Seen (NA)
: "Jungle WHY AREN'T YOU GANKING"
tbh i'd rather have both junglers leave me the F**k alone in lane and we can fight for crab and dragon and stuff instead.
Xoiyer (NA)
: Real talk tho, people complain about Vayne a lot and I think they don't take the whole kit into consideration. She has single target damage and if she fucks up and hits someone else she loses stacks of silver bolts. She doesn't have any attack speed steroid and she doesn't have anything that gives her extra range. She has a hard lane when people actually know how to pressure and bring presence into a lane.
I mean, i know that all too well having played over 3k games. most adcs are a bad matchup for her to be completely honest. she just has to deal with it and outscale.
: * I'm not convinced by the lore aspect (just my personal opinion, your mileage may vary). * Want to give her a clear identity: You mean a mechanical/strategical one? It's still not clear after this change to me. "The ADC that has a tool for every situation"? Also, it might feel similar to jinx bazooka/mini-gun, depending on the actual effect of each type of ammo. * Less of a balance nightmare: I think this would have the opposite effect. Adding more features and flexibility to a kit makes it harder to balance overall. Silver Bolts may lack enough tuning levers, but having different types of ammo means they all have to be balanced (no clearly superior one), they all have to feel distinct enough to be worth swapping, and it will create a huge skill gap between high MMR who'll always have the proper ammo selected, and low MMR where they won't optimize it. Now, none of those are impossible problems to solve, but if the goal is "make her simpler to balance", I don't think that goal will be reached. Also, I should have asked that first, but are you just theorycrafting for its own sake (and yeah, it's fun :) ), or are you trying to convince Riot to actually make some changes?
i want to see actual changes. as it stands, vayne is pretty unfun to play until 3 items or 30 min into the game. she gets bullied by literally everyone because she has so much power late game. meanwhile tristana has a fairly decent early game, is safe at all points of the game, better item spikes better steroids and carries just as hard if not harder.
: As usual with this kind of threads... Why? The idea isn't bad (it's even rather good, as others have mentioned), but what's your goal? Why take the time and the people it takes to do that change? Never do change just for the sake of change, you need to have a precise objective in mind. And THAT is what's important to communicate. The rest can be ironed out later down the road if everyone agree on the goal, but when you're just making a paper kit on a Board, the goal you want to achieve is what matters.
Well, I've played over 3k games with vayne. I've player her when she was op, i've played her when she was a troll pick. I want to 1, give her a clear identity rather than just "tank shredder adc" we have 3 of those. 2, i want silver bolts to be less of a balancing nightmare and the subject of complaint by literally everyone that dosen't play vayne. I'm just throwing ideas out there but vayne's main pain point tends to be her W. Also, nothing in her lore is reflected in her kit, besides the fact she hunts evil. what makes her different from batman or Diablo 3's demon hunter?
: This is actually a really cool idea Although it needs some work, I feel like giving her more skill expression on having to decide whether to be stronger against squishy characters or tanky characters is a good idea However, Vayne is commonly seen as a tank shredder adc, so it could be that her W just needs some nerfs on its base damage
they've done that twice already and it just makes her laning garbage. Like vayne and tris are "hypercarries" but tris' laning isn't even that bad. and she's not weak early or mid game and carries just as hard as vayne can from 200 more range away.
: In some cases probably. I wouldn't agree that 4 is too much. However I would agree that my ideas all in the same kit could be overbearing. The slow would probably be the worst tbh. Giving Vayne that kind of kiting would be a bit too strong likely.
yeah maybe a slow isnt the best idea. maybe a bolt for extra range, but her attack speed will be lowered. kinda like jinx but still single target obv.
: Good idea but it needs to have a decent cooldown (30+ seconds) so she has to plan ahead for the situation she's going to be in. That's one problem I have with 2 form champs (Jayce, Nidalee, Elise) is they can switch back and forth too easily. If they pick the wrong form they can switch back in like 3 seconds. Therefore I think it should have a long cooldown so if she picks the wrong ammo type, she is punished for it.
yeah or just make it so she can only change ammo types at base. maybe they can even be really strong effects, but she has to buy them instead?
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: Doran's Ring Doran's Ring Doran's Ring
Ignore those idiots they dont read patch notes. i did this immediately after the patch dropped. its actually so nice to have mana and HP
: > [{quoted}](name=Rysophage,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=WQprMvf7,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2018-05-10T21:54:27.218+0000) > > he is an annoying TOP LANER. he's a horrible BOT LANER. I want cancerous ranged champs OUT of top lane. But you just said "At least Kennen is okay", which makes it sound like you're okay with KENNEN OF ALL PEOPLE in the top lane, but Quinn, Urgot, Graves, Corki, and Lucian are a no no(You can actually fight Quinn/Urgot/Graves/Corki/Lucian when their ults are up)
I was referring to the changes they made this(?) patch that let him actually have the tools to be played bot lane. his winrate's still garbage but at least it can be done.
: The hell? You think all those others are the worst experiences of League but KENNEN OF ALL PEOPLE is okay? His ult is practically no counterplay and his passive is annoying as all hell and lasts long enough to where if you get hit by it once you're practically going to be at no health to fight back. He's killable, sure, but as Yaśuo Main said, he's a fucking nightmare.
he is an annoying TOP LANER. he's a horrible BOT LANER. I want cancerous ranged champs OUT of top lane.
: kennen is on yasuo levels of fucking nightmare what do you mean. not because of his laning phase or anything (while it is cancer) its because of the malphite levels of cheese Multi-man ult with flash R zhonyas
yeah with that 43% winrate bot lane he must be a real terror. and no kennen does not have infinite dashes, only one real cooldown, random shields, an ability that completely nullifies bot lane, insane one item power spike that's under 3k gold. i really dont want to hear a yasuo player complaining about anything ever.
: Urgot is far from an ADC at this point.
It's in quotations for a reason.
Rioter Comments
: You aren't a shotcaller.
People like you are why there's so many players sub gold. how do you think people LEARN?
: > [{quoted}](name=A Bad Varus,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=WleWkXXm,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-05-09T21:40:03.871+0000) > > Satan forbid you have to be flexible in a team based game. Do you ever see pro players have to play lanes they don't want? Nah. Because in 5 man teams it's not necessary. So unless you've got 4 mates to play with at all times, you'll get shoved someplace you don't wanna be. But in all seriousness, please name another game that does anything similar. I'll be waiting.
> [{quoted}](name=Gragas Undressed,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=WleWkXXm,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-05-10T01:43:13.079+0000) > > Do you ever see pro players have to play lanes they don't want? Nah. Because in 5 man teams it's not necessary. So unless you've got 4 mates to play with at all times, you'll get shoved someplace you don't wanna be. But in all seriousness, please name another game that does anything similar. I'll be waiting. Name a MOBA that's as successful as league? No one's stopping you from playing DOTA 2. You could also just learn support it's the strongest its ever been and its only boring if you suck. and this is coming from an adc main.
Fxzar (NA)
: I got banned for spoiling a movie... really ?
: League of Legends RPG? wow!
I want a card game and a fighting game tbh. Riot could pioneer the MOBA card game if done properly. cmon man.
: Isn't Camille far too overtuned at the moment?
Camillie is an LC$ champ. she's not getting changed until the meta shifts and she's not played in competitive.
: > [{quoted}](name=Rysophage,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4yIpOObw,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-05-05T22:08:33.795+0000) > > {{item:3020}} {{item:3916}} Lol this is 1500g item, and dont forget right now every champion has to build tear 850g or lost chapter 1300g
CatSith (NA)
: With the Buffs to Maw of Malmortius on the pbe, Can you nerf HexDrinker?
Terozu (NA)
: What characters from other mobas would you like to see in LoL?
Anyone from Dawngate. That game literally had the best designed heroes in any moba period. EA shutting it down was possibly the biggest mistake in gaming since Sony turning down that deal to make a console with nintendo.
: @Riot Repertoire Still averaging 6k dark harvest damage per aram. Its not debatable, its too much.
: To all Riven main, do not buy "Pulsefire Riven skin" until Riven can carry as hard as ADCs.
MrHaZeYo (NA)
: Lol, aww the ADC overlords are going to have to adapt like the rest of the world. The IE changes are needed, and now it becomes like it's AP counterpart (Deathcap). It still is going to be almost a better item over Deathcap, it needs it's true damage to be dropped to 10-15% like you said while keeping it's cost price on PBE. > They're just making marksmen's damage take longer to come online. That's not fun for anyone. It's not fun for every non ADC who have to deal with ADCs hitting their power spikes way earlier then they should be. These changes are step in the right direction, but I think more needs to be done.
{{item:3147}} {{item:3078}} {{item:3146}} all one item power spikes on non-adcs. oh and{{item:3046}} on yasuo. wtf are you talking about?
: why doesnt anyone take kindred bot lane?
weak as hell low range and no damage without marks shes awful bot lane
: > [{quoted}](name=ADC Bard,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=tAmAhIby,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2018-05-04T00:43:07.440+0000) > > {{champion:432}} https://orig00.deviantart.net/b165/f/2013/241/7/5/fairy_type_orb_v3_by_karite_kita_neko-d6k85b5.png https://orig00.deviantart.net/7edc/f/2012/143/e/6/e61c753d495166b19242791514534ee5-d50w3p6.png (Fairy/Psychic) Hehe... Fairy isn't a real Pokemon type. Any types released after the first two generations don't count. In generation 6, there will be "Wood" type Pokemon. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAqTF0KwVfI Accepting "Fairy" is a slippery slope that I don't want to head down.
> [{quoted}](name=Hemulen Magi,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=tAmAhIby,comment-id=00090000,timestamp=2018-05-04T00:50:18.908+0000) > > Hehe... Fairy isn't a real Pokemon type. Any types released after the first two generations don't count. In generation 6, there will be "Wood" type Pokemon. > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAqTF0KwVfI > > Accepting "Fairy" is a slippery slope that I don't want to head down. Fairy gave dragons an actual weakness and other pokemon are alot less boring when they're not just normal (also some pokemon like the clefairy line are literally faries). also introduces new moves and opens up more pokemon ideas. and we got a new eeveeloution. And idk about you but im all for dragon-types being weaker.
: How is {{champion:136}} not a Dragon type?
> [{quoted}](name=L Psy Congroo,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=tAmAhIby,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-05-03T22:40:41.117+0000) > > How is {{champion:136}} not a Dragon type? I think he should be Divine.
Opdí (NA)
: This is Permabanabble???
you were punished before probably you dont just get a permaban out of the blue.
: Can we just rework Tryndamere?
Trynd has had an anti fun toxic design since day one. He's not getting reworked. Rito's gonna ruin crit for adcs but watch trynd and yasuo still be cancer
Luralin (NA)
: i love how hard grill gamers were pushing for overwatch to get pro female gamers but none of them wanted to be the one to actually do it.
> [{quoted}](name=Luralin,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=W6Or3peW,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2018-05-03T06:16:35.723+0000) > > i love how hard grill gamers were pushing for overwatch to get pro female gamers but none of them wanted to be the one to actually do it. That's how it is with literally everything.
: How does jinx carry a minigun and a rocket launcher with those noodle arms?
: you aren't even supposed to build rageblade on trynda though.
Does it matter? He gets 100+ free AD and 40%+ free crit no matter what he builds.
: I honestly don't even blame losses on bad players anymore...
: Hi my name is kha zix .
this is for pro play so we get more LC$ big plays
Rioter Comments
SatomiKun (EUW)
: {{champion:6}} Good to know, we are just 5 years behind the schedule! {{sticker:sg-miss-fortune}}
no one wants to buy skins for ugly champions
: new client feature
I want my soulstealer vayne background T.T
Sinnypoo (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Rysophage,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yVvE61ui,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2018-04-30T22:17:14.181+0000) > > Average spell range in LoL 850. > Average adc attack range 550. > > > What? especially adcs like vayne who have literally no damage outside of thier own range what? yet when youget in their range its a 2 auto attack kill
maybe you monkeys should stop diving into 4 people trying to kill me?
Ducasi (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Rysophage,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yVvE61ui,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2018-04-30T22:17:14.181+0000) > > Average spell range in LoL 850. > Average adc attack range 550. > > > What? especially adcs like vayne who have literally no damage outside of thier own range what? CDR + Mana (especially given the upcoming nerfs) VS Auto?? Are you seriously making a comparison with the availability of DPS among the 2 classes???? {{sticker:sg-miss-fortune}}
What are the AP versions of these items again? {{item:3076}} {{item:3742}} {{item:3143}} {{item:3075}} {{item:3110}} also LOL {{item:3047}} Riot's nerfing mid because those crybabies has been the most spoiled class since season 2. Also mages, unlike adcs, actually have utility and are not just there to do damage. that's why they're in a solo lane. they use thier level adv. and utility in thier kits to help thier team. {{champion:4}} {{champion:34}} {{champion:25}} {{champion:61}} {{champion:163}} {{champion:142}} {{champion:136}} Remind me how many adcs that have utility? ashe and sivir? jhin sometimes?
: Boo hoo no damage out side of my auto range but can still out range 90% of melee's whole kit who make up 65% of the roster. This excuse is only ever relevant in context to other Adcs who dont have less damage for their long range and long range mages for the same reason. average spell range if you exclude every melee champion in the game maybe.
{{champion:53}} {{champion:12}} {{champion:32}} {{champion:31}} {{champion:79}} {{champion:111}} {{champion:57}} {{champion:54}} {{champion:62}} {{champion:19}} {{champion:238}} {{champion:157}} {{champion:5}} {{champion:254}} {{champion:80}} {{champion:107}} {{champion:64}} Do you even play this game? oh right how could i forget about fucking {{champion:89}} {{champion:89}} {{champion:89}}
: I LOVE laning against Zoe.
omg she was nerfed to shit like 4 patches ago shut up and get good ffs zoe's not even good
Onotori (NA)
: These ADC changes are not enough.
All this lifesteal crying is cool and all but with 3 crit items, boots, GA, and lord dominik's where is the lifesteal? Fleet footwork is getting nerfed and the lifesteal items are probably going to be used more since every adc wont have to go triple crit every game. You sound like a salty top laner maybe you should try playing adc before you cry about it.
: also ..... Winning by own skill. Ignoring that adcs stats (along with MOST mages) arent appropriately lowered for the threat and safety their range provides
Average spell range in LoL 850. Average adc attack range 550. What? especially adcs like vayne who have literally no damage outside of thier own range what?
Elohaven (NA)
: ADC mains want ADCs nerfed just so...
Adc is ganked alot because there's two potential kills in the lane and dragon is bot lane. nothing's gonna change that for a long time. has nothing to do with how strong the role is.
Skelenth (EUW)
: When Riot is nerfing mages but leaves adcs untouched
Cry me a river. Mid has the most impact out of any role. The only problem with adcs i can think of is crit items are too cheap. and that's an item issue not an adc issue. and if you nerf crit yasuo fanboys are going to cry so oh well.
Rioter Comments
: I love dodging lux's E
Ray 701 (EUW)
: Why are Janna and Warwick being ignored every patch?
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Rysophage

Level 110 (NA)
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