: Not that the Nexus: Galio post isn't still relevant... but only current Universe and Map content is likely to be canon.
Does this mean it was a typo and they actually rode atop Silverwing raptors instead? This is something I’ve been curious about since reading that Nexus article, seeing as we’ve never really gotten any visuals or information on the ebony wyverns.
: Eww, no. Zilean should never be any kind of king. That would just ruin him. He's a doddering old time wizard who made a breakthrough at the expense of his anchor in reality. So while I am ok with them making it so he's not perpetually mentally lost in time, he still needs to remain the time wizard who vanished in his city's hour of need.
Given how outdated Zilean is as a champion and how much potential he has within his theme, I think he could be taken in a lot of different directions that isn't just "doddering old time wizard". That may be the most desirable option for people attached to his current lore, gameplay and VO, but as someone who sees potential within the "chronolord" archetype I think he could be so much more; even an Aspect of Time, which would probably be the most epic realization of the fantasy you could achieve within the League universe.
: > [{quoted}](name=Scathlocke,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=kjAGAe9O,comment-id=000000040000,timestamp=2018-09-17T22:29:32.524+0000) > > There are certainly hints in more recent lore updates outside of the game... Looking at Katarina's and Swain's lore mostly. There we can see a bit more of General Du Couteau and that small note at the end... _"He would raise others in her place, simply to spite her. "_ Can we safely assume Urgot's line upon executing Talon with his R hints towards the updated canon? p~~leaseplaseprettyplease~~
For those wondering, Urgot says "Obedient to the end" when executing Talon with his ultimate, suggesting Talon does everything Du Couteau asks him to.
: Hextech Camille
Can she get any more Hextech than she already is though?! O_O
: Post augment ideas for your favorite champs!
{{champion:133}} **P - Harrier**: * Valor now swoops in and strikes Vulnerable targets that Quinn attacks, dealing physical damage and ignoring a percentage of the enemies' Armor. ___ **W - Heightened Senses**: * Activating Heightened Senses will now also cause Valor to reveal enemy champions who are invisible or camouflaged. ___ **E - Vault**: * Quinn may now reactivate Vault mid-flight in order to place herself on the opposite side of the target enemy. (_Bugs ahoy!_) ___ **R - ~~Behind Enemy Lines~~ Tag Team**: * Quinn now swaps places with Valor, allowing the player to take control of him until Tag Team is reactivated. As Valor, you passively ignore unit and terrain collision while out of combat, attacking from melee range. Behind Enemy Lines' standard movement speed effects still apply. ___ **R - Skystrike**: * Reactivating Tag Team will fire **Skystrike**, a hail of arrows that deals physical damage in the area based on missing health and allows Quinn to tag back into the field at a nearby location of the player's choice within the area of effect.
Zapzya (OCE)
: Which other skin line would you like to see developed?
It's not a skin line (yet) but I'd really love to see more Ravenborn/Black Rose skins
: > [{quoted}](name=ZygfrydGamomg,realm=EUNE,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=MWyTEcv0,comment-id=0000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-09-15T08:50:42.194+0000) > > It's still there on the old boards. I saw it a few days ago, but unfortunately, I don't have the link. A bit of Googling last night led me to it, had a long IronStylus post about the development phase. Interesting read :P http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3481674
She was indeed rushed. Champions were being pumped out at a much quicker rate back then, and Quinn got less time than most — not to mention they had a confused direction for the champion all throughout (was she going to be a Demacian vigilante with a melee weapon? A ranger with a crossbow? A knight? Scout? Marksman? Fighter? Assassin?). What we ended up getting was a conglomeration of all those things, and her art/gameplay didn’t quite live up to League’s standards as a result.
: That's why so many want it changed back =(
This. I suspect they’re saving the name change for their VGU (like they did with Nunu), but some official confirmation would be nice too
Rioter Comments
Zapzya (OCE)
: I mean, if you have a pet, you can get a general idea of what kind of noise they're making at you. I have a cat, and I can tell what it kind of meow it makes, whether it wants food or attention (body language also plays a part). I also assume she is just imagining what Valor is saying as well, projecting her own thoughts onto the bird. That doesn't mean she insane though, she can be aware that Valor doesn't actually think that. I also talk at my cat in a less serious but similar manner for fun. In fact, most of my family who are around cats do this. I would guess most people with cats do this.
> I also talk at my cat in a less serious but similar manner for fun. In fact, most of my family who are around cats do this. I would guess most people with cats do this. I do this with my cat too. Though judging by Rioter comments it would in fact seem that Quinn just intuitively understands what Valor is saying.
: It might not be, but a girl who loses her twin brother, and then forms an equally intense bond with a bird, and communicates with said bird as if it could talk to her as a normal person is a pretty solid case for clinical insanity...
I think in our world she'd definitely get written off as a bit nutty :-) In a fantasy setting like Runeterra though, there can be a myriad of reasons why they're able to communicate. Here's something to munch on: https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/61tf1z/ama_were_the_rioters_behind_demacias_stories_and/dfh51mh/
: Yes, please make her an ADC. Toplane and Jungle Quinn is the absolute worst.
I'd be alright with Quinn turning into an ADC if they made her a melee-hybrid again. I thought that was a really interesting niche for her as a Marksman that simply failed due to a poor execution.
: To your points, in your "talking" section, the bird just screeched, and Quinn took that as communication. She's nuts, so I don't think we can exactly trust her communications with her bird as being completely sane.
I really don't think clinical insanity is the story Riot's trying to tell with Quinn as a champion.
: Quinn and Valor first.
"but valor's just a pet bird lol, why would he be in quinn's na-" https://i.imgur.com/5it7UzK.png" "doesn't matter, he can't talk or communicate with quinn like nunu & willump ca-" https://i.imgur.com/Tcw2nIk.png" "still, he's just a bird. it's not like he would be able to put up a fight or anythi-" https://i.imgur.com/rpfTaFX.png" "W-WELL... QUINN HAS ALWAYS DONE ALL THE WORK IN GAME ANYW-" https://i.imgur.com/zLov5u3.png" "YOU KNOW WHAT. VALOR SMELLS" https://i.imgur.com/V5eRswz.png"
: How many Gemstones do you guys and gals have?
Four. Don't even remember the last time one dropped for me {{sticker:sg-janna}}
: > [{quoted}](name=Zapzya,realm=OCE,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=2FHdjGUr,comment-id=00050001,timestamp=2018-09-11T04:22:04.728+0000) > > Only suggestion I have would be to speed up the reworks so you can start progressing the story. Perhaps don't wait for champions to be updated in game (or a related champion to be updated) before updating them. If you can't write them fast enough, hire more writers? You could just find a story which definitely won't include non-updated champions and progress those instead. I don't know how viable those suggestions are. Lore updates have been more frequent recently I think, which is good. > > I think the only way forward is to make the lore you currently have as good as it can be. People will always miss the old lore, you just have to make them love the new one. The easiest way to do that (IMO) is to make it feel less static, which can only be done through finishing the reworks asap (without sacrificing quality), or finishing them in segments and moving those segments ahead, then coming back and doing the others later. Pretty rough scenarios either way. There used to be (several desk moves ago) a big printout on the wall near my desk that had all the champ icons on it, with big round stickers placed over them if they had been brought up to date. It was a really good, visual, indication of how far there was yet to go. I know that Scathlocke led the charge to get all the short bios updated a while ago (which is good) but I don't think any of us thinks that's sufficient. I might see about getting a new printout and some stickers. Good to have it in line of sight all the time. Don't quite follow your second paragraph there - could you explain? Finishing in segments and moving those segments ahead? Do you mean progressing stories for bundles of updated characters, leaving some out in the cold in the near future? Ah, I think I've got it - you're saying the two roads we have ahead of us are either to update everyone ASAP, which leaves everyone at chapter 1, OR to get our chapter 2s and 3s etc. going to give a sense of life and consequence into the world again, with the downside being that this would slow down getting the other updates started. Bit of a devil's bargain, I agree. I suspect the plan is to do both, slowly. :/ Some groups of champs have had movement and progression, while we're still updating groups of outdated champs as we do region update bundles. I believe there are plans afoot to bring more meaty progression to some small groups of champs, AND other, separate, efforts to get bigger batches of updates in progress. 'Course, all the plans in the world don't mean squat until they ship, so yeah. TL;DR - Yes, good idea. I think we're going to try both. Hopefully that's not the worst of all worlds!
Any chance you could share this list with us once it’s been updated, Bio? There are some champions who are in a weird place at the moment where their lore has been brought up to date with the modern world but they’re still on the list for major VGUs in the future, which could potentially alter their themes in big ways and therefore their narratives and place in the story. As a result, it’s a bit unclear whether their lore is here to stay or if it will get changed again — Quinn, Skarner, Mordekaiser, and Shyvana are all good examples of this.
: Which Region Is Your Favorite?
I think it's pretty telling that Bandle City has no votes while Ionia has the most, at the moment. I mean it’s still a pretty small survey (I'd actually be interested in the results of an official Riot one), but as the least and most developed factions, respectively, it may just be that some regions need more love than other more fleshed out ones to truly resonate with more players.
: New Teaser Post
Oh look, ANOTHER Jinx skin... {{sticker:sg-lulu}} And judging by the new voice line, I'm guessing another legendary or perhaps even ultimate skin.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: September 7
I really loved seeing your champion word clouds a while back (the ones made from player surveys). Any chance we’ll be seeing more some time soon? Would love to words other players relate with my favorite champs =)
EdgeLady (NA)
: Future Versus Event Matchups and Ideas?
This will probably never happen considering their lower popularity and lack of a developed rivalry, but I think a Quinn VS Talon event would make for some pretty cool legendary skins, with Quinn as a paragon of order wearing spectral blues and silvers and Talon as a merciless killer with a black Noxian hawk.
: VGU wise I think Quinn really just needs some relatively small changes, like Shen got when he got his sword. I posted a W rework idea a few months back, because I feel like that skill is the one that could be tweaked to make Quinn feel very fresh without the alienating her existing player base. Here was the full writeup: https://www.reddit.com/r/QuinnMains/comments/7chxuk/rework_discussion_making_w_a_more_fitting?sort=top I'm likely going to repost that and clean it up a bit.
Honestly I disagree; Quinn’s theme as a Demacian ranger and falconer promises much more than her current gameplay has to offer, and simply making minor tweaks to her W isn’t gonna cut it (it certainly won’t solve Valor feeling less like a partner and more like a taxi). While I do think Quinn’s kit has some things that are fun, iconic, and worth preserving (_cough cough Vault_), in many ways her gameplay is too linear and lacks excitement. To use a comparison, new Akali is a much more fun and flavorful realization of her archetype than old Akali, while offering significantly increased depth and potential for mastery. I’d like to see the same done for Quinn, whose core combat pattern revolves around shooting people marked by a cross-hair. I mean really?! How is that at all an exciting realization of the ranger/falconer theme? (Also, hi Flash!)
: The event still took place in that location, but we moved the image and information down into the Void - Voidborn gallery. Hope that helps!
Is there any way you guys could have it in both places, just for us lore nerds' sake? =)
: and is Riot automatically correct? They build full damage and attempt to one shot. Sounds like an assassin to me.
> They build full damage and attempt to one shot. There are plenty of champions who do this that are very clearly not Assassins. Lux, Syndra, Annie, and Veigar, just to name a few. It stands to reason, then, that just because a champion routinely relies on damage-focused items and can situationally one-shot enemies does not make them an Assassin. If you look at some classic examples of Assassins (Zed, Akali, Fizz, Talon) you’ll notice their ability to both enter and escape fights with relative ease. This, in combination with their squishiness, high target access, and burst damage is what defines the Assassin class... not their sole ability to one-shot, which several non-Assassin champions can also do, given the right conditions. In effect, no matter what you build on champions like Rengar and Nocturne, their kits will never give them the ability to reliably escape a fight once they’re inside of one (barring unrelated game mode items like Spectral Cutlass).
: Rengar, Diana, and Nocturn are assassins
[Do your research, man.](https://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/gameplay/taking-another-look-subclasses)
FeeNeeX (EUNE)
: Is @Reav3 trolling with this post or is he/she for real?
> You really need to Re-think your Priorities here AND Value NECESSITY over POPULARITY While I agree Leona and Diana could use a champion relaunch (their themes feel pretty underserved by their middle-of-the-road kits and visuals), they’re not really as in need of VGUs as other, more outdated champions like Morde, Skarner, Fiddlesticks, etc. I think it’s important Riot tackles the champions who need it most first, and those who the community overwhelmingly agrees warrant big changes — otherwise, as a company they won’t be able to move forward with and get their value out of VGU projects due to a lack of player interest and impact.
Reav3 (NA)
: Anything is possible, though I think that would betray her core theme a bit. Quinn core theme is basically a ranger/hawk master not a knight. I would rather try to make the best version of a ranger with a bad ass pet hawk, because that would feel way more true to Quinn
Someone's been playing a bit of BfA too, I see... ;) https://i.imgur.com/VAQcHbq.png" Personally, I'm partial to the Raptor Knight idea. Quinn's core theme may be that of a ranger/falconer but she also has some knightly- and bird-rider elements in her design as well, which may be worth considering. On the flip side, simply taking her current ranger theme and expanding upon it with her VGU is just as great of an idea in my book. What's really important is that you guys nail the relationship between her and Valor, which is the heart and soul of the champion imo.
: Worldbuilding: Your Turn!
In your opinion, who’s the coolest champion in all of Runeterra and why is it ~~Quinn~~ Valor?
Arakadia (NA)
: But how do you incorporate Zaunite elements into a majestic and unearthly wind spirit? Thats what I'm wondering. She looks like she is wearing the sales of a ship maybe, but not at all from Zaun. I'm just interested on how Riot will update her visuals whenever they get around to it.
That'll be a decent challenge for sure. Who knows, maybe Riot will simply separate her from Zaun as a faction and link her to Runeterra as a whole, avoiding the design issues that would arise from trying to make her more distinctly Zaunite.
: She won't be an R-Shapeshifter if that's what you're asking.
Out of curiosity, would you guys ever consider making another champion like this? Old Quinn, Nidalee, and Elise have been some of my favorite champions to date, even if they were a bit unhealthy/difficult to balance.
Arakadia (NA)
: She isn't a Zaunite girl anymore. I think your asking for her to feel more like a Zaunite champion (with aesthetic and artistic connections) which I support. Not sure how they would combine that with mystical spirit at the same time though.
To be fair, Janna’s a spirit that was born out of the minds and prayers of sailors. Perhaps, as time passes and her “audience” or believers shift, her appearance changes to suit how they see her or what they think she looks like? And since most of her followers are in Zaun atm, it makes sense she’d take on more Zaunite characteristics.
: Janna Visual Update
Thomas Randby (Riot Hylia) is the artist behind this masterpiece :) I agree Janna could use a VGU, even if it's a minor one gameplay-wise. This would be a great direction.
: So much for bot lane diversity
I agree with this. The problem here though is that _a lot_ of players were heavily attached to and/or invested in the ADC-support bot lane meta. Making this strategy significantly less viable after so many years of it being the standard is obviously gonna cause pain for thousands if not millions of players worldwide. I'm not sure there's an easy answer to this or much less a satisfying one; it may very well be that the two metas simply cannot coexist.
: What accents do you wanna hear in LOL and what VGU champs do you wanna see have an accent?
I don’t know about accents but depending on the direction they choose for her VGU, I think something more [rough and gravelly](https://youtu.be/6D4weTzhztY) for Quinn would be cool (though maybe a bit less rough than that example). Out of curiosity, how come you relate Talon/Katarina to Hispanic accents?
: I'm just stating a fact. How can that be controversial?
That was just a texture update, not a full visual update. Her model, animations, and potentially even theme are still outdated and could use a lot of work to bring her up to League’s modern standards.
: I don't think Quinn needs to be included in a lot of champions who need full blown VGUs. Furthermore, Miss Fortune, Kassadin, Singed, Alistar, and Maokai got model updates and gameplay updates, but didn't get animation updates nor VO updates (except Mao). They just need to get animation and VO updates and they'll be in a good place. Shen and Fiora also go model updates and gameplay updates, but just like the others, they didn't get animation updates or VO updates. If they'd just go back and complete the work they started on these champions, they'd feel brand new, just like they look. Sona is also in the same boat as the first batch, but I feel like her model still looks too dated to be considered updated. She's gonna need a VU to fully realize her as a modernized champ.
Quinn for sure needs a VGU. She has an awesome theme and concept (Demacian scout with a trained bird) that’s being wasted at the moment due to a poor execution in spite of its massive potential. Riot could do anything from an [Assassin’s Creed-style falconer like Bayek and Senu](https://goo.gl/images/ziFxYX), to a badass flying rider like the [Demacian Raptor Knights](http://i.imgur.com/Ainjq4G.jpg) and still end up with a champion that is highly aspirational and resonant. Not to mention Quinn has generally just been a balance and design headache since her release and is nowhere near the level of modern visual fidelity as new champions such as Taric or Akali. Sure, she’s not bottom of the barrel like old Nunu was but her age is showing nonetheless.
: Favorites: {{champion:39}} I mean, it's obvious. Her animations in general are just so fluid and wonderful to look at. {{champion:555}} I love the rogue-y feel to his run cycle and the transition into Ghostwater Dive is amazing. Least favorites: {{champion:44}} I mainly dislike how floaty he looks in his normal running animation and how his right arm is always sticking out. Looks really uncomfortable. {{champion:133}} FIX. HER. POSTURE. PLEASE. My back hurts just looking at her {{sticker:sg-janna}} {{champion:143}} Just kind of a boring run cycle in general. I know she doesn't have much to work with but I feel like it could be a little less stiff at least.
I was having a hard time thinking of who else besides Quinn suffers from a poor run animation until I read your post. Zyra is definitely one of those that had me scratching my head when I first saw it. It looks so terribly stiff and plain while not playing into her theme at all, at least from what I can see.
RiotLamz (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Quínn,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=xBX3bl5R,comment-id=0011,timestamp=2018-08-15T20:40:10.259+0000) > > Fix Quinn please! Although I guess the problem is more her idle stance... any chance that could fall under the scope of your project? Sorry probably not. Soon as you start changing Idle poses it can have a big knock on effect causing changes to several other animations thus increasing scope. We can get away with tweaking runs fairly easily though.
Since Quinn technically has two run animations -- one where she's on foot and another one during her ult -- is there any chance you guys could revisit her ult's run animation? I can't speak for every Quinn player out there, but [many seem to agree](https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/story-art/fVq9ikst-now-that-quinn-is-getting-looked-at-can-we-play-as-valor-again) her current ult visuals are a downgrade: she's supposed to be flying, but hardly hovers an inch above ground while Valor floats in a T-pose above her, and is overall just goofy and silly to look at with Valor growing exponentially in size in order to justify being able to lift her. If it's not _too_ out of the scope of your work, it would be cool to be able to simply fly as Valor again for the current ult, as he had much smoother animations and was generally more satisfying to look and play as. [Here's an example of what he looked like while flying!](https://youtu.be/zzAeP9tbyeI?t=1m26s)
: Since Quinn and Valor was reverted to Quinn because of technical problems can we have it back now?
Personally, I'd love to see Valor appended to the name again too, but I can also understand why Riot might want to hold off on it for now. Quinn and Valor haven't really felt like the tag-teaming duo they once were since their rework, and Riot probably understands that renaming them now won't solve those issues. Once they get their VGU though, I have faith their gameplay and thematic concerns will be addressed, and that their name will be changed back to Quinn & Valor like it should have been from the start.
: I like this idea but I think if they will go to with the raptor/griffin direction for quinn, valor will look like just sejuani's bristle and wouldn't deserve the 2 in one name. Which is sad. I agree with kayn and Rhaast though, kled seems like a secondary character unlike willump.
> I like this idea but I think if they will go to with the raptor/griffin direction for quinn, valor will look like just sejuani's bristle and wouldn't deserve the 2 in one name. Well, not necessarily :) While Demacian raptors may be voracious and aggressive (two of them are seen dueling in Lux's short story), they are also unique for the deep and loyal bonds they form with the rare riders who are able to tame them. Not just any common soldier can bond with a raptor--Quinn would be an exceptional case. This IMO is a perfect opportunity space for the champion, preserving if not emphasizing what makes their relationship special: trust and a symbiotic partnership. _"Most soldiers rely only on their weapons. Few truly rely on each other."_
: My Nunu Appreciation, love Killaburn
You were the first person I thought of when I saw Nunu & Willump’s new model leaked. So glad to hear you like them; after all your threads, polls, and general anticipation, it’s like coming to a storybook’s happy ending.
: Yea, I don't agree that lethality should be made melee only since {{champion:91}} and {{champion:238}} can both build {{item:3095}} along with {{item:3147}}. Essentially, the items people associate with the marksmen class can be used by the assassin/fighter (melee) class groups as well. Prohibiting marksmen characters from being allowed to build lethality would simply be unfair. Also, the lethality items like {{item:3147}} cannot be reset on {{champion:21}} and {{champion:133}} like it can be on {{champion:121}}, {{champion:107}} and {{champion:91}}, etc. Miss Fortune can burst once then that is end of it, unless she can get out view long enough to reset it. Instead, what should happen (instead of simply prohibiting ranged characters) should be that the passives and mechanics of Duskblade should be changed. Instead of allowing marksmen character the full 5 seconds to use the bonus burst damage, why not just nerf it down to like 2.5 seconds? Or just nerf the time in general, to like 2.5 seconds for all fighting styles. I mean, the item is suppose to help assassinate targets. Giving an assassin a 5 second window after being seen is ridiculous. They should either go in and use the damage or loose out on it.
{{champion:133}}'s nearsight can reset Duskblade if she uses it on an enemy to make them lose vision of her.
: give me birb mode.
This is exactly what I’d like to see out of her rework; Janna is able to transform into a bluebird in her lore so it would be cool to see this in game. Her lore also says she’s stronger the more people rally behind her and believe in her, maybe that could translate into her gameplay somehow too?
: [Lore Theory] Braum is the Freljord's Version of Janna.
> But what about Janna's Zephyr. Braum doens't have a fam- Zephyr was actually “retconned” (?) into an alternate form that Janna takes when she’s not in her humanoid form. Her lore mentions she’s often seen as a blue bird. The prospects of Braum transforming into a moustached poro, however...
: *Stubs toe* Fucking Ghostcrawler
I knew this game was going to shit when he buffed all fingers and nerfed our toesies.
NekroCreed (EUNE)
: The creator of the Incognium Runeterra, Zindelo. It would be exciting to see the interactions with other champions in-game e.g. Vel'Koz, and to see what Riot Games' standards would produce for his ability kit, lore and aesthetics.
: What is kayle going to look like after her rework?
I think there are ways of making highly-armored champions look lethal rather than beefy. A lot of it has to do with the champion's silhouette, model size and animations. Quinn is a champion that has several layers of armor, for example, but still looks the part of an ADC/assassin. Same goes for bulky skins like Warden Karma or Sivir which don't distract from the main role of the champion too much.
Tomeksz (EUNE)
: If they work so closely with the original writers/HQ why did they revealed champion gender? xd
I see what you’re saying, and you could be right, but I think I’ll give official Riot sources the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise.
: Can you point me to where they said that the new champ in the image is a mage? Everyone keeps saying that they said it was a mage, but I can't find it. All I find is, "Besides the colorful new mage currently in hiding, we have another new champion locked away, with no release date in sight…" which indicates the next champ being a mage and then talks about the following champ that we see in the image being discussed.
I’m hoping it’ll be Demacia’s first assassin champion. Sure, we have Quinn, but she’s more of a weird marksman/diver/assassin hybrid.
Tomeksz (EUNE)
: Where was it confirmed that this champion is gonna be female?
As BadPiriPiri mentioned, the Portuguese version of the Roadmap uses feminine pronouns to refer to the champion, which is no coincidence seeing as masculine pronouns are the default when someone’s gender is unknown. Keep in mind that Riot’s translators probably do work quite closely with the original writers/HQ to make sure what they’re translating is correct, otherwise they’d risk misinforming the rest of the community globally.
Rioter Comments
Show more

Valor Bot

Level 83 (NA)
Lifetime Upvotes
Create a Discussion