Rioter Comments
: The feedback for Blood Moon Elise initially versus the changes that hit PBE yesterday were about the same, actually. (I've been collecting feedback for the skin.) The team's aware of player feelings for both the initial color, as well as the color most currently on PBE. We've been discussing it.
Have you ever considered renaming the skin, and picking a different jungler for the Blood Moon line at a later time? From what I have noticed the people who don't like the pink are concerned with the quality of the blood moon skin line, and the people who don't like the red are concerned with the quality of elise's skin line. By doing a rename, everybody wins. What about pink Masquerade Elise?
: > people were outraged that male monsters could look as crazy as Cho'Gath, but female ones had to keep a human form. This is a lie. No one, but a whiny minority of the population wants or cares about a Chogath-like female monster champion. Much like I am a minority of the population that wants a hot male monster champion with a human form. This narrative of "we are the people" needs to stop because you aren't.
Naturally, I can't talk for everyone, but did you see the threads when Zyra was announced to be humanoid? Every other thread was about sexism and body types. It was almost impossible to get a word in edgewise. These are the people I am talking about.
: Random [ran-duh m] adjective 1. proceeding, made, or occurring without definite aim, reason, or pattern: I don't think anything about Gnar's transformation is in any way, shape, or form, random. By any definition. Uncontrolled? Yes. But not random.
Perhaps this is true. Still, being hit by one stray shot at one wrong moment can completely send you spiraling out of control. This is how I see it as random. Technically nothing in league is truly random (even crits can be influenced), but it is still out of the player's hands. I suppose that is the point.
GreenLore (EUW)
: Overall riot has started to experiment more with champs than before. I mean look at Braum,who is the first tank who actually tries to tank the damage for his team. However while you are right about riot doing stuff they originally didn't want to add,they do keep some kind of control over these things,so that they don't get out of hand. {{champion:150}} has no control over his transformation,but it still depends on ingame mechanics,if you don't want to transform,then you can still try to avoid damage and stop attacking the enemy to cool off,you can also trigger the transformation early. So while the transformation is not fully controllable,it is still controllable to some extent. {{champion:268}} has untargetable minions,most likely to reduce the amount of micromanagement that would be needed(I mean what if you would also need to worry about protecting your soldiers?) {{champion:429}} has to offer the black spear to her ally,so the ally can flat out refuse to take the spear if he doesn't want to loose control over his/her champ at any point.It is like you actually sign a contract that allows kalista to break this rule And well about Rak'Sai: Riot said that they are nowadays ok with monsters,because in earlier times they tried to make champs appealing to everyone,but since we have already so many it is ok if some champs only appeal to a certain group of players and not to everyone. There were other problems with omen the one was that he didn't have a clear archetype,while Rak'sai clearly is a tunnel digger/land-shark/sandworm and the other one is that it was hard to tell if omen was a ranged or melee champ.
All of these adjustments are made so the champion is cohesive with the current roster and doesn't break down their own foundations. I think it is quite a good thing, as they still explore these new mechanics and realms of design. The face that they are adjusted for the LoL environment doesn't diminish the fact at all in my eyes.
: > While Zyra is a cool and interesting champion, people were outraged that male monsters could look as crazy as Cho'Gath, but female ones had to keep a human form. Some people maybe ... sexy monster girls are my achilles heel, so I was rather pleased. Elise less so because they missed out on a glorious opportunity to make a true spider girl ... but still. What I find funny about Rek'Sai is this is _Excatly_ what I felt should have been done with Kha'Zix: they could have easily called Kha female with no other alteration and it would have worked out fine. I like monsters. I like monster girls. No way I'm outraged at either.
Not everyone was outraged, but did you see the way the forums exploded? I'm not saying monster-girls that are humanoid are bad. There was just no variation (other than maybe Anivia) until now.
: The invoker champion must happen. It could be implemented like the game Magicka, where you press a combination of 2 or 3 buttons and it forms a spell based on those elements. For instance, the first button you press could determine its element, the second button whether it's a skillshot or a wall etc... Now let's hope Riot breaks some other rules they have set for themselves even though the world has shown them that those rules are unnecessary, like "loss forgiven when a player leaves encourages toxicity" and "voice chat is bad" (both proven wrong by Dota 2).
I've been hoping for an invoker-esque champ since I started. It would be epic, and is more likely now than ever.
Sharjo (EUW)
: Hey Azir's the closest thing we really have to true micro in League at this point.
This is basically how I meant it. Have you ever had to control five or six units at once in DotA? It feels a lot like playing Azir.
: I expected it to be iluminati {{champion:161}} {{item:3078}}
Oh, you "expected", did you? http://i.imgur.com/UVNcrGx.jpg
Visys (NA)
: For some reason I expected this to be a complaint thread.. Glad I was wrong.
While I can't say I agree with every decision Riot makes, but hey, I'm no game designer, what do I know? They are a pretty awesome company that makes, runs, and maintains one of the best games I've played. They take waaaay too much **** on a daily basis, and deserve positive credit where it is due.
  Rioter Comments
cshakes (EUNE)
: What would you think of [these](http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/story-art/0meyHZxw-blood-moon-elise-color-changes) color edits? These like what you were looking for?
I like the last one a lot. Blood moon needs reds and whites. I'm just glad riot listened to some of the community feedback. They are cool like that!
Xemeron (NA)
: So, I saw that new champion, RekSai
I was just about to make this thread. I LOVE her style! Riot did so much right here. Plus, a fifth champ from the void means all void team is possible. I am curious though...what makes a Champ like Rek'Sai acceptable and Omen bad. She breaks every rule that made them throw omen out. I'd love to hear some designer's perspective on the subject.
: About time y'all check the PBE... Blood Moon Elise is now red! EDIT: downvoted for giving a reminder *before* OP edited his post? Aw, come on! I was doing him a favor!
I just saw the update! The top post has been changed!
: I'd also add Yi as a potential for the final Blood Moon in the jungle role - although he's already got a good bunch of skins, he hasn't really got a high quality classy one, outside of headhunter IMO. Also mixing his eye lenses thing with a demon mask? Could be pretty bad ass! XD But also Lee Sin, Wukong, Udyr are ionian enough to fit the bill in the jungle role. On the demon side as you said, Nocturne shows a lot of promise, Elise could, but it would resemble her classic skin too much with the colours unless they drastically alter the model, also Maokai (tree demon), Evelyn and Hecarim could all be notable additions for the final skin. Or perhaps even some champion they haven't released yet!
All of those seem like solid picks to me. I wouldn't even mind if it was Elise with a different skin. Maybe once this is resolved the community can do a poll on it.
AbodyHUN666 (EUNE)
: night hunter rengar can toggle his hood??
Yep! It is awesome! Just by using taunt, joke, or laugh. Just like Neon Strike Vi's glasses and Heimer's walk cycle.
catraven (OCE)
: a questionable buy anyway, but i wouldn't get it if it was red. the pink 1 is good.
I actually quite agree - the skin looks great! It just shouldn't be blood moon unless it changes.
: Yeah, but I see where you were going with your photoshop edits, and we all appreciate your efforts for providing a comparison. The simplest solution - renaming the skin so it fits with either the Marquis (Marquise - in Elise's case as she's female) or Masquerade line of skins - is the best one. Hopefully Riot shows some thematic sense and does this. As for an alternative to round out the Blood Moon team in the jungle position - perhaps Blood Moon Vi, Xin Zhao, or Sejuani...
I agree that a rename is the best route. She goes with a lot of other themes much better than blood moon. A rename would let Elise have the skin, Riot have the money, Blood Moon have a better lineup, and a happier community. Everybody wins. almost any jungler would be great, but I really lean toward Nocturne to carry the whole Ionia/Shadow Isles tie in theme. I could totally see Xin getting away with a sweet blood moon skin too. Lots of possibilities!
: Jinx shoulda got a bloodmoon skin. I can totally see her wearing a creepy mask.
We already have an ADC on the team - the last one should be a jungler. Fitting with the Ionia/shadow isles theme would be preferable in my opinion.
: I'll upvote this, Elise should have been dressed up as a Geisha with a simple Kabuki mask, (this way pink could still work) and her spider form would be inspired by Jorōgumo, the spider queen demon of Japanese folklore+^_^+{{champion:60}} {{item:3151}}
That would be amazing! And very fitting too.
Takran (NA)
: The real reason people are getting twitchy about Blood Moon Elise.
Updated the top post with community suggestions for more fitting skin groups. Feel free to share thoughts and ideas!
Aimi (NA)
: More like "Order of the Lotus" Elise to me but I still like the skin.
That fits well too! I'll add some stuff to the top post. I agree that it is a good skin, it's just not a blood moon skin.
: i dont play elise. never have. as someone who doesnt care for the champ i will say, i LOVE the skin. BUT what i DONT love is that its counting as a blood moon. the colors are off, and the mask is as well, like you said. recolor and change the mask? sure. or rename it and make it its own skin/ pair it with someone else similar. hell, add some hearts and now its Heartseeker Elise. which really? that would be awesome. think about it. shes literally going to eat your heart, unlike Ashe and Vayne. they could then give the last blood moon skin to a jungler like Eve, and that could be a kick start to her VU/GU too
Heartseeker would work really well too. I know it is a silly thing to be bothered about, but there is just so much wasted potential right now. Blood moon can be one of the most awesome skin lines out there, and the Elise skin could be a great addition to another set. A little rename is all it would take.
Knalxz (NA)
: TBH I really don't like how the Shadow Isle just took over the Blood Moon Skins. Before it seemed like an Ionian thing but now its just out of a wack. Its like Orcs from Mordor going out on a play date with Hobbits.
> TBH I really don't like how the Shadow Isle just took over the Blood Moon Skins. > > > Before it seemed like an Ionian thing but now its just out of a wack. > > Its like Orcs from Mordor going out on a play date with Hobbits. I feel it fits, since the whole blood moon thing represents the Oni (demon) characters in oriental theater. Having the demonic shadow isles and the oriental Ionia meet seems like a match made in heaven to me. Ninjas who play in the theater intermingled with actual demons? So amazing! I am toying with the idea of Blood Moon Nocturne - imagine him in a blood moon mask...It would be amazing!
551202 (NA)
: @Riot: Why {{champion:84}} and{{champion:60}} do not wear their mask (on their face) like the others {{champion:429}} {{champion:98}} {{champion:412}} ?
You know what would be amazing? Toggle-able masks like rengar's hood and Vi's glasses.
: If they didn't want it to look like her base skin, then choose a different champion to get a blood moon skin, elise doesn't even make sense. Shen and Akali both fit because they are ionian and it is culturally accurate to the lore behind their region. Kalista and Thresh both make sense based on the statement that Riot made about blood moon Kalista being based off of local Ionian legend about her (supposedly, Thresh has a similar reason). Elise just has no reason to be in this skin line at all. They could have chosen almost *any *Ionian or shadow isles champ other than elise and it would have made more sense, *and* they could have chosen a champ that doesn't require compromising the aesthetic integrity of the line just because it looks like the base. This just seems like Riot getting lazy and sloppy about skins.
I am really thinking the idea of a rename is a good one. Elise gets a better skin as intended, Blood Moon gets a new jungler, and everyone wins.
: > Now's she too red. I agree she should be more red, but not like that, she's pretty much all her gracefulness that the skin is supposed to have. Honestly, I wish they would just rename the skin. It fits the theme, but I think it could still be something else. ^ Marquis Elise. There - simple, easy and ties it in to another skin which Elise's present 'Bloodmoon' actually matches nicely:
This! Or Perhaps Masquerade Elise. Compare her model to Eve - it would fit the theme well. Frilly masks, skimpy pink/purple/blue attire, and shadow isles friends: http://i.imgur.com/rtyCBiG.jpg EDIT: also, when working on the photoshopped colors, there were few surfaces I could turn white without it looking weird. I agree on too much red.
Atuko (NA)
: Can Blood Moon Elise please be red like all the other Blood Moon skins?
I did some red recolors here: http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/story-art/qxiX85Qj-the-real-reason-people-are-getting-twitchy-about-blood-moon-elise I think it is looking quite a bit better in terms of the blood moon line than the pink one does. as a stand alone skin, pink is fine, but as a blood moon skin, it kinda hurts the quality of the whole line.
: Exactly! I really hope they do a bit more work on her, it has so much potential to be awesome. It just seems they put most of their creativity into Blood Moon Thresh who i think looks freakin amazing, totally fits the theme.
Oh yeah! Blood Moon Thresh and Kalista are amazing, and spot on! They fit well with Shen and Akali too. I LOVE what riot did with them, and it is why I am sad to see the last one choke like this.
: The pink doesn't fit, I understand their preference on this but it should remain red if it wants to be apart of the whole blood moon reference, as well that mask.
I think it either needs a recolor and a little mask tweak, or a rename. I think the reasoning was sound in a vacuum, but as the final member of such a team, I think it helps to think of it on a grander scale.
: Personally i dont like the Blood Moon Elise skin, i feel it is the worst of the line and even as a stand alone skin its lacking. Its not a bad skin but to me i feel it is just lacking that Blood Moon feel. Admittedly it does look a lot better red than pink, but it still doesnt live up to the other Blood Moon skins. There seems to be a demon/horned mask theme with the others that hers doesnt have. Her outfit is also not as flashy or noticeable as the others, i find i need to zoom in all the way to even see the details of it, whereas the other you can just look at and see the details. Overall its just lackluster to me, but this is just my opinion of course.
I can completely agree that her mask is out of line too, but again it comes largely to colors. All blood moon masks are thick, with a red and white palate, and have horns of some fashion. Elise's is Pink and gold, and is mostly dainty filigree, and is only a half mask. It's like comparing these: http://i.imgur.com/JB746Ug.jpg http://i.imgur.com/ZalDb00.jpg Both are good, they just don't belong together.
: I don't really understand Riot's argument that she already has red abilities so red would look bad on her. Look at Thresh, he's got both both that's okay. Maybe I'm missing something.
The idea is they don't want it to look too similar to the base skin, which has red particles. I think it is wise to want to make it unique from the base skin, but not at the cost of undercutting the blood moon skin line. I think the particles are fine as is - it is just the texture that needs a recolor to match the rest of the line.
Rioter Comments
: Way cool! I really like the idea!
Thanks! I hope some more people take a look at this. It could make for an awesome QoL change in my opinion.
Zarxis (NA)
: I think Kha'Zix should be able to get all 4 evolutions in every game. In his current form, he's always a nightmare to balance because one set (in a particular order) of evolutions is always dominant. Look at Viktor. He was stuck always taking his Death Augment until Riot finally reworked him. Kha has had his optimal set of evolutions changed almost every other patch... I understand that the idea of Kha'Zix's evolutions is to pick 3 that fit the situation, but one set of three is almost always better than picking that one left-out evolution in the same way that Viktor's Death Augment was almost always better than taking either of the alternatives.
I didn't think of that, but you make an excellent point. Evolution would be more about picking what you need in a given situation as opposed to picking one specific path. That will do a LOT to help balance him out in the long run. I'm adding that to the top post.
: Rengar has far superior DPS both burst and sustain. Khazix damage is astonishingly low for a single target assassin.
While I believe that the both Rengar and Kha'Zix both have strengths and weaknesses in their kits, in all my tests (playing as both Rengar and Kha'Zix with a few different friends) Rengar won 8 out of 10 fights at full build. The only times Kha'Zix won was when he took Rengar by surprise, getting most of his burst off before Rengar could respond. Part of the reason I think it would be healthy for The Hunt to not effect Kha'Zix's final evolution is because he will always be valued in context of Rengar's current power level. I don't think Kha is necessarily in a bad place right now, but he feels weaker than he is because Rengar tends to outclass him when they go 1v1.
geogio13 (NA)
: I very much think that the idea of apex predator would work out well, as it encourages the team to do more than just act in the lane war. Plus it is thematically brilliant.
I honestly think that having a late game jungle based objective like "Slay Baron at level 18" or "kill every large jungle monster on the map once." or some such thing would be a cool way to help Kha'Zix experience full evolution without Rengar. It provides a good incentive to have Jungle and objective awareness.
: Actually, Rengar gets increased vision range while in a bush, which is helpful. Otherwise, I'm thinking a Randuins, then full damage Kha could kill a Rengar. All kinda depends on if you can surprise the other.
I actually didn't know that! At least Rengar has something to gain. I still think it needs some alteration though. Every Kha'Zix wishes they could reach stage four. I don't think I know of any Rengars excited about extra bush vision. In fact none of my Rengar-maining friends even are aware of this. I still think Kha should have some method of attaining a fourth evolution point without rengar, them maybe have the hunt grant one of them extra bush vision. As long as Kha'Zix is limited by the event, the champs will always be valued in relation to each other instead of for their own merits. Plus for Kha'Zix, it's more about experiencing a fantasy - he is one of the only champions with a large portion of his kit sealed off in most games. Even Viktor can fully evolve now.
Rioter Comments
: Community! Tell me your skin ideas.
do-do-do-do-do Inspektor Viktor Also, warring kingdoms yasuo would be a boss!

Takran

Level 30 (NA)
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