: All crit items only give 25%. RF, Hurricane, stattik and pd all got their crit items reduced by 5%. Thats not that big sure the attack speed nerf was pretty significant. GA is NOT better than PD lets compare. PD is 2600 gold. You get 30% attack speed, 25% crit and 5% movement speed. Then you get the 2 passives ghosting and lifeline (90 second cool down). Statwise it is the same as rapidfire canon. Now most ADC's are rushing IE first and a zeal item second. So the nice thing about PD is it fits into 2 of the 3 criterias that an adc wants to meet, and thats a higher critical strike chance, and attack speed, the bonus movement speed is always a plus. Whether an ADC is ahead or behind they always want to be a high dps threat. Now lets look at Guardian Angel. For 2800 gold you get 45 AD and 40 armor. GA has a unique passive: Upon taking lethal damage go into stasis and revive with 50% of you hp and 30% of your mana (300 second cooldown) I can guarante you that After IE nobody is considering into rushing into a GA second item. Its pretty gold inefficient to go GA second. Doesn't give you any crit chance, any attack speed, and the armor is useless against a heavy ap team. When behind in a game as an ADC GA is never a priority item. GA is sort of a third party item so to speak. Similar to Merc scimitar, Maw, Last whisper and blood thirster. Situationally those items can be useful but its not a core item to the success to a strong adc. So in short PD is good against both AP and Ad burst. The cool down on lifeline is 90 seconds compared to the 300 seconds of GA, Crit and attack speed is crucial to most adcs, armor is not. AS and crit is always good to build whether ahead or behind. GA is only good to buy when ahead, its a poor item when your score is 2-8
> [{quoted}](name=WeeWeeBojangles,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=1QWYP0Aj,comment-id=000100010000,timestamp=2019-02-08T04:16:31.624+0000) > > All crit items only give 25%. RF, Hurricane, stattik and pd all got their crit items reduced by 5%. Thats not that big sure the attack speed nerf was pretty significant. GA is NOT better than PD lets compare. > > PD is 2600 gold. You get 30% attack speed, 25% crit and 5% movement speed. Then you get the 2 passives ghosting and lifeline (90 second cool down). Statwise it is the same as rapidfire canon. Now most ADC's are rushing IE first and a zeal item second. So the nice thing about PD is it fits into 2 of the 3 criterias that an adc wants to meet, and thats a higher critical strike chance, and attack speed, the bonus movement speed is always a plus. Whether an ADC is ahead or behind they always want to be a high dps threat. > > Now lets look at Guardian Angel. For 2800 gold you get 45 AD and 40 armor. GA has a unique passive: Upon taking lethal damage go into stasis and revive with 50% of you hp and 30% of your mana (300 second cooldown) I can guarante you that After IE nobody is considering into rushing into a GA second item. Its pretty gold inefficient to go GA second. Doesn't give you any crit chance, any attack speed, and the armor is useless against a heavy ap team. When behind in a game as an ADC GA is never a priority item. GA is sort of a third party item so to speak. Similar to Merc scimitar, Maw, Last whisper and blood thirster. Situationally those items can be useful but its not a core item to the success to a strong adc. > > So in short PD is good against both AP and Ad burst. The cool down on lifeline is 90 seconds compared to the 300 seconds of GA, Crit and attack speed is crucial to most adcs, armor is not. AS and crit is always good to build whether ahead or behind. GA is only good to buy when ahead, its a poor item when your score is 2-8 The problem is oftentimes doing a bit more damage might have saved you in the first place. I’m not going to imply it isn’t a decent buy, but it being so cost ineffective _can_ set you behind. Furthermore, I would argue that this item is once again “a poor item when your score is 2-8.” Building defensively is a “when ahead” move. If you’re behind, building more defense is going to cement your loss. All this will do is ahead adc’s will be able to bow fit GA, mercurial scimitar, AND a ~~sterak’s~~ phantom dancer shield into one build. A rough build many crit adc’s will potentially be going now is PD, IE, scimitar, GA, last whisper upgrade, boots.
Rioter Comments
9 Upsetˉ (EUNE)
: Bringing back the old Infinity Edge. / So far the worst urf mode ever made by riot.
> [{quoted}](name=9 Upsetˉ,realm=EUNE,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=xL2HpTKH,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-02-09T13:27:27.960+0000) > > Just played an urf game vs garen and he spammed like x5 IE and ghostblade walked by US AND BOOM instant pentakill within a blink, Next time riot when you are about to release a game mode get your shit together and then release it OR PUT BANS or DISABLE CHAMPIONS in urf mode like u disabled new items like spear of shojin!!!! Meh. The real problem in urf is the elder dragon. Also getting more than one IE is a trap, if you want to run that strat get 1 IE, and if you have transcendence, get 3 essence reavers. Cheaper, and they will give 4 more AD each.
: Not really necessary to change it. The problem with the old PD passive, which reduced 12% damage from the last target attacked, was that it offered nothing against assassins. If talon, rengar, khazix, etc come out of nowhere and one shot you then this doesn't do anything. There is only a 2 second shield because this item is designed specifically so that ADC's don't get one shot in under 2 seconds by assassins. PD is great against ad assassins. You can argue that maw would be a better choice against a team with an ap assassin like lb or katarina. But don't forget PD also gives you 25% crit. You can still have a 2 item power spike with 50% crit while also not having to worry about getting deleted. PD goes instantly into you build while maw is more of a 3rd or 4th item on an adc if needed. Play a few games as an assassin if the opponent is smart enough to build PD you will definitely tell that its doing something.
> [{quoted}](name=WeeWeeBojangles,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=1QWYP0Aj,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-02-07T21:23:41.607+0000) > > Not really necessary to change it. The problem with the old PD passive, which reduced 12% damage from the last target attacked, was that it offered nothing against assassins. If talon, rengar, khazix, etc come out of nowhere and one shot you then this doesn't do anything. There is only a 2 second shield because this item is designed specifically so that ADC's don't get one shot in under 2 seconds by assassins. PD is great against ad assassins. > > You can argue that maw would be a better choice against a team with an ap assassin like lb or katarina. But don't forget PD also gives you 25% crit. You can still have a 2 item power spike with 50% crit while also not having to worry about getting deleted. PD goes instantly into you build while maw is more of a 3rd or 4th item on an adc if needed. > > Play a few games as an assassin if the opponent is smart enough to build PD you will definitely tell that its doing something. Old PD had more attack speed though, and more crit too. Why buy new PD when a GA does its job better?
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=Pierce The Veal,realm=NA,application-id=LqLKtMpN,discussion-id=FJ0z2G4l,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-02-06T19:28:13.753+0000) > > Udyr’s ult damage isn’t actually a passive, but moreso a form change. For Jax, you have it whether you activate ult or not. The bonus damage every 3rd hit is a passive tied to Jax's ultimate. So this should not be disabled until the ult buff actually ends - not when it begins.
> [{quoted}](name=Frontline Fury,realm=EUW,application-id=LqLKtMpN,discussion-id=FJ0z2G4l,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-02-06T22:46:52.247+0000) > > The bonus damage every 3rd hit is a passive tied to Jax's ultimate. So this should not be disabled until the ult buff actually ends - not when it begins. I see. So he gains the passive until he uses jax’s ult. I’d say it’s sort of working as intended, since you lose jax’s ult once you use it, even if only during the duration of his ult.
: I wish there was variety in AP itemization, because as it stands you'll always get the same items
I think for variety to exist, we need more niche options (like AD itemization), and fewer one off powerful items. Aka, {{item:3157}} {{item:3102}} {{item:3916}} {{item:3151}} These items give lots of damage and defense against ALL damage types. They’re so good that building a zhonya’s against a full ap team doesn’t even seem like that bad of an idea. {{item:3285}} also gives everything a mage needs, lane mana sustain while building, mana, cdr, free aoe damage. It’s so good that it becomes essential. Even Vladimir players pick it up sometimes. Don’t get me wrong, AD itemization, in certain cases, suffers from the same problems. Sterak’s, triforce, titanic hydra are major offenders. So are mercurial scimitar, black cleaver, and guardian angel. But if you pay attention, you’ll notice that ad champions, by class, don’t actually have much build diversity either due to these game distortingly powerful items.
: But it's only integral if your kit isnt over loaded with true dmg or you are a conqueror abuser
> [{quoted}](name=ApocaIypse Meow,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=m4aZeIAz,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2019-02-06T19:11:20.180+0000) > > But it's only integral if your kit isnt over loaded with true dmg or you are a conqueror abuser That, I agree with. While I understand that bruisers wouldn’t be able to do anything vs tanks without conqueror, conqueror seems to lack too much counterplay. Not to mention Riot adding true damage across the entire game, making it so the only way to go tanky is Sterak’s builds where you kill fast enough and have enough hp to live long enough to kill fast enough. I think the biggest things riot could do for conqueror is (A) remove the bonus AD it gives (B) change the 5 seconds in combat to 3 seconds in combat with champions. (C) make its damage be reduced still by ninja tabi and randuin’s (so make ninja tabi’s and randuins’ % damage reduction apply before the true damage conversion).
: [Gameplay] When Sylas uses Jax's ult, the passive portion is removed for the duration of the effect
> [{quoted}](name=Frontline Fury,realm=EUW,application-id=LqLKtMpN,discussion-id=FJ0z2G4l,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-02-06T19:25:50.162+0000) > > The bug: When Sylas activates Jax's ultimate, he loses the passive portion of the ultimate despite the active part still ticking down it's buff. This does not happen with similar ults such as Udyr's. Udyr’s ult damage isn’t actually a passive, but moreso a form change. For Jax, you have it whether you activate ult or not.
: Probably so that the item doesn't break Transcendence. Lets just be honest, if it had that passive any mana ad user that uses autos and needs cdr would buy the shit out of it and gain a boatload of stats.
> [{quoted}](name=Ragnaveil,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9VkTMdIA,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-02-06T18:42:03.157+0000) > > Probably so that the item doesn't break Transcendence. Lets just be honest, if it had that passive any mana ad user that uses autos and needs cdr would buy the shit out of it and gain a boatload of stats. But for it to work you’d need to build crit, and at most what are you going to buy with transcendence? A black cleaver and a death’s dance? Then you lose out on more crit and all your item slots are full. Plus, it’s not like transcendence gives _free_ stats, you’re already paying for the cdr, it just allows you to get gold efficiency off excess cdr. The only real champion that benefits off of old essence reaver and that much cdr was nocturne. Adc’s usually don’t need cdr nearly as much as nocturne does, and nocturne runs oom with 3-4 Q’s so essence reaver was solid. He is pretty much the only champion who truly liked essence reaver (before the short lived craze where everyone was getting it for 100% crit). Two other champions like old essence reaver. Draven, who’s usually better building other stuf, and lucian, once again better off building botrk black cleaver.
AR URF (NA)
: Anyone play this game long enough to tell whether or not a person is salty by their actions?
Akrid415 (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=heroikc,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7KhkiF8d,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-02-06T05:09:51.858+0000) > > Yeah, most marksman tops are like that. There's gotta be a counter to it. I hate cheesy shit like that.
> [{quoted}](name=Akrid415,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7KhkiF8d,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-02-06T05:35:49.810+0000) > > There's gotta be a counter to it. I hate cheesy shit like that. The counter is send a mage top.
Ryzê (NA)
: ~130 cs nasus = 500 stacks now
> [{quoted}](name=Ryzê,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=m4aZeIAz,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-02-06T06:28:24.354+0000) > > thank you for this garbage I suppose you didn’t bother building any armor. Didn’t buy ninja tabis, or swifties (helps with the slow), and, now that I checked match history, pretty much always build the same exact thing regardless of what team you’re playing against. I don’t mean to offend, but if you built a ninja tabi/swifties+zhonya’s, heck, ryze can even do well with an iceborn gauntlet or a frozen heart, that nasus would have been able to do absolutely nothing to you. Building full damage with a merc treads; you shouldn’t expect to automatically win against _any_ champion. It’s crazy how much people forgot that _counterbuilding_ is an integral part of the game, especially if one champion is the reason you lost.
: "I want ADC to be less shitty to play"
Let’s be fair here as well, if it wasn’t for IE being such a wonky item and giving no crit until completed, crit ADC’s would be in a perfectly fije state. The zeal items are some of the most solid damage items in the game, they only lack consistency. And crit adc’s would furthermore not be bad if a few select adc’s and mages were toned down. It’s not that crit adcs are terrible right now, it’s that certain offenders in today’s meta render them hard to use. The problem, partially, is all the free damage. Press the attack, predator, summon aery, arcane commet, electrocute, dark harvest, luden’s echo proc, statikk shiv proc, duskblade proc. All of these add up and make it hard to play ANY squishy champion that has to get in range to do stuff. The only reason bruisers, who roughly do the same thing as ADC’s, have been decent is because of the combination of high base ad, sterak’s, triforce, titanic hydra, and conqueror, of which adc’s only have access to triforce.
Player342 (EUNE)
: Daily reminder that we still describe damage in this game with term "champions per second"
Tfw a pink ward is tankier than most of the champions in the game.
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=drash79,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=BGZe1ry9,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-02-05T17:42:47.024+0000) > > Mayors, Presidents, Generals, Cops, and Judges would all be cut in half creating endless power vacuums world wide, making global power struggles more deadly. You are wrongfully assuming benevolence in all those officials. Some places might see an improvement depending if they were lucky enough that key tyrannical figures vanished. If Hitler and Stalin randomly disappeared in the early 1930s, wouldn't the world have turned out for the better?
> [{quoted}](name=Linna Excel,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=BGZe1ry9,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2019-02-05T18:06:47.585+0000) > > You are wrongfully assuming benevolence in all those officials. Some places might see an improvement depending if they were lucky enough that key tyrannical figures vanished. If Hitler and Stalin randomly disappeared in the early 1930s, wouldn't the world have turned out for the better? Probably not. There were multiple people who fit the same mold that could have taken up Hitler or Stalin’s posts relatively easily after the power vacuum caused by their death. Hitler and Stalin are rather representative of their regimes, like attracts like, hence their regimes, or at least the higher ups were filled with people like them or of a similar mentality/capability.
: Conqueror damage Hashinshin playing Renekton
When I get readings of 3000 true damage done, when I mouse over it, usually it’s only like 500-800 damage dealt that would have otherwise not been dealt. It’s only really strong becaus of the bonus AD you get on top of the true damage. That really makes the rune strong, otherwise it woild be pretty weak.
: > [{quoted}](name=Pierce The Veal,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EV6OMUJr,comment-id=0001000100000000,timestamp=2018-12-24T14:45:43.337+0000) > > We were talking about old galio and how the rework supposedly didn’t preserve his identity as a “tank,” and if you read very carefully, you would realize I said that galio before his rework was *never* played as a tank. Even after his rework he was at best an AP bruiser. No one was talking about old galio in the original post it was about how the rework was good then riot kept changing him causing problems and you REPLIED TO ME TALKING ABOUT THE REWORK GALIO also again rework galio was not fucking played as a ap bruiser until 7.21 and I put the meta build before 7.21 in my post and it was full tank galio before 7.21 he had bad ap scaling but riot buffed them to be good in 7.21.
> [{quoted}](name=boricCentaur1,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EV6OMUJr,comment-id=00010001000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-24T15:16:17.707+0000) > > No one was talking about old galio in the original post it was about how the rework was good then riot kept changing him causing problems and you REPLIED TO ME TALKING ABOUT THE REWORK GALIO also again rework galio was not fucking played as a ap bruiser until 7.21 and I put the meta build before 7.21 in my post and it was full tank galio before 7.21 he had bad ap scaling but riot buffed them to be good in 7.21. Oh my bad, I was just too stupid to realize yu actually thought that the reworked galio was ever close to being a tank, so I assumed you were talking about the original form of galio, largely in part due to your lacking capability to formulate a sentence. So I realize that what you’re trying to tell me is for a few patches, Riot fucked up, and made his AP scaling too trashy, introduced tank items that were too strong on him, and made his tank stats too strong and so he was played as a tank for all of 5 patches? You’re not talking about consistent long term play, no, You’re talking about a period of time where riot fucked up their intended design and weren’t able to fix it for several patches because it was esports time. And, furthermore, the reason why he was so good as a tank was because 1) conqueror didn’t exist 2) IE didn’t give true damage 3) lots of assassins 4) his damage reduction was broken 5) he could share his busted ass damage reduction with his adc/teammate during his ult. Old galio was always an AP bruiser. Riot, when reworking galio, mentioned they wanted to make him an ap bruiser. Riot, then fucked up. Then that design stuck around for a few patches before they decided to fix him. And now, since more true damage is in the game, that old galio has become an impossibility. I’m sorry this is so hard for you to comprehend.
: Damage outscales defense to the point of khazix being able to duel tank amumu all game long.
> [{quoted}](name=ImGodlyatYasuo,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=pTRA0RQE,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-12-24T07:28:31.673+0000) > > I went tank amumu, he went khazix full ad all game long he out sustained, out damaged, and out lived me. The game ended with them taking baron and elder 10 seconds flat in the time it took me to walk to baron from mid they took it and ryze ulted to mid in the time it took me to get to mid to elder they took and they just solo ended the game, prior they took baron and took all of mid and the nexus towers since we couldnt stop the endless push mid. This is how the average game feels for people who play tanks as tanks instead of AP ONE SHOT GERNADE AMUMU BUILD!!!! You fight someone with high damage they kill you early, they get a lead, they get armor shred by the time you actually finish some items, and bam they death ball mid and the game is over. No stopping, Objective after Objective, No Backing, No fighting, Just waiting for them to push mid in 30 seconds and end the game flat out. For ONE, you were a silver 4 amumu against a GOLD 4 kha’zix, you were outtiered. SECOND: you rushed cinderhulk, which is an item whose defense scales the more defense you have. THIRD: you ended the game with three completed defensive items, excluding boots. Of those, ONE was an armor item. FOURTH: he was far more fed than you, 18/7/6 to your 4/10/10. He ended the game with 18k gold, you ended with 12k. AND furthermore they had an 18/3 jinx and you still went for and bought an abyssal mask. At this point you can’t blame damage creep. You can only blame yourself, and had it been ranked, I would have said matchmaking, but it was a normal, and their fiddle was Iron 3. Simply put, it wasn’t damage creep, they were simply too much better than you. > [{quoted}](name=Sire Hippington,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=pTRA0RQE,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-12-24T14:51:36.495+0000) > > not disagreeing with the statement that damage outscales tankiness way to far, but the specifc example is pretty bad, Kah is designed around winning 1v1s while amumu is a powerfull teamfighter, seems about right that the 1v1 champ wins the duel vs the teamfight champ... And this is also true as a side note. You could have wom your team some teamfights had you made them group.
saltran (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Pierce The Veal,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=j55gmnBc,comment-id=00020000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-23T14:18:35.716+0000) > > So what defines an item as terrible is whether it’s core on some champions or not? > > People need to understand that an item doesn’t need to be built every game for it to have value. In fact, a game full of many situational items instead of a few core items is a far more fun and interesting game. > > It was a decent alternative to bloodthirster at the time, though perhaps it could have used a small buff, it ultimately wasn’t that bad in the first place. If a item isnt even used on their best intended users, which happened to the ER with lifesteal, I will say that its a trash item.
> [{quoted}](name=saltran,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=j55gmnBc,comment-id=000200000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-23T14:33:07.353+0000) > > If a item isnt even used on their best intended users, which happened to the ER with lifesteal, I will say that its a trash item. I guess the word “niche” doesn’t mean anything to you. Alrighty, let’s just delete all the items in the game and make the items very specifically pander to champions. The entire reason league has been getting “more damage” is because we went from cookie cutter builds, lots and lots of items that were never 100% what you wanted, but were all pretty good, to items tailored to specific champions and classes of champions. Essence reaver was one of those niche items, one that wasn’t too different from bloodthirster but offered the alternative to its slightly higher lifesteal: mana sustain. The winrates on champions who took essence reaver weren’t far off from those who took bloodthirster back then, and they were higher if they were mana gated champions. Let’s be fair here, the only reason anybody took the new crit essence reaver and the current essence reaver is because they were *broken.* One gave you AD, crit, mana restore, and 30, THREE FUCKING ZERO percent cdr. The other turns various champs into urf mode upon activation. The reason that old essence reaver wasn’t that popular was it didn’t allow you to 1-2 shot people at 1-2 items.
: > [{quoted}](name=Pierce The Veal,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EV6OMUJr,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2018-12-23T14:12:51.068+0000) > > On the contrary, he was always an ap champion. The only way you could take him tank is if you took advantage of the old thornmail’s 30% damage return. > > He was always an anti mage mage, so an AP champion, one scales, albeit badly, with magic resist. Which literally meant he went abyssal scepter into regular ap items, oh, and maybe a zhonya’s for the cherry on top. I guess every mage nowadays is a tank. No he hasn't building ap on galio became meta in 7.21 before that he could maybe build rod and if you are talking about old galio no one cares the old one was poorly designed and never played for a reason so saying he should be ap since the old was is irrelevant since the one we have now is not that galio. Also here is the average galio build in the na lcs in season 7 http://gol.gg/champion/champion-stats/25/season-S7/split-ALL/tournament-ALL/patch-ALL/role-ALL/league-ALL/
> [{quoted}](name=boricCentaur1,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EV6OMUJr,comment-id=000100010000,timestamp=2018-12-23T14:35:47.884+0000) > > No he hasn't building ap on galio became meta in 7.21 before that he could maybe build rod and if you are talking about old galio no one cares the old one was poorly designed and never played for a reason so saying he should be ap since the old was is irrelevant since the one we have now is not that galio. Also here is the average galio build in the na lcs in season 7 http://gol.gg/champion/champion-stats/25/season-S7/split-ALL/tournament-ALL/patch-ALL/role-ALL/league-ALL/ We were talking about old galio and how the rework supposedly didn’t preserve his identity as a “tank,” and if you read very carefully, you would realize I said that galio before his rework was *never* played as a tank. Even after his rework he was at best an AP bruiser.
Aarron (NA)
: Literally only Fiora built it frequently If Jayce wanted mana he'd opt for tear, but Jayce hasn't built tear in several years
> [{quoted}](name=Aarron,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=j55gmnBc,comment-id=0002000000000001,timestamp=2018-12-24T06:31:06.223+0000) > > Literally only Fiora built it frequently > If Jayce wanted mana he'd opt for tear, but Jayce hasn't built tear in several years It not being bought consistently every game doesn’t mean it didn’t have value. There were matchups and team comps where it being cheaper and restoring mana was a big advantage. Nocturne used to build it pretty often as well, and it was a decent buy for anyone who would opt in for lifesteal.
: I addressed this problem on myself a long time ago. Bring exhaust on ADC! Now you have less to fear.
> [{quoted}](name=ı Sona ı,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=tetEq7Qa,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2018-12-24T03:06:50.307+0000) > > I addressed this problem on myself a long time ago. Bring exhaust on ADC! Now you have less to fear. What!? Next you’re going to say they should take defensive boots and consider actually getting a hexdrinker/ga! Oh the horror! /s
Paroe (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Pierce The Veal,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bicNwRfe,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-12-20T06:45:07.582+0000) > > I feel like that’s literally the only drawback to playing rakan, which means it absolutely should not be changed. Rakan would be too powerful. > > Back when urgot was “weak” people were begging riot to allow him to use titanic hydra. Imagine how terrfiying that would have been. How is 275 range a drawback? Its clunky and strange - Rakan either needs a proper basic attack range or an exception so he can use itemization that he was clearly meant to utilize.
> [{quoted}](name=Paroe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bicNwRfe,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-12-20T07:27:42.754+0000) > > How is 275 range a drawback? > Its clunky and strange - Rakan either needs a proper basic attack range or an exception so he can use itemization that he was clearly meant to utilize. Him being classified as a ranged champion is literally a built in drawback. You’re telling me he should get to benefit off of outranging all the melees and use their itemization too? If he was meant to utilize that itemization then perhaps they would have actually classified him as a melee champion then?
saltran (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Pierce The Veal,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=j55gmnBc,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2018-12-20T06:39:16.353+0000) > > That’s not true, various champions did buy it. Just because it wasn’t the adc’s favorite item didn’t mean it was terrible and never bought. > > I used to love taking it on nocturne, for one, as did many others. > > Jayce also somewhat liked the item. > > There were a few others, and it was often a good substitute for bloodthirster if you wanted good mana sustain as well. It wasn't a core item on any champ and was even more niche than the current ER on some bruisers. That item was terrible.
> [{quoted}](name=saltran,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=j55gmnBc,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-20T10:20:38.087+0000) > > It wasn't a core item on any champ and was even more niche than the current ER on some bruisers. > > That item was terrible. So what defines an item as terrible is whether it’s core on some champions or not? People need to understand that an item doesn’t need to be built every game for it to have value. In fact, a game full of many situational items instead of a few core items is a far more fun and interesting game. It was a decent alternative to bloodthirster at the time, though perhaps it could have used a small buff, it ultimately wasn’t that bad in the first place.
: Galio should just go back to being a tank like after they made him into a ap champion first and a tank second he has caused so many problems like he did not caused a lot of problems as a tank.
> [{quoted}](name=boricCentaur1,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EV6OMUJr,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-12-22T21:45:08.947+0000) > > Galio should just go back to being a tank like after they made him into a ap champion first and a tank second he has caused so many problems like he did not caused a lot of problems as a tank. On the contrary, he was always an ap champion. The only way you could take him tank is if you took advantage of the old thornmail’s 30% damage return. He was always an anti mage mage, so an AP champion, one scales, albeit badly, with magic resist. Which literally meant he went abyssal scepter into regular ap items, oh, and maybe a zhonya’s for the cherry on top. I guess every mage nowadays is a tank.
GigglesO (NA)
: Instead of buffing adc's
> [{quoted}](name=GigglesO,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9Bw8NLA1,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-12-20T03:33:16.713+0000) > > What if we just let them play the game again by nerfing damage? > > I'd really love to not be blown so hard all game. > > Its not fun dying instantly as anyone. It’s not even fun to play most assassins anymore either because everyone has as much burst as you anyway. Maokai? He’ll 100-0 an adc no problem. Mundo? Same story. And then there’s the “fighter” class, aka the better assassins that can also act as carries. Why should I play an assassin when irelia, jax, and camille don’t have silly delays put into their kit and arguably outdamage most assassins (freaking leblanc and rengar being the exceptions)
Paroe (NA)
: This discussion has been around since release, but can we make Rakan melee?
I feel like that’s literally the only drawback to playing rakan, which means it absolutely should not be changed. Rakan would be too powerful. Back when urgot was “weak” people were begging riot to allow him to use titanic hydra. Imagine how terrfiying that would have been.
Rester (NA)
: Why are people such salty bois in Nexus Blitz, where you're supposed to chill and have some fun?
> [{quoted}](name=Rester,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=tKIObwFh,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-12-20T06:40:28.312+0000) > > Legit, enemies and teammates. This is why we can't have nice things or game modes. {{sticker:slayer-jinx-unamused}} I think that it’s because they feel forced to play the game mode to get tokens. I’ve been annoyed about it myself. People get so toxic in that gamemode when it’s supposed to be for fun.
saltran (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Netkous,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=j55gmnBc,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-12-19T23:18:45.291+0000) > > or give it life steal like in the good old days That item was absolutely garbage that no champ ever bought, the first version of ER was terrible.
> [{quoted}](name=saltran,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=j55gmnBc,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2018-12-20T03:06:34.711+0000) > > That item was absolutely garbage that no champ ever bought, the first version of ER was terrible. That’s not true, various champions did buy it. Just because it wasn’t the adc’s favorite item didn’t mean it was terrible and never bought. I used to love taking it on nocturne, for one, as did many others. Jayce also somewhat liked the item. There were a few others, and it was often a good substitute for bloodthirster if you wanted good mana sustain as well.
Sukishoo (NA)
: VGUs dont get reverted.
> [{quoted}](name=Sukishoo,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9tqZiHi5,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-12-18T15:35:43.669+0000) > > VGUs dont get reverted. Keep her graphics revert her gameplay bam. > [{quoted}](name=D357R0Y3R,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9tqZiHi5,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-12-18T15:33:59.656+0000) > > People who are asking this, are old akali abuser that want her to come back to that state where nobody knew she was broken, and the few people like TF blade abused her to get challenger > > While new Akali is overtuned but has much more counterplay than full point and click stat checking garbage, and thus is healthier **ESPECIALLY** when they made her unable to hardcounter half of league champions in last patch The new akali has more counterplay? You mean the part where she can’t get hit by turrets, and just pretty much slowly whittle you down before she can execute you? Old Akali you could cc, or wait out Q. Heck, if you took the effort to *read* you would realize I recommeneded a revert/partial revert with more skillshots included. Watch some old akali gameplay. The difference between *good* akalis and bad akalis is *very* clear.
Jinxalot (NA)
: If they reduce the duration of the Shroud and eliminate the extended duration, that would help tune her into something reasonable. In late game, the Shroud is up for an insane duration. With CDR and the extra duration she can almost spam the Shroud up permanently.
> [{quoted}](name=Jinxalot,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9tqZiHi5,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-12-18T15:25:14.892+0000) > > If they reduce the duration of the Shroud and eliminate the extended duration, that would help tune her into something reasonable. > In late game, the Shroud is up for an insane duration. With CDR and the extra duration she can almost spam the Shroud up permanently. But that’s the thing, without the shroud her damage and burst combo is garbage. So Riot has created a balancing nightmare.
Rioter Comments
: This will probably turn out like S6(?) when swifties were buffed and everyone was too fast
> [{quoted}](name=205181825,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7J3IWrK8,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-12-11T13:35:22.283+0000) > > This will probably turn out like S6(?) when swifties were buffed and everyone was too fast To be fair, swifties were the cheapest pair of boots in the game, costing, I believe, 800 gold total, for boots that gave 60 movespeed.
: Which is actually bullshit since a champion like jax should ABSOLUTELY NOT have problems with tanks. Just shows you how broken tanks actually were that jax can't beat them anymore. A MELEE AA CARRY WITH SUSTAIN DMG CANNOT BEAT TANKS. What world are we living in like holy shit. Thank god there is conq now. If we get rid of essence reaver jax is going to be fine again. Not conq.
> [{quoted}](name=GayFluffyUnicorn,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AAlArNAg,comment-id=000b0000,timestamp=2018-12-11T14:45:39.026+0000) > > Which is actually bullshit since a champion like jax should ABSOLUTELY NOT have problems with tanks. Just shows you how broken tanks actually were that jax can't beat them anymore. > > A MELEE AA CARRY WITH SUSTAIN DMG CANNOT BEAT TANKS. > What world are we living in like holy shit. > > Thank god there is conq now. > If we get rid of essence reaver jax is going to be fine again. Not conq. Well Riot doesn’t allow you to drain tank, doesn’t allow melees to have good damage itemization, and so they need to rely on a mishmash of broken items to somehow work or be broken. Remove/nerf those items and suddenly they are garbage.
Poske (EUNE)
: The idea is horrible so it might be just something Riot ll do I ll explain why its a horrible idea because I dont expect non League Gods to understand it Its an anti melee change and Riot has DONE enough of those already They Quadrupled tower damage - ANTI MELEE They added free shields of gold - ANTI MELEE (toplane high elo meta is bassicly all ranged) They increased tower tankiness - ANTI MELEE (because map opens up slower) (They ll make it open up even slower soon XYDD) **Increasing everyone movementspeed would just be another anti melee blshit** If you cant comprehend that, congratz you have Riot live design team IQ Also some skillshots which are unreliable in high elo (like ziggs q and nidalee q would be even worse off)
> [{quoted}](name=Poske,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7J3IWrK8,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2018-12-11T16:07:44.044+0000) > > The idea is horrible so it might be just something Riot ll do > > > I ll explain why its a horrible idea because I dont expect non League Gods to understand it > > Its an anti melee change and Riot has DONE enough of those already > > > They Quadrupled tower damage - ANTI MELEE > They added free shields of gold - ANTI MELEE (toplane high elo meta is bassicly all ranged) > They increased tower tankiness - ANTI MELEE (because map opens up slower) > > > **Increasing everyone movementspeed would just be another anti melee blshit** > If you cant comprehend that, congratz you have Riot live design team IQ > > > Also some skillshots which are unreliable in high elo (like ziggs q and nidalee q would be even worse off) How is it anti melee if it just means ranged skillshots become worse because they’re easier to dodge?
: Personally skillshots make this game fun and I don't feel bad getting hit with a charm/morg bind because I know I could've reacted. I think they need to focus hard on reworking out targetable cc, with the exception of some supports for assassin peel; because it's mindless and not fun to play against. Take Eve for example, if you don't see her on the map you literally just can't be pushed up far or she can targetable cc you with invisibility and your only option for counterplay is flashing out of range which might not even work.
> [{quoted}](name=sneakyPedro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7J3IWrK8,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2018-12-11T16:12:03.468+0000) > > Personally skillshots make this game fun and I don't feel bad getting hit with a charm/morg bind because I know I could've reacted. I think they need to focus hard on reworking out targetable cc, with the exception of some supports for assassin peel; because it's mindless and not fun to play against. Take Eve for example, if you don't see her on the map you literally just can't be pushed up far or she can targetable cc you with invisibility and your only option for counterplay is flashing out of range which might not even work. Which is funny, because eve’s cc is not “targetable” point and click unless you use her e, in which case you have to either flash, or walk into close enough range to use it.
: or increase movement speed AND increase damage {{champion:120}}
> [{quoted}](name=hhaavviikk,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7J3IWrK8,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2018-12-11T17:24:40.558+0000) > > or increase movement speed AND increase damage {{champion:120}} {{sticker:sg-ahri-2}}
Kídá (NA)
: and go back to mobility creep of season 6?
> [{quoted}](name=Kídá,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7J3IWrK8,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2018-12-11T19:20:24.481+0000) > > and go back to mobility creep of season 6? Dashes were the source of mobility creep, not movement speed. Nowadays, increasing movement speed across the board would just make it so dashes are relatively weaker, hence making mobility weaker in ways.
: > [{quoted}](name=Pierce The Veal,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J16phEvl,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-12-11T10:55:07.700+0000) > > I think it’s trying to communicate guys! I can transalte If you want {{item:3153}} ASAP, pick the Klepto keystone
> [{quoted}](name=H1de on blue,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J16phEvl,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-12T15:05:40.198+0000) > > I can transalte > > If you want {{item:3153}} ASAP, pick the Klepto keystone {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-thumbs}} Thanks.
: Akali and her 'levers' - why are so few on the table?
The issue here is Akali isn’t actually strong. The issue is people hate the shroud *so much* that it doesn’t matter that she’s weak, nobody wants to deal with her. So let me address your concerns: The passive circle isn’t a bad idea, but you have to remember that hitting this won’t be solving the issue. People will still ban her until and unless she is so bad that she is not worth banning (or until true stealth is gone). The mana champion thing has been out of the question for a looooong time. Energy is part of her identity, and this same suggestion has come up umpteen times since she was released. Yes, I mean since her release, and not her rework. It really would just make her more obnoxious to play agaisnt as she would be better in extended fights. The Q heal removal would definitely make her less annoying. However, do remember she’s weak as heck right now. The shroud is rhe only thing actually good about her. And the energy regain, once again, is unfortunately not the issue. These ideas are all valid and great, but the problem isn’t that we’re trying to nerf a *strong* champion. We’re trying to take a weak, but hated champion and make them balanced, but not hated. What that comes down to is removing the true stealth and buffing her damage, but in that case why did you even rework akali at all? The rework is just impossible to balance and impossible to make not antifun. The issue with old akali was that she “wasn’t complex,” “lacked counterplay,” and “was antifun.” Well if you just look at akali before her pre mini rework, she was garbage early game, and only got strong mid game and stronger towards late game, but at end game fell off. As opposed to current akali who is just disproportioantely strong early then just garbage at all other times. There’s a reason why r/akalimains is asking for a revert.
: hopefully, people like you need to learn to pick a champ and not deviate ever your team comp is a lie you have no team, only 4 unkillable enemies taking your precious gold now go 1trick talon support
> [{quoted}](name=Hammermancer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ixoViujd,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-12-11T08:35:33.645+0000) > > hopefully, people like you need to learn to pick a champ and not deviate ever > > your team comp is a lie > > you have no team, only 4 unkillable enemies taking your precious gold > > now go 1trick talon support ~~the terrifying abomination that is rengar support~~
: Well, Riot turned the rest of the game into URF. They should do so with movement speed as well. And "skill shot" is subjective if you look at the width of Akali's "skill shots" that are harder to miss than a Ryze W.
> [{quoted}](name=Frontline Fury,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7J3IWrK8,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-12-11T10:34:38.969+0000) > > Well, Riot turned the rest of the game into URF. They should do so with movement speed as well. > > And "skill shot" is subjective if you look at the width of Akali's "skill shots" that are harder to miss than a Ryze W. Roughly the idea I had, yeah. A lot of these skillshots are actually hard to miss if you’re trying to hit them; that or your cdr is so high that you can spam it until something hits.
: Varus VO update would be something interesting
I’m still sore about how he’s uh, something something virtue signalling something somehing 3 men in one body. So no, thank you.
: if u want that item asp do thieving lucian
> [{quoted}](name=Bulletproof Car,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J16phEvl,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-12-11T06:54:49.450+0000) > > if u want that item asp do thieving lucian I think it’s trying to communicate guys!
Scrai (EUW)
: jax nerfed and still got a 53% winrate
> [{quoted}](name=Scrai,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AAlArNAg,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-12-11T01:03:15.029+0000) > > makes sense rework his stupid e or nerf him again That’s because 1) they didn’t nerf his early game or midgame 2) what makes him really broken is essence reaver 3) death’s dance now heals off his magic damage, so he now has a new great item for him. Ask yourself this, if his ult passive was removed, would jax still be good with his current state? The answer is probably yes, because of triforce, sterak’s, titanic hydra, and most importantly, essence reaver. He used to have issues with tanks, but now conqueror solves that issue for him.
: > [{quoted}](name=Pierce The Veal,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=000000010000000100000001,timestamp=2018-12-06T08:37:22.260+0000) > > No, no. The problem here isn’t just the punishment, but *why* it was doled out. Who was it who gave out the punishment? It’s not a matter of “inappropriate punishment” as much as it is a problem of *inappropriate moderator.* Moderators *will* make mistakes. We're humans, and we have a lot of stuff to go through. It's unfortunate and inconvenient when it happens, but no one is getting removed over an occasional mistake. In this case the moderator is aware the punishment was incorrectly applied, and that's sufficient, as it is not a common trend for that individual.
> [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=0000000100000001000000010000,timestamp=2018-12-06T12:57:44.169+0000) > > Moderators *will* make mistakes. We're humans, and we have a lot of stuff to go through. It's unfortunate and inconvenient when it happens, but no one is getting removed over an occasional mistake. In this case the moderator is aware the punishment was incorrectly applied, and that's sufficient, as it is not a common trend for that individual. That’s understandable and acceptable. If it is as you say and that moderator doesn’t normally make such mistakes, then I understand your stance.
: I think the total damage goes like 10->110->1110->11110->111110->this unit is invulnerable
> [{quoted}](name=ZackTheWaffleMan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MWQMs6ll,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-06T19:09:01.895+0000) > > I think the total damage goes like 10->110->1110->11110->111110->this unit is invulnerable Yeah it was something like so.
: It's a bit of a shame though, since some execute abilities show around 99999 damage being "dealt" which should technically still heal to full! That being said, would be incredibly overpowered, so if it doesn't, I am glad! ^^
> [{quoted}](name=IIIrd Bishop,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MWQMs6ll,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-12-06T19:13:27.329+0000) > > It's a bit of a shame though, since some execute abilities show around 99999 damage being "dealt" which should technically still heal to full! That being said, would be incredibly overpowered, so if it doesn't, I am glad! ^^ Yeah. It looks really cool though! But, ultimately, it is more for show than really the damage being dealt.
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Pierce The Veal

Level 123 (NA)
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