: Just because THE AUDIENCE knows about something doesn't mean THE CHARACTERS do. Its not a "SHOWMANCE" just because Riot or Riot's playerbase knows about it. If it was forevermore hidden from us then there would be no stories for us to see/read about it, would there? The game not having every Champion does not disqualify the game from being canon. I have no idea where you logic here is. I was willing to give the benefit of the doubt but I think 4 Step was right after all: just another Xano alt with other alts to upvote yourself on every post.
> [{quoted}](name=AbiwonKenabi,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=00010000000100000000000000000000000100000000,timestamp=2019-11-28T18:29:59.574+0000) > > Just because THE AUDIENCE knows about something doesn't mean THE CHARACTERS do. Its not a "SHOWMANCE" just because Riot or Riot's playerbase knows about it. If it was forevermore hidden from us then there would be no stories for us to see/read about it, would there? > > The game not having every Champion does not disqualify the game from being canon. I have no idea where you logic here is. > > I was willing to give the benefit of the doubt but I think 4 Step was right after all: just another Xano alt with other alts to upvote yourself on every post. That's what showmance means - 2 person play lovers but not real lovers. Given the interactions Rioters have created for the 2 and the population of audiences know this ship, it's a showmance, not a hidden romance. Hmmm I don't know but I think a new game missing a lot of champions and regions but adding a lot of new characters is not "canon", it's more like a different version/universe thing.
: > LOR bought the copyright and produce their own game. WHAT? No, no they didn't. Legends of Runeterra is being developed by RIOT GAMES. The same Riot Games that owns the League of Legends copyright. It is not being produced by a different company, it is the same company and they are the ones who decide what is canon and what is not.
> [{quoted}](name=AbiwonKenabi,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=00010000000100000000000000000000000000000000000000000001,timestamp=2019-11-28T18:25:19.187+0000) > > LoR as a whole is a copyrighted game. That does NOT mean Riot gave the copyright to someone else. It is still Riot games. I don't know what you are trying to say. I mean I've heard that the voicelines in LOR have some copyright that Riot can not claim to own. Apart from that, sometimes products from the same company can vary a lot and it's mainly due to the fact that they are done by different group of artists. The artists sometimes can add their own preferences to the products. Does that ring you a bell ?
Atgo (EUW)
: ~~Garen never should date Taric but I would like Garen getting friendzoned.~~
> [{quoted}](name=Atgo,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=mu3WeT5y,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-27T19:00:58.151+0000) > > ~~Garen never should date Taric but I would like Garen getting friendzoned.~~ It's suppose to be all friendzoned or all shipped, this way there won't be any wars, but clearly Riot don't care about the wars.
: > If everyone knows they are hidding their relationship, then it's not a hidden relationship, it's a showmance instead, meaning they are trying to play as secret lovers for the audience. You don't pay attention to what I say. I addressed this: > Riot has always been really weird about timelines and character knowledge--a character making a snide remark about the two doesn't necessarily mean in-canon that they already know or that they even meet either of them. Basically, in-game interactions _could_ be canon in the future. Illaoi has never met Braum, but if she did, she would like him, as she expressed in her quote towards him. The characters that make remarks to Garen or Katarina may not know about any relationship they have (or if there is even a relationship yet) but if they did, this is how they would remark. > it's not that popular You can't know this. I'm basing my statement on being in the League community for 9ish years and also the state of this thread: mostly downvotes. And most threads I see of this nature are downvotes. I don't have an exact count, but neither do you. I think its safe to say that at least both sides have a lot of people. > how can it be the lore when it does not have all the champions? Uh, what? Why would every Champion in the game need to be in LoR in order for it to be canon? What about written stories that only include one or two Champions? Or short stories that don't have _any_ Champions? Are they non-canon? The answer is they are still canon. This does not invalidate LoR either. > how can it be the lore if it starts off only part of the champions and regions selectively? Ixtal wasn't included in League lore until recently, that doesn't mean it or any other region is non-canon. The primary reason they didn't include every reason in LoR was for gameplay purposes; they only have so much development time, so they chose to spend it on a few select regions and fine tune them as much as possible. It does not invalidate the potential canon of the characters contained in the cards. For example, Scarmother Vrynna, a Freljord card, recently appeared in a Sylas short story. She wasn't known about before LoR, yet she was eventually confirmed to exist thanks to Sylas's story. Hence not a stretch to believe Katarina and Garen at the very least meeting and forming a friendly relationship (not even necessarily a romance) in the future, like implied by many in-game quotes and LoR interactions.
> [{quoted}](name=AbiwonKenabi,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=000100000001000000000000000000000001,timestamp=2019-11-28T05:53:26.552+0000) > > You don't pay attention to what I say. I addressed this: > > Basically, in-game interactions _could_ be canon in the future. Illaoi has never met Braum, but if she did, she would like him, as she expressed in her quote towards him. The characters that make remarks to Garen or Katarina may not know about any relationship they have (or if there is even a relationship yet) but if they did, this is how they would remark. > > You can't know this. I'm basing my statement on being in the League community for 9ish years and also the state of this thread: mostly downvotes. And most threads I see of this nature are downvotes. I don't have an exact count, but neither do you. I think its safe to say that at least both sides have a lot of people. > > Uh, what? Why would every Champion in the game need to be in LoR in order for it to be canon? What about written stories that only include one or two Champions? Or short stories that don't have _any_ Champions? Are they non-canon? The answer is they are still canon. This does not invalidate LoR either. > > Ixtal wasn't included in League lore until recently, that doesn't mean it or any other region is non-canon. The primary reason they didn't include every reason in LoR was for gameplay purposes; they only have so much development time, so they chose to spend it on a few select regions and fine tune them as much as possible. It does not invalidate the potential canon of the characters contained in the cards. > > For example, Scarmother Vrynna, a Freljord card, recently appeared in a Sylas short story. She wasn't known about before LoR, yet she was eventually confirmed to exist thanks to Sylas's story. Hence not a stretch to believe Katarina and Garen at the very least meeting and forming a friendly relationship (not even necessarily a romance) in the future, like implied by many in-game quotes and LoR interactions. I know what you mean, but what I mean is this : since Riot has been promoting this ship and people have already known this ship, it's not a secret or hidden romantic relationship, instead, it's a showmance. I think LOR being canon or not is controversial, I just don't think a game missing so many champions and regions but adding so many new settings should be canon. It seems a different version to me.
: > LOR bought the copyright and produce their own game. WHAT? No, no they didn't. Legends of Runeterra is being developed by RIOT GAMES. The same Riot Games that owns the League of Legends copyright. It is not being produced by a different company, it is the same company and they are the ones who decide what is canon and what is not.
> [{quoted}](name=AbiwonKenabi,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=0001000000010000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-28T05:55:50.580+0000) > > WHAT? No, no they didn't. Legends of Runeterra is being developed by RIOT GAMES. The same Riot Games that owns the League of Legends copyright. It is not being produced by a different company, it is the same company and they are the ones who decide what is canon and what is not. I heard LOR voicelines have copyright
Zkaiser (NA)
: Then I could say the comic books aren't canon because they don't feature all the champions. Riot MAKES LoR and Riot writers create all of the lore bits and voice lines. Everything we see in LoR is canon. The Fearsome General is General Du'Couteau, the Arena Bookie for the Reckonings is named Karl, and at some point Garen asked Katarina to meet him at the docks at night. It's not like Riot gave the rights for League characters to an outside company who is doing whatever they want with the characters. Riot is making the it themselves and is using the LoL lore to populate the game.
> [{quoted}](name=Zkaiser,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=00010000000100000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-27T19:00:02.820+0000) > > Then I could say the comic books aren't canon because they don't feature all the champions. Riot MAKES LoR and Riot writers create all of the lore bits and voice lines. Everything we see in LoR is canon. The Fearsome General is General Du'Couteau, the Arena Bookie for the Reckonings is named Karl, and at some point Garen asked Katarina to meet him at the docks at night. > > It's not like Riot gave the rights for League characters to an outside company who is doing whatever they want with the characters. Riot is making the it themselves and is using the LoL lore to populate the game. Comic books did not buy the copyright to produce their own comic series. LOR bought the copyright and produce their own game. You can add anything you want if you bought the copyright, it's like a different version of the characters. Riot can not say it's not canon because LOR bought their copyright, does that make sense to you? It's just a different team.
Zkaiser (NA)
: Everything in LoR is canon dude.
> [{quoted}](name=Zkaiser,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=000100000001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-27T18:18:13.611+0000) > > Everything in LoR is canon dude. I don't think a new card game with not all the champions or regions should be considered as canon. Does that make sense to you? It's a card game, they can script anything in the game as long as they bought the copyright. If you bought the copyright, you can add things to your game too, and you can't say it's not canon. Hope that make sense to you.
Zkaiser (NA)
: You believe that Garen hasn't killed anyone? He's probably killed MORE on the battlefield than Katarina.
> [{quoted}](name=Zkaiser,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2019-11-27T18:14:00.376+0000) > > You believe that Garen hasn't killed anyone? He's probably killed MORE on the battlefield than Katarina. I think what op means is this: since Garen kills so many on battlefield, he is not likely to love someone who kills many on battlefield.
: I never once said its what Rioters say. Katarina and Garen is a popular pairing, and Riot is giving a nod to it with their lines in Legends of Runeterra. Some people don't like this relationship. That's fine. Many others like it though, for some of the reasons I was talking about. I don't have an exact number of those people, but I think there are always plenty of people defending the idea when threads like this pop up. Its an old school ship, of course it is going to have fans. I couldn't really say if it was a "showmance" or not, since we don't have any canon stories with both Garen and Kat. All we have is a years-long series of nods to this popular pairing. Just because we, the audience, are privy to it doesn't mean its not hidden. And Riot has always been really weird about timelines and character knowledge--a character making a snide remark about the two doesn't necessarily mean in-canon that they already know or that they even meet either of them. Its really dumb, but the most reliable canon there is are the written stuff. LoR and even in-game League quotes are supplementary.
> [{quoted}](name=AbiwonKenabi,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=0001000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-27T05:56:16.130+0000) > > I never once said its what Rioters say. Katarina and Garen is a popular pairing, and Riot is giving a nod to it with their lines in Legends of Runeterra. > > Some people don't like this relationship. That's fine. Many others like it though, for some of the reasons I was talking about. I don't have an exact number of those people, but I think there are always plenty of people defending the idea when threads like this pop up. Its an old school ship, of course it is going to have fans. > > I couldn't really say if it was a "showmance" or not, since we don't have any canon stories with both Garen and Kat. All we have is a years-long series of nods to this popular pairing. Just because we, the audience, are privy to it doesn't mean its not hidden. And Riot has always been really weird about timelines and character knowledge--a character making a snide remark about the two doesn't necessarily mean in-canon that they already know or that they even meet either of them. Its really dumb, but the most reliable canon there is are the written stuff. LoR and even in-game League quotes are supplementary. it's not that popular, there are many people dislike garen kat. Also LOR is not the lore. It's a lore based new storyline. I think riot wants to promote their new game and so they tell you it's the lore, but if you think about it, how can it be the lore when it does not have all the champions? They could say "more will be added in the future", but come on, how can it be the lore if it starts off only part of the champions and regions selectively? I mean, that's not a good excuse, if you know what I mean, for example, they could select a few champions from all the regions, instead of saying more regions will be added in LOR **as the regions already exsist in LOL**. That's what showmance means - two people playing lovers but they are not real lovers. See, Rioters claim that they are secretly in a relationship, or that's what they try to hint at to the aundiences, but how can it be a hidden romantic relationship if it's already known by people? If everyone knows they are hidding their relationship, then it's not a hidden relationship, it's a showmance instead, meaning they are trying to play as secret lovers for the audience. Hope that makes sense.
: I think the verdict was "possibly canon in the future, but as the World of Runeterra is now, non-canon". But I was speaking less about an actual canon pairing and more that people are a fan of the idea of pairing Garen and Katarina together. This has been a popular pairing for a long time, despite not being canon.
> [{quoted}](name=AbiwonKenabi,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=00010000000100000000,timestamp=2019-11-26T18:30:32.560+0000) > > I think the verdict was "possibly canon in the future, but as the World of Runeterra is now, non-canon". > > But I was speaking less about an actual canon pairing and more that people are a fan of the idea of pairing Garen and Katarina together. This has been a popular pairing for a long time, despite not being canon. But that's what you think, not what rioters say. And lots people don't like this ship. We never have an authentic poll for this ship. Poeple don't like this ship probably never come here and vote for it so you can't say the majority like this ship. I hope that make sense to you? Also, consider the defination of "hidden relationship", isn't kat and garen more of a "showmance" instead of "hidden romance"? If you know what I mean.
: What? They both kill people for their country. The main way in which they are different is the country the come from and that country's values. Demacia values things like honorable battles, whereas Noxus honors cunning, strength and skill. So each uses the values of their country to fight for their country. If you consider Garen to be more morally correct, that's fine. It just means you have values that line up closer to Demacia's. But you have to acknowledge that different places have different values, and that doesn't make them inherently bad. I'm sure this could be a neat story hook for a potential Katarina and Garen-centric story (maybe not initially a romance), which is why many people like the pairing.
> [{quoted}](name=AbiwonKenabi,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=000100000001,timestamp=2019-11-26T16:28:01.227+0000) > > What? They both kill people for their country. The main way in which they are different is the country the come from and that country's values. Demacia values things like honorable battles, whereas Noxus honors cunning, strength and skill. So each uses the values of their country to fight for their country. > > If you consider Garen to be more morally correct, that's fine. It just means you have values that line up closer to Demacia's. But you have to acknowledge that different places have different values, and that doesn't make them inherently bad. I'm sure this could be a neat story hook for a potential Katarina and Garen-centric story (maybe not initially a romance), which is why many people like the pairing. Wait wait wait, but didn't Rioter just said they are not canon on twitter not long ago?
Arakadia (NA)
: Even if they met earlier in the lore Garen could not possibly leave Demacia or waste time with a romance in the present. The ship being old or legacy does not make it any better or less shorhorned.
> [{quoted}](name=Arakadia,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=000400000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-26T07:08:06.997+0000) > > Even if they met earlier in the lore Garen could not possibly leave Demacia or waste time with a romance in the present. > > The ship being old or legacy does not make it any better or less shorhorned. Wait what? But rioter said it's not canon on twitter! What are you guys talking about?
Atgo (EUW)
: I will be honest here, I heavily dislike the Garen x Katarina ship and I think they should give more focus on each region internal affairs before they do big interactions between regions and their champs. They dont even need to necessarily conclude the internal plot lines, I justthink they havent advanced enough(while this applies to both Demacia and Noxus it's more for Noxus). So I wouldnt want Katarina x Garen to ever happen or Garen and Darius meeting before both of them gets more stories developing their own regions. However with that said, you're gonna probally get those things soon enough. The new Sylas story has set up the Winter's Claw to attack Demacia and guess what? by his color story Darius was fighting the Winter's Claw recently, which would means that if the Winter's Claw suddenly decides to take most of the forces towards Demacia, Noxus's most important and proeminent military commander will know it. Add that with Noxian spies on Demacia giving news about the mage rebellion and it seems Demacia(maybe allied with Avarosans) vs Sylas + Winter's Claw vs Noxus is the next plot line being prepared for those regions and it will likely include Katarina x Garen and Garen vs Darius.
> [{quoted}](name=Atgo,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=mu3WeT5y,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-11-23T13:02:17.983+0000) > > I will be honest here, I heavily dislike the Garen x Katarina ship and I think they should give more focus on each region internal affairs before they do big interactions between regions and their champs. They dont even need to necessarily conclude the internal plot lines, I justthink they havent advanced enough(while this applies to both Demacia and Noxus it's more for Noxus). So I wouldnt want Katarina x Garen to ever happen or Garen and Darius meeting before both of them gets more stories developing their own regions. > > However with that said, you're gonna probally get those things soon enough. The new Sylas story has set up the Winter's Claw to attack Demacia and guess what? by his color story Darius was fighting the Winter's Claw recently, which would means that if the Winter's Claw suddenly decides to take most of the forces towards Demacia, Noxus's most important and proeminent military commander will know it. > > Add that with Noxian spies on Demacia giving news about the mage rebellion and it seems Demacia(maybe allied with Avarosans) vs Sylas + Winter's Claw vs Noxus is the next plot line being prepared for those regions and it will likely include Katarina x Garen and Garen vs Darius. Katarina is no difference than a battle partner like Darius or others to Garen, I think riot is just trying to aviod garen's gay ship and so they promote Katarina x Garen. If you know what I mean...
: And then Legends of Runeterra brings it back in full force with interactions.
> [{quoted}](name=Lintu Puck,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=wgejIh3F,comment-id=000a0000,timestamp=2019-11-26T03:48:00.193+0000) > > And then Legends of Runeterra brings it back in full force with interactions. That's what they said on twitter, I'm not sure which one you were talking about, but they said it's not canon, it's a what if theory and a ship rioters like. Something like that. Is there anyone really play that stupid card game btw? I'd rather play farm village on browser.
Falkeal (NA)
: GarenxKatarina is canon and it's a pretty big problem in a serious setting
Didn't Rioter just said it's not canon on twitter a month ago? WTH?

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