: The issue is that tastes vary. I'm not a fan of garish over-designed fancy skins with a billion fancy effects and obnoxious new voice lines. Conversely I love the Warden skin line and, I kid you not, Crimson Elite.
That's what I'm saying though. Warden offered a cool theme that wasn't just sci-fi/mecha. They even made an Ashe skin that wasn't blue on blue. Crimson Elite could've been really great because it could have had some cool lore implications, or at least given us a glimpse into Noxian uniforms.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: Mordekaiser also has a Dragon World skin...that one will look awesome as well.
It's Dragon Knight, and I have that one too.
InTheory (EUW)
: I thought you were going with the infernal Diana and state that they were too similar before the rework and now they'd even share a skin.
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=ThurgotOfThunder,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=gnxbKc9e,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-07-17T15:21:33.519+0000) > > Well you're wrong, because I have owned Infernal Mordekaiser for like 8 years. He was kidding, I'm pretty sure. The joke is - that skin is just a recolor.
Kelg (NA)
: thats a chroma my dude
Well you're wrong, because I have owned Infernal Mordekaiser for like 8 years.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Kanzler (NA)
: Frozen heart? Thornmail? Adaptive helm? Spirit visage? Warmogs? 1) your point is entirely opinion based on what you think is "cool" 2) your post sucks.
Attack speed reduction? Cool. Adaptive helm is a great example of a cool, situationally powerful effect. I like it a lot actually. Spirit Visage is either the only MR item you need, or you're wasting money on stats you don't want, IE any tank with no sustain. Warmoggs is great, but having 800 more hp only does so much when you get crit for 500 twice a second. Don't be condescending because you disagree. My post is about powerful % based damage reduction and how they could balance tank items by finding a home for that on some of them and reducing the amount of armor pen/shred in the game, which would be an overall buff to the health of the game, in my opinion.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: Uhh, I know there is video evidence that he can. Was it removed at some point?
> [{quoted}](name=Daddy Issues,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=KIasmRVd,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-04-23T15:07:42.871+0000) > > Uhh, I know there is video evidence that he can. Was it removed at some point? Well, you're wrong. So.
Rioter Comments
: I honestly don't think Ryze's changes will make him overbearing(especially considering he has to use spell flux to deal that true damage, in which case with these changes means he can't root you).
> [{quoted}](name=Atrushan2,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=FQJJ96sB,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-04-18T04:01:29.173+0000) > > I honestly don't think Ryze's changes will make him overbearing(especially considering he has to use spell flux to deal that true damage, in which case with these changes means he can't root you). I think making him E you before W in order to snare is an extremely good change, personally. Ryze root has always been immensely frustrating as melee's, and immobile one's especially, when he gets to a point that if you don't have flash you don't get to play the game. And I'm not saying this will break Ryze or anything, I just don't like the precedent of adding true damage to everything.
: Flat true damage is fine. You are talking about vayne and fiora, however, who deal percent max hp true damage. This means there is **NO** way to counter them since building hp will just make them deal more true damage. Again though, flat true damage is fine imo but yeah fuck vayne and fiora.
> [{quoted}](name=Salamencę,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=FQJJ96sB,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-04-18T03:58:31.551+0000) > > Flat true damage is fine. You are talking about vayne and fiora, however, who deal percent max hp true damage. This means there is **NO** way to counter them since building hp will just make them deal more true damage. Again though, flat true damage is fine imo but yeah fuck vayne and fiora. I agree with you on principle, but I also think that enormous flat true damage applied at too high of rapidity can have the same feeling, as it completely invalidates your defense. Uses that are gated by long cds or behind some other template that prevents them from being applied over and over again rapidly are fine, in my opinion.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: It was actually more a matter of principle wherein if we broke ranged/melee expectations for champions, what's the point of the distinction and what kind of can of worms is being opened up insofar as power creep and intuitiveness of the game are concerned.
Which I understand, even if it kinda sucks in this case. What about the attack speed scaling? And thanks for the reply, I appreciate it.
: Yeah. Feels pretty bad. Not getting full effect from Conqueror has a similar feel. On the plus side, we've been testing a few new fighter items that hopefully don't need to have the 'melee only' flag on them, but it's hard to say if they'll make it to Live in that state. Recently I put in a change for testing where Urgot was just considered melee for the purposes of systems like these, but overwhelmingly got negative feedback on that. My personal preference would be that we have another split similar to how we have range / melee that describes defensive profile rather than range profile. In most cases they line up, but if for example, we had a light / heavy split, that might do good stuff for making champions like Urgot and GP more balanceable within the item system. Biggest immediate problem I can see with that, however, is that there's no immediate gameplay connection to that profile in the same way there is for AA ranges.
I'm just curious, what was the negative feedback with him being considered melee? Too much damage? Items/Runes too strong? Also, I've seen rioters say that attack speed scaling on W has been tested, what went wrong with that? If it can't crit, I can't imagine that being too strong.
: Rework Concept: Mordekaiser, the Iron Revenant
Passive: Iron man: A % of Mordekaiser's max hp can be created as shields based on X% of damage dealt by his abilities. While this shield is above X%, Mordekaiser's basic abilities slow enemies by X% Q: Mace of Spades: Mordekaiser can activate Mace of Spades to enhance his next auto attack, stacking up to 3 times (3 seperate enhancements on 3 seperate attacks) Hit 1- Dawn- Mordekaiser swings his mace upward, lightly bumping enemy champions on hit (just a displace, not a stun) Hit 2- Dusk- Mordekaiser swings his mace sidways, and the damage echoes out behind the first target (Ravenous Hydra, but metal) Hit 3- Nightfall- (Oooh, cool, *cheers*) Mordekaiser slams his mace downward, dealing a % of his target's missing hp. If this kills a champion, Nightfall may be recast at no cost, instantly. (Chain auto resets for a % missing hp execute, but it's gated behind a cooldown AND being the third use of a single ability. W- Harvester of Sorrow: Mordekaiser shreds (metal) some of his own maximum %hp to apply a cloud to himself, and to a nearby allied unit. Enemies the cloud touches are dealt X damage per second for 4 seconds. Mordekaiser may recast Harvester of Sorrow to become a cloud of metal and teleport to the other cloud. Enemies touched by Mordekaiser in this state are stunned for X seconds. E: Siphon of Destruction: Mordekaiser blasts 5 shards of metal outward in a cone. These shards pass through minions and monsters, but stop on contact with champions, large, and epic monsters. Mordekaiser can pick up the shards that are stopped for a % missing hp heal. R: Children of the Grave: Passive: Every enemy that Mordekaiser damages withing 5 seconds before they die is compelled to join him in service (controlled as a swarm, the same way the ghost is now, with obviously hugely reduced stats) Active: Mordekaiser singles out an enemy (Current big rotating Morde head works fine for this) with a debuff called "Paranoid" (Metal). All enemies that approach within X units of their Paranoid ally are feared for 3 seconds. All heals and shields applied to this unit are also applied to Mordekaiser while they're Paranoid. Lasts 5 seconds, but the duration is refreshed every time Mordekaiser or his Children of the Grave damage the Paranoid unit. Children of the Grave always attack the paranoid unit and cannot be ordered to do otherwise. This is an idea I've floated out a couple times but haven't gotten a lot of conversation over.
Rioter Comments
: drake: COME AT ME BRO now if only minions could flash a M7.....
I've seen minions flash mastery. I like the scuttlecrab flashing the surrender flag at me, then the crying Amumu emote.
Mcsquzzy (NA)
: i would pay the value of an ult skin just to be able to see this in all games
I actually love it. I think it lightens the mood in the game and just helps me remember I'm playing a video game, for fun, so I should be having fun.
Rioter Comments
: So I Just Played Illaoi vs Illaoi in One For All
I lost it when the tentacles flashed mastery at you.
Takerial (NA)
: All I'm getting from you, is that you don't know how to properly play the melee into range match-up at your current elo, and you want to blame the system rather than your ability to properly play the match-up.
> [{quoted}](name=Takerial,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2018-03-28T02:54:37.929+0000) > > All I'm getting from you, is that you don't know how to properly play the melee into range match-up at your current elo, and you want to blame the system rather than your ability to properly play the match-up. All I'm getting from you is that you have no concept of how the game works and that you'd rather insult someone than offer a valid counterpoint.
: > [{quoted}](name=ThurgotOfThunder,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=000300000001000000000000,timestamp=2018-03-28T02:17:26.187+0000) > > So you expect me to use Q to poke and to farm? That's what you said earlier, about champions having abilities to farm from range. I can farm with my E, but you're on something if you think it's going to clear a whole wave before you have 300 armor and maxed it. This also costs mana, and will run you oom even faster than your already contradicting arguments. > > To get in range to poke Jayce, I open myself up to at least two autos, probably a cannon Q that may or may not be empowered, Hammer form passive auto damage, hammer Q, and hammer E, which will definitely do more damage than my Q did to him, and also push me off and slow me so I can't even smack him a few times. His Q being point blank doesn't matter, the damage doesn't scale with distance. > > And I think you're severely overestimating how long his shield lasts early in the game especially. That bonus armor will apply to maybe one or two hits, then your shield is gone and maxing W is useless again. > > Your arguments contradict each other while also managing to ignore reality. Nice. you know, maybe if you focused more on finding how to win instead of justifying why you lose you wouldn't have such a hard time. Following your logic i'm also telling you to max both your w and your q at the same time. Well yes, if that was the case, I would be ignoring the fact that you only get 1 skill point per level. But i'm not telling you that. You just don't want to see that there's other ways to play. You max your q and go comet if you want to poke your opponent. You max your other spells if you want to use q to last hit. Simple. You also stay away from the river (because you seemingly can't farm Under tower) and walk in the wave to e once the minions are low. Also : do you play with 200 ms or something? In what world do you have to walk in jayce's melee range to q him? Malphite's q has 625 range while jayce's cannon form has 500. If you have to eat jayce's whole kit every time you q then you really are setting yourself up for failure. And even if that was not the case : If jayce can apparently do 3 autos and 7 spells in the time it takes you to point-and-click your q (which you apparently can't do while he's auto attacking a minion) why don't you ban jayce? Clearly all your problems will be solved since, seeing how you put him, jayce is the most broken champion in the game. And once more: Malphite's w gives him 30% bonus armor at max rank. With his shield up, that value triples. If you a) have the same mechanical capacities as a beginner bot and b) waste all your mana before walking into lane, that additional armor WILL help you more than 2 abilities you will never use by AT LEAST making you take oh-so-slightly less damage(anyway in your scenarios you die every time you cast a spell so you're better off never using them so you can at least reduce the damage of the empowered q's that you are so adamant on not dodging) (finally the point blank q is that he can't really empower it, heavily reducing the damage)
> [{quoted}](name=BlueVestGuy,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=0003000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2018-03-28T02:49:09.174+0000) > > you know, maybe if you focused more on finding how to win instead of justifying why you lose you wouldn't have such a hard time. > > Following your logic i'm also telling you to max both your w and your q at the same time. Well yes, if that was the case, I would be ignoring the fact that you only get 1 skill point per level. But i'm not telling you that. You just don't want to see that there's other ways to play. > You max your q and go comet if you want to poke your opponent. You max your other spells if you want to use q to last hit. Simple. You also stay away from the river (because you seemingly can't farm Under tower) and walk in the wave to e once the minions are low. > > Also : do you play with 200 ms or something? In what world do you have to walk in jayce's melee range to q him? Malphite's q has 625 range while jayce's cannon form has 500. If you have to eat jayce's whole kit every time you q then you really are setting yourself up for failure. And even if that was not the case : If jayce can apparently do 3 autos and 7 spells in the time it takes you to point-and-click your q (which you apparently can't do while he's auto attacking a minion) why don't you ban jayce? Clearly all your problems will be solved since, seeing how you put him, jayce is the most broken champion in the game. > > And once more: Malphite's w gives him 30% bonus armor at max rank. With his shield up, that value triples. If you a) have the same mechanical capacities as a beginner bot and b) waste all your mana before walking into lane, that additional armor WILL help you more than 2 abilities you will never use by AT LEAST making you take oh-so-slightly less damage(anyway in your scenarios you die every time you cast a spell so you're better off never using them so you can at least reduce the damage of the empowered q's that you are so adamant on not dodging) > > (finally the point blank q is that he can't really empower it, heavily reducing the damage) I get that it feels good to try and insult people, but there's no need for that here. You are suggesting that I poke with Q, and also that I farm with Q, and also that I clear full waves with E, and also that I max W for the shield armor bonus. Jayce gets movespeed from switching forms. Any good Jayce player will absolutely, 100 percent of the time, land at least an auto on you every time you go to use Q for anything but a melee minion farm from behind your casters. Any good Jayce player can bully most top laners, especially Malphite in this instance, away from a wave simply by existing. If you try and farm under tower, you eat autos and Q every time, because that's how ranged works vs melee. And yes, Jayce can cast an auto, ranged Q, R, hammer Q, hammer auto, and hammer E in under a second because animation cancelling. That's literally just how the game works. Don't belittle me instead of posing an argument because you very clearly don't have one.
: > [{quoted}](name=ThurgotOfThunder,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=xzRiiqP4,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:49:09.583+0000) > > It feels really bad that 3 of the resolve runes are soft healing over time runes, runes that buff existing healing, or ones that offer healing over time to allies. Why can't we get a resolve rune that straight buffs armor all game? Or MR all game? Or even just a simple HP/5 rune? Probably because riot's trying to step away from uninteractive stat-sticks... Which, While i'm saying that, Is kinda ironic when you remember that a good amount of runes are literally stat-sticks
> [{quoted}](name=ZenithEevee,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=xzRiiqP4,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2018-03-28T02:15:21.272+0000) > > Probably because riot's trying to step away from uninteractive stat-sticks... > > Which, While i'm saying that, Is kinda ironic when you remember that a good amount of runes are literally stat-sticks Or % damage increases, which is even worse than just bonus stats.
: > [{quoted}](name=ThurgotOfThunder,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=0003000000010000,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:33:35.303+0000) > > Good joke. Mana crystal is 250 mana, right? Malphite Q at level one is 70 mana I'm pretty sure. 3-4 more Q's before I back, worth. Yes, that's why you also take manaflow band. You're not supposed to farm every single minion with your q ; you do that to poke your opponent so he can't get you to 20% health while remaining at 100%. You can also farm with your e, you know? You can clear the whole wave with that, not just 1. > And you know Jayce can shred armor right? Also his % hp knockback deals magic damage. Also if I buy ninja tabi and a mana crystal on my first back and try to all in a Jayce at level 6, I'm going to die, and it's not going to be close. Maxing W first is a terrible idea and I hope you never do that. Any good top laner will keep your passive down all the time, and if you're walking away from minions far enough to let it recharge when it's broken, you're still losing cs just like you would any other time. You're not supposed to tp in and ult either. You poke your opponent with your q + comet + scorch. Jayce's e does 8% of your max health, unless he maxes it first, which then means he does 0 damage with his other abilities. The shred comes from his first cannon attack, not hammer. If he shreds you in a fight, that means he's not going to be able to Knock you back (because theres a cd to switch forms), and his q will probably be at point blank too. In other words : He's exposed and loses a good amount of damage. Regardless, your shield only triples the armor bonus. The "200 armor level 6 with tabis only" was an hyperbole. Doesn't change anything to the fact that 50 additional armor (from your shieldless w) will benefit you more than an "ability you can't use due to high mana costs" and an "ability you can't use otherwise the top laner will take away half my health in one spell rotation". Plus, losing a wave of cs just to recharge your shield will net you more gold than losing every wave of cs because you can't farm.
> [{quoted}](name=BlueVestGuy,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=00030000000100000000,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:57:57.604+0000) > > Yes, that's why you also take manaflow band. You're not supposed to farm every single minion with your q ; you do that to poke your opponent so he can't get you to 20% health while remaining at 100%. > You can also farm with your e, you know? You can clear the whole wave with that, not just 1. > > You're not supposed to tp in and ult either. You poke your opponent with your q + comet + scorch. > Jayce's e does 8% of your max health, unless he maxes it first, which then means he does 0 damage with his other abilities. The shred comes from his first cannon attack, not hammer. If he shreds you in a fight, that means he's not going to be able to Knock you back (because theres a cd to switch forms), and his q will probably be at point blank too. In other words : He's exposed and loses a good amount of damage. > Regardless, your shield only triples the armor bonus. The "200 armor level 6 with tabis only" was an hyperbole. Doesn't change anything to the fact that 50 additional armor (from your shieldless w) will benefit you more than an "ability you can't use due to high mana costs" and an "ability you can't use otherwise the top laner will take away half my health in one spell rotation". > Plus, losing a wave of cs just to recharge your shield will net you more gold than losing every wave of cs because you can't farm. So you expect me to use Q to poke and to farm? That's what you said earlier, about champions having abilities to farm from range. I can farm with my E, but you're on something if you think it's going to clear a whole wave before you have 300 armor and maxed it. This also costs mana, and will run you oom even faster than your already contradicting arguments. To get in range to poke Jayce, I open myself up to at least two autos, probably a cannon Q that may or may not be empowered, Hammer form passive auto damage, hammer Q, and hammer E, which will definitely do more damage than my Q did to him, and also push me off and slow me so I can't even smack him a few times. His Q being point blank doesn't matter, the damage doesn't scale with distance. And I think you're severely overestimating how long his shield lasts early in the game especially. That bonus armor will apply to maybe one or two hits, then your shield is gone and maxing W is useless again. Your arguments contradict each other while also managing to ignore reality. Nice.
: they're was some words after "its not good". grammar ? eng is not primary langage everywhere.... anyway u want more : - giving him tankiness when he'll already used his burst is pointless... when you use your combo, u just back off - your proposal dont help wukong with his current gameplay nor reliably helping his pitiful laning phase - Wukong dosn't need more tankiness via "a mini game". if riot want to make Wukong into a bruiser, they'll need to rework him... not only his passive. Edit : resistance buff would be good on Wukong ult tho (still hope they wont increase tankish wu side).
All right, we'll play this game. Wukong has short cd's on E and Q, it feels to me like he is supposed to jump in with E, land a Q bonk, decoy, and choose to either keep fighting or run away. Putting clones on E not only preserves this gameplay, but amplifies every part of it. It also helps his lane by aggroing fewer minion hits and, in a lot cases, less retaliation from his lane opponent. Clearly Wukong is intended to have at least some innate tankiness, and it's not a mini game, it's an effect. A pretty simple one actually. Your argument essentially is that my idea is bad because it is bad, and that's not an argument.
: tbh The only good ones are Boneplate, Demolish, Secondwind, The one Resistances one, And font of life, If you ever decide to go Swaink'in toplane.
> [{quoted}](name=ZenithEevee,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=xzRiiqP4,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:44:42.095+0000) > > tbh > The only good ones are Boneplate, Demolish, Secondwind, The one Resistances one, And font of life, If you ever decide to go Swaink'in toplane. It feels really bad that 3 of the resolve runes are soft healing over time runes, runes that buff existing healing, or ones that offer healing over time to allies. Why can't we get a resolve rune that straight buffs armor all game? Or MR all game? Or even just a simple HP/5 rune?
: > [{quoted}](name=ThurgotOfThunder,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:16:00.711+0000) > > How often do you farm from range with abilities on tanks? Most abilities with enough range to farm safely in lane either cost way too much mana to be efficient for farming or are hard to target one minion. Like, you want me to Q every minion to death as Malphite? Oom by level 2. > > I'm not saying every melee should get a free pass in lane, and that obviously wouldn't be the case here, I'm suggesting that we give some of these melee champs who are already hard countered by range/kiting in the mid and late game the ability to do literally anything in lane. I understand when I pick a tank I might have to sacrifice farm, but should I have to sacrifice doing anything in lane simply so I don't feed gold to the other top laner? Am I going to be useful if I'm not allowed to farm? If my build is more gold efficient (lol, tank items are a joke compared to ranged carry items). I mean buy a mana Crystal on your first back and with manaflow band you should have less mana issues. Anyway comet malph does decent damage so you should be able to poke them back with your q until you can all in at level 6. If for some reason you can't do that just max w first. I fail to see how jayce could bully you out of lane when you have 200 armor and your only complete item is ninja tabis.
> [{quoted}](name=BlueVestGuy,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=000300000001,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:28:10.302+0000) > > I mean buy a mana Crystal on your first back and with manaflow band you should have less mana issues. Anyway comet malph does decent damage so you should be able to poke them back with your q until you can all in at level 6. If for some reason you can't do that just max w first. I fail to see how jayce could bully you out of lane when you have 200 armor and your only complete item is ninja tabis. Good joke. Mana crystal is 250 mana, right? Malphite Q at level one is 70 mana I'm pretty sure. 3-4 more Q's before I back, worth. And you know Jayce can shred armor right? Also his % hp knockback deals magic damage. Also if I buy ninja tabi and a mana crystal on my first back and try to all in a Jayce at level 6, I'm going to die, and it's not going to be close. Maxing W first is a terrible idea and I hope you never do that. Any good top laner will keep your passive down all the time, and if you're walking away from minions far enough to let it recharge when it's broken, you're still losing cs just like you would any other time.
Kythers (NA)
: {{item:1054}} {{item:3047}} heh nothing personnel
> [{quoted}](name=Kythers,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:26:08.201+0000) > > {{item:1054}} {{item:3047}} heh nothing personnel How often do you get to have both of those things at level 1? Or 2? Or 3? What are the odds you buy Tabi before your lane opponent buys something with more damage on it? Also having Tabi without being allowed to buy any hp or damage to retaliate is just going to extend the duration between your recalls, and you will have to recall often if you're trying to farm against a ranged champ in lane.
Takerial (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=ThurgotOfThunder,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:16:00.711+0000) > > How often do you farm from range with abilities on tanks? Most abilities with enough range to farm safely in lane either cost way too much mana to be efficient for farming or are hard to target one minion. Like, you want me to Q every minion to death as Malphite? Oom by level 2. > > I'm not saying every melee should get a free pass in lane, and that obviously wouldn't be the case here, I'm suggesting that we give some of these melee champs who are already hard countered by range/kiting in the mid and late game the ability to do literally anything in lane. I understand when I pick a tank I might have to sacrifice farm, but should I have to sacrifice doing anything in lane simply so I don't feed gold to the other top laner? Am I going to be useful if I'm not allowed to farm? If my build is more gold efficient (lol, tank items are a joke compared to ranged carry items). This game is all about trade offs when you pick a champion in a certain role. Part of the trade offs is losing in lane pressure and sacrificing some early hp to farm on melee versus range for most match-ups. This is especially true if you pick off-meta melees that are in a weaker state atm.
> [{quoted}](name=Takerial,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:24:48.227+0000) > > This game is all about trade offs when you pick a champion in a certain role. > > Part of the trade offs is losing in lane pressure and sacrificing some early hp to farm on melee versus range for most match-ups. > > This is especially true if you pick off-meta melees that are in a weaker state atm. But... I'm not talking about "sacrificing some early hp to farm," I'm talking about not being allowed to lane, at all, for 15-20 minutes because you simply cannot approach a wave without eating a huge, unavoidable, ranged chunk of damage with little to no opportunity for retaliation that comes at no cost to the champion hitting you with it because it's mostly auto attacks. It's not a trade off, it's picking a champ with the intention of playing a game of League of Legends, and instead getting to play recall simulator for farming a single minion.
Rioter Comments
xRopez (EUW)
: Riot should atleast swap Chrysalis with Bone Plate Those are the only 2 Runes in the Resolve Tree who are good to take as a Melee to try survive Poke from Ranged but unfortunately they are in the same lane
> [{quoted}](name=xRopez,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:16:55.217+0000) > > Riot should atleast swap Chrysalis with Bone Plate > > Those are the only 2 Runes in the Resolve Tree who are good to take as a Melee to try survive Poke from Ranged but unfortunately they are in the same lane Chrysalis was a cool idea, but it feels bad that you lose that tiny hp bonus to gain a tiny adaptive damage bonus when there are basic, not keystone runes that give you up to 12% damage increase. The defensive rune stat bonuses aren't good.
Akaash (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=ThurgotOfThunder,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=pypdoTez,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-03-28T00:36:23.605+0000) > > I remember that, because it offered a way to get back into a game in which you're getting destroyed, and forced the team with such a huge advantage to play around their killstreak champs. It was a mechanic that allowed a team that was extremely behind to grab some extra gold by snagging a pick on that 6-0 jungler, or the superfed adc that has no concept of positioning. It didn't help the team get back into the game. The bounty was focused heavily onto the killer. Meaning the person who was really behind probably wasn't going to come back unless they luckily got the kill. Right now kill streak bounties go to the entire team. Which works to prevent an individual from snowballing. It was extremely rewarding to get, but if your 20 kill zed killed a 20 kill talon, it wasn't going to affect the snowball at all.
> [{quoted}](name=Akaash,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=pypdoTez,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:12:30.232+0000) > > It didn't help the team get back into the game. > > The bounty was focused heavily onto the killer. Meaning the person who was really behind probably wasn't going to come back unless they luckily got the kill. > > Right now kill streak bounties go to the entire team. Which works to prevent an individual from snowballing. > > It was extremely rewarding to get, but if your 20 kill zed killed a 20 kill talon, it wasn't going to affect the snowball at all. But if their 20 kill Talon made a stupid dive, and you snagged a kill under your tower because he dove you like a moron, you would get a huge reward, and it would punish that 20 kill Talon for being a moron.
Takerial (NA)
: The only melee champions that don't have a significant gap closer are either a tank which means you don't need as much gold to be effective, have abilities that makes farming from a distance possible, or are both. If you want to play Melee champions, then you need to play appropriate for that champion. If it means sacrificing early lane pressure to survive to point of being useful, then that's what you have to do. If you have a super easy lane on a regular basis, then you're either in the wrong elo, or you're making a lot of mistakes outside of laning phase.
> [{quoted}](name=Takerial,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-03-28T01:08:49.951+0000) > > The only melee champions that don't have a significant gap closer are either a tank which means you don't need as much gold to be effective, have abilities that makes farming from a distance possible, or are both. > > If you want to play Melee champions, then you need to play appropriate for that champion. If it means sacrificing early lane pressure to survive to point of being useful, then that's what you have to do. > > If you have a super easy lane on a regular basis, then you're either in the wrong elo, or you're making a lot of mistakes outside of laning phase. How often do you farm from range with abilities on tanks? Most abilities with enough range to farm safely in lane either cost way too much mana to be efficient for farming or are hard to target one minion. Like, you want me to Q every minion to death as Malphite? Oom by level 2. I'm not saying every melee should get a free pass in lane, and that obviously wouldn't be the case here, I'm suggesting that we give some of these melee champs who are already hard countered by range/kiting in the mid and late game the ability to do literally anything in lane. I understand when I pick a tank I might have to sacrifice farm, but should I have to sacrifice doing anything in lane simply so I don't feed gold to the other top laner? Am I going to be useful if I'm not allowed to farm? If my build is more gold efficient (lol, tank items are a joke compared to ranged carry items).
: > [{quoted}](name=ThurgotOfThunder,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2018-03-28T00:26:16.644+0000) > > Cool, but should I have to play Renekton every game in order to be able to go to top lane? I'm pretty sure that was all of season 3-4
> [{quoted}](name=Mordepool,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2018-03-28T00:55:25.581+0000) > > I'm pretty sure that was all of season 3-4 And boy, that was a lot of fun, huh.
: tbh I dont think anyone really noticed a lot of the buffs, Nor cared... Like, Remember Gromp buff, And how you could use it with Cass and have infinite use out of your dual fang spell if the enemy AA'd you once?
> [{quoted}](name=ZenithEevee,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=76PEEaQG,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-03-28T00:23:07.172+0000) > > tbh > I dont think anyone really noticed a lot of the buffs, Nor cared... > > Like, Remember Gromp buff, And how you could use it with Cass and have infinite use out of your dual fang spell if the enemy AA'd you once? Since their removal on SR, people have brought them up quite a lot because, specifically, they helped tank junglers clear a little faster and healthier. But also, those buffs were on TT. I'm talking about bringing them over to make clearing the jungle more rewarding, and keep the junglers in the jungle longer.
Rioter Comments
: >E spawns clones that stay after dealing the damage to his target that look just like his W decoy and offer the same effect. its not good. Would still be easy af to spot whose the true WK from clone.... Along not helping Wu. would be better to ask to Wu mains (no offense)
"its not good" isn't a counter argument. Also grammar is hard.
: {{champion:58}}
> [{quoted}](name=Cryonix,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-03-28T00:10:38.547+0000) > > {{champion:58}} Cool, but should I have to play Renekton every game in order to be able to go to top lane?
: > [{quoted}](name=ThurgotOfThunder,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-03-27T23:09:10.771+0000) > > Jungle ganks should never, ever, be the answer to simply not being allowed to lane vs someone. Andd sure, you can "build armor and run them down" but they're going to actually get to farm while you have to sit behind your minions and pray they push you under tower so you can maybe sneak in some farm. But even then, they're going to harass you while you try because towers have a slower reaction time than most corpses/they can usually outrange the tower, especially if you hope to kill a caster minion. sure they are, if you want to listen to what some monkey said in old boards in 2012 who made it maybe gold at best, you can believe you're supposed to do things alone in a team game i guess what top laner are you playing that is immobile i actually can't think of any unless you're actually one tricking garen or something , who builds one piece of armor and can 1v1 anyone in the game
> [{quoted}](name=T I L T B O I,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=famgQKjf,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2018-03-27T23:37:17.944+0000) > > sure they are, if you want to listen to what some monkey said in old boards in 2012 who made it maybe gold at best, you can believe you're supposed to do things alone in a team game i guess > > what top laner are you playing that is immobile i actually can't think of any unless you're actually one tricking garen or something , who builds one piece of armor and can 1v1 anyone in the game If you can't answer that question, I honestly don't know why you responded other than just to troll. Garen, Darius, Singed, Malphite, Nasus, Aatrox, Ornn, Volibear, Shen, Illaoi... Do you need me to go on? Sure those champs can usually win a fight 1v1, but if they have to eat 5-6 or more autos before they can even get into range, they're going to lose that fight. Particularly early in the game, before they have access to all their abilities are particularly vulnerable to being harassed from range. Like, sure if you land your cc you might be able to fight, but there are a lot of caveats to that that put the advantage heavily in the favor of the raged champ.
: Ah, so having it spread out more rather than appearing all right next to the target, that's a cool idea too!
Yeah, since his E already spawns two other little nimbus-riding Wukongs, it wouldn't be all that wierd, I don't think, for them to just remain on the map for a second or two after the ability is cast, wherever they landed.
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ThurgotOfThunder

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