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Meddler
(NA)
:
Quick Gameplay Thoughts: February 22
The Yetii Rider
(NA)
Meddler, what are your thoughts on the game after the Teleport nerf?
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Meddler
(NA)
:
Morg - we did try some other changes including on the passive. Conclusion was overall Morg's kit was in a fine spot though, including with good balance and counterplay across a really wide range of skill levels. Decided not to change too much as a result.
Kayle - Her late game is intended to be really strong (hypercarry). Intent is that she should pay for that with a pretty weak early game. If she does look out of line first thing we'd assess therefore is whether her laning's actually soft enough. Second thing would be whether, even if she struggles to get there, her late game's just too hard to deal with. Feeling pretty good at this point about her balance off internal testing, real test's always once a champ goes live though.
If Kayle's laning phase is weak, what's to stop her from just going into the jungle and power farming until 11?
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Scathlocke
(NA)
:
Darth Vader is unquestionably the villain for much of the story, but he's not the evil mastermind he was originally shown as. He did some utterly abhorrent things, for selfish and spiteful reasons... and yet, he is considered redeemed "in the eyes of the Force" or whatever, by the end.
It's far safer to assign the terms "hero/villain" or "protagonist/antagonist" to stories. We are building stories here, not moral judgements designed to tell people how to live their lives, in the real world.
Basically, if ANY character wakes up in the morning and thinks "What's the most evil thing I can do today?" then that's a hard pass from me, friends.
Considered redeemed "in the eyes of the Force" is the issue here.
That's the way the writers have presented it to the audience. The audience doesn't have to agree with it. And your players' opinion of your characters should matter more to you than the opinions you have written us to have for them.
Like Silas. I personally think Silas is utterly unlikable and the sad part is that his storyline has ruined Lux's character for me even more than her rework did. Lux used to be a character who was a renowned military genius and tactician. Then you just ripped that out of her, and now she's so gullible that she approached a man who was jailed for being **unable to control his power** and she agreed to do favors for him in exchange for **lessons about magic**? It's a butchering of the original personality. Silas is a man who **justifies** Demacia's treatment of mages in my eyes, he literally couldn't control his own power and a man died because of that. If that's how magic functions in the world then yes, mages who fail to control themselves should be locked up for life for the safety of everyone else, that's why prisons and exile exist in the first place. And yet somehow everyone is supposed to think this is "unfair" because some rich mages get away with it? No. That just means the rich mage kids should be in jail as well, it certainly doesn't mean Silas should be free.
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Scathlocke
(NA)
:
Was Darth Vader good or evil?
Discuss.
Darth Vader is unquestionably evil. The prequels show that he was misguided and misled, but that doesn't matter. Murder is evil, the act of killing someone without justification, without hesitation, without remorse. That is an evil in EVERY culture, which is why it is illegal in EVERY culture. And we can see Vader kill people for failing him or just general incompetence throughout the original trilogy.
Even if you somehow pretend that European culture should not be the center of a game created by Americans of European descent (in which case, the final circle of Inferno is reserved for traitors, which Vader was in every stage of his life. He betrayed the Jedi Order, he betrayed his best friend, he betrayed his suboordinates in the Empire, and he also had Starkiller create the Resistance as treachery against Sidious), then you must accept that murder is evil. If you do not accept that murder is evil, then you are simply amoral and I have no interest reading the lore of characters written by an amoral person. That's totally unrelatable to a person like me who has a clear and concise set of moral values that don't give a shit what other cultures think.
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| Rioter Comments | new Comments | Views | |||
WAZZZUP500
(NA)
Dragon is ridiculously easy to solo and thanks to sweep plant, you barely have to worry about being spotted with a ward.
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Marshbouy
(NA)
Lol who ganks for bot lane?
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Marshbouy
(NA)
Assists give you 150 gold. That's more than you were getting before.
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Slythrin Umbreon
(NA)
Phantom Dancer has the Lifeline passive, so it doesn't stack with Hexdrinker/Maw/Sterak's.
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Meddler
(NA)
:
Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 25
Meddler, Irelia is a diver, and you've just taken away some key aspects of her kit that were helping her kill marksmen. If divers aren't meant to jump on, tank against, and ultimately kill marksmen, what **are** they supposed to do? Disarm (hurts auto attackers) and breaking shields (anti-BT, now anti-PD, and anti-Locket) aren't enough of a niche for a champion who is supposed to kill marksmen? Why not?
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Z3Sleeper
(NA)
Yes, fighting over baron is the point. That's something that should happen, it's an important part of late game. Split pushing is neither fun nor interesting, 5v5 team fights and zoning are fun.
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GayFluffyUnicorn
(EUW)
Uh, no. As a jungler, I know full well how frustrating it is for a top laner to practically IGNORE all objectives JUST because they have TP up. Then you ping and beg for them to start their TP, they don't, and you get killed by a 5v4.
Top laners should actually fucking group for dragon and baron from the beginning instead of sitting there farming while the rest of the team tries to set up vision and zone off.
Those champions who are unable to effectively team fight by design currently do not pay enough of a price for their lane dominance with late game team fighting weakness. They should be forced to team fight, and suck, to make up for their excellent lanes. That will drop their win rates as is appropriate.
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aezens
(EUW)
This encourages top laners to fight with the team instead of sitting in top lane waiting for a good chance to TP in.
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Trollmanship
(NA)
That **is** the point of this change. TP just makes top lane into a farm fest with split pushing.
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Meddler
(NA)
:
Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 9
What is the point of Sejuani living longer if her CC is weaker? Tanks are there to give their team CC, that's all genuine tank players care about. Tanks don't need more damage.
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Squad5
(NA)
:
For now I'd like to test out sharpening his identity as a higher damage and CC but lower durability tank. It's definitely possible that something might need to be added back onto the kit - and it could just be placed somewhere else that gives more play for the enemy.
The Yetii Rider
(NA)
Thing is, if the CC and damage are enough, then the durability isn't a factor.
He's a tank. Actual tank players don't want or need damage to kill champions, we control the board and never die. If you're trying to appeal to top lane players who don't like tanks, fine, but then don't keep his CC. If he has high damage, then his CC being too high as well is just going to make him a toxic juggernaut style character rather than a tank.
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Squad5
(NA)
:
Trying to maintain his ability to scrap in lane by allowing him to cast more spells and get stronger trades with brittle. At the end of the day he needs to be a bit more vulnerable to taking damage back during those trades though.
The Yetii Rider
(NA)
...Why? If you just nerf all his damage, but make him scale well like you are and give him good defenses, he can be a strong jungler. Why are you so worried about preserving his ability to go into top lane?
Tanks shouldn't function properly in top lane. Cinderhulk is a must buy on tanks with the lower health that every tank item gives, so if a tank can function in a lane without Cinderhulk, then they're overtuned and too powerful with it.
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D4M2X0
(EUW)
AP champions are hurt more by MR than AD champions are hurt by armor. This is true. However, that doesn't matter. Because you aren't competing with your teammates to see who can deal more damage or get more kills, it's all about working together.
Mages being powerful PREVENTS full AD teams from existing most of the time. Yes, you can see Zed or Yasuo mid occasionally but usually the midlaner is going to be AP and the support will be primarily magic damage as well. This simple fact is enough to force tanks and bruisers to buy one MR item which is not an armor item. In other words, by simply having a mage in the game, all AD champions' damage increases because the enemy team cannot stack as much armor against them as they otherwise would.
So mages actually inflict plenty of damage onto the enemy team beyond just their abilities. They amplify the damage the carry does by forcing MR builds and the carry amplifies the damage the mage does by forcing armor builds. This is healthy, and teams that are full AD or full AP are uncommon because they are not as good as a balanced team is.
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Zerenza
(NA)
This is the thing, when you say items "aren't good" on Burst Mages, what you actually mean is that they aren't AS good as other items.
AP and Health work just fine on a champion like Zoe, it's just that if we assume Zoe will always get her full combo off and will hit people with it, Luden's Echo and Void Staff will ensure she gets more mileage out of her abilities than Rylai's or Rod of Ages.
But that's a stupid assumption to make to begin with. People are bad. You are bad. I am bad. We make mistakes. Health is a way to compensate for mistakes. Having a little extra breathing room to tap your Zhonya's or to Flash away can make all the difference between getting a weaker but still full rotation or not using an ability at all.
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VanaQuish
(EUNE)
Lethality is designed to kill mages. Why should mages be able to fight assassins, assassins are their counter.
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Zerenza
(NA)
Zhonya's Hourglass has a myriad of uses. It allows you to predict when the majority of a team's burst will be coming at you and avoid it. It gives mages 2.5 additional seconds of "cooldown reduction" because they get their cooldowns back by the time they get out of stasis. ADCs do too, but mages' abilities are vastly more powerful than ADCs so that is clearly a win for the mage in this case.
Also armor as a stat is better for mages than it is for ADCs, as mages have solo lane stats. They have more health and access to more health items like Rod of Ages and Morellonomicon which give them more effective HP with the armor from Zhonya's than ADCs get from Guardian Angel.
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Meddler
(NA)
:
Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 31
> Nunu - Has never quite performed as well as we expected him to post update, even with optimal builds. Looks like we were a bit off in terms of how much power he'd get from learning curve. Giving him a bit more mid combat durability in particular as a result, with a stronger heal when he uses his Q on champions
Tanks don't have in-combat sustain, Meddler. {{item:3083}}
A tank is not supposed to take damage and come back with a surprise burst of healing. That's what juggernauts do. {{champion:36}} {{champion:122}} {{champion:420}} {{champion:106}} {{champion:83}} .
A tank is supposed to absorb and mitigate large amounts of burst damage. They do this by having high stats in the first place.
Nunu has low power because his role demands high stats and you carved his stats into nothing. Nunu's base health and health per level are TERRIBLE and the compensation he gets for that is a high scaling shield on his ultimate, which is something he can only use AFTER he's charged through a bunch of skill shots to get to the enemy team. That's not tanking. That's some kind of weird initiating juggernaut.
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CaptainMårvelous
(NA)
The Yetii Rider
(NA)
Boards are just a negative place in general. You don't see people talking about fun new ideas, asking questions, or having a good time playing League. People don't have any reason to post anything that isn't negative.
I don't think this is any different than people who don't show appreciation for pro diversity when it exists, or for mage players continuously requesting new itemization when the other players don't outwardly express appreciation for their itemization. When things are good, there's no reason to talk at all.
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Riot MapleNectar
(NA)
:
Preseason Dev Update Number 3!
With all the extra cannon minions coming into the game, is the gold reward for cannons going to be adjusted? Seems like this is going to heavily frontload laning income while seemingly not affecting the jungler or support income that much.
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Meddler
(NA)
:
LoL's always had ramping gold bounties. Those have been based purely off champion kills up until now however, so they do 'punish' you for doing well/give the enemy a chance to catch up, but only reflecting certain types of success. We're looking to shift bounties from being 100% champion kill based to something like 70% champion/30% minion or monster. That better reflects actual advantage and removes a soft incentive to just farm and minimize risk (so many reasons to do that already regardless).
What about supports? If the enemy Soraka is 0/0/20 and I take her down, do I just get 300 gold because she has 0 CS?
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Sulghunter
(NA)
The Yetii Rider
(NA)
Yes. The Runes Reforged rework has added a lot of base damage to champion kits. Now if Sona uses her Q, she gets to add some extra damage with Scorch, and she gets to throw Summon: Aery onto the enemy, and she also gets an extra 13 damage from Spellthief's Edge...it's a mess.
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Draconian565
(NA)
The game doesn't have to be balanced though. The overwhelming majority of players don't think of this as a sport. It doesn't have to be fair, or equal, or competitive. The entire point of a GAME is to have FUN.
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D357R0Y3R
(EUW)
Uh...as opposed to when the junglers simply stayed in the jungle and farmed up Feral Flare until 20 minutes?
You can either have interaction or you can have farming, there will never be a mix of it.
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Draconian565
(NA)
Win rate isn't really the point here.
You don't have to care if people are losing a lot at low elo, but when something is just horribly unfun and feels unfair, that's a problem.
This is the reason that point and click CC has been phased out of the game slowly over the years. What do you do when you get suppressed? Nothing. You sit there and watch the screen for 1.5 seconds. You might as well be dead for that time period.
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Draconian565
(NA)
At what elo? Because if you're talking Plat+, lower ranks are going to have a much harder time than that dealing with a point and click suppress.
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VanaQuish
(EUNE)
Dude, almost every item in the game is never bought. Only a handful actually see any play. That means by your standard there are almost no good items in the game. Items like {{item:3151}} {{item:3041}} {{item:3174}} and{{item:3042}}
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Draconian565
(NA)
Top lane isn't about team fighting and it never has been. Top lane is about being powerful in lane and split pushing, both of which Tahm can do very well when he has a suppress.
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VanaQuish
(EUNE)
...What? You think just because an item isn't good enough to make it into anyone's 5 item slots, that means it's not good?
The 5 items people build every game are the BEST items. There are plenty of mage and assassin items that are never built just because other items are better.
You don't see GA on Tristana all that often. Does that mean GA needs MORE ad? No it just means the players value crit more than defense.
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VanaQuish
(EUNE)
Uh, yes. Both QSS and Guardian Angel, in their current forms, contribute to a mage's primary role of dealing damage. Staying alive allows you to deal more damage. A lot of mages don't even have that many good ratios anyway. Their base damage is already high enough, and more often than not, you will find getting an extra rotation in a la GA or not being CC'd to death is going to give you more damage than a Deathcap that didn't help at all when you got blown up.
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NaturesMayhem
(NA)
How do they have single burst damage? How? They either have it through base damage or they have it through ratios. There is no magical third option. So if they don't have it through ratios (because if they did, they would have a really hard time getting fed in the first place but then be unkillable after), then they have to have it through base damage.
> Assassins only get stronger late game as they gain the ability to essentially one shot the enemy ADC or mage carry.
Were you here last year? Assassins were completely unable to touch any ADC as their supports used Ardent Censer, Redemption, and Locket of the Iron Solari to heal and shield their allies through all of their damage. It was so bad that the best mid laner in the entire world, known for his Zed play, played a support mid at World's. Because mid lane was not going to defeat bot lane. But I guess Faker just "doesn't know how to play" assassins.
> Going into the practice tool real quick as Zed, level 18
You are not proving my point. Go in at level 9. I said that they dropped off late game, talking about dropping off late game only agrees with me. Go in level 9, no items, and see how much damage you have. Then add one item, which is about what Zed can expect to have at level 9. There's barely any difference.
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AMADEUSdotEXE
(NA)
Tanks need stats. They don't need exciting or interesting passives, their kits are incredibly dynamic. A tank is busy chain CCing people, they don't need to remember to press a button for an active, which is the reason that Gargoyle Stoneplate isn't on your list. It's probably the most interesting and skill expressive tank item in the game and no one uses it because tanks NEED stats.
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Neptunia xoxo
(NA)
How can Infinity Edge help marksmen kill tanks properly without killing squishies too easily if it doesn't have true damage? % health damage? That will be better against squishies than tanks because it will be reduced by armor, which squishies don't get, unless it's also true damage. And we have BoRK, which doesn't kill tanks enough. Infinity Edge is necessary for tanks to be tanky.
Duskblade is good because assassins are supposed to be powerful when they get their one item spike. The mid game is their high point. Not every class has scaling, and assassins have the least of it.
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MLDzXnRRR
(EUNE)
Lol. Tanks benefit from Tenacity. They don't need a cleanse.
QSS is good enough on mages without it giving AP. Mages aren't nearly as reliant on multiple item scalings as marksmen.
Guardian Angel is an AD item. Mages shouldn't have multiple stasis options, they get the most out of having a few extra seconds to get their cooldowns back.
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NaturesMayhem
(NA)
> You shouldn't be able to build tank and still nuke people as an assassin.
This statement shows that you have no idea what an assassin actually is. Assassins have always been champions with absurdly high base damage. The reason for this is so that they will spike in the mid game, be powerful roamers, and out duel most champions they roam to kill.
This is the reason Lethality exists as a stat. Lethality gives a small amount of AD and then armor penetration. What does armor penetration do? it allows for more of the champion's listed base damage to actually resolve. That is better for assassins than building raw AD, because their base damage is so high.
Now, why is building AD on them bad? Well, it's because their ratios are intentionally gimped. Why is that? It's because if you have a champion with high base damage AND high ratios, they will go 20 and 0 because they snowball like crazy and become gods through both levels and items. You have to pick one, that's why marksmen have shitty base stats.
So no, you SHOULD be able to build tank and kill people as an assassin. Because assassins are designed to basically kill anyone at level 9 with no items. Their kits are self-reliant, allowing them to be relevant even if they fell a bit behind because they drop off like a rock in the late game. The items themselves have nothing to do with this. Tank items could offer 0 AD and they would still be good on assassins.
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Dannar Hetoshi
(NA)
> No hard CC
Kench is the only champion in the game that has a suppress on a basic ability. And he has a stun.
And before you say that those two things need to be built up, Top Kench exists. Tahm Kench is more than capable of getting his suppress off regularly in top lane.
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Aura 411
(NA)
Thing is, if you take Stormrazor away, you have ADCs desperately trying to rush to THREE items, plus boots, before they are good. The entire point of 8.11 was to make it so Zeal Item + Infinity Edge was not a good power spike, and it succeeded. Once marksmen get to 3 items they are stable, but that's a long time for them not to be in the game.
And that's good. We shouldn't have two marksmen in every game.
But if you want marksmen to stick around, removing Stormrazor seems like a bad way to do it. Ezreal and Kai'sa will just reign terror again like they did in 8.11 because they don't build crit.
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rawiazam1
(EUNE)
Hey congrats.
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ISmurfy420
(EUNE)
Udyr gets movement speed and attack speed and it persists pretty much constantly. If Udyr doesn't have a passive, Jax and Diana don't have passives either.
Mundo's passive is basically the definition of a passive. He has a ridiculous amount of health regen, always active, scales with his levels and the items he buys. It's good.
Shyvana's passive is hilarious because I main Nunu so against me she basically gets +5 armor and MR, that's it.
Skarner definitely has a passive. His passive is huge and defines his gameplay.
And if you think Zilean doesn't have a passive you haven't played him in ARAM.
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Infernape
(EUW)
The Yetii Rider
(NA)
That doesn't matter. The way you build a champion doesn't change his primary role. Nunu is a tank, his kit is made to tank. You don't buff assassins to give them better wave clear or marksmen to give them more durability. Nunu's primary goal is not to deal damage, so why would they give him more damage? No one should be building him AP in the first place. He's not a battlemage.
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Riot MapleNectar
(NA)
:
We're actually buffing ap nunu builds. There seems to be some mismatches with what went to pbe and what we're shipping. For clarity, these are the nunu buffs
Consume (Q)
Ability Power Ratio for Heal :: .5 >>> .7
Snowball Barrage (E)
Per snowball Ability Power Ratio :: .05 >>> .06 (Max Ability Power Ratio :: .45 >>> .54
"Willump's Turn" (Damage Attached to Root) Ability Power Ratio :: .5 >>> .8
The Yetii Rider
(NA)
...Why? Nunu is a tank. His job is to engage and deliver lots of crowd control. Why do you need to buff his damage? Why is a tank's damage output EVER relevant?
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FangedEyes
(NA)
We have it...it's called Bots.
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chipndip1
(NA)
Role niche promotes diversity, role confusion removes it. We refer to these kinds of champions, like Nami or Lee Sin, as 'generalists'. Meaning they can perform multiple beneficial factors to the team, which makes them a far more useful pick than a specific champion who is tailored to one of the benefits they provide.
See here: if Urgot is both as durable and with as high a damage output as a juggernaut, but he also has crowd control like a tank, he makes other picks in both roles worse. Why pick Darius over Urgot, when Urgot has comparable damage and an AOE fear? Why pick Sion over Urgot, when Urgot has way more damage and comparable CC?
In general, champions should pick between high CC or high damage, they shouldn't have both. The exception is mages as a whole, and that's fine because mages are squishy as hell and we all get to laugh as their mains beg for melee-tier itemization like that's ever going to happen.
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chipndip1
(NA)
Juggernauts have never been picked or played for their CC. The number of juggernauts who completely lack hard CC is astounding ({{champion:36}} {{champion:420}} {{champion:75}} {{champion:2}} {{champion:102}} {{champion:48}} {{champion:83}} ).
Nerfing Urgot's ability to win a fight with a teamwide is not a bad thing. His goal should be dealing lots of damage. If players want to inflict massive crowd control on the entire enemy team, they shouldn't be picking a RANGED champion to do that over someone like Malphite or Amumu, right?
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ValiantKiller
(NA)
How is this trolling? The duo queued up, trying to do a kill lane, and they lost. That's not against any rules.
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| Rioter Comments | new Comments | Views | |||
