ChunLii (NA)
: It has Demacians hunting mages for sport. How is that not over the top
When did we start discussing morality?
ChunLii (NA)
: It has Demacians hunting mages for sport. How is that not over the top
Says the guy who doesn't know what hunting for sport is. Edit: You replied to your own comment... the irony.
ChunLii (NA)
: It has Demacians hunting mages for sport. How is that not over the top
I think you need to reread the story if you think the mageseekers are hunting for sport. I also think you need to read Rengar's story in order to get an idea of what hunting for sport really is.
ChunLii (NA)
: How is it subjective view? He is forming an analysis based on what he read. There is evidence in story:
No. There's evidence of persecution in the story, but there's no evidence of it being ridiculous; just like there's no evidence of it being intriguing. That's for you and you alone to decide, and that's what makes it a subjective viewpoint. An opinion.
: What would you consider a point?
A statement supported by evidence and not merely expressing your subjective viewpoint.
ChunLii (NA)
: You’re not making any sense. He did make a point which you have yet to dispel.
Because there's no point to dispel. He expressed an opinion. Expressing your opinion doesn't make it fact. There's no counter-argument to be made because all it would come down to is differences in opinion.
ChunLii (NA)
: I mean all you have to do is read story
But expressing your opinion isn't a point. It's just expressing your opinion.
ChunLii (NA)
: He did make a point: that Demacia’s treatment of mages is over the top and hard to take seriously. You, however, didn’t make a counter argument. You just attacked the person. Not nice.
> [{quoted}](name=Motonari Mori,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=HNAVlAAE,comment-id=00050000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-28T21:58:44.514+0000) > > He did make a point: that Demacia’s treatment of mages is over the top and hard to take seriously. You, however, didn’t make a counter argument. You just attacked the person. Not nice. That's just an opinion. What evidence does he have to support his claim?
ChunLii (NA)
: You didn’t argue his point. You just attacked him.
He merely ranted about finding the story ridiculous. He didn't make a point, he expressed a subjective opinion.
: Demacia's hate towards magic is so unreasonable that it's becoming comical. Honest to god, I can't take these stories seriously anymore. They're all the same: "Oh, look at how misguided and narrow-minded Demacians are! You see how magic can be used for good? Well, their fanatism is so overbearing that they can't, so they try to eradicate it despite all the negative consequences deriving from that course of action! Isn't that an interesting story?". No, it no longer isn't. It just makes me want to laugh at their stupidity now. Is this what the writers want?
Well I guess that's something you share with the story; a whole bunch of writing just for people not to take you seriously.
: ***
It's ironic that you call someone else snobby.
: > [{quoted}](name=Breezy Boyy,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=2m2XBvfk,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-12-16T03:03:18.086+0000) > > I wonder what her current form is supposed to represent, my guess is Demacia. With all the "justice" and "honor" and what not, you gotta bet that behind closed doors, they're probably into some kinky shit. I don't see how these things go together. If you're a nation that prides itself on honor and justice, what should be considered culturally attractive would be a fair, just, and elegant maiden, not unlike the ones commonly portrayed in stories of chilvalry. If I had to guess, Evelynn's current form (or how we see her in-game) has to be from a darker place, presumably Noxus (although, given how Noxus is so focused on strength, Evelynn should have gigantic muscles). Also, Evelynn is described as a "Horned Woman" in Vayne's lore, so apparently Vayne is into horns (or she chooses to interpret horns as something attractive for some odd reason).
Just because Demacians value justice and honor doesn't mean they have transcended beyond human nature. They're still humans, and as humans they're still susceptible to carnal desires. As a matter of fact, since they're so uptight as a culture, seeing someone dressed provocatively is definitely going to bring out their secret desires more than just seeing another modestly dressed person.
: To your knowledge is misplaced. The attackers from Ivern's bio were intended to be Vastaya, the only reason why it didn't explicitly call them by name was because Ivern predated Rakan & Xayah and the LU that followed those two. At that time Riot was only teasing the existence of Vastaya but that wouldn't suddenly make it debatable if it was or wasn't them. Adding to that, the Vastayashai'rei weren't human which Ivern's bio states the Chimeric beings were half-like in appearance, so it couldn't have been them either Anyway, your theory seems fine in thought and I applaud the attempt made but it's easily disputed and plainly doubtful. How anyone else could buy into it is beyond my comprehension, although a lack of prudence would be the culprit.
You're either forgetting or overlooking the fact that Neeko is Vastayshai'rei. She states it clearly in her special interactions. She's clearly a chimeric being as well so saying that the chimeric entities Ivern encountered were Vastayashai'rei and not Vastaya could very well be true.
: Is Warwick vegan?
I doubt it. I think it's even implied that he eats the humans that he kills.
: Why couldn't this story exist with the "Institute of War" still around?
Why add an element to the story that is unnecessary and stagnates character growth and story progression? If the IoW were to still exist then Yasuo and Riven would be wasting their time fighting matches instead of trying face their problems themselves.
Splision (NA)
: Or they could simply update his visuals and VO.
So are you going to address the points that I made earlier? Were you even notified? Just in case you weren't notified... A sadist is an individual who finds pleasure in hurting or torturing something else. Jhin is a serial killer, not an artist. He used to kill entire villages wielding nothing but blades before he was captured and locked away. Killing someone with a blade is more intimate than killing them a gun. He found pleasure in what he did and he finds pleasure in what he does to people. You picked out one phrase and ignored the rest. You even ignored the part where I said the Darkin and Shadow Assassin have the same abilities. >Right. The Ionians and the Darkin should also play differently because they are different beings and also the most interesting aspect of the new lore. So what you're saying is that Varus should get a VGU to fit his new lore. Thanks for finally agreeing with me.
Splision (NA)
: Or they could simply update his visuals and VO.
> Right. The Ionians and the Darkin should also play differently because they are different beings and also the most interesting aspect of the new lore. So what you're saying is that Varus should get a VGU to fit his new lore. Thanks for finally agreeing with me.
Splision (NA)
: Or they could simply update his visuals and VO.
A sadist is an individual who finds pleasure in hurting or torturing something else. Jhin is a serial killer, not an artist. He used to kill entire villages wielding nothing but blades before he was captured and locked away. Killing someone with a blade is more intimate than killing them a gun. He found pleasure in what he did. You picked out one phrase and ignored the rest. You even ignored the part where I said the Darkin and Shadow Assassin have the same abilities.
Splision (NA)
: Or they could simply update his visuals and VO.
Jhin is also a sadist and he's a sniper. Nidalee, Jayce, and Elise have different abilities when they transform. Shadow Assassin and Darkin play differently and have different stats, but they have the same abilities.
: A lore change to match his gameplay, maybe. You said “a revert”, which would imply that only changing it back to what it was and not changing anything about his old lore is the most correct option. You are saying that the old lore of Varus was better than anything Riot could have written for him. Saying that reverting his lore completely and not editing it to make more sense with his gameplay is the correct option is fine... but it’s your opinion. It’s not a hard fact. Saying it is implies that all other opinions are wrong, including those who actually like the rewrite. That’s a bit closed-minded.
How did Varus' pain and anguish come through so differently? He found out that his family was killed in the invasion and then turned to the goo for help. Damn I can totally feel the pain and agony. Lucian finding out that his wife Senna is one of Thresh's play-toys and hearing her screams within the lantern totally pales in comparison to that.
Splision (NA)
: Or they could simply update his visuals and VO.
This time you are actually wrong. Read the lore again buddy. Varus used a bow and arrows before he was sealed away. He then used Valmar and Kai's bodies to create a new body for himself. The problem was that he couldn't completely purge their minds so now he has to deal with them taking mental control from time to time. But the fact still stands that Varus the Darkin was a bowmaster that used blighted arrows against his enemies. He was/is sadistic but the fact still stands that he used bow and arrows before he was sealed away. Why does there need to be a mechanic that ties in the multiple personalities? Rhaast still has the same abilities as Kayn. Like I said all he needs is a VU and a VO to go with it. The multiple personalities can be worked in through the VO.
: A lore change to match his gameplay, maybe. You said “a revert”, which would imply that only changing it back to what it was and not changing anything about his old lore is the most correct option. You are saying that the old lore of Varus was better than anything Riot could have written for him. Saying that reverting his lore completely and not editing it to make more sense with his gameplay is the correct option is fine... but it’s your opinion. It’s not a hard fact. Saying it is implies that all other opinions are wrong, including those who actually like the rewrite. That’s a bit closed-minded.
But you liking the old lore doesn't justify keeping a gimmick that's common among comic book characters. There are other champions that seek vengeance for the loss their family members and loved ones. Varus isn't unique in that regard. {{champion:236}} {{champion:21}} {{champion:67}}
Splision (NA)
: Or they could simply update his visuals and VO.
It does. The Darkin, Varus, was known for being a bowmaster that used blighted arrows against his enemies. His weapon of choice and fighting style never changed in the new lore so his current gameplay fits with his new lore.
Quepha (NA)
: But that is also a fact which clearly follows from the other facts I have stated. There is a disconnect between his new lore and his gameplay which Riot has acknowledged. Riot puts gameplay first and Varus's gameplay is of high quality. Therefore, his gameplay should not be drastically changed. Therefore, the only remaining thing that can be changed is his lore.
Or they could simply update his visuals and VO.
: A lore change to match his gameplay, maybe. You said “a revert”, which would imply that only changing it back to what it was and not changing anything about his old lore is the most correct option. You are saying that the old lore of Varus was better than anything Riot could have written for him. Saying that reverting his lore completely and not editing it to make more sense with his gameplay is the correct option is fine... but it’s your opinion. It’s not a hard fact. Saying it is implies that all other opinions are wrong, including those who actually like the rewrite. That’s a bit closed-minded.
I'm a devoted player, too. Your opinion is no better than mine.
Quepha (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Splision,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=yGuE7i8u,comment-id=0000000300010000000000000000,timestamp=2018-04-24T03:42:22.733+0000) > > He needs a VGU Wrong. Varus has an iconic gameplay kit that is fun and accessible to players of all skill levels, healthy for the game in terms of play/counterplay, and carves out its own niche in terms of strengths and weaknesses among the cast of adcs. A dramatic change to his kit to risk destroying this delicate balance in order to better match a lore update would be a grand sin. The most correct route for making Varus into a cohesive whole would be a lore revert.
That's an opinion. Not a fact. So far I've enjoyed most of the new lore that the narrative team is pumping out, and I've also enjoyed most if not all of the VGUs as well. Aatrox, a champion added to the roster after Varus, is getting a VGU. I don't see why Varus shouldn't.
GenoXx (NA)
: Confessions of a broken blade. Part 2! It's here
I'm going to call it now and say it was the priest. He told the bone washer to keep a vital piece of evidence to himself and he seemed to be aware of the power within Riven's blade.
Quepha (NA)
: False. It makes Varus less cohesive as a champion in a way that can't be solved without completely changing his gameplay kit. That damages the gameplay experience of League of Legends which Riot's manifesto states is the most important part of the game. Varus's rewrite is an objective failure according to how Riot evaluates their own work.
Varus' lore rewrite wasn't a failure. He needs a VGU but that doesn't mean his lore rewrite was a failure.
Terozu (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Scathlocke,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=f3TR76fs,comment-id=00060002000100020000,timestamp=2018-03-02T22:25:31.133+0000) > > This is exactly the case. Rek'Sai's brood are the spawn of a Voidborn creature, not Voidborn themselves. > > Also, are all rabbits the same? All cats? All humans? Citation. The spawn of a voidborn is not a voidborn. It is voidborn spawn.
Where in that quote does it say that some of Rek'Sai's brood were born in the Void?
: > [{quoted}](name=Splision,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=1A7opPmI,comment-id=000100000001,timestamp=2018-03-04T13:47:18.432+0000) > > She was still with her sisters in one of the tales of Ornn so I doubt things will change in that sense. Riot's done really "out there" changes before lol. At this point it's like trusting a chimp won't throw poop at you just because you tell him you like the outfit you have on right now.
But all of those "out there" changes have been with old champs that didn't receive lore in quite a while. Yes, Lissandra hasn't received lore in quite a while, but why would Riot's narrative team bother mentioning Lissandra and her sisters in a new champion's story if they didn't intend to keep that aspect?
: im fine with an update but they better not change her entire lore about having been human and her sisters. If they just add to it to further explain stuff that'd be nice.
She was still with her sisters in one of the tales of Ornn so I doubt things will change in that sense.
Terozu (NA)
: Well until that rework he is voidlimg spawn. And fyi he always came out of a breach. His daddy was still in the void. Also a quick check of the queue says thats not true. And even if it was, it would be equally possible that hes still void spawn not void born.
But if he came from a breach and wasn't born in Runeterra then that means he was born in the Void, and since he was born in the Void that makes him a Voidborn regardless if he's something else's spawn or not.
: What if Kassadin is Jaheje from Rek'Sais color story?
I was thinking the same thing when I read Kassadin's bio yesterday, and it's a strong possibility since the nexus article mentioned easter eggs that us lore heads might pick up on.
Fasmodey (EUW)
: What is Void then lul? A pocket dimension serving as mega large af Fortress of the Watchers? When did Watchers get that much power up... They are beings incapable of defeating Iceborns.
They created the Iceborn and controlled all of Valoran using them. They were also plenty of losses for the Iceborn before they were shoved into the abyss.
: So they've been around since the dawn of the Universe
I don't see why not. They created the Void; not the known universe.
: Did they officially turn the Watchers into Voidborn? Do you have a link? I'm a little salty if they did. I was big into that theory back in the day, but it kept getting shot down because the Watchers were specifically something else. EDIT: Nevermind, I see it.
They're not Voidborn. They're masters of the Void and more than likely made the Void itself.
: > [{quoted}](name=BonzaiBuddy,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=Eyi9XZZZ,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-03-02T17:18:07.931+0000) > > The watchers aren't voidborn. Void born are the creatures MADE by the Watchers, the Void as a whole was the product of the Watchers just like Lissandra''s black ice. Now we I don't think we know that they made it...Its said "waiting through the eons until its masters, the mysterious Watchers, mark the final time of undoing."
Even if they didn't make it, they're not born from it. Thus they're not Voidborn.
: The Watchers are now Voidborn? Not gonna lie that's a little disappointing.. .
They're not Voidborn. They created the void itself.
: Are you allowed to divulge any information about the Watchers that were mentioned? Or are we to wait for even more to come?
The ghost shopkeeper on aram gives some pretty good insight into the Watchers.
: Excuse me but i have my doubts about about the part of the new lore that says "Though it has bred many of them, no two horrors of the Void are exactly the same." Because the Zz Rot Portal {{item:3512}} and the Voidlings of Malzahar show me a different thing.
> ...no two horrors of the Void are **exactly** the same. That doesn't mean that some voidlings aren't very similar in appearance.
: Did I miss something or did the Kai'Sa story not address her sanity at all?
She never entered the void.
: There is a LOT to talk about with these, and they're very interesting. I'll do a quick bullet-pointed list for people who don't have the time to read right now, but want to get the basics. Although you should read them, they're good. **"Where Icathia Once Stood"** -Icathia was once conquered by Shurima, before they rebelled, which is when the story takes place. -The narrator is part of the Kohari, an elite group of Icathian warriors. -There is a Kohari by the name of Sai**jax** who wields a large polearm, is wary of the Void, survives the story, is a master of combat, and has an apparent love for eggs. That all sounds...a little familiar. -The Kohari attempt to fight off an invading Shuriman army, including some Ascended, by having their priests unleash a mysterious power. It's the Void. The land is covered in Void Goop, the corpses are mutilated and changed, and the city is warped by the Void. The narrator begins to slowly lose his mind as the story ends. **Kassadin** - Kassadin is not his real name. It's the Shuriman phrase "Kas sai a dyn" ("whom does the desert know?") poorly pronounced, and it stuck when said constantly by people looking for him. -Kassadin is a skilled explorer and archeologist/treasure hunter kind of guy. -One day, he returns home to find his village destroyed, and his wife and daughter nowhere to be found. This is Void doing. He learns of a "Prophet" who may be trying to pull the Void back into Shurima. -He uses his connections from work to craft his signature armor, using talents from Zaun and Ionia, likely among others. -His sword is a Shuriman weapon called the "Nether Blade of Horok". -He sets out for Icathia, ready to kill the Prophet, or die. Or both. **Malzahar** - Malzahar is a Shuriman orphan who grew up as a street fortune teller. He got famous for being very, very good at it, but could never see his own destiny. -Sick of watching the gaps in wealth and despair that society brings, Malzahar leaves his hometown of Amakra and starts to roam the wastes. -While alone, his visions get worse. He sees how terrible people can be, and what awful things might occur. -He stumbles into the ruins of Icathia, and is touched by the Void. It...changes him. -Malzahar now sees an end to the suffering: FEED THE WORLD TO THE VOID. He sees himself as a savior. -He accumulates followers with his newfound powers, convincing them to make sacrifices and offerings to the Void to appease it. Of course, they're really only helping it along. **Kai'sa** -Kaisa is Kassadin's daughter. You probably already knew that. -At age 10, her village starts doing...weird shit and sacrificing animals to the "dark powers below". She sets a herd of sacrificial goats free, and they run off into a canyon. -This seems to please the Void enough, because it erupts, destroying the village and trapping Kai'sa underground. She survives on the debris for a few days, and continues to move deeper and deeper into the chasm. -Surprise it's full of Voidlings. She kills one with a knife Kass gave her, and after its "death", the creature seems to merge with her. This is the symbiotic suit. -Trapped for "almost a decade" in the caves (which are not ACTUALLY part of the Void, this is important, she has NOT actually been there), she decides it is imperative to keep the Void away from Runeterra. -Her name changes from Kaisa to the much more voidy "Kai'sa" to reflect her status of being from "two worlds".
Don't forget it was mentioned that Sai**jax** had mottled skin... And of course being the badass that Sai**jax** is, he killed one of the Asended, or one of the god-warriors.
: Kai'Sa Login Screen
For me every login screen is good, but damn this one is fucking epic. League of Legends doesn't even have a show yet and I'm already hyped imagining her theme playing in the middle of a battle.
: > [{quoted}](name=Splision,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=dmIzTEKQ,comment-id=000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-21T05:09:45.681+0000) > > Why are you using a translation as the basis for your argument and not the lore written by the narrative team in the US? If the lore was originally written in English in the US then it stands to reason that the version of the lore you should be basing your arguments on is the English version and not the translations. You didn't get downvoted for using a canon quote you got downvoted for using a literal translation of a canon quote which can change the intended meaning of phrases. > > For example the Spanish translation of the English "you're welcome" is "de nada" but if you were to take the literal translation of "de nada" in English it would be "give nothing". "Give nothing" isn't the same thing as "you're welcome" in English, but it has the same intended meaning as "you're welcome" in Spanish. Your example is a compound phrase, that is not the same as a single word. The work of the translators is to keep the intended meaning of phrases intact, **avoiding literal translations**. If the intended meaning of the phrase was different they could have translated the phrase as: "Jax y sus compañeros" or "Jax y su gente" or "Jax y sus camaradas" (and more)... But they choose "Species" for a reason. Also, even in the old lore, no one knew the actual race of Jax... Why would we know his race now?. And even without counting the translation, the narrative team of the US used the word "kind", whose synonyms are: order, genus, species; breed; set. So, in the original context the word "kind" can be used to say "Jax and the members of his species" as well.
The old lore isn't canon anymore. Evelynn wasn't a demon in the old lore. She was an assassin for hire. Mundo wasn't corrupted by the void in the old lore. He was scientist that created a chemical that transformed him. Jax's race/affiliation was unknown in the old lore. That has nothing to do with the new lore. Now he's one of the last survivors of Icathia, a region that is known for it's affiliation with void portals and we know for a fact that exposure causes mutations (ex. Kassadin, Malzahar, Mundo, and that male Marai who was supposed to be the Tidecaller). With that in mind it's not difficult to postulate Jax is an Icathian human that was exposed to the void. If he were not a human and a completely different species then there would be no reason to imply void mutation, that is, if he were a completely different species than human then that in itself would be a sufficient explanation for his purple skin and other strange features.
: > [{quoted}](name=Arakadia,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=dmIzTEKQ,comment-id=0000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-21T02:49:28.408+0000) > > I don't think translating the word into a different language and using it in a similar way still makes the quote cannon. Kind could go either way, but translating it into another language which changes the meaning isn't fair. Well, it is an official translation made by Riot... Sometimes the use of words in different languages can give us more information than the English language but it doesnt mean that it changes the meaning. For example, the Trailer of the Last Jedi in a language (I think it was Turkey) made it clear that Snoke was talking with Rey because he used a word that is only used when talking with females or something like that. And just to be sure that the translation is canon here is the link to the page of Jax in spanish: https://universe.leagueoflegends.com/es_AR/champion/jax/
Why are you using a translation as the basis for your argument and not the lore written by the narrative team in the US? If the lore was originally written in English in the US then it stands to reason that the version of the lore you should be basing your arguments on is the English version and not the translations. You didn't get downvoted for using a canon quote you got downvoted for using a literal translation of a canon quote which can change the intended meaning of phrases. For example the Spanish translation of the English "you're welcome" is "de nada" but if you were to take the literal translation of "de nada" in English it would be "give nothing". "Give nothing" isn't the same thing as "you're welcome" in English, but it has the same intended meaning as "you're welcome" in Spanish.
: > [{quoted}](name=WOOOOOOOOHOOOOOO,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=pdirzjNT,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-14T16:44:07.604+0000) > > Literally everything is magic {{champion:136}} A god who controls the cosmos Scien-.... oops wrong argument xD
Nagakabouros would like a word with you.
: Where it gets interesting is when you get into the questions. *What is* magic? Where does it come from? What makes some things more magical than others?
I feel like the universe is a software program and magic is the code that can be used to hack the program.
: My body is ready
Not with clots in your system.
: > [{quoted}](name=Splision,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=h44fEzAQ,comment-id=00020001,timestamp=2018-02-10T06:24:06.048+0000) > > I could be wrong but look at what was added with the edit; "...the R ability will be able to one shot other void creatures...". So either Kassadin's daughter has been corrupted to the point that she appears too monsterous to even be considered corrupted, or the new champion is a voidling. ... dude... you REALLY think that the tooltip is real and what they say about one shot void creatures is real as well? No way, its a joke. And anyways, they might be talking about the herald and other creatures, not that the new champion is a void creature.
I never talked about the tooltip. I talked about the comment the rioter left behind which is corroborated by the teaser in the video. I definitely hope that tooltip is fake, especially with that last passive (I ain't got that type of BE to spend). It's true that the phrasing by the rioter could have been a mistake, but as it is used in the comment the rioter is stating that next champ is a voidling. I'm not saying that it is I'm just saying that based on the semantics of that phrase. If the intended semantics were as you stated then they would (or at least should) use a phrase along the lines of, "This champions R ability will be able to one shot Herald and other void creatures (including Baron)...".
: And Swain says the "girl who came back" line, like he does to Kassadin. Seems pretty heavy-handed that it's Kass's daughter.
I could be wrong but look at what was added with the edit; "...the R ability will be able to one shot other void creatures...". So either Kassadin's daughter has been corrupted to the point that she appears too monsterous to even be considered corrupted, or the new champion is a voidling.
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