: > [{quoted}](name=Riot MoreChrono,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=fpLkakbA,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2019-05-31T17:18:08.815+0000) > > Announcement is here! https://nexus.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/2019/05/dev-state-of-clash/ In my opinion, it's really sad that Riot will change Clash to two separate one-day tournaments. The Clash idea was to play a "big e-sport tournament over several days". Now, it's only a small one-day tournament. One two-day tournament would be better than two one--day tournaments. So it's sad that Riot didn't choose a two-day tournament.
> [{quoted}](name=HyperionCH,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=fpLkakbA,comment-id=00070000,timestamp=2019-06-03T08:43:20.391+0000) > > In my opinion, it's really sad that Riot will change Clash to two separate one-day tournaments. > > The Clash idea was to play a "big e-sport tournament over several days". Now, it's only a small one-day tournament. > One two-day tournament would be better than two one--day tournaments. So it's sad that Riot didn't choose a two-day tournament. We might still go with a two-day (or three-day) format. This is just what we are trying to see if we can get it to work. It could definitely change in the future.
razorx009 (OCE)
: Clash
Announcement is here! https://nexus.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/2019/05/dev-state-of-clash/
Lkr (EUNE)
: Ranked armor bug on loading screen
Yeah sorry about that. We have a fix for this coming very soon!
razorx009 (OCE)
: Clash
I promise you I am not just memeing when I say, there will be more information about Clash SOON.
oNOVAo (NA)
: In Promos for Gold!!! So Excited!
Good luck! I hope it worked out for you. I have been trying to get to gold FOREVER.
: I know I shouldn't tag on a comment and a different situation like this, but could y'all possibly do a follow up on what caused a good chunk of games to crash at random? I'd love to know what caused it considering it happened to me in a ranked game none the less.
> [{quoted}](name=Ragnaveil,realm=NA,application-id=LqLKtMpN,discussion-id=YartxzMk,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2019-05-15T03:15:00.086+0000) > > I know I shouldn't tag on a comment and a different situation like this, but could y'all possibly do a follow up on what caused a good chunk of games to crash at random? I'd love to know what caused it considering it happened to me in a ranked game none the less. Sorry, I don't know what caused a bunch of games to crash randomly. I am only familiar with what caused Ranked to not be updating properly which was essentially we deployed the wrong thing.
: The problem about ranked.
Sorry about that. We had a little technical problem with the system. Don't worry, you will get the LP.
Cosnirak (NA)
: >It's not perfect, but we believe the player experience is better in the long run. This thread is a bunch of players giving you the feedback that at least for them, it's not better. I know you *know* that already. But I'm pointing it out because I want you to *feel* that and to remember it. The entire rating and match making system is massively flawed and not a good fit for League.
> [{quoted}](name=Cosnirak,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=0053,timestamp=2019-05-09T02:20:02.606+0000) > > This thread is a bunch of players giving you the feedback that at least for them, it's not better. I know you *know* that already. But I'm pointing it out because I want you to *feel* that and to remember it. > > The entire rating and match making system is massively flawed and not a good fit for League. Totally agree that for some people the system doesn't work. That why I am here reading and talking about it because we want to make it better. But it also does work for a lot of people. There are many many players that enjoy the ranked experience. That doesn't mean we can't improve. Definitely learning a lot front this thread.
Leonerdo (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Riot MoreChrono,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=0050000000010000,timestamp=2019-05-09T01:58:41.289+0000) > > I personally think this is the problem; players assume that rank and MMR are tied very closely together. And while they do work together, MMR tends to change quickly and wildly, while we purposely try to keep rank and LP much less volatile. This leads to some unfortunately side effects where two players who have similar MMRs will be have different ranks. It's not perfect, but we believe the player experience is better in the long run. This has been the issue since the very first day that the "League System" (ranking system) was introduced back in Season 2 (Edit: It was Season 3.) LP was invented to be a facade. And Rank was made to be based on LP (instead of MMR), so it's also a facade. They are arbitrary fabrications. They only matter in terms of player goals on the ranked ladder and cosmetic rewards. But for the purpose of matchmaking, LP and Rank are now entirely irrelevant. MMR is the only thing that controls matchmaking. A big part of the confusion is because MMR changes much more quickly than LP or Rank. Your Rank always lags behind your MMR since LP changes are more limited than MMR changes. That is the intended purpose of the system though. MMR is erratic; it's up and down all over the place. So the League system (and LP) was invented to smooth out the process of climbing (or falling) in Rank. What we end up with though, is a system that hints at MMR, but ultimately lies. People think they interpret their skill and the skill of thier allies/opponents by looking at rank, and they sort of can. But it's a crude estimation. It's a rounded number. And then when it becomes clear that the system isn't accurate (e.g. Plat player, Silver teammates, all secretly in Gold MMR), people are naturally confused and upset. So there's really only 3 ways we can move forward. 1. We do nothing, and people continue to be bamboozled by the League system, get angry, and make conspiracy theories. 2. Riot allows players to see their actually MMR, optionally of course. (We could completely revert the system and go back to MMR-based ranking alone, but I don't see that happening.) 3. Someone educates the playerbase, preferably in video format, because some nice animated graphs would make this SO much easier to explain. Of course such education campaigns never reach that many players. But if it's easily accessible to those who are looking for it, that might be enough. (Perhaps, link it in pinned thread on the Gameplay boards, so people can find it while looking for a place to rant? \*wink\*) Personally, I prefer option 2 over option 3. "Why not both?" is also a good option :))
> [{quoted}](name=Leonerdo,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=00500000000100000000,timestamp=2019-05-09T03:47:59.267+0000) > > This has been the issue since the very first day that the "League System" (ranking system) was introduced back in Season 2 (Edit: It was Season 3.) LP was invented to be a facade. And Rank was made to be based on LP (instead of MMR), so it's also a facade. They are arbitrary fabrications. They only matter in terms of player goals on the ranked ladder and cosmetic rewards. > > But for the purpose of matchmaking, LP and Rank are now entirely irrelevant. MMR is the only thing that controls matchmaking. > > A big part of the confusion is because MMR changes much more quickly than LP or Rank. Your Rank always lags behind your MMR since LP changes are more limited than MMR changes. That is the intended purpose of the system though. MMR is erratic; it's up and down all over the place. So the League system (and LP) was invented to smooth out the process of climbing (or falling) in Rank. > > What we end up with though, is a system that hints at MMR, but ultimately lies. People think they interpret their skill and the skill of thier allies/opponents by looking at rank, and they sort of can. But it's a crude estimation. It's a rounded number. And then when it becomes clear that the system isn't accurate (e.g. Plat player, Silver teammates, all secretly in Gold MMR), people are naturally confused and upset. > > So there's really only 3 ways we can move forward. > > 1. We do nothing, and people continue to be bamboozled by the League system, get angry, and make conspiracy theories. > 2. Riot allows players to see their actually MMR, optionally of course. (We could completely revert the system and go back to MMR-based ranking alone, but I don't see that happening.) > 3. Someone educates the playerbase, preferably in video format, because some nice animated graphs would make this SO much easier to explain. Of course such education campaigns never reach that many players. But if it's easily accessible to those who are looking for it, that might be enough. (Perhaps, link it in pinned thread on the Gameplay boards, so people can find it while looking for a place to rant? \*wink\*) > > Personally, I prefer option 2 over option 3. "Why not both?" is also a good option :)) I am definitely in favor of talking about it more. Education is key! Great suggestion.
Cdore (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Riot MoreChrono,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=00500000,timestamp=2019-05-08T16:48:29.882+0000) > > It is true that we do want to keep queue times as short as we can. However, we do monitor the within-team and between-team MMR differences very closely to ensure that the games are still even. Let's take Gold 2 as an example, the average within-team MMR difference in NA is 40 MMR and between-team difference is 3 MMR. For context, the entirety of the MMR difference in Gold 2 is 81 MMR I respect your response, but I feel like there's a lot of information that needs to be addressed in order to understand the context of why MMR difference matters specifically just in Gold 2. [](https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/59af2189c534a58c97bd63b3/1555348895999-MV37603ZAHK81Z2SZHJ1/league+of+legends+rank+distribution+April+2019.jpg?content-type=image%2Fjpeg) Using our topic creator as an example, he was wondering why there is a Plat in his matchmaking. The general answer is that the plat is there to even out elo averages between both teams, but to understand where that flaw comes from, we have to understand why he is there to begin with. You've already pinpointed that you guys strive for short wait times. And you gave your response to show that the difference between matchmade teams tend to be small. But you leave out, not a fault of your own, the problem of tier distribution, duos, and the way the endpoints of each rank tend to work out in solo queue. If you will stay with me for a moment, and if OP is reading, let me explain where the problem comes from. I'll just put on my data science glasses before I do. {{champion:74}} The highest amount of League's playerbase in ranked sits in Silver. The second highest is in Gold. The third highest is in bronze. Fourth is plat. What we can already conclude based on just raw numbers is that silver, gold, and bronze will always have the most lucrative queue times and possible team permutations due to what roles people choose. It's why currently from Diamond 1 to Challenger, they have the most autofills. It's just basic population. In this respect, we can already see that the ranks where you'll have the biggest discrepancies of matchmaking is Plat and onward based on sheer population. In order to balance out wait times, naturally, Bronze, Iron, and Plat+ have to draw closer to the median pool of the ranked queue. You will have plats or silvers in Gold games. And the closer you get to Plat 4, your matchmaking starts to have Gold 2s, Gold 1s, Plats 4, and Plats 3, and sometimes Plat 2s. This is very important because suddenly, you have a major jump in variance. This variance can be explained by two things: the willingness to have short queue times and the nature of the two two tiers of every rank. Silver 1, Gold 1, and every 1 tier after has the lowest amount of people in it. Why? Cause the variance is so strong here between both ranks that Tier 1 is just a transitional period. You will either rise to the next rank or fall back to Tier 2 simply due to being stuck between two major skill variances. All of this information comes together to explain why OP feels the way he does, and I feel like you know already why this is the case. **The mmr system does not line up with the noise that is Tier 1-Tier 4 of next rank relationship, the presence of duos, the forcing of quick matchmaking times, and the natural median of the playerbase.** LP gains care about one thing: whether your team won or loss. For each person, it seems to take into account amount of games you played and that's about it. This kind of system would be fine in a game where your individual performance was ranked or the above issues in bold were not present. But since Riot has chosen to use a 1v1 mmr system for a team based game, ShirleyG's complaints are very real. In an ideal world, you will have no more than two tiers of difference, and that should be an exception, of the players on your team. Everyone should always be at the same tier as you to make matchmaking truly fair. I don't think it's **true fairness**, but in the context of this system, it makes the most sense. But that also assumes, what you already know, that we always have people only and that all ranks have a large enough playerbase who each all play various roles to never have to autofill. But as we know, autofill exists BECAUSE the roles of this game are disproportionately represented. Supports are the least played role while mid/ adc are the most played. These vary based on rank, but overall, this has been the general case of where most of Riot's design decisions came from sense before Season 1. I was there around the boards when Rioters specifically made cases about this proportion representation of the playerbase, and why certain classes are more popular. That's fine, that's the nature of a video game. Some people play different roles. Unfortunately, I feel like Riot screwed up things when they attempted to upset the natural order of this to force quicker matchmaking. And thus, you have irons in Silver games, you have silvers in gold games, you have golds in plat games, and you plats in diamond games, and you have diamonds in master, GM, and Challenger. I actually thought dynamic queue was better in the sense that if you had a long wait time on your role, you would change to another simply to have quicker matchmaking on your own decision. This is a much better way to do it than forcing people into matchmaking simply to keep people from getting bored. @ShirleyG: You are in gold. You are good at the game. You are where only the second amount of people are. You are within the top 30% of the players of the game. You are not bad enough where you are in silver, bronze, or iron, which is where the amateurs and casuals sit. You are above them. You know the game on a higher level and you're good at the role you do. Based on all that I have written, I am going to give you an answer that is more realistic with how solo queue works and League of Legends. I've been gold since season 4, and have been playing since 2010. I follow the competitive scene and yet never got to Plat or above, though I've nearly gotten to Plat last and this season. I am not a pro, but most people in solo queue aren't except for the elite at Diamond 1 and above. But I'm not stupid either. Solo queue is a magical land that goes against the fundamentals of 5v5s. You do not have communication, you do not have a set team, you do not have practiced routines with four others over and over like competitive, you never met any of the people you queue with, and sometimes you run into smurfs from other ranks or you run into duos who are using the advantage of better communication and coordination. These facts of solo queue show that there is a distinct way of "carrying" that will win you games faster and higher in wr than others. Supports are among one of the worst roles to climb with. They depend too much on the team, and it explains why Brand, Zyra, and Pyke are among the favorite supports to carry with: cause they focus on killing people rather than the support duties of bodyguarding, getting vision, removing vision, and other utility functions. In this respect, utility playstyles and champs are the worst ways to climb in solo queue. Now let's look at how smurfs climb. They choose champs that can 1v5, splitpush hard, and or do things that has little dependency from their own team. They choose Draven, they choose Irelia, they choose Riven, they choose Lee Sin, they choose Ahri, they choose any champ that can make a play on their own or draw huge team pressure for little risk. In this respect, solo queue is a game about who can carry the hardest by abusing all the issues that solo queue brings vs being in a competitive game. You being in gold doesn't mean you are bad at the game. It means that your playstyle and champ pool are currently not meta enough to get you higher. I'm not going to tell you to settle for gold, but I will tell you that climbing involves playing to win, and that means learning the game in a completely different matter to what anyone else has told you. tl;dr: Play the game as if your team will always be irrelevant. Play the game knowing that the variance toward higher tiers causes harder games. Not for your own fault, but because the system doesn't gradually push you into higher ranked games. For instance, promo games intentionally team mixmatch players. This has been a fact no one can deny. The real way to do promos is to just keep matching the player up like normal. Let them slide themselves into plat or whatever rank is next rather than throwing them into the middle of the sea and hoping the RNG gods give them all that they need.
> [{quoted}](name=Cdore,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=005000000001,timestamp=2019-05-09T00:53:12.364+0000) > > I respect your response, but I feel like there's a lot of information that needs to be addressed in order to understand the context of why MMR difference matters specifically just in Gold 2. > > [](https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/59af2189c534a58c97bd63b3/1555348895999-MV37603ZAHK81Z2SZHJ1/league+of+legends+rank+distribution+April+2019.jpg?content-type=image%2Fjpeg) > > Using our topic creator as an example, he was wondering why there is a Plat in his matchmaking. The general answer is that the plat is there to even out elo averages between both teams, but to understand where that flaw comes from, we have to understand why he is there to begin with. > > You've already pinpointed that you guys strive for short wait times. And you gave your response to show that the difference between matchmade teams tend to be small. But you leave out, not a fault of your own, the problem of tier distribution, duos, and the way the endpoints of each rank tend to work out in solo queue. If you will stay with me for a moment, and if OP is reading, let me explain where the problem comes from. I'll just put on my data science glasses before I do. > > {{champion:74}} > > The highest amount of League's playerbase in ranked sits in Silver. The second highest is in Gold. The third highest is in bronze. Fourth is plat. What we can already conclude based on just raw numbers is that silver, gold, and bronze will always have the most lucrative queue times and possible team permutations due to what roles people choose. It's why currently from Diamond 1 to Challenger, they have the most autofills. It's just basic population. In this respect, we can already see that the ranks where you'll have the biggest discrepancies of matchmaking is Plat and onward based on sheer population. In order to balance out wait times, naturally, Bronze, Iron, and Plat+ have to draw closer to the median pool of the ranked queue. You will have plats or silvers in Gold games. And the closer you get to Plat 4, your matchmaking starts to have Gold 2s, Gold 1s, Plats 4, and Plats 3, and sometimes Plat 2s. This is very important because suddenly, you have a major jump in variance. > > This variance can be explained by two things: the willingness to have short queue times and the nature of the two two tiers of every rank. Silver 1, Gold 1, and every 1 tier after has the lowest amount of people in it. Why? Cause the variance is so strong here between both ranks that Tier 1 is just a transitional period. You will either rise to the next rank or fall back to Tier 2 simply due to being stuck between two major skill variances. All of this information comes together to explain why OP feels the way he does, and I feel like you know already why this is the case. > > **The mmr system does not line up with the noise that is Tier 1-Tier 4 of next rank relationship, the presence of duos, the forcing of quick matchmaking times, and the natural median of the playerbase.** > > LP gains care about one thing: whether your team won or loss. For each person, it seems to take into account amount of games you played and that's about it. This kind of system would be fine in a game where your individual performance was ranked or the above issues in bold were not present. But since Riot has chosen to use a 1v1 mmr system for a team based game, ShirleyG's complaints are very real. In an ideal world, you will have no more than two tiers of difference, and that should be an exception, of the players on your team. Everyone should always be at the same tier as you to make matchmaking truly fair. I don't think it's **true fairness**, but in the context of this system, it makes the most sense. But that also assumes, what you already know, that we always have people only and that all ranks have a large enough playerbase who each all play various roles to never have to autofill. But as we know, autofill exists BECAUSE the roles of this game are disproportionately represented. Supports are the least played role while mid/ adc are the most played. These vary based on rank, but overall, this has been the general case of where most of Riot's design decisions came from sense before Season 1. I was there around the boards when Rioters specifically made cases about this proportion representation of the playerbase, and why certain classes are more popular. That's fine, that's the nature of a video game. Some people play different roles. Unfortunately, I feel like Riot screwed up things when they attempted to upset the natural order of this to force quicker matchmaking. And thus, you have irons in Silver games, you have silvers in gold games, you have golds in plat games, and you plats in diamond games, and you have diamonds in master, GM, and Challenger. I actually thought dynamic queue was better in the sense that if you had a long wait time on your role, you would change to another simply to have quicker matchmaking on your own decision. This is a much better way to do it than forcing people into matchmaking simply to keep people from getting bored. > Very well thought out response. Some of it is right on, but some of it is not quite reality (and this isn't your fault, you don't have all the information). I want to focus specifically queue times, distribution and skill variance. Queue times is not our only goal, as I said before, we want short queue times with fair games. If we were truly forcing the fastest queue times we wouldn't bother matchmaking at all, we would just put people into games as they showed up. Those games would probably suck. What we are doing is allowing for some acceptable variance within teams and between teams. You are totally right that at higher tiers, with less population, this acceptable variance gets larger, but it's still not an enormous amount despite what a players ranking might tell you. I personally think this is the problem; players assume that rank and MMR are tied very closely together. And while they do work together, MMR tends to change quickly and wildly, while we purposely try to keep rank and LP much less volatile. This leads to some unfortunately side effects where two players who have similar MMRs will be have different ranks. It's not perfect, but we believe the player experience is better in the long run. Also, anecdotally, the skill variance at the top of a tier and the bottom of the tier are not all that different. The main reason you see lots of people at the bottom of a tier and less at the top is purely a player motivation one. Lots of players get into new tiers and stop playing (or they end up at 0 LP and stop playing), meanwhile players who are in division 1 of a tier tend to play a lot because they are so close to getting to the next goal. There is no massive jump in variance between tiers.
: > [{quoted}](name=Riot MoreChrono,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=0050000000000000,timestamp=2019-05-08T20:39:13.160+0000) > > Thanks! When it comes to detecting intentional feeding, I don't really know the answer because there is a completely different group of people working on that. When it comes to the case of leavers and leaver buster, it's a hard question. The reason we don't do it now is quite simply it could very easily be abused (Game isn't going very well, teammates start pressuring other teammates to leave so they get reduced LP loss). Now, that isn't to say that we won't ever do anything, but we aren't doing anything right now and the team that manages all of this negative player behavior stuff isn't my team. I know it's not the best answer, but it's the answer that I've got. Gotcha. I'm a manager myself and it can be tough when people have huge questions that your department simply doesn't deal with! ha ha. I'm very curious about learning about the systems that detect the trolling that people often associate with loss streaks, especially in low elo. While the system detects verbal abuse and the like very well I feel, it's hard to figure out how you guys would detect things like intentional feeding, soft inting or cs stealing. At those points, players are using the very boundaries of the game to screw with their teammates. If possible, could you send an email or something to that team to lay out for players what the current game looks like, what they are aware of, and what they are trying to fix and how? I'm very interested how they've considered going about it and what hurdles they are fighting with if nothing else. I can't speak for everyone, and this is probably an isolated experience, but I have so many games where it feels like someone is skirting that line between having a bad game, and out right trolling.
> [{quoted}](name=Mavëríck,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=00500000000000000000,timestamp=2019-05-08T20:51:04.675+0000) > > Gotcha. I'm a manager myself and it can be tough when people have huge questions that your department simply doesn't deal with! ha ha. > > I'm very curious about learning about the systems that detect the trolling that people often associate with loss streaks, especially in low elo. While the system detects verbal abuse and the like very well I feel, it's hard to figure out how you guys would detect things like intentional feeding, soft inting or cs stealing. At those points, players are using the very boundaries of the game to screw with their teammates. > > If possible, could you send an email or something to that team to lay out for players what the current game looks like, what they are aware of, and what they are trying to fix and how? I'm very interested how they've considered going about it and what hurdles they are fighting with if nothing else. I can't speak for everyone, and this is probably an isolated experience, but I have so many games where it feels like someone is skirting that line between having a bad game, and out right trolling. There isn't really a way to get directly in contact with teams like that. I think he best thing you can do is make a post about it. If you do that, drop a link to it in a reply to me and I will see if I can get someone to come answer a few questions. Can't guarantee they will (they are super busy), but they might.
: > [{quoted}](name=Riot MoreChrono,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=00500000,timestamp=2019-05-08T16:48:29.882+0000) > > It is true that we do want to keep queue times as short as we can. However, we do monitor the within-team and between-team MMR differences very closely to ensure that the games are still even. Let's take Gold 2 as an example, the average within-team MMR difference in NA is 40 MMR and between-team difference is 3 MMR. For context, the entirety of the MMR difference in Gold 2 is 81 MMR Chrono, I appreciate you laying everything out for us. I personally have had many of my misconceptions about match making as it stands, debunked and feel better about it. Question though. What sorts of systems are in place to detect intentional feeding and why isn't there something like loss forgiven or reduced LP loss in the case of leavers that have been marked by leaver buster in ranked? I'm not accusing or trying to box you in. Honest question.
> [{quoted}](name=Mavëríck,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=005000000000,timestamp=2019-05-08T20:09:27.654+0000) > > Chrono, > > I appreciate you laying everything out for us. I personally have had many of my misconceptions about match making as it stands, debunked and feel better about it. > > Question though. What sorts of systems are in place to detect intentional feeding and why isn't there something like loss forgiven or reduced LP loss in the case of leavers that have been marked by leaver buster in ranked? I'm not accusing or trying to box you in. Honest question. Thanks! When it comes to detecting intentional feeding, I don't really know the answer because there is a completely different group of people working on that. When it comes to the case of leavers and leaver buster, it's a hard question. The reason we don't do it now is quite simply it could very easily be abused (Game isn't going very well, teammates start pressuring other teammates to leave so they get reduced LP loss). Now, that isn't to say that we won't ever do anything, but we aren't doing anything right now and the team that manages all of this negative player behavior stuff isn't my team. I know it's not the best answer, but it's the answer that I've got.
Cdore (NA)
: I think what is being left out here is that Riot has "short wait times" in their design philosophy. So they sacrifice matching you with the most even skilled teams they can for the sake of getting you into games quicker. There is no doubt about this, which is why I believe OP's concerns are valid.
> [{quoted}](name=Cdore,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=0050,timestamp=2019-05-08T16:07:10.858+0000) > > I think what is being left out here is that Riot has "short wait times" in their design philosophy. So they sacrifice matching you with the most even skilled teams they can for the sake of getting you into games quicker. There is no doubt about this, which is why I believe OP's concerns are valid. It is true that we do want to keep queue times as short as we can. However, we do monitor the within-team and between-team MMR differences very closely to ensure that the games are still even. Let's take Gold 2 as an example, the average within-team MMR difference in NA is 40 MMR and between-team difference is 3 MMR. For context, the entirety of the MMR difference in Gold 2 is 81 MMR
: > [{quoted}](name=Riot MoreChrono,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=002a0007000000000000,timestamp=2019-05-07T22:52:36.576+0000) > > I totally respect that it might feel that way, but in reality it just isn't true. Streaking is not a concept in matchmaking for League. Every winstreak will eventually end in a loss. People often remember losses much more clearly than they remember wins. It's just as likely that in every game you won, there was an equally outmatched player on your team, you were just able to claim victory so them being outmatched doesn't matter to you. However, when you lose, it matters a lot, so you remember it. I've spent a lot of time trying to debunk those misconceptions, and I think here's a point that Riot should highlight and emphasize much more: after a win-streak, your MMR increases and you **do** get harder games, that's true and normal, and it's important to acknowledge it. But it is NOT because you get worse teammates, **it is because you get better opponents.** In fact, you *also* get better team-mates, everyone in those games is better. Part of the problem is that a lot of players imagine there is a "skill pie" to share between all team-mates, and if they get better, they take a bigger share of the pie and their team-mates get worse in compensation. What they forget is that the total size of the pie increases, and as a result every player always has a 20% share of their team. (Premades excluded, but that's a whole another story.)
> [{quoted}](name=DeathBurst,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=002a00070000000000000001,timestamp=2019-05-08T09:11:34.841+0000) > > I've spent a lot of time trying to debunk those misconceptions, and I think here's a point that Riot should highlight and emphasize much more: after a win-streak, your MMR increases and you **do** get harder games, that's true and normal, and it's important to acknowledge it. But it is NOT because you get worse teammates, **it is because you get better opponents.** In fact, you *also* get better team-mates, everyone in those games is better. > > Part of the problem is that a lot of players imagine there is a "skill pie" to share between all team-mates, and if they get better, they take a bigger share of the pie and their team-mates get worse in compensation. What they forget is that the total size of the pie increases, and as a result every player always has a 20% share of their team. (Premades excluded, but that's a whole another story.) This is a very good assessment.
: @RiotGames Please Do something About this
Again, winrate is not part of the equation at all. Ever.
: > [{quoted}](name=Riot MoreChrono,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=002a00070000,timestamp=2019-05-07T18:12:59.041+0000) > > There is MMR decay but it is nothing like decay in ranked. It takes a very long time to even start decaying from inactivity and the amount of that decay is much slower. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > I have taken a look at the system in general and everything appears to be working as intended. I couldn't find your "other" account, so I couldn't look into your case specifically but based on what you are showing and what you have said, I can guess what's happening. > > The difference in MMR between P4 and G2 is probably not as big as you think it is, which is why you see plat players in your games. > > Also, winrate isn't a factor in matchmaking. Essentially what is happening is this; you, with a high winrate at your MMR (climbing), are occasionally meeting up with players that have a low winrate (falling) at the same MMR. I get that this is frustrating, but we can't just group all the high winrate players together and all the low winrate players together. Low winrate can be explained in a lot of ways. Could just be a bad start to the season, or players trying a new role/champion, there are MANY factors that could lead to a difference in winrate at the same MMR. The MMR number is the only thing that matters in matchmaking. > > The reality is that if you have a high winrate then your MMR is going up relative to what your rank indicates. You will be gaining lots of LP on wins and not losing very much for losses. The system is trying to move you up. Are you going to win every game? No. Are you always going to be matched with people that are the same rank as you? No, because they are not the same MMR as you and again MMR is all that matters for matchmaking. So my only gripe with win rate matchmaking is that if you are on a streak after the third game or so you will get a bad teammate. It seems after every three-game win streak you are given a teammate that clearly is not playing to the best of their ability or is just totally outmatched. I wouldn't care but it happens too often after a streak for it to be a coincidence. It honestly feels that if you are a player that wins more the games will only get harder as your teammates will get worse.
> [{quoted}](name=Boo Koo God,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=002a000700000000,timestamp=2019-05-07T22:17:23.737+0000) > > So my only gripe with win rate matchmaking is that if you are on a streak after the third game or so you will get a bad teammate. It seems after every three-game win streak you are given a teammate that clearly is not playing to the best of their ability or is just totally outmatched. I wouldn't care but it happens too often after a streak for it to be a coincidence. It honestly feels that if you are a player that wins more the games will only get harder as your teammates will get worse. I totally respect that it might feel that way, but in reality it just isn't true. Streaking is not a concept in matchmaking for League. Every winstreak will eventually end in a loss. People often remember losses much more clearly than they remember wins. It's just as likely that in every game you won, there was an equally outmatched player on your team, you were just able to claim victory so them being outmatched doesn't matter to you. However, when you lose, it matters a lot, so you remember it.
: > [{quoted}](name=Riot MoreChrono,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=002a,timestamp=2019-05-06T03:46:53.698+0000) > > Gonna take a look at this tomorrow and see if something strange is going on. If your mmr is greater than your displayed rank And you don't play for a while (or a day or two) Does your mmr decay and start moving closer to your actual rank? I know you have rank decay in diamond+, but that just decays your displayed rank right? Is there a mmr decay?
> [{quoted}](name=ShirleyfG,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Eak7Kd7P,comment-id=002a0007,timestamp=2019-05-07T03:10:38.961+0000) > > If your mmr is greater than your displayed rank > > And you don't play for a while (or a day or two) > > Does your mmr decay and start moving closer to your actual rank? > > I know you have rank decay in diamond+, but that just decays your displayed rank right? > > Is there a mmr decay? There is MMR decay but it is nothing like decay in ranked. It takes a very long time to even start decaying from inactivity and the amount of that decay is much slower. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- I have taken a look at the system in general and everything appears to be working as intended. I couldn't find your "other" account, so I couldn't look into your case specifically but based on what you are showing and what you have said, I can guess what's happening. The difference in MMR between P4 and G2 is probably not as big as you think it is, which is why you see plat players in your games. Also, winrate isn't a factor in matchmaking. Essentially what is happening is this; you, with a high winrate at your MMR (climbing), are occasionally meeting up with players that have a low winrate (falling) at the same MMR. I get that this is frustrating, but we can't just group all the high winrate players together and all the low winrate players together. Low winrate can be explained in a lot of ways. Could just be a bad start to the season, or players trying a new role/champion, there are MANY factors that could lead to difference in winrate at the same MMR. The MMR number is the only thing that matters in matchmaking. The reality is that if you have a high winrate then your MMR is going up relative to what your rank indicates. You will be gaining lots of LP on wins and not losing very much for losses. The system is trying to move you up. Are you going to win every game? No. Are you always going to be matched with people that are the same rank as you? No, because they are not the same MMR as you and again MMR is all that matters for matchmaking.
: @RiotGames Please Do something About this
Gonna take a look at this tomorrow and see if something strange is going on.
: I may be misreading op but it looks like s/he said "once you're out" implying that they wouldn't have anymore games to play.
Yep, I totally misread. Spectating once you are out should totally be a thing.
: I don't know if this is too much extra dev work, but I thought this would be a great feature addition. While playing in your bracket, once your out, you get the ability to spectate the remaining games. {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-thumbs}}
We talked about this a lot and it boiled down to was we don't have a reliable way to get you out of spectating and we definitely don't want you to miss your match.
: Lets get those community vs rioters games going again so i can ban Bard in one for all again ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ノ
: {{item:3115}} {{item:3124}} {{item:3153}} {{item:3091}} {{item:3116}}
: {{champion:122}} You guys created this monster... .. and now you're gunna pay for it. {{sticker:slayer-jinx-wink}}
Watched a Darius Bot 1v1 a co-worker in a game just the other day. Darius Bot is so OP.
L4T3NCY (NA)
: You.. ...you're not welcome here...
L4T3NCY (NA)
: ONE FOR ALL challenge: Rioters VS Players. Friday 16/9 @6PM PST.
It would appear that Bard is the only champion available for me to select at this time.
: Welp Hope your bodies are prepared! I'm bringing friends! In other News; Bucket List: - Get talked too by a Rioter (CHECK!) - Play with a Rioter (We Will See!)
: I guess I'll try to get in... But having a Timezone on that 4PM Would be GREAT {{sticker:slayer-jinx-wink}}
: How does Nexus Siege differ from a normal game?
So so many ways. It's still super fun though, it shares that. http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/featured/nexus-siege
: HOW ABOUT A SHACO???
arc95 (NA)
: can you put the mastery score back under the portrait?
Hey all, The total amount of CXP (and the gold border) have always only appeared at the highest mastery rank, which is now 7. When you get there the point totals and sweet goldness will be back.
: Hextech ward skin unlock pictures are the wrong size
Yep, we noticed this little snafu and it should be fixed in the next patch.
: But then again so far I've only opened three chests in my time since the release of the system, and one was the Gift chest to "celebrate" the release. Maybe I'm mistaken but I don't believe so. Because I only remember getting Assassin Yi and Katarina and maybe another skin (I disenchanted all, leaving me at 458 blue and 2331 orange essence). One of them was even a gemstone I converted into a chest and key (because I don't really enjoy playing Annie) I can't tell though, because I don't know the essence values by heart and maybe there are more than just a champion and 2 skins in there, but I'm not sure. And to clarify this is no run for free content. I'm just trying to understand the exact mechanics of the system, specifically in my situation now. Sorry if I'm being a bother but I was just kinda frustrated with my inability to get my own chest:) Best wishes TheZer0Craft
Our records show you have opened 4 chests that were earned via Champion Mastery. 1st Chest: Katarina 2nd Chest: Snowman Ward 3rd Chest: Nightmare Cho'Gath and Gemstone 4th Chest: Demonblade Tryndamere (this was the chest you received from the Gemstone) So it looks like they have been granted properly and opened already, at least according to the 3 champions you referenced in the post. This guide might be able to provide more answers: https://support.riotgames.com/hc/en-us/articles/207884233-Hextech-Crafting-Guide
: Dear Riot MoreChrono Seeing your answer to this post with the border on the champions page and the golden chest in the corner I was wondering if it counts as earning a chest on your champion, if one of your pre-made friends earns an S rank and makes you get a chest? Because until recently I have not gotten an S rank on any my two mains {{champion:203}} {{champion:202}} Now I have though, and I did not receive any chests. I went to check my champions page and on the two before mentioned and {{champion:136}} I seem to already have earned a chest. And yes, I am 100% sure that I have not earned S ranks on any of these before this weekend. On Aurelion I have yet to earn one. Thank you for taking the time to read this and hopefully you can help me:) Best wishes TheZer0Craft
Yep, it counts for however you earned the chest for that particular champion regardless of actual grade. So, just like you experienced with Kindred and Jhin, those chests had been earned before you yourself earned the S.
: Hextech crafting not rewarding new content
Hey DyNasty Royal, Unfortunately, the functionality that you saw on PBE was actually a bug in the system and was not intended to work that way. The goal is to always give you permanent content of the same type that you rerolled. However, if you do own all of that content (like in your case) all we can do is give you another random permanent. This can still be disenchanted into more dust that normal shard content or saved to reroll, but the best advice is to just hold onto it until something new that you do want comes out.
Jolg (NA)
: It is nice on our champions page but can we also get the border in Champion Select? Small QoL change that would be awesome.
We are looking at possible solutions for this. Champ select can be a pretty busy place and we don't want to push out other information, but it is on our radar.
Kei143 (NA)
: Can we make it so that we can see which champs have a chest already in champ select?
We are looking at possible solutions for this. Champ select can be a pretty busy place and we don't want to push out other information, but it is on our radar.
: > [{quoted}](name=Riot MoreChrono,realm=NA,application-id=LqLKtMpN,discussion-id=GdO2loEh,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-04-26T00:06:55.493+0000) > > I think the problem might be that they are playing champions that they have already earned chests on. For example, I see chests earned on Soraka and Miss Fortune, so they are being granted. But playing these champions again and getting an S will not result in another chest. I don't know if you can answer this or not, but is there a way that we can see the champions that we've already earned chests from? I don't have a main champ or role, so I have no idea what champs I have chests on and which I don't.
Yep, just like Randomonium described, there is a border around the champions on the Champions page. Also, if you hover over the champion, the tool tip will have a gold chest in the lower right hand corner if you have earned one for that champion.
: Not Winning Any Hextech Chests
I think the problem might be that they are playing champions that they have already earned chests on. For example, I see chests earned on Soraka and Miss Fortune, so they are being granted. But playing these champions again and getting an S will not result in another chest.
: No Hextech Chest from S rank
Hey xBLiNDBoi, I did some looking into this and it appears you earned a chest for Morgana with an awesome game on 3/29, which is why you didn't get the chest for her on 4/20
: Never a better place or time to get used to commanding the ball, imo. Considering how much you'll be spamming QWE :3
: Never a better place or time to get used to commanding the ball, imo. Considering how much you'll be spamming QWE :3
: I can imagine that a wall of pretty, magical cc is hard to beat
: That's why I play Ori :D
Man. What I wouldn't give to be good at Ori. Maybe Urf is the place to give it a try!
: 100% uptime speed buff and shield is also pretty handy =P
: https://media.giphy.com/media/xT1XGxsDUyNZpF3ZZK/giphy.gif
: This is the day you'll regret making fizz. {{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}{{champion:105}}
Hmmmmm, I detect a first ban suggestion in this comment.
L4T3NCY (NA)
: URF CHALLENGE: Rioters VS Players. Friday 22/4 @6PM PST.
: > [{quoted}](name=Riot KateyKhaos,realm=NA,application-id=mNBeEEkI,discussion-id=oEpWkdwO,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2016-04-06T00:30:10.653+0000) > > Since Heartseeker Orianna came out recently, it'll probably be a bit until her next skin. :) @KateyKhaos do you know if there are any plans involving more uses for gemstones other than just hextech annie and crafting more boxes and keys? Is there any talk about other exclusive skins obtainable only through the gemstones or anything of interest? Basically if I have some extra gemstones is it safe to go ahead and forge them into chests or will other amazing stuff come out that will make me hate myself for not saving them?
> [{quoted}](name=videorfeak,realm=NA,application-id=mNBeEEkI,discussion-id=oEpWkdwO,comment-id=000100000002,timestamp=2016-04-06T03:50:12.750+0000) > > @KateyKhaos do you know if there are any plans involving more uses for gemstones other than just hextech annie and crafting more boxes and keys? Is there any talk about other exclusive skins obtainable only through the gemstones or anything of interest? Basically if I have some extra gemstones is it safe to go ahead and forge them into chests or will other amazing stuff come out that will make me hate myself for not saving them? Hey videorfeak, Currently, Annie is a test and we still aren't sure how we will be using gemstones in the future. We want to see how much players like it and what kind of content fits best. It's up to you whether you want to hold onto the gemstone or wait for other content though.
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Riot MoreChrono

Level 111 (NA)
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