: > [{quoted}](name=MasticatingGrill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kEVn1sdP,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2015-01-31T04:03:28.698+0000) > > Your math is a war crime? Let's start with that. > > The combo comparison assumes MAX on all skills? Seriously. We're looking for the just-past-six point where Ahri tries to break out of laning phase. > > And this is not just about AP scaling or Charm buff, this also resonates with removal of DFG. > > So if she broke out of laning phase with a kill, and could B for rushed DFG at say level 8 if not sooner.... > > Then we are talking about much lower ability ranks, probably about 150 AP, and only one rank in Spirit Rush. > And now Ahri is either going to counter gank a 2v1 retaliation mid, delete top, or come gank bot while jg goes top. > > DFG was 15% health, so 150-200 dmg base? Then you have one rank in Charm for the 20% bonus PLUS the 20% DFG bonus. > You have six points to divide between Orb and Fox-Fire. One in Charm, one in Spirit Rush and let's go with 150 AP? > > Now this is a very lazy calculation but please bear with me, I'm in a hurry: > > 150-200 base %health magic damage > 199.5 magic damage + 171 true damage with three ranks in Q (yeah bad example but..) [90+52.5] x 1.4 + [90+52.5] x 1.2 > 336 magic damage if you somehow have three points in Fox-Fire at this point... [90+60] x 1.6 x 1.4 > 135 magic damage from Charm itself with one rank [60+52.5] x 1.2 > 483 magic damage from Spirit Rush with one rank [70+45] x 1.4 x 3 > > So... 1300+ magic damage plus 171 True damage? A full DFG combo plus 1-2 auto attacks would delete 1500 EHP which at that stage of play is... > > ...pretty much anyone in the game unless tank went bonus MR early. But even the tank would almost surely die from any further damage. > > NO ONE cares about 1800 EHP of damage at level 18 with a measly 200 AP that late in the game. But 1500 EHP at level 8 is damned scary. > > With the combined removal of DFG and the Charm buff to damage, she'd be hitting more in the range of 1000 EHP damage at even 200 AP. > > And guess what, the new less murderous mid-snowballer ahri now gets speed buffs on Q for more kiting. A very VERY different feel. > > Please add your opinion and corrections if you will. > > EDIT: Ahri's higher bases are nice but, at a glance the increased AP ratio on Charm is a miserable dogbone for the poor fox. > Riot was quite serious about trying to move away from a combo assassin and more into a kite mage with solid poke. I was comparing the original kit abilities vs the the changes. It was a scenario of 1 vs 1 with a full combo to see what the max damage possible would be with 100/200 AP respectively **without** DFG. If we want to focus just on Lv. 6 3 pts in Q, 1 pt in W, 1 pt in E and 1 pt in R with 120 AP assuming DFG. vs Lv. 6 New Ahri with {{item:3089}} 120AP + 30%(cuz deathcap passive) = 156 AP This will assume no runes/masteries. Just base stats for Ahri. Enemy will have 1500 HP. Then: **Old Ahri** Q: 180+ 70% AP W: 80+64% AP E: 60+35% AP R: 210+90% AP So vs a 1500 HP champ, Ahri DFG's for 15% of the enemy's max health. This does 225 dmg. then gives her a 20% damage boost. Then the old charm mechanic where it gives an additional +20% damage boost after it lands. So the equation would be like: DFG active(15% max hp) + [(180 + 84 + 40% dmg boost) + (80 + 76.8 + 40% dmg boost) + (60 + 42 + 20% dmg boost) + (210 + 108 + 40% dmg boost) Total Dmg: 225 + 369.6 + 219.52 + 122.4 + 445.2 = 1381.72 This doesn't include auto attacks. If we compare to new Ahri and removal of DFG and charm damage amplification and she uses a near equivalent item such as {{item:3089}} (but probably more than likely will be using {{item:3165}} but lets ignore that for this part) **New Ahri** Q: 180+ 70% AP W: 80 + 64% AP E: 60 + 50% AP R: 210+90% AP Equation would be like: (180 + 109.2) + (80 + 99.84) + (60 + 78) + (210 + 140.4) Total Dmg: 957.44 So Yes if we're talking about about how much the removal of DFG + her charm combo impacts her damage then yes, its a lot of missing damage. However if we're only talking about the removal of her charm's damage boost only in comparison with her old vs new kit then the change isn't that much if you're comparing at maxed out skills. If you want to compare just the difference at Lv. 6 with removal of her charm damage boost with 120 AP then... With Damage Amplification: (180 + 84 + 20% dmg boost) + (80 + 76.8 + 20% dmg boost) + (60 + 42) + (210 + 108 + 20% dmg boost) Total Damage= 316.8 + 188.16 + 102 + 381.6 = 988.56 (180 + 84) + (80 + 76.8) + (60 + 60) + (210 + 108) Total Damage= 858.8 Damage Difference = 129.76 If we want to say Ahri at Lv. 18 with 500 AP with just pre-charm nerfs. 336 (+ 420 AP) + 269 (+ 384 AP) + 180 (+ 175 AP) + 540 (+ 540 AP) Total Damage: 2844 Post charm nerfs. 280 (+ 350 AP) + 340 (+320 AP) + 200 (+250 AP) + 450 (+ 450 AP) Total Damage: 2640 Damage Difference = 204 So Yes. Old Ahri was better in terms of just base damage throughput. Disregarding DFG removal the charm difference isn't that much. Sure its a slight damage nerf but Ahri gained a great utility feature with the movement speed boost on her Q.
> [{quoted}](name=ravenswolfy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kEVn1sdP,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2015-02-02T17:54:41.570+0000) > > So Yes. Old Ahri was better in terms of just base damage throughput. Disregarding DFG removal the charm difference isn't that much. Sure its a slight damage nerf but Ahri gained a great utility feature with the movement speed boost on her Q. Right, good. That was all that I insisted. Thank you for the diligence of bearing with me on this. I just wanted the fuller comparison including loss of DFG, and a lower set point to compare damages. I actually like the overall move back to kite-mage. Just the initial loss in post-breakout damage was PHENOMENAL on day one. And it is taking a bit of time to change my bad habits. I feel like Ahri will have a healthier range of item diversity picks, at least until people settle into some stale new meta again. But in the meantime have an upvote, and thanks again.
: > [{quoted}](name=MasticatingGrill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6vyJKkBe,comment-id=00070000000000000000,timestamp=2015-01-30T11:22:53.704+0000) > > Riot is backing itself into a corner with some bad picks on the rework board. Their fix for AP assassins being able to 100-0 in one combo was removing DFG, but they also took LBs silence and Ahri's charm damage buff. It was a major mistake for assassins to ever be able to 100-0 ANYone uncontested. They took Talon's silence too for similar reasons. If they cannot set the target for an assassin to be 60-0 on ADC and 30-0 on tanks in one clean engage, they did something horribly wrong in the design phase. That's not what those changes were about. The whole general shift for assassins was to space out their kill potential and add more counterplay. It's fine for an assassin to 100-0 anyone, even a tank, provided they give their victim opportunities to react to them and outplay them, which is why several assassins lost their silences, and a major reason why DFG was removed. > [{quoted}](name=MasticatingGrill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6vyJKkBe,comment-id=00070000000000000000,timestamp=2015-01-30T11:22:53.704+0000) > > Take away Annie's resists? Completely remove Poppy's passive? Why not take out Malph's shield? Morg's life steal? Akali's sustain? There is a TON of champs with levels of stealth tankiness once you start looking. {{champion:54}} 's shield is just about as far removed from stealth tankiness as can be (it's a clearly visible shield that even changes Malph's model when active). I'm not too big a fan of {{champion:25}} 's spell vamp or {{champion:84}} 's sustain, but sustain itself can be perfectly visible provided it's properly implemented. {{champion:39}} is a champion who lacks clarity in her sustain, because she sustains in such small amounts and from practically everything in her kit that it's difficult to see how much she's healing for at any given time. > [{quoted}](name=MasticatingGrill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6vyJKkBe,comment-id=00070000000000000000,timestamp=2015-01-30T11:22:53.704+0000) > > And my god man. Shaco, Teemo just the tip of the iceberg. Frustration has always been a design goal for some champs. Trollcranking? With that shield... Anivia OP egg taunt that makes people bronze themselves into dying for that finisher. Frustration is exactly proportional to encouraging good play practices and counterplay. Trap sweeping, pink wards, knowing when to pull out. "PANTHEON IS MISSING" etc. I'm not sure how being wreathed in flames is unclear on Annie. Or for that matter if you just left click on her it will show how many stun stacks she has. No guessing there either. It's good that you mention {{champion:35}} and {{champion:17}}, because they've been called out by both the community and Riot themselves for having toxic kits. Perhaps frustration has a place as a gameplay mechanic in League, but frustration for the sake of frustration isn't good. If we really do want to have deliberately frustrating or trollish champions in the game, they should still be fun to play against in some way or another. Killing {{champion:34}} when she's in egg form, even if you die for it, is tremendously rewarding, and so is dodging a {{champion:53}} hook or clearing an enemy pink ward.
Incidentally we just sorted a match where disabling Katarina was the only way to win. Kill logs showed she was deleting champs with damage dealt in a 0.2 second window. The tank lasted 0.4 second even with a hard MR item. That is in the new setup without DFG. Kat's damage is just so high that she can 100-0 pretty much anyone and reset. And you have to go 4-5 together versus her. We turned the whole game around with Riot's latent cast issue...several times when she Shunpo-dodged from my Annie stun proc, she arrived at her target without taking damage....but was STUNNED because Rito coding. Then instead of ulting three people she got focused while stunned and instantly died. Does that work for counterplay? Because legitimately it seems more like a bug to fix. And whether Akali, Kat, Zed...Jax? Godyr? I feel like being able to 1v5 an equally fed comp is tons more frustrating to a team than Annie's E or even Teemo's shrooms. 100-0 with almost no counterplay is still a serious risk on many champs. And the 35% reduced damage for Ahri does nothing to resolve classically toxic assassins like Kat. (They removed the DFG which means no %health damage + steroid, less max AP and they also removed the dmg buff from Charm...assassin Ahri seriously loses in the range of 35% dmg from her early combo prior to level 11). http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/kEVn1sdP-ahri-changes-how-much-did-it-hurt?show=flat&comment=0004 Please help in correcting if I made some huge error on that, I was in a hurry. But Kat can still easily do that much and more without a crutch like the DFG.
: Ahri Changes. How Much Did It Hurt?
> [{quoted}](name=ravenswolfy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kEVn1sdP,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-01-22T20:01:45.674+0000) > So At 200 AP the damage difference is close but still lower than the old version. (Disregarding penetration and magic resists) > > Thoughts? Your math is a war crime? Let's start with that. The combo comparison assumes MAX on all skills? Seriously. We're looking for the just-past-six point where Ahri tries to break out of laning phase. And this is not just about AP scaling or Charm buff, this also resonates with removal of DFG. So if she broke out of laning phase with a kill, and could B for rushed DFG at say level 8 if not sooner.... Then we are talking about much lower ability ranks, probably about 150 AP, and only one rank in Spirit Rush. And now Ahri is either going to counter gank a 2v1 retaliation mid, delete top, or come gank bot while jg goes top. DFG was 15% health, so 150-200 dmg base? Then you have one rank in Charm for the 20% bonus PLUS the 20% DFG bonus. You have six points to divide between Orb and Fox-Fire. One in Charm, one in Spirit Rush and let's go with 150 AP? Now this is a very lazy calculation but please bear with me, I'm in a hurry: 150-200 base %health magic damage 199.5 magic damage + 171 true damage with three ranks in Q (yeah bad example but..) [90+52.5] x 1.4 + [90+52.5] x 1.2 336 magic damage if you somehow have three points in Fox-Fire at this point... [90+60] x 1.6 x 1.4 135 magic damage from Charm itself with one rank [60+52.5] x 1.2 483 magic damage from Spirit Rush with one rank [70+45] x 1.4 x 3 So... 1300+ magic damage plus 171 True damage? A full DFG combo plus 1-2 auto attacks would delete 1500 EHP which at that stage of play is... ...pretty much anyone in the game unless tank went bonus MR early. But even the tank would almost surely die from any further damage. NO ONE cares about 1800 EHP of damage at level 18 with a measly 200 AP that late in the game. But 1500 EHP at level 8 is damned scary. With the combined removal of DFG and the Charm buff to damage, she'd be hitting more in the range of 1000 EHP damage at even 200 AP. And guess what, the new less murderous mid-snowballer ahri now gets speed buffs on Q for more kiting. A very VERY different feel. Please add your opinion and corrections if you will. EDIT: Ahri's higher bases are nice but, at a glance the increased AP ratio on Charm is a miserable dogbone for the poor fox. Riot was quite serious about trying to move away from a combo assassin and more into a kite mage with solid poke.
: > [{quoted}](name=MasticatingGrill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6vyJKkBe,comment-id=00070000000000000000,timestamp=2015-01-30T11:22:53.704+0000) > > Riot is backing itself into a corner with some bad picks on the rework board. Their fix for AP assassins being able to 100-0 in one combo was removing DFG, but they also took LBs silence and Ahri's charm damage buff. It was a major mistake for assassins to ever be able to 100-0 ANYone uncontested. They took Talon's silence too for similar reasons. If they cannot set the target for an assassin to be 60-0 on ADC and 30-0 on tanks in one clean engage, they did something horribly wrong in the design phase. That's not what those changes were about. The whole general shift for assassins was to space out their kill potential and add more counterplay. It's fine for an assassin to 100-0 anyone, even a tank, provided they give their victim opportunities to react to them and outplay them, which is why several assassins lost their silences, and a major reason why DFG was removed. > [{quoted}](name=MasticatingGrill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6vyJKkBe,comment-id=00070000000000000000,timestamp=2015-01-30T11:22:53.704+0000) > > Take away Annie's resists? Completely remove Poppy's passive? Why not take out Malph's shield? Morg's life steal? Akali's sustain? There is a TON of champs with levels of stealth tankiness once you start looking. {{champion:54}} 's shield is just about as far removed from stealth tankiness as can be (it's a clearly visible shield that even changes Malph's model when active). I'm not too big a fan of {{champion:25}} 's spell vamp or {{champion:84}} 's sustain, but sustain itself can be perfectly visible provided it's properly implemented. {{champion:39}} is a champion who lacks clarity in her sustain, because she sustains in such small amounts and from practically everything in her kit that it's difficult to see how much she's healing for at any given time. > [{quoted}](name=MasticatingGrill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6vyJKkBe,comment-id=00070000000000000000,timestamp=2015-01-30T11:22:53.704+0000) > > And my god man. Shaco, Teemo just the tip of the iceberg. Frustration has always been a design goal for some champs. Trollcranking? With that shield... Anivia OP egg taunt that makes people bronze themselves into dying for that finisher. Frustration is exactly proportional to encouraging good play practices and counterplay. Trap sweeping, pink wards, knowing when to pull out. "PANTHEON IS MISSING" etc. I'm not sure how being wreathed in flames is unclear on Annie. Or for that matter if you just left click on her it will show how many stun stacks she has. No guessing there either. It's good that you mention {{champion:35}} and {{champion:17}}, because they've been called out by both the community and Riot themselves for having toxic kits. Perhaps frustration has a place as a gameplay mechanic in League, but frustration for the sake of frustration isn't good. If we really do want to have deliberately frustrating or trollish champions in the game, they should still be fun to play against in some way or another. Killing {{champion:34}} when she's in egg form, even if you die for it, is tremendously rewarding, and so is dodging a {{champion:53}} hook or clearing an enemy pink ward.
Like I said Annie's E is clearly visible and you can count her stun stacks. What more do you want, visible cooldown indicators for her E? May as well ask for a CD indicator on Yi or Nunu. Some part of the game must be left to skill and instinct. Sure she can be a rotten surprise for new players with crappy skills, but honestly most well built champions should have a real shocker in their kit. Like Zyra used to terrify me with her bizarre kit. Your core argument is that she needs to be physically weaker than ever in trade for more lane harass. Which is strange because her Qs and autos have the same range. You just want a more mana efficient poke? Or that speed boost to land one more parting Q on an opponent? Annie could be a cannon or a fortress in the past, but what you suggest sounds more like a little skirmishing gunboat that blows up if you ever land a hit on it.
: I think you and I have very different mentalities regarding this. You expect Riot to fail before they even make a change, and see the balancing and adjustments they do as just more signs of failure. You also dislike risk and change, and so expect any rework to also be a failure. I think Riot's been doing an overall great job and, while they do make mistakes (and some pretty big ones, like 4.20 {{champion:19}}), they also listen to feedback (despite what the boards here may think) and improve accordingly. I think League is a better game than it ever has been, and I think it's going to keep improving. Riot announced an eventual massive overhaul to Poppy, and I look forward to it, as they did an amazing job with {{champion:14}}. If you keep seeing Riot as some kind of opponent trying to deceive and spite you, you're pretty much setting yourself up for disappointment with every new change they make.
Sion did turn out okay, even with conversion to a mana using champion. But the overall recent trend has been broken releases and misreading the concept when they rework a kit. Followed by a rain of patches to keep altering the new kit due to insufficient testing. This is leading me to general pessimism at this time, yes. I do think some champs badly need a full rework and soon because their old role is obsolete. But Annie just seems low on the list for an overhaul. She just needs pre-DFG power attitudes.
: Isn't deceptive tankiness a bad thing, though? If you're playing Annie, you might get some sort of satisfaction at being able to take a couple extra hits (even then, that's difficult to gauge), but if you're playing as her opponent, it's both confusing and frustrating to not damage her as much as you're supposed to, and damage yourself while doing so. {{champion:78}} , on top of her other flaws, is a big example of how unhealthy stealth-tankiness can be, since her damage reduction passive makes her much tougher in a way that's difficult to determine.
You just reminded me that Poppy has been threatened with another of Riot's low quality reworks. Once completed the last Megling will be gone and there will be one more dippy Yordle. A Red even casually mentioned that maybe they would throw out the whole backstory and complete concept and just make a slightly similar champion with the same name. And a totally new kit. These guys are making some really risky moves with their new and reworked stuff. It's like the PBE is almost useless to indicate whether a champion is ready to ship :( You can clearly see it from the panic patches after every single recent release.
: > [{quoted}](name=MasticatingGrill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6vyJKkBe,comment-id=000700000000,timestamp=2015-01-30T10:24:15.232+0000) > > This is an argument against diversity. :( Poppy is a clear example of stealth tankiness, yes. And EVERYONE knows her. I'm not arguing against diversity, I'm arguing against a lack of clarity. I think tanky characters are fine, as long as that tankiness is visible in some form. Everyone knows Poppy (or do they?), but that doesn't make it any less difficult to gauge the strength of her passive, which is one of the many reasons she's unhealthy to play against. > [{quoted}](name=MasticatingGrill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6vyJKkBe,comment-id=000700000000,timestamp=2015-01-30T10:24:15.232+0000) > > So you are saying that TRULY rare ability specs like stealth tankiness and mana injection etc should have all been removed? Definitely yes to the first, most likely yes to the second. Making anything difficult to fully appreciate is bad design. I think mana is a whole can of worms that needs to be addressed comprehensively, but giving mana to others needs to carry some significance beyond just having your champion act like a mana battery, which was one of old {{champion:16}} 's major problems. > [{quoted}](name=MasticatingGrill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6vyJKkBe,comment-id=000700000000,timestamp=2015-01-30T10:24:15.232+0000) > > Riot can barely balance a stun so lets remove all silences, then blinds and probably roots too? Where does simplifying end? I'm not advocating simplification of anything here. If something lacks clarity or consistency or healthiness, or if it could just be improved, then I'd like that thing to change for the better. I'm not a fan of blinds (again, due to confusing feedback), but I think stuns and silences are fine, again provided they're clear enough in their application. > [{quoted}](name=MasticatingGrill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6vyJKkBe,comment-id=000700000000,timestamp=2015-01-30T10:24:15.232+0000) > > The entire point of Annie was to bait enemies and frustrate them. Counterplaying her involves not getting pulled in. But is that counterplay, though? More to the point, is it truly healthy for a champion to frustrate its opponents? I'm not sure of the answer, but I know for sure that frustrating people via insufficient clarity isn't a good thing to have.
Riot is backing itself into a corner with some bad picks on the rework board. Their fix for AP assassins being able to 100-0 in one combo was removing DFG, but they also took LBs silence and Ahri's charm damage buff. It was a major mistake for assassins to ever be able to 100-0 ANYone uncontested. They took Talon's silence too for similar reasons. If they cannot set the target for an assassin to be 60-0 on ADC and 30-0 on tanks in one clean engage, they did something horribly wrong in the design phase. Take away Annie's resists? Completely remove Poppy's passive? Why not take out Malph's shield? Morg's life steal? Akali's sustain? There is a TON of champs with levels of stealth tankiness once you start looking. And my god man. Shaco, Teemo just the tip of the iceberg. Frustration has always been a design goal for some champs. Trollcranking? With that shield... Anivia OP egg taunt that makes people bronze themselves into dying for that finisher. Frustration is exactly proportional to encouraging good play practices and counterplay. Trap sweeping, pink wards, knowing when to pull out. "PANTHEON IS MISSING" etc. I'm not sure how being wreathed in flames is unclear on Annie. Or for that matter if you just left click on her it will show how many stun stacks she has. No guessing there either. I still disagree with 100-0 assassins but if you want to kill Annie you bait her E at minimum. You probably bait her stun too, gambling on Flash or a mobility skill to escape that hard damage and harder disable. She cannot chase you very easily. Annie gets kills by baiting tryhard ganks, Flash initiating, and bursting hard damage into a team fight. She does not chase, and an auto attack steroid would potentially turn her into another Kayle or Teemo or etc. Besides they normalized her attack and cast ranges. She used to have an even shorter range on Q than on her auto if I remember it right. Of course they nerfed hell out of her R range over the years. And there are still bugs with applying stun via R in certain situations. I do not have all the answers but I HATE Dota 2 and I also sorely dislike the old games where everything was pretty much the same except for damage radius and caster stats. I want to keep Annie as a squishy little brawler with a big bomb.
: DFG helped Annie's burst a lot, but it was not necessary. I have seen Annie's with just a Rod of Ages completely obliterate my midlaner, and it wasn't even fully stacked. Giving her a move speed boost allows her to just initiate without having to flash guaranteeing a kill on any immobile champion. You DO NOT need to buff her auto attack harass so that the enemy mid is always at half health, where she can zone them and setup kills on them. Everything you are proposing would make her way to overbearing in lane and then Riot will have to nerf her into an unplayable safe. If these were implemented a melee mid (Zed, Talon, Fizz, Diana) would never be able to touch Annie and would be GG at champ select.
I think you understand annie then. Flash dependent nuke is somewhat unhealthy, and without DFG perhaps they can make her slightly less flash dependent again like the old days. But you seem to understand her root as a gank resistant mid. At least her E is no longer 16 seconds up, with what a 30sec cooldown? And they nerfed the early game damage and now the early laning resists too. But what do you think of the supposed Tibbers buff? Overall I am not much impressed yet. He still seems very slow moving, 3/4 second burst speed barely nets one extra auto attack...sometimes. I guess the extra E tankiness is nice tho such as when he tanks a turret or when he lives more than 1.7 seconds in a team fight (hello Smite). This just nets that her initiate is even more Flash-R-E than ever before. Which makes her distressingly predictable. Old Annie could pretty much counter gank any single champion who didn't go in hard at full health...and with her E on CD. She has lost a lot of that power and versatility and now RoA is one of the topmost core items on her. Damage bases lower, E damage lower, E resists lower too now. Annie is becoming very AP dependent, somewhat pen dependent, and heavily Tibbers dependent. This just seems like they really cramped her options for play style.
: Isn't deceptive tankiness a bad thing, though? If you're playing Annie, you might get some sort of satisfaction at being able to take a couple extra hits (even then, that's difficult to gauge), but if you're playing as her opponent, it's both confusing and frustrating to not damage her as much as you're supposed to, and damage yourself while doing so. {{champion:78}} , on top of her other flaws, is a big example of how unhealthy stealth-tankiness can be, since her damage reduction passive makes her much tougher in a way that's difficult to determine.
This is an argument against diversity. :( Poppy is a clear example of stealth tankiness, yes. And EVERYONE knows her. So you are saying that TRULY rare ability specs like stealth tankiness and mana injection etc should have all been removed? Riot can barely balance a stun so lets remove all silences, then blinds and probably roots too? Where does simplifying end? The entire point of Annie was to bait enemies and frustrate them. Counterplaying her involves not getting pulled in.
: Annie's PBE Changes Are Great, But She Needs a New E
I think you have some confusion on roles here. In a word, Annie has always been. DELIBERATE. She was intended to look small and weak but have a shocking tanky side and hit like an atom bomb esp in team fights. Poor HP, slow, no fancy dodges or illusions. No inbuilt lifesteal or other special immunities. And TERRIFYING. Thanks to item changes they messed with her kit. There were more champ counters against her in mid. Annie went down to support. In the era of the DFG Annie's viable kits shrank quite a lot. And it didn't help that Riot tried to make her more AP dependent. With the DFG removed, in this initial period Annie is still lacking a lot of viability outside support picks. I mean anyone with a brain would counter pick her for mid as reasonable caution....? She just does not have that "assault fortress" feel that I used to love in her. The feel of E being vital in her kit, her life or death. The Yi killer. This current minor buff to E's utility on Tibbers does not really make up for the bear mostly being slow...and the BAM factor of smite. If they want to make Tibbers a huge part of her post-six kit, he should really inherit more stats from her. Want to tank? Now you have two tanks. Pure damage? More damage including to towers. Unless you want some strange thing like Akali, say AP makes Tibbers tankier but HP or resists make him do more damage? The current flow of changes from Riot feels a bit lazy. And god forbid they try to rework a kit that is still 90% of being a solid mid again. For support.
: Ranged can beat anyone. I'm referring to the melee's who have to sit in his turret zone to fight. He can plant a turret almost whenever he wants mid to late game. When he's dead, his turrets still eat you for a few seconds before going down. That's what I hate.
Heimer top still a less toxic pick than a Lucian. Mid you want someone with better range, or a Smite Nunu. Bottom lane you want a correctly chosen Support that can screw him over.
: I described 1 situation out of many where, regardless of how far he is from his turrets, they'll still be wrecking you. No matter if he's dead. His turrets are wrecking you. That's what I'm getting at. Reading and comprehension man. > I can't say how many times I've seen a heimy, just to have him flash over wall and run, **but his turrets are still rocking my face**.
Yes but this is still bringing up the flash dependent champ issue. Heimer is weakest when on the run, you need a comp and strategy. Either have someone pick into him to keep him from setting up. Or have someone pick into tanking or ganking. He doesn't even need to Flash to stun you and sit with popcorn. It is hella important to not let YOUR Flash get baited out early. Once you've either destroyed his turrets or at least made him run... ...the provocateur needs to disengage and the killer needs to kill. If there is ONE quality of life improvement....I want ONE timer change. Have the turrets begin counting down from START of his B sequence.
Veraska (NA)
: rubber dress? i think you and i are picturing some vastly different?
Magical TV shows from the 90s? Sakura was fighting an electrical damage based card. Tomoyo had a RUBBER dress ready. Because Tomoyo was creepy as hell. Magical Girl Lux with frills and fake decorative armor will be creepy as hell.
Veraska (NA)
: im just picturing something very "magical girl" but with like, light armor plating. which sounds to me. right up her character alley. im just picturing like, under her armor. all the frilly high fashion garments and such. you know what im saying or do i have to draw some references?
> im just picturing something very "magical girl" but with like, light armor plating. which sounds to me. right up her character alley. > > im just picturing like, under her armor. all the frilly high fashion garments and such. you know what im saying or do i have to draw some references? Yes yes it was just before Tomoyo made Sakura wear the RUBBER dress. And the above is why your idea needs to be shot down with a finely vajazzled LUXOR.
: >She's got to be that champ that you dread trading melee with when you go in to CS because she's a beefy lady with a big-ass blacksmiths hammer and **HER CONVICTIONS WILL NOT FALTER** . Whatever you dish out she will be able to take. To draw a parallel she should come off concept wise as the lady-yordle equivalent of Garen, minus the patriotism and military position. > I feel you there. > You can swap around Home-Gurls skills as much as balance dictates but the whole theme of being a pint-sized diplomat This is where you lose me. Diplomat? I realize that's a current thing. But what does that mean and how does it translate into any meaningful theme for Poppy at a high level? Things I get the feels for when I thin of Poppy: - Big power, small package. Whether she's the runt of the litter, the outcast, whatever, she's tiny and packs a punch. Contrast, love that shit. - Conviction and loyalty. Maybe she's part of the home guard, maybe she's her own little one-yordle army. Either way, she has her allegiance and it's like an oath that binds her. - Serious. Unlike a lot of yordles, Poppy is probably the least goofy or silly. Maybe she's even stoic. Either way she's not a big-brain like Heimer, nor is she a crazed bomber like Ziggs. She's got grit and isn't down with the nonsense. Big character reference for me, though not in terms of actual scale :P -- http://i.imgur.com/8YbWLA3.jpg?1 Let me know if I'm off the mark with that. Diplomat though.. Yes, I realize that it's something in the current iteration of her story. But what does that mean at a **high level**? A diplomat is a career, it isn't an identifying characteristic of a person's core. You could be an honest, peace loving diplomat. You could be a sneaky, covert ops "diplomat". You could have good, bad or neutral agendas. Either way, this is the least compelling term that currently shows up in the lexicon. I would argue that it's completely arbitrary, and is only compelling on an extremely granular level. Not something I'd build a character off of. That said, I'm open to ideas. I'm more interested what players **feel** viscerally when they play or want to play Poppy. What makes her compelling at her core? What makes her speak to the pint-sized terror in all of us? What makes us root for the underdog? What allows us to feel what drives her?
So she's gonna get killed just like a couple other recent champs that got reworked. Following recent reworks, she'll have her passive gutted and be much easier to delete. Following recent reworks, she'll have at least one true AoE ability. Following recent reworks, she'll probably have a modified 'skill shot' ability. I expect her ult may be reduced in core power but gain a useless passive. A "SNEAKY COVERT OPS DIPLOMAT" IS AN ASSASSIN POPPY IS 100% ANTI ASSASSIN. This heavy handed and dismissive attitude toward prior art is why we Rito Plz. The Little Lannister is a good personality, but she fights with the power of the Mountain. Powerful charge, powerful smite, shrugs off killing blows and deletion abilities. And reinforcing this was the unshakeable will and sense of justice and honor. Poppy has no escapes, no CC, no AoE disables...and she does not NEED them. She will charge in, take hits, KILL her target and break your formation with pure will. If you gut her like the other reworked champs and take away that identity....SHAME.
: Heimerdinger balance plz
> With his rework he become one of the most annoying champions to lane, or even play against. His support role is an absurdity, and his mid/top lane is just crazy. I propose a couple of changes to him, that I feel would make him a bit more balanced. > For 1, the second he is out of range of his turrets, they need to deactivate. I can't say how many times I've seen a heimy, just to have him flash over wall and run, but his turrets are still rocking my face. This leads me to my 2nd proposition. > ONCE HEIMERDINGER IS DEAD, HIS TURRETS NEED TO DEACTIVATE IMMEDIATELY! When Zyra dies, her plants die. Yea she has her passive, but that shit's easier to dodge, and if you lived with 20 hp after fighting Zyra, you have a chance to escape. With heimy, his turrets will own you. > That's all I can really say about Heimerdinger. He's annoying enough with his turrets, please do something about them when he's out of range, or dead. You describe a flash dependent situation and label it as champ being OP. Instead this means your picks and communication were poor as a team. If a Heim wants to flash wall, then NEXT time you should bait his flash. When he goes over, there should be someone waiting on the other side. To make a Heim quit if he's in some other lane, you want like a Smite Nunu or Smite Karthus or such.
darkdill (NA)
: So what's the plan for Lux in terms of textures/model/visuals/etc.?
> Her animations are totally fine, though I imagine her textures could use the same kind of reflective shine that Leona now gets. I also imagine they'll probably want to reduce her model's chest size on all skins, what with their whole "nerf oversized boobs" mentality as of late (though in Lux's case it's very sensible). > > Anything to say? The chest nerfs ongoing are because Rito figured out the world has switched to flat screens lol.
Cronovey (NA)
: Considering that in just a couple weeks of being in Korea for Worlds, NA pros were able to achieve Challenger rating in Korean solo queue, no, it isn't true. While *some* players may be better, it's easy to make a claim that you're better than someone, and much more difficult to prove it. Just because some solo queue players may be better mechanically does not mean that they would make a good team player and be able to achieve what professional players from all over the world can achieve; in a queue where communication is generally lacking, ward coverage is much spottier, and champion select boils down to teams bickering over who gets stuck supporting while someone bans selfishly to get rid of their own counters half the time, you can't judge how well a player works on a coordinated team.
> Considering that in just a couple weeks of being in Korea for Worlds, NA pros were able to achieve Challenger rating in Korean solo queue, no, it isn't true. While *some* players may be better, it's easy to make a claim that you're better than someone, and much more difficult to prove it. > > Just because some solo queue players may be better mechanically does not mean that they would make a good team player and be able to achieve what professional players from all over the world can achieve; in a queue where communication is generally lacking, ward coverage is much spottier, and champion select boils down to teams bickering over who gets stuck supporting while someone bans selfishly to get rid of their own counters half the time, you can't judge how well a player works on a coordinated team. Try to be a Korean Challenger in NA SoloQ...I think that was the point being made. Bastards will be all like chingchong racism AFK "you are Korean you can 1v5". Players in some countries take these ladder type games more seriously.
: > According to Rito central, (autolyte bot) unlike Tribunal the current report system only counts one report per reported match. And it simply values the most reputable reporter based on whatever crap metrics they use to measure that. But when you tilt on your main like a monkey instead of hamming on to an alt, you now generate VALID reports from players who are probably in better standing than the idiots you did that ONE match with. > > You are getting no sympathy because your only responses are "THOSE TROLLS STARTED THIS BAN THEM", "Riot sucks and everything sucks trolls are gonna get me banned", and "Yeah I know I ruined a bunch of other matches but hey I was on tilt and that is NOT my fault." > > Trying to condescend on an alt and begging for a 1v1 to prove yourself is just gross. If this is your true personality then I do expect at least a two-week slot incoming for you in the near future. If at that time you demand an elevated review you will almost certain be perma banned. Don't blame Rito for your lack of a filter. Now THERE'S the kind of constructively critical response I'm looking for. This wasn't a sympathy seeking type of post, it's intention was to start some discussion on the topic and you've now provided me some details I was unaware of and can indeed help me to make some better decisions in the future. I had no idea that with riots crappy new system that multiple reports were no longer a big factor. It used to be that playing with a duo that reports you (or god forbid a 4 man troll squad in a normal that reports you) were great ways to get a case started in tribunal and I suppose were a big part of the problem in why the report system was failing to do its job well a while back. It makes me extremely happy to know that this is the case and makes my subsequent actions all the more foolish and reckless. In response to the tilt games not being my fault, that's just ridiculous, of course I'm responsible for my actions in those games, and and 100% at fault for them. I only made the case that those actions were a natural and human reaction to a previous stimulus. And they indeed were. No one else can be blamed but me for face checking a bush in the second game at a minute 10 seconds when the only other person out of the fountain is Braum and he's not even to the inhibitors. That the whole team then cries gg, refuses to head to the enemy red and prevent a 3 buff start for the opposing team (pure folly in a game where fb was given up that early by the jungler), and then also refuses to leash at blue either and leaves the jungler (who is a champ with very low ability to solo a buff at lvl 1) to do it with zero chance of being able to make a first clear even and have life left, is the epitome of silver level play. In say a platinum level game even those players would be intelligent enough to know that there is a very good chance the game is a loss unless that early strategic blunder is mitigated as much as possible, they would not have followed me to enemy red, they would have been WAITING there, warded up. Hell those players would t be a minute late out of the fountain either, you know how many players in my higher level matches take a minute plus to get in position? None, protecting from an invade inside a minute is crucial to the game's start. So while the face check is on me, the insta rage and refusal to cooperate as a team is on them and lost the game before minions spawned. Bot lane even died as the four invaders ganked right after red. That team never wanted to win, which makes the start hella frustrating, to have to endure any smart mouthing and finger pointing afterwards would have been impossible. Just to provide context and clarify some things. As far as trying to condescend on a smurf, you should accept your OWN advice, your first post was undeniably volatile towards some one who was already in a bad place. THIS should have been what you posted, it's the perfect response. It provides a well grounded viewpoint, constructive criticism, and is more nuetral toward the player. Thanks! +1'd
I value this response more than your previous posts. I was volatile because I've seen quite a few complaint threads and they seldom end well. In my initial response I just read your OP and then looked you up, and I did not like what I saw. :/ Silver is a pit but it's also one that you can rank out of, with beginning of season being the best time to try for next rank during the flood of qualifiers. Did you look up the players from that losing match and find a major rank gap with bottom lane? It's very easy to get a bad premade duo bot against a smurf premade duo, then your jg is stuck camping bot. Especially when in promos it becomes key to stay polite and NEVER mention in chat that you are in promos. Probably a real troll would have looked you up and seen you are in promos anyway, but still. Esp some of Gold V, Silver V, there are smurfs keeping below III rank by playing badly....and then they get to shit all over someone's dream when they see a promo player. You can still escape Silver eventually. Gold is a little better but there are some third rate drama queens and I hate that tier. Maybe I should look you up after I've spent a bit more time ruining lives over on EUW with my new end of season alt.
: > http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/miscellaneous/WZcEUHBm-would-you-punish-a-question-of-morals-i-suppose?show=flat > > Check my post here, having a similar discussion on the ethics in league right now. > > The current consensus seems to be to punish everyone for everything, regardless of the situation or the cause, despite EVERYONE having to go through this at one point or another. Personally I'd agree with you. Screw those guys. They need you to win. And if they wanted to win, they shouldn't have raged on you, or anyone else on your team. Save it for the enemy. So by raging on you, they aren't cooperating as a team. And if they aren't cooperating, it means they don't want to win (in my eyes). So by going afk, you're giving them exactly what they were asking for. That one single game has started a loss streak now. Totally tilted because of it. That kind of thing is the worst and it CAUSES things like tilt streaks. Third game now in a row I lost, started this one 5/2, but the problem is i was 5/2 when the score split was our 5 to the enemy 18. Being tilted in games where you HAVE to carry to win makes it a lot harder. Called some bad shots in this one too so its not like it was all my team. I muted everyone at the start which of course made my chat simply game related and the team followed my orders but that one was never gonna be winnable. So far I'm 0/3 on the night in three games that I never could have won, only one of which (and since I had everyone muted who knows) was not totally toxic. This is not a good trend Riot. if 66% or more of my games are like this (and believe me, the number is a LOT higher) whats the point of playing? Its not enjoyable in any form. If you ever wondered what makes players leave your game for another and stop playing, this is the reason Riot.
> > http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/miscellaneous/WZcEUHBm-would-you-punish-a-question-of-morals-i-suppose?show=flat > > > > Check my post here, having a similar discussion on the ethics in league right now. > > > > The current consensus seems to be to punish everyone for everything, regardless of the situation or the cause, despite EVERYONE having to go through this at one point or another. Personally I'd agree with you. Screw those guys. They need you to win. And if they wanted to win, they shouldn't have raged on you, or anyone else on your team. Save it for the enemy. So by raging on you, they aren't cooperating as a team. And if they aren't cooperating, it means they don't want to win (in my eyes). So by going afk, you're giving them exactly what they were asking for. > > That one single game has started a loss streak now. Totally tilted because of it. That kind of thing is the worst and it CAUSES things like tilt streaks. Third game now in a row I lost, started this one 5/2, but the problem is i was 5/2 when the score split was our 5 to the enemy 18. Being tilted in games where you HAVE to carry to win makes it a lot harder. Called some bad shots in this one too so its not like it was all my team. I muted everyone at the start which of course made my chat simply game related and the team followed my orders but that one was never gonna be winnable. So far I'm 0/3 on the night in three games that I never could have won, only one of which (and since I had everyone muted who knows) was not totally toxic. This is not a good trend Riot. if 66% or more of my games are like this (and believe me, the number is a LOT higher) whats the point of playing? Its not enjoyable in any form. If you ever wondered what makes players leave your game for another and stop playing, this is the reason Riot. I have said before, in LoL I do like the idea that everyone gets PWND eventually for fighting it out in chat. In other games like WoT it just made the game boring as shit when it used to be amazeballs. The difference, a really big one, is that in WoT you'd only get one life to waste. And almost no healing. So when somebody went apeshit yelling at everyone to juke the artillery or he'd kill us all IRL....it just fit. Also the difference between LoL and Dota, there is a bit less emphasis on KDA metrics for snowballing. So you can actually have a little fun, level by pushing an empty lane, anyone can farm jg late game. I want to have fun and I want others to feel like they are having fun. And on my lesser alts I do what I want :3
Diabols (NA)
: Because Riot doesn't want to make Grocer Soraka, where she throws real bananas and spills fruit for her abilities.
> Because Riot doesn't want to make Grocer Soraka, where she throws real bananas and spills fruit for her abilities. YOU IDIOT THAT WOULD BE PERFECT. They could tear up this new garbage kit and FIX IT. Infinite bananas for her allies, and only the PEEL for her enemies. Your Mom just wants you to eat well. If her R had a health cost instead of mana we could call it "OH NO A BUS." And the enemy team would cry and quit the game.
Skias (NA)
: At least Azir is fun. She looks really dry, just another champ held together with broken passives.
> At least Azir is fun. She looks really dry, just another champ held together with broken passives. Azir is becoming almost fun to play thru patches and quality of life improvements. Would be nice if Kal did not have to start out like that.
: For those who truly don't get it, who don't understand the purpose of this post, or the reasoning behind bringing this example up let me lay it out for you. In a game where I got trolled intentionally, abused verbally, berated and demeaned, belittled and blamed, a game that was lost due to the negative behavior and attitudes of each player EXCEPT for myself (my negative behavior had no effect on the outcome of the game, it was already a lost cause in champ select and certainly over by the 10 minute mark when I decided to let those idiots have a piece of my mind), I was reported by every member of our team, and likely by members of the opposing team who were convinced by the idiots to join the hive mind thinking. After having been forced to suffer thusly with these players, after being antagonized and abused without having done anything of the sort to them to deserve it, the fact that I was reported by the whole team, and probably band wagon enemy team players means that this game will come up as a case for possible punishment. Just from this one game, due to the amount of reports recieved. Now when tribunal was around I wouldn't have been bothered much, I regularly judged cases and if this one came up for me to judge it'd be an easy pardon. Guy gets attacked by all 4 members of his team in a trolled game and remains a positive contributing member despite it until hitting a breaking point and defending himself? Easy pardon. I never subscribed to the policy that both parties in a fight are equally culpable. That's just ridiculous, the party picking the fight intentionally is to blame, the person defending himself has acted as any human naturally would in such a situation. But tribunal is gone, that system was broken any ways, abused by the very troll it was intended to punish and now we have something equally ineffective at handling these kinds of situations. Riot crew clearly does not concern themselves with context, despite the value of context in such a situation. Right and wrong in a moral society is determined solely by context, but this factor is ignored completely by riots punishment crew. All of which boils down to this: the fact that I'm aware that I'm going to receive a ban for that single game (a chat restriction at the very least, but likely a ban, because I went ham on those fools after I had had as much as I could take) in turn caused a series of events that negatively impacted dozens of other players as well. The simple knowledge that I knew I would receive an unfair and unjust punishment makes any subsequent games and my behavior in them inconsequential. It's only a matter of time until that game would be reviewed and the sentence handed down. Because of this, what reason could I possibly have to be incentivized to act decently toward any one in any game there after? Because those players likely ony received a report from me means their behavior will go unchecked, they will do this in game after game spreading the issue around further, and an innocent party in the end will be made to suffer further for their crimes. The system encourages this, promotes it, allows it because it's the way the system was designed, context has no bearing when it should be all important. Because of this, because the trolls had won as soon as the game ended and reports were filed, I was left to deal with the consequences of the actions of other players. I will be punished for their behavior, while they will get off Scott free. This doesn't sit right with me, and it shouldn't with any player. But the truth is I have no possibility of recourse, none. If the system is going to promote this, what point do I have now, in the limited time frame left, to continue to act in a decent and respectful fashion? There is none, and if they can act this way with impunity and get away with it, then I might as well act just like them. And so, I did. You made your own mess riot. Do you get it now? Can you see?
> If the system is going to promote this, what point do I have now, in the limited time frame left, to continue to act in a decent and respectful fashion? There is none, and if they can act this way with impunity and get away with it, then I might as well act just like them. And so, I did. You made your own mess riot. Do you get it now? Can you see? According to Rito central, (autolyte bot) unlike Tribunal the current report system only counts one report per reported match. And it simply values the most reputable reporter based on whatever crap metrics they use to measure that. But when you tilt on your main like a monkey instead of hamming on to an alt, you now generate VALID reports from players who are probably in better standing than the idiots you did that ONE match with. Getting reported by four jagoffs who are inches from their own bans does not get you banned. Going on tilt and schrekking all over people who are trying to actually play is what gets you banned. Or at least banned faster. You are getting no sympathy because your only responses are "THOSE TROLLS STARTED THIS BAN THEM", "Riot sucks and everything sucks trolls are gonna get me banned", and "Yeah I know I ruined a bunch of other matches but hey I was on tilt and that is NOT my fault." Trying to condescend on an alt and begging for a 1v1 to prove yourself is just gross. If this is your true personality then I do expect at least a two-week slot incoming for you in the near future. If at that time you demand an elevated review you will almost certain be perma banned. Don't blame Rito for your lack of a filter.
TDrex (NA)
: The real scare here is how bad this skin looks.. Why not something that makes a little more sense like putting a riot raka skin out where she looks like riot squads medic. Reaper raka.. like.. why?
Because they killed Mother and now a vampire wears her skin.
: > > TLDR: Trolls op as fuck. > > > > Edit: Forgot to mention, I got 4x reported by my team for this. Is that right? Is that fair? Is that just? The above account is 100% accurate in its details, including my own actions and mistakes. Is it right to be reported on for that game? Its obvious all four of them deserve reports and bans, but what about me? > > http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1618575092/50084578 > > I see a rolling clusterfuck here, sure. You were probably screwed from five minutes in. > > BUT. I also think that you deserved to be reported. > > http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1618685465/50084578 > > YOUR VERY NEXT MATCH. 0/7. You sold your kit for consumables. Troll train to Worlds OP jungle main. > > Overall your trending Ranked KDA and objective control per match show that you need more practice. > Right now you are often being carried if your team can even win at all. > > And by the gods if you want to duel in lane, BREAK a weakened 3 man group or dive a tower alone... > ....Evelynn is not the preferred jungle main for that much utility. She is awesome but you need placement. No one asked you for a critique of a game I straight stated I was trolling, after that first one all it took was one person to say something foolish and being on tilt was gonna make me troll. I certainly don't need any advice from you about my ability to play, I certainly don't require being carried, I do the carrying and you have no idea what your talking about if you think eve isn't a terrific tower diver with resets on her mobility and a build that's mostly tank after lizard. I sure deserve reports for the games after the first and I stated already I was searching for permaban levels of toxicity in those games given how pissed I was. That's tilt. Your condescending response is exactly what's wrong. Like you have all the answers to climbing, like you know something more than I do. No one asked for your advice, just opinions on what was wrong about that match. Edit: who would take any advice from an unranked level 17 who just showed he has very little idea of what he's talking about. Seriously, think before you post man. I mean you haven't even managed 80 cs in any of your history games. Granted most are hexakill, but a 37 minute match on summoner rift and you manage all of 64 cs? You are the epitome of what's wrong with this game. You have zero idea what you're talking about but you think you can offer advice anyways... You are what's toxic. You just trolled this post and everyone can see it... Think before you post. Second edit: add me in game, I'll so some 1v1 laning exercises with you. You think you can dish out the advice, let's see how you handle some coming from your betters. I won't be rude, I won't act like a jerk, I really will teach you since you clearly have a lot to learn. Be the bigger man, take me up on this, and let's let the community see it and react to it shall we? Balls in your court.
> > > TLDR: Trolls op as fuck. > > > > > > Edit: Forgot to mention, I got 4x reported by my team for this. Is that right? Is that fair? Is that just? The above account is 100% accurate in its details, including my own actions and mistakes. Is it right to be reported on for that game? Its obvious all four of them deserve reports and bans, but what about me? > > > > http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1618575092/50084578 > > > > I see a rolling clusterfuck here, sure. You were probably screwed from five minutes in. > > > > BUT. I also think that you deserved to be reported. > > > > http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1618685465/50084578 > > > > YOUR VERY NEXT MATCH. 0/7. You sold your kit for consumables. Troll train to Worlds OP jungle main. > > > > Overall your trending Ranked KDA and objective control per match show that you need more practice. > > Right now you are often being carried if your team can even win at all. > > > > And by the gods if you want to duel in lane, BREAK a weakened 3 man group or dive a tower alone... > > ....Evelynn is not the preferred jungle main for that much utility. She is awesome but you need placement. > > No one asked you for a critique of a game I straight stated I was trolling, after that first one all it took was one person to say something foolish and being on tilt was gonna make me troll. I certainly don't need any advice from you about my ability to play, I certainly don't require being carried, I do the carrying and you have no idea what your talking about if you think eve isn't a terrific tower diver with resets on her mobility and a build that's mostly tank after lizard. I sure deserve reports for the games after the first and I stated already I was searching for permaban levels of toxicity in those games given how pissed I was. That's tilt. Your condescending response is exactly what's wrong. Like you have all the answers to climbing, like you know something more than I do. No one asked for your advice, just opinions on what was wrong about that match. > > Edit: who would take any advice from an unranked level 17 who just showed he has very little idea of what he's talking about. Seriously, think before you post man. I mean you haven't even managed 80 cs in any of your history games. Granted most are hexakill, but a 37 minute match on summoner rift and you manage all of 64 cs? You are the epitome of what's wrong with this game. You have zero idea what you're talking about but you think you can offer advice anyways... You are what's toxic. You just trolled this post and everyone can see it... Think before you post. > > Second edit: add me in game, I'll so some 1v1 laning exercises with you. You think you can dish out the advice, let's see how you handle some coming from your betters. I won't be rude, I won't act like a jerk, I really will teach you since you clearly have a lot to learn. Be the bigger man, take me up on this, and let's let the community see it and react to it shall we? Balls in your court. Lord above, this is why I alt. Here's an example of a troll match for you. http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1584200749/220255416 The others insta locked after I already called role, so I took Annie and re called as ADC. They didn't dodge :3 And their Fiora was hyper carry after early fed. Excellent fun had by all, we never even had surrender vote <3 I will never 1v1 any player who cannot even escape Silver on their main. Not even with this unranked alt. Try joining some of the fun custom games like anything tagged Silver vs Platinum. And so long as you keep tilting on your main, I sincerely hope you slide all the way back to Bronze. For every match where you can validly whine about your team, how many other matches did you ruin on tilt?
: Champion Update: Singed
This is a teaser and NOT an encouraging one.
: Taric vs. Thresh (Mana costs)
> {{champion:44}} > Mana 255 (+56) > Mana regen. 4.1 (+0.4) > (**NOTE** the abysmal mana regen and mana regen per level) > > Imbue > RANGE: 750 > COST: **60 / 80 / 100 / 120 / *140* mana** > > > Shatter > COST: **50 mana** > COOLDOWN: 10 > > > Dazzle > RANGE: 625 > COST: **75 mana** > COOLDOWN: 18 / 17 / 16 / 15 / 14 > > > Radiance > RANGE: 200 > COST: **100 mana** > COOLDOWN: 75 > > > > {{champion:412}} > Mana 200 (+44) > Mana regen. 5 (+0.7) > (NOTE The middle of the road base mana regen and mana regen per level) > > Death Sentence > RANGE: 1100 > COST: **80 mana ** > COOLDOWN: 20 / 18 / 16 / 14 / 12 > > Dark Passage > RANGE: 950 > COST: **50 / 55 / 60 / 65 / 70 mana** > COOLDOWN: 22 / 20.5 / 19 / 17.5 / 16 > > Flay > RANGE: 400 (800 total) > COST: **60 / 65 / 70 / 75 / 80 mana** > > The Box > RANGE: 450 > COST: **100 mana** > COOLDOWN: 150 / 140 / 130 > > > > TLDR; > Taric's mana costs are enormous, especially for a melee champion. > Add to this, this, his base mana regen and mana regen per level are @#$*&ing abysmal, these are all mainstays from his old passive that used to give him free mana per hit... compare this to Thresh; one of the top 3 support champions in the game that has RANGED auto attack, much higher base damage (THRESH REGULAR AUTO ATTACK WITH HIS PASSIVE(Mana free to trigger)) IS HIGHER THAN TARIC'S PASSIVE MODIFIED BASE AUTO ATTACK DAMAGE(Not mana free to trigger), NICE BALANCE RIOT) and above all else Thresh's mana costs are actually reasonable. > > Put these together and Thresh has an enormous advantage over Taric. > > > > PROPOSED SOLUTION: > Combine his old passive with his current passive > {{champion:44}} 's old passive give him mana per hit... it sucked. Then they changed it to do damage based on his mana, which sucked... now they changed it to reduce his cooldowns and give him a **very** small amount of damage after using a skill (it gives 60 magic damage if you have 300 armor... if you all 4 skills, it does 240 pre-mitigated magic damage in FOUR AUTOATTACKS); > **Give these modified magic attacks the ability to restore his mana, which is doubled against champions** > > Example: > He uses dazzle on the opposing champion while having 70 armor at level 5, this means he has 14 bonus magic damage from his passive, let's say the average adc {{champion:222}} and the total magic damage is 10, which refunds 20 and makes his absurd costs a bit more manageable. > > This would balance his insanely high mana costs to a reasonable level. > The balance of his off to say the least. > Thoughts? Feels like Leona is very much overshadowing Taric lately, bringing Thresh into this is completely inappropriate. Taric and Thresh are miles apart in their laning AND in their team fight utilities. Just NO. Leona's favorite thing is this Amumu-style duct-tape toss that pulls her to victim from a safe hiding place. Then she bonks them too. Taric cannot port in like that, when his flash is down he telegraphs each dive. So comparing those two, I feel Taric has too high mana cost and has pretty weak CC for a 2014 support. His damage buff is a little crappy too. The armor buff is highly situational, but hey look at Galio being MR pref. Taric is a low DPS, semi tanky shrine-buff carrier with decent sustain and moderate shred but poor engage and CC. Rito patches and "evolving play" pretty much have taken him out of the picture outside ARAM and maybe Dominion.
Zmelvard (NA)
: How does someone on a mac get access to the beta?
> How does someone on a mac get access to the beta? Macs can run real OSes too. Not just OS 10.WeBrokeYourAppsTimeToBuyTheNewVersionsOfAllOfThem.dealwithit
: Is Kalista Senna?
Don't think too hard about it, next year her lore will say she's TARIC REAJU WAIFU from Planet Diamond.
iTams (NA)
: Let's play the "What Will Be Removed from CertainlyT's Champion's Kit Game"
Looks like another kit where they start big, then trim a little to try and make her fit a 'meta'. I am not a fan of the pruning phase but godforbid she launches like Azir or Cass HELL NO. Also someone going on about Yasuo OP as fuck. At this point you gotta WORK to use him.
: This is BS Riot.
> TLDR: Trolls op as fuck. > > Edit: Forgot to mention, I got 4x reported by my team for this. Is that right? Is that fair? Is that just? The above account is 100% accurate in its details, including my own actions and mistakes. Is it right to be reported on for that game? Its obvious all four of them deserve reports and bans, but what about me? http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1618575092/50084578 I see a rolling clusterfuck here, sure. You were probably screwed from five minutes in. BUT. I also think that you deserved to be reported. http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1618685465/50084578 YOUR VERY NEXT MATCH. 0/7. You sold your kit for consumables. Troll train to Worlds OP jungle main. Overall your trending Ranked KDA and objective control per match show that you need more practice. Right now you are often being carried if your team can even win at all. And by the gods if you want to duel in lane, BREAK a weakened 3 man group or dive a tower alone... ....Evelynn is not the preferred jungle main for that much utility. She is awesome but you need placement.
Unreport (NA)
: What Champion do you recommend?
> (((Sorry if I post it on a wrong Forum, I clearly don't use the Forum alot))) > > My friend is just starting out League of Legends, And I don't know what champion he should Try. There are some free to play Champs when your just starting out like {{champion:222}} {{champion:121}} Or even {{champion:127}} . What do you guys recommend what champions he should use since he's starting out? You should duo Q with your friend in some bot matches, get a feel for what types of champ they have the mindset for. If they want to try ADC, make sure they get one with good escape potential and make them practice escaping for a while. That way even if they cannot get kills easily, they won't throw bottom all the time. If they want support, I favor Sona and Lux right now as intro supports to learn. Your friend will RAPIDLY appreciate why AP champs buy a mana/5 item early in the game. Mid lane, Annie or Xerath or Vel Koz. Don't get them starting out mid Yaz or Fizz as a new player. Top lane, Garen became fun again. Very simple and no mana to keep track of. No health cost skills either. I don't have many good suggestions for top esp for a new player, when I do top it's usually Annie xp. Keep them out of the jungle role entirely for a while if possible. That above suggestion for Wukong Top would be pretty good. I am bleh on Shyv top for new players.
: @Riot: Before you rework Urgot, please look at Cassiopeia as an example.
Urgot should have a channel ulti that works with Zhonyas and takes him plus enemies in radius to a target location. Range should be short enough yet that diving him at inhib won't let him bring you to fountain. But he could teleport you away from wounded drag/Baron so his team can steal it. It also has Trundle/Anivia levels of troll potential which is also good, he could save the enemy team. Urgot is a rotten banana and his ulti should make him as annoying to everyone as a Teemo. It's his calling in life. Soraka can jump off a cliff after her crap rework.
ChrilleN (NA)
: The new dragon buffs
> The thing I get about these buffs is that by taking dragon your carries will be better which is better for the team but as a support main I don't see many beneficial aspects to the buff for supports {{summoner:3}} . The movement speed will be great but it just doesn't seem like there's a reason for supports to be like "Oh, I need drag so I can make this play" or "I need dragon to help peel/ heal" which kinda sucks. I think it'd be amazing if they could add something to a supports heals, it wouldn't help every support but it would be something. They might be able to add that by adding 5% to third party heals but idk exactly how they'd program it. So I was wondering what everyone else thought. Since right now it seems every role benefits greatly from it, and then supports can't do as much with it {{item:3070}} LOOKS FAKE. That said, if the new drag buff is stacking up to fifth drag kill then I also assume drag is harder to kill. First kill is regen buff for sustain, second is tank buff, third is roaming buff and kite/peel, fourth is shred...fifth is GG pretty much. And I really REALLY REALLY. doubt Rito would give such a GG buff for fifth drag unless they're trying to shorten matches with a siege breaker buff. +15 HP5 and MP5, +30% to TOTAL resists, +15% move, +30% shred???? You may as well be ahead by 3-4 levels and 8K gold. Let's break this down. +3 health and mana per second is substantial but still mild. +30 % resists, if you have like 86 resist base you'll go from 46.24% reduction to 52.896% which is more than 14.3% increase in damage reduction. +15 % move, this is stronger than the Furor passive for boots and is constant. Strongest single persistent move buff in the game? +30 % pen is harder to sort out, depending how it interacts with existing % effects like Last Whisper and Void Staff... ...assuming no adjustment to % items' effects, shredding base 223 resist then you get more than 14.5% reduction of effective health. (156.1 vs 123.6) So just that above, fifth drag would give an ADC as much as 40-50% higher chance of not just engaging, but KILLING the enemy tank without help. Inversely, a peel tank could pretty much 100% escape at any time without at least a 3v1 if not 4v1 situation. This makes the leak highly suspect. And then we get 250 True Damage as free DoT? Stack an Ignite, and you just guaranteed your last-hit even if they have say 750 health left. No joke, other things being equal ONE champ could go from 1v1 potential to 1v3 and another from 1v2 to 1v5 with high enough life steal. This seems MILES beyond what Baron can do for a team. If they buff Baron in similar fashion it would be INSANE instant-win territory.
: But Rito, You Promised!
OP raises valid concern but downvoting for not said "PWOMISED" in title.
Kaowru (NA)
: > OP called self handsome........ https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=288674544630676&set=a.101272536704212.3023.100004643972884&type=1&theater :I
> > OP called self handsome........ > > https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=288674544630676&set=a.101272536704212.3023.100004643972884&type=1&theater > > > :I http://imgur.com/HEKjgy3 Next time please go to Con as this guy, please. I know it will be hard but it would be funny as hell.
: Only able to get a bit more RP from Riot one time?
> I don't think I've asked for a bit more RP when I was only short like 10 or so more than once, but this is news to me. > > So I'm sitting at 478 RP after buying $10 worth to buy Championship Shyvana, which puts me down 12 RP from being able to purchase a Mystery Gift so I can exchange one with a friend (so we can both not only get the Harrowing icon but also possibly a Harrowing skin). Thats what I had intended to do, and when I sent in a support ticket to ask for an extra 12 RP (I even offered original fan art! {{champion:32}}), they told me I had already been given some extra RP in the past and that they couldn't do that more than once. Again, this is news to me. :( > > So am I really just stuck here just out of arms reach of being able to buy a mystery gift or a 975 skin on sale? Am I really going to have to buy $5 more in RP just to get an extra 12 RP? You know how batteries come in multiples of two and most devices use an odd number of them?
Marenjii (NA)
: Gnar is such cancer. Idk why he gets his ranged slow, and then they put another slow on his jump. Makes absolutely no sense. How are you supposed to escape him!?
> Gnar is such cancer. Idk why he gets his ranged slow, and then they put another slow on his jump. Makes absolutely no sense. How are you supposed to escape him!? {{champion:6}} You have questions about the slow and the teleporting....yeeeesssss......
Kaowru (NA)
: LYTE YOU**************
> That was to get your attention. > > NO WAIT DONT GO, THIS INVOLVES A 6"1 HANDSOME BLACK GUY APOLOGIZING FOR HIS ACTIONS > NO WIAT, IVE GOT PIZZA! > > Phew, okay now then. > > Now, I was suspended for 2 weeks for undisclosed "toxic behavior." In all honesty, I don't think I deserve it, but it's not up to me. So, I want to appeal to the better sides of the LoL community and Lyte. > > Please help me understand why I was suspended, please tell me what I cannot be saying to people. > I need help, I don't know what I said to earn the suspension or if it was the amount of reports, but I want to know what I said to people to net a 2-week ban. > > Id like to think I'm a fair minded individual who isn't perfect but I have seen toxic players. While I occasionally butt heads with them, I don't do it often enough to ruin 2 weeks worth of games. :( > > Regardless, Id like to apologize to the League of Legends community for my transgressions that resulted in my 2 week suspension > > And Lyte if you are reading this, I would like you to know that if you decide to lift my suspension, I will not let this community down again, I will just hit the mute button and report them for trash talking. > > And if I'm rEALLY frustrated, I'll just play something else. > > So, can you show me your compassion and lift my banishment and tell me what specific wordplay or actions I was suspended for? > > I credit Nerak23 for this post. OP called self handsome........
: @ RIOT: Moderating -(FALSE Warnings/Accused of Hack?)
Idunno, would the Autobots Assemble if I mentioned that Halloween is "Best celebrated by grabbing a grill's lollipop from her mouth and putting it between her lips instead"...? What about it I said that ZAnews is a bigger racist blow against its home country than the jokes that foreigners tell about them? Umm Umm what if I said that Tom Cruise is a ba- *THIS POST REDACTED BY REQUEST OF THE CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY*
: As a master league player i'm just going to say this
> Promos are a joke. > > Please bring back an elo system, or at least make it so that you don't require a 60% winrate against opponents 5 times better than you. > > I lost 200 points in masters over the course of a week literally because promos takes opponents from the highest spectrum of your mmr, and teammates from your lowest spectrum. > > Don't believe me? Get into promos, win 10 straight games, lose promos 0-3. > > Wanna know why? > > They. Are. Fucking. Rigged. > > Riot won't ever admit it, but they are. > > In season 5, please change this, I hate the way you guys turned ranked into this carry 4 other people masochism test just to raise yourself a division. It's a game of teamwork, not luggage simulator 2014. > > Oh wait, it is. > > Good job, Riot, keep doing what you're doing, it's not like you guys read what's written on your own boards anyway. More precisely, I think having a high winrate and heavy carry MMR is what holds you back as a smurf. In normal Ranked matches, your MMR has an effect but it is also clamped by your tier. In promos, taking the example of a Silver I it seems to me the upper clamping limit is based on Gold III or so. So imagine you get a Gold II who is actually a Diamond smurfing, that player then picks on your weakest lane. GG
: No champ takes actual skill to play. The whole design philosophy behind champion design in League Of Legends is "easy to pick up and play, hard to master". If champions actually required you to do something like "manage X secondary resource or you die instantly", then Riot would probably delete that mechanic as that champion wouldn't appeal to the majority of the community and it wouldn't make them money in this game. I will agree with the point that Anivia does have a high skill ceiling to master when it comes to mana management and proper zoning/skillshot usage.
> No champ takes actual skill to play. > > The whole design philosophy behind champion design in League Of Legends is "easy to pick up and play, hard to master". If champions actually required you to do something like "manage X secondary resource or you die instantly", then Riot would probably delete that mechanic as that champion wouldn't appeal to the majority of the community and it wouldn't make them money in this game. > > I will agree with the point that Anivia does have a high skill ceiling to master when it comes to mana management and proper zoning/skillshot usage. Idunno, a lot of completely new players were buying Jinx and a few other highlighted champs....feeding and being toxic.
: Champion's like Yi should be disabled until East coast gets acceptable ping.
: Preseason 2015: Increasing Strategic Diversity
Can Tibbers get some super secret scaling off bonus AD please? Double thank if not documented in the patch notes.
: > > > If fizz was OP, why is he never seen in the lcs? > > > > Because organized competitive play is different than what we play? > > DID YOU JUST TELL YOURSELF TO GET GOOD. I THINK YOU DID. > > In high ELO there are better counters against Fizz than Annie but he is still not OP. Organized competitive play =/= high elo. If your comparing solo queue to LCS you aren't very intelligent.
> > > > If fizz was OP, why is he never seen in the lcs? > > > > > > Because organized competitive play is different than what we play? > > > > DID YOU JUST TELL YOURSELF TO GET GOOD. I THINK YOU DID. > > > > In high ELO there are better counters against Fizz than Annie but he is still not OP. > > Organized competitive play =/= high elo. If your comparing solo queue to LCS you aren't very intelligent. So you are saying a bad team comp with bad communication is now FIZZ's fault?
: A She Hulk champ
> I think a muscular women could be nice you knock something like She Hulk I knock there {{champion:254}} ... But i would like a Amazon female a really tall one strong melee. > http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_medium/0/77/194106-25533-she-hulk.jpg > > Feel free to coment and rate. > Any way Hope someone agreed. > Shyvana size growth and muscle growth: > http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/story-art/O2vlyKhu-shyvana-in-game-art-size > also you should look that post (not my post but it about a strong women champ too rate it up if you like it) > http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/skin-champion-concepts/9x4qsuYP-strong-female-champion > Sorry for the bad english A new Amazonian power woman sure, but not a She Hulk clone. First of all, "Yay incest!!" is not a great place to start when writing in champion lore. Second, the fanart for Gnar is gross enough. Most important, James Tiberius Kirk would keep dragging her into the bushes and ulting.
: > If fizz was OP, why is he never seen in the lcs? Because organized competitive play is different than what we play?
> > If fizz was OP, why is he never seen in the lcs? > > Because organized competitive play is different than what we play? DID YOU JUST TELL YOURSELF TO GET GOOD. I THINK YOU DID. In high ELO there are better counters against Fizz than Annie but he is still not OP.
pleep (NA)
: Another issue that leads me to believe there is a problem with matchmaking is the sheer volume of people in silver and bronze. The graph should look like a bell curve with the majority of people being average (like in any other activity) but with league it looks like exponential decay. A fuqton of people in the bottom two sections with almost no-one in the top 3 sections. Gold should be the average, but it is actually the top 15% This leads me to believe a large portion of the players in silver are being kept there far longer than they should be because of variables outside their control.
> Another issue that leads me to believe there is a problem with matchmaking is the sheer volume of people in silver and bronze. The graph should look like a bell curve with the majority of people being average (like in any other activity) but with league it looks like exponential decay. A fuqton of people in the bottom two sections with almost no-one in the top 3 sections. Gold should be the average, but it is actually the top 15% > > This leads me to believe a large portion of the players in silver are being kept there far longer than they should be because of variables outside their control. Rito uses an inverse log. Lots of trash in the slums, some few middle class, then an Ivory Tower topped by a steeple.
pleep (NA)
: Am i the only Gold + player that will admit that elo hell is real?
To me the biggest component of ELO hell is the guy that literally says in chat "seems you're in promos. too bad for you :3". There's not a ton of them that come out and say it so directly. But it can be a part of the promo barrier or promo curse that some claim to see. And for example someone who is maybe Gold III skill will find it very difficult to escape Silver if the promos have team issues. Now if you are a Plat ranking an alt, you should be better able to carry yourself into Gold without a lot of fuss. Group smurfing in Normals is hella fun. When you're against a full team of 30s who are gold or higher and you all have no runes.
Agidyne (EUW)
: Accurate representation of what Vi does to your carry.
> http://imageshack.com/a/img911/4605/CocaGt.gif You failed to demonstrate how she outpenetrates. This drawing is more of a Blitz or Braum metaphor.
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MasticatingGrill

Level 24 (NA)
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