: {{champion:266}} doesn't exist anymore in any capacity. This is a completely different champ replacing one that had a dedicated following and just needed numbers tuning.
That’s very true. Kinda said that it was debatable, forgot about the part on whether Aatrox is a rework or a different champ altogether.
Rioter Comments
5050BS (NA)
: Also bad design and inconsistent. Procs are not spells
Better than taking damage WITH your spell shield.
: Why do i ''lose'' games when im playing good?
Rewt (NA)
: Tank Damage early game should be addressed
lol dumb shit can’t tell the difference between a Warwick and an actual tank like Alistar or Nautilus.
Zullar (NA)
: Revert Runes Reforged, Revert Dragons, Revert Every New Champ & Rework In Last 2 Years
xboxjake (NA)
: Delete this and bring back season 9
Mihalikb (EUW)
: Define the pre-season for you so far in 3 words or less.
5050BS (NA)
: Even with lowered XP Jungle is the most influential Role
And yet people are still complaining about the Jungle EXP nerfs.
: The Solution for Top Lane
There’s a reason ranged top laners are a thing: to curb the juggernauts that would easily dominate, like Darius.
: Sad to say this, but the Akali is a rework failure
Wouldn’t say it was a complete failure.
86400 (NA)
: Blitz hook should be his ult and have a 3 min cd.
Or dodge the hooks, and he becomes a useless blob.
Rioter Comments
: Shaco's Q should have an indicator
I don’t know if it is true for everyone, but when Shaco uses his Q, you can see the puff of smoke animation, even within the fog of war. But that only applies when he blinks into your vision. I dunno. That’s what I believe.
: Please either decrease overall damage in the game or increase resistances.
Antenora (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=The entire team,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EfjV1Xa6,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-11-02T16:32:58.691+0000) > > Lel complaining about too much damage when you’re a Vayne. > > You got clapped. Deal with it, and learn to dodge their attacks. Imagine thinking they did any damage with that build. xd
It’s almost as if you’re saying that, just to cover up the excuse that you can’t admit that you got clipped and that you are bad. Kappa.
: This game is ridiculously unbalanced
Lel complaining about too much damage when you’re a Vayne. You got clapped. Deal with it, and learn to dodge their attacks.
: Malzahar straight up ruins URF
It’s almost as if this particular game mode wasn’t supposed to be balanced in the first place. WHAT’S UP WITH THAAAAAAAT?
: I Hate What Urf Became
If you don’t like it, then don’t play it. Duh
: This community will never admet the facts, Facts say that toplane is weak role and Bruiser are not good, Fact say Botlane is win condition everygame and mages item make them so broken, i dont get why is everyone so delusional and whats more stupid is Why riot even listen to this delusionals.
Because it's NA. The NA forums equate to two threads: The 99% who made "I can't win against this champ cuz it's OP Riot is dumb" and expect validation, and the 1% who think that the people who make the "I can't win against this champ cuz it's OP Riot is dumb" threads are dumb themselves.
: I said the same thing back when everyone complained about ARURF. "If you can pick champs everyone is just going to play the broken ones and ruin every game", but nope, the community wants what the community wants, now they got it and the boards are full of the complaints I predicted over a year ago. You reap what you sow, community.
Im sure the community is blaming Riot for their own misgivings too, much like a lot of things: assassins, “damage” meta, tank meta, whining about damage, etc. Because Rito is so smart at me feeding 15 games and yet I haven’t won a single one with my feeding.
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=The entire team,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=4UKyQ1Ek,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-10-26T20:57:54.294+0000) > > Surprisingly they gave me a Prestige Bewitching MF skin. That's impossible. I'm talking about the Random Legendary Permanent. Prestige Bewitching MF is a Mythic skin. Bewitching MF is an Epic. Miss Fortune has 0 Legendary skins at this time. Maybe from the Masterwork chest, but there's no way you got Prestige Bewitching MF from the Random Legendary Permanent token.
> [{quoted}](name=Busty Demoness,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=4UKyQ1Ek,comment-id=00030001,timestamp=2019-10-26T21:17:24.649+0000) > > That's impossible. > > I'm talking about the Random Legendary Permanent. > > Prestige Bewitching MF is a Mythic skin. > Bewitching MF is an Epic. > Miss Fortune has 0 Legendary skins at this time. > > Maybe from the Masterwork chest, but there's no way you got Prestige Bewitching MF from the Random Legendary Permanent token. Oh! Okay. I just got the token, and I got Dark Star Jhin :3
: So which Legendary Permanant did everyone get?
Surprisingly they gave me a Prestige Bewitching MF skin.
: Spear of Shojin removed in PBE
: Does it to adc anyways.
Or {{item:3046}} or {{item:3026}} or {{item:2420}}
Rioter Comments
: Malphite Ult
No. Bully the rock monster more early game, so that way he can’t one-shot you.
Keiaga (NA)
: Restating every wrong point you've already made, but longer, doesn't make it anymore correct. It's all just more rules you think tanks have that include several exceptions and exclusions and special conditions.
Fine geez. Then stay in your own hole of ignorance, and leave us out of it. Play Mundo support tank and watch the results. Because surely the doctor can save the marksman from two carries, like a real smart summoner who thinks juggernauts are tanks would.
Keiaga (NA)
: You claim that all tanks need to have abilities to support their team and focus on defense. There's a handful of "tanks" that have as little defensive capabilities as juggernauts. {{champion:154}} won't be able to peel anyone with his cc and can only initiate. Pretty similar to a juggernaut. {{champion:79}} {{champion:20}} {{champion:14}} also have little to no peel. If a tank needs to "lock down" an enemy champion then {{champion:82}} has his point and click ult which takes someone out of the fight entirely for 7 seconds. Cant get more locked down than that. Cooldowns and playstyles have nothing to do with being a tank. Nautilus and alistar's displacement is 14-10 seconds long. Volibear's is 12-8. Certain tanks have extremely offensive playstyles and are rarely used for peel, very similar to juggernauts. {{champion:31}} {{champion:150}} {{champion:79}} {{champion:54}} {{champion:20}} {{champion:33}} just to name a few. If a tank doesn't need to have high health/resistances, what's stopping Rakan from being a tank since he has shields, CC and health and does everything that other Vanguards/Wardens do? TLDR every single trait or requirement that you're claiming a champion needs to have doesn't apply to certain vanguards or wardens, or are exhibited more by other champs who clearly aren't tanks. The ruleset doesn't work if every aspect of the requirements has multiple exceptions, conditions and inclusions to make it work. The only constant a tank has ever had in any genre of game is that they need to take a lot of damage.
Zac has his Q, which locks down and can peel two enemies for a surprising amount of time, and has his ulti and E to initiate, and yet the blob doesn't have a lot of damage compared to a Darius. Gragas has his peel: Body Slam at 9 seconds if he hits someone, and it's so easy to land; along with his ultimate that c an displace and knock back everybody. Nunu has his threat and peel with his ulti, snowball and snare, easily enough to stop someone in their tracks in order to knock the yeti back or run away. Sion needs damage to be threatening, and has a lot of peel with his AoE knock ups and initiation. There are some tanks that have more disruption than peel, and others that have more peel than disruption, and even some tanks that have more supportive options than both disruption and peel. It's called personalizing. Morde's lockdown is a lot more different though. It also locks Morde away into his Death Realm, essentially isolating his target rather than locking the target down for Morde's allies. It isn't really a lockdown because Morde can still die from losing against the target he isolated. Morde ain't helping his team simply because he used his ulti on someone, because it's still a 4v4, not a 5v4. Plus, Morde doesn't really have utility outside of his ultimate. Cooldowns and playstyles DO have everything with being a tank. You forget Nautilus's passive on rooting people on his autoattacks, and Alistar's 10 second stun, powerful and inescapable initiation, and tanking prowess with his ultimate. Volibear can't exactly deal AoE disruption at all, and only really does single target damage with minimal AoE damage that really is just damage. And honestly, 8 seconds for ONE person to get flipped isn't really that much for disruption. Yes, some tanks have offensive playstyles and rarely use it for peel, but two things. One: tanks need the damage in order to be threatening. That's why Sion, Malphite and Poppy have very strong damage, but unless they have a taunt, they have no way of forcing you to attack them. With the amount of CC and strong base damage, they would be enough of a 'threat' to make players see them as a "get them off my face or so help me" phase, and a desire to kill them. That's what gamers familiar with RTS or RPGs coin the term as THREAT. Two: tanks need to have these aggressive playstyles because they have nothing else to offer once they blow their whole load. Malphite has a godly initiation with his ultimate, but that is his only hard CC, and the rest of his abilities are very subpar. Rammus can force ONE person to hit them after hitting them with his Q, but that's it, which requires his autoattacks to hurt, due to him not having anything else. Cho'gath... is a specialist (AKA he can do anything: be a mage, tank, disruptor, all-around dick, etc), but again, he doesn't have much in terms of hard engage other than his very easy and dodgable Q, so he needs that threat with his R and E to be threatening to the other team. Gnar is only a threat in his Mega Gnar phase, and can be completely abused in his Mini state, so once Gnar reverts, he cannot do anything at all. Again, the Rakan argument has been done to death, but I'll say it once again. Rakan's specialty is his mobility, not his tankiness. He has less HP, armor and magic resist at lvl 18 compared than Braum or Alistar, but he is also a jack-of-all-trades aggressive support. Sure he has shields and heals, but if he built tank, they would be very small. His CC is still impressive, but not to the likes of Braum or Alistar, and if he did blow his knockup and charm, he wouldn't be able to peel very well. He can do everything, but doesn't specialize heavily on heals like Soraka, CC like Braum or defenses like Alistar.
Keiaga (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=NemeBro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sE1KvKHc,comment-id=0002000100000000,timestamp=2019-10-20T01:07:10.914+0000) > > He listed the qualities that differentiate tanks from the juggernaut class as opposed to focusing on their common quality, which is being tanky. > Right now, you're actually telling me that all juggernauts inherently have the quality of "being tanky", or in other words, "the quality of being a tank" but are not tanks. And they're not tanks because they don't exhibit CC initiation or shielding, which are all traits that are all completely lacking of the connotation of being a tank in the first place, as evidenced by the fact that the phrase "Being tanky" is apparently completely unrelated to CC, initiation, and shielding.
Prove it. I want to know what sources you're pulling out with the term of 'Tank'.
: And don't expect a tank to survive in the current meta, either. The only way to survive as a beefy champion is to out-sustain, and that means having the damage to feed your lifesteal.
Damage always and eventually outscales defense.
: Careful when you say "Tanks have mobility" {{champion:516}} {{champion:57}} {{champion:14}} {{champion:31}} Mobility isn't the best identifier. Mobility is headed into Fighter and Assassin territory.
Mobility is mainly used for initiating or adding more CC. It's not limited to just tanks.
Keiaga (NA)
: All juggernauts are inherently tanky without runes. Some of them are tanky without heals likes {{champion:82}} {{champion:102}} {{champion:86}} . Just now you used the term "Tankiness" as a quality of being "hard to kill" and not as a quality of having any of the traits you previously listed are mandatory for tanks like CC, initiation or ally shielding. All the champions I listed are obviously not tanks, but they all have the qualities you're insisting are integral for tanks. {{champion:79}} has a slow, a stun, a passive heal and a displacement in his kit. {{champion:555}} also has a slow, a stun, a passive heal, and a displacement in his kit. Why is Gragas a tank and not pyke? If it's because Gragas also has inherent bulk and is hard to kill then why isn't {{champion:122}} a tank even though he also has a slow, a displacement, and a heal in his kit? Meanwhile {{champion:32}} has 2 stuns in his kit and is a tank. But for some reason {{champion:106}} is not a tank even though he has a displacement, and a slow/fear. If tanks are dictated by how much cc/initiation/ shielding in their kits there's a whole lot of exceptions, confusion, and conditions. But if you think of a tank as "a champion that is hard to kill due to health and resistances" then everything suddenly makes sense. you're also wrong about your tangent in the last paragraph, but lets keep things focused.
Juggernauts have to be tanky without runes too, but that is only one step in a list for qualifications for being a tank. Abilities for support, disruption and defense rather than offense. AoE rather than dueling abilities. Protection for their allies rather than destruction for the enemy. Initiate the fight and lockdown rather than destroy the carries with damage without mobility skills. I don't understand what you're not understanding about the differences between a Garen and a Nautilus, or a Mundo and a Leona, or a Darius and an Alistar, or a Mordekaiser and a Taric. The thing is with your argument on Grag and Pyke is that their slows and stuns and heals and displacements on their kit work a lot more differently. Gragas has lower cooldowns on his stun and slow, and is much easier to land, but also designed to knock back enemies and peel. Pyke on the other hand, doesn't have nearly thhe same abilities or playstyle, for his stun is made to use offensively and escaping. He is also a lot more frail than Gragas due to Pyke's passive not granting bonus HP, along with his heal being much more different compared to Gragas (Gragas heals his own HP, Pyke regenerates a portion of his health, which are two different types of healing), which makes the assassin support not a good candidate for being a tank. Pyke is only good for tanking, purely because of runes like Aftershock, and because he has his executing ultimate, which makes him a much more different threat. And Darius isn't the best for tanking because his displacement has a long cooldown, is so easy to bait out, and he isn't really good as a peeler unless he gets up close and personal. The dude is also a lot more selfish, for he will steal kills from the carry due to his ultimate, which is generally not a good idea for a tank to do. He is tanky, like a juggernaut, but he doesn't fulfill the roles of a tank. And for your other argument, Amumu has great initiation with his Q, and has lockdown on the entire party, while dealing consistent AoE damage in exchange for being a terrible duelist, and a punching bag. Volibear, however, chases only one target, shreds them with his ultimate and roar and execute, but he cannot lock down multiple people. Amumu is a better candidate for a tank compared to Volibear, mainly due to the teamfighting prowess Amumu has, compared to Volibear. Sure, Volibear CAN be a tank, but Amumu is much more of a disruption threat due to his ultimate forcing marksmen to stop autoattacking. A tank doesn't always have to have high health and resistances, because that basically means a really really big man. Again, the reason why I brought the 'MMO tangent' was that tanks are being used as a broad term for just a really really big man, which isn't the case in LoL. They can be tanky, but being a tank is much more specialized than being tanky, mainly due to their utility. It's like a paladin vs a berserker/viking.
: I'm well aware of that, but I've really never understood this argument. In any other game a tank is a very hard to kill high armor/health entity. Yet for some reason in League, we cannot call a 300 armor 4k health "juggernaut" a tank. I find it odd. Some other word should have been made to describe what we call "tanks" in League.
>In any other game a tank is a very hard to kill high armor/health entity. And I believe I found the problem. In ANY OTHER GAME, tanks would be very hard to kill, with their high armor and health, constantly being healed by two healers, using GCDs and cooldowns to half a. But not League. People are beginning to compare these tanks to MMO tanks, but MOBA tanks are a lot more different. Tanks are more supportive in their role rather than offensive, focusing on protection and disruption rather than damage. If the tank dies after being focused down by the other five enemy champions, then their job is done. If the tank protects their carries successfully throughout the teamfight, then they are doing their job. So why is it that you can't seem to accept that?
Keiaga (NA)
: By that logic {{champion:432}} {{champion:245}} {{champion:497}} {{champion:555}} are all tanks since they have initiation based mobility, cc and Shields? Tanks like in any game, have the primary job of initiating and tanking damage without dying. Their damage cc or mobility are secondary characteristics. Juggernauts are tanks.
That twist in logic is probably gonna get you laughed at. Tanks are inherently tanky, without resorting to runes or heals. Bard is absolutely frail, can't initiate for shit and has no shields, but can build tanky (which makes him very ineffective). He is a poker and an enchanter, not a tank. Ekko can build tanky (and is surprisingly annoying to deal with when he does), but his initiation is very easily dodged and telegraphed. He's an assassin and mage, not a tank. Rakan is meant to be a jack of all trades initiating support. He's just flashy, but really frail if built improperly. While he CAN be a tank, he's not consistently threatening enough to be one. Pyke only relies on Aftershock and his stupid passive. Get out of here. The flaw in that logic is that you expect tanks to be like an MMO tank: a job that requires little input and little awareness of your HP, and to think about nothing else other than initiate the fight and act like the dummy. That's not how a MOBA tank works (at least, in Riot's eyes). They peel for their damage dealers, they initiate to get a good fight starting, they CC a lot to disrupt assassins, and they have to be a little more mobile to catch other people. If they die, then that either means that they were clearly the center of attention with five people attacking him/her (which is the point of tanking), OR the tank isn't prepared, and the other teammates were just dawdlin.
Verxint (NA)
: I've found that at least 3/4 people who whine about dying to tanks proceed to bring up Darius, Nasus, Mundo, Voli, etc. Sometimes they even double down to a level of "If it's not squishy it shouldn't be allowed to do damage"
Maybe they should git gud
Whining bruiser mains: https://i.imgur.com/M5ND355.jpg%5B/img%5D
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=MordridtheBlack,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=k8ItLQAf,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-10-17T13:17:53.274+0000) > > The system we have isn't perfect, but I'd rather have a flawed system that works over anything else Why not create a system that isn't flawed?
Because everything has flaws. Something deemed flawless still has little flaws, and people will bitch or abuse it to their hearts’ content.
: Will Senna have a dash?
She has a giant goddamn gun. Of course she's gonna have thirty million dashes.
: I am disappointed with the upcoming Lulu buffs.
The shield part is enough for now. They'll add more later if it feels like it isn't enough, so calm down {{sticker:slayer-jinx-unamused}}
: Do you like the proposed preseason changes to League?
I’m in the middle. There are some things I like, and some things I didn’t like. Honestly, I can’t wait for Senna 🥰
OutlawRo (EUNE)
: Why doesn't Riot just put back oracle's elixir to make facing akali a bit less frustrating.
They removed the elixir because of the complaints from constant warding pains and battles between supports. Put it on a tank, never worry about wards or vision again. Then again, I can see why you dealing with Akali is annoying. But bringing back an item won’t solve it. Use vision wards.
: I'm just going to say it this balance team is trash
If you don’t like it then don’t play it.
: I fixed Master Yi (in just under six minutes)
What is your damage? Untargetibility that resets? Parrying? A low cost low CD dash? True damage, despite your complaints about true damage before? No, seriously. What the hell is your damage? This champ just transformed into a Jax/Kayle hybrid clone. You literally can’t win unless it’s early game. You literally can’t escape from him because of his dashes. Like, seriously, what the eff-ing hell is your damage?
: I fixed Malphite (in about four minutes)
Pika Fox (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=The entire team,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wEJQl4Kz,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-10-12T22:40:54.335+0000) > > Or outdamage his damage. Thats unlikely, hes an early game juggernaut. Outdamaging him AND out tanking him is unlikely.
My Darius is the answer to outdamaging him.
: garen should kill anything he gets too that is what a fukin juggernaut does
https://i.imgur.com/M5ND355.jpg%5B/img%5D Their Garen complaints in a nutshell.
Show more

The entire team

Level 181 (NA)
Lifetime Upvotes
Create a Discussion