: People easily get balance and design confused; I *do* think he's one of the best designed champs in League right now, but he's not the best balanced imo. The reason DuskDaUmbreon gave is correct; he *feels* good/fair. But I think it's important to dive into *why* he feels that way. WW has windows of power that you can play around. His strengths are clear, his weaknesses are clear. You know what you need to do against a WW or to play alongside one. He's intuitive. These things are underappreciated, especially at high elo where everyone has formed the "correct" impulses around every champ in the game, nearly. With WW, you don't need a lot of experience for your impulses to be the correct ones. That's why he feels fair. On top of that, he fits his theme incredibly well; his abilities feel like a hunter, so the WW players gets a visceral experience by playing him. Likewise, playing against him can be slightly nerve-wracking, but only for those small windows where you are low hp and WW is nearby. He's influential on any game that he's in without being oppressive. His numbers are pretty balanced, for the most part, but that will change with the meta as different items or different runes come and go. For the last few weeks he's actually trending pretty strong from some of the data that I watch. What's much more important is that Riot can tweak certain balance levers without making WW feel less like WW. That's part of good design, but doesn't mean he'll always be super well balanced.
> [{quoted}](name=KempyreanPirate,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3xA4x8xo,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-01-31T19:51:01.788+0000) > > People easily get balance and design confused; I *do* think he's one of the best designed champs in League right now, but he's not the best balanced imo. > > The reason DuskDaUmbreon gave is correct; he *feels* good/fair. But I think it's important to dive into *why* he feels that way. > > WW has windows of power that you can play around. His strengths are clear, his weaknesses are clear. You know what you need to do against a WW or to play alongside one. He's intuitive. These things are underappreciated, especially at high elo where everyone has formed the "correct" impulses around every champ in the game, nearly. > > With WW, you don't need a lot of experience for your impulses to be the correct ones. That's why he feels fair. On top of that, he fits his theme incredibly well; his abilities feel like a hunter, so the WW players gets a visceral experience by playing him. Likewise, playing against him can be slightly nerve-wracking, but only for those small windows where you are low hp and WW is nearby. He's influential on any game that he's in without being oppressive. > > His numbers are pretty balanced, for the most part, but that will change with the meta as different items or different runes come and go. For the last few weeks he's actually trending pretty strong from some of the data that I watch. What's much more important is that Riot can tweak certain balance levers without making WW feel less like WW. That's part of good design, but doesn't mean he'll always be super well balanced. See my recent post. >He needs to lose his damage reduction, imo. All he needs to build is a ton of health (Titanic...Cinder...) and the damage reduction does the rest. He should need to invest in tanky gear. That, and potentially his global sense needs to go. He can gank from virtually anywhere if the person is low hp cause he runs at mach-10.
Seenan (NA)
: Can someone explain why Warwick's the epitome of balance?
I personally don't think he's balanced. I think he's a bit on the strong side considering how tanky he is and how much damage he ends up doing...AND he can solo dragon/rift herald at a low level. This website - http://bestbans.com/ - has him on every 'TOP X BAN' because he has a high influence to win. The only one he doesn't look like he influences is bronze. But Silver until DIAMOND, he has a high influence to win. I don't think that's high balance, nor high mastery since even in Silver, he proves a good winrate. na.op.gg holds data from plat+ and he even has a decent winrate on that. He needs to lose his damage reduction, imo. All he needs to build is a ton of health (Titanic...Cinder...) and the damage reduction does the rest. He should need to invest in tanky gear. That, and potentially his global sense.
: Because of a few reasons. First off, he's had the least balance changes of everyone (besides intentionally dumpstered champions) since his rework (I think, besides the stat update *everyone* got, he had *one* other change), and he's maintained a fairly close to 50% winrate. Second, is because he *feels* relatively fair to fight. He doesn't feel unfair, he doesn't feel broken. And what makes that amazing is that, not only was he a problematic champion pre-rework (Sole purpose was to nuke the ADC with his R in late game), it's that he's a draintank, and Riot has *constantly* had problems with those in the past (See: Aatrox, Darius, Akali, Fiora, Kindred (sorta), Nasus...). And, on top of that, it proved that CertainlyT *is* amazing for game balance...**as long as he's kept in check**.
> [{quoted}](name=DuskDaUmbreon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3xA4x8xo,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-01-31T19:15:52.484+0000) > > Because of a few reasons. > > First off, he's had the least balance changes of everyone (besides intentionally dumpstered champions) since his rework (I think, besides the stat update *everyone* got, he had *one* other change), and he's maintained a fairly close to 50% winrate. > > Second, is because he *feels* relatively fair to fight. He doesn't feel unfair, he doesn't feel broken. And what makes that amazing is that, not only was he a problematic champion pre-rework (Sole purpose was to nuke the ADC with his R in late game), it's that he's a draintank, and Riot has *constantly* had problems with those in the past (See: Aatrox, Darius, Akali, Fiora, Kindred (sorta), Nasus...). And, on top of that, it proved that CertainlyT *is* amazing for game balance...**as long as he's kept in check**. He's STILL a drain-tank, only now, he's more tankier with his damage reduction.
Jamaree (NA)
: He has clear wells designed flaws and weaknesses but strengths that go along with it. His chase game is terrifying but in turn his ability to run away is shit, you know what he is going to do and there is room to play around his kit. His ultimate is also fair for what it does, unlike the only other suppress in the game which is just a point and click, he has to aim his so his reward of the hardest cc in the game is justified.
> [{quoted}](name=Jamaree,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3xA4x8xo,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-01-31T19:15:45.818+0000) > > He has clear wells designed flaws and weaknesses but strengths that go along with it. > > His chase game is terrifying but in turn his ability to run away is shit, you know what he is going to do and there is room to play around his kit. > > His ultimate is also fair for what it does, unlike the only other suppress in the game which is just a point and click, he has to aim his so his reward of the hardest cc in the game is justified. This I don't believe. His ability to run away is pretty well-off if there's at least one low hp champ and/or if he activates his damage reduction/fear. And he can ULT away if anything, which is nearly a screen-away ult...with a decently low CD. There's no risk to using his fear/damage reduction, since it goes off even if CC'd. Imo, they need to remove the damage reduction portion of that. He's already a bruiser, why does he also need a fear that pretty much can't be stopped if he gets close? 6th best jungler on na.op.gg.
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=SpongebobIsLife,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6V8vIlXG,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-01-31T17:23:44.407+0000) > > No. Pre-Rework leblanc had some seriously busted damage and on top of her passive, made her also really annoying to deal with. True, but it shouldn't be yes or no in terms of extremes. Both cases are bad for her, a middle ground, ie balance, must be met. She isn't in the best spot now, so a small, but not overwhelming buff is needed imo.
> [{quoted}](name=Ęcliptic,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6V8vIlXG,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2018-01-31T17:57:57.958+0000) > > True, but it shouldn't be yes or no in terms of extremes. Both cases are bad for her, a middle ground, ie balance, must be met. She isn't in the best spot now, so a small, but not overwhelming buff is needed imo. She still has busted damage, but now it's loaded all into her passive essentially.
: Darius's problem, from a challenger Mordekaiser main
Imo, his hilt needs to add a bleed stack again...and his movement speed on bleed needs to come back, if even just 1% per stack so he isn't easily as kited. I'm sure anyone would be bleeding if someone knocked you in the face with a decent speed spinning axe hilt. His ult animation needs to happen a lot faster too. Too many times have I been denied just because it takes forever to do the damage.
: Darius's problem, from a challenger Mordekaiser main
Imo, his hilt needs to add a bleed stack again...and his movement speed on bleed needs to come back, if even just 1% per stack so he isn't easily as kited. I'm sure anyone would be bleeding if someone knocked you in the face with a decent speed spinning axe hilt.
Subdue (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Seenan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jV8ucpYa,comment-id=000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-30T19:28:18.009+0000) > > 'Cause 1 time of me feeding hard/not doing well vs 7 times of my teammates doing bad/feeding in a row isn't something to compare? There are 10 players in a game. If each player does poorly in just 10% of their games, that means 50% of your games will have someone on your team do poorly, even if individually you all only do poorly 10% of the time. That's basic math.
> [{quoted}](name=Subdue,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jV8ucpYa,comment-id=0001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-30T19:43:33.286+0000) > > There are 10 players in a game. If each player does poorly in just 10% of their games, that means 50% of your games will have someone on your team do poorly, even if individually you all only do poorly 10% of the time. > > That's basic math. No? There's a difference between going 0-8 and going even/dying only once or twice. That's doing extremely poorly vs having a teammate of sufficient MMR. Now, if my team was even across the board, I would be the sole factor in determining the game - but that's hardly ever how it is. That's basic logic.
Subdue (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Seenan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jV8ucpYa,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-30T18:53:29.078+0000) > > In that game, I actively accepted I did bad that game to my teammates. Of course, you're not going to believe me, but I do accept that the game is essentially my fault when I'm 0-8, cause I'm barely ever 0-8 (or if I am, my assists should be out the ass). > Do you think people regularly do that? > > Again, this game I'm talking about was my recent Malz game. I was fp, couldn't really do a lot as I got countered and the rest of my team wasn't doing a lot at all judging by the 15-1 Kha. Why is it that when you do poorly, it's okay because you "accepted it", but when your teammates do poorly it's the matchmaker's fault?
> [{quoted}](name=Subdue,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jV8ucpYa,comment-id=00010000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-30T19:13:02.158+0000) > > Why is it that when you do poorly, it's okay because you "accepted it", but when your teammates do poorly it's the matchmaker's fault? 'Cause 1 time of me feeding hard/not doing well vs 7 times of my teammates doing bad/feeding in a row isn't something to compare? There's an
Subdue (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Seenan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jV8ucpYa,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-01-30T09:45:54.253+0000) > > ? Way to pick the one game I did bad in, about 2+ weeks ago, on a champion I'm relatively still learning. Go look at the Syndra games seeing as how I mentioned in the OP, that I was talking about mid-lane. Do you think your teammates cared that it was "the one game you did bad in?" To them, you were just the feeder that the evil matchmaker put in their team.
> [{quoted}](name=Subdue,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jV8ucpYa,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2018-01-30T12:42:11.790+0000) > > Do you think your teammates cared that it was "the one game you did bad in?" > > To them, you were just the feeder that the evil matchmaker put in their team. In that game, I actively accepted I did bad that game to my teammates. Of course, you're not going to believe me, but I do accept that the game is essentially my fault when I'm 0-8, cause I'm barely ever 0-8 (or if I am, my assists should be out the ass). Do you think people regularly do that? Again, this game I'm talking about was my recent Malz game. I was fp, couldn't really do a lot as I got countered and the rest of my team wasn't doing a lot at all judging by the 15-1 Kha.
Subdue (NA)
: https://i.imgur.com/vVcWZzC.jpg
> [{quoted}](name=Subdue,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jV8ucpYa,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-01-30T06:09:48.382+0000) > > https://i.imgur.com/vVcWZzC.jpg ? Way to pick the one game I did bad in, about 2+ weeks ago, on a champion I'm relatively still learning. Go look at the Syndra games seeing as how I mentioned in the OP, that I was talking about mid-lane.
: 2018 Ranked Placements Venting post!
I placed 2-8 in placements, with more than 5 of the games because laners don't know how to not be shit. Excerpt from: >https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/jV8ucpYa-either-appropriate-the-matchmaking-mmrdont-give-me-feeders-or-dont-make-me-first-pick The fuck am I supposed to do when I'm actively getting countered as the first pick of the whole game AND my team is a bunch of feeders? 2 of their team both have higher ranks than the entirety of my team. I'm also in promos. Gotta love this matchmaking system. How they expect me to actively 1v9 if I'm also firstpick and I don't have all champs? You don't see LCS players first-picking their mid-laners...there's a reason why.
: Is anyone else getting aggravated at matchmaking lately?
Me. > https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/jV8ucpYa-either-appropriate-the-matchmaking-mmrdont-give-me-feeders-or-dont-make-me-first-pick
Dewott610 (OCE)
: Just gonna leave this here https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=Y_oCnKDv_n4
> [{quoted}](name=Dewott610,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=8fL61bK7,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-01-30T00:40:58.591+0000) > > Just gonna leave this here https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=Y_oCnKDv_n4 This is just terrible.
: Stop watch is 600 Boots is 300 By taking the insperation tree 2nd you are guaranteed to save 900 Gold. 900 Gold, that means just for clicking a rune you started the game with 900 gold on your opponent while they have to struggle to build items.
> [{quoted}](name=PhantomGG,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=8fL61bK7,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-01-29T12:45:30.240+0000) > > Stop watch is 600 > Boots is 300 > > By taking the insperation tree 2nd you are guaranteed to save 900 Gold. 900 Gold, that means just for clicking a rune you started the game with 900 gold on your opponent while they have to struggle to build items. Not even sure why you were downvoted, since you're mostly correct.
Rioter Comments
: "We can win"
The Ezreal and Shyv built pretty poorly against their comp (and in general), so...
Mewko (NA)
: Even as a mid lane main
Yeah, a free 1-time stopwatch for adcs and mages alike is sorta broken.
Rioter Comments
: Twitch is broken and ruining this game
Nerf camo duration/add more detection radius, nerf how it resets upon kill/assist.
Bârd (NA)
: I've been playing Dota a lot lately, and have some things to bring back.
> [{quoted}](name=Bârd,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lc9wtQhv,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-12-26T06:23:10.507+0000) > > 3. The RNG in this game is nothing to complain about. Seriously. You're getting mad about plants, crit chance, and dragon spawns? You've got it lucky over here; you don't have to deal with rune spawns, bash, evasion, or Dota crits (which have lower proc chances than League crits, but MUCH higher multipliers). > DotA crits at least have pseudo-crits, so you can potentially prime crits. League is just entirely RNG.
: would have to readjust the whole item and by that point should just make a new item. But if they made an item that reduced MR with consistent dmg then champs like {{champion:69}} {{champion:50}} would break the item day 1.
> [{quoted}](name=RainbowIcee,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=5a6AjbY5,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2017-12-24T18:53:05.138+0000) > > would have to readjust the whole item and by that point should just make a new item. But if they made an item that reduced MR with consistent dmg then champs like {{champion:69}} {{champion:50}} would break the item day 1. {{champion:90}}
Crocele (NA)
: Should i ever max q over w as Orianna?
: Sooo... no ones going to do anything about Miss Fortune?
They need an actual meaningful nerf for Duskblade Ranged users. ~10 or 20 damage, whatever it is, is not even close to enough of a balance for Ranged to Melee.
: Can we please, for the love of poros, get a patch for hitboxes.
Sejuani's Q hits you if you're behind her on her ass. This has gotten me killed more times on her than I can count.
TehNACHO (NA)
: So Muramana has a bad rep for being so slow to stack, but do realize the amount of AD it can provide when fully stacked is actually really high for any single AD item, especially one that costs 2400. Glitch or not, between Ezreal's Q's base damage, Trinity Force, and Frostburn, no shit that combo hits really hard.
> [{quoted}](name=TehNACHO,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=muYv5JNJ,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-12-16T22:36:06.442+0000) > > So Muramana has a bad rep for being so slow to stack, but do realize the amount of AD it can provide when fully stacked is actually really high for any single AD item, especially one that costs 2400. Glitch or not, between Ezreal's Q's base damage, Trinity Force, and Frostburn, no shit that combo hits really hard. More importantly, why is Frostburn AND Trinity stacking damage, if they are?
Rioter Comments
CatSith (NA)
: @RIOT Why not keep yasuo weak until you find a solution to his gameplay instead of buffing him?
Yasuo only gets 'unstoppable' when he gets at least 3 of his items, one of them probably having to be lifesteal-based. The other two being IE+zeal item. And, partly from the fact that he gets a free ult on any displacement whatsoever, he's actually difficult to play until then. Take a Darius, Renekton, absolutely shit on him. Also, the Ferver deletion hit him pretty hard.
: Honestly the biggest buff to bruisers compared to whats on PBE
One I would agree with is having the bursts not stack anymore, like it used to be. Having RFC+Shiv+crit go off is pretty much taking out half any squishy's hp.
: So this error just came out of nowhere.
Iirc, those tend to be memory errors. But you can reinstall maybe.
: Guys... stop telling plat+ players to 'git gud' "because MF is immobile". You, as an individual, will _not_ notice a 4% increase in the amount of times MF has beaten you, simply because NO player's individual games can produce and adequate sample size. As for the issue, yes she is flourishing right now. We have an early-game adc here, whose early-game success is amplified by runes, whose poke is amplified by runes, and who can make exceptional use of Duskblade, a problem item. I would prefer Riot approached this from the lethality and snowball aspects, however, as they tend to be a problem on many champions.
> [{quoted}](name=NekoniClaws,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nQNb5U4F,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2017-11-27T02:26:35.461+0000) > > Guys... stop telling plat+ players to 'git gud' "because MF is immobile". > > You, as an individual, will _not_ notice a 4% increase in the amount of times MF has beaten you, simply because NO player's individual games can produce and adequate sample size. > > As for the issue, yes she is flourishing right now. We have an early-game adc here, whose early-game success is amplified by runes, whose poke is amplified by runes, and who can make exceptional use of Duskblade, a problem item. I would prefer Riot approached this from the lethality and snowball aspects, however, as they tend to be a problem on many champions. MF as an early game adc? Her aoe ult says otherwise. And I'd say her passive and Q are far more stronger mid/late than early.
: Aren't we all tired of two/three items Vaynes, Xayahs etc. bursting people down like assassins?
: Zoe's RNG "W" is way too unreliable
Zoe got a rocketbelt last game which pretty much saved her with the small dash associated...
: Imagine the following AP champs if they could crit with their spells. {{champion:115}} {{champion:28}} {{champion:45}}{{champion:17}} {{champion:99}} {{champion:45}} {{champion:101}} {{champion:161}}{{champion:134}} {{champion:45}} {{champion:105}}{{champion:1}} {{champion:69}} {{champion:45}}
> [{quoted}](name=Baron Barian,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zZnbOiLP,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-11-25T23:16:45.833+0000) > > Imagine the following AP champs if they could crit with their spells. > > {{champion:115}} {{champion:28}} {{champion:45}}{{champion:17}} {{champion:99}} {{champion:45}} {{champion:101}} {{champion:161}}{{champion:134}} {{champion:45}} {{champion:105}}{{champion:1}} {{champion:69}} {{champion:45}} There would definitely have to be some rebalancing on AOE and whatnot, no doubt. Most of those champs deal high aoe damage.
Mr Meat (OCE)
: Wow! Sounds like thats the only champion who can do that! {{champion:31}} {{champion:105}} {{champion:134}} {{champion:29}} {{champion:45}}
> [{quoted}](name=Mr Meat,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=cvnFHEOO,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2017-11-24T12:10:52.101+0000) > > Wow! Sounds like thats the only champion who can do that! > > {{champion:31}} {{champion:105}} {{champion:134}} {{champion:29}} {{champion:45}} Yet, how many can do it safely? Fizz has to dive right in. Cho has to dive right in (albeit, he's tankier). The rest are 'press R' champs, so they have to get close enough to R. Twitch ofc gets higher range and hits everyone though, no excuse.
Rioter Comments
: Rito stop giving me Annie in every level up capsule its becoming a meme XD
Look at it this way. If you wanna get M6/7, you're solid.
: Why Duskblade Is The Most Broken Item In The Game
Imo, I think it should have been halved for Ranged. Why it's only something like -20 damage from melee to ranged is beyond me. You Vayne ult and Q, you're heading towards 1000+ damage late game, esp if the crit procs, assuming she buys it.
zlumpy (NA)
: They need better AI. Too easy for people to dance in and out of the zone doing damage and being completely ignored. Some champs are so good at it that usually the only hit they ever take is the one they get while leaving the danger zone after rofl stomping your face into the ground.
> [{quoted}](name=zlumpy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J9PV7v1E,comment-id=0013,timestamp=2017-11-22T03:19:16.649+0000) > > They need better AI. Too easy for people to dance in and out of the zone doing damage and being completely ignored. Some champs are so good at it that usually the only hit they ever take is the one they get while leaving the danger zone after rofl stomping your face into the ground. Some people are Diamond+ just for abusing that mechanic.
: If, hypothetically, Riot made a new Fervor, should it be under Domination or Precision?
Replace the Lethal Tempo or upgrade it with a Fervor-esk thing.
Seenan (NA)
: Is it normal to get 270+270+270+90+90 BE on level up?
Imo, they should give us 270 MINIMUM for any champ shards. The 450s are cheap enough to buy as it is. Or just make 450s sell for 270 as well, so it balances out the old IP system. 270x5 = 1350, nearly the same of IP.
Thilmer (EUW)
: Crit chance: a problematic stat that should be removed
DotA has something like a pseudo-crit, where every time you don't crit, it adds more chance to crit until you crit...to which it goes back to the base chance. People in high-ELO abuse this. 30% to crit should mean you crit at least once every 3-4 hits. 50% should mean every 2 hits. After 50% crit chance, how would it work? Would it just go passed 100% crit % for the next set of crits? Ie, 80% -> 160% (crits) - 60% -> 140% - 40% -> 120% - 20% -> 100% - 0%?
Rioter Comments
: Riot confirmed they are looking at it. Also, Darius shouldn't be a lategame champion. Idk why Riot keeps pushing for it. He should be a lane bully that falls off as the game progresses; that was his identity.
> [{quoted}](name=VulDread,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AFa45zQI,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2017-11-18T03:17:23.027+0000) > > Riot confirmed they are looking at it. > > Also, Darius shouldn't be a lategame champion. Idk why Riot keeps pushing for it. He should be a lane bully that falls off as the game progresses; that was his identity. That's a sure-fire way to keep him, along with half+ the roster, out of competitive. Do we really want that?
Tyvan (NA)
: Played a game of acsension and the enemy team afked early into the game
SirΤeemο (EUNE)
: overwatch costs 29 dollars , while buying all content from league costs around 1500-2000
> [{quoted}](name=SirΤeemο,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=YAkTuO5E,comment-id=0001000000020000,timestamp=2017-11-11T20:03:05.203+0000) > > overwatch costs 29 dollars , while buying all content from league costs around 1500-2000 You can't compare it like that. Overwatch doesn't have champs to buy, while League does. Overwatch JUST has aesthetics/cosmetics to lootbox. League has champs and cosmetics, neither of which are mandatory (can theoretically be grinded, outside of skins).
: You'll have to Google it it seems like. I think the new system is intentionally vague. It kind of feels like the smoke and mirrors you'd see in a mobile game from an indie company. 4/10 would not want to be taken advantage of by it
> [{quoted}](name=The MechE,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=00Ng5isM,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-11-11T19:13:00.866+0000) > > You'll have to Google it it seems like. I think the new system is intentionally vague. It kind of feels like the smoke and mirrors you'd see in a mobile game from an indie company. > > 4/10 would not want to be taken advantage of by it I just tested it as a yolo. I bought 'Mystery Champion' and it immediately unlocked Taliyah. So, I find it strange how 3950 unlocks 4800+ champs by default but for whatever reason, we only gain the shards by...I guess, BE gain by disenchanting. But if you get the proper champ shards that way, you might as well just use those for unlocking the champs because 3780 is that small bit cheaper than 3950 to unlock the same thing. Basically, by default, all 4800 and 6300s are 3950, 3780, or the shard perm amount for 4800s (less than 3780). Not that I'm complaining but it's strange.
Seenan (NA)
: 'We've updated the minimum given for Mystery Champ Shards from 3150 to 4800+' clarification
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Seenan

Level 47 (NA)
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