Rioter Comments
: think we can restore highlander to 10 seconds and make wuju style scale with total ad so that steraks works again D: ? yi is still being punished for a rageblade/devourer synergy that dissappeared from the game along time ago don't let the name fool you, i'm really an ezreal main and am in no way biased towards yi
I think that instead of restoring highlander to 10 seconds, it would be more fitting for them to increase the % move speed so that he can cover the same distance in 7 seconds that he could cover in 10 previously. 10 second duration with low move speed will always foster tank Yi. It gives more time for resets and encourages a playstyle of chasing past their opponent's haste duration, which requires survivability. Simply moving faster in less time removes that playstyle because he could actually just stick to his target and get the reset regardless of his survivability, as an assassin should.
Rioter Comments
: "the overwhelming dynamic queue backlash is just the minority of the playbase"
We are a minority. We're the minority that actually gives a fuck about the game. We're the minority that fucking asked for ranked team builder in the first place and got loldynamic queue instead. This minority consists of all the people that actually understand the game (What pro thinks dynamic queue is good?). But nah, we here at Riot games will listen to the majority that don't play this game competitively and don't care enough about anything to post threads about their opinions on dynamic queue. If they're not speaking out, then obviously we can just use biased surveys (When btw, we could've just done a census by giving every player the question on login, but then we wouldn't be able to hide/lie about how we got our sample) to show that they all support dynamic queue!
: Thanks for the reply. My client just shut down after the match so I wasn't able to report them, but I've calmed down now so everything is a-ok.
That rioter is wrong, I've reported through the riot games support website. Although there's no specific option for a report, you can submit a request as "I have a question about league of legends/Riot games" and ask them to investigate X player for Y offense. They usually reply telling you they'll investigate it, that you should use the in game report feature next time if you can, and that they cannot disclose any punishments inflicted on the player to you. The link is on the top of your screen on the right, 3 spots right of boards.
: Yi is continuing to get buffed
Master Yi is trash tier right now... lol. They did gut him. You do not have even the slightest understanding of the game given that you are bronze 5 8 lp. You should not be challenging a pro's opinion, or really anyone's opinion on this game, when you can't click a mouse.
Sasogwa (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Meddler,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=cGhNw0N7,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-05-21T23:15:29.558+0000) > > Not in 6.11. The 6.10 buffs, plus Bloodrazor buffs, have put him much closer to a good spot. We'll be assessing Bloodrazor and a couple of other items again, then making a call on whether to buff some champs like Yi who are still underperforming post mid-season changes. I think it's likely we'll buff him further sometime post 6.11, that's a prediction not a plan though at this point. I would like to point out, outside of winrate considerations, that it's also about the feeling of the champion. Having a short ultimate with a high cooldown makes you feel really clunky and bad. At that point, I would better consider a nerf of Yi's damage if it could go with reverting the ultimate over a buff of his damage and ultimate stays as it is right now. Even if that means reducing his winrate.
To add onto this, it actually makes his win condition really shitty. In team fights, he needs to use ~2 - 3 seconds to engage, ~1 second lost while in alpha, and he will likely be cc'd/exhausted after that unless your team is so ahead that the enemy team can't afford to hold a cc ability for Yi. That leaves him with less than 3 - 4 seconds to burst a squishy if he's NOT cc'd, and the squishy will likely have some form of mobility that requires you to spend another second or 2 to get back on the target, this can reduce that to 1 - 3 seconds to burst down that squishy. That's a really shitty scenario, so Yi's win condition instead changes to split push, which is not reliable in higher elo where they know how to deal with it, especially since the shorter highlander duration hurts his 1 v 1 duels with tanks tremendously, which means he has to be snowballed too. Snowball + split push is a horrible win condition akin to that of Tryndamere, who is also in a really bad spot. Not to mention how that change decimated his identity as an assassin that catches people out and hunts them down. His highlander doesn't last long enough for that.
Rioter Comments
: Yasuo's windwall vs Zilean's Q is completely unfair
Wow that's stupid. I don't like them changing the bombs to be classified as clones though, that sounds like more creep block.
: It's 2016 and the cooldown on Karthus ult, which is easily countered, is still 200/180/160 seconds.
Karthus is really strong right now because of the item changes, he's sporting like a 55% win rate in Diamond+ elo so they would have to nerf him in other parts if they reduced this cd for sure.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: [GAMEPLAY] Master Yi crits less than he should
Ah.. Master Yi... The Spaghetti is strong in that one...
: I'd argue that _release_ feral flare was at the very least just as strong as sated, simply because the scaling On-hit heal was a stupid concept to begin with
The difference between sated and feral flare is that sated was much more snowbally, as it significantly increased the value of your other on hit items/scaling. The ridiculous cost efficiency of steraks/maw combo was also another oppressive factor that made snowballing an issue. Feral flare was far less of an issue in that regard. Strength wasn't the issue with sated. Yi was still hovering a 48 - 51% win rate after sated release, but bruiser itemization + a bug that made his double strike start proccing every 2 hits from phantom hit which was originally disabled for being too strong jumped that up to 51 - 53% which still wasn't the main issue. The main issue was it made him stupidly snowbally, more than ever before, and being 1 v 5 triple/quadra/penta killed by a 2 - 4 level higher Yi is very frustrating when it does happen, which resulted in his hatred/ban rate.
Rioter Comments
LankPants (OCE)
: Just remember that Xin/Yi/Jax/Shyvana are all balanced around an overpowered item. Bloodrazor may be a lot stronger than you're estimating while these champions are considerably weaker because they're balanced around devourer. Just look at what's happens to Shyvana and Jax's top lanes, they've both been struggling for a long time because they couldn't build devourer top. I don't think Bloodrazor's that weak, it feels about as good as Cinderhulk on Shyvana for example and she's a good champ to look at because she synergises with both items. I think your pool of champs is just overnerfed because of Devourer.
I agree, although I think that bloodrazor does still need buffs. There is really no reason to buy it on anyone right now unless you're kindred. Better to just grab machete and skip jungle item all together or to go with warrior or cinderhulk. Really though, there is no reason to have bloodrazor at all. Those auto attacking junglers can be balanced around warrior or cinderhulk instead, they're just not.
: Just to make sure you understand this OP. 80%/20% split does not mean you will get what you want every fifth game. It is your odds in an individual game. Unless someone else is trying to get the same champ as you, the odds state that you will not get your champ. It is better to assume you won't, and simply be happily surprised if you get what you want. You strike me as really self-centered. You should work on that.
I sincerely hope you're either trolling or high/drunk. > Don't argue with people when everyone else is saying you are wrong. You realize how many down votes you have on all of your comments yes? Are you at least capable of grasping numbers, and the negative sign in front of it? Even if everyone was saying he is wrong, that just means that all those people are idiots. A million brainless morons agreeing on something doesn't make it true.
GTHell (NA)
: But you still need to press A and left clicking. Can you have something like Dota 2 which you just A and hit the closest minion?
Yeah, under keybinds for hotkeys, instead of binding A to "Attack move," bind it to "Attack move click" which is like a smart casted version of attack move. You won't have to left click. You can also bind attack move click to just left click in your input.ini file, which makes kiting super easy, but then you have to bind your select click to something else (Like shift left click).
GTHell (NA)
: Make Attack Move (A) auto attack like right clicking on minion? HOW?
You can change it to attack the target closest to your cursor in settings. So if you misclick slightly away from your target, it will still attack your intended target.
Rioter Comments
: Go back to solo lane you scaredy cat!
I'd love to (And I do occasionally do it on my smurf, it's pretty fun but he has a lot of match ups that are just unplayable) but Master Yi is even more garbage in a solo lane than jungle because he was balanced flare/old devourer/sated devourer. Without it, like Shyvana, he is garbage.
nep2une (NA)
: lolno He's one of the most idiotically stupidly broken champs right now.
I agree that he is idiotically stupidly broken but that doesn't mean jungle malz has to be deleted. I don't think that that nerf that Pika Fox mentioned was too harsh though. Probably will still be on the strong/op side.
: Go back to building crit you scaredy cat!
I'm sure he would if they actually made a jungle item that didn't make building crit so slow/awkward, and if they didn't switch his E scaling from total AD to bonus AD which makes building zeal items awkward. It's not being a scaredy cat to build the only way that is viable.
Meddler (NA)
: I imagine we'll need to buff Yi. First step's looking at Bloodrazor though for Yi and other AS liking junglers, determine whether that needs buffs as a starting point or not.
Have you considered Ichigo's analysis on the highlander nerf? He's a fairly well known (in higher elo) master tier Yi main. Or he used to be - he stopped after the Highlander nerf. Here is his post:
: are you guys on crack? check his winrate from bronze-gold. he's insane and can delete anyone with rageblade/his r without too much of an issue, and it's mostly true damage
I hope you're on crack because otherwise you're just obnoxiously ignorant. He's sitting at a 42% win rate right now.
McKeifus (NA)
: Guinsoo's Increases On-Hit Damage 33%? How Bad Could It Be?
Where did you get 33% from...? First hit is 100% on hit damage, 2nd hit is 200% on hit damage because of the phantom hit procing on hit effects an additional time at full strength. That's 300% on hit damage in 2 hits instead of 200% in 2 hits. That's a 50% increase. Also being gated behind 6 auto attacks, 3.6k gold, and shitty gold efficiency without stacks is really significant. It might be unhealthy on hybrid champs that use both the AD and AP like Kayle, Kog'maw, and maybe jax, but it's either mediocre with really strong on hits (Vayne) or crap otherwise.
: Congratulations Riot, with this patch...
You're very wrong on the bloodrazer/guinsoos changes being stronger. I'm actually appalled by how many people think that that's a buff. [Here are win rates as of today in NA]( The three lowest win rate junglers are Master Yi, Shyvana, and Warwick in that order. Master Yi went from a 49% win rate to a 42% win rate. He was gutted when he wasn't that strong to begin with (Just really frustrating to play against because of how he snowballed with on-hit/bruiser itemization). Bloodrazer does 30 physical damage on hit to targets for every 1k health they have. Targets do not have 1k health when you buy bloodrazer unless they bought an HP item. Devourer did on average 90 magic damage when sated and taking into account phantom hit. You need to hit a target with 3k HP to deal the same damage in physical damage with blood razer. Also, while bloodrazer scales with armour pen, targets also typically have more armour than magic resist so the benefits of armour pen are negligible in comparison to it just being magic damage.
Cezium (NA)
: I actually did note this exact thing while playtesting this change. The argument I made, however, was that there was so much ambient CDR on so many items Kennen wants to build, it would likely be ok to allow it to happen. Even if you go Rylai's first item, you're going to end up getting a Zhyona's/Abyssal at some point and potentially even CDR boots if you want the summoner spell cooldown reduction for flash. I found myself very, very rarely unable to use the second cast of W after using it the first time.
So essentially what I got from this is: "We here at Riot Games nerfed Kennen's mark duration for #CleanNumbers. #CleanNumbers > actual balancing decisions." Riot Logic.
WinBoat (NA)
: You're crazy if you think he's gonna get Sejuani treatment. This new enchantment is basically going to be his Blade of The Ruined King which is typically Master Yi's first item if he is in lane and not jungling. So it's still going to be a hella lot effective, it still has the attack speed. So basically once he gets rageblade, he will still destroy people.
Devourer with no stacks does 30 magic damage on hit. For bloodrazer to deal 30 physical damage on hit, a target needs 1,000 HP. Targets don't have 1,000 HP when you buy bloodrazer unless they built giant's belt/bami's cinder/cinderhulk. On top of that, targets have more armour than mr when you get bloodrazer, so it's still less damage. Sated devourer did on average 90 magic damage on hit (When accounting phantom hit). Bloodrazer needs to hit a 3k health target to deal that much in physical damage. Bloodrazer also costs 200 more gold. It's far worse than devourer, even without the phantom hit it's usually less damage. Only thing it has going for it is that it benefits from armour pen, so if you have youmuu's or black cleaver, super late game it will deal more damage than devourer without phantom hit since most champs have at least 1 mr item since maw/merc scim are so popular.
Elewd (NA)
: i dont think they originally planned to remove devourer, i think just after all this time and the farming jungle item just causing more issues than benefits it was time to axe the item concept. they are keeping the ghost hit thing in which is nice but now you gotta actually build for it with lackluster stats.
They did plan it. There was a red post last patch stating that they planned "significant changes" for guinsoos and devourer in 6.9. > [{quoted}](name=Riot Axes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ApE4WjUg,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2016-04-09T00:36:43.516+0000) > > Both items have significant changes planned for the midseason patch.
NoZodiac (NA)
: Nocturne is not a devourer jungler. He benefits so much from the early damage and CDR. Besides, full damage assassin Nocturne hasn't been good for a long while.
He also has one of the highest base attack speeds in the game, but didn't go sated because the phantom hit was awkward on him and he wants armour pen, which sated doesn't benefit from. There's no such thing as a "devourer jungler." They are auto-attack based junglers and they work with multiple enchants. There is not a single auto-attack based jungler that cannot be balanced around warrior, cinderhulk, or devourer. Whichever one is most popular depends on whatever is most optimal at the time from Riot's balancing.
: As a Shyvana main, I am actually happy that Devourer is gone because it might mean Top Lane Shyvana can once again be balanced without making Jungle Shyvana stupid strong. I think overall this will be better for the health of the champion and allow her to have more diversity/interactivity within her play.
Yi main, and I'm happy that devourer is gone too but less happy that he received a crippling ult nerf the patch before. Makes his team fighting god awful, and snowballing and split pushing is a really unreliable win condition as you get higher elo.
Meddler (NA)
: We've got a number of Devourer building junglers we're planning to look at once 6.9 has been out for a week or so, see how they've been affected and whether we should look at making changes to them given the new environment. Yi's one of those champs.
I'm a Yi main and I'm happy devourer is being removed, but less happy that you guys gave him a crippling ult nerf one patch before. And it is crippling, it makes team fighting god awful, on a champion that was already notorious for being bad in team fights unless snowballed. Which he often was because on-hit and bruiser itemization (Steraks) are OP. The ult change doesn't solve that issue, it creates a new one after devourer is removed. His ganks are far more difficult to pull off and he has 3 - 4 seconds to burst down a target for his reset in team fight after accounting for time to reposition/flank and time in alpha, and he likely will eat cc after that. Since that scenario seems really unappealing, now his primary win condition is just split pushing, which is not a reliable win condition in higher elo.
Rioter Comments
: Yi isn't even overpowered I have no idea why they're even nerfing him.
tl;dr: It's not about power. It's about his popularity and being frustrating to play against. Longer version: > Yi is super frustrating to play against because he snowballs very hard with a lead because of cheap cost efficient broken on-hit and semi-tank items, which hurts his counterplay because he deals a lot of damage while being fairly tanky. Hence his ban rate.
Rioter Comments
Nαgma (EUW)
: lol ,you got the yi icon it was ironic or ?
What is the irony in that? * I hate how much mobility/survivability marksmen got from updates/itemization * I hate how top lane is dominated by tanks and the only thing that lets fighters see any play is if they synergize with guinsoos or build the same way the tanks do with sunfire/iceborn/titanic * I hate how Yi is forced to be built to be viable in this meta - as a bruiser/tank, abusing the same broken items * I hate how Yi is so garbage in most top/mid lane match ups * I hate how Yi is now super frustrating to play against because he snowballs super hard with said broken itemization, hence his ban rate. * Oh and I also hate how riot is looking for ways to "sejuani" him by destroying his kit with PBE changes before they fix the real problem of itemization abuse. So... What part of the way I feel about this season doesn't make sense? Yi won't be gutted by devourer/guinsoo changes unless they don't do anything to steraks/sunfire/iceborn/titanic, or if they decide to gut his kit before the item changes.
: Both items have significant changes planned for the midseason patch.
And do you have follow up changes planned for the champions that will be affected in a follow up patch? I hate when you guys nerf champions when items are the problem, then you nerf the items finally and leave the champions on an "acceptable" weak end of the spectrum of power. When you do that, it makes doing well with those champions feel much less rewarding, such that a player doing really badly will have more of an impact than you doing really well because your champion has a smaller range of power when they're left towards the weak end of what's acceptable.
Mozhu (NA)
: Rageblade is fine, but perhaps it's **numbers could be toned down a bit.** many champions rely on that item to even do well in lane..
Yeah because tanks are fucking broken and rageblade is the only thing that allows some fighters to deal at least some damage to malphites building sunfire and iceborn. It's not fine, it's a broken item necessary to keep fighters somewhat relevant in this broken meta. Fixing problems with more problems. Fighters that don't use rageblade that well get the D.
Eyesack (NA)
: Can we remove devourer from the game and then actually fix champs that rely on it to function?
Feel the exact same way, this season fucking sucks. Makes me really demotivated to play.
: Remove Highlander's immunity to AS slows
Wait... you want this on top of the current PBE nerfs? And both these things encourage Yi building glass cannon instead of the bs bruiser/tank build... how? The issues with Yi are that: * He is able to be fairly tanky and deal a lot of damage because current on-hit itemization like guinsoos/devourer and semi-tank itemization like steraks/maw are too efficient. * Because of the cost efficiency and synergy of those items, he snowballs very hard. * He is extremely frustrating to play against when he snowballs with current itemization - Hence the high ban rate despite an average/mediocre win rate. His issues are itemization, which leads to massive snowball potential which feeds into frustration and lack of comeback patterns because his counterplay becomes insignificant. Those same items (Not all built together, obviously) have made many other champions problematic as well {{champion:104}} {{champion:102}} {{champion:10}} Neither this change, or the PBE changes lead to solving any of his issues or issues with the game in general. They only serve to put a nail in the coffin for glass cannon Yi, as he will not be viable in the slightest without the broken itemization he currently abuses. Yi cannot be in a healthy balanced state (Which he was in for almost 3 seasons... His last change was in season 3) as a bruiser/tank. Also, it's interesting that you think that Yi lacks counterplay that he should have from AS slows, when really AS slows have almost 0 counterplay themselves. Malphite's and Nasus's particularly. They are on short cooldowns with long durations, they're almost permanent. That's why they're very difficult to duel late game. There should be at least 1 champion who can realistically be a threat to them 1 v 1 at 40 minutes.
: State of the Season: Coming up on mid-season
404 Error Solo Queue not found
º LB º (NA)
: Lissandra's New Buff is too op! Rito pls
Now she can flip her hair, or just *let it go,* tho.
: omg riot, Maw of Malmortius nerf wasn't needed!
Almost got me. You're a cheeky one. But I held my down vote. Well memed sir.
: Is it just me or is Master Yi still stupid strong?
Win rate wise, no. He went down quite a bit but is still seeing really high ban rates. Gameplay wise, he still snowballs really hard with the broken semi-offense semi-defense itemization and guinsoos (Even devourer tbh) because those items are too cost efficient. So if he gets ahead, he will still be stupid strong and really snow bally. Next patch's nerfs will gut glass cannon Yi, and he'll be forced to continue building current unhealthy items to survive, until those items get nerfed/replaced/rebalanced or w/e too eventually (Which, thankfully, they've mentioned they will do in the state of the season post). Sucks for a Yi main like me though because Riot usually doesn't revert champion nerfs that were caused by items after they nerf the actual item (See: {{item:1401}} ). He won't even have any hope of being a reset carry after those changes, he has to be built as a bruiser because he can't survive for 4 seconds with a glass cannon build in the middle of the enemy team after a 50% reset.
: So champion with 0 use in high elo/lcs is nerfed again
Horrible argument. Nerf is unjustified though. Guts squishy Yi, hurts bruiser/tank Yi. If he does need a nerf (Which he doesn't, the tank items everyone is building right now do like steraks), they need to nerf tank Yi, and buff squishy Yi (Fixing tank itemization would buff squishy damage Yi as a consequence by making ADCs stop building steraks/maw and w/e bs)
Sniper 0 (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Wenderwall,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ntbcOpxj,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2016-04-05T22:36:08.730+0000) > > What's the nerf he got? It's a -20% to his highlander passive on kills. So 50% reduction to the cooldown on kills and assists.... lol It's a slap on the wrist
It increases alpha strike's cooldown by 2+ seconds (Depending on CDR) on kills/assists at max rank alpha. AD Yi gets gutted, That's at least 4 seconds to burst a squishy Yi down. Tank/Bruiser Yi is the most successful build right now because it's still difficult for Yi to not be bursted down in the 2 seconds he has in between alphas as a squishy as is. Tank/Bruiser Yi and will still be viable after this, but that's no slap on the wrist, and tank/bruiser Yi is the problem and that's not being fixed, it's being encouraged.
: LMFAO faker played yi mid like last season what u talking about 3 years after rework
Yeah and he got carried and it didn't really matter what he played that game because their team was way better.
Maikal (NA)
: "Gold gain was increased." Except for junglers......
Maikal (NA)
: Make Steraks/Titanic scale off bonus HP
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