: Riot games is the source of all toxicity
So yeah, there is a serious issue with the report system being discriminatory. Which I will advise that take advantage and take all you can into a legal council if you have an actual case. See Riot has an issue with using an automated report and ban system, and getting a repeal from this system is actually impossible. Which is a serious issue since Riot does not disclose who they deal punishments to. I wad playing support and get a 4 man, this 4 man decided that they didn't want a random to support them so they took Kayle top instead of going bot, and their plan was to duo farm top lane. I bought a support item and went bot, and ended up solo for a while, what's worse is all 4 of them joined in on verbally harassing me for picking up a support item when I was a solo lane. Because I told the mid to "fuck off" when she harassed me about my support item, I got a 10 game chat restriction, while they spent the entirety of the game spamming harassment. They trolled me, intentionally, with verbal harassment far worse than "fuck off" but when it came time to report at the end of the game my reports carried no weight because I reported 3 people, but all 4 of them reported me, being a premade. I got no message that any action had been taken on anybody while I received a 10 game. The problem riot doesn't realize is that this incident alone is enough to warrant an investigation to discriminatory service refusal (bans and restrictions are service refusals) and like a restaurant they declare that they have the right to refuse service to anyone. But also like restaurants they have to provide legitimate reason and follow through on precedent if they set it, in other words if they ban me for saying "fuck off" but somebody else tells me to "fuck off" and have no action taken against them when they're reported then they would have to supply a different reason I was targeted with service refusal. Which Riot doesn't want to do, more players banned is fewer players paying, since they don't release information on other players receiving restriction they create a loophole, a loophole they can't leave open when it comes to legal action however. Since if they don't keep a record of precedents of whether action was taken against a player or not a discrimination case will automatically win as a lack of evidence is the same as evidence that they took no action against their players. Riot specifically doesn't want this scrutiny and prefers a system where they just say "if they're bad they won't escape our system" and not deal with them if the automatic system doesn't deal with them due to an inherent unfairness in how reporting works... 4 versus 1 will always result in the 1 getting screwed and the 4 getting away with murder. They don't care for toxic behavior so much as to throw out a wave ban for a group of people, they only take action when people gang up on a single person, which is dangerous as the lack of evidence of discriminatory service refusal only protects them a small amount, and if somebody does get enough against them it will be a pretty canning case due to the system deliberately designed to allow for this malicious behavior. Riot will change their stance one day, there are lots of people out there with access to lawyers capable of taking them down for more than just this one kind of behavior.
: Maybe you should just mind your own business. Stop trying to invade people's privacy unless you would like your own invaded.
> [{quoted}](name=LIIMP RICHARD,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=xvxuj3k4,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-02-01T13:12:01.300+0000) > > Maybe you should just mind your own business. Stop trying to invade people's privacy unless you would like your own invaded. Sorry, did you think people couldn't tell that you'rev played Nami today in a 30 min game where you only had 3 items? As stated privacy has always been an honor system kind of thing. If you are worried about privacy, don't use the internet at all.
: Riot should tell us when Players get banned.
I actually support a system that automatically bans for the word int or inting. 99% of the time its being used, its being used to attack a teammate, who typically isn't intentionally feeding. Its used toxicly except for the 1% of the time somebody says "I'm not inting" in response to somebody else flaming them. This game is quite a few steps ahead of games like Overwatch where people just don't understand what is and isn't toxic behavior. Most people have a handle on whether or not what they're doing is toxic in this game, but that doesn't mean everybody is aware. Declaring that a teammate is inting is pretty much never the way to go about an actual throwing teammate. "Kench ate me and threw me into the enemy trying to kill me" "Draven is running down mid and dying to tower" Why say inting even in these scenarios? You can explain what they're doing to teammates, but otherwise declaring is only going to make that kind of behavior worse. And if you call a person having a bad game out for "inting" do you really expect them to suddenly start having a better game because you complained? Do you really think stealing their farm will help? Most people understand this, thus the game isn't near as bad as something like Overwatch. Its the stragglers that haven't figured it out yet that need help, thus automated systems that get rid of throwers and other toxic behavior.
: > [{quoted}](name=Brumbo Tungus,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2EITiVpE,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-12-02T23:37:22.004+0000) > > Sightstone being removed was less about supports and more about jungle because a bunch of junglers built it and gave their team a whole lotta vision. The current way you get a warding item works perfectly fine but it could use some lowering (maybe 400-450). > > Vision shouldn't be about how many glowing sticks i put into the ground and more about how i can best use my limited number of sticks to get the most coverage and have to use game knowledge to figure out where they're going. I don't get why they couldn't just make it a support only item or even give only 2 wards or make it that you can place more control wards or something. My main point is that if you're behind, its so hard to get wards since you need to complete whatever mission they have instead of just being able to buy it with whatever amount of gold.
I would consider your thoughts, but as a support main I would prefer if they reverted the support items to giving better stats and useful actives. Its tiring to see people complain about a lack of vision while riot has prioritized the person with the least gold to spend it on vision. I started playing long before trinkets and sight stones, when you had to buy each ward. It was logical to make ADC's who had the most gold income on the team spend some of it on vision, while their support focused on assisting them as a support, getting much needed mana gen and cool down reduction items. Now everybody has trinkets with plenty of ward coverage on their own, sight stone is an unnecessary bulk to any build and so are the now ward trinket items. There's no reason a support should worry about vision if everybody else's 4 is ready to use.
Koƒu (NA)
: I find the mastery 6-7 system somewhat unfair as a support. The more recent patches have been geared towards creating faster game-play. (i.e. faster death counters). I've recently played some games in which I am incapable of getting an S- (or up) simply because I die **once** and the games over before I can rack up a higher score. Quite simply, it's almost impossible to get an S-, S, or S+ on support, because you're not taking CS, you're not dealing a ton of damage (if you play someone such as Soraka. Even with her, apparently 60k in healing with only one death, isn't enough for anything more than an A-)and you're not collecting kills. Only assists. Even on more damage/Cc based supports, such as Leona, I went 1/0/17, and only received a B+.
It's a flaw in the system that it rates based on damage dealt, rather than kill participation, it's based on "CS" rather than gold earned. The ranking system doesn't account for a jungler properly either, you can get 5 dragons, get baron twice, and have rift herald and still the stat you needed to get that S was more farm. It's not even able to rate you for how well you play the champion. It simply rates your stats in that game compared to stats of other players playing that champion. Considering many junglers also play in lane, supports are played in roles where they farm, damage dealers are played as tanks. Yeah, it hardly accounts for build diversity in a single champion, and due to the fact that you have no idea what stats are going to be high (essentially what you're competing against) you can't adjust your playstyle to get the S rank. You just gotta hope that your ability to play the game they want you to play will reward you. S ranks are just as much RNG as the chests, except the RN Generator is other players playing the champions at the time.
: Like requiring 3 mastery tokens to get Mastery 7 when you only get Mastery Tokens on S or S+ ranks (see bottom)? Or are S ranks (not S+) too easy to get? Also, if you actually read the article, you'll understand that they know about the RNG aspect. "Because loot has some RNG elements to finding champ shards and permanents, we’re working on a way to pick up only champ shards for IP or RP. " I disagree entirely on the mastery meaning nothing. You still need the skill to get S ranks on the champion. It's just additionally harder because you rely on RNG to get the champion shards you need. Doesn't make it mean less. Just that some people 'might deserve it' but haven't gotten it yet. That feels like means more to me. As for the penta kill idea, I'm guessing you do not play support or tank champs. It needs to be an idea that is accessible to every champion in the game. Pretty sure you'd tilt your team and carries if you steal a penta kill as the support (not to mention you don't build damage anyway so GETTING those kills will be rough). ****** Earn an S or higher in a champ mastery-enabled queue with that champ, unlocking a new Mastery token for that specific champ Combine 3 Mastery tokens with a champ shard of the same champ, OR the champ permanent of the same champ, OR 600 blue essence, to unlock Level 7 (copied from the article)
Except that an S rank does not indicate skill with a champion. In fact the S rank picks up people who are skilled at the game, but actually means very little about how good or bad they are with that specific champion. Whether or not your showcase of ability in the game will translate across the stats the algorithm looks at to determine your rank is pretty much just as much RNG as the Hextech Boxes.
: Patch Chat with Playtest - Patch 6.4
It pains me to see Cailyn players maxing Q first I never have mana problems on Cait.
: The Keybind Wars: Which Key is Best for Flash?
If you want to understand my preference, it's a tad bit strange. D is "harder" to hit on my controller I use a keypad with a joystick to control the camera. I put flash on D when it's my Defensive spell, I put flash of F when it's my oFfesnive spell. I am just more likely to hit F to be aggressive with a summoner, and more like to hit D to get away or defend myself. This is why occasionally you see me switch up which key I have it on when I play certain champions where flash is my offensive spell. This is hardly ever the case for me, and typically even if I use flash offensively it makes me take a step back for a split second and go "I will have no summoner for an escape here so I better be sure." While it's a largely personal reason, and really doesn't make a difference in making me any better of a player. It is the reason you see flash on D for me pretty much all of the time.
: This needed a reply, supports get no respect in lower queues, all they get is the blame for their mistakes, no recognition for their good actions, merely because their actions are not always visible in their score. This is the most honest post I have ever seen, though, I'm also biased as a support main xD
The problem is there is also a lot of players that are terrible at support, farming because their ADC "sucks" or roaming, or hiding behind the turret until lane phase is over. I've honestly seen my fair share of these people that believe that as a support they're allowed to get snobby and let their ADC solo bot lane. This post is a sign of low skill play, a support has to just continue to assist their adc, all game. Getting "pissed off" and leaving them to solo the lane against a duo isn't helping your team. Supporting another lane, taking their farm, letting them die when you had the power to save them, not warding, etc. is being a bad support. Don't do those things because somebody called you a bad support, prove them wrong, continue to support them and try and get them ahead, try to prove them wrong by supporting harder. Carry them, and if they're an ungrateful prick, report them. Tribunal will get them, don't pass out punishment by yourself, because then it will become a quibble between the two of you and you're both in the wrong. As clever and funny as the post was, it's a joke. A lot of support players have no idea how to perform the easiest role in the game, yes support is the easiest role. You simply sit in lane and provide presence, warding is part of it, but warding is a part of every role. Quite literally support is like playing any other position, but you don't have to farm, you don't have to worry about getting the last hit on the kills, you don't have to worry about anything but keeping your health bars higher than theirs. This is coming from a fill main, and of course that actually means support main. I get plenty of recognition for my performance, and anybody that complains simply gets carried, without me stealing their farm, without me screwing them over.
: 5 Faces of new champ select
Primary Role - Fill You mean support?
: They have 100+ champs. It's hard not to have some sort of overlap for a while. I think that they did really well with Jhin in making him still feel unique, even if they pulled inspiration from elsewhere
Just sayin, that ult is exactly what Caitlyn's should have been
Pepumu (NA)
: You guys just don't know how to play him, he's a monster. Im always the one wining the game when I play taric.
Old Sion was also a monster, that's not a reason to ignore a rework.
mvmlego (NA)
: Saying that a champion needs to be reworked on the basis of their kit feeling "underwhelming" is not a valid criticism because it is way too subjective. His play rate and win rate are both healthy, and he is viable at high-level play* (which indicates that a significant number of players find his kit to be both enjoyable and powerful). If you don't like his kit, then the solution to that is to not play him, not to ask Riot to rework him. The only time Riot should be reworking something is when it is unhealthy for gameplay (e.g. Fiora's and Poppy's old ultimates), breaks continuity with or is completely isolated from the game's lore (e.g. Kayle's and Nautilus's backgrounds, respectively), or does not meet Riot's benchmark for artistic quality (which, as you pointed out, includes Taric's current in-game model). Unfortunately, ChampUp has a tendency to make their reworks overbroad. Poppy didn't need to have her passive scrapped; Soraka didn't have to be turned into a celestial vampire; Kayle's splash art didn't need to be sexualized; and Taric doesn't need to have his kit reworked. *http://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/stats/taric
Objectively all targeted abilities should be up for rework, that doesn't exactly mean "abolish all targeted abilities" I will default back to Kat, but her Q is a targeted ability. Hands down there's no way making it a skill shot would inherently make the ability more powerful. Therefore it should be, and be balanced around that fact. Her W is an AOE and is fine for the most part. Her E is a... targeted ability, but if you were to make it a skill shot, to where she could jump anywhere she pleased it WOULD make the ability inherently stronger. Therefore, NOT worth changing (objectively). Taric's stun is a targeted ability, making it a skillshot would improve the kit... Objectively, since it being a skillshot wouldn't make him inherently stronger. He needs adjustment, tweak how one or two abilities function, and for the love of christ a new look and some more facets to his rather flat personality. Considering his outward personality is "Gems"
: I'll be honest, I played a fair bit of old Sion. Whether AD or AP, his kit was a clunky mess and the character itself was a joke. The rework however gave him that identity of an unkillable warmachine, but what made me truly love the character is the voice work, and the story it tells. Scott McNeil did an amazing job, but the writers who actually came up with the dialogue deserve huge praise too. Playing Sion, while in combat, you're this blood-lusting monster ready to destroy everything in front of you. But in those quiet moments, when you're just walking around, you really feel the emptiness that Sion feels. How he doesn't understand what happened to him, and how, deep down, there's still remnants of the man he once was, however twisted and shattered. How he hates what's happened to himself, but is unable to do anything about it before the hunger takes control of him once again. That's what makes Sion's rework such a success. The fact that you can identify with the character so much. The lore they wrote for him is absolutely amazing. The style they used with it works extremely well, the more simple writing for before the combat, and the real Sion coming out, if only somewhat and for only a short time, afterwards, before reverting back as he loses himself once more.
Sion is the most complex character in league, with the emotions of his screams, the emptiness, the pain, and the almost playful way he reacts to fighting, and the now subtle references to his old Voice (tucked away arnold references that are subtle enough for him to be his own character). The only reason they could get away with making such a character so deep and resonant, and different, was because he was a one off joke character. So nobody "really" misses the Sionan The Barbarian. Changing any other champion would likely have the same problem Fiora had. Even Poppy was a stretch too far for some, considering she was "kind of" a joke, but not as blatant and one off as Sion, so there is still a consensus that the changes for Poppy's character worked. Urgot could get a personality re-write, but he's still going to be Urgot, he's still going to be the ugly duckling. Re-writing him would be a chore, considering he's not even a joke champion (I mean arguable he could be a joke, but he was not made as a joke). I mean if we start looking at champions that need a re-write we start to see alot of the early champions. Kat comes to mind to me, but the problem is... I love Kat, she's my favorite character... but her characterization and personality is really flat and beyond the shallow part that I just love about her, there's nothing. She's a walking one-sided waifu pillow when you think about it, there's no actual changing needed, just filling in the details, for christ sakes at least put a second side of the pillow... But that's the problem, I don't want her to change at all, I just want her to open up and show some facets that we never saw before.
: Because really if any champ needs the aging thing it would probably be Annie who is forever 7 {{champion:1}}
Teen Annie update would be amazing
: Fiora, a cute and beautiful personality? What the hell? Rather than have people look down on her, she dueled and disgraced her own FATHER. She looks out for herself. I don't know how anyone could possibly think she had a "cute" personality, other than the fact that I'm sure at least some people though "She's a woman, she needs to be cute/beautiful or else nah". I'm glad Riot is becoming very progressive when it comes to making more diverse female champions.
Except that they didn't, they took an existing "tsundere" character and turned it into a Wasp. That's not progressive.
: "This just makes it seem like riot's artists and developers don't communicate with each other." I'm convinced that they don't, like most of their departments, they must work individually for the most part. I posted a comment on the Poppy post stating that the irises are adorable and over-exaggerated in the splash art, but the in-game model had very small irises that don't even get close to matching the splash art. When I saw the teasers for the in-game models, I was reminded of the character Disgust from the Pixar movie "Inside Out". The very same picture I'm referring to even has Poppy making a contemptuous face that almost exactly resembles Disgust. This is appropriately named given the emotion it invokes. She also has a rounder, chubbier face/skull in the splash art that, combined with large eyes and irises, gives a very irresistible appearance (must hug.. too cute). The in-game model? A pointy chin (those are popular now adays in Riot HQ) and small irises and narrow eyes. She doesn't represent the cute little girl introduced in her original lore, innocent and in despair from her father's death. No, she looks like some over-confident _woman_ with a bad attitude, possibly a service to fans of the old, unattractive sassy middle-aged-sounding woman that was Poppy. I say this is akin to the Tristana VU, who along with Poppy and Fiora, has been given the aging treatment. The fact of the matter is that when we are talking about aesthetics and loyalty to the characters, they weren't intended to be what they have regrettably become. These are supposed to be cute and or beautiful personalities, and every little detail matters.{{champion:78}} {{champion:18}} {{champion:114}}
Tristana's was an improvement, Poppy's was a step to the side (it is better work but it's not quite the champion they wrote about in the lore). Fiora's was a step backwards, she didn't need any modification and they gave it to her anyway, changing the way she looked taking away the playful french vixen and giving us the pompous french wasp, they did that without even changing the voice which just shows how ridiculously and hilariously bad the update was. Yet they know that it was bad, this post tells us that they "Know" it was bad, and yet they won't change it. We just have to live with this new shitty champion until riot abolishes all true damage. This entire post is the equivalent of "I'm not racist, I know I said I hate all black people. I swear I'm not racist, but I still hate all black people." It's unfortunate that riot can't say, "alright ChampUp you guys botched the Fiora visuals, try again."
: I was with you 100% until you said her old ult was badly designed and she was previously overpowered. Neither of those is true. Now, I'm only 75% with you. Everything else was spot on accurate though. Nice job.
Her ult, was and is badly designed. The old one was a "run, use the ult and it will either be enough to heal you up and kill them, or you will ult and immediately die because you are targetable at the end and you couldn't do enough damage." The problem with her old ultimate was that it was her main source of damage. While an ult is supposed to be that trump card, you pull it out once in a while to turn the tide. If you didn't have her ult before the update, you couldn't fight, you just literally couldn't. Honestly her new ult should have been something to make her a duelist, not a teamfighter. That's the biggest glaring point on it. It doesn't fit the rest of the kit, which is made to make her a duelist. It was a heal that allowed you to tower dive a 1v1, or you can use it to catch somebody out and make the teamfight. The ults are poorly designed simply because they don't belong on a duelist, her old ult was better, but it had too many points that made using it 1v1 worthless (CD/reduced damage/interaction with onhits) Fact is, her ult needs to be completely redesigned, to make her into a duelist. Honestly taking the same move speed buff it gives you, applying a slow to the enemy, and make an AOE slow that slows the target's allies by a substantial amount, and perhaps AOE damage to anybody standing in it, besides the target and Fiora. The idea being to keep it a 1v1, to where teammates want to just let the fight happen, rather than try to turn it into a teamfight. It should be the kind of ult that puts a teamfight on hold while Fiora duels her target. She's a duelist dammit.
: As a support main, I am very worried about the costs of health pots rising and the removal of mana pots. Most supports use those items a lot because they rarely get farm. Making it harder for supports to stay in lane is a worrying situation, so unless these refillable potions that you were talking about are cost efficient for a support to buy a support item AND these refillable items, you are going to make the lives of supports suck for a long time. Furthermore, the removal of mana pots is a huge issue for certain champions, such as every single AP mana mid, and several bot-lane supports. Losing those pots will kill the early game of many of these champs, as their ability to use those spells against champs who don't have that limitation (Zed, Kennen, Shen, Riven, Akali) is going to kill the laning phase for many champs. This impacts the jungle too, as it would basically require mid-lane champs to get 2nd blue. I can basically feel mid's who don't get that second blue calling "Open mid" or "AFK". Basically, please don't change mana pots and health pots. Those items are so key to support roles (and mids for mana), that it will cause a lot of issues.
You are letting your mana costs control you, you should not be relying that heavily on pots and blue buff, the secret is to not run out. The reason the jungler has dependencies on blue is because they have to typically spam abilities to kill camps. I swear to you, I haven't bought a mana pot in forever, and if I did, it was probably trolling around with builds to see if I could make something stupid actually work. I play {{champion:12}} {{champion:1}} {{champion:69}} {{champion:9}} {{champion:105}} {{champion:41}} {{champion:74}} {{champion:81}} {{champion:43}} {{champion:30}} {{champion:10}} {{champion:99}} {{champion:90}} {{champion:25}} {{champion:76}} {{champion:61}} {{champion:50}} {{champion:91}} {{champion:4}} {{champion:45}} {{champion:110}} {{champion:26}} All without mana pots or blue buff. It's all about keeping an eye on your costs, your supply, and the situation, a concept hard to grasp for many, but I think it's a bit dissatisfying to have somebody spam happy against you to keep buying mana pots to keep chipping you down when you have a better command of your character. The pots put them behind for a small convenience and hoping to catch somebody off their guard. But, I'm afraid I've never been killed BECAUSE of a mana pot they had, simply annoyed that I had to dance around a few more skillshots, or deal with a few extra homing missles. Fact was it felt like I was 10 levels above people when they used pots, especially if they couldn't use that extra juice to actually do something worth my time. I'm not saying I'm a challenger player with this, but mana pots are a crutch, not an edge.
: Are they getting rid of mana pots on ARAM as well? I know these huge feature changes usually focus exclusively on Summoner's Rift but mana pots were pretty dang important for some champs on the Murder Bridge.
{{summoner:13}} if you have mana problems on ARAM Pots are next to useless
: "Were gonna remove mana pots so champs that dont require mana are even more frustrating and difficult to deal with because we like to make things **balnced**"{{champion:84}} {{champion:85}} {{champion:238}} {{champion:55}}
Except {{champion:238}} is the only one of those 4 in meta, {{champion:85}} became a top laner, {{champion:84}} is not picked and extremely situational, and {{champion:55}} is too easy to shut down. Fact is, if you couldn't deal with them without pots, then you just plain picked the wrong champion to go against them.
Canastus (NA)
: Still no planned changes for Cassiopeia? It's been six months already and you still intend to let her stay in the gutter with the lowest recorded pickrate in her history along with an everlasting 45% winrate across all elos? Removing mana potions is just going to make her life even harder since I always had one in my inventory when starting a game, her manacosts are just too damn high. Just making the smallest mistake with her E-lasthitting at the beginning of the game can force her to recall since she won't be getting any of that mana back. Usually that mana potion was her insurance in case that happened. If you fail to return with a Tear after your first back, you'll be having an extremely hard time which can only lead to her losing the lane.
I never get mana pots on anybody, and literally never had a reason for mana pots on Cass.
: None of the champions they just listed use{{item:2004}} It was a Joke
But Darius doesn't use mana and he's not in the list.
: I don't think the change will stick. People are finally learning to ward properly so unless they make the trinket hold charges, IMO stealth wards will come back
Trinkets CURRENTLY hold charges.
: Preseason 2016 crests the horizon!
Still waiting for the invite to PBE, considering I've played cait since she came out, and liked her, since she came out, and still like her. And the changes seem to buff my playstyle. But, alas, they changed the way PBE worked and now I'm no longer able to log in.
: {{champion:34}}: This is where Angels came from? {{champion:1}} : Not Even Once {{champion:69}} : Flexible n shit. {{champion:131}} : Moon Powers= Night Activities {{champion:114}} : Excellent with swords {{champion:39}} : Excellent with multiple swords if you catch my drift {{champion:429}} : Blue Skin=Navi From Avatar= Hair Braid Firckle Frackling? {{champion:10}} : I guess if you have a thing for nuns... {{champion:89}} : Still raking in cash form her "Jimmy Delights Breakfast Sandwich" Lawsuit she filed against their mascot so ig she pays for dinner {{champion:127}} : Perpetually Nipping out {{champion:117}} : More Nightmares {{champion:25}} : Goth chicks are hot {{champion:61}} : That's my Fetish! {{champion:421}} : Uhhhh...how do you eve-nope, don't wanna know {{champion:113}} : Has a thing for Bears {{champion:16}} : Being Horny is always at the front of her Mind *Ba Dum Tss* {{champion:18}} : Uhhh fewer nightmares, but still, nightmares. {{champion:154}} : Hot for Zac is just anything over 154 Kelvin
What's with you and the "nightmares" regarding yordles?
: Forget URF. I'm bringing sexy back. {{champion:103}} {{champion:84}} {{champion:22}} {{champion:51}} {{champion:40}} {{champion:222}} {{champion:43}} {{champion:55}} {{champion:7}} {{champion:99}} {{champion:21}} {{champion:267}} {{champion:76}} {{champion:78}} {{champion:92}} {{champion:15}} {{champion:37}} {{champion:134}} {{champion:102}} {{champion:254}} {{champion:67}} {{champion:143}}
You include {{champion:78}} but not {{champion:1}} {{champion:117}} or {{champion:18}} 1. But you also missed {{champion:34}} {{champion:69}} {{champion:131}} {{champion:60}} {{champion:28}} {{champion:114}} {{champion:39}} {{champion:10}} {{champion:89}} {{champion:127}} {{champion:25}} {{champion:61}} {{champion:133}} {{champion:113}} {{champion:16}} {{champion:429}} But most importantly you missed the sexy beast {{champion:421}}
Sherrif (NA)
: The problem is, there's a serious doubt that you don't have reason to be reported. You said you didn't type anything toxic, but in fact you did say something... and if you were reported for it, you know that's why you were reported, you should look at what you said and rethink how you talk. I've gotten 1 punishment from the tribunal, two days I think, basically I played a lot of ARAM when it first came out and would be salty about the fact that it would constantly give me champs like Udyr. After maybe 20 games on howling abyss with a similar tone, bad rolls, losing games, people throwing blame at me, barking back was what I did. I know I was being out of line, I haven't done it again, the system worked there. Before that, and since then, I have never ran into punishments. I'm not having blind faith in the system, but I usually doubt people's innocence when they complain about their tribunal bans. In fact if you get a tribunal ban, and couldn't imagine why... It's a wasted ban, you won't be reformed by it, but that doesn't mean you didn't deserve it. If you're getting bans, and if support is not appealing them, just pay attention to what you say. You might realize something about the way you communicate, it's probably pretty negative. I prefer if the system was tuned to go after the passive aggressive players, those are the types of players that don't get it, they don't understand their "harmless" comments hurt feelings, and degrade their team's performance, which is apparently the problem. The strait toxic trolls will always be in games, and the bans typically don't bother them, especially if they're not permanent. They'll get reported, removed, and they will be back.
You type in a very aggressive tone, that's why there's serious doubt. You have a need to defend yourself, you have a need to put out a word, you have to have the last word, and on top of all of that you are getting chat restrictions. Fact is, I have a friends list of about 50 active people, none of them have chat restrictions. You're not learning that your behavior is undesirable, sure maybe people are not being nice to you. But biting back is what you're doing, you're not keeping a level head, even when I generically challenged the group of players you identified with. All I'm trying to say is that you're aggressive, here in this forum. Sure you're harmless, but if you were in my pre-made team and one of my friends spoke bad about you, I'd probably tell him to shut up in our call. But if you bite back and tell him how wrong he is for saying things, I'd take back any defense I have for you, report you both and move on. That aggression that you're exhibiting here is the reason you received your chat restrictions, and if you want to deny that, you'll keep getting them, and nobody will give you sympathy. I hear of people reporting me for x, y, and z they love to make it obvious that there's a report being thrown my way. But I never hear another word of it, no emails, no bans, no restrictions. There's a clear difference in our behavior, and while you, being front seat to your own actions and will always find your actions to be desirable, refuse to believe that if you were in your game, you'd report him. Loved the behavior experiment my clan did, where it took chat logs from OLD games people played, and essentially pasted them back at the people that posted them. More than half the people, in the heat of the moment, not remembering what they said, felt hurt by their own words... 90% of them said the opponent they played was very toxic.
Sherrif (NA)
: The biggest problem with "constructive criticism" is the fact that it's hardly ever said in a constructive way, and even then it's not a useful thing to add. People have a huge tendency to criticize people for making a mistake, not realizing how toxic and unhelpful it is to point out the mistake you know you just made. Nine times out of ten people know the mistakes they just made, and you pointing them out is only going to make it worse. The off chance that they didn't realize they made a mistake, it's unlikely you're going to be the one to convince them they did, and even then it wouldn't help matters. My guess is you're the type of person that has to chat all game, throwing in your analysis of every play your team makes hoping they'll improve as a player within the short time you're playing with them. You're not gonna help people improve their game that easy. Fact is, telling people they're making a mistake, complaining about their build, or strait being toxic because they fed is not going to make the game go ANY better. All of these behaviors are negative, simply because you're not going to convince them their build is wrong by complaining about it (in fact they'll likely refuse to build the better item even if they know it's better just to spite you), they can't undo the mistake they made by belittling them, and shouting at the feeders on your team isn't going to stop them from feeding. Fact is, you're worried the system is either gonna be to lenient towards negativity, or that the system will pick up on your passive aggressive negativity and you'll be looking at an auto-ban soon. Don't give people a reason to report you, use the chat window for what it was meant, not as your soap box to preach to your team the ways of victory. Promise you, the auto-ban system will not punish you for playing the game.
It would help if you read what I said, I'm afraid. Providing "Constructive Criticism" in a game of league, would be similar to going to a new job and criticizing the way things are done to the people who work there. You don't do it because, even if you're right, you don't know whether they made a mistake or actually don't know what the right move was to make. The former will feed into the frustration of already making the mistake. If they didn't understand the game, you telling them, no matter how polite you word it, is likely to simply cause them to feel that criticism is not coming from a source with a level head. On top of all of that, it's not a matter of whether or not you think you're only providing positive advice. If they take it as negative critique, it's negative. It doesn't matter if it was really "coming from the right place" fact is written word lacks inflection, making the tone and voice of what you say to be a subjective opinion, not a concrete. Meaning that no matter how you think you word something, somebody could read ANYTHING stated and turn it into a negative attitude with the right inflection. So critique in a field of emotions will quickly turn into slander. Best advice I can give any league player? Stop trying to give advice to your team, it's a proven that it won't improve their performance that game, likely it will make them perform worse, and it's possible that they, and the system/tribunal will agree you were being negative.
Lyte (NA)
: I'll be honest, a lot of players say this happens, but we've rarely seen it. Every player behavior system is backed by the Report System which analyzes reports. If a player false reports often, their reports have 0 value. If a player reports accurately, their reports actually get more powerful.
On a side note, a good change for the system would be to have it more verbose on the reports we make. Lemme know if the report I made was counted as invalid, or valid. Lemme know if the other player was contacted because of their behavior from that game, or a pattern of behavior. The more we know when we report people, the better WE as the players can do to improve how we behave simply by observing other's mistakes. On top of know how we can help by reporting the behavior even if the negativity isn't directed towards us, help us know.
Lyte (NA)
: I'll be honest, a lot of players say this happens, but we've rarely seen it. Every player behavior system is backed by the Report System which analyzes reports. If a player false reports often, their reports have 0 value. If a player reports accurately, their reports actually get more powerful.
I find this choice to be in poor taste, it doesn't matter how many "cry wolf" reports you count, fact is I report when I find a player to be a negative experience on the game, if it's not counting them because the vague threshold isn't being completely crossed, we have a problem. The system likely states these aren't worth punishment even though they go around with a massively negative attitude and need the system to tell them to chill out. While a ban from that one game isn't necessary, marking them as innocent after they've shown a negative attitude is wrong, you know that. If the system ignores them because it can't figure if it's really negative enough, what happens when you've turned off their ability to report (without telling them) and they get the dreaded 4 queue team that is only there to make you their punching bag. Hell, even if you do disable their report button, you just took away the victim's self defense mechanism. On top of all of that, without knowing how your reports are "graded" how am I to know what behaviors I shouldn't report for? I don't know how much weight my reports have, I don't know if reporting them is even doing anything. The behavior of the community is below a serious threshold, I'm finding that I could report somebody in 90% of my games. But if you're saying I need to save my reports for the guy that's getting a tsunami of reports in order to keep my ability to report.... What's the point of ever actually reporting? The problem is you're punishing the wrong people by having a report by anybody be taken as a negative. People losing their honor ribbons directly because of a report? No sir, wait until the system decides if the report is something to report before taking any actions. If it turns out somebody was reporting for no good reason, who really cares, throw out the report and keep going. Grading somebody's report validity as an average will only cause problems for that player, considering as long as a player felt negative/aggression from another player they should be in the right to report them for it. But I'm not against riot taking look at cases where multiple reports were thrown around and judge the whole case, who's innocent and who's toxic, and dole out the penalties to everybody who earned them. Whether they were reported or not. That kind of report backfire, go ahead, but if I get belittled by my team, or have the enemy who won their lane say "I haven't rekt a kid this hard yadda yadda" I shouldn't have to fear reporting anybody.
: Again no system is perfect. And when a system isn't perfect you can bet someone with intent to ruin another's day will go about in working their way around that very system. Doesn't matter how many kill switches you've got, no matter the number of people you've got checking the records to say "Yep he's a bad egg boot'em." Things like this aren't ment to be contained or controlled it's something that is and will be. But Riot seems to think otherwise as they've now initiated a literal PURGE for anyone unlucky enough to cross paths with a resident of Toxic city.
I'd like to point out to the "Egotistical Jerk" that replied said "No System is perfect except mine" That statement is incorrect, EVERYthing is imperfect, the universe is imperfect. Your system of splitting the playerbase will still have the non-toxic queue filled with toxic players.
: Do you think these features will restrict freedom of speech and further suppress the more vocal community? Considering anyone can mute a player in a few seconds why so much resources is being allocated to ban players for merely saying words. I think saying racist or sexist things should be frowned upon but punishing players for trash talking is crazy. What about a checkbox that a player can check on whether or not they want it, like the old XBOX matchmaking where players would be matched based on their personality. 1.Underground 2.Professional 3.Family
Freedom of Speech is not what you think. You have the right to say whatever you want, but that also means everybody has that right, and more to the point they have the right to call you out for being a dick. It also mean you are responsible for what you say, you're not going to go to jail because you wrote "Thanks Obama" but that doesn't mean that you have the right to write that on the bathroom stall. You're writing on somebody's property, sure they may pay an artist to put up a cool mural in the bathroom. But they don't have to sit and watch you deface it without punishing you. Fact is what you write in the chat here is on Riot's bathroom stall, they're nice enough to allow you to write all over it, but it's a privilege, not a right. Riot doesn't want your "toxic queue" option, they would rather remove the toxic people from the game all together. Fact is, if you check that box to play with toxic people, you have no right to complain when you get the trolls and the people that 4 man queue and complain at you the whole game. You checked the box didn't you?
: Then why don't you try fixing the reason people rage in the first place if that was the goal? What you're doing is the equivalent of turning on your air conditioning to fix global warming.
I've seen this response alot, care to describe what the reason people rage in the first place happens to be? I've seen those words multiple times, people claiming that Riot needs to get to the real problem. But I just don't know what that problem is, and nobody cares to describe it.
: Thank you! ^^^ being able to actually be reported in this game... is pathetic.... get rid of the report system. Riot is only tending to babies and turning gamers into cry babies and bitches.... its not even gaming anymore... its more like what can i do to get this person banned cause i will feel so much better about myself.... not how it works riot....
It's funny to me, the amount of posts here where it's clear that they get reported often, think they don't deserve it, but they likely do. You clearly have issues controlling what you say, and don't realize that people don't want you in their game when you talk this way. I can see that just from your knee-jerk responses here. The idea is not "report people so I can feel better about myself" it's get about getting rid of the problem to begin with. Sure, automated systems are rarely error free, but I don't think many people are worried about the errors. Mostly people are worried that when they get reported because they were negative, they'll be punished for it, without the safety net of a person looking at it and saying "He's a dick, but what he said wasn't worth a ban" Basically the sum of all the posts that disapprove of the new system come down to this, it's going to ban me because I'm kind of a dick. People shouldn't be able to call me out for being a dick right? Wait for the system to get a bans out to the wrong people, Riot will likely correct the issue, have faith, if it keeps happening the system will be scratched.
: > [{quoted}](name=Aithòs,realm=NA,application-id=Ag8jgd8Q,discussion-id=BvErb2td,comment-id=0053,timestamp=2015-05-21T02:07:17.442+0000) > > The problem here isn't the speed of the feedback at all... > > The problem is that there is no clearly defined, definitive set of rules for people to follow. You are essentially creating the worlds largest lynch mob, where the overwhelming majority of people in charge of punishments are teenagers who aren't mature enough to make those kinds of decisions on their own. > > Part of the problem is that it's far too easy to report, people don't consider reporting a big deal (on either side: reported or reportee) and so it becomes a weapon against people you didn't like. That's a big deal when it is a system meant for serious offenses and excessive behaviors. > > I wrote a huge post on this but I'm going to wait and make my own thread because this post is upsetting given my recent experiences. I think you have really good intentions and you're an intelligent guy, but you're still trying to treat the symptoms when you should be identifying and taking care of the causes instead... geting reported for gg ez is stupid if you can get reported for that whats left? you got problems if you did that bad or are jsut but hurt by some one saying ggez i want my rules i will follow them. there are none and the ones that they do have are supppppppper grey the world is black and white you did bad or you did good you did somehting or you didnt do something you think something or you dont think something when you start with maybes or buts you allow grey so what if you died so what if you cant win the lane? doesn't change the fact you made bad desicions and worse didn't ask for advise or follow it at that point YOU CHOOSE to make things harder for the other 4
The world is far from black and white... Good and Bad are subjective, it's an opinion. Popular opinion just so happens to say that certain behavior patterns are desirable and undesirable. Your knee jerk-jerk reaction to "GG EZ" being negative is proof that you don't understand that it's unnecessary negativity. Basically, if you believe that giving somebody "advise" is going to help, then you're probably in the camp of people that believe they didn't deserve their reports. I hate to say it, but if you have been banned, there was probably a reason for it, and until you learn what that reason was, you'll continue to receive them.
Aithos (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Menea6587,realm=NA,application-id=Ag8jgd8Q,discussion-id=BvErb2td,comment-id=00530001,timestamp=2015-05-21T15:42:39.563+0000) > > Well: > 1. That's simply not true because the overwhelming majority of players are college students, not teenagers. > 2. The Tribunals punished people more leniently than Rioters who are probably in their 30s or 40s for the most part, have a job and know responsibility first hand. > 3. The system is based on the metrics gained from the Tribunal. So if you were to be punished by the system, the Tribunal would have already punished you. > 4. There is only one rule in League and that is "Don't be a dick". If you really need to be explicitly told that you can't use X, Y, and Z in League when you would never yell them out in a public place in real life because you don't know if saying X, Y, and Z are "being a dick", then I question your moral compass. > 5. Only the most egregious people get banned permanently. If you get punished or warned, then take it as a learning experience like you do in real life. It's not the end of the world or the end of your LoL career. > 6. It is much more valuable to deal with Type I error (reporting someone who is innocent) than dealing with Type II error (not reporting someone who is guilty). The former can have an appeal. The latter continues to degrade the community. > > > It is very easy for me to say, "I have never been chat restricted or banned in game so there's no problem." I have been banned on the forums multiple times, and you know what? I deserved it because when I really look at what I posted, it was wrong. And you know what? When I play with friends who have been chat restricted, when I get to know them and their personalities and vices, they provide very little evidence that the system was wrong. 1) I can tell you right now that while the "average" age of players may not be teenager that's largely because older players skew the results more, the point I was trying to make is that teenagers and early 20s are by far the two biggest groups of players and there are far more in the 14-24 range than 25-35 or any other 10 year group you can choose. People who are 14-24 are largely going to be less mature. 2) The tribunal is gone an being re-worked because it was a bad system, and it wasn't lenient, people just clicked punish. There was also no context, there was no way to flag the teammates for punishment, it was a lynch mob and nothing more. 3) The system is a text search against a dictionary, there is no system. And I disagree, I would not have been punished by the tribunal because I don't insult people, I don't berate them, I don't say derogatory things, the vast majority of what I've been reported for are isolated things that someone either misunderstood or just didn't like. 4) It's not my moral compass I'm concerned about. I worked in retail sales/management for over a decade, I know what is and isn't appropriate to say, which is why you won't ever see me insulting people, calling them racist, sexist or homophobic terms or anything like that. The kinds of things I'm talking about are the kid who reported me last night for saying "you fed" in post game in response to him blaming the team for losing when he died 12 times in a 30 min game. I am talking about people who report for constructive criticism like "you should build armor against 4ad before completing 3 dmg items when you're the only tank for the team". 5) I'm not talking about getting banned. I'm talking about being punished, for not being toxic. I'm talking about being punished because either typed a lot or because you said something that someone didn't like. The system isn't supposed to be used for those reasons, it's to report people who were toxic, who had a significant negative impact on the game experience. Not just someone who rubbed you the wrong way. 6) I disagree, especially in a game like League of Legends where there is no actual harm coming of the latter. RIot says they don't punish people with prior punishments more easily, but that's BS. I got a second restriction entirely based on one set of reports from a toxic premade who harassed and abused me the entire game while I said NOTHING toxic. Once you get punished you get punished again for any mistep, justified or not and RIot deems you guilty no matter what. There is no appeal. They twist situations to fit their judgement, I've been going back and forth with them for weeks about my punishment and they have consistently misinterpreted and misrepresented the situations in my games to intentionally present them in a more negative light. I have been playing this game for almost 3 years, I've played thousands of games. I never had any problems until a couple months ago. I had all the honor icons, I work every game to try to lead and coordinate my team. I got the good behavior skin at the end of last season. Then I quit playing ranked and team builder and started playing normal drafts. Virtually every game is with a premade, and at least HALF of them are toxic and the toxic ones will report you for absolutely nothing. RIot's stance is: don't say anything or the report is valid. It doesn't matter if they called you racist, sexist and homophobic insults the entire game, it doesn't matter if they told you to kill yourself (which happened to me half a dozen times on the forums yesterday for disagreeing with people), if you so much as say "fuck you" when someone tells you they hope you get ebola and your whole family dies - valid report. That's straight from Riot support. Don't criticize anyone, don't defend yourself, don't point out obvious trolls to the enemy team, don't say anything that anyone might dislike or it's a valid report. They say they only punish serious and excessive behavior but that's not true, because every single game they can point out to me, if there was something inappropriate it was an isolated comment. Oh, and don't disagree with anyone, because apparently arguing, even if it isn't toxic is not allowed either.
The problem is, there's a serious doubt that you don't have reason to be reported. You said you didn't type anything toxic, but in fact you did say something... and if you were reported for it, you know that's why you were reported, you should look at what you said and rethink how you talk. I've gotten 1 punishment from the tribunal, two days I think, basically I played a lot of ARAM when it first came out and would be salty about the fact that it would constantly give me champs like Udyr. After maybe 20 games on howling abyss with a similar tone, bad rolls, losing games, people throwing blame at me, barking back was what I did. I know I was being out of line, I haven't done it again, the system worked there. Before that, and since then, I have never ran into punishments. I'm not having blind faith in the system, but I usually doubt people's innocence when they complain about their tribunal bans. In fact if you get a tribunal ban, and couldn't imagine why... It's a wasted ban, you won't be reformed by it, but that doesn't mean you didn't deserve it. If you're getting bans, and if support is not appealing them, just pay attention to what you say. You might realize something about the way you communicate, it's probably pretty negative. I prefer if the system was tuned to go after the passive aggressive players, those are the types of players that don't get it, they don't understand their "harmless" comments hurt feelings, and degrade their team's performance, which is apparently the problem. The strait toxic trolls will always be in games, and the bans typically don't bother them, especially if they're not permanent. They'll get reported, removed, and they will be back.
Aithos (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=PhDashing,realm=NA,application-id=Ag8jgd8Q,discussion-id=BvErb2td,comment-id=00530002,timestamp=2015-05-21T17:48:27.181+0000) > > "The problem is that there is no clearly defined, definitive set of rules for people to follow." > > There is: The Summoner's Code. You should give it a read sometime, it is quite excellent. No, it isn't. That's the entire purpose of my post, the Summoner's code is vague and Riot has acknowledged it is intentionally vague because they want the COMMUNITY to decide what is punishable. That's a problem, because that causes people to use the report feature as a weapon against people they didn't like, not against people who were actually toxic. That's why constructive criticism, poor sportsmanship and isolated comments are still considered valid reports. Who cares that the person did nothing insulting, nothing vulgar, nothing excessive, and nothing that affected the environment of the game (or anything in game at all) - if they did something you didn't like just report them. Then if Riot looks and there is any cursing (whether directed at someone or not) or anything that MIGHT under some circumstances been offensive it's considered valid. They don't even bother to look whether the situation warranted a report, they just look for guilt. That's why we need a more clearly defined code,
The biggest problem with "constructive criticism" is the fact that it's hardly ever said in a constructive way, and even then it's not a useful thing to add. People have a huge tendency to criticize people for making a mistake, not realizing how toxic and unhelpful it is to point out the mistake you know you just made. Nine times out of ten people know the mistakes they just made, and you pointing them out is only going to make it worse. The off chance that they didn't realize they made a mistake, it's unlikely you're going to be the one to convince them they did, and even then it wouldn't help matters. My guess is you're the type of person that has to chat all game, throwing in your analysis of every play your team makes hoping they'll improve as a player within the short time you're playing with them. You're not gonna help people improve their game that easy. Fact is, telling people they're making a mistake, complaining about their build, or strait being toxic because they fed is not going to make the game go ANY better. All of these behaviors are negative, simply because you're not going to convince them their build is wrong by complaining about it (in fact they'll likely refuse to build the better item even if they know it's better just to spite you), they can't undo the mistake they made by belittling them, and shouting at the feeders on your team isn't going to stop them from feeding. Fact is, you're worried the system is either gonna be to lenient towards negativity, or that the system will pick up on your passive aggressive negativity and you'll be looking at an auto-ban soon. Don't give people a reason to report you, use the chat window for what it was meant, not as your soap box to preach to your team the ways of victory. Promise you, the auto-ban system will not punish you for playing the game.

Sherrif

Level 147 (NA)
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