Prandine (NA)
: In regards to mastery level, that's not a good indicator of champion skill since it only indicates how much a person has played said champ. Other people have already talked about idea 1, so I'll just say that there's a reason these ideas haven't been implemented; because they aren't effective or guaranteed tools at tackling or deterring trolls.
I will 100% concede the mastery level requirements, it was a thought that after some discussion doesn't hold any weight. But I'm failing to see how increasing the level wouldn't be effective. This is however under the assumption that riot is doing anything about trolls to begin with. Could you elaborate at all? Is there any suggestions out there that are better? Do you have any suggestions? These boards are a lot of naysayers without anyone actually offering anything.
: > [{quoted}](name=Terrim,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=4HYRPEME,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2019-10-22T03:12:31.472+0000) > > yes it does, because I won't have to waste 20 mins of a game with a guy trying to ruin my fun. > > Kind of a silly question don't you think? You won't have to waste 20 minutes ever again? No one else will ever try to ruin your fun? Are you sure?
so because you can't catch everyone you shouldn't try to catch anyone?
: Does this make the game more fun? Yes or no? If the answer isn't yes, then it is no, and its a bad idea.
yes it does, because I won't have to waste 20 mins of a game with a guy trying to ruin my fun. Kind of a silly question don't you think?
Jansuo (EUNE)
: Yes, he remains unpunished but god forbid if you start flaming them. On my EUW account, I went from honor 2 to honor 4 in like a few weeks, I kept carrying, being honored, I rarely used the chat, and even when I did, it was to say things like "wp". I was happy to have a winstreak but then I got a troll in my game. After 10 minutes I called the troll "a spoiled brat", and at 15th minute I called our toplaner brain-damaged because he pressed NO-surrender (hate being held hostage in a game that is 100% lost). After the game -- 10 games chat restrict. Did the troll get any punishment? NOPE
I got a 10 game chat restrict for telling a Gragas who started with a cull, took no smite, and 10 mins in he said he was taking a break to "roll a blunt" but never came back to "die in a fire"... he's still playing
Syrile (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Terrim,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=4HYRPEME,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-10-17T22:20:39.602+0000) > > I don't believe you could automate that system, there would be way too many false positives and far too much backlash, but from a players point of view there is nearly no system at all. They monitor hate speech, and some toxicity, but as far as actual in game events (int feeding, afk without disconnect, and just trolling ie gragas in the jungle with a cull) nothing seems to ever be done. I know tons of programmers that disagree. In fact, I have seen them function in tons of games. Riot simply has no interest in doing so. Would it be hard to automatically detect a player that was spawning and running straight down mid over and over again, dying within seconds of spawning? I doubt it. And that is just one thing out of many that can be used to detect this.
I am a programmer, I can tell you you're not taking into account all the variables. For instance, what if it's a brand new player, they really don't understand the basics of the game, they end up going 0/50/0 in their first 10 games in pvp, they get picked up by the automated system and punished for it. That to me doesn't seem fair, they could put more effort into their system though, it's extremely lacking as far as everyone I've talked to (aside from the community on these boards who go around sniffing each others farts). They can't catch them all with an automated system, it's just not possible. But they could be catching a hell of a lot more.
Kei143 (NA)
: If they don't engineer a new system, it would mean someone has to manually pull the games and upload the games for the community. Which is pretty much human resources used not for production purposes. --- --- --- Now I'm just going to talk about the cases for gameplay reviews, as the verbal reviews are already 99.9% accurate. Those other companies and games are FPS games, where games last 5-10 minutes. The size of the reviews is also different, where population is also different, where overwatch has a population of 40million but LoL has 80 million. LoL also has alot of different ways it can be played in compared to FPS games. Different ELOs play alot differently and low ELO players may not be able to identify when something is actually intentionally done. This means that LoL games requires alot more review time compared to FPS games. The knowledge needed to properly judge a gameplay is more intense and alot of misjudgment can happen. At the end, it's still the Rioter's call on whether someone should be punished. --- --- --- While I'm not opposed to the community doing some pre-screening for disruptive gameplay for the Rioter, im not sure if itbsolves the problem space you are looking to solve. If the problem space we are looking to solve is to provide visibility to the community that their reports and reviews are being taken seriously, then a community concept like [Monthly Report Cards](https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/player-behavior-moderation/aFmEtAVK-riot-should-add-monthly-status-cards) probably would do a better job. If the problem space is about getting rid of trolls, then it'll be faster to let the Rioter review it alone, and not have a community input. Visibility, speed and accuracy. Tribunal can answer 1 part of it, but not the other two. Tribunal is not the only solution to the system's poor visibility.
I agree with 90% of what you're saying here, the tribunal was inefficient, there's no doubt on that but the IFS may be accurate on 99.9% of verbal cases, what about the game play cases? Even in the Ask Riot you quoted they spoke on how it needs improvement in those areas. Visibility is a massive issue, it really feels as though people just do what ever they want in a ranked game and it doesn't matter. If you come to the boards and mention it you're called a troll yourself, so whats the fix? Everywhere on the boards I see people shooting down ideas or suggestions but offering none of their own. We just continue on doing nothing? Why is it that verbal transgressions are so heavily monitored but intentionally ruining the fun of the game for others isn't?
rujitra (NA)
: This isn't a shitpost at all. It's completely valid to tell you that you need to look within yourself. Millions of players play while seeing a troll in *virtually no games* - so if you're seeing more "trolls" than that either you are mislabeling people as trolls who aren't, or you're doing something to cause them.
had he come in and said something like that, sure lets discuss it. Let's discuss what he is saying vs. what I am saying. Let's see if maybe I am the reason, lets have a discussion or a debate about it. He basically jumped in and said "No you're a troll".... grow up Posts like that are why millions of players don't come to the forums, it's well known with almost everyone I've ever played with over the last 9 or 10 years (not sure when I made my account, but it was a very new game then).
: **YOU** are the one that cares about attention and being taken seriously, and when you don't get your way, it devolves into personal insults.
*YOU* are the one who suggested I was the troll first, whats that about personal insults? Go shitpost someone else I don't care about attention at all, I would like to see any other suggestions, or a debate about my suggestions. Hell maybe I am the troll, that very well could be, but if I am, I can guarantee you are with the posts I've seen of yours all over these boards.
: Loading in Late ever since i was given the new Client
same boat here, I load in at the very end of the carousel, get a random champ/item. No issues beyond that, no fps issues, and only started on patch 1.19. Music starts playing at the end of the loading screen, then just stays on loading screen. I tried dropping all graphics, tried playing boarderless, tried full screen. I get no issues in SR, 100 fps on average, never above 32ms ping.
Kei143 (NA)
: They cross the line when they intentionally want to lose the game, that's the only line that will be drawn.
I can respect that, but what happens to these people who intentionally want to lose the game? I report them, never see confirmation of the punishment. This is why I would love (but don't expect) to see the tribunal come back, at least then it felt like something was happening. Now it just feels like a free for all as long as you don't flame or use hate speech.
: I don't need your permission to post or reply **anywhere**, got it? You want to win games, stop looking at how you can change everyone else, and look at how you can change yourself.
you don't need my permission, but you're as bad as the trolls in the game, you shit post people all over the boards and expect me to take you seriously? you're a joke, and a bad one
rujitra (NA)
: For the time it takes them to get that *first* account to the new level, then yes, it would delay. But after that, it would have no noticeable difference from today. This is the same as if you raise the price of something - you'll see a drop in people purchasing it immediately, but when it normalizes, it'll be back to around normal (this is for certain commodities). Alternatively, if you create a dam blocking a river, and don't let any water through, eventually the river will overflow and start flowing normally again. There's literally no benefit - nothing would change, because the following: * Trolls who want to troll will be slightly delayed, but they don't come in "packs" so the only benefit is for them to get their next account up to a higher level. Many of these players buy accounts or bot them to a higher level to begin with, so there's really no benefit here. * Trolls who troll in one game because they get pissed off won't be discouraged by this because they aren't discouraged by the risk of losing their account now - a higher "barrier" won't provide any more discouragement than the barrier already does.
all you did was reword your other statement, you offered nothing else. In other words, I still 100% disagree with your logic. They don't come in packs: exactly my point, they need to level their account to be in ranked, which would take longer to get there. Longer gap between being level 1 and level 60 means that the amount of trolls at level 60 would go down, not by a lot but at least it's something, if you can't see the math behind this I don't think I can help you any further. Trolls who troll in one game because they get pissed off won't be discouraged by this because they aren't discouraged by the risk of losing their account now: by riots own statistics the majority of people who are punished once don't re-offend, this would cause even less of them to re-offend because it's a higher barrier. Your logic is flawed.
Syrile (NA)
: It is a myth that there is no way to build a system that can detect most types of trolling. It is purely a choice to not do so that allows this type of behavior to continue.
I don't believe you could automate that system, there would be way too many false positives and far too much backlash, but from a players point of view there is nearly no system at all. They monitor hate speech, and some toxicity, but as far as actual in game events (int feeding, afk without disconnect, and just trolling ie gragas in the jungle with a cull) nothing seems to ever be done.
Kei143 (NA)
: If that's the case, the IFS is well suited for you. Automation eliminates all bias and everyone gets treated the same. If your question is "I said this but got punished, yet the other guy that said worse is roaming Scott free", then let's have you understand the behavioral system a bit more. Think of it like a health bar (or tension meter) in music games. When you hit the note at an off beat, your tension meter increases. When you completely miss a note, the meter increases by alot. When you hit the note at good timings, it reduces the meter. Riot's behavior system works the same way, as in we all have a toxicity meter attached to our accounts. When players are mildly toxic, it goes up a tad. When people use hate speech, it pretty much fills up the meter. of course, clean games reduce the meter. It is possible for playerA to get punished and playerB not to, even though playerB was waaayyyyy more toxic . Let's say playerA started the game with the toxicity meter at 95% and playerB's at 35%. Ingame, playerB said some pretty nasty shit and playerA responds with some shit as well. After the game, playerA gains 10% toxicity and playerB gains 50%. Now playerA is at 105% toxicity and gets punished, whereas playerB is at 85%, and not punished in that specific game, even though playerB was found to be 5x more toxic than playerA in that game.
I don't care about toxicity, you can say whatever you want to me, frankly as soon as someone gets toxic I mute them, toxicity means nothing to me and frankly I don't think it should even be monitored, but it is, so I try my best to follow the rules. I never once stated anything about "I said this and got punished, yet the other guy that said worse is roaming Scott free" this post wasn't even about that. This is about the people who actually intentionally ruin games: afk, taking no smite in jungle, int feeding, or going in with the intention of losing. That's my issue, toxic people in chat get punished, I know that first hand, I got chat restricted and frankly I deserved it, but the people who go in with the explicit intentions of losing the game seem to go free. I've never once gotten a message saying they've been punished for a report. Now when the tribunal was around, I know people like that got punished because we would be told if they were. One of the main issues with the tribunal was that it gave rewards for punishing people (it's in an ask riot post, quick google search for tribunal brings it up), but I would gladly do it just to try and improve the community. Taking 15-20 mins to review a few cases before I play a game to get rid of some of the people that make the game less fun, count me in.
rujitra (NA)
: You are asking what’s wrong with inconveniencing innocent people for little or no benefit? Trolls who want to troll either are the type that won’t care how hard you make it, or the infrequent trolls who don’t even troll that often such that it’s hard to differentiate from them having a bad game. The first category won’t care and will still troll. The second category won’t be affected by this at all because they don’t even troll in a vast majority of games, making it hard to detect. Thus, virtually no benefit, but a large inconvenience for new players or those on a secondary account.
it still takes longer for the trolls to get into ranked, less trolls at any given time: benefit. You're making a new account, cool, it takes level 50 instead of 30, you take the account a bit more seriously, less likely to throw it away: Benefit. infrequent trolls would be less likely to infrequently troll because it still runs the risk of being punished: benefit. Even if it's a small benefit, it's a benefit. If it's only your second account whats the big deal getting to 50 or 60 instead of 30? You're not likely going to do it 10 times, just twice. This would also make people less likely to buy an account that is out of their rank, ie buying a plat account for the rewards. The price would go up because it takes longer to get there, less people would be willing to do it, and it takes more time to get it done. I appreciate the discourse but I completely disagree with your logic
Kei143 (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Terrim,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=4HYRPEME,comment-id=000200000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-17T15:04:09.285+0000) > > As much as I agree with this comment, I got trolled in 5 games in a row playing ranked. Meaning the trolls were on my team 5 games in a row. Most time times when people claim the are trolls in every game, they have a pretty bad misconception of what a troll is, and probably wrongfully accusing others of trolling.
As much as I understand this, and I will admit they may not have all been trolls, but I had an Eve start building AD then swap to AP mid game, a Nami last pick as ADC then build support, a Nautilus that went afk 3 times for about 3 mins each time... the others were essentially a bot lane starting fights even though they're 0/6 and the enemy adc is 12/0... the last one I can say probably not trolling, maybe just a bad game but where is the line between intentionally feeding and having a bad game? Do they not realize they can't win the fight anymore?
Kei143 (NA)
: You think the tribunal would pardon your actions? It won't.
thats kind of the point, I don't want to be pardoned for any of my actions, nor my speech, but I don't want others to be pardoned either. I'm not looking for special treatment, I want fair treatment for everyone.
: > As much as I agree with this comment, I got trolled in 5 games in a row playing ranked. If you're seeing a troll in every game, you might be the troll.
you're such a sweet heart, I'm looking for constructive criticism, not just shit posting... feel free to join the discussion or move on to another thread.
rujitra (NA)
: The problem is that by making it take longer for trolls to troll ranked, you’re making it harder for innocent players to play ranked as well. And if someone really wants to troll, they will, regardless. Further, mastery locking would greatly inhibit the ability of teams to swap champions or pick order, which is an oft forgotten yet extremely powerful tool to help win the game in champion select.
That I had never thought of, very good point with the swapping champs. As far as the innocent players, whats wrong with that? They get more practice time before they jump into ranked. If you're talking about smurfs then I still don't see the issue, if you want to smurf it takes a bit longer to get into ranked, but if you want to troll getting your account perma banned is more of a detriment, getting 5,6,7 accounts banned and wasting time to get back to level 50 or 60 is a deterrent
Get2 (NA)
: IDK, I get trolls in my game, and I just assume it's pretty much a loss, and I can go do something else for 15 minutes while objectives get blown to smithereens from a team that is deadset to lose. Eventually, I will be in a match where the enemy team has trolls, and I am about 100% certain that troll accounts are flagged and distributed in this way to "promote equity" in the vigilant 51% WR formula. But yeah, some investment into the account would be nice. But level 30 still takes a bit of time and so does getting the 20 champs. Unless you want to pop 20 bucks into the account. If that's how people want to spend 20 bucks, it keeps the game free for me. But yeah, I tire of this season's trollfest. It's been pretty interesting. Then again, I fixed it by waiting until basically last week to start ranked, and spend most of my time in ARAM. Can't really troll ARAM. <3
As much as I agree with this comment, I got trolled in 5 games in a row playing ranked. Meaning the trolls were on my team 5 games in a row. I enjoy the climb, but not when the odds are stacked against me, ARAM is nice and all but I found it gets old and I was playing it in customs before it was an actual mode, I can only take a few games before I'm bored. I think more investment in an account is the best method, they want the champs and spend money, like you said keeps the game free for us, and it keeps them out of ranked for a little longer. I get trolled in a draft or blind pick, oh well it means nothing, I'm gonna go in and have fun. I get trolled in ranked and it's just frustrating, I'm here to put the effort in, they're here to negate my effort.
Get2 (NA)
: Something might need to be done, but can it really? People who troll are dedicated to their cause. Maybe if they had to pay monthly for the game? IDK.
so let their dedication take a little longer, that's kind of my point. At the very least we get more of a break between the trolls, takes them longer to get their new account into ranked so in theory there would be less of them at any given time. You can't get rid of trolls completely in anything, I'm a realist, I understand that no matter what you do some people just want to watch the world burn. But as of right now it feels like nothing is being done, I'm not saying nothing IS being done, but it does feel that way.
: Did you just take the worst two ideas from the thread below this one and pretend they're your own?
didn't see the post below this as I was making this, nice attitude though, you must be fun at parties.
Get2 (NA)
: You'd have to have a level 50 or 60 account, and 20 champs at mastery 3 or higher. You see the problem here, yes? Why not just say that accounts that aren't at least 5 years old can't play ranked. Might as well.
so make it mastery 1 even, but isn't doing nothing even worse?
Terrim (NA)
: Suggestions: Deterring The Trolls (Not Trundle)
Also, bring back the tribunal. I loved being a part of the process, and it actually felt like people were getting punished for once. We're getting punished for defending ourselves yet the people actually causing the offence go on like nothing happened. I'm not a model player, I get tilted, I get flamed and flame back. But the tribunal made me feel like at least some people were getting justice.{{champion:10}}
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=Terrim,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=3dcOubAp,comment-id=000f,timestamp=2019-10-16T21:14:31.347+0000) > > I'm in the same boat, I got a chat restrict for telling a a Gragas jungle who bought a cull, only came to lanes to take minions, and took a 15 min break to "roll a blunt" to "burn in hell". I'm sure it wasn't the only time I was reported and have done my best to change my attitude towards the game since my chat restrict, but I don't think I should have lost my ranked rewards over that. I was in my S1->G4 promos while he did this, I could have said A LOT worse to him. > > So I feel you, and from what I was told by support he may have been punished and I wasn't notified of it. I doubt it, didn't ease my grief at all, just suck it up and deal with the fact that riot hates bad words but not bad human beings. I don't think they get punished unless you are notified of their punishment via the pop-up in game. Im not sure tho.
> [{quoted}](name=ScrubRogue,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=3dcOubAp,comment-id=000f0000,timestamp=2019-10-16T21:41:30.866+0000) > > I don't think they get punished unless you are notified of their punishment via the pop-up in game. Im not sure tho. from what I'm told by support they may have been punished and I wasn't notified, it's not 100% effective at notifying people. That's what the mod told me through a support ticket anyways.
: Second year of season rewards I am missing and people still get away with int feeding
I'm in the same boat, I got a chat restrict for telling a a Gragas jungle who bought a cull, only came to lanes to take minions, and took a 15 min break to "roll a blunt" to "burn in hell". I'm sure it wasn't the only time I was reported and have done my best to change my attitude towards the game since my chat restrict, but I don't think I should have lost my ranked rewards over that. I was in my S1->G4 promos while he did this, I could have said A LOT worse to him. So I feel you, and from what I was told by support he may have been punished and I wasn't notified of it. I doubt it, didn't ease my grief at all, just suck it up and deal with the fact that riot hates bad words but not bad human beings.
Tomoe Gozen (EUNE)
: I don't agree with you. I've felt like Riot went out with a bang on their 10th year and announced a lot of cool new games and things to look forward to. League has a big preseason patch ahead that's, like always, changing up the gameplay and evolving the map so i'm always excited for that. A new champion (Senna) to celebrate, possibly Fiddle and Voli reworks hitting the Rift soon after her, My Shop, Login bonuses, OG URF, animated series set in Zaun, (close to anime/movies people have asked for years), and 5 games announced. Although you can argue that new champs, reworks and pre-season changes are nothing new since they come out every month (two months) and pre-season is a yearly big patch, Riot in my eyes have exceeded my expectations with just how much they've announced the upcoming stuff. I've been playing League since S1, which is also 10 years as a player. I'm not gone and i don't have my one foot out the door yet. I've experienced League changing over the years and personally, League has become monumentally better than what it used to be way back in the day. I don't feel nostalgic by looking back because i've been playing League for all this time. Many friends that i've played the game with have left the game for various reasons and RIot's never going to 100% pander to every player with every patch or new release - myself included. Riot's made mistakes and they'll keep making mistakes. We've also made mistakes and called for buffs/nerfs/changes that ended up making the game worse and yet we don't own up to them, we shift the blame. I've long since stopped trusting the shared voice of this community and i've started using my head to figure out if something is bad or good for me. But by experience doesn't speak for everyone which means that every player has their own bad/good changes that Riot puts out. Finally, the expectation from Riot isn't that League retains as much of the veteran players as possible. As with life, people move on for various reasons and pretending as if Riot not showering vetarans with gifts/respect or changes aimed specifically for them at every possible opportunity is a bad thing, is a moot point. I don't want to be treated as a special player nor royalty. Just as i've picked up League 10 years ago and stuck with it to this day, the same way will someone new today embark on their 10+ year long journey. --- As for the new games, i'm only interested in Legends of Runeterra and animated series ARCANE. Heartstone wasn't my thing as i've never liked to play WoW, despite being that player who immensely loved WC3 and TFT expansion and love the story Blizzard crafted over the years and expanded in WoW. Gwent is really fun but for me came a bit too late once my Witcher 3 hype died down (and playing Gwent in-game). I'm not interested in Artifact (Valve's card game) and it's being reworked as we speak. But as a 10 year long League player, i'm certainly interested in a card game of a game i've stuck to playing this long. ARCANE is going to be fun as it's likely the setting in Zaun and when Vi and Jinx were young. So we're going to see the origins of certain champions or at least, have some more of their mysterious backgrounds/upbringings revealed. #All in all to me, this is a big celebration for both Riot and League and i'm proud to be a part of this journey.
I am 100% behind you, this game has evolved like so many have not. Over the course of 10 years most games slowly die out and LoL has evolved and changed to keep players interested, I've been around a long time, at least since season 2, if not season 1 (unsure of my creation date). The new games looked incredible and I'm really excited to try them all and hopefully stick with 1 or 2, the FPS looked very interesting even if it was lacking a plethora of new characters although I'm sure there will be more than the 3 we saw and the top down dungeon crawler is something I was really happy to see after hearing there would be no more co-op events (I for one loved the star guardian and odyssey events). I can agree with some points, tanks have gone the way of the dinosaur, you do nearly no damage causing you to use at least one item for damage, and you're blown up rather quickly even if you go full tank. But does no one remember the tank meta and how much people complained about it? The damage scaling is a little ridiculous compared to the tank scaling, some bruisers seem harder to kill than most tanks, and assassins have gone off the rails. But the game is always adapting and changing, the meta will change again. My only real negative that Riot has done is the balancing, we're seeing champs get buffs because they have a skin coming out, or nearly every champion that gets reworked/released is crazy overpowered like it wasn't even tested. I understand that balance is a never ending fight, and you will absolutely never get it perfect, but it does sort of feel like they're not even trying anymore. All in all, I'm super pumped, I got chills a few times during the video and that's all that matters. I'm excited for where Riot takes this and excited to see whats next. I kept thinking Riot is just hording money over there, taking in all this cash (minus the charity donations, applause to that) and doing nothing with it. Now I see they've been doing tons! Developing that many games, music videos, and an animated series... that takes cash and balls and colour me impressed!
: Orrrrr you could just build 4 Wilds into your comp. Because in order to get max yordle, you have to get Tier 4 Gnar, and use 6 team slots, when you can get 4 wild with T1 WW/Nidalee, T2 Ahri, and T3 Rengar. You're much more likely to get 4 wilds before you get 6 yordles, and you have more room for other things. And having undodgeable autoattacks synergizes with glacials/rangers/gunslingers which is the stuff that yordle's typically counter. I'm sorry you're mad that your comp get's ruined by a team of at least 6 champions, and you can't counter their counter to your bs with 2 recurve bows.
except the fact that you can turn anyone into a yordle now, Garen yordle is absolutely broken, magic immune while spinning, stuns don't stop his spin, and you can get him to 100% dodge.
: Gangplank is getting Deathblade stacks for killing his barrels.
Can confirm, I was just coming to the forum to post it, every barrel destroyed seems to count as a kill

Terrim

Level 223 (NA)
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