: Nah, The difference between ranked and normals is huge. You cannot reciprocate the same learning environment you get in ranked, in a normals game. Maybe they can lock people out of playing a new champion in ranked UNLESS they have at-least 1 normal game under their belt with it, but a whole patch is excessive.
of course the difference is huge, going into ranked to leran the basics of a champion though is not okay. You can leran advanced mechanics and interaction sin normals, just possibly not niche situations. This is 100% false.
: That's why sylas was so overpowered on release right? What about Kayle now, with everyone saying she's dogshit. You completely missed the point of my post so congrats to that.
I addressed the exact point you're making in your text. If the point you are trying to make is somehow hidden in the text and I need to read between the lines to address you're argument, that form your argument in a more understandable matter. I addressed what I can read, and not what you are thinking as you type an incoherent argument.
: For a patch? No. Here's my question, How would you tell if that champion is released weak or not? Norms? That's not the best environment to really show champion strengths and weaknesses. So they'll be unplayable for two whole weeks, Riot will have no idea on what worked and what didn't unless they take normal games full of randoms at face-value, so they might buff or nerf the wrong things. Instead they could do nothing, and then, let's say kayle since she's the most recent, would be released to ranked with no changes and people would still be upset because "Omg don't pick her she's so weak stop inting in my games!" All together this is a terrible idea.
You do realize they over buff released champions while people are learning to use them then pull back the buffs later or have to nerf them because people figured out. All in all the balance process takes weeks to months anyways. forcing people to learn the champions before evaluating balance would be just as efficient or more so. All together, youre opinion is not absolute, calling something a terrible idea based off your 1 opinion is just idiotic.
Rioter Comments
: If you build crit everygame the win rate drops even lower because you int? LOL
and it does not "pop off" super hard, if you build crit when youre behind you will never do comparable damage to an adc building crit lol. Have you ever even played gangplank recently? Or do you just want to tell me what you know about a champion you have 0 experience on?
: While GP can proc melee grasp with his Q he cannot be buffed in any shape or form.
Maybe so, maybe make it count as ranged grasp proc and then give the mana refund
Alzon (NA)
: Yes, but does his primary build include crit? If the answer is “no,” then that’s why his late game winrate is so terrible. Crit may be much weaker early-mid, but it pops off super hard later.
If you build crit everygame the win rate drops even lower because you int? LOL
Rioter Comments
Yenn (NA)
: There needs to be some form of accountability for these idiotic balance changes
Agreed champions get forced into meta with insane buffs (like reksai) and champions will be left weak and underperforming for months or even years at time.
: Ranked and Riot, We need to Chat.
Not to mention there's a built in incentive in ranked to not try when you get off role, so dodging should be less painful to compensate for the new ranked system encouraging not trying. I suggest just adding 1 free dodge a day with no wait and no lp loss, then the second dodge being how the first one is now etc. I also reccomend just putting a dodge button in champ select theres no reason to need to close the entire client anymore. Dodging has been around for a while just make it a part of champs select strategy.
: Can we talk about how the level of fun has dropped dramatically and the level of toxicity has risen
ITs a fun loop. Incentive built into ranked to not try. People troll, people get upset and type. Riot punishes you for typing to players that lose on purpose. gg riot fun time , fun loop to be in Were supposed to get trolled every other game and just say nothing or else were toxic GG!
Meddler (NA)
: We're working on an attack move bug at the moment. From what we're seeing it's not GP specific, though he does seem to be affected more than most. Will hotfix once we've got a confirmed fix for it.
and how about some gp buffs? or an adjustment? His late game scaling is a complete joke compared to his old self. He does laughable damage late game compared to any other hyper carry and he doesn't use bruiser items as well as actual bruiser with high base damages in their kits. Season 6 his ult got absolutely gutted because people were sniping kills with thunderlords, (thunderlords is gone and electrocute doesn't work on his ult now). Gangplanks ult does like 15 damage a wave lvl 1 not factoring mr with a laughable slow. He loses almost every top lane matchup and gets outscaled by any other scaling champion. Pls... send help for the gangplank mains... were dissapearing and dying
: > [{quoted}](name=Me Clap U Cheeks,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=TagHQhKd,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-02-21T04:40:33.301+0000) > > Well removal of klepto , followed by gangplank adjustments to compsensate for him being gutted for klepto. Right, right. Not necessarily buffs, just reverts of nerfs.
Sadly... Most people hate gp being meta so its very unlikely he gets love
: The problem is that they've allowed kleptomancy, which has always proven to only be overpowered on the few champions who can take it, but worthless on the other 140-- especially seen with the no-farm top strategy we had recently, to stay in the game despite the fact it breaks a fundamental component of scaling. Which would be your rate of income. When all it does is push what's supposed to be a late game power spike due to a champion's heavy reliance on items after a weak lane phase, keeping it in the game means they have to nerf the champions because they're getting what's supposed to be late-game power at mid-game. And that's not fair to the champions. It's not Gangplank who needs buffs, it's Klepto that needs to be removed.
Well removal of klepto , followed by gangplank adjustments to compsensate for him being gutted for klepto.
Rioter Comments
: I think everything that you took the time to type out sucks
> [{quoted}](name=LadyLantern,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=UEx7clmG,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-02-10T20:32:44.591+0000) > > I think everything that you took the time to type out sucks Pretty vague statement, so cool? good for you i guess.?
Rioter Comments
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: December 14
Rioter Comments
: I too feel like if league had less punishments( and no perma bans) there would be less toxicity
This idea would remove perma bans via chatting. So only people intentionally losing games trolling afk could be issued bans. Again lowering toxicity because people aren't frustrated about constant chat restrictions and suspensions.
: So overall while this seems like a good idea one of the most annoying things in this game to me right now is someone spamming missing after a questionable play.
Luckily, in my idea the ability to mute pings would still be available for when people used pings as an outlet to flame :). Thanks for the input!
: You set forth some very interesting ideas on how to limit toxicity in ranked games. I feel though if a player wants to be toxic and they don't have the chat platform to troll they will just int instead. Toxic players will be toxic players, and although removing or limiting chat will impact some toxic players it won't stop many who will use some other form of trolling to continue to be toxic.
of course it will never fully eliminate toxic players and ways of being toxic. However, I do think it will address one of ranks biggest issues. Which is chat and what it can lead to. Of course toxic players will find other ways to be toxic however this happens already. Although this may not remove toxicity completely it will make it less frustrating to deal with because the mental stress of chat isn't there and hopefully will on average make games more enjoyable. Thats the whole thing here, no system would be fullproof but I do think on average this could help a lot. Thanks for the insight
: When I started playing League a long time ago I learned a lot from chat. Way back when I picked "support" Sona but I was still CSing and they ADC let me know STOP TAKING MY FARM to which I relized I was doing something wrong. you cannot put that in a ping. long story short I learned some things that I did not know before.
Chat would still exist in normal games and other game modes. This idea is for ranked. There is plenty of resources on youtube etc to learn as well outside of the games in game chat.
Raywhisper (EUNE)
: I have a perfect way to kill league toxicity. Write /fullmute all in every game. Have /all chat disabled. You still have to manually mute your teammates emotes so it has a flaw but works 100% of the time.
Still doesn't prevent your team mates from fighting with each other and ruining the game.
: I'm worried about game play greifing increasing. Riot already has some data. The difference though, is Riot didn't remove everyones chat. Troll the game and you aren't getting any feedback. Hard to tell if other people are getting mad or not. I would bet that things stay about the same. I think the big issue is convincing Riot to remove a feature because some players are immature.
These are all viable issues I would be worried about greifing increasing as well, however I think it would level out because tons of people grief because of what's happening in chat. So I think it would balance out. The reality is though is that there is a problem currently and this is just one possible solution. There is no guarantee that it would work but it's not perfected either its an idea in the making that would need to be built apon.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 3
Hi Meddler, Graves adc again please :[
: U can't kill the unkillable.
Yeah I guess Kill is an exaggeration. I was more trying to say that attacking one of the root issues is more effective and healthy than just covering up the problem.
: > 2. People will win more games and have a more positive experience due to lack of stress from team mates arguing in chat or being flamed. Meaning more players will be honorable and will make the honor system more relevant how do you win more games if your opponents are also winning more games..? XD > 8. **This ones huge** - People will be able to have more fun in league of legends even when losing, because people will be able to focus on improvement and themselves rather than arguing with others in chat with every loss. This also means the entire player base could potentially improve. I wouldn't say focusing on improvement is "fun" I really think professional/best leauge players who are constantly challenger have less fun than your average player. uh.. good example right now would be hashinshin, he was stuck in diamond, as soon as Iwilldominate called him out he climbed to masters in ONE DAY, which leads me to believe he didn't want to try hard to get to challenger/masters because it wasn't as fun as being diamond also chat can be really fun. just think of all the people who are honor level 5, they clearly give their team mates a positive experience thru chat, you can banter overall I agree with this if only for the sole fact that It means I won't get banned for typing anymore
I would argue that focusing on self improvement is still more fun than being flamed/flaming. It adds mental stress and increases tilt. It may not be super "fun" but it's definitely more enjoyable than dealing with added mental stress over a loss when you could focus up and move on.
: and chatting leads to more trolls and intentional feeding/losing!
hmm... all chat is the problem with begging for reports However threes a lot of problems that go on in team chat as well.
: I've been asking for chat to be eliminated from the game since season 5. This would get rid of all the ppl flame warring in game, and less people would be banned for "typing" when the real BIG problem with ranked play is trolls and intentionally losing players.
and chatting leads to more trolls and intentional feeding/losing!
Rioter Comments
: If you're not in or near Diamond and you're ACTUALLY complaining about *anything* Akali does you need to hit the training tool and that's me being as polite as possible. I've never seen so much butt hurt over a champ when their low elo win rate is less than even 45%.
Been Diamond the last two seasons! Diamond 4 80 lp in pre season before a 6 month break! Don't worry my feelings aren't hurt! So thank's for validating my opinion!
: Akali has what is called “Obscured”. It’s a version of camouflage, not invisibility (as camouflage is designated by its longer duration as opposed to invisilbity. What this means is that all forms of true sight, be that turrets, Control Wards, or any ability that grants it **will** reveal her (if she was invisible, all that would reveal her would be turrets). What is particular to her ability in the “Obscured” effect is that even when she’s revealed (and you have full active location info, not a delayed flicker like invisibility), is that she can’t be directly targeted by point and click effects. The reason she is allowed to have this more powerful effect is because unlike camouflage, marked for its longer duration used to cover distance, Akali is limited to a confined area that all parties know the limit of. It is important to note that the duration only extends when she puts herself into danger by leaving the shroud, and that any form of attack from her also drops out of the shroud. All forms of AoE or skillshots still hit her (and it’s easier to list the champions *without* one of those than those with), and that she isn’t fully untargetable during the shroud, meaning that any damage that is tracking her before she drops in will still hit her, including turret shots (which is different from Fizz or Vlad, who will be immune to any damage headin towards them when they use their respective untargetiblity spells)
Let me show you something. [(http://prntscr.com/l01e0h)] Not invisibility aye? Also noticed how it says you can't select her with attacks or abilities. Those of us who actually play the game consider that unforgettable.
: > [{quoted}](name=HeIIion,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=cmqMAcxE,comment-id=000200000001000000000000,timestamp=2018-09-28T23:29:38.249+0000) > > So? You can't target her with target spells or basic attacks, buts she isn't untargetable? Correct? So she's targetable but untargetabely targetable, did I get that right? > > yet again in my previous post I literally just said I understand what it does but use different terminology than you. So I guess at this point you aren't even reading what im saying but rather just coming at me now for no reason. Again stating you understand more! How about you just use the proper term instead of a made one that people used to spread lies about how her stealth works? He does understand more if you have to use bad terminology that doesn't even apply to what her stealth does in a vain attempt to win people over
I can tell just by looking through your history you're just another controversial being going post to post disagreeing with everyone for any reason you can find. So i'll save you the time of continuous responses so you can move on to your next post. GLHF
: > Fizz and Vlad are not viable comparisons, akali shroud lasts up to ten seconds. Which is a much longer duration than those invulnerability abilities. And Akali's isn't an invulnerability spell (technically neither are theirs but that's another topic). It isn't even an untargetability spell. The only thing you cannot due to Akali while she is in her shroud is click on her. The number of champions that affects in any meaningful way is minuscule. And for all champions, all you have to do to completely negate the ability is simply walk away. Unlike any other stealth champion, Akali cannot go anywhere with hers, as it is confined to a simple ring. *That* is why it lasts longer, as she needs it in order to proc her passive, which is where her damage is loaded. > You assume immediately that everyone but yourself doesn't know the basics of a champions kit before starting a discussion. News flash! I know exactly how she works! I've played her a decent amount, read her abilities, and played against her many times! Except you clearly do not, as you refer to it as "true stealth", which it isn't. I explain it because you have an issue with it that stems from a misunderstanding of what it does, leading to a fear of it and belief that is "overloaded". It is stealth in a confined area that prevents you from clicking her. That's all it is. It is not a "turret dive for free ability" (unless you consider a turret dive just standing under the turret not doing anything). It is not a "get out of jail free card". It's not even as good as either regular camouflage or invisibility, as she has neither the range of the former nor the reliability of the latter.
> It isn't even an untargetability spell. The only thing you cannot due to Akali while she is in her shroud is click on her. So? You can't target her with target spells or basic attacks, buts she isn't untargetable? Correct? So she's targetable but untargetabely targetable, did I get that right? > I explain it because you have an issue with it that stems from a misunderstanding of what it does, leading to a fear of it and belief that is "overloaded". yet again in my previous post I literally just said I understand what it does but use different terminology than you. So I guess at this point you aren't even reading what im saying but rather just coming at me now for no reason. Again stating you understand more!
: A champion being frustrating to play against does not mean a champion is overpowered or overloaded. I find Orianna frustrating. Does that make her overpowered? Once a group think starts, it's hard to undo. People learned that Akali was designed by CT, one of the most hated champion designers. Then, reddit and the boards start the lie about "true stealth". The average player who isn't active in outside communities then takes that at face value, and doesn't investigate it. They fear this "true stealth", and so they ban her, never realizing what the ability actually does. If you want to talk about data, how about her win rate? Does that any way seem overpowered or overloaded? I was dismissive of your post because I have just about had it with these constant misleading posts about Akali, and that fact that you leave out a dissenting opinion in your poll only adds to that. You presuppose that her kit is overloaded, only offering a lie as reasoning for why that is. That is not the foundation of an argument, but of propaganda. I acknowledge that people may just dislike Akali. Everyone has champions they hate facing, including myself (ones that are likely far away from what the general boards community consider toxic champions). But with your post, it's clear that you have an ulterior motive due to your reliance on misinformation and the aforementioned lack and dismissal of a disagreeing viewpoint.
Offer a lie about her kit? I literally just stated that I understand what it does but don't share the same vocabulary as you on the abilities. The result of what the ability does is still the same? So you just coin it as propaganda as if your declaration is pure truth? How disliked a champion is even by high elo players isn't a potential indicator of the state of a champion ? You are hilarious. The balance team has even made changes to champions in the past purely because of how frustrating something is to play against and even items (banner of command and zzrot). Yet you claim that it can't be a basis for argument when the creators themselves consider it while creating and balancing characters? This has turned into just trying to assert you are right in every situation so I'm going to drop it so you can wander off to someone else's post and act like an aristocrat.
: Akali has what is called “Obscured”. It’s a version of camouflage, not invisibility (as camouflage is designated by its longer duration as opposed to invisilbity. What this means is that all forms of true sight, be that turrets, Control Wards, or any ability that grants it **will** reveal her (if she was invisible, all that would reveal her would be turrets). What is particular to her ability in the “Obscured” effect is that even when she’s revealed (and you have full active location info, not a delayed flicker like invisibility), is that she can’t be directly targeted by point and click effects. The reason she is allowed to have this more powerful effect is because unlike camouflage, marked for its longer duration used to cover distance, Akali is limited to a confined area that all parties know the limit of. It is important to note that the duration only extends when she puts herself into danger by leaving the shroud, and that any form of attack from her also drops out of the shroud. All forms of AoE or skillshots still hit her (and it’s easier to list the champions *without* one of those than those with), and that she isn’t fully untargetable during the shroud, meaning that any damage that is tracking her before she drops in will still hit her, including turret shots (which is different from Fizz or Vlad, who will be immune to any damage headin towards them when they use their respective untargetiblity spells)
Fizz and Vlad are not viable comparisons, akali shroud lasts up to ten seconds. Which is a much longer duration than those invunrability abilities. You seem to assume that people seen unforgettable or invulnerable when they say invisible? We know how she works and that you can stills see her outline and hit her at times. We just don't point it out because those of us who play against her assume that's already known when having a discussion about the champion. You assume immediately that everyone but yourself doesn't know the basics of a champions kit before starting a discussion. News flash! I know exactly how she works! I've played her a decent amount, read her abilities, and played against her many times! All you did was explain her w ability? I don't know how that is definitive proof that there is nothing wrong with it.
: I don’t pay attention to names most of the time, unless the poster makes something personal. I don’t remember your name from anything, so you’ll have to refresh my memory of when I’ve commented on your stuff. And some people may have a problem with Akali. How much of that is from actually disliking her, and how much of it is from designer bias, group mentality, or not actually understanding something and therefore just buying into hyperbole? As for your post, when you start off with the position that you can’t be wrong, and that the belief that something doesn’t need to be changed is “factually wrong”, then you aren’t interested in a healthy discussion.
Read your second paragraph here, you state that there is nothing wrong with akali and anybody that thinks so just doesn't understand the game and is buying into hyperbole automatically. You leave out the possibility that people may have legitimate issues with her (including the highest elo of players) yet somehow you seem to assume your opinion is absolute. So you quite contradict yourself saying that i'm not open to healthy discussion when you immediately affirm that your opinion is absolute and anyone that disagrees is buying into mob mentality. \ This is definitive proof you have no interest in actual discussion but rather want to just assert why you are always right. My opinion of akali is my own and has much backing plus reasoning behind why I see her as a problem. The point of this post wasn't to go into depth about what her problems are because there are plenty of posts already doing that. Rather it's to explore possible fixes to her overloaded kit, W being a big offender. If you truly believe she is in a perfect state and is not frustrating or overloaded, Get back to me after she eventually gets nerfed when people get better at her. Or go look at her ban rates. Platinum +[(http://prntscr.com/kzzxr7)] Diamond + [(http://prntscr.com/kzzy4w)] Challenger [(http://prntscr.com/kzzyh1)] Gold/SilverBronze - Roughly come out to 40 % Stat Source: [(https://u.gg/lol/champions/akali/build/?rank=gold)] Also her win rate isn't an argument to be had because she is mechanically intensive so bad players bog down her win rate heavily. She is in the category of kalista and azir where they can still receive nerfs due to how strong they become in high elo. Yet you claim there is no potential issue to discuss in any way and this is pure hyperbole? I guess statistics of how disliked and feared a champion is in ranked play through all elo's isn't enough basis to create a discussion. Or maybe you just form your opinion purely off your gut feeling without looking at any data and then assume you are above others? Logical. Your aggressive mentality and condescending tone is toxicity to the discussion board environment. Please stay away from my posts
: Well what they said in this post alone was not harassment, but I can not say about the rest. If you have a problem with the mod report them to their bosses.
The harassment part is consistently coming onto my posts with the goal of just spreading negativity. THe points of this post like others on the boards are for healthy discussion and for the community to voice their opinions on things. He didn't bring any true discussion to the table. He simply is just saying im wrong and theres no discussion in a condescending tone. Coming onto a post to disagree in a condescending post and just downvoting everything you see ruins the point of voicing an opinion (which im 100% other people have an issue with akali). these are facts, and his deliberate effort to come after my posts is harassment.
: The mod is not harassing you. They are giving you their opinion on your post.
He comes onto all my posts with a negative tone basically just trying to trash talk. Go look through all of his posts on peoples stuff, it's all negativity with a condescending tone. The dudes insanely toxic.
: Well when “true stealth” is an actual thing in the game, then we can have this discussion. Akali’s shroud isn’t true stealth. Oh, and I vote no changes, which you have coincidentally left out of your poll.
True Stealth was what the called it, or "invisibility" was the coined term when they separated it from camouflage. How about this, stop going on posts to disagree for the sake of disagreeing? Oh, and btw, its pretty low for a "mod" to be consistently harassing peoples posts.
RealDsy (EUNE)
: Reworking useless skills - Corki
How about we just revert the failed rework like we did with all the other reworks that forced champions to be gutted or perma ban. He was reworked as an adc and forced out of his role into mid because his package was so much better mid. Now hes not even playable as adc and everytime he becomes meta hes hard nerfed and dissapears. Just revert him and graves
: None of your options. Just make the restealth time take longer in the early game.
That doesn't address the fact that she can avoid every gank due to it's low cool down. That only helps the toxicity of her dueling while being untargetable. She can also drop it every time she gets ganked for a free escape.
Rioter Comments
: I'm real tired of the same champions in every game
"were working on taking excess damage out of the game" - darius and khazix buffs Yours Truly Our Silver Balance Team
: 45 ms boots for supports
Support is already the easiest and most rewarding role in the game with the lowest skill needed. The items are already all insanely cheap and mediocre play is rewarded. The role doesn't need anymore buffs.
: Li Ruin, Modern Ionian and Mistress of the Whip.
All of the ratios are way too high. That much percentage health damage on two seperate abilites would make her the most broken champion in the game, along with mobility and cc? The ability ideas are interesting along with the concepts, but all of the damage numbers and ratios are way too high.
Meddler (NA)
: So, just to set context, I'm not sure how much we should or shouldn't be buffing Viktor at present. I also haven't played that much Viktor myself, so while I'm happy to offer some thoughts on different approaches they'll be coming more from a place of theory than experience. AA range - I suspect that would add power more to Viktor's laning phase than teamfights looking at how changes to AA ranges have affected other champs in the past. If difficulty proccing Q is the issue to solve I'd just add a tiny bit of extra range to the Q empowered attack instead (or add a bit more if it's already got some and I'm unaware). That avoids adding extra power to his CSing and base AA harass in lane if that's not desirable. Q and W haste/slow - For arguments like these I'd start with an assessment of what Viktor's strengths and weaknesses should be, then look at how the current state of those abilities does or doesn't match those targets. Without doing that too high a risk of just pushing in power without consideration of what the desired outcome beyond 'stronger' is. W damage amp - Highly skeptical of this one. Team damage amps tend to be extremely strong, particularly if they're AOE and/or immediately applied. Satisfaction for them is generally pretty low though, relative to their power. I'm not aware of player desire or kit needs that would push Viktor towards being more ally dependent, so I can see thematic argument for this approach but not much else. E delay and R speed - This is a case where I'd need to play against Viktor in his current state more to speak with any confidence. Rylai's is certainly a much more niche item on him than it used to be, so it's possible tuning for needed counterplay has changed. At the same time though Viktor's historically had some really reliable damage output, so I'd be somewhat hesitant to strip counterplay out. Again though, this is one I feel least confident about answering. R control during stasis/death - Death I don't think's the right call at all. With rare exceptions (zombie passives) once you've killed an enemy champion they're deliberately unable to actively retaliate against you and I think that's an appropriate rule. If we were making Viktor today could see some argument for having his ult vanish on death instead, probably wouldn't make that change though given it's been this way a long time. From memory functions it that way in large part because Tibbers continued to exist post Annie's death and Viktor R's prototype started with a copy of Annie R. Reactivation during stasis is an ongoing topic for us internally. Zoe was a test case for whether we should potentially be making reactivation abilities useable while stasis'd or CC'd. Debate on whether that's been a good thing that we should apply to other reactivateable abilities or something we should strip off Zoe continues though.
The e reduction to .8 is much needed, I play a fair share of viktor. The second rendition of e never lands unless they are cc, losing up to 300 damage per e easily. since rylais is a 20% slow for 1 second it doesn't even ensure the second part of e lands either. This ultimately removes part of his kit which I don't consider counterplay but rather wasted ability in a kit that was overnerfed due to an overtuned item aka old rylais. Now that rylais is reduced in power I think it's safe to bring this ability back in line or at least test it. IF it's atrocious there is the ability to hot fix!
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: September 26
Hi Meddler, Can we please consider a Grave rework revert, or explore bringing back his old kit onto a new character. One other option is that in champ select you could choose which gun you want to take out with graves 1. Rifle - his old kit and mechanics, keeping some things in place maybe reworking his passive and toning it down on his e for adc graves. keeping r knock back. 2. shotgun load out- allows you to play as current graves. I really miss playing adc graves along with others. Would this ever be a possibility. I understand that graves has been viable many times but I still don't consider it a succesful rework because it forced him out of his favored role that a lot of people loved playing him in. Even if a champion is good doesn't mean the rework was succesful looking at leblanc is a good example. She was extremely relevant in pro play but didn't feel good to play compared to her old self. Graves is also virtually never truly balanced as a jungler, anytime he is meta he is pick ban and overperforms which then leads him to over nerfed states. Adc graves really should be considered again and brought back to the table. However, New graves doesn't feel bad OVERALL to play he does feel bad as an adc and I miss playing him as an adc. Would there ever be a possibility to return him to adc role with his amazing feeling autos or introduce a champion like his old self maybe with an old western style rifle instead of a shotgun? Thanks!
: Old Graves was a basic character, where basically everything he had Lucian does better. While new Graves may not be the best balanced all the time, reverting him isn’t going to happen, nor will the kit be coming back. Also, can people stop with the “choose which version of the champion you want in champ select” thing? It’s just not going to happen.
why would we have to stop doing something just because naysayers say it wont happen. If the community speaks and wants something giving the justification for why we are wrong for wanting something, quite frankly kills games! + the argument that him and lucian are the same are lame excuses that have been fed and brainwashed into teh community. They literally had one ability in common, a dash? So if 2 champs have a dash they both can't exist? That's not sound logic at all. Im saying people like me loved the champion so saying it will never come back because riot says so, will continue to alienate players!
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The GoldPlank

Level 167 (NA)
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