d0ed3e0fc25bb2917fa038cdd215e2.jpg I can see Comet being good on Orianna, but Aery is much more consistent and also activates on your E; still pretty debatable though. While absolute focus is _ok_ transcendence is so much better simply because it allows you to reach 40% cdr with Morello and Zhonyas/Banshees, and in all honesty Orianna isn't even that great in lane; she just can survive tougher matchups easier than other champions. I can see your reasoning behind the precision tree, but IMO inspiration is just so much better for the extra sustain and mana for the midgame to lategame along with an extra 5% cdr on all your skills. {{champion:143}} ~ These are the runes I like to take on her: https://i.gyazo.com/c00a6d2c7b2d537d6aa47f7bd1897a77.jpg Electrocute is given, the only real alternative being _maybe_ summoner specialist for ignite cheese. Cheap shot also is a very good choice especially once you have a Rylai's built. I love ghost poro on Zyra because you can use a control ward + poro for the vision of both jungle paths, same for mid Zyra; Although I can see the reasoning behind zombie ward. I can see why you might want ravenous hunter but the lifesteal just isn't really worth it as a support, and even as a midlaner you still might want the increased roaming speed. I get absolute focus but as an aggressive laner without any innate healing you're going to be below 70% in a lot of trades unless you're fighting a Janna. {{champion:37}} ~ These are the runes I like to take: https://i.gyazo.com/35368aadacb9c3a79a4b41e09a58230c.jpg For the most part, I totally agree with you! But there is one issue. Ultimate Hat is just so effective on Sona because of the higher Crescendo uptime, and, while I can see the use of manaflow, ultimate hat is just too useful. However, as we get closer to preseason, I'll see how they stack up again. Edit: why aren't all my pictures working??
> [{quoted}](name=Fairyfleur,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=001c,timestamp=2017-11-01T19:57:27.067+0000) > > I was looking at a few of my favorite champs and wanted to offer some insight. > > {{champion:61}} ~ > These are the runes I like to take on her: > > https://i.gyazo.com/f1d0ed3e0fc25bb2917fa038cdd215e2.jpg > > I can see Comet being good on Orianna, but Aery is much more consistent and also activates on your E; still pretty debatable though. While absolute focus is _ok_ transcendence is so much better simply because it allows you to reach 40% cdr with Morello and Zhonyas/Banshees, and in all honesty Orianna isn&#x27;t even that great in lane; she just can survive tougher matchups easier than other champions. > > I can see your reasoning behind the precision tree, but IMO inspiration is just so much better for the extra sustain and mana for the midgame to lategame along with an extra 5% cdr on all your skills. > > > {{champion:143}} ~ > These are the runes I like to take on her: > > https://i.gyazo.com/c00a6d2c7b2d537d6aa47f7bd1897a77.jpg > > Electrocute is given, the only real alternative being _maybe_ summoner specialist for ignite cheese. Cheap shot also is a very good choice especially once you have a Rylai&#x27;s built. I love ghost poro on Zyra because you can use a control ward + poro for the vision of both jungle paths, same for mid Zyra; Although I can see the reasoning behind zombie ward. I can see why you might want ravenous hunter but the lifesteal just isn&#x27;t really worth it as a support, and even as a midlaner you still might want the increased roaming speed. > > I get absolute focus but as an aggressive laner without any innate healing you&#x27;re going to be below 70% in a lot of trades unless you&#x27;re fighting a Janna. > > > {{champion:37}} ~ > These are the runes I like to take: > > https://i.gyazo.com/35368aadacb9c3a79a4b41e09a58230c.jpg > > For the most part, I totally agree with you! But there is one issue. Ultimate Hat is just so effective on Sona because of the higher Crescendo uptime, and, while I can see the use of manaflow, ultimate hat is just too useful. However, as we get closer to preseason, I&#x27;ll see how they stack up again. > > Edit: why aren&#x27;t all my pictures working?? They work don't worry, I just have to copy the links, so lets go into this. For ori, I agree summon aery is probably better for burst matchups like talon and syndra, so I'll put that in. Transcendence's 10% cdr at 10 minutes is ok if you aren't gonna be aggressive, but absolute focus is great because of the increases shield from the extra ap and in general the extra damage. I will say that I think it depends on the matchup so if ori hard wins against said champion I would take absolute focus. The reason zombie ward is great is because usually the adc can take ghost poro and you can take zombie ward for longer vision control. Whenever a trinket ward dies to my knowledge a new blue ward spawns in its place for zombie ward so thats really good on supports that can spec into domination. Ghost poro is fine if your adc doesn't take it. Ultimate hat has a problem, it multiplicative with other cdr, making it less effective. (Whats supposed to be a free 15% turns into 8%) and I don't believe she gets benefits from transcendence from ultimate hat if you cap cdr. (could be wrong) Thank you for taking the time to type this, I appreciate your insight.
: Commenting on the pages for Sion: Tank * Pretty decent, there isn't much to debate as far as tank runes go (except for Support Sion - switch to Aftershock and choose between Demolish and Font of Life). However, Celestial Body is not a great choice for Sion. Laning phase is the time in the game where you actually have decent damage. In your first few levels, you can bully most lane opponents pretty hard and get an early advantage. Losing a significant amount of damage early hurts Sion a lot, and I would not recommend taking it unless you're in a tough match-up where you need to focus just on survival. In contrast, Approach Velocity is way too nice on Sion to not take as your primary choice from that slot. Being able to close in on enemies you hit with a long range E or on the very edge of your Q is fantastic for Sion in pretty much any situation. Lethality * There are actually a lot of possibilities for damage-oriented runes for Sion, but there is one glaring issue with your setup - Sudden Impact doesn't work on Sion's ult. It is not registered as a dash (not even the short dash when you manually end it - I tested this on the PBE). It is legitimately useless on Sion. Thankfully, Cheap Shot works super well for him. Other than that, Ravenous Hunter is alright - probably the best in the slot for Sion - but it has the same issue as Hextech Gunblade and Death's Dance, since AOE damage (the entirety of Sion's kit) is reduced to 1/3 healing. Because of that and Electrocute's long cooldown, it's honestly just as appealing to take Sorcery primary with Arcane Comet and Gathering Storm/Scorch.
> [{quoted}](name=Glory ln Death,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=001b,timestamp=2017-11-01T19:48:37.104+0000) > > Commenting on the pages for Sion: > > Tank > > * Pretty decent, there isn&#x27;t much to debate as far as tank runes go (except for Support Sion - switch to Aftershock and choose between Demolish and Font of Life). However, Celestial Body is not a great choice for Sion. Laning phase is the time in the game where you actually have decent damage. In your first few levels, you can bully most lane opponents pretty hard and get an early advantage. Losing a significant amount of damage early hurts Sion a lot, and I would not recommend taking it unless you&#x27;re in a tough match-up where you need to focus just on survival. In contrast, Approach Velocity is way too nice on Sion to not take as your primary choice from that slot. Being able to close in on enemies you hit with a long range E or on the very edge of your Q is fantastic for Sion in pretty much any situation. > > Lethality > > * There are actually a lot of possibilities for damage-oriented runes for Sion, but there is one glaring issue with your setup - Sudden Impact doesn&#x27;t work on Sion&#x27;s ult. It is not registered as a dash (not even the short dash when you manually end it - I tested this on the PBE). It is legitimately useless on Sion. Thankfully, Cheap Shot works super well for him. Other than that, Ravenous Hunter is alright - probably the best in the slot for Sion - but it has the same issue as Hextech Gunblade and Death&#x27;s Dance, since AOE damage (the entirety of Sion&#x27;s kit) is reduced to 1/3 healing. Because of that and Electrocute&#x27;s long cooldown, it&#x27;s honestly just as appealing to take Sorcery primary with Arcane Comet and Gathering Storm/Scorch. Noted, thanks for your impact, or this case cheap shot.
: the morde page needs alot of work. how dare you not be an expert on mordekaiser? kappa :3 if morde ult + e will proc the keystone it sounds great but if not then what about item actives like the hextech options? if not you should use something else as morde doesnt need as much of a mobility boost as u'ed think. morde ult is already up by the time the duration ends if u got the ghost with a little cdr. its a good idea on the surface but show a lack of experience on morde (you non morde playing lesser human being ( kappa <3)). "while above 70% health" lol no you cant asume youll stay up there morde is a very clutch champion often dying or totally decimating everything hanging on small amount of hp differrence. even factoring bush cheese and such its not worth scorch: its fine but other trees could give better options. as for the second tree both are fine but have you ever seen morde hyper carry with attack speed? have a nice day man <3
> [{quoted}](name=freight train722,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0019,timestamp=2017-11-01T19:06:24.171+0000) > > the morde page needs alot of work. how dare you not be an expert on mordekaiser? kappa :3 > > > if morde ult + e will proc the keystone it sounds great but if not then what about item actives like the hextech options? if not you should use something else as morde doesnt need as much of a mobility boost as u&#x27;ed think. > > morde ult is already up by the time the duration ends if u got the ghost with a little cdr. its a good idea on the surface but show a lack of experience on morde (you non morde playing lesser human being ( kappa &lt;3)). > > &quot;while above 70% health&quot; lol no you cant asume youll stay up there morde is a very clutch champion often dying or totally decimating everything hanging on small amount of hp differrence. even factoring bush cheese and such its not worth > > scorch: its fine but other trees could give better options. > > > as for the second tree both are fine but have you ever seen morde hyper carry with attack speed? > > have a nice day man &lt;3 Currently most morde mains find stormraiders to be very good allowing them to stay in range for each q aa and w aoe damage, so I don't have a problem with phase rush here. Its easy to proc with a simple aa e q or other variations and gives slow resist which I believe is really important in team fights. Ultimate hat is taken if you arent vsing magic damage, otherwise you don't take it. Its only taken because there arent any options. I should of said that you can take absolute focus in easy lanes, but celerity for harder ones. Will change that. Scorch or the other two could be taken based on what you need. HOWEVER, I agree with you that there are definitely other trees morde could take and I'll note that down. I'm sure glacial augment with gunblade could work but if there are other keystones you think would work you can inform me, just know the set bonuses are VERY important to early game so specing into precision or resolve as your main tree is slightly iffy. Thanks for writing this.
: I think arcane comet is gonna be better on bard that aery. His heals are mostly irrelevant and his constant slows should make landing comets easy
> [{quoted}](name=Monado II,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=001a,timestamp=2017-11-01T19:15:11.133+0000) > > I think arcane comet is gonna be better on bard that aery. His heals are mostly irrelevant and his constant slows should make landing comets easy While I agree his heals are irrelevant, they won't be when adding the aery shield and plus its easy to do damage with aery when arcane comet can miss AND won't be up very often due to non spammable cd's (I.E. w,e) . I could be wrong though.
: Works for me! I'll probably refer to your page now if I want a quick gist of what to run on a certain champ. Thanks dude
> [{quoted}](name=ShadowbladeTalon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0018,timestamp=2017-11-01T18:46:32.116+0000) > > Works for me! I&#x27;ll probably refer to your page now if I want a quick gist of what to run on a certain champ. Thanks dude Thank you.
: i think when u take predator on x champ u shouldn't take anyother runes than ingenious hunter (to have ur keystone more often).
> [{quoted}](name=Ryuumoku no koke,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0017,timestamp=2017-11-01T18:10:36.455+0000) > > i think when u take predator on x champ u shouldn&#x27;t take anyother runes than ingenious hunter (to have ur keystone more often). Noted.
Sparkle (NA)
: Aw, this is SO cool! I really like that you took a crack at theorycrafting one for every single champion - gave 'em a once over and they all seem like legit options. I love that you included alternatives for champs like AP Ezreal too. Even though there are some here or there I would personally switch out (which really comes down to playstyle a lot of the time) these are a really solid baseline (and it's cool to have tangible examples to discuss). :D
> [{quoted}](name=Riot Sparkle,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0016,timestamp=2017-11-01T18:04:19.703+0000) > > Aw, this is SO cool! I really like that you took a crack at theorycrafting one for every single champion - gave &#x27;em a once over and they all seem like legit options. I love that you included alternatives for champs like AP Ezreal too. > > Even though there are some here or there I would personally switch out (which really comes down to playstyle a lot of the time) these are a really solid baseline (and it&#x27;s cool to have tangible examples to discuss). :D Thanks. Yeah the pages definitely can be changed based on play style, these are more like templates for players to find their preference from.
: >Electrocute is probably the best for riven, you could go into precision but riven really doesn’t need much attack speed, and the rest of the runes in domination are great for riven. Sudden impact for lethality on q and e. Eyeball collection for more ad. Ravenous hunter for great healing on abilities. Transcendence for more cdr, and building multiple cdr items will give more benefits. Gathering storm for late game relevance. I agree and disagree with this very strongly. 1 Riven benifits extrememly hard from low amounts of attack speed. It increases her fast combo speed and increases smoothness on combos with enemies with flash up (as you want to cast w auto ult while they remain stunned) the 18 percent attack speed is very good for this from precision. 2 Electricute will probably remain a lane dominate build but I think her go to will be with press the attack as you get far more value out of extended trades and if played right will have easilly half of your damage in the 12% increase, including the second part of your ult. Including lifesteal is an incredibly valueble stat on riven and sacrificing that for 10 cdr at 10 minutes isnt very worth imho. 3 The reason people take 10 cdr in runes on riven is for laning phase. Her cdr cap can easilly be dipped into items. Her core of Black cleaver and DD is 30% and she can itemize a host of other items to fill out that cap. so the 10% cdr at level 10 wont really be a priority because the lane is over at that point and your already pressing 20-30% cdr at that point. 4 A corner case riven page I like to use is predator because she is an extremely potent roaming champion. And as such she benifits really well from lucidity boots and predetor to move her extremely quickly into other lanes if she is ahead. TLDR i think riven will have two main pages, electrecute and press the attack. but I think she will have a ton of diversity in different options.
> [{quoted}](name=Automated Riven,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0015,timestamp=2017-11-01T17:46:35.610+0000) > > I agree and disagree with this very strongly. > 1 Riven benifits extrememly hard from low amounts of attack speed. It increases her fast combo speed and increases smoothness on combos with enemies with flash up (as you want to cast w auto ult while they remain stunned) the 18 percent attack speed is very good for this from precision. > 2 Electricute will probably remain a lane dominate build but I think her go to will be with press the attack as you get far more value out of extended trades and if played right will have easilly half of your damage in the 12% increase, including the second part of your ult. Including lifesteal is an incredibly valueble stat on riven and sacrificing that for 10 cdr at 10 minutes isnt very worth imho. > 3 The reason people take 10 cdr in runes on riven is for laning phase. Her cdr cap can easilly be dipped into items. Her core of Black cleaver and DD is 30% and she can itemize a host of other items to fill out that cap. so the 10% cdr at level 10 wont really be a priority because the lane is over at that point and your already pressing 20-30% cdr at that point. > 4 A corner case riven page I like to use is predator because she is an extremely potent roaming champion. And as such she benifits really well from lucidity boots and predetor to move her extremely quickly into other lanes if she is ahead. > > TLDR i think riven will have two main pages, electrecute and press the attack. but I think she will have a ton of diversity in different options. Noted, thanks for the input. I am a BAD riven player lol.
GGLineaR (NA)
: I think Yorick could switch between Harvest and Grasp, depending on the player. I've come up with a build I think may actually be broken, but I'll keep it to myself. Not even sure they'll work once these go live.
> [{quoted}](name=GGLineaR,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0014,timestamp=2017-11-01T17:37:28.142+0000) > > I think Yorick could switch between Harvest and Grasp, depending on the player. > > I&#x27;ve come up with a build I think may actually be broken, but I&#x27;ll keep it to myself. Not even sure they&#x27;ll work once these go live. I agree I should of made a second page, I'll take a shot at it.
: I did say you were overestimating the value of Arcane comet and out of all the keystones it might be good on him. But the number of champions I did see you slap it on had a better keystone for them or didn't mesh well with them to begin with. Its going to be arcane coment, summoner changer, or phase rush on Swain. Phase Rush and Stormraiders are similar but have significant difference(s). The means of activating the effect is became a huge game changer. You no longer need to do 30% of a champions health to proc it and instead just need to land 3 different types of attacks (which includes aa). This change instantly opened up this keystone to other champions, made it better or worse for those currently using it. Even ranged champions will still take this because they can proc it FROM RANGE. Swain very much a contender for this keystone and at the very least might be match specific. I would also say your overestimating the value of mana band. That keystone seems very noob trapish.
> [{quoted}](name=MistakenKing,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=00110000000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-01T17:42:11.787+0000) > > I did say you were overestimating the value of Arcane comet and out of all the keystones it might be good on him. But the number of champions I did see you slap it on had a better keystone for them or didn&#x27;t mesh well with them to begin with. Its going to be arcane coment, summoner changer, or phase rush on Swain. > > Phase Rush and Stormraiders are similar but have significant difference(s). The means of activating the effect is became a huge game changer. You no longer need to do 30% of a champions health to proc it and instead just need to land 3 different types of attacks (which includes aa). This change instantly opened up this keystone to other champions, made it better or worse for those currently using it. Even ranged champions will still take this because they can proc it FROM RANGE. Swain very much a contender for this keystone and at the very least might be match specific. > > I would also say your overestimating the value of mana band. That keystone seems very noob trapish. Arcane comet may not mesh well with a lot of the characters yeah, but phase rush is not easy to proc without certain skill setups and also doesn't give slow resist to ranged champs. True ranged champs have an easier time procing it depending on who they are but the ms boost doesnt really synergize well and on swain I don't see the need for ms when positioning only needs to be somewhat near the target (could be wrong). Many mid champs don't have a use for the ms boost. Summon aery is very specific to champion so that only leaves arcane comet. While the keystone may or may not be good for certain champs, the sorcery tree is WAY too good to not take as opposed to domination which can feel very underwhelming on a number of champs besides the keystone. In the descriptions I say you should take mana band or the magic shield one depending on whats better for your lane. The only thing available besides those two is ultimate hat and its not good on everyone.
: Ultimate hat is interesting it adds 5 - 15% CDR for Ultimate only and it scales multiplicative with CDR This means that Ultimate hat adds up to 15% flat CDR at 0% CDR and down to 8.25% CDR when having 45% CDR However going from 0 --> 15% Ultimate CDR allows casting ultimate 17.6% more often while going from 45% ---> 53.25% CDR allows casting ult 32% more often ~~Oh and if it was FLAT 15% ultimate CDR it would be absurdly strong when stacking CDR going from 45% ---> 60% CDR allows you to cast ultimate 68% more often~~ {{champion:266}} Wouldn't Aatrox be likely to take Legend tenacity instead of AS because of him being melee and not having any good tools in his kit for avoiding or negating CC (and him being CC'ed also makes him easier to kill because of being unable to heal from his W)
> [{quoted}](name=Champion Skin,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0013,timestamp=2017-11-01T17:24:37.244+0000) > > Ultimate hat is interesting it adds 5 - 15% CDR for Ultimate only and it scales multiplicative with CDR > > This means that Ultimate hat adds up to 15% flat CDR at 0% CDR and down to 8.25% CDR when having 45% CDR > However going from 0 --&gt; 15% Ultimate CDR allows casting ultimate 17.6% more often while going from 45% ---&gt; 53.25% CDR allows casting ult 32% more often > > ~~Oh and if it was FLAT 15% ultimate CDR it would be absurdly strong when stacking CDR going from 45% ---&gt; 60% CDR allows you to cast ultimate 68% more often~~ > > > {{champion:266}} > Wouldn&#x27;t Aatrox be likely to take Legend tenacity instead of AS because of him being melee and not having any good tools in his kit for avoiding or negating CC (and him being CC&#x27;ed also makes him easier to kill because of being unable to heal from his W) Tenacity is definitely an option against cc heavy teams, so I will note that.
: I don't even care if you would just put some random thingies in those pages; making personalised pages for each and every champions is a lot of work that you should be proud of. For an ARAM main player such as myself, this data is a gold mine, so I sincerely thank you for what you've done, this will save me a lot of effort and will truly help me a lot in the upcoming season
> [{quoted}](name=ThePaffLegacy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0012,timestamp=2017-11-01T17:17:11.679+0000) > > I don&#x27;t even care if you would just put some random thingies in those pages; making personalised pages for each and every champions is a lot of work that you should be proud of. For an ARAM main player such as myself, this data is a gold mine, so I sincerely thank you for what you&#x27;ve done, this will save me a lot of effort and will truly help me a lot in the upcoming season Thanks
: Seeing Swain being told to take GLP is like a slap to the face that just makes me feel gross. A lot of the things I saw on here seemed really wrong. ROA and GLP are very different. For one GLP is only more gold efficient than ROA for like 1 or 2. Then ROA just overtakes GLP in stat wise. I don't know about Quas since I haven't seen his stream in a while but Auto- (something) a challenger Swain player does not build it and even says its a noob trap. Any Swain player worth their salt will also tell you its just bad. Swain doesn't need the slow from GLP to land his W or make his kit work. I definitely think you are overestimating the value of Arcane Comet
> [{quoted}](name=MistakenKing,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=001100000000,timestamp=2017-11-01T16:56:43.571+0000) > > Seeing Swain being told to take GLP is like a slap to the face that just makes me feel gross. A lot of the things I saw on here seemed really wrong. > > ROA and GLP are very different. For one GLP is only more gold efficient than ROA for like 1 or 2. Then ROA just overtakes GLP in stat wise. I don&#x27;t know about Quas since I haven&#x27;t seen his stream in a while but Auto- (something) a challenger Swain player does not build it and even says its a noob trap. Any Swain player worth their salt will also tell you its just bad. Swain doesn&#x27;t need the slow from GLP to land his W or make his kit work. > > I definitely think you are overestimating the value of Arcane Comet Since arcane cd is reduced that much by swain DOT and even ulti makes it better then phase rush if that's what were arguing. Phase rush doesn't even give slow resist for range champs and is a lot worse the stormriders currently is so its only good on select champ. I agree they are both different, but I think GLP is often built to snowball and kill squishy champs due to how easy it is to catch them with the active. I have made a ROA rune page. Also, you said there were a lot of things wrong, but you only named two. what else is a problem?
: You also don't have Gathering Storm, but you have it for Soraka. Sona wants ap more than any other support in bot lane...
> [{quoted}](name=chipndip1,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=000700000000,timestamp=2017-11-01T16:45:24.534+0000) > > You also don&#x27;t have Gathering Storm, but you have it for Soraka. Sona wants ap more than any other support in bot lane... Noted.
: Swain does not get GLP, I'm not really happy or satisfied with your list. I would check out the sub reddits to see what those people are building since they seem more accurate. Swain does not build GLP. Gross
> [{quoted}](name=MistakenKing,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0011,timestamp=2017-11-01T16:44:20.663+0000) > > Swain does not get GLP, I&#x27;m not really happy or satisfied with your list. I would check out the sub reddits to see what those people are building since they seem more accurate. > > Swain does not build GLP. Gross Actually, he does take glp. In fact, the subreddits and high elo players alike take it in many match ups. It makes landing w REALLY easy and is not very different from ROA. You can take roa in games where the slow won't help, but the champ definitly takes this item and I myself have HIGH success with the item. If you want to disprove me you'll have to give me a basis of why its not as good as___ and if you arent happy with the list then tell me why, not just that you aren't happy with it.
: I edited my original for some Fiora stuff as well. You were a lot quicker on the draw than expected. Haha...
> [{quoted}](name=GedweyStenr,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=001000000000,timestamp=2017-11-01T16:42:00.802+0000) > > I edited my original for some Fiora stuff as well. You were a lot quicker on the draw than expected. Haha... I check pretty often when I'm here, especially since I know some of these pages may be really iffy compared to others. Especially when the players that main these champs come in and tell me why my page is bad, so I want to fix it as soon as possible. Don't worry I got the fiora page too. Both of them bothered me due to true damage but its still better to take press huh.
: i mean i'm sure it's pretty good if you do proxy and are willing to focus it all on that. Like my page might be thrash (there's a reason i'm silver) but atleast to me looks more fun, and fits a different playstyle.
> [{quoted}](name=Jerry SeinfeId,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=000b00000000,timestamp=2017-11-01T16:30:12.924+0000) > > i mean i&#x27;m sure it&#x27;s pretty good if you do proxy and are willing to focus it all on that. > > Like my page might be thrash (there&#x27;s a reason i&#x27;m silver) but atleast to me looks more fun, and fits a different playstyle. Yep, but its a different play style that I didn't include so I have it down now. Thanks for your input.
Durzaka (NA)
: Zac should be taking Conditioning rather than Iron Skin. Iron Skin value is just trash overall (same with Mirror Coat), and unless it turns out that Zac NEEDS the +5 armor to clear the jungle, Conditioning will always be better. I also would prefer Ultimate Hat over the free boots, but thats just me I guess.
> [{quoted}](name=Durzaka,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=000f,timestamp=2017-11-01T16:24:24.353+0000) > > Zac should be taking Conditioning rather than Iron Skin. Iron Skin value is just trash overall (same with Mirror Coat), and unless it turns out that Zac NEEDS the +5 armor to clear the jungle, Conditioning will always be better. > > I also would prefer Ultimate Hat over the free boots, but thats just me I guess. Noted
: For fiora press the attack is still best for her since most of her damage is physical. She is my main and the Fiora Mains discord have pretty said that that's the best one generally. Also one could make the argument for Legend: Bloodline instead since that's her main way of staying alive, she's so squishy the minor tenacity won't do much. I think you're very wrong with Camille. She's my secondary main and I've been testing her on PBE, the best I've found is Press the Attack-triumph- Alacrity (or the tenacity one) - coup de grace with domination secondary- sudden impact- eyeball/ghost poro. This gives her the damage she needs to actually be able to dive and her constant aa resets help proc that press the attack very efficiently.
> [{quoted}](name=GedweyStenr,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9WjLdAo,comment-id=0010,timestamp=2017-11-01T16:25:25.810+0000) > > I think you&#x27;re very wrong with Camille. She&#x27;s my secondary main and I&#x27;ve been testing her on PBE, the best I&#x27;ve found is Press the Attack-triumph- Alacrity (or the tenacity one) - coup de grace with domination secondary- sudden impact- eyeball/ghost poro. This gives her the damage she needs to actually be able to dive and her constant aa resets help proc that press the attack very efficiently. Noted, I'll fix this right away.
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Lord Dolan

Level 192 (NA)
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