Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: June 14
Since when is counter jungling something Nunu/Karthus combos seek out? It barely ever happens with those two. Karthus takes "most of the friendly jungle", yes, but there's a reason why Nunu doesn't necessarily buy the jungle items at all. He uses Consume to help Karthus get strong through his relatively weak early clear, then to get Relic Shield procs.
DrWiz4rd (NA)
: the devs like Lux tho, can't you tell?
you mean her new skins every 6 months since launch?
Jantessa (NA)
: They should have left it before the buff. I also loved promote, and I liked it living on as a niche item that I could pick to counter fed AP tops. (Eg malphite top running away with the game because of awesome engaged? Now he is stuck bot clearing the banner and we can start a fight.) Riot buffing it to the point of breaking and then just deleting it is sad.
"The item wasn't bought enough when it wasn't OP, because people didn't understand when it was useful" That's NOT a reason to remove it from the game. Just revert it to that state, while people remember it's a thing and might still buy it, and have a chance to be underwhelmed in the wrong situations. It'll hit the right use rate in no time.
òwò (NA)
: Ah the riot special, nerf items nerfs users in the same patch and they are at the bottom of the pit
Then say "what happened???" and undo everything next patch, instead of reverting one change.
: you forgot one, zyra is gonna be strong now wooo {{champion:143}}
She's been strong.
: I've seen very few games going as short as 20 minutes, personally.
People give up in 15 minutes half the time now, in my experience. Down 2 kills? /all GG. Lose a 3v3 at dragon? /all GG.
: You don't see her because she's a pick for coordinated, competitive teams. Her winrate is sub-50% because it should be, because she's not meant to be an easy champion to play optimally. Neither of these facts change that her kit is one of the most all-encompassing of any mage in the entire game. If she loses a bit of her shield, she still has a much more versatile kit than almost any mage in the entire roster to fall back on (if not the *most* versatile).
3.38% pick rate is 18th of 48(using the KR server stats), which sounds pretty decent. But because 2 champions are played mid each game, you have an effective 1.69% play rate(as in, 1.69% of champions played mid are Ori, but she's played in 3.38% of games), so that's closer to 1/60 champions played are Ori. Meanwhile, her ban rate is only .2%, which is 118th of 141, and 33rd among 48 champions for mid(yes, that seems off, but w/e, op.gg), so it's not exactly a major impact on the numbers. And, of COURSE most players haven't played more than 50 games of her, mid lane is only 1/5th of players, and how many players have played enough ranked games to have more than 50 JUST on Ori? 48% win rate at a pick/ban rate below 5% is buff territory IMO. If mains alone can't win more than 48%, when they only track Plat+ stats, the champion is not strong. A "safe" mid shouldn't vary between 48.5% and 51.5% EVER unless they are garbage or busted. @SeeYouSpaceASol
: lol byeeeeeeeeeeee Fortnite is trash lol. Literally play any other decent battle royal if you really want to ;/
: It's not dying. Lul
It's certainly not growing, let me tell you.
: Path variation goal: success. Sorry we're stepping on your toes. I imagine if you're breaking from the standard meta clears currently, there'll be even more room for you to explore and outmaneuver the enemy jungler in the future. Generally speaking, we've seen notably less quick gank routes in our playtests. I imagine your route would still be quite surprising to laners, and therefore more likely to succeed.
... that's not path variation, that's just changing the standard path.
: Upcoming Jungle Changes for 8.10
(Stop removing the ability to prioritize gaining vision from the game. As a support player, removing Sightstone means I can't guarantee I get sufficient wards until after 15 minutes, in the case that I'm playing a Relic support, and my ADC doesn't let me last-hit, and the laners on my teams already didn't ward. Now junglers don't have an item that gives wards, and now have lost 1/2 of the monsters that grant vision. It's madness. This kind of awful design guarantees binary play, where lack of vision means either 100% passive play, or 100% active play, especially in the first 15 minutes of the game, when supports often won't have ward active.) Never mind how this will eliminate non-early game junglers from the competitive pool AGAIN. If you can't get level 3 fast or win a duel at level 2, you're basically useless with this change. And you keep having to restructure the jungle because you made the buff camps be the center of jungle pathing by making them so strong, but you don't want them to be the center of pathing, and you can't figure out the really simple cause-and-effect that sets up. It's like when you made baron give extra stats, or dragon give a bunch of gold; players and teams will (generally) beeline to the most obvious, immediate bonus, and center their gameplay around that. You don't remove focus on buffs by removing another valuable monster: you weaken the buffs or bring them more in line with other camps in terms of XP, or make the XP less to make up for how valuable the buff is, so that junglers who are better against one monster at a time get buffs to help them clear easier, while junglers with better 1vX monster clear get more XP as a bonus, instead. It feels like the people responsible for jungle changes over the 5 years I've been playing LoL are people who don't understand economics, specifically opportunity cost. Because, ultimately, that's what early game jungle pathing is. You weigh the possible actions you can take, and, ideally, act in the way that grants you the most possible power in that time, whether that's XP, gold, objectives, etc. The reason buff-camp-buff is prevalent is because 1. the efficiency of the route means the least time spent doing nothing on first clear, 2. lack of viable alternatives (specifically, lack of efficient secondary camps and lack of vision security around objectives making early dragons a coin flip(unless you pull bot lane, and lose them pressure/tower/gold and XP), especially after this change), and 3. Most junglers who are relevant in later stages of the game require buffs to clear early on, due to the way they scale, or they otherwise fall levels behind and instantly lose. Changes like this one show that there is a clear lack of understanding as to the role of the jungle by the very people designing it.
: ???? Better system for getting wards. New support item to make up for previous losses. ????
Having to complete a quest, one of which being entirely reliant on our adc letting us last-hit cannon minions, just to be able to ward reliably is awful.
: Reminder that Zoe has been nerfed 4 times now.
Sorry, but .5 seconds on cd per rank is nothing when she only needed one to kill you, and reducing (only slightly) the distance from which she can hit you isn't a nerf, either. It's called "releasing an actual champion".
: Reminder that they have already said they're going to be doing rotation between "big" patches and smaller ones with this being the small one.
The small patches, then, should be used on the most glaring, manageable issues, then, right? Like an actual Zoe nerf.
: Can you please stop nerfing Azir. He is becoming (if he wasn't at this point) the worst champion to play in the game. He has the lowest win rate and is countered by so many champs. He's an ascended god-emperor for heaven's sake. Please treat him like one. edit: he has ONE of the lowest win rates, not the lowest. but my argument still stands
"One of the worst win rates": this is due to his high pick/ban rate. Fewer games played, and more "worse" Azir players are playing him, while tradition Azir players aren't getting their hands on him. The fact that other champions who are niche picks have lower win rates means he's doing fine. "Countered by so many champs": He has one of the highest effective farming ranges, and mobility to avoid being killed. If you're having trouble with a lot of champions as Azir, especially with how strong he is right now, that might be a "you" problem. "He's a god-emperor... please treat him like one": they're making sure he's not too powerful in-game, the problem is people like you playing him and expecting him to be OP because of lore garbage.
: "If you switch out your primary style while editing runes, your selections for the secondary style will persist." - what exactly are you meaning by this? If I edit my rune page and game starts right before I click save, are those changes what I get in game?
No, it means that, when you edit an existing, completed rune page by changing the primary tree, the entire page won't reset, only the primary tree will. For instance, if you have Domination/Inspiration as your two trees on a saved page, and then change Domination to, say, Sorcery, the Inspiration choices will persist.
Daoist (NA)
: If riot you can consider Azir's general win rate, 46.06%, you think he needs a nerf?
Everybody who becomes ~100% pick/ban in solo queue has lower win rates. It's because those champions start being played by people unfamiliar with them, as a default pick when they don't know what to play. Additionally, higher ban rates, especially in high elo, lead to fewer picks by people who have been playing him already. Win rate is actually really bad for determining how strong something is. Pick/ban rate is much more effective. Low pick rate champions frequently end up high on win rate charts due to high variance (low sample size) and high rates of "mains" playing those champions.
: It was fun seeing other ADCs than Jhin for a while. Guess it's back to counting to 4 like I'm watching Sesame Street.
It's 20 damage. On his ult. You start with ~25% physical damage reduction as base. Do the math, it's not a huge deal.
: Patch 8.3 notes
Lee Sin in the Blood Moon mode, not Kayn...
Pandoria (NA)
: Let WoW have him back
WoW doesn't want him.
Noraver (NA)
: I could be wrong, but... This looks like a serious nerf to Heimer all around. It seems like he'll be pretty unplayable against anybody who can poke him/his turrets or just all-in him before he can hit them with a spell, since they basically do nothing on their own now.
Heimer can charge his beams instantly whenever his grenade is on cooldown, as noted by the "disco" note. His early game damage is fine with these changes, his scaling will be much better, and he'll be much more relevant in surprise fights. As a Heimer main, I'm looking forward to these changes. Plus, being able to hold multiple turret kits right from level 1 is huge against champions who could kill them as soon as they are placed.
: Join the Camille Launch Day Stream on 12/12 PST
TFW Camille is disabled when the stream is scheduled to start. {{sticker:slayer-jinx-wink}} {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-popcorn}}
: Yes, taking away a little ult range and making it unstoppable is such a nerf. ???
The frequency it gets stopped is so low, and reducing the range is like making it ALWAYS be stopped slightly early. That's TERRIBLE.
: Why does Shyvana need the buffs she was given offset when she's in a terrible spot right now?
"we wanted this to be a net-power-buff" Kappa
: Or, idk, we could give someone who hasn't gone every year a chance, like: Crown, Fly or kuzan
Crown, sure. The others need to be significantly better for it not to be a joke to send them.
R3ktar (NA)
: LUL
C9 flair, I'm sadly not shocked by this response.
: Rusty's Guide to Group B
Using "prefix" as a verb... I'm done reading.
: Riot Pls: Ranked Pls - 2017 Season Ranked Changes
I remember that a bunch of "Twitter analysts" had the idea for Flex Queue back in January and February, pretty much exactly as-is here, and Rioters had seen it and basically downplayed it. Hmm.
: Hey everybody, I'm the dude who wrote this patch note. Unfortunately, I goofed. This feature is coming, but not in Patch 6.20. We didn't get QA signoff until too late in the patch, and somewhere along the line our product team and our comms team miscommunicated. While I've delivered a lot of bad news before (nobody likes it when their champion loses 5 AD), I'm really sorry to be the bearer of this bad news. Like you all, I am excited to see this in game, and I look forward to enjoying it with you when it goes to live. This feature will be on PBE soon, and we intend to ship it with the next patch. EDIT: As an apology, I have attached this drawing of Vayne. I'm uh...not an artist. http://imgur.com/0Lhf2wP
Least shocking retraction ever.
: -95% slow- My Rylai's Nunu mid lives once more.
Liandry's first, of course.
: Worlds 2016: On-Air Team
Wish we could count on even half of them to know what an "LPL" is, but that's still more than any previous year, so that's something, I guess. Sad that Monte and DoA aren't there, but glad that they have something else to do instead. And for better pay, apparently.
Ralanr (NA)
: Compared to super long fear or permanent wards? Yes, it isn't game breakingly broken.
Yes, let's use even more broken things to say that this isn't so bad. Imagine defending a serial murderer because they stopped at killing 8 people when there were 3 more in front of him.
: 100 damage? WOW THE GAME BROKE!
Don't know if you know this, but, at level 6, 100 damage is a massive percentage of many champions' maximum hp, in some cases 10% or more. It's the better part of an Ignite's worth of damage at that point in the game. Now, imagine having the ability to just take a third summoner spell, if one is Ignite, for free. Pretty broken, right? There you go.
: Not a game breaking bug so no reason to disable him.
Extra 100+ damage per ult isn't broken, okay.
: Ever heard the term "vocal minority"?
Yes, and it's not in effect here.
: 2016 NA CS Summer Qualifiers Format
This can't POSSIBLY go wrong, be exploited, etc.
: I love the number of reasons you gave, which was zero, as to why they ARE the best. I've stated elsewhere in this thread that they aren't the BEST merely based on KDA, because they have a support who just plays healing supports, and a mid who takes 0 risks in lane. No reason for them to have anything but low death totals. Really simple. None of their players have top CS@10 differentials AFAIK. The major thing they have is that they win fights and get first blood, which, surprise, is more based on team play rather than individual stardom. Also, you still haven't given me a good reason why you conflated "damage share" with game length, as though there should be some relation, which is still funny to me. I also didn't "attack" you, unless criticizing your adherence to an imaginary correlation is some sort of assault. It isn't, though. You would have then "attacked" me both earlier AND, ironically, in this comment, by saying that I only used "ad hominem" when I gave my all too acceptable reasoning that damage share doesn't mean you played long games. Also, on the subject of "not reading comments", you STILL haven't addressed half of what I said. But that's fine, because you used snide comments and an emote. Really good arguments, those. Want some stats? Huni was 5th in Kill Participation among players with 10+ games at his role. Adrian was ALSO 5th. Pobelter was DEAD LAST. RO was 4th, and WT was 6th. Not exactly even stars in teamfighting stats. Beyond their 55%+ first blood participation rates on Huni and RO, the team really has no outstanding stats, besides KDA, which, again, healing supports, mid laner who just farms, ADC who just farms, top laner who gets camped by his jungler all game. Really simple to figure out that those are inflated stats. But sure, it's just me being rude and making things up! Yeah. I'm sure it's me, and not you having a tiny capacity for thought. Bye!
http://oracleselixir.com/statistics/na/na-lcs-2016-spring-regular-season-player-statistics/ Try finding stats outside of KDA which make IMT look like the top players. I dare you.
: Go back to your first comment. Read it. Realize you stated there are no real reasons for IMT's players to be best in their roles. You then go on to try to prove that they aren't the best in their given roles based off a stat that shows how imbalanced a team is or who the "carry" is. After that. you attack me because I responded to only half of your previous comment. Amazing how you avoid the actual content of the comment. It is still a personal attack no matter how you try to spin it. Congratulations, I now agree with all that you have said due to your reliance on proof and data, while being able to avoid personal attacks. Have a good day.
I love the number of reasons you gave, which was zero, as to why they ARE the best. I've stated elsewhere in this thread that they aren't the BEST merely based on KDA, because they have a support who just plays healing supports, and a mid who takes 0 risks in lane. No reason for them to have anything but low death totals. Really simple. None of their players have top CS@10 differentials AFAIK. The major thing they have is that they win fights and get first blood, which, surprise, is more based on team play rather than individual stardom. Also, you still haven't given me a good reason why you conflated "damage share" with game length, as though there should be some relation, which is still funny to me. I also didn't "attack" you, unless criticizing your adherence to an imaginary correlation is some sort of assault. It isn't, though. You would have then "attacked" me both earlier AND, ironically, in this comment, by saying that I only used "ad hominem" when I gave my all too acceptable reasoning that damage share doesn't mean you played long games. Also, on the subject of "not reading comments", you STILL haven't addressed half of what I said. But that's fine, because you used snide comments and an emote. Really good arguments, those. Want some stats? Huni was 5th in Kill Participation among players with 10+ games at his role. Adrian was ALSO 5th. Pobelter was DEAD LAST. RO was 4th, and WT was 6th. Not exactly even stars in teamfighting stats. Beyond their 55%+ first blood participation rates on Huni and RO, the team really has no outstanding stats, besides KDA, which, again, healing supports, mid laner who just farms, ADC who just farms, top laner who gets camped by his jungler all game. Really simple to figure out that those are inflated stats. But sure, it's just me being rude and making things up! Yeah. I'm sure it's me, and not you having a tiny capacity for thought. Bye!
: Ad hominem. Classy. Damage share is a great way to show which position on a team is strong/weak. Not a great stat to compare people across different teams.
So then why did you tell me my damage share stat was wrong in the first place? Sounds like you just wanted anything to fight about. And it's not ad hominem when you've literally displayed the trait. You refuse to read my comments, except to say "hurr durr, that's wrong!"
Roguely (NA)
: o that's cool except we're talking NA
You do realize that they all vote for both leagues, right? And that that's only one team that I mentioned, and that others were affected? Really good reading, though. :>
: Yes. Let us ignore the fact that they ended their games the fastest while killing more of their enemies than any other team and dying the least. Sounds reasonable.
You DO realize that damage share is a percentage of you team's damage, so THE GAME LENGTH DOESN'T AFFECT IT? Holy illiteracy.
Roguely (NA)
: which players were those?
Only the dozen I've seen mention it on twitter, mostly EU teams like H2K.
: Besides the statistics, which are fact based indicators. And guess who leads in many of the statistical categories? IMT. {{sticker:slayer-jinx-wink}}
Oh, yeah, the damage share percentages, they ALL led those, huh? :> They only led in KDA, which happens when your support only plays healers, and your mid takes zero risks.
: Probably because Hauntzer was worse this split than last year, and Balls was better.
And yet Hauntzer was still better than Balls, which is the entire point.
: How the hell does a middle of the pack mid-laner like Jensen get first team and an actual solid mid-laner like Froggen get looked over? Seriously compare their stats and Froggen is an overall better player and carried the entire Echo Fox team when he played; Jensen should be third team and Bjergsen shouldn't be on any all pro team.
Jensen literally solo-carried C9. The mid you should be complaining about being ahead of Froggen is Pobelter.
bachmap (NA)
: The level of sadness I have that Bjergsen is no longer the #1 mid laner... There is always next split!
For me, he was still top 2, with Jensen. And I'm no TSM fan. If the rest of the team picks up their share of the slack, he'll shine once again, don't worry.
: Announcing the 2016 Spring Split award winners
Apparently, if this thread is any indicator, IMT actually stands for "Imagination", because IMT fans are coming up with really amazing imaginary reasons why their players were actually ALL the best at their roles.
: Piglet just did not perform better than turtle at all this split
Except for the whole "outpacing him in damage share, even as a split-pusher, with a roaming support, while not getting counterpicks or being camped by his jungler" thing.
Roguely (NA)
: I love all the comments. "wildturtle's bad just got carried by a good team" "Adrian isn't amazing just lucky he's on a good team" "pobelter isn't the best mid but I bet he's happy he's on a good team" "huni carried sometimes but isn't the best top". At what point do people realize, they ARE the team and they are good?
Turtle got his hand held for 80% of every game by perpetual healer Adrian, until the point that he had enough farm to clean up some kills for well outside the fight. Adrian is actually quite good. Anyone who actually watched last season knows he has a bigger champion pool, but WT hamstrung him into only playing dedicated healers. Pobelter is a fantastic low-econ safe mid, a true "anti-carry", unlike Keane. He didn't give up dumb kills to his opponents, and contributed to his team through roams and consistent CC and damage in fights. Not a top mid, but very good at his role in this team, with 2 other laners with big gold needs. Huni carried a lot of games, but you have to remember that he always had RO there to save him if he made a misstep, or to get him fed. He also had one of the highest gold shares in all of NA, across all roles, even. He's definitely a strong player, but context is important. He might be the best top laner, but other top laners are nearly as good at carrying, without the huge investments IMT make into Huni. Reignover is actually the best jungler in NA, and my MVP pick. His early pressure, esp. top lane, was very valuable to IMT's game plans. Outside of Rush and Dardoch, no one was close to him in the kind of presence he had on the map. Face it, IMT are a great team, because they are greater than the sum of their parts. Each fits their role on the team excellently, so they don't all need to be top at their positions. For my money, they were all top 5, and 3 or 4 were top 3, at their roles in NA this past split. At what point do people realize, they ARE the team and **they are good**? EVERYONE agrees they are good. Just because they aren't all #1 doesn't mean we don't think they are good. #1 is just for the absolute best at the role, and, let's face it, Jensen was stronger than Pobelter as a carry and in impact for his team. C9 literally doesn't make playoffs without him. WT was good this season, but Piglet was a much bigger threat all game long than WT was, and was a true #1 carry for TL. Aphromoo's playmaking, in lane and across the map, were key to making a roster with two new LCS carries work; whereas Adrian wasn't able to be the roam and ward god he was last season because he was forced to sit in lane and protect WT. His overall presence was much less than before, not because he is bad, but because that's his role. Reignover and Huni? Sure, I'll give them both #1, they were great.
: The real universe. Sneaky and Turtle played better than Piglet this season.
No, they didn't. Sneaky was the third most important player on a team with one true carry this season, and Turtle was the third/"cleanup" carry of IMT, where "hey, I can wait until 35 minutes to contribute, and do the last 20% of the enemies' hp, and take a ton of kills to make my stats look good" fits. Piglet was consistently the #1 damage contributor on a top-4 team where he got less gold handed to him than Fenix.
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RobotEthanMars

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