Vanlash (NA)
: PLEASE someone anyone from riot help me.
Get this man his account back so he can enjoy the anniversary event on his accounts. You got my upvote man. Going on other social media like Reddit or Twitter will help a lot.
: > [{quoted}](name=EyesOfTheFox,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=2LtMkTd6,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-10-16T04:06:45.720+0000) > > Aram perhaps? That's what my first thought was.
> [{quoted}](name=MIDIANx138,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=2LtMkTd6,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2019-10-16T04:47:39.582+0000) > > That's what my first thought was. You know I don't think it's aram now that I think of it, aram has two nexuses as well with the same colors (like a mini sr), and there is no nexus in the middle of aram, so i dont think so.
fire263 (NA)
: Honestly, was wondering that myself. I assume it could be a new section of the map for perhaps a different gamemode? There's a lot to speculate but not much we know so far. It could very well be something for the other games that they announced, or perhaps more neutral targets in summoners rift since the beam is white, which most likely means it's not siding with either red or blue. It could also be a leak to new lore, but for now, I know absolutely nothing about what it means, and for all I know we may never find out.
> [{quoted}](name=fire263,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=2LtMkTd6,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-10-16T04:04:15.318+0000) > > Honestly, was wondering that myself. I assume it could be a new section of the map for perhaps a different gamemode? There's a lot to speculate but not much we know so far. It could very well be something for the other games that they announced, or perhaps more neutral targets in summoners rift since the beam is white, which most likely means it's not siding with either red or blue. It could also be a leak to new lore, but for now, I know absolutely nothing about what it means, and for all I know we may never find out. Probably, even though I wouldn't mind being spoiled more with new content xD
: Upvoted because also curious.
> [{quoted}](name=Metal Janna,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=2LtMkTd6,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-10-16T03:46:02.643+0000) > > Upvoted because also curious. It's just bothering me so much because I just like how it ended with that happening and there was no explanation after and I'm pretty itchy to know what it means lol
Rioter Comments
: [Gameplay Update] Aurelion Sol, The Star Forger
As a person who's been made a post opposing the Aurelion Sol changes and not being a fan of the changes since it hit PBE because... 1. It doesn't really feel like Aurelion Sol 2. He's not really a niche pick anymore 3. He's more of a burst-mage then a battle-mage. 4. Overall, very unsatisfying..etc. I love the ideas of the changes because it respects who Aurelion Sol is supposed to be, and this kit sounds more of a battle-mage the current Asol will ever be. This also addresses the issue with his ult of how it feels so lackluster right now. All in All, I would be so down to try and invest my time into playing with these Aurelion Sol changes, you have my upvote!!
musixxal (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=TheMojoKiller,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jTVcgEm1,comment-id=00030000000000000001,timestamp=2019-08-28T16:51:42.165+0000) > > Lol buddy, that could have easily been talked over but Riot refused to give some sort of 1 on 1 feedback on any changes, especially with his small community. Those who are mad at the changes aren't mad because we can't afk farm anymore, he's just not unique anymore and Riot changed him for the sake of them and other people, not for us. You had to land a stun and properly position yourself to do more damage while dodging cc, now you can just land a stun and stand still and the orbit speed would have done that for you straight it. > > The thing is, they made him like how they are with everyone else, a burst mage. They nerfed his late-game power, roaming, and lowered his skill-ceiling. He no longer has that unique niche identity anymore, and it also might come to him being pick or ban at some point, and that really isn't fun. It's also fun giving feedback but only to be ignored because they would already stick with the changes from the get-go. > But don't worry, he's now an easier burst-mage with his core ability up 60% of the time, because there shouldn't be hard champions like him :). how is he not unique, he has floating stars around him all the fucking time that can't be turned off unless you knock him up or something, can't stop him with silences anymore so he's actually a better sustained dmg dealer than he was before. his Q got QOL changes his E got QOL changes all these changes literally amount to QOL changes but the boards, as fucking ever, wants to complain about literally some of the best changes for him ever because the stars don't stay expanded forever, ignoring that once he reaches late game they are pretty much fully expanded forever. and he gets to move like fucking sonic. but as i've said in this thread already, whatever, no one even thinks about the changes in any meaningful way and then they wonder why riot ignores them. "he's not unique anymore" ok who the fuck else has floating stars around them and can fucking traverse half the map at will without using a summoner spell or an ultimate?
> [{quoted}](name=musixxal,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jTVcgEm1,comment-id=000300000000000000010000,timestamp=2019-08-28T17:07:54.985+0000) > > how is he not unique, he has floating stars around him all the fucking time that can't be turned off unless you knock him up or something, can't stop him with silences anymore so he's actually a better sustained dmg dealer than he was before. > his Q got QOL changes > his E got QOL changes > all these changes literally amount to QOL changes but the boards, as fucking ever, wants to complain about literally some of the best changes for him ever because the stars don't stay expanded forever, ignoring that once he reaches late game they are pretty much fully expanded forever. and he gets to move like fucking sonic. > but as i've said in this thread already, whatever, no one even thinks about the changes in any meaningful way and then they wonder why riot ignores them. > "he's not unique anymore" > ok who the fuck else has floating stars around them and can fucking traverse half the map at will without using a summoner spell or an ultimate? Play him enough and you'll know what I mean. He didn't recieve quality of life changes, he got adjusted. His passive movement on e is huge, as well with it being on an ult tier cooldown. His playstyle is different because of w changes which orients him to being a more of a burst mage. I literally only ever started making posts about it because as a dedicated asol main, and after playing the pbe with the changes, it didn't feel right, and I wasn't the only one sharing that concern. Not everyone is going to like the changes, especially when these level of changes are involved.
Rioter Comments
musixxal (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=duje,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jTVcgEm1,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2019-08-28T12:56:35.318+0000) > > You actualy are this dumb....... Can you read what i said. They have completly changed his playstyle and his role and made in totaly not unique like it use to be "no, you stay on the periphery of a fight and press Q and W, and then eventually you press R." EXACTLY YOUR A DAMN BURST MAGE NOW WHICH IS THE ISSUES THAT IM TALKING ABOUT AND A BAD BURST MAGE TO GO WITH THAT THERE ARE 15 OTHER CHAMPS THAT FILL THAT ROLE WAY BETTER GOD YOUR SO DENSE. his playstyle is a more streamlined and modern version of his old self. he's also not a burst mage lol, but whatever i'll just wait for the film to come out before the boards wakes up to it. OH THATS RIGHT, there already is film on it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hWmWIZYe2I same asol, just streamlined, less clunky, with better tools for his own sake. but whatever none of ya'll actually want that, i suppose the asol players are upset they can't afk W the wave at lvl 1 and 2 anymore.
> [{quoted}](name=musixxal,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jTVcgEm1,comment-id=0003000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-28T13:00:01.548+0000) > > his playstyle is a more streamlined and modern version of his old self. > he's also not a burst mage lol, but whatever i'll just wait for the film to come out before the boards wakes up to it. > OH THATS RIGHT, there already is film on it. > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hWmWIZYe2I > same asol, just streamlined, less clunky, with better tools for his own sake. > but whatever none of ya'll actually want that, i suppose the asol players are upset they can't afk W the wave at lvl 1 and 2 anymore. Lol buddy, that could have easily been talked over but Riot refused to give some sort of 1 on 1 feedback on any changes, especially with his small community. Those who are mad at the changes aren't mad because we can't afk farm anymore, he's just not unique anymore and Riot changed him for the sake of them and other people, not for us. You had to land a stun and properly position yourself to do more damage while dodging cc, now you can just land a stun and stand still and the orbit speed would have done that for you straight it. The thing is, they made him like how they are with everyone else, a burst mage. They nerfed his late-game power, roaming, and lowered his skill-ceiling. He no longer has that unique niche identity anymore, and it also might come to him being pick or ban at some point, and that really isn't fun. It's also fun giving feedback but only to be ignored because they would already stick with the changes from the get-go. But don't worry, he's now an easier burst-mage with his core ability up 60% of the time, because there shouldn't be hard champions like him :).
: They're running out of ideas to disappoint us. You've gotta admit this is pretty creative
> [{quoted}](name=SgtAwesomeness,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=zij79YiX,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-08-21T07:50:25.176+0000) > > They're running out of ideas to disappoint us. You've gotta admit this is pretty creative Riot knows best though, what are you talking about man :)))) {{sticker:zombie-nunu-bummed}}
: I heard the Sol mains community was cautiously optimistic about the changes? I play him and have him at m7 (not nearly as committed to him as you are, though! Cho'Gath is my one true love). Also, Mordekaiser mains had a decent amount of input on his update. Malicious Metal was literally flown in to Riot HQ to test him and provide feedback. Rather than never giving an explanation for these changes, Rioters are on record saying that Sol has a very low playrate because he's unapproachable and difficult to understand, whilst often being too powerful in the hands of his mains. I think they're trying to bring him to a place where there is slightly less disparity between his best and worst performances, whilst windowing his power so that he is easier to balance but his stars feel like they still pack a punch. What's so wrong about the changes in your eyes, if I may ask?
> [{quoted}](name=Void Kaiju,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OHgA8igA,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2019-08-22T14:31:33.114+0000) > > I heard the Sol mains community was cautiously optimistic about the changes? I play him and have him at m7 (not nearly as committed to him as you are, though! Cho'Gath is my one true love). Also, Mordekaiser mains had a decent amount of input on his update. Malicious Metal was literally flown in to Riot HQ to test him and provide feedback. > > Rather than never giving an explanation for these changes, Rioters are on record saying that Sol has a very low playrate because he's unapproachable and difficult to understand, whilst often being too powerful in the hands of his mains. I think they're trying to bring him to a place where there is slightly less disparity between his best and worst performances, whilst windowing his power so that he is easier to balance but his stars feel like they still pack a punch. > > What's so wrong about the changes in your eyes, if I may ask? There was a lot of mixed feedback to the situation, but the people who were concerned about the changes didn't get much insight at all, even though they asked for feedback and such. Also, the thing is that Asol may be strong in the right hands, but he isn't the one to be TOO strong or TOO weak, so to say he's a balancing nightmare is an exaggeration. Barely picked in competitive play, not picked or ban all the time, not complained about the entire community, you barely see him in the patch notes, and FINALLY Riot doesn't mention how "problematic" he is until he gets changes. It just seemed to me that these changes are for the whole league community and not for the Asol mains :) Hence I'll quote Riot Cobra: "For what it's worth - we have asked players directly questions that can give us a better idea about players' opinions on A Sol. He generally ranks super highly in terms of visuals but is among the lowest (if not the lowest) when it comes to satisfying and engaging gameplay. "
: I feel you but I also feel like I have to address the mentioned champs one by one and why I think Sol is in a different league. - Irelia: I don't think her rework belongs in the rest of your category. Mechanics got changed but It was basically to put more weight on her dashing ability and to make her dueling less reliant on items. Even hardcore mains agree that she mostly retained her gameplay identity. - Akali is a tough one. If I mained her pre rework I'm sure I'd be bitter for the changes BUT, Akali was in a problematic state because of her fed-or-starved gameplay. She was too monotone, in need of at least a visual rework, most players hated going against her even back then and the only difference is she was nowhere to be seen. The rework surely was a success. Made her more fun although it's kinda subjective, skyrocketed her popularity and at least gave her a kit you can balance around. She's pretty much in a good spot rn. - Mordekaiser is in the same vein as Akali: Very problematic, visually unappealing to most players and in need of a kit you can balance around. - Aatrox: I loved his rework, although I have to admit that's because it fit me personally. It was a radical change but it was all to match his warlord identity and his draintankiness. I agree that maybe riot could have looked to make him more auto-attack heavy like he was but he's a really fun champ in his own right. - Galio: From what I've gathered, the champ was pretty much a meme pre VGU. He needed one either way but the problem lies with riot not deciding or which role they want to land him, dragging him through a rollercoaster of a balance history. - Malz/Zac: Frankly, I know jack shite about those two so I won't touch on them. NOW, for the main issue. I DO think Sol's changes were unwarranted, because there are some differences between him and the rest of the bunch that make it a bad idea to change him so much: - Sol fills probably one of the, if not the most, specific niches in league. A 24/7 roaming battlemage. There is NO champ that remotely resembles his playstyle. His stars are one of the most unique mechs in the game and he's the only battle mage that operates that way. People have been saying that his playstyle is too uninteractive. Well, learn to abuse it then, here, it's not hard, just push your lane when he leaves and make him lose XP and gold for unsuccessful roams. And Sol can choose to play around that by faking roams and other such things. It's not uninteractive, it's just macro-heavy - Sol is in a spot where he can be balanced without big mechanical changes. Smaller QoL changes on his Q to stun at any distance/be faster or E with lower cooldown or higher speed could very well balance him out and make him even pro strong. - His changes might make him stronger, but as Fizzics also said, he's just not that fun anymore. Believe it or not, his W being constant/toggle actually IS a big deal. It completely turns his early game, which is his bread and butter and the reason most people play him, completely on its head. It also changes the pace of his teamfighting from slower but constant to burstier but in intervals. You no longer get to say, "sit while I push you" to the enemy. Sol is changed from probably the most unique mage in league to a burst Anivia.
> [{quoted}](name=NelsieLisnen,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OHgA8igA,comment-id=000a,timestamp=2019-08-22T16:03:08.428+0000) > > I feel you but I also feel like I have to address the mentioned champs one by one and why I think Sol is in a different league. > > - Irelia: I don't think her rework belongs in the rest of your category. Mechanics got changed but It was basically to put more weight on her dashing ability and to make her dueling less reliant on items. Even hardcore mains agree that she mostly retained her gameplay identity. > > - Akali is a tough one. If I mained her pre rework I'm sure I'd be bitter for the changes BUT, Akali was in a problematic state because of her fed-or-starved gameplay. She was too monotone, in need of at least a visual rework, most players hated going against her even back then and the only difference is she was nowhere to be seen. The rework surely was a success. Made her more fun although it's kinda subjective, skyrocketed her popularity and at least gave her a kit you can balance around. She's pretty much in a good spot rn. > > - Mordekaiser is in the same vein as Akali: Very problematic, visually unappealing to most players and in need of a kit you can balance around. > > - Aatrox: I loved his rework, although I have to admit that's because it fit me personally. It was a radical change but it was all to match his warlord identity and his draintankiness. I agree that maybe riot could have looked to make him more auto-attack heavy like he was but he's a really fun champ in his own right. > > - Galio: From what I've gathered, the champ was pretty much a meme pre VGU. He needed one either way but the problem lies with riot not deciding or which role they want to land him, dragging him through a rollercoaster of a balance history. > > - Malz/Zac: Frankly, I know jack shite about those two so I won't touch on them. > > NOW, for the main issue. I DO think Sol's changes were unwarranted, because there are some differences between him and the rest of the bunch that make it a bad idea to change him so much: > > - Sol fills probably one of the, if not the most, specific niches in league. A 24/7 roaming battlemage. There is NO champ that remotely resembles his playstyle. His stars are one of the most unique mechs in the game and he's the only battle mage that operates that way. People have been saying that his playstyle is too uninteractive. Well, learn to abuse it then, here, it's not hard, just push your lane when he leaves and make him lose XP and gold for unsuccessful roams. And Sol can choose to play around that by faking roams and other such things. It's not uninteractive, it's just macro-heavy > > - Sol is in a spot where he can be balanced without big mechanical changes. Smaller QoL changes on his Q to stun at any distance/be faster or E with lower cooldown or higher speed could very well balance him out and make him even pro strong. > > - His changes might make him stronger, but as Fizzics also said, he's just not that fun anymore. Believe it or not, his W being constant/toggle actually IS a big deal. It completely turns his early game, which is his bread and butter and the reason most people play him, completely on its head. It also changes the pace of his teamfighting from slower but constant to burstier but in intervals. You no longer get to say, "sit while I push you" to the enemy. Sol is changed from probably the most unique mage in league to a burst Anivia. Right on the nose.
: Might I also add he is a lot like a burst mage with these changes. He loses that battle mage category. Why does everything in league need to burst? Cus it gets views on pro play and racks money in? Great. Like Vlad you don't even need to build tanky just build dmg. Ryze is another battle mage that burst. I remember reading once Idk where riot themselves said they tend to go for bumping up damage because its easier for them and it makes pro viewership less boring to watch. Because viewers don't want to see slow and strategic pushing over constant action and fighting. That's why they buff and nerf specific champs not caring about solo play because they want viewers to see different champs more often than the same ones. This is why aatrox lost his identity because pro picked him for his strengths AND the revive. Not just the revive. But riot decides its unhealthy. Aatrox still gets picked, riot decision nerf after aatrox already lost his revive. Riot on the case said it was far too easy to proc the revive and get away for free. As if tryn ult isn't the same bs. At least when they made aatrox kill before he could revive it made sense. Grrr.
> [{quoted}](name=Bløød Zerø,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OHgA8igA,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-08-22T09:33:34.167+0000) > > Might I also add he is a lot like a burst mage with these changes. He loses that battle mage category. Why does everything in league need to burst? Cus it gets views on pro play and racks money in? Great. Like Vlad you don't even need to build tanky just build dmg. Ryze is another battle mage that burst. > > I remember reading once Idk where riot themselves said they tend to go for bumping up damage because its easier for them and it makes pro viewership less boring to watch. Because viewers don't want to see slow and strategic pushing over constant action and fighting. That's why they buff and nerf specific champs not caring about solo play because they want viewers to see different champs more often than the same ones. > > This is why aatrox lost his identity because pro picked him for his strengths AND the revive. Not just the revive. But riot decides its unhealthy. Aatrox still gets picked, riot decision nerf after aatrox already lost his revive. Riot on the case said it was far too easy to proc the revive and get away for free. As if tryn ult isn't the same bs. At least when they made aatrox kill before he could revive it made sense. Grrr. Riot knows best {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-thumbs}}
Rioter Comments
: Rito pls buff the ban system
I love you. It's funny how there is 140+ champions but you see the same shit almost every game, as well as the same stuff banned :). At least there would be more variety in the game instead of seeing pyke and/or yasuo every game.
mskoldis (EUNE)
: Recently I’ve also started to play a lot of Aurelion sol and I love his playstyle. I agree with everything that you’ve said. Aurelion still keeps his abilities but his playstyle is like every other champion. That’s what made Aurelion fun. This feels like the ryze change where riot is trying to invite new players to the champion but rams over those who’ve adapted to his current playstyle. I hope this thread gets some attention from riot. Amazing ideas. I hope Aurelion doesn’t gets killed like Ryze.
> [{quoted}](name=mskoldis,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=000c,timestamp=2019-08-06T13:27:13.453+0000) > > Recently I’ve also started to play a lot of Aurelion sol and I love his playstyle. I agree with everything that you’ve said. Aurelion still keeps his abilities but his playstyle is like every other champion. That’s what made Aurelion fun. This feels like the ryze change where riot is trying to invite new players to the champion but rams over those who’ve adapted to his current playstyle. I hope this thread gets some attention from riot. Amazing ideas. I hope Aurelion doesn’t gets killed like Ryze. Agreed.
: The Removal of TT: Can We Get Permanent Nexus Blitz in Return?
> [{quoted}](name=SouperPlatypus,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Lws74iqk,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-03T19:08:34.280+0000) > > > Although the removal is understandable please upvote this so any mods or Rioters who read this will understand that we would like something to replace TT now that its going )-:< The removal is understandable? Riot decided to ignore all pleas and calls for anything related to that mode. "**_We think it's the best move to remove TT because we can't it the way we want it yada yada_** is just some coverup bullshit for their lazyiness in attempting to make the gamemode better. If they cared about bettering the mode, they would have at least got a few rioters to ask TT players in thoughts on what should be done to the mode. I can tell you that no attempts were made. And it gets even better! They also love repeating the pattern of uneccesarily changing champions that don't need changing for them to end up being broken, then nerfed to the ground and left there, lol.
: Because we are talking about battle mages, control mages and high dps mages. These are the champions he's directly competing with. Aurelion Sol's late game is not strong by any margin. There are control mages out there with higher damage AND higher zone control, look at Anivia, Azir and Orianna. The only time Aurelion is hitting 5 people at once, is if they're clumped together, and there are many champions that can damage 5 champions, CC them at a consistent rate. Again, look at Azir, Anivia and Karthus, all of which do a LOT more damage. So let's forget about his late game, because Aurelion is absolutely not a late game champion, he is an early to mid game champion, who focuses on getting his teams ahead with his roams and stacks HP items and mows through teams, taking little damage in return, before they're able to build the items to bring him down. Now you're somewhat contradicting yourself when you say damage is not the only factor when it comes to a late game champion, which is true, as you're ignoring some of the buffs to his main utility spell - his Q. With these Aurelion Sol changes, his late game damage is the only thing that's going down. His Q is getting buffed to be a lot stronger late game, with a lower cooldown and higher travel speed. Aurelion Sol is already very predictable. He's going to try and hit you with his stars whenever possible. Which is still going to be the same now?
> [{quoted}](name=Toþykachu,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=000200000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-03T14:57:14.686+0000) > > Because we are talking about battle mages, control mages and high dps mages. These are the champions he's directly competing with. Aurelion Sol's late game is not strong by any margin. There are control mages out there with higher damage AND higher zone control, look at Anivia, Azir and Orianna. > > The only time Aurelion is hitting 5 people at once, is if they're clumped together, and there are many champions that can damage 5 champions, CC them at a consistent rate. Again, look at Azir, Anivia and Karthus, all of which do a LOT more damage. > > So let's forget about his late game, because Aurelion is absolutely not a late game champion, he is an early to mid game champion, who focuses on getting his teams ahead with his roams and stacks HP items and mows through teams, taking little damage in return, before they're able to build the items to bring him down. > > Now you're somewhat contradicting yourself when you say damage is not the only factor when it comes to a late game champion, which is true, as you're ignoring some of the buffs to his main utility spell - his Q. With these Aurelion Sol changes, his late game damage is the only thing that's going down. His Q is getting buffed to be a lot stronger late game, with a lower cooldown and higher travel speed. > > Aurelion Sol is already very predictable. He's going to try and hit you with his stars whenever possible. Which is still going to be the same now? At this point, we are getting nowhere. We keep having different views on this topic, and it seems like it's not going to change. I respect your opinion, and hopefully you can respect mine. Thank you for your valued input on this post.
: When the thing that he is doing is toxic? Is Tahm Kench being able to devour allies iconic to his kit and identity? Yes. Is it also so toxic that his had to be nerfed insanely hard for competitive, leaving him in a completely useless state as a support for the rest of us for so long? Also yes. Aurelion Sol is sat in a similar boat. His ability to constantly shove the wave and instantly look to roam is completely unmatched, inflating his win rate by a huge margin by players who are able to properly identify the optimal times to roam. With these tweaks they're able to adjust it accordingly so he no longer instantly clears a wave, roams to a side lane and then uses the increased mobility to get back to lane without losing a significant amount of gold. By removing the passive speed and increasing its cooldown, a bad roam is now properly punishable. This means that later on, if this turns out to be a huge nerf, they are able to actually increase his damage and buff him in more meaningful ways.
> [{quoted}](name=Toþykachu,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=0006000100000000,timestamp=2019-08-03T14:44:03.795+0000) > > When the thing that he is doing is toxic? Is Tahm Kench being able to devour allies iconic to his kit and identity? Yes. Is it also so toxic that his had to be nerfed insanely hard for competitive, leaving him in a completely useless state as a support for the rest of us for so long? Also yes. Aurelion Sol is sat in a similar boat. His ability to constantly shove the wave and instantly look to roam is completely unmatched, inflating his win rate by a huge margin by players who are able to properly identify the optimal times to roam. With these tweaks they're able to adjust it accordingly so he no longer instantly clears a wave, roams to a side lane and then uses the increased mobility to get back to lane without losing a significant amount of gold. By removing the passive speed and increasing its cooldown, a bad roam is now properly punishable. This means that later on, if this turns out to be a huge nerf, they are able to actually increase his damage and buff him in more meaningful ways. But that is the thing though, his early game waveclear is unmatched, and OP, I know. But the beauty of it all is that it has counterplay! You can punish Aurelion Sol from pushing. The fact that Aurelion Sol shoves waves puts him at risk of getting ganked. His pushing can also punished by the laner themselves if they can gap-close him, cc-him, or make him waste mana on them instead of pushing. Tahm's W is his identity and saving allies was strong, and all he had to do was be near them to save them. But that isn't the same case here man, if you let him push, he gets to roam. If you punish him from trying to push, he has to stay and clear waves, or gets killed from being out of positioned or just being ganked. That's why I love this guy so much, it's because he's in no terms of being absolutely broken, or too op to the point where there is no counterplay.
: > [{quoted}](name=TheMojoKiller,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2019-08-03T06:23:14.235+0000) > > Glad not you're not on the change Asol hype train :), not giving up until Riot hears our plea. Not the plea from those people who think they are right even though they don't play him enough, but from the ones who's dedicated a shit ton of time into him. Might I ask what constitutes 'not enough' because I've dedicated over 1,000 ranked games to Aurelion Sol. Is that not enough?
> [{quoted}](name=Toþykachu,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=000600000000,timestamp=2019-08-03T09:38:44.493+0000) > > Might I ask what constitutes 'not enough' because I've dedicated over 1,000 ranked games to Aurelion Sol. Is that not enough? Side note, I'm not pointing fingers at you, I'm simply pointing fingers at people who are getting the say in what happens to Asol, even though they don't play him. Everyone has a view, but I'm trying to reach a compromise.
: Have you ever considered that maybe these abilities are toxic and should be removed to free up space within the champions pool for more meaningful buffs? Aurelion Sol could literally out push every single champion at level 1 and roam from level 3. You could not play aggressively in a side lane, nor could you invade the enemy jungler because Aurelion Sol would always arrive before anyone else. He's had significant power removed from the rest of his kit for a while now, such as a weaker slow on his ultimate, lower damage and weaker base stats. Do you really believe a champion should be completely terrible in every metric so long as they're able to cling onto their one toxic niche that forces them to be this way? By all means you can keep Aatrox's revive, but say goodbye to a lot of his damage, sustain and durability.
> [{quoted}](name=Toþykachu,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=00060001,timestamp=2019-08-03T09:43:26.178+0000) > > Have you ever considered that maybe these abilities are toxic and should be removed to free up space within the champions pool for more meaningful buffs? Aurelion Sol could literally out push every single champion at level 1 and roam from level 3. You could not play aggressively in a side lane, nor could you invade the enemy jungler because Aurelion Sol would always arrive before anyone else. He's had significant power removed from the rest of his kit for a while now, such as a weaker slow on his ultimate, lower damage and weaker base stats. > > Do you really believe a champion should be completely terrible in every metric so long as they're able to cling onto their one toxic niche that forces them to be this way? By all means you can keep Aatrox's revive, but say goodbye to a lot of his damage, sustain and durability. Since when was being good at something was considered toxic, especially in the case of Aurelion Sol? His wave-clear and roaming early game is fucking strong when you pull it off, yes, but that's IF you pull it off. Aurelion Sol doesn't have that free reign when him and his laner reach level 3. You would know as if you were versing a Fizz, he would go all in on you if you were pushing and wave-clearing, because he can gap-close and burst hard. Something a lot of champions have, which who they can punish Asol if they play the matchup right. The enemy jungler could play around engaging on Asol when he tries to roam, because it can be predictable. This is also considering the fact that he could fail his roams due to lanes being attentive to his MIA. Long story short, he is strong at what he does, but he has CLEAR weaknesses and windows of opportunity of punishment. Like tell me, how is being good at something, yet being able to be completely punishable, toxic? Also, "one toxic niche" is an exaggeration, while they are completely changing the way he's played, he's not hanging on to one toxic niche, he's hanging on to everything the champion is SUPPOSED to be. And that is in no way toxic.
: I said he has **one of** the lowest damage outputs, **late game**, out of all **mages**. Not in general. You are severely underestimating the presence of other battle mages in the game. Karthus, Swain, Anivia etc. can all pull off constant AoE damage late game, with Anivia and Karthus doing a LOT more damage than Aurelion can ever wish to dish out late game. Vlad, Cass and Ryze have the ability to 1v5 late game a LOT easier than Aurelion Sol, as A Sol is prone to getting instantly turned on and killed if he's seen to be alone. From the videos I've seen so far, his early pushing power is still very strong and doesn't burn through your mana in the same wasy as current Aurelion Sol. He doesn't necessarily need this movement speed now, if he has the ability to use his E from much further away? It just means he is punished more for a bad roam, which is seems only fair in the long run, as this has been a problem with balancing Aurelion for a while now. As mentioned previously, these changes are not supposed to be a nerf, but an adjustment to his kit to allow him to fit more comfortably in the game, meaning they don't have to keep nerfing him, because his win rate reaches absurd levels when put behind someone who knows what they're doing. (A winrate that stems almost entirely from his roaming potential).
> [{quoted}](name=Toþykachu,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=0002000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-03T09:54:19.153+0000) > > I said he has **one of** the lowest damage outputs, **late game**, out of all **mages**. Not in general. You are severely underestimating the presence of other battle mages in the game. Karthus, Swain, Anivia etc. can all pull off constant AoE damage late game, with Anivia and Karthus doing a LOT more damage than Aurelion can ever wish to dish out late game. Vlad, Cass and Ryze have the ability to 1v5 late game a LOT easier than Aurelion Sol, as A Sol is prone to getting instantly turned on and killed if he's seen to be alone. > > From the videos I've seen so far, his early pushing power is still very strong and doesn't burn through your mana in the same wasy as current Aurelion Sol. He doesn't necessarily need this movement speed now, if he has the ability to use his E from much further away? It just means he is punished more for a bad roam, which is seems only fair in the long run, as this has been a problem with balancing Aurelion for a while now. > > As mentioned previously, these changes are not supposed to be a nerf, but an adjustment to his kit to allow him to fit more comfortably in the game, meaning they don't have to keep nerfing him, because his win rate reaches absurd levels when put behind someone who knows what they're doing. (A win rate that stems almost entirely from his roaming potential). ?? Why are we comparing Aurelion Sol to Anvia, Karthus, Cass, and etc. a solid point to saying how weak he is. Again, damage alone isn't the solo determining factor in what makes strong in the late-game. Is he super crazy strong when it comes to damage? No, but that isn't the thing here. Even though they are all battle-mages, they bring something different to the table, and that's what I'm saying about Aurelion. You shouldn't be saying he's weak because he isn't killing people instantly with his stars, because that isn't him. What no other battle-mage brings that Aurelion Sol does is the base ability to potentially damage up to 5 people at once, zone people out of fights, grant cc to the team (assuming you get rylais), at a consistent rate, as long as his W is up. What I'm saying is that it's the damage and utility Aurelion Sol brings to the team that no one complains when a team gets an Aurelion Sol because of the absolute potential to be a carry in teamfights. Now, no matter how you or Riot say it, this a nerf to his damage. It also makes him more predictable in fights. For starters, once you right past mid-game, that AP scaling on his passive will be weaker than his live. His w not being able to have full up-time at the point takes him away from having full dps WILL make a difference, because while positioning yourself right made you do more damage live, but the pbe w restricts you from constatly dps the team, because you'll just be squishy burst-mage not being able to have that power like you used to. B But wait, stars move faster! But wait, you can have it up every 2 seconds! Again and again, his scaling was nerfed late game, and removing the complete uptime of his W does remove his battle-mage like kit, and those 2 seconds are crucial. The stars "being faster" isn't going to be stronger at this point or make up for it.
: I've never played him in ranked, but I think that a lot of champions core identities are being butchered. Aatrox losing his revive passive and Asol's ability to fast push a wave and roam. Are either being removed entirely or are being shifted over to other champions (twisted fate) in this case. I'm sorry that this happened to your favorite champion <3
> [{quoted}](name=Shawkeekee,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2019-08-03T05:56:26.187+0000) > > I've never played him in ranked, but I think that a lot of champions core identities are being butchered. Aatrox losing his revive passive and Asol's ability to fast push a wave and roam. Are either being removed entirely or are being shifted over to other champions (twisted fate) in this case. I'm sorry that this happened to your favorite champion <3 Glad you're not on the change Asol hype train :), not giving up until Riot hears our plea. Not the plea from those people who think they are right even though they don't play him enough, but from the ones who's dedicated a shit ton of time into him.
: Instead of fixing the shit meta, they try to make everyone fit the shit meta. {{sticker:sg-lux-2}} Riot games at its finest.
> [{quoted}](name=WoonStruck,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-08-03T05:32:40.604+0000) > > Instead of fixing the shit meta, they try to make everyone fit the shit meta. {{sticker:sg-lux-2}} > > Riot games at its finest. I agree, this kind of way of doing things is unhealthy and boring. I feel for the players who have had their fair share of champion changes even though most protested otherwise. Hopefully, this could shed some light on how much some champion communities, no matter the meta or appeal factor to all, can be just as dedicated as anyone else. Hopefully Riot can start doing the right thing.
iiGazeii (NA)
: I mean, you can roam like every other mage and just... walk there? You don't need enhanced movement speed to roam effectively. Even the most immobile of mages can roam effectively. Just buy Mobi Boots and/or take Relentless Hunter. Aurelion Sol suffers from the fact that his plays aren't flashy and satisfying. His gameplay boils down to "creative walking", and while there is a lot of nuance in mana management and positioning and he is **absolutely** a powerful and skill-intensive champion, he really isn't all that fun or impactful to play unless you've dedicated hours and hours to his unique playstyle. Changing his kit to be more accessible and familiar to players that aren't one of the four Aurelion Sol mains is healthier for the champion as a whole. Yes, these changes take away some of his sustained damage, but the added burst and in-combat mobility make his plays more dynamic and engaging for everybody involved. His sustained damage isn't gone, it's just in the late game, now. The playstyle of keeping your opponents right in range for your stars is still there, but his sustained damage is geared more for the mid-late game, when his W is at max rank and he can spam it to keep his stars up all the time, and his early game will be more about the burst damage plays you can make. I understand, there is a lot of pride that goes into mastering such a difficult champion and it hurts to see that difficulty go down to appeal to the masses, but the more people that play ASol, the more attention he gets from the devs, which means more frequent balance passes (and more skins).
> [{quoted}](name=iiGazeii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-08-02T23:36:40.447+0000) > > I mean, you can roam like every other mage and just... walk there? You don't need enhanced movement speed to roam effectively. Even the most immobile of mages can roam effectively. Just buy Mobi Boots and/or take Relentless Hunter. > > Aurelion Sol suffers from the fact that his plays aren't flashy and satisfying. His gameplay boils down to "creative walking", and while there is a lot of nuance in mana management and positioning and he is **absolutely** a powerful and skill-intensive champion, he really isn't all that fun or impactful to play unless you've dedicated hours and hours to his unique playstyle. > > Changing his kit to be more accessible and familiar to players that aren't one of the four Aurelion Sol mains is healthier for the champion as a whole. Yes, these changes take away some of his sustained damage, but the added burst and in-combat mobility make his plays more dynamic and engaging for everybody involved. His sustained damage isn't gone, it's just in the late game, now. The playstyle of keeping your opponents right in range for your stars is still there, but his sustained damage is geared more for the mid-late game, when his W is at max rank and he can spam it to keep his stars up all the time, and his early game will be more about the burst damage plays you can make. > > I understand, there is a lot of pride that goes into mastering such a difficult champion and it hurts to see that difficulty go down to appeal to the masses, but the more people that play ASol, the more attention he gets from the devs, which means more frequent balance passes (and more skins). And this is what personally irritates me to be honest. Why should a champion like Aurelion Sol, who is in a HEALTHY state and in OK place in the meta, be required for changes on what makes Aurelion Sol, Aurelion Sol. There is 140+ champions to pick and learn, but it's simply not ok for Aurelion Sol to be an interesting niche pick when compared to other flashy champions? Usually when a champion gets this type of treatment, they usually have a big source of complaint (No Zac Engage Counter-play, Fiddlesticks E, etc.), but there is nothing infuriating about Aurelion Sol when it comes to versing him. Why shouldn't it be okay to have a champion that rewards you for practicing him to take the control of the game in your hands? Everyone has the ability to play him and fufill his potential to the fullest, but changing him to become easier to most at the sake for "the rest of the people" instead of listening to the DEDICATED and PASSIONATE Aurelion Sol players, who decided to go on a journey to master Aurelion Sol? Aurelion Sol not being the flashiest champion in the game can be an opinion, because I believe otherwise (but anyone is welcome to decide for themselves), but him not being flashy to some people shouldn't be the determining factor of changing him. That's just a flat-out insult to the dedicated Aurelion Sol players. And as I do thank you for your input, as it does give light on what other people think, the people of voice and opinion who have DEDICATED their time to playing this champion and who have formed a community around him, should be able to influence what should happen to Aurelion Sol.
: A trait of all battle mages is their good zoning ability, of which most have better control of due to their much later higher game damage. Cassiopeia has her ult and W to zone people, Anivia has her wall and her ult, Karthus has his E and W and Vlad has the ability to just run at you and instagib your squishies if you get too close. Aurelion has one of the absolute lowest damage outputs late game out of all the mages in the game and by the time you reach late game, if the enemies are in range of your stars, then you are also in range of their abilities and in most cases they will out DPS you. His W not being interuptable also means you are able to ban champions that aren't Kassadin. I don't see how his roaming power is worse? He can use his W from much further away, in exchange for it being a slightly longer cooldown. His ability to side lane has been massively improved as he can now reach a fight much more quickly mid-late game due to the overall range increase and massive MS increase he'll be getting 600 at all ranks to 800 by rank 5. In the long run, this change is supposed smooth out some of his power, so they can meaningfully buff him without making him completely overbearing when played by a proficient Aurelion Sol player, like he has been previously. If these changes end up nerfing him overall, then I have no doubt that they'll buff him in future patches.
> [{quoted}](name=Toþykachu,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=00020000000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-02T23:59:58.597+0000) > > A trait of all battle mages is their good zoning ability, of which most have better control of due to their much later higher game damage. Cassiopeia has her ult and W to zone people, Anivia has her wall and her ult, Karthus has his E and W and Vlad has the ability to just run at you and instagib your squishies if you get too close. Aurelion has one of the absolute lowest damage outputs late game out of all the mages in the game and by the time you reach late game, if the enemies are in range of your stars, then you are also in range of their abilities and in most cases they will out DPS you. His W not being interuptable also means you are able to ban champions that aren't Kassadin. > > I don't see how his roaming power is worse? He can use his W from much further away, in exchange for it being a slightly longer cooldown. His ability to side lane has been massively improved as he can now reach a fight much more quickly mid-late game due to the overall range increase and massive MS increase he'll be getting 600 at all ranks to 800 by rank 5. > > In the long run, this change is supposed smooth out some of his power, so they can meaningfully buff him without making him completely overbearing when played by a proficient Aurelion Sol player, like he has been previously. If these changes end up nerfing him overall, then I have no doubt that they'll buff him in future patches. Though saying "Aurelion Sol having the absolute lowest damage output in the game" is a bit of an exaggeration, that's fine. The reason he's still good because of how efficient he is when it comes to constantly being able to damage multiple enemies at once, especially when you pull off good positioning. No other battle mage can pull off consistent aoe teamfighting against up to five people AT ONCE like Aurelion Sol can. Why should he be able to do heavy impact damage when such a champion is able to manipulate a teamfight so well, with a BASE ability. High-reaching numbers don't solely measure the worth of the champion, it's what they provide. That's why I'm stressing so much that these changes will remove that kind of power, power that's rewarded for practicing a lot. Even when knowing that, there is counterplay if you can get the best of him by gap-closing him or ccing him, it's a healthy factor of Aurelion. As with roaming, it is nerfed heavily. You honestly can't wave-clear as fast due to your w having a big cooldown with limited uptime. With the old (E), it also factors in the ability to get to your lane fast and then clearing the wave, then moving on to another lane, with you using your e or not. The movement speed boost you get is the key to roaming, and with that gone, it's a severe unnecessary impact.
: Aurelion's late game at the moment is nothing special. He lacks any sort of innate tankiness or sustain compared to other battle mages, Cass and Vlad have their healing, Rumble and (old) Ryze had constant shields and Karthus doesn't mind dying at all. His damage is also considerably lower than all of them late game, so acting like he's always been some kind of late game hyper carry really isn't true. His W late game will only be on a 2 second cooldown and given the massively increased speed of the stars, his overall damage will be WAY up, even late game. As mentioned previously, the ability to no longer have your W interupted is absolutely huge, given the large presence of CC and interupts in the current meta. He also gains a lower cooldown on his Q mid-late game, as well as it giving him more movement speed when he travels behind it, increasing the chance for a stronger stun. There'll definitely be a new learning curve that you'll have to commit yourself to if you want to become a god at this champion again, but I firmly believe that these, overall, are a net positive.
> [{quoted}](name=Toþykachu,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2019-08-02T22:49:40.662+0000) > > Aurelion's late game at the moment is nothing special. He lacks any sort of innate tankiness or sustain compared to other battle mages, Cass and Vlad have their healing, Rumble and (old) Ryze had constant shields and Karthus doesn't mind dying at all. His damage is also considerably lower than all of them late game, so acting like he's always been some kind of late game hyper carry really isn't true. > > His W late game will only be on a 2 second cooldown and given the massively increased speed of the stars, his overall damage will be WAY up, even late game. As mentioned previously, the ability to no longer have your W interupted is absolutely huge, given the large presence of CC and interupts in the current meta. He also gains a lower cooldown on his Q mid-late game, as well as it giving him more movement speed when he travels behind it, increasing the chance for a stronger stun. > > There'll definitely be a new learning curve that you'll have to commit yourself to if you want to become a god at this champion again, but I firmly believe that these, overall, are a net positive. I never said anything about him being a late hyper carry at all, but he does well when played correctly when it comes to fighting with your team late game in a 5v5. Something that Aurelion Sol can do quite exceptionally well when comparing those champions to him is the ability to manipulate the battle-field when it comes to zoning people with your stars, and do enough damage to kill or pressure the enemies. Going the AP Bruiser route gave you the damage to kill squishes or tanks because the hp shred to tanks, and magic pen w/ cc for squishes. Of course making it so that stars aren't disabled is pretty damn good, but it's the reason why committed Aurelion Sol players can pull it off regardless. The positioning to dodge the cc, kite around their cc, and damage them and zone at the same time, (especially when you have rylais) is under-appreciated. And it's also worth mentioning that if those changes go through, Aurelion Sol won't have that strong roaming potential that has live. That's also one thing he's good at that not most champs are. This isn't a buff to Aurelion Sol, it's a change of playstyle to make him easier for other players, but also nerfing the capabilities of how you can impact a game. With the time I've been playing Aurelion Sol, and few days I've been consistenly testing out the Aurelion Sol changes, I strongly believe that it isn't a net positive with most of these changes.
: A Sol is not technically a God. Riot confirmed this. This new playstyle gives you several notable advantages that you don't quite realise. Firstly, CC does not cancel the W anymore, giving you a LOT more opportunities to succeed. The damage you deal from landing every star when you activate your W is far higher than the current damage and only has a 2 second cooldown, meaning late game, your damage is WAY up. The bonus movement speed on W after it retracts now means you can afford to go other rune choices instead of phase rush every game.
> [{quoted}](name=Toþykachu,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-08-02T21:37:03.180+0000) > > A Sol is not technically a God. Riot confirmed this. This new playstyle gives you several notable advantages that you don't quite realise. Firstly, CC does not cancel the W anymore, giving you a LOT more opportunities to succeed. The damage you deal from landing every star when you activate your W is far higher than the current damage and only has a 2 second cooldown, meaning late game, your damage is WAY up. The bonus movement speed on W after it retracts now means you can afford to go other rune choices instead of phase rush every game. As previously mentioned, because of the changes, his early and mid-game is strong. And because his passive damage was increased early, as well as his W speed, he's going to do a lot more damage, I acknowledge that. When it comes to late game against a decent comp, it's not going to be that "easy" to pick someone out when they know all they have to do is avoid your set-up, your q. And if the enemy-team is not fed, but scaled enough, it's not going to be easy to one-shot someone without comitting and risking your life. Keep in mind, your passive ap scaling is weaker late game. If you can't finish them with one combo, you have to either leave or commit, hence the life of a burst-mage, which we have plenty of. Having the ability to zone, do good consistent damage rewarded with positioning, and being able to roam effectively with enough practice feels very rewarding. Having that thrown away to just turn him into another burst-mage (by which some could argue other burst-champs could do better) doesn't feel fun or great or healthy.
Dynikus (NA)
: >-Your roaming is hit hard. You can only get good roams off whenever your e is off cool-down (which is every 1 min, 20), as you lost your e passive movement speed. This also nerfs gap-closing when it comes to long chases. So it's best to engage with Q+E or find a way to catch them off-guard. (Consistently activating your W over and over helps for chasing or running away, since it procs your w movement speed. I'm not sure about this one. His e getting a substantial distance increase rank 1 (enough to go from mid to either side lane) plus the addition of his w move speed I think makes his roams stronger and saves you from needing to put any additional points into e before maxing other abilities. I've noticed from the few games I played on pbe with him that you can waveclear even faster with w, then use the short movespeed burst for a roam. Overall though the changes do hurt his late game, and completely change how the champion is played, which I don't really know if I like yet with how few games I've played.
> [{quoted}](name=Dynikus,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Me1sLuOX,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-08-02T20:33:28.274+0000) > > I'm not sure about this one. His e getting a substantial distance increase rank 1 (enough to go from mid to either side lane) plus the addition of his w move speed I think makes his roams stronger and saves you from needing to put any additional points into e before maxing other abilities. I've noticed from the few games I played on pbe with him that you can waveclear even faster with w, then use the short movespeed burst for a roam. > > Overall though the changes do hurt his late game, and completely change how the champion is played, which I don't really know if I like yet with how few games I've played. As everything is up for debate, its just one idea I decided to mention to maybe bring a spotlight to other ideas, but it can make you think twice in either using your e to fly to lane or to another lane to consider losing that movement speed buff. The w movement speed could be tuned down a bit to compensate keeping the e passive on as well.
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: Is there a way to silence those little monsters in ARAM that follow people around?
I mean the easiest solution for this would be for them to just like act poros (Basically little legends wouldn't be able to emote alongside you, preventing them from repeatedly doing special voice-lines accustomed to them & how poros would just follow you around and not make noise).
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TheMojoKiller

Level 349 (NA)
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