: > [{quoted}](name=only luciano,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wUYBgdPo,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2019-08-25T17:30:50.865+0000) > > Name them? Kennen, Neeko, Vayne, Renekton, any Riven that knows what they're doing, a decent Yorick
> [{quoted}](name=Salamencę,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wUYBgdPo,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-25T17:59:41.643+0000) > > Kennen, Neeko, Vayne, Renekton, any Riven that knows what they're doing, a decent Yorick Yes to all except maybe Renekton, which I think can swing in favor of Darius depending on how it goes. Yorick also indeed is one of the few melees who just outright beats his ass in a manfight early one.
: > [{quoted}](name=QueenAqua,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ihlw5y0g,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-08-12T19:32:45.114+0000) > > "She's spurned so many suitors. A wonder they did not see why." - Swain upon collecting a soul fragment from Fiora > > This line seems to heavily imply that fio is into women, and with the latest valentines skins between her and vi, it looks even more so. Idk where riot plans on going with this, just giving the exact quote that makes it seem that way. Idk how true it is, or even if it transcends into the project universe, it just seems to be the direction riot is heading. Personally, i wouldn't mind, fio doesn't have an established sexuality (like old varus did with a wife and i believe a child) and neither does vi. They kinda suit each other tbh, but maybe that's just me Im tired of people bringing up this line. It says nothing about her sexuality and if you read the lore you would know that fiora she spurred suitors because if she got married then she would lose control of her house to her husband. That's why she duels men for her hand in marriage, not one mention of women. Oh and nothing in the lore says vi is gay either, she calls caitlyn cupcake because of her traps, if anything vi would like jayce since she says his face is nice and cait tells the boys, not girls that she left her fuzzy cuffs( obvious sex joke). Shipping can be so annoying with you folks.
> [{quoted}](name=SoultakerKatana,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ihlw5y0g,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2019-08-15T04:26:16.657+0000) > > Im tired of people bringing up this line. It says nothing about her sexuality and if you read the lore you would know that fiora she spurred suitors because if she got married then she would lose control of her house to her husband. That's why she duels men for her hand in marriage, not one mention of women. Oh and nothing in the lore says vi is gay either, she calls caitlyn cupcake because of her traps, if anything vi would like jayce since she says his face is nice and cait tells the boys, not girls that she left her fuzzy cuffs( obvious sex joke). Shipping can be so annoying with you folks. You're really losing it here buddy, why does Fiora possibly being gay anger you so much? She only duels men for her hand in marriage because she lives in a patriarchal society where men are typically the heads of noble houses so noble men want to marry her and produce an heir (because, you know, it's something only a man and a woman can do) to gain control of the Laurent house. It has nothing to do with sexuality my son. You really need to calm down.
KOG IRL (NA)
: Which ADC is the best at fighting 1v1's?
> [{quoted}](name=KOG IRL,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3MH8W89L,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-21T15:59:01.784+0000) > > So I've been playing lots of Kog'Maw and I'm definitely enjoying his (her?) teamfighting capability. But his 1v1 dueling capability is kind of meh. > > So in some cases, the enemy team picks split pushers or perma-roamers or basically champs that get picks or champs that look for 1v1's, and in those cases they really don't want to group up as 5 because that's not where their strength is. So if I'm on Kog'Maw in that situation, i don't get to have my glorious 5v5 teamfight. I find myself in fights with fewer enemies, or duels basically, or just getting myself picked off, and Kog just doesn't shine in those fights like he would in a clean 5v5 engage. > > So that got me wondering... what ADC would you guys on this forum consider to be the absolute best at fighting 1v1's? Like an ADC that can duel champs that Kog'Maw would just get wrecked by. Champs like Riven, for example. Even if there's no ADC that is good at dueling a fighter, just tell me which one would be best at it, even if that means "not good, but less shitty than the others". > > Right now I'm thinking it might be one of these: Lucian, Vayne, Quinn, or Tristana. Or it could be another? I've played basically none of any of them. {{champion:67}} Since you're asking for the best, and not some of the best, this is the only correct answer. A Vayne that survived laning phase is the best ADC duelist in the game and among the best duelists in the game, able to beat most assassins and bruisers one on one late game.
cUEthel (EUW)
: ***
> [{quoted}](name=cUEthel,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=urVGvvkP,comment-id=00090000,timestamp=2019-08-12T04:00:40.336+0000) > > lol learn to analyse and you'll come back. Spoiler : it might be too difficult for you > > lol same thing... U can't analyse farm either > > that you're a noob {{sticker:sg-kiko}} pls dont come to my games, I have more than enough already > > lmaoooooooo to think you believe nunu was the problem in this game, and you actually think you'd have done better {{sticker:sg-miss-fortune}} hillarious delusion Nah you're just bad, enjoy falling down silver. =)
cUEthel (EUW)
: "your team isn't holding you back"
https://euw.op.gg/summoner/userName=cUEthel Mediocre to bad KDA on everyone you play regularly, including your two mains. Bad average farm on your most-played champion. So what do we take from this? That you linked a picture featuring five bad players, one of them you. https://matchhistory.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUW1/4147515403/2205772579334496?tab=overview Check out this Nunu game lmao. "Muh team DX"
: I played a lot of Poppy before the rework. The only unique and functional part of her kit, her E, they kept. So I was happy. Can't help you if you liked the budget Tryndamere version.
> [{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=gAsjAEEJ,comment-id=0008000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-11T03:26:39.943+0000) > > I played a lot of Poppy before the rework. The only unique and functional part of her kit, her E, they kept. So I was happy. > > Can't help you if you liked the budget Tryndamere version. Well first of all, a conditional wall slam CC is not an overly unique moba ability compared to Poppy's ultimate, but that doesn't matter because Poppy's ult was a mistake. You clearly can't read though. Nowhere did I say that old Poppy's abilities should have been preserved, and indeed I explicitly stated that wasn't the case. I can see why you get so frustrated that you made this topic. You don't seem to be able to glean the meaning behind people's posts.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=gAsjAEEJ,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2019-08-11T00:37:38.618+0000) > > Yes, some people are unreasonable and think that Poppy should have kept her old passive and ultimate, but some people just would have liked for Poppy to maintain her basic identity as a hard-scaling melee carry, as opposed to becoming a lane bully tank. Literally the ONLY reason Poppy could be a hard-scaling melee carry was because of her old ultimate. The old Poppy was a very old-school iteration of a tank, with her multiple instances of damage mitigation and her targeted peel. The intended use for her ultimate was to kill the person you ulted without interruption to knock out a key threat _(she did increased damage to the champion she ulted)_, but instead people used it as an opportunity to kill entire teams with impunity. Poppy being a peeling tank is realizing what she was actually intended to be doing from the start, rather than just being a more extreme version of Jax. Her new ultimate actually does what the old one was SUPPOSED to, removing threats from a fight.
> [{quoted}](name=Reaversal,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=gAsjAEEJ,comment-id=00080001,timestamp=2019-08-11T03:26:18.793+0000) > > Literally the ONLY reason Poppy could be a hard-scaling melee carry was because of her old ultimate. Then tool her new kit to give her other steroids that enabled her to hard scale into late game as a carry. This also honestly isn't true. Her passive also made her absurdly tanky with minimal tank stats built and her Q blew ADC health bars down to a quarter. > The old Poppy was a very old-school iteration of a tank, with her multiple instances of damage mitigation and her targeted peel. The intended use for her ultimate was to kill the person you ulted without interruption to knock out a key threat _(she did increased damage to the champion she ulted)_, but instead people used it as an opportunity to kill entire teams with impunity. She had one form of CC in her E. Being able to mitigate damage is not just a tank trait, all melee carries have mechanics like that. Tryndamere has the single best tank ability in the game, and even more modern skirmishers like Yasuo have multiple ways to mitigate damage while still building mostly damage. And yes, the "intended use of her ultimate" was to isolate one dude and kill them. Which is not a tank trait, but a quality found in divers and sometimes skirmishers. > Poppy being a peeling tank is realizing what she was actually intended to be doing from the start, rather than just being a more extreme version of Jax. Her new ultimate actually does what the old one was SUPPOSED to, removing threats from a fight. Her old ult only kept people from threatening her, not her team. It was always a selfish ability and Poppy was a relatively selfish champion. But who cares? What they intended and what they made are not synonymous, and the latter is far more important to the people who liked old Poppy at all.
: >(so Poppy shouldn't have been changed into a waifu-bait dumb blonde) Translation: You don't actually read any of the lore, didn't actually play the champions before their reworks, and are just complaining for the sake of complaining.
> [{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=gAsjAEEJ,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2019-08-11T03:03:24.695+0000) > > Translation: You don't actually read any of the lore, didn't actually play the champions before their reworks, and are just complaining for the sake of complaining. I accept your concession my man, because everything I said is true. Stay mad.
: It's not for you.
> [{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=gAsjAEEJ,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-08T04:59:04.022+0000) > > It gets tiring having to repeat this every single time there's a rework of any kind, but I will: > > The rework is not for you, if you like the version of the champion _that's in need of a rework_. It's for everyone else. > > If you _like_ something that's a problem for the game, or a problem for balance, or a problem for the company's profits, or simply outdated, then their decision to change it is clearly not _intended_ to be in line with your desires. > > Edit: For anyone who thinks I mean Pantheon, this was actually in reference to the hopefully upcoming Aurelion Sol changes. Changes which look like they're finally trying to salvage his gimmick into a working kit. I actually haven't seen any complaints about Pantheon. Probably because as far as what you _do_ with him goes, the only thing they're changing is how the Q works, and no one's complaining about that since the minion aggro changes a while back screwed it over anyway. None of the "everyone else" would give a shit if a reworked champion didn't align with their interests because they aren't losing a champion they liked. Yes, some people are unreasonable and think that Poppy should have kept her old passive and ultimate, but some people just would have liked for Poppy to maintain her basic identity as a hard-scaling melee carry, as opposed to becoming a lane bully tank. Riot shouldn't just drag their shit-covered underwear over pre-reworked champion's faces and tell them to go fuck themselves, they should try to at least maintain a champion's general role and demeanor (so Poppy shouldn't have been changed into a waifu-bait dumb blonde) while making their kits more functional and accessible to other players. But that's too hard, so half the reworks just become homogenized tanks and early game bullies. It's annoying how many reworked champions had their scaling gutted, like Poppy, Warwick, Xin Zhao, and Aatrox.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FEgV6I1c,comment-id=000100000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-02T01:09:10.752+0000) > > I am a subhuman, I shouldn't be given the same respect as dirt. Well that's, vaguely kinky, but whatever it's your life
> [{quoted}](name=zeskgames,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FEgV6I1c,comment-id=0001000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-02T03:46:45.137+0000) > > I am not only bad at this game, I am also mad. Obviously.
: ***
> [{quoted}](name=zeskgames,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FEgV6I1c,comment-id=00010000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-01T05:30:52.439+0000) > > Just wanted to let you know I'm still bad and always will be bad at the game. Keep on keeping on brother.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FEgV6I1c,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-07-31T20:24:59.373+0000) I am so salty that I had to edit a quoted post to attempt to prove a point. Which ironically proves the point of the original post I agree.
> [{quoted}](name=zeskgames,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FEgV6I1c,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-07-31T20:57:03.186+0000) > > I'm still bad at the game. No need to tell me twice buddy.
: Yasuo: A Hard to Swallow Pill
> [{quoted}](name=zeskgames,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FEgV6I1c,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-31T20:13:17.284+0000) > > I am bad at the game. I agree.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qAz9pEeU,comment-id=000a00010000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-31T09:26:03.271+0000) > > I see you're having some comprehension problems here, so let me make my point easier for you to understand: > > Functionally, on a gameplay level, new Poppy plays very differently from old Poppy and her role in-game has been essentially completely reversed, from hard-scaling melee carry to early game utility tank. > > Please, quote me saying she had "no tank attributes", plenty of melee carries have "tank attributes" to let them survive team fights, such as Master Yi's damage reduction on his W, Jax's resistance steroid on his R, and Tryndamere's death immunity through his R. > > Do these attributes make them tanks? > > Was old Poppy a tank? Yes or no question. > > You're so caught up on what numbers registered in her kit without looking at how she actually played or functioned in-game, which is what actually dictates champion role. > > It's okay friend, I accept your concession even if you were not brave enough to give it openly. https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/narcissistic-personality-disorder/symptoms-causes/syc-20366662 <3
> [{quoted}](name=NelsieLisnen,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qAz9pEeU,comment-id=000a000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-31T09:35:45.182+0000) > > https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/narcissistic-personality-disorder/symptoms-causes/syc-20366662 > > <3 https://www.goodtherapy.org/blog/psychpedia/projection =)
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qAz9pEeU,comment-id=000a000100000000,timestamp=2019-07-31T07:20:35.242+0000) > > Her E and her W giving movement are just about all that's left, though that shit isn't important. > > Tank and utility attributes lol? She was a hard-scaling carry who dove into teams and killed the carry, followed by everyone else. Now she's a fat tank whose damage falls off and excels largely in the early game. > > Her old lore was boring, but her new lore and demeanor are putrid garbage meant to titillate the lowest common denominator with another dumb bubbly cute waifu yordle character. She's literally mentally disabled, but she's cute so obviously you like her, right? > > Nah, new Poppy sucks ass. Yes thank you, her old W was also similar. Passive armor and active movespeed minus the mobility block she has now. In saying that her new kit is completely different I think you are ignoring a lot of obvious elements. So she had no tank attributes? That's insincere. She had mitigation on her passive, armor on her W, and damage block on her ultimate. But those existed so that she could essentially assassinate others. Now they are meant for her to tank and deal moderate damage late game. Her Q is also similar remember? A flat damage and % health burst on a low cooldown. "the lowest common denominator" "mentally disabled" Touching on mental health issues while also showing alarming signs of NPD is a tad too ironic. Also in modern societies, in case you missed the progress made in the last century, we strive to not discriminate or assign worth based on others' mental health. I won't be continuing this conversation, since I am the one conversing and you are here to, putting it mildly, relieve your internal deficiencies.
> [{quoted}](name=NelsieLisnen,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qAz9pEeU,comment-id=000a0001000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-31T09:01:52.409+0000) > > Yes thank you, her old W was also similar. Passive armor and active movespeed minus the mobility block she has now. In saying that her new kit is completely different I think you are ignoring a lot of obvious elements. So she had no tank attributes? That's insincere. She had mitigation on her passive, armor on her W, and damage block on her ultimate. But those existed so that she could essentially assassinate others. Now they are meant for her to tank and deal moderate damage late game. Her Q is also similar remember? A flat damage and % health burst on a low cooldown. I see you're having some comprehension problems here, so let me make my point easier for you to understand: Functionally, on a gameplay level, new Poppy plays very differently from old Poppy and her role in-game has been essentially completely reversed, from hard-scaling melee carry to early game utility tank. Please, quote me saying she had "no tank attributes", plenty of melee carries have "tank attributes" to let them survive team fights, such as Master Yi's damage reduction on his W, Jax's resistance steroid on his R, and Tryndamere's death immunity through his R. Do these attributes make them tanks? Was old Poppy a tank? Yes or no question. You're so caught up on what numbers registered in her kit without looking at how she actually played or functioned in-game, which is what actually dictates champion role. > "the lowest common denominator" "mentally disabled" Touching on mental health issues while also showing alarming signs of NPD is a tad too ironic. Also in modern societies, in case you missed the progress made in the last century, we strive to not discriminate or assign worth based on others' mental health. I won't be continuing this conversation, since I am the one conversing and you are here to, putting it mildly, relieve your internal deficiencies. It's okay friend, I accept your concession even if you were not brave enough to give it openly.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qAz9pEeU,comment-id=000a0001,timestamp=2019-07-31T01:26:36.356+0000) > > Poppy retained pretty much none of her old identity. You never played old Poppy. None? She retained her E and they primed her Tank and utility attributes over her diving-assassination although she can still dish out hefty damage as a tank. Her Q is still a flat and percent health burst although it became AOE and with less damage. She's still a yordle with a hammer and ponytails that works for Demacia, only now she has more interesting lore than just "I want revenge".
> [{quoted}](name=NelsieLisnen,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qAz9pEeU,comment-id=000a00010000,timestamp=2019-07-31T06:24:51.200+0000) > > None? She retained her E and they primed her Tank and utility attributes over her diving-assassination although she can still dish out hefty damage as a tank. Her Q is still a flat and percent health burst although it became AOE and with less damage. She's still a yordle with a hammer and ponytails that works for Demacia, only now she has more interesting lore than just "I want revenge". Her E and her W giving movement are just about all that's left, though that shit isn't important. Tank and utility attributes lol? She was a hard-scaling carry who dove into teams and killed the carry, followed by everyone else. Now she's a fat tank whose damage falls off and excels largely in the early game. Her old lore was boring, but her new lore and demeanor are putrid garbage meant to titillate the lowest common denominator with another dumb bubbly cute waifu yordle character. She's literally mentally disabled, but she's cute so obviously you like her, right? Nah, new Poppy sucks ass.
: Imo most of riots reworks have been succesful in one way or another. {{champion:84}} {{champion:266}} {{champion:3}} {{champion:6}} {{champion:83}} Lots of old mains didn't like their radically updated gameplay, but the champs are really strong, pro viable and got hella popular. {{champion:39}} {{champion:20}} {{champion:14}} {{champion:78}} {{champion:41}} {{champion:44}} The overall best. They retained a lot of their identity while bringing it up to date and becoming more relatable. All have above average viability. {{champion:28}} {{champion:82}} {{champion:19}} Even if they are still not pro viable, their new identities where as good as you can get. Each of these reworks captured the feel of what the champs were supposed to be in the first place. {{champion:50}} {{champion:10}} Those two are having it rough. Each of these strayed away from the original identity of the champ, distancing a lot of mains, even though their concepts are cool. On top of that, they are still struggling to find a good place in the meta, both in soloQ and pro play. {{champion:81}} {{champion:25}} An OTP's wet dream. Their identity and gameplay remained essentially unchanged, but their lores got enriched and their aesthetics updated. Both very solid.
> [{quoted}](name=NelsieLisnen,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qAz9pEeU,comment-id=000a,timestamp=2019-07-30T09:47:23.593+0000) > > Imo most of riots reworks have been succesful in one way or another. > > {{champion:84}} {{champion:266}} {{champion:3}} {{champion:6}} {{champion:83}} Lots of old mains didn't like their radically updated gameplay, but the champs are really strong, pro viable and got hella popular. > > {{champion:39}} {{champion:20}} {{champion:14}} {{champion:78}} {{champion:41}} {{champion:44}} The overall best. They retained a lot of their identity while bringing it up to date and becoming more relatable. All have above average viability. > > {{champion:28}} {{champion:82}} {{champion:19}} Even if they are still not pro viable, their new identities where as good as you can get. Each of these reworks captured the feel of what the champs were supposed to be in the first place. > > {{champion:50}} {{champion:10}} Those two are having it rough. Each of these strayed away from the original identity of the champ, distancing a lot of mains, even though their concepts are cool. On top of that, they are still struggling to find a good place in the meta, both in soloQ and pro play. > > {{champion:81}} {{champion:25}} An OTP's wet dream. Their identity and gameplay remained essentially unchanged, but their lores got enriched and their aesthetics updated. Both very solid. Poppy retained pretty much none of her old identity. You never played old Poppy.
: While not all reworks Riot have done are great, Pantheon is looking good and promising
> [{quoted}](name=Forhonor321,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qAz9pEeU,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-29T20:09:58.717+0000) > > I mean, they're still keeping his look very well intact to his old/original and his gameplay is also identical to what he has. He looks and feels a lot better now. > > Yes, there have been some reworks that have gotten a lot of negative criticism or just haven't worked like they're suppose to now, such as {{champion:84}} {{champion:3}} {{champion:10}} but at the same time we get reworks that for the most part a fairly well done at keeping/expanding themes and just refreshing champions, like{{champion:78}} {{champion:14}} {{champion:20}} > > And I'm going to be honest: I never really liked Pantheon as he still is right now. He just feels so monotone, one trick like and only does one good, annoying thing during the game until he just becomes way too outscaled. He chucks spears that you can't avoid in any way nonstop or until he's out of mana, his E just wasn't that interesting, and his ult I only felt was good as a free teleport than a damaging demigod from the heavens. Not to mention that his current look just is outdated and stereotyped as this cartoon spartan. > > BUT, as I said, he looks and feels a lot better now. He still has that feel of a spartan but has a unique feel to him with the designs of his weapons and scars he bears. His gameplay looks enhanced now with what I can presume to be more powerful spears but actually dodge-able now, near identical W but I think also gives some AS from what I could see, E now let's you move and presumably take less damage from the front and his Ult feels more impactful and interesting. > > I don't know if everyone else feels similar, I've actually seen some ridiculous comments on how his classic look is ruined and some are NOW quitting the game because of that, but I for one am looking forward to this rework and might still play League a bit longer because of it (or keep playing until Riot just completely screws it somehow). Poppy's rework objectively blows chunks though.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ngAbUY7N,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2015-12-06T21:35:36.267+0000) > > The better question is: how do you expect to rank up if your self-esteem is so low that you give up the moment you quickfind a game and see the enemy team's rank? I qualified at Bronze III after playing for a month. during the next month i dropped to iron III. Now i am climbing elo by playing high bronze and low silvers. The funny thing about it is, after eighty something days of this game, I understand that if I can not beat people in the elo above me, how can I say that I deserve to be in that elo? So to expound upon this answer... if it is that big a problem... you probably don't deserve what you think you deserve.
> [{quoted}](name=juscallmeYAYA,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ngAbUY7N,comment-id=000b0000,timestamp=2019-07-24T21:53:54.571+0000) > > I qualified at Bronze III after playing for a month. during the next month i dropped to iron III. Now i am climbing elo by playing high bronze and low silvers. The funny thing about it is, after eighty something days of this game, I understand that if I can not beat people in the elo above me, how can I say that I deserve to be in that elo? So to expound upon this answer... if it is that big a problem... you probably don't deserve what you think you deserve. My post is four years old.
: not that i disagree, but most carry items arent less passive either. the core items of all different types of carries {{item:3078}} {{item:3124}} {{item:3031}} {{item:3147}} {{item:3285}} {{item:3089}} {{item:3161}} are all very passive items. i think especially {{item:3068}} {{item:3001}} are fine the way their passives are.
> [{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=m8AkMcGJ,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2019-07-23T19:43:58.721+0000) > > not that i disagree, but most carry items arent less passive either. > > the core items of all different types of carries > > {{item:3078}} {{item:3124}} {{item:3031}} {{item:3147}} {{item:3285}} {{item:3089}} {{item:3161}} > > are all very passive items. > > i think especially {{item:3068}} {{item:3001}} are fine the way their passives are. Those items have passives. But they aren't "passive". Triforce requires you to weave autos between abilities to make good use of, guinsoo's stacks and then you attack super fast and are in your power hour, duskblade is a big chunk of damage on the first auto from reveal, luden's is a big splash of damage when your ability hits, and spear of shojin makes you attack fast and have low cooldowns for the duration. All have clearly tangible effects that are noticeable. Even Infinity Edge noticeably both gives you crit and makes your crits big boy huge. Those tank items just passively damage or debuff the enemy when you're in range/being attacked. They're barely noticeable, if at all.
Cloud273 (NA)
: Why don't Tryndamere's crits deal reduced damage?
Because Tryndamere only crits with autos, while Yasuo weaves his Q in to increase his DPS through AA resets and can AOE crit and crit from range, among a myriad other reasons. It's also there to force Yasuo to build more damage, because if he wasn't reliant on building lots of AD he could potentially build bruiser. People complain that Yasuo gets too tanky already.
: Illaoi is not balanced
> [{quoted}](name=07bbEQrFBn,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=a7htbAn4,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-21T02:45:33.335+0000) > > Had game with illaoi in team, she fed, she was 1/6, but still she was way stronger than enemy ryze that was ahead. Her one E made this ryze lose 70% of his hp. One E. 1/6 illaoi has to hit just one E to take 70% of hp from the enemy. How is this fair. You're probably right. Because she is usually bad.
: That's not a juggernaut move.
> [{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bAkRGoto,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-20T17:37:17.111+0000) > > So, what is a juggernaut? By Riot's explanation, it's a raid boss. A character intended to be able to 1v1 anyone and usually take 2 or 3 enemies to take down. A fed one can usually reliably 1v2. > > But... Mordekaiser's ultimate is completely counter to that. He makes it so you are not allowed to use the intended counter-- teamwork. > > That's all I've got to say about it. Just realized it was really odd to have a move that goes completely opposite the theme of the subclass. Dueling is not necessarily a big juggernaut strength. It's often commonly part of their kit, but being slow fatasses means that certain ranged duelists can kite them out and DPS them down, and the class that is tooled to be the best at dueling generally speaking are skirmishers, of whom almost any can beat almost any juggernaut in a 1v1 as the game goes on. {{champion:11}} will beat literally any juggernaut in the game in a duel, even {{champion:75}} who is otherwise the best juggernaut duelist and even tends to beat most skirmishers in a 1v1. {{champion:75}} {{champion:48}} {{champion:83}} are IMO the best duelists among juggernauts (some more recent ones like Aatrox or Morde might deserve a spot but not enough experience for me to say), and of those only Nasus can beat most skirmishers in a one on one I think, and like I said even Nasus loses to Yi unless he can literally one-shot him with his Q. Even some divers might be able to manage it. So basically, dueling isn't necessarily a juggernaut's primary strength.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nPKsXcyR,comment-id=0013000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-19T04:27:06.987+0000) > > You did. I did not, I even spelled it out to you when you didn't take the hint.
> [{quoted}](name=AlphaM Gaymer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nPKsXcyR,comment-id=00130000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-19T13:39:19.167+0000) > > I did not, I even spelled it out to you when you didn't take the hint. You did.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nPKsXcyR,comment-id=00130000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-19T02:57:21.768+0000) > > I can't help but notice you avoided the question. Why is that? > > He's not. I didn't avoid any questions, I implied you are wrong and gave you the opportunity to do proper research before trying to discuss such things here. You're cornering yourself in a really compromising position.
> [{quoted}](name=AlphaM Gaymer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nPKsXcyR,comment-id=001300000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-19T03:10:33.194+0000) > > I didn't avoid any questions You did.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nPKsXcyR,comment-id=001300000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-19T02:04:49.690+0000) > > Yet he's performing like total dogshit in even high elo solo queue despite also being an easy champion to pick up and play. Why is that? > > He's not, as I've already explained. You play Mundo to kill carries, not to CC teams or protect allies. You don't seem to know what a tank is. It isn't just about being able to weather damage. > > In the thread I linked they refer to the former as a burst mage and the latter as a skirmisher/melee carry, which is correct. > > Even before the subroles became a thing Yasuo was listed as a fighter, not an assassin. Winrates =/= power. Even LS could tell you that. What do you even think "High elo solo queue" is? lmao. Mundo is a tank, mundo is not played to kill carries. totally different beasts. What you explained was misguided, I understood your narrative the first time but it's far from correct.
> [{quoted}](name=AlphaM Gaymer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nPKsXcyR,comment-id=0013000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-19T02:27:43.801+0000) > > Winrates =/= power. Even LS could tell you that. > > What do you even think "High elo solo queue" is? lmao. I can't help but notice you avoided the question. Why is that? > Mundo is a tank He's not.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nPKsXcyR,comment-id=0013000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-19T01:33:46.228+0000) > > Guardian is a subclass of tanks, of which vanguard is the other. Dr. Mundo is a juggernaut. Let's see what Riot has to say on the subject: > > https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/3A5uuBw7-champion-subclass-list > > Juggernauts > > Nasus > Darius > Mordekaiser > Illaoi > Trundle > Olaf > Garen > Shyvana > Udyr > **Dr. Mundo** > Volibear > Yorick > > Wow would you look at that. > > He's a juggernaut. He has high durability and is meant to run down squishies and beat them to death. He doesn't engage for his team, disrupt with CC, or peel for his carry, he's there to cause havoc with his kill potential. > > Also where is this "Mundo is meta" shit coming from? Is he being played in pro or something? He is being played in lck and lpl scrim a LOT and he's a hot topic among certain coaches and casters. And Mundo is functionally a tank irregardless of classification. Riot also tried to call tf and yasuo assassins, no thnks
> [{quoted}](name=AlphaM Gaymer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nPKsXcyR,comment-id=00130000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-19T01:45:30.835+0000) > > He is being played in lck and lpl scrim a LOT and he's a hot topic among certain coaches and casters. Yet he's performing like total dogshit in even high elo solo queue despite also being an easy champion to pick up and play. Why is that? > And Mundo is functionally a tank irregardless of classification. He's not, as I've already explained. You play Mundo to kill carries, not to CC teams or protect allies. You don't seem to know what a tank is. It isn't just about being able to weather damage. > Riot also tried to call tf and yasuo assassins, no thnks In the thread I linked they refer to the former as a burst mage and the latter as a skirmisher/melee carry, which is correct. Even before the subroles became a thing Yasuo was listed as a fighter, not an assassin.
Bultz (NA)
: When do early game champions actually fall off?
> [{quoted}](name=Bultz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sqoXp0gj,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-19T01:11:48.853+0000) > > All I see is them beign strong start to finish, only beaten by being outscaled if someone survives early game? wtf Stop being ambiguous. Which champions are you complaining about? Use an example.
: > [{quoted}](name=Chembaron Yamada,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nPKsXcyR,comment-id=00130000,timestamp=2019-07-18T23:33:08.837+0000) > > Mundo is one of the bruisers, tho. He is a Juggernaut, like Garen or Yorick. Not a tank. No, Dr. Mundo is a tank and he serves the function of a tank not a juggernaut. You are confusing tanks with guardians
> [{quoted}](name=AlphaM Gaymer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nPKsXcyR,comment-id=001300000000,timestamp=2019-07-19T01:21:22.669+0000) > > No, Dr. Mundo is a tank and he serves the function of a tank not a juggernaut. > > You are confusing tanks with guardians Guardian is a subclass of tanks, of which vanguard is the other. Dr. Mundo is a juggernaut. Let's see what Riot has to say on the subject: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/3A5uuBw7-champion-subclass-list Juggernauts Nasus Darius Mordekaiser Illaoi Trundle Olaf Garen Shyvana Udyr **Dr. Mundo** Volibear Yorick Wow would you look at that. He's a juggernaut. He has high durability and is meant to run down squishies and beat them to death. He doesn't engage for his team, disrupt with CC, or peel for his carry, he's there to cause havoc with his kill potential. Also where is this "Mundo is meta" shit coming from? Is he being played in pro or something?
Asnen (EUW)
: You definitely don't know how voting works, same with champion balance. You see.. if the vote is getting upvotes AND downvotes the total upvote count looks like it isn't moving. Thank you for your attention, fellow gamer. :) {{sticker:sg-lux}} {{sticker:slayer-jinx-wink}}
> [{quoted}](name=Asnen,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VsV12H7a,comment-id=000500000000000100000000,timestamp=2019-07-17T02:51:20.149+0000) > > You definitely don't know how voting works, same with champion balance. You see.. if the vote is getting upvotes AND downvotes the total upvote count looks like it isn't moving. > > Thank you for your attention, fellow gamer. :) {{sticker:sg-lux}} {{sticker:slayer-jinx-wink}} Ouch, when you don't know what your talking about and the people who do can easily see that you don't, sorry man.
: > [{quoted}](name=Eedat,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VsV12H7a,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-07-16T23:45:14.247+0000) > > Hi, I was wondering what metrics you use to determine that Shaco is in need of a buff. According to Lolayltics, he's sitting at 52% winrate with 4% pickrate in Plat+ and 55% winrate with only 2% playrate in Masters+. While I agree these numbers wouldn't put him in top tier by any means, its also a pretty far cry from needing straight buffs. He has pretty good numbers in Plat+ and the high ELO mains seem to be making him work in high ELO as well > > Are you proposing straight buff(s) or a trade off for more damage to make him feel better to play? the metrics i use is the general consensus of all high elo shaco mains, statistics are a very bad approach when it comes to a champ that is exclusively played by one tricks
> [{quoted}](name=Desperate Shaco,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VsV12H7a,comment-id=00020003,timestamp=2019-07-16T23:59:59.874+0000) > > the metrics i use is the general consensus of all high elo shaco mains No way there could be any bias there. =^)
: I'm a bit surprised you can't see how. It's common sense that you're abusing one person enough that they can't even play in their own lane, and make them rage quit, therefore hurting that person's teammates and making them lose unfairly. Of course it's their fault if they can't adapt to them being camped but they can't help if they are being dived constantly. If they somehow manage to survive until mid game, then they don't have any gold for any items, therefore can't help the team in teamfights, etc etc.
> [{quoted}](name=MiracleMorg94,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6KgEfiwy,comment-id=0004000700000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-12T20:24:37.806+0000) > > I'm a bit surprised you can't see how. It's common sense that you're abusing one person enough that they can't even play in their own lane, and make them rage quit, therefore hurting that person's teammates and making them lose unfairly. > > Of course it's their fault if they can't adapt to them being camped but they can't help if they are being dived constantly. If they somehow manage to survive until mid game, then they don't have any gold for any items, therefore can't help the team in teamfights, etc etc. It's not unfair if one person was a combination of being so terrible at the game to be constantly mulched by the jungler as well as too emotionally fragile to handle feeding, it's just unlucky, and the fault lies solely on the shoulders of the little guy who ragequit with tears in his eyes and snot dribbling down his chin.
: how to counter heavy tanks as jhin
> [{quoted}](name=xXxShellShocKxXx,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=50jmtRZj,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-09T19:16:21.801+0000) > > just like in the title, i am struggling to counter in any way a said tahm kench / trundle / any other tank that is played by not mentally disabled person . Tank meta is such a pain in t ass. It would be very good if riot focused more on team play rather than having in team two bulldozer tanks that scale 300 armour 200 mr and 4k health + does damage like decent full build udyr...... Lord Dominik's Regards. Alternatively, play an ADC that is better at killing tanks, since Jhin by design sucks balls at it relative to others in his role.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UPRjZ6ty,comment-id=000a000100000000,timestamp=2019-07-06T07:37:03.825+0000) > > Why are you giving Darius three items when the problem is that laning against Jayce he never gets those three items by the time Jayce gets his? Because nothing Jayce builds will stop this? Let’s look at jayce’s core items. Youmuu, he’s in combat and active will not be enough to out run you. Duskblade. Does nothing. Black cleaver. 1/3rd the bonus ms you will get from the same passive on triforce.
> [{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UPRjZ6ty,comment-id=000a0001000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-06T08:02:47.359+0000) > > Because nothing Jayce builds will stop this? > > Let’s look at jayce’s core items. > > > Youmuu, he’s in combat and active will not be enough to out run you. > Duskblade. Does nothing. > Black cleaver. 1/3rd the bonus ms you will get from the same passive on triforce. You seem to have some trouble with reading comprehension, so let me spell it out for you: By the time Darius has three items, Jayce has like four and a half or more if Jayce is not currently nerfed into the shithouse and if both sides played optimally in isolation. To put it another way, due to Jayce being able to easily bully Darius from afar while being able to disengage if Darius does close the distance (or just all-in the less than healthy Darius in hammer form), Jayce gets his items faster than Darius and as such can snowball.
: > [{quoted}](name=guygoestothestor,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UPRjZ6ty,comment-id=000a0001,timestamp=2019-07-06T06:04:26.747+0000) > > because if you don't play something with disengage as a ranged top laner your high you can let them get in melee range so they waste their gap closer so you can use your disengage and then just kite them There is no excuse anymore to being kited unless it’s by an Ashe or something. Stop taking ignite and start taking ghost. I’ll use Darius as an example here because he is extremely immobile. So. You decide it’s time to go for a kill on. Eh. Jayce. Jayce knocks you away in an attempt to engage. You know this. Your main build consists of triforce, steraks and deadman’s. So. You get one auto and he knocks you back. Rage passive triggers, deadman’s slows him, pop ghost. He will not, cannot and never will get away from you. Long story short. Stop fucking taking ignite.
> [{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UPRjZ6ty,comment-id=000a00010000,timestamp=2019-07-06T06:16:14.707+0000) > > There is no excuse anymore to being kited unless it’s by an Ashe or something. > > Stop taking ignite and start taking ghost. > > I’ll use Darius as an example here because he is extremely immobile. > > So. You decide it’s time to go for a kill on. Eh. Jayce. > > Jayce knocks you away in an attempt to engage. You know this. > > Your main build consists of triforce, steraks and deadman’s. > > So. You get one auto and he knocks you back. Rage passive triggers, deadman’s slows him, pop ghost. He will not, cannot and never will get away from you. > > > Long story short. Stop fucking taking ignite. Why are you giving Darius three items when the problem is that laning against Jayce he never gets those three items by the time Jayce gets his?
: I like how TFT gets their roles right
> [{quoted}](name=Amenaphus,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=YEGnZlEa,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-06-30T01:20:57.636+0000) > > Tanks can tank up to 4 people at once no problem, while also dealing damage or cc with their ability. > > ADCs can carry if the tanks properly peel them. > > Assassins can assassinate a few people before dying to the tanks. > > Mages can burst down once they get items and mana up. > > So why cant normal league be like this? Notice how in this guy's description of the game he unknowingly told us that tanks are the class who decide the course of the game with two of the other classes being defined as being killed by or enabled to do anything by the tanks. No thanks bud.
: > [{quoted}](name=Kelg,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=TlEfcUsm,comment-id=0000000000020000,timestamp=2019-06-28T18:06:37.786+0000) > > Didn't know we were all playing in the LCS. I actually don't give a crap about pro play. In soloqueue picking a tank is asking your team to carry you. LCS is this game played at the highest level. Played optimally. The game has to obviously be balanced for that. Tanks not being strong isn't because they're obsolete. It's because most players like you are idiots compared to the people who are actually good. If tanks are already strong, how are they supposed to buff them? Games are always balanced towards the highest level for reasons that should be obvious. (Although it seems you aren't catching on). If you picking a tank means you are asking to be carried. Maybe it's not the class and you. Hmm. People who are actually good have no problems with it. Cmon. You're better than me. You shouldn't have a problem.
> [{quoted}](name=goodiesohhi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=TlEfcUsm,comment-id=00000000000200000000,timestamp=2019-06-28T18:29:04.080+0000) > > LCS is this game played at the highest level. LCS is the game played at the highest level with voice chat among the entire team and with everyone being familiar with the playstyles of their teammates. In other words, it is a type of play that fundamentally _does not exist_ at any level of solo queue. Unless you are dumb and want to go pro, it is an environment a player will never play in no matter how much they improve, so why balance around it? Balancing around very high elo solo queue sure, but LCS? No.
: The people asking for “ugly” female characters are getting old
> [{quoted}](name=youngdrago,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=mNORGcTw,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-06-07T13:56:34.605+0000) > > Ever since Kai’sa released there’s been a rise in people asking riot to make female characters that are somewhat no appealing to the eye. The whole idea is that league need more diverse character instead of another good looking guy or girl. But I fail to see how they expect riot to go through with the request given how we treat characters like Illaio. She has a play rate or around 1.85% while Lux has a play rate of 4.44%. Why would riot even bother making a somewhat “ugly” Champ if you guys don’t even plan on playing her. Remember riot is a company and makes money off of skins. Why make a champ that no one will play of but skins for? If you’re gonna ask for a champion to add diversity at least play and buy the skins. This is the exact same problem with people complaining about unnecessary petitions for characters who have different sexual orientations cause we need “diversity” that majority of the boards also agree is stupid. If you want more ugly character than buy the skins of characters like illaio of Grages. There is no problem, you're just whining because you don't personally want it and you'd prefer them continue making waifu designs and I guess because you're uncomfortable with gay people. There is no problem with players wanting Riot to diversify their designs. Homogenization in designs is inherently boring and bad, even if normies brainlessly eat them up. Look at other games instead of just League. Ana from Overwatch is an old woman who most would not find attractive these days, but is the highest pick rate hero in the game. You bring up Illaoi and Taliyah's apparently bad play rates. There's no reason this couldn't be the case with an old lady character in League.
: no i thnik darius can win. damage wise yes yas outscales but in a fight darius can win if played well. edit: how many stacks nasus we talking aboout here?
> [{quoted}](name=strikingXV,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dJwGNpuA,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2019-06-09T17:11:37.893+0000) > > no i thnik darius can win. damage wise yes yas outscales but in a fight darius can win if played well. > > edit: how many stacks nasus we talking aboout here? Nah, Yasuo can fairly easily avoid the outer rim of Darius' Q which cripples Darius' sustain in the fight, and Yasuo himself will have no problem sustaining through Darius' damage. I haven't fought him later on since thornmail became common but I doubt it changed things too much.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UVdvGyjl,comment-id=0002000000010000,timestamp=2019-06-02T07:13:19.621+0000) > > Her old passive worked better if she built mostly damage, her current one scales with the health she builds, meaning to get real usage out of it she has to build tank. > > Q doesn't feel the same because the old one scaled incredibly and could take off over half of an ADC's health in a single cast. Was it healthy? Not really, but you're just lying here friendo. Why lie? > > W gave attack damage as well as armour. Current one feels better, but who gives a shit? That isn't what I'm saying, work on your reading comprehension. > > E: Sure > > If you think that Poppy changing from arguably the hardest-scaling melee carry in the game who dealt absurd damage and could destroy teams into a CC tank doesn't constitute as a role change then you're just wrong. Like, there can be no argument here. Did you ever actually play old Poppy? She rushed Triforce and then built nearly full damage, ulted the most worthless piece of shit on the enemy team, and then killed the enemy team, assuming she was six-slotted. New Poppy bullies lane and tries to snowball but her damage falls off and she focuses on CCing the enemy in team fights for her team to kill them. If she tries to roll up on any decent duelist late game she will be unceremoniously killed. > > Sorry buddy, but you just don't know what you're talking about. So nothing was to be missed on her Q, as it was just a auto. The passive which is an enchanced auto. IF we bring back the scaling from her old kit. But We Delete Old move all the time, like Ezreal W. This was Changed a few times, I'm taking it as it is now. and his Kit was minorly adjusted for it. Is there anything that you missed we shouldn't have deleted. Like The heal on his W? Or things like Alistar. Would you want a duplicated Alistar because his E and passive were swapped. P,Q,W,E imo theyre exactly like Old poppy. Maybe shifted around a bit here and there. The only thing that is missing IS her R, and the rest got a shift in power, adjustments. The shift in power was from Single target damage, to Multi target damage, to help her in lane, to help her in team fights. The old poppy was just a enhance minion. Poppy Wasnt deleted, There isnt anything to be missed aside from the Ult and maybe Scalings. However. I cannot say the same for other certain champions. Like Aatrox. Old Aatrox is deleted and replaced with a different champion. I'll agree with you there. But. {{champion:78}} {{champion:19}} {{champion:20}} {{champion:41}} {{champion:84}} {{champion:3}} {{champion:83}} They were very great reworks, and I felt like they didn't leave anything during the rework. They were just given new stuff and nerfed the old. I cant say the same for {{champion:266}} {{champion:39}} {{champion:114}} {{champion:6}} is the special case. a lot was removed, however it feels like a better version of the old kit. . and changed in some regards.
> [{quoted}](name=Neekophile,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UVdvGyjl,comment-id=00020000000100000000,timestamp=2019-06-03T04:20:05.967+0000) > > But We Delete Old move all the time, like Ezreal W. This was Changed a few times, I'm taking it as it is now. and his Kit was minorly adjusted for it. Is there anything that you missed we shouldn't have deleted. Like The heal on his W? > > Or things like Alistar. Would you want a duplicated Alistar because his E and passive were swapped. What are you even talking about here? Ezreal is still a mobile skillshot ADC who pokes down enemies and Alistar is still a supportive CC tank. Their roles and identities are intact, unlike Poppy's, so what is even the comparison? Learn how to think. > P,Q,W,E imo theyre exactly like Old poppy. This isn't an opinion, you're just wrong, and if you think her roles being completely reversed from high damage melee carry to CC tank you're wrong, period, not up for discussion. What about this are you not getting? > Maybe shifted around a bit here and there. The only thing that is missing IS her R, and the rest got a shift in power, adjustments. The shift in power was from Single target damage, to Multi target damage, to help her in lane, to help her in team fights. The old poppy was just a enhance minion. Poppy Wasnt deleted, There isnt anything to be missed aside from the Ult and maybe Scalings. The shift was from damage and scaling to durability, AOE, and utility. The old Poppy was actually considerably stronger than current Poppy in team fights, but only late game where she could quickly kill enemy champions after ulting the most useless person on the enemy team. Why are you even talking about old Poppy if you don't know anything about her?
: Back at you. If they're so popular already, that puts a hole in your claim that all the votes come from people who already like them. And severely hurts your point that reworks screw people who like the champions. If it were true, people would know not to vote for champs they like for reworks. No, she wasn't. Not sure what game you were playing, but she was none of those things. And you just completely ignored where I pointed out everything that made the old Poppy generic as well as everything that makes the new Poppy unique. You're just ignoring the facts. Plus, to claim people weren't using it as intended when, if that was their intention, they could have made it so she can only damage that enemy, is stretching way too far. They allowed it because that was one of the intended purposes. Mordekaiser's ultimate lacks _that_ purpose. I get that you don't like reworks. That you like outdated, more generic kits. But to claim that that's not what they are is to ignore reality.
> [{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UVdvGyjl,comment-id=00010000000000000000,timestamp=2019-06-02T10:09:27.055+0000) > > Back at you. If they're so popular already, that puts a hole in your claim that all the votes come from people who already like them. How does me pointing out that the champions picked got the most votes due to being more popular take away from the claim that the votes came from people who like them? Are you serious? Do you have any idea what you're talking about? They are relatively popular, hence why they got picked, since those people playing them obviously tend to like the champions. >And severely hurts your point that reworks screw people who like the champions. If it were true, people would know not to vote for champs they like for reworks. No it doesn't, not when: A. Those people could simply be stupid and not know what they're doing by voting. B. Not every rework is bad in the way I've said, pay attention to this point that you clumsily missed because it will be coming back later and make a real big fool of you. > No, she wasn't. Not sure what game you were playing, but she was none of those things. And you just completely ignored where I pointed out everything that made the old Poppy generic as well as everything that makes the new Poppy unique. You're just ignoring the facts. Nope, you're just ignorant if you believe old Poppy was not a hard-scaling carry. Let's go with one example of something I said that is laughably and blatantly true: That Poppy is tankier than Tryndamere without ults. Tryndamere has how many tank steroids without his ultimate? Poppy had how many now? Oh that's right, two. > Plus, to claim people weren't using it as intended when, if that was their intention, they could have made it so she can only damage that enemy, is stretching way too far. They allowed it because that was one of the intended purposes. Mordekaiser's ultimate lacks _that_ purpose. "ACTIVE: Poppy focuses the target enemy champion for the next few seconds, dealing them increased damage and becoming immune to all effects not originating from her target for the duration." Nah, it was intended as a dueling tool. You're wrong bud. > I get that you don't like reworks. Cite where I stated I dislike all reworks. =) > That you like outdated, more generic kits. Cite where I stated this as well. > But to claim that that's not what they are is to ignore reality. Cite where I claimed that as well. =) That's what I mean when I say you can't think with any nuance. I play the Irelia rework. I play the Fiora rework. I play the Yorick rework. I play the Warwick rework. What do all of these reworks have in common? They didn't change the champion's role completely. Weird, right?
: In a 1v1 deadmatch {{champion:122}} wins for sure
> [{quoted}](name=YamiBakura322,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dJwGNpuA,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-06-01T16:50:43.862+0000) > > In a 1v1 deadmatch {{champion:122}} wins for sure Nope, Yasuo outscales Darius' damage in general and doesn't need to ramp up with five separate attacks either. {{champion:23}} {{champion:75}} {{champion:11}} {{champion:24}} {{champion:114}} These five can for sure, with the only one I'm not 100% positive about being Fiora. The other four do so easily.
: They're for people who like the general theme of the champion but not their outdated/bug-riddled/unbalanceable kit. And every other player who doesn't look at the champion because every part of the champion in its current state is unappealing to them. You may not care about Voli and Fiddle getting reworked, but it's silly to say only current players care... especially this time, when there was a vote to prove other people do, too. If they think like me, they wanna see the reworks because they will make the characters more appealing to current non-players. Old Poppy was an auto-attacking champion who didn't actually have the scaling or mobility to be a hypercarry. She was essentially a worse Tryndamere. The only thing different about her ult is that if the enemies had a mage support, you could die to them, unlike Tryndamere. She was as generic as generic gets, and wasn't even good at it. The one thing that was unique to Poppy, Heroic Charge, they kept. And the new kit they gave her is fantastic. You wanna rag on her for being generic despite the facts that she has the _only_ dash interrupt in the game, one of only _two_ ranged attacks that act entirely like a melee attack, and the _COOLEST_ ultimate in the game? Nice try. I played old Poppy too, but the new one is so much better I can't even begin to miss her old, ugly version. **** I can level with you on them adding in mechanics that are similar to existing ones, but better, though. But Mord's ult is definitely not akin to Poppy's old one. Hers was most often used on a person she _didn't_ plan on going after, and killing their ally while invincible. Plus, at the time of Poppy's rework they didn't have the means to make an ult like Mord's. If you watched the Sylas video, they actually learned quite a lot about interactions while coding him that they never knew before. And I'm sure that helped with programming Mord's ultimate. Rather than old Poppy, though, it's more like his new ult is the apex of Camille's and Xin's. But it wouldn't very well fit thematically for either of them. For actually taking another player to another plain of existence, it'd have to be a ghost, demon, or cosmic character.
> [{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UVdvGyjl,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2019-06-02T06:13:31.295+0000) > > They're for people who like the general theme of the champion but not their outdated/bug-riddled/unbalanceable kit. And every other player who doesn't look at the champion because every part of the champion in its current state is unappealing to them. > > You may not care about Voli and Fiddle getting reworked, but it's silly to say only current players care... especially this time, when there was a vote to prove other people do, too. If they think like me, they wanna see the reworks because they will make the characters more appealing to current non-players. Do you think it's a coincidence that the two champions that won, Fiddle and Voli, are the ones with the highest play rates? Do you have anything backing your assertion that a substantial amount of the votes come from people who don't play them? > Old Poppy was an auto-attacking champion who didn't actually have the scaling or mobility to be a hypercarry. She was essentially a worse Tryndamere. The only thing different about her ult is that if the enemies had a mage support, you could die to them, unlike Tryndamere. She was as generic as generic gets, and wasn't even good at it. She was the hardest-scaling melee carry with the game with better sticking power than Tryndamere who was much harder to peel and, frankly, was much tankier even without her ult due to her passive, which was actually the most broken part of her kit. But who cares? What did you say that disproves anything I said? > The one thing that was unique to Poppy, Heroic Charge, they kept. And the new kit they gave her is fantastic. You wanna rag on her for being generic despite the facts that she has the _only_ dash interrupt in the game, one of only _two_ ranged attacks that act entirely like a melee attack, and the _COOLEST_ ultimate in the game? Nice try. I played old Poppy too, but the new one is so much better I can't even begin to miss her old, ugly version. > **** No, I rag on her because she is just another in a long line of CC tanks when she used to be a carry. If you like new Poppy that's fine, but if you think she should have been created you're wrong my man. Old Poppy was quite possibly the most cancer champion in the game and needed a rework, but does that mean she needed to have her entire role changed? Something as fundamental as her basic function, going from carry to tank? You people can't think with any nuance, you read my posts and think I'm saying old Poppy was healthier or even more fun than new Poppy or some shit, when what I'm actually saying is that regardless of old kit health and fun versus new kit health and fun, the old Poppy had the BASIC IDENTITY of a late game carry, and new Poppy's BASIC IDENTITY is that of a lane bully tank, and this is wrong. > I can level with you on them adding in mechanics that are similar to existing ones, but better, though. But Mord's ult is definitely not akin to Poppy's old one. Hers was most often used on a person she _didn't_ plan on going after, and killing their ally while invincible. What a monumentally poorly-thought out statement. Old Poppy's ult was indeed not used on her target. Can you figure out why that is? It's because her ult was not being used like it was intended. Wow. That was hard to figure out, huh? Do you think that the extra damage she did to her ult target was there for fun? Hence why new Mordekaiser's is HEALTHIER, because it singles out one person for him to fuck up and makes it so people can't stop him, but doesn't let him kill the entire enemy team by making him immune to everyone else. > Plus, at the time of Poppy's rework they didn't have the means to make an ult like Mord's. If you watched the Sylas video, they actually learned quite a lot about interactions while coding him that they never knew before. And I'm sure that helped with programming Mord's ultimate. You're probably right, which actually just says poorly of Riot.
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UVdvGyjl,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2019-06-02T05:16:52.734+0000) > > Then give her a different ult, or update it. Don't completely change the role of the champion. I said I missed the ult, not the Ult was the big issue. Her kit is exactly the same thing aside her ult really. So, lets break it down. P: Old Poppy made her tanky via damage reduction when she was low, Her new passive Makes a auto ranged that gives her a shield. (Overall- So no invisible stat, but something thats visable to the player. So. Feels better) Q: Old: Enchanced auto attack. New: Skill shot that helps her in lane wave clear. (Overall- Feels the same, but just Better for her to farm and harass) W: Old Gave stats and movement speed New Gives Stats, Knocks up enemy champions if they dash, And giving her movement speed (New is just better version, Feels the same ) E: Legit same move R: They gave her A new ULT. Old: ults target. Makes a Duel where poppy is immune to damage from any other champion and deals bonus damage to that champion New: Big Knock back/Up (Did they change the role of the champion?... My thoughts no.)
> [{quoted}](name=Neekophile,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UVdvGyjl,comment-id=000200000001,timestamp=2019-06-02T05:57:12.249+0000) > > I said I missed the ult, not the Ult was the big issue. > Her kit is exactly the same thing aside her ult really. > > So, lets break it down. > > P: Old Poppy made her tanky via damage reduction when she was low, Her new passive Makes a auto ranged that gives her a shield. > (Overall- So no invisible stat, but something thats visable to the player. So. Feels better) > Q: Old: Enchanced auto attack. New: Skill shot that helps her in lane wave clear. > (Overall- Feels the same, but just Better for her to farm and harass) > W: Old Gave stats and movement speed New Gives Stats, Knocks up enemy champions if they dash, And giving her movement speed > (New is just better version, Feels the same ) > E: Legit same move > R: They gave her A new ULT. > Old: ults target. Makes a Duel where poppy is immune to damage from any other champion and deals bonus damage to that champion > New: Big Knock back/Up > (Did they change the role of the champion?... My thoughts no.) Her old passive worked better if she built mostly damage, her current one scales with the health she builds, meaning to get real usage out of it she has to build tank. Q doesn't feel the same because the old one scaled incredibly and could take off over half of an ADC's health in a single cast. Was it healthy? Not really, but you're just lying here friendo. Why lie? W gave attack damage as well as armour. Current one feels better, but who gives a shit? That isn't what I'm saying, work on your reading comprehension. E: Sure If you think that Poppy changing from arguably the hardest-scaling melee carry in the game who dealt absurd damage and could destroy teams into a CC tank doesn't constitute as a role change then you're just wrong. Like, there can be no argument here. Did you ever actually play old Poppy? She rushed Triforce and then built nearly full damage, ulted the most worthless piece of shit on the enemy team, and then killed the enemy team, assuming she was six-slotted. New Poppy bullies lane and tries to snowball but her damage falls off and she focuses on CCing the enemy in team fights for her team to kill them. If she tries to roll up on any decent duelist late game she will be unceremoniously killed. Sorry buddy, but you just don't know what you're talking about.
: That's pretty much what they did babe. She plays very similar to prior
> [{quoted}](name=NaSingularity,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UVdvGyjl,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2019-06-02T05:56:38.547+0000) > > That's pretty much what they did babe. She plays very similar to prior She used to be a damage-dealing carry and now she's a CC tank, but other than her role being the exact opposite of what it used to be yeah I guess she plays exactly the same.
: I used to main Old Galio. It was at some point where it was me who was carrying a game and the enemy ADC. And they built a {{item:3140}}. And after that we lost the game. It felt awful and I dropped the champion after that. I'm thankful Galio is no longer a Flash Ult Bot. Currently Galio, Urgot and Akali, While Messy they are still more balanced I found. Urgot is a Crab Tank, and he feels like one, the old one felt pretty awful. however, lets say Who cares if they feel more polished, more Interesting. We still are deleting the messy hot garbage they are. Its still a missing champion, not a good one but one none the less. And Because they were hot trash, they still had a Charm to it. I played a lot of Pre-Rework GP, Yorick, Poppy, Galio, Swain, Urgot(Duing the time he was being used as an Mid-Laner) and Taric. (not Irelia, Kayle, Aatrox, Evelyn, Warwick, Nunu, akali. I Forget some. I do miss the silly shenanigans you do with Old Poppy ult. But I think its for the better for the game.
> [{quoted}](name=Neekophile,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UVdvGyjl,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-06-02T05:11:16.921+0000) > > I do miss the silly shenanigans you do with Old Poppy ult. But I think its for the better for the game. Then give her a different ult, or update it. Don't completely change the role of the champion.
: Simple answer: because they are often so outdated that the way they play doesn't fit in the game. That, or they have a kit that can't be balanced around its core mechanic. I've said this to other people on other threads, but reworks are not for the people who _like_ the outdated/bug-riddled/unbalanceable champions they're based on. And this Mord is far more akin to the REAL Mordekaiser, not this sham that you newer players have always known.
> [{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UVdvGyjl,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-06-02T05:06:28.210+0000) > > Simple answer: because they are often so outdated that the way they play doesn't fit in the game. That, or they have a kit that can't be balanced around its core mechanic. > > I've said this to other people on other threads, but reworks are not for the people who _like_ the outdated/bug-riddled/unbalanceable champions they're based on. > > And this Mord is far more akin to the REAL Mordekaiser, not this sham that you newer players have always known. Then who are they for? The vast majority of the playerbase couldn't give a flying shit about whether or not any given champion is reworked. Do you think I give a shit that Volibear and Fiddlesticks are getting reworked? No, the only people who do are Voli and Fiddle players, be they dedicated OTPs or people who play them every now and then. And no, that shit will not fly. Champions are reworked for a reason, and as someone who played old!Poppy her old passive and ult at bare minimum needed to either go or be heavily retooled. What they _didn't_ need to do is take Poppy, one of the few melee hypercarries in the game, and turn her into a generic lane bully CC tank. Which is what they did. And now Mordekaiser is getting a healthier variation on her old ultimate which she could have gotten. Yippee.
: You're not, though. You have no idea what you're fucking talking about and you're derailing this thread with your bullshit.
> [{quoted}](name=4 Step Cadence,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=fiHZaFVx,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2019-05-29T11:04:35.876+0000) > > You're not, though. You have no idea what you're fucking talking about and you're derailing this thread with your bullshit. How am I derailing this thread by actually talking about the (terrible) new ability names? If anything I should be commended for being willing to argue my case, as opposed to the people silently downvoting me while being too scared to make a case for why I'm wrong.
: Oh so you're calling people who don't agree with you stupid now? Real mature. Its the names of a character's abilities in a video game. Grow up. Holy shit.
> [{quoted}](name=4 Step Cadence,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=fiHZaFVx,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2019-05-29T11:03:51.784+0000) > > Oh so you're calling people who don't agree with you stupid now? Real mature. > > Its the names of a character's abilities in a video game. Grow up. Holy shit. Point out where I called anyone stupid my friend.
: They always bring in mains to playtest their champion when they're getting a rework, because they trust their feeback more than someone who rarely if ever plays those champions. You have 19 games as Morde logged on this account, none of them recently. Explain to me how you know better than someone who has probably played hundreds if not thousands of games as Morde, and understands his thematic and character more than you. The whole "Morde's a metal man and has metal references" doesn't fit anymore. He was an older champion that didn't really fit into the current Runeterra thematically. They wanted his ability names to reflect his power in that world and universe, not be a reference to ours. I don't see how that's so hard for you to understand.
> [{quoted}](name=4 Step Cadence,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=fiHZaFVx,comment-id=000200000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-05-29T11:01:41.144+0000) > > They always bring in mains to playtest their champion when they're getting a rework, because they trust their feeback more than someone who rarely if ever plays those champions. > > You have 19 games as Morde logged on this account, none of them recently. Explain to me how you know better than someone who has probably played hundreds if not thousands of games as Morde, and understands his thematic and character more than you. > > The whole "Morde's a metal man and has metal references" doesn't fit anymore. He was an older champion that didn't really fit into the current Runeterra thematically. They wanted his ability names to reflect his power in that world and universe, not be a reference to ours. I don't see how that's so hard for you to understand. More logical fallacies, nothing but appeals to authority over and over again without actually talking about the (terrible) renames to his abilities except for what you've mindlessly parroted after reading a Rioter say it. Obliteate does not fit into current Runeterra any more than Mace of Spades did, it is considerably more generic, actually describes the ability more inadequately than Mace of Spades did, and yes, does not benefit from iconic status like the old ability name did. It is strictly worse and no amount of Riot apologist rhetoric will convince me otherwise. Try to actually defend the new names on their own merits next time.
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NemeBro

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