: People completely missing the point lol he wasnt playing support after calling support!
he was supporting sometimes. tell me the name for the role where you support half the time and the other half try to make plays and take the enemy jungle camps?
Chermorg (NA)
: ***
yeah I don't understand this. the player seems to have a strategy of supporting but also roaming to steal the enemies camps and to gank other lanes. this is against the rules? is it illegal to roam at all? or only if it is too much? how much is too much? I would like to hear some clarification on this issue as I often play support but like to roam to try to make plays.
: Anyone else noticing this trend?
it is absolutely nuts how easy it is to get punished for chat in this game
Feorana (NA)
: Can we talk about the "Enemies are Missing" pings?
its a pretty idiotic thing to do. like what is the purpose of ? spamming a teammate when they make a mistake? best case they mute your pings worst case you tilt them into feeding. but I don't see what can be done about it. you could change the ? ping into a smiley face and people are still going to be toxic with it
: It's so blatantly obvious that you are trolling. I don't know if you were hoping you'd get banned so you could contest it, or honestly thought you'd slip under the radar. I don't even know what information you're looking for; you 100% know you were trolling. > So first question, it seems that playing off meta in ranked is considered trolling & griefing Playing off meta is not trolling or griefing. Trolling or griefing is .. trolling or griefing. You've been reported 511 times in a little over a MONTH; many of these are by your opponent, not your teammates. For comparison, I have been reported once lifetime on one of my accounts, and 8 lifetime on the other. You've made a game of trolling, and even admit to it many times. [7:41] SION ORNN MID (Gragas): do this every game, no consequences. [11:25] [All] SION ORNN MID (Gragas): the automated system will decide. it cant detect this. You ban your teammates champ picks You pick non-meta champs to tilt teammates You build those non-meta champs as non-meta as possible (ad mages, etc) You intentionally steal farm You intentionally KS You don't go to the lane assigned, and instead go to interfere with others You leave your team when a teamfight breaks out
sounds like a good ban. good job. I hope you are telling the truth this time
: Yes Because you are not the holy trinity
> [{quoted}](name=GlobDaBlob,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=E5bxNPnA,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-12-18T21:05:50.411+0000) > > Yes > > Because you are not the holy trinity how do you know?
: Why would god be a mushroom midget
> [{quoted}](name=ShaolinToilet,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=E5bxNPnA,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-12-18T21:00:56.905+0000) > > Why would god be a mushroom midget just out of boredom to see what its like. then he makes himself forget he is god
Rioter Comments
Chermorg (NA)
: You were not giving general advice. You were harassing and calling them bad repeatedly, as well as being overly negative. Obviously you ruined someone's game as they reported you for it. My original question still stands.
> [{quoted}](name=Chermorg,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=AipzOWw3,comment-id=000400000000,timestamp=2017-12-16T00:11:49.002+0000) > Obviously you ruined someone's game as they reported you for it. > sadly that is not usually why people get reported. if people were reporting only the ones actually ruining their games then this would be a better place but instead they will report you if - you had a bad game you were afk for 30 seconds they don't like your pick they don't like your ban they don't like your item build you accidentally brought the wrong runes you didn't bring the runes they think are best you didn't give the missing enemy ping you gave the missing enemy ping you didn't come when they pinged you didn't put down enough wards you took some of their cs you stole their kill you didn't leash you took blue buff you are a smurf you are a noob you disagreed with them you used emotes you wrote 'lol' at the wrong time you wrote 'gg' when it "wasn't a good game" you voted yes on a surrender vote you voted no on a surrender vote those are just a few I can think of that ive seen people get reported for. I'm sure there are dozens of other frivolous things people are getting reported for all the time. I bet these kind of reports outnumber legit reports 10 to 1
Pic (NA)
: Why are people so toxic? //Slight vent
snowballing enemies, heavy reliance on teammates, and leaverbuster combine to make this the most toxic game ever created.
: can you be banned for quoting somebody?
it could. dont quote someone who is using hatespeech
Splatyo (NA)
: getting notified when you get reported.
probably would be good as long as the notification is delayed a bit. otherwise the guy is going to turn around and report everyone to make sure they report the guy who got them
: I gotta punish YOU
thumbs up because its funny :D
: I have figured out where the toxic behavior comes from and the cause.
you are right the game is the creator of most of the toxicity. snowballing, autofill, and matchmaking all contribute to making an extremely toxic game but the biggest of all without a doubt is leaverbuster. in this game no matter how frustrated you are, no matter how bad the game is going for you, no matter how many trolls or afks are on your team, **you cant leave**. nothing is more toxic than that. any other game if you are having a bad time you turn it off and instantly start to feel better. not this one.
: "i either play janna support or i play janna adc, your choice :)"
TrulyBland (EUNE)
: ggez **is** considered negative by the system, by Riot, and by the community, and will be picked up as mildly negative behaviour. So reporting for ggez is not noise, and thus does not provide cover for anybody.
the reason riot cant manually review reports is because people get reported in far too many games. most of it is nonsense like that. if 90% of the reports werent false or over the mildest trash talk in the world then it might be possible to review a higher % of cases manually. which would lead to more trolls getting banned.
: > [{quoted}](name=MUSHROOM MIDGET,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=F5wEcp4w,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2017-09-01T23:14:10.052+0000) > we need to stop reporting people for things like saying ggez That's kinda nasty and pointless thing to say tho. People should stop saying that shit, and keep reporting it. There won't be tears on my pillow if some ggez-saying a-hole gets banned for it.
riot has said no one is getting banned for saying ggez unless they are doing a lot of other toxic things. all you are doing by reporting it is providing cover for people who really deserve the reports.
: We're constantly making changes/improvements to feeder detection. It will always be a hard problem to solve, and will never be perfect. A big reason being players frequently report players who are not feeding, because they are upset. This makes the signal very dirty. Players who report that 1-9 top laner for feeding, when they were just getting beat, make it much more difficult for us to accurately penalize feeders.
this is an important comment. we need to stop reporting people for things like having a bad game or saying ggez or playing sona mid. all that is accomplishing is confusing the system and making it harder to punish the real trolls who actually deserve it.
: You would only need to check reported games. Like you said, there are so many players, so that's the only way to do it.
the problem with that is someone is reported in most games. with many of the reports being for things like ggez and support not buying sightstone - flooding riot with massive report numbers and making it impossible to check them. if you are only looking at reported games for 60 million accounts you are still definitely talking about millions of games a day with the way people will report for any tiny reason. and to check for trolling you cant just do a chatlog scan either. you have to actually watch gameplay. maybe they can watch the games on 3x speed or something but still that woudl be at least 15 mins per game when you include picking the game and loading time. 15 mins per game x millions of reported games = not going to happen
: No, what you do is you simply allow for extremely harsh punishments for trolls, and return some or all LP lost because of a troll. If you ban people heavily for trolling, then people aren't going to decide to troll in a losing game to save their premade's LP. And it also gets rid of assholes like this, who seem ironically unaware that they are perpetuating the thing they are raging about.
yes in a perfect world that would be the best solution. but in reality it is very hard to catch trolls and feeders. the only real way to do it is to manually review games. and with 60+ million active accounts there are definitely millions of trolls out there. do you have any idea how long it would take to manually check Millions of accounts for trolling?
: This is why we should be able to report in champ select
well would you rather be able to find out you have trolls in pregame so you can dodge? or would you rather they stay quiet until the game starts? if you allow reporting in champ select that guy is going ot be very quiet until the game starts.
Rioter Comments
archerno1 (EUNE)
: > [{quoted}](name=MUSHROOM MIDGET,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=6ssUuKn4,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2017-08-21T22:52:10.830+0000) > > the only way riot can catch these players is if everyone stops reporting for the weak frivolous stuff like 'ggez' > > riot gets millions of reports every day. there is no way they can manually review games unless that gets cut way way back. stop reporting unless its really really bad. its the only way. Why would that be only way? Chat is moderated by automated system. It doesnt take up resources and it doesnt make choice between chat and ingame behavior. Do u even know what automated system means?
an automated system can never catch these kinds of trolls. only manual reviews by riot can catch them. but riot cant review a million games every day that are reported. the only way they could review them by hand is if the report numbers come way down.
: Another Grand Flaw in the System
the only way riot can catch these players is if everyone stops reporting for the weak frivolous stuff like 'ggez' riot gets millions of reports every day. there is no way they can manually review games unless that gets cut way way back. stop reporting unless its really really bad. its the only way.
Kei143 (NA)
: The current point of permabans is to discourage the toxics from coming back. While a chunk of them certainly do come back, the point isn't to make it easier for them to come back.
scazzman (NA)
: blind reporting
it is not troubling or a problem. false reports do nothing. so it is perfectly fine to report everyone in the game. i fact i doubt reports do anything anyway. the automated system takes care of the punishing.
: Why Are People So Terrible?
it is a frustrating and toxic game sometimes. and when people are frustrated and they cant leave they lash out with rage or troll. i honestly think 90% of the toxicity in the game would be solved by allowing people to leave the game when they arent having fun.
Kąyn (NA)
: Riot's Problem
all you can do is mute everyone and go to mid or top and wait for the game to end. sounds like a bad situation but if you rage and hate then you are getting banned.
: A way to deal with champ select trolls
you could say goodbye to anyone playing an unusual pick
: is riot actively trying to improve catching trolls?
Kei143 (NA)
: How the heck did you jump from 21 games to 421 games? If you are pulling my statistics, I'm not a gold 3 player yet. I am a silver3 player though, so I am close to the ELO I'm supposed to be at.
well im just trying to give a realistic example. a player who is improving isnt going to just suddenly jump from a silver 5 to gold 3. he will slowly win more than he loses and grind his rank up. im just saying if it takes him 421 games to promote that far then 221-200 is a reasonable w/l for an improving player. they still end up at 50% like everyone else.
: So, what you're saying is, because a challenger player intentionally threw 50% of his games to stay in Bronze so he could boost people, his other 50% were purely luck? There was no skill involved? Also, why does 50% win rate matter so much to you? Sure, if you throw games to go to lower ELO, you'll be able to carry games more often, but you'd have to already be much higher rank skill-wise even then. Someone in Silver 2 wouldn't be able to throw a third of his/her games and still carry enough games in Bronze 2 to get a 50% win rate. Also, smurfing is a thing, in case you weren't aware. A Diamond player in Bronze will be able to pull off a near-100% win rate, if they remain "honorable", so where do you address that in your random statistic? If everyone has a 50% win rate, how would something like that occur? And my last two questions: Can you provide a legitimate source showing the matchmaking system is "rigged" to give 50% win rate? And, are you just salty you only have a 50% win rate?
when did i say it was luck? nothing about this is luck. and im talking about over a large number of games. because mmr raises so rapidly your diamond smurf in bronze would only be able to get about 50 wins before he is back to diamond mmr. at that point he wins 50%. so maybe short term he could be 50-2, but after 450 games he still would be about 250-200.
: Is there a MMR system in place? I have been doing a decent job and got 10 wins with only 1 loss. I just hope that complete newbs to MOBAs don't have to experience this.
they do use an mmr system so the true new players should be out of the worst of it if they can make it through the first 5 or 10 games
: What is up with people? I wanted to give LoL a try, but this is inexcusable...
the problem is such behavior has already been punished. most of those people you are playing with have been banned for being toxic and so have created new accounts. when you make a new account you are playing with the worst of the worst. low level league of legends is a real prisoners island atm
Kei143 (NA)
: 50% win rate is only true if you are at the ELO you are supposed to be. QTpie in bronze will have close to 100% win rate. Unless you are at the top of the ladder with no room to improve, it's probably easier and faster to improve that small mistake you keep making and increase your win rate by 10% while being able to stomp you current competition cos you've gotten better.
it is true he would have 100% winrate in bronze but he would never be in bronze for very long. mmr jumps very very fast. 3 wins jumps you up a rank, 15 wins jumps you up an entire division. the difference between silver 5 and platinum 5 is only about 30 wins. so say you are silver 5 and you improve quite a lot. all the way up to gold 3. well that would only be about 21 games above 50/50 and they are spread out. so maybe it takes you 421 games to promote that far? your win/loss would be 221-200. 52% winrate. thats for a gold 3 level player starting in silver 5. *edit - its not quite that simple but that is very close to how it actually would work
: You clearly aren't grasping the point I am trying to make. You will **NEVER** maintain a 50% win rate if you intentionally lose 33% of your games. You cannot tank your MMR that hard while maintaining a 50% win rate. The system **DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY!**
you are **100% WRONG** https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNqqghH-gEE just watch the first 30 seconds of that video. that guy played 248 games as tahm kench in season 6 and lost them all. every single one. guess what his overall winrate was? 49%
: 50% win rate will result in you climbing the ladder. You cannot simultaneously tank your MMR to get easier games and maintain a 50% win rate, the system literally does not work like that.
mmr jumps up and down very fast. only about 30 wins seperate silver 5 from plat 5. if someone lost 10 games in a row they would find themselves facing much much easier competition. you didnt see the master yi/tahm kench guy people were talking about? he was like 380-0 with master yi and 0-380 with tahm kench+some other champ he liked to tank with. he proves the system literally works exactly like that.
: >thats arguably the best player in NA. Just because that's what QT says doesn't make it true. Go look at the top of the ladders: (NA) TF Blade- 61%, (KR) PraY- 60%, (EUW) Hans Sama- 64%, (EUNE) Xayria- 67%
maybe at the extreme top they can win 60% because there are not enough good players to match them up against. for the other 99.9% if you have played 300+ games your winrate is 50%. thats just how it is.
Kei143 (NA)
: Why not just git gud and win 60% of the games without throwing any games?
because its matchmaking. in a matchmaking system EVERYONE wins around 50%. its just how the system works. no matter how good you are you will never win 60%. Imaqtpie - https://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=imaqtpie Challenger 1,054 LP / 415W 349L Win Ratio 54% thats arguably the best player in NA. he wins around 50% just like everyone else.
: Honorable player- sitting at or around 50% win rate. Will win approximately 50 out of every 100 games. Dishonorable player- In games they try they have a 50% win rate, in games they int they have a 0% win rate. That means they will win 33 out of 100 games (33 int losses and 50% of the other 67 games). One of these players will climb, the other will not. I don't know how you came to your conclusion but for a player starting 33 games in the hole to win 50 games they would need a 75% win rate in games they try (good luck).
luck has nothing to do with it. in a matchmaking system everyone will win 50%. the more you lose, the easier games they give you. thats how they keep you at 50%
: I don't think it's "fun fact" when it's mostly a speculation/deduction on your part.
its not speculation. its a fact. that is how riots matchmaking works. look it up
: Doesn't Riot say some BS fact like "33% of honorable players win more of their games than toxic players"?
lol probably. they are funny
Rioter Comments
: Ran and Experiment on Report System. Results not Surprising, System is Biased and has Flaws.
i agree the war against toxicity was a very bad idea. now people realize they cant rage at their teammates so they just troll instead.
: Well I don't think Riot is incompetent enough as so they can't design a system for detecting these trolls.
well i suppose they can put in something to ban these guys this time. maybe something like if you have less than 20% winrate with a champion you have more than 100 games played with = punishment. but the greater problem is that people intentionally lose so they can get easier games. and there is no way to fix that. its a problem with matchmaking. if people want to lose then they are going to lose. and yeah you can get them to be less obvious about it but there is no way to Force them to try to win. for every guy like this out there who is completely obvious in his attempts to lose the game, there are hundreds you never notice. they ignore your pings not because they are dumb or make a mistake but because they are trying to get caught and force a bad teamfight. they stand with the team but when the fight breaks out they forget to use any skills. they are trying to lose. every game with matchmaking has this problem. you can see it almost every game in overwatch. its not an accident that the guy won 380 games in a row on yi. he sets up those wins by losing. if you lose you get easier/more fun games if you win you get harder. whats the motivation to win?
Velthios (NA)
: Riot, They broke your banning system and it's DISGUSTING
its not that they don't care - its because they have no real way to detect it
: In my own experience, players who say "ez" are usually pretty consistent about acting like little shits. Usually it follows a game full of all-chat taunts and harassment. It's not about my bitter taste. It's about what causes the bitter taste. I know that that person just probably pissed off and hurt several other people on the enemy team. And that's not okay. Don't be shitty. It's not that hard.
: There is no purpose for saying to enemies, "ez" in victory other than to put them down and make them feel like crap. That is the definition of harassment. Additionally it's super unsportsmanlike. When my teammates say this it leaves such a bitter taste in my mouth. It takes some of the fun out of winning. It's really not hard to do, just don't be an asshole.
some people are jerks. that is reality. but if you are turning people in for saying 1 comment that is very mildly rude, then i think you are a bigger asshole then they are. 'he left a bitter taste in my mouth! something needs to be done about this'. holy shit be a man
: Well. That's because "ggez" is poor sportsmanship and flaming... Even if _you_ think it's because people are too sensitive, it's still flaming.
and overly sensitive people like you are why there are too many reports for riot to possibly review the MUCH bigger problem of trolls
Subdue (NA)
: "Riot sucks at catching trolls!" - Let's help them out!
i believe it was riots plan to overban any kind of toxicity because those reports make up the vast majority of the reports they recieve. then when all toxicity stopped, the reports would become far fewer and it might be possible to sift through them and find/ban trolls more often. unfortunately riot seems to have underestimated how sensitive people are. they are still bombarded with reports in most every game for things as trivial as 'gg ez' or even less. i was once told i was getting reported for saying 'ggwp' because according to the reporter 'it wasnt a good game'.
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