: Burst builds are becoming the norm, and it sucks.
None of what you've said makes sense. Shyv has no incentives to go tank or on-hit, that's why AP is better. Not because we want or need burst, but because every other build of Shyv is just that bad. Malphite is just because he's a cheeser and his tank build is only good when played with a Yasuo or against a very AD heavy team since he has no CC other than his R, meaning if he wiffs the R as a tank and the enemies aren't AD heavy, so he can't build armor to scale his E or W, he won't be doing damage, won't be providing CC, and will just be ignored or kited and killed easily. Vlad is still a tank-mage, he just doesn't build tank because with a DCap, you get almost 2x your AP as HP and heal for a ton. DCap and a Zhonya's, you'll have plenty of heals and can become invulnerable when ever they try to burst or finish you. AP is just better. No incentive for tankier builds. Garen is tanky damage. You go Trinity into full tank. At worse, you may go for a PD second. Given his original build was Cleaver into full tank and Cleaver is only 150 more health than a Trinity, the tankiness hasn't changed. Brand isn't a support because he just does a lot of damage. He's a support because he does better against 2 people and also roams very poorly and this is a roaming mid meta. It's also a roaming support meta, but Brand can force a support to stay by bullying the enemy ADC while his own ADC takes plates because of it. In Mid, his opponent can still roam since Brand is a bad turret taker by himself, but that's gone when he has an ADC who can do that. He has a lot of AoE and is a lane bully. He can spoon feed his carry while also building items that turn him into a control mage like a Rylai's which will turn his R into a perma slow on the entire enemy team. It's a very healthy place for him to be. Grasp also doesn't give offensive stats. It gives health. It does a little bit of your health as damage, heals you for that much, and gives you permanent HP, not offensive stats. Aftershock does damage so it still helps in a trade. Otherwise, it'd be useless outside of a team fight since anyone can wait for it to fall off before bursting. The damage makes the enemy want to try to escape rather than just wait it out, meaning if you can only do short trades with your opponent, it's best since they'll either take excess damage, or you auto-win the trade because they back off.
: > [{quoted}](name=TrikzterzArma,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=eLsmmnfU,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-11-19T04:03:27.153+0000) > > Senna isn't broken lmao. Just play someone with good engage and cc. Leona, Thresh, Alistar, Blitzcrank Thats... for literally any carry. You can't say a counter to a damage carry is CC because thats not champion specific. And its more difficult for her because her range is nearly Caitlyn's.
Not any carry. Any target who's immobile and squishy. You just engage on them, they die. Rinse and repeat. In bot lane, grab a Leona or Alistar. Every time you come into lane after 3, if they're not under the turret, dive her. It's the same method you do when going against a Sona or Zyra. Don't let them poke you down. Get to lane and immediately kill them, push under tower, go B. Come back, jump them, push, B. Kill, push, B. Kill, push, B. This has been how you deal with supports without insta-stuns for ages. Sonas and Zyras know the bane that is a Leona or Ali who can W+Q combo. If they're within range to AA you, they're within your engage range. Leona E range is 875, far exceeding even the highest of AA ranges. Ali's W is 650, which outranges Senna for 40 stacks of mists. They go to poke, you immediately engage. They die, you win. GG.
: > [{quoted}](name=The King Diamond,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MEVaxFMl,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2019-11-12T17:15:50.987+0000) > > Isnt it like... fkin overpowred? > So much permanent stats technically for free? > Or I don't understand something? Senna is mostly ad and will get ap if she wins. Thresh gets critchance and range which is useless (unless u go ad thresh)
Range is arguably one of the most useful stats and he also gains 40 AD. With his E at Red, his next AA does a total of 300% of his AD, 100% for the actual AA and 200% from the proc. That's 120 damage just on the initial AA with extra range to be able to do it. Crit chance isn't useful, but 120 damage is worth a lot more than 30 AP with the highest AP scaling being 40%, which is her R. 12 damage and 12 more shield. 25% on Q healing, so about 7 extra healing. Then 30 armor. Senna's natural armor is 87.5 max, which is about 47% reduction, with the 30 that's 117.5, which is 54% reduction. So 7% physical reduction, if they have no leth, LWhisper, Cleavers, any of the many armor reduction passives on champs... I'd say 120 damage is pretty fucking OP. The AP and Armor though is... arguably worthless.
Trias000 (EUNE)
: That's stupid. Thresh can barely use that 30% crit chance, whereas if Senna steals all of his souls, that's huge for her.
The crit is useless, but 50 range and 40 AD is a fuckton of damage. His E has a 200% AD ratio, so his AA will do 300% of his AD. 40 AD is 120 damage. She also doesn't get his souls. She just gets the AP and Armor. 30 AP. 30 Armor. 2 cloth armors and an amp tome, essentially. Thresh gets 50 range, which is huge, and a BF sword worth of AD.
: Seems to me they just need to buff the gold income of these items. Increase the amount of gold you get for a hit with spellthiefs and add an additional gold to the support alone for CS with relic. To explain what I mean about the cs with relic because that might be hard to understand. Support and nearby champion get 100% menion gold. PLUS support gets extra 12 gold. The problem being that coin is consistant easy gold you do nothing for. It should give the least payout. As the other two require risk to gain income. They really need to balance it to where spell thiefs gives MOST gold. Relic gives about 5-7% less and coin 2-4 % less than relic.
They removed the extra gold you get for using it, actually. Maybe 1 minion ever wave, which is 20ish gold every 30s despite having a 40s CD because you can manage the stacks properly to do so. After you upgrade it from shield, you can get 3 stacks at 1 per 30, which allows for better use of the item. It doesn't compete with Nomad's currently in gold gain, but the passive it gives alone, but being able to use it on Cannons, getting that incredibly useful shield passive, and providing sustain for your lane partner is all really impactful to the lane itself. It by itself has a trade-off for the less gold it gives. It's a huge ball of stats for tanky supports where-as the other two are severely lacking in stats to make up for them getting more gold. Well, not so much on Spellthief's right now, but definitely in comparison to Nomad's. Wouldn't say relic needs anything more than what it has. Tank items are cheap, the item itself provide a nice amount of shield that'll be amplified by the usually naturally high resistances of the user like Leo with her W up and Ali with his R. Also makes first item Gargoyle Stoneplate pretty damn strong since you'll have health from Sightstone and Relic together already.
Penns (EUW)
: the real use of spellthief line is to be built by mid laners accept your destiny hehe https://i.gyazo.com/6a6345ef28a135b206ee2c03e095dee5.png Not sure if you want coin on Zyra cuz no damage but in diamond+ it has higher win rate on her than spellthiefs lul
Well, logically, Spellthief's early doesn't provide much damage. 8 every 1.25s, which turns into 15 every 1.25s, max of 3. 24 and 45 damage isn't much. The 5 AP initially isn't all too great and the 20 AP from Frostfang also isn't amazing. Nomad's Medallion into your usual Rylai's and Liandry's would be fine. I'd say you lose out on a cheaper spike, but it's still about 1350 to go from Frostfang to Queen's, which is only 40 AP. For 2200, 60 AP is pretty crap. You can cut that down to only 850, use the other 1350 on actual AP items, plus you'll make more gold using Nomad's Medallion too. Can also choose Eye of the Oasis instead of Frostqueen's to open up a whole slot so your gold maker will be attached to your SS. You can get Eye of the Watch when getting Spellthief's, but 35 AP isn't really worth the loss of gold Oasis would give.
Rioter Comments
: Rhaast confirms Varus is a darkin
Can't wait to see Varus lore update to be honest. His bow is referred only as 'Darkin bow'. Likely it's Pallus, which is the Pit's name. Unknown if he's at the midpoint though. We won't really know if he's won against the corruption or in the middle of facing it still. His lore is still old and hasn't been revamped. I'd have to guess he's on the VU+Lore update line similarly to what they did to Trundle ages ago with Sejuani. Can't wait to see the Darkin lore. This isn't even mentioning we have 2 more to learn about.
: A channel on her Q doesn't work thematically and would affect the flow of her kit way too much. Not to mention the ACTUAL issue with Nidalee is the rate at which she can clear the jungle. All Riot needs to do is make her abilities a lower % effectiveness against Jungle camps. Even if this meant bringing back the Neutral Monster root on her Mark if she needed to kite the camps for her first clear or so. Right now you basically finish Runic Echoes and Rank 5 Q and you can start instagibbing jungle camps and not losing any mana.
Thematically, she's throwing a spear and will take the time to throw it properly with precision and force. If her clear speeds were the only reason for her being nerfed repeatedly, her Q would never have been nerfed ever since they affect very little how her clears go plus, any AP jungler right now that goes Runic can instagib entire games. Diana has been doing that since she was released and no one batted an eye at all. Shyv is the only one that's ever been nerfed for clearing too fast. Even Udyr never had his clear speeds nerfed until Runic came out and even then they nerfed his damage not because of his speeds but that huge amount of burst he did, lol. Nidalee has been in balance limbo for a while and is currently used for counter jungling only similarly to Nunu. Her team fighting is iffy unless she's ahead due to clunkiness which was added in because of her Q, which had nothing to do with her clear speeds.
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=Zair Umbras,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HAEZmOE5,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2016-04-29T04:18:11.942+0000) > > I feel like people aren't realizing the entire thing about Yi and Sated was the attack speed and the fact it made his true damage INSANE. He destroyed anything and there wasn't much the enemies could do but build health, which was then chunked by the BotRK he'd have after the sated. They decided to make it to where he instead gets 3% max health per hit as phys damage. > > Honestly, I've already tried him on the PBE and he does perfectly fine. In fact, tank killing is hilarious. Bloodrazor does quite a lot of damage and it's enhanced by armor pen, which also enhances BotRK. The only actual loss here is Rageblade which has been causing many issues with Irelia and Jax on top of Yi. Just get a decent build like Bloodrazor->BotRK->Ghostblade if enemies aren't building too much armor or you're able to get to their backline, or go with Lord Dominikk's so anyone who has health items gets to be murdered because you'll have 3 items that say 'HAHA, SCREW YOUR HEALTH ITEMS'. What you don't understand is that Double Strike and Phantom Hit was applied every 2nd attack which means 3ple onhit damage. I got the feeling is that your problem is that not that Yi is overpowered but Yi is going to kill me or my tanks which he suppose to do. He is skirmisher not pure assassin. Does not have burst like other assassins like Zed, Fizz, Talon but he got high sustain damage like Fiora, Vayne and any other skirmisher. THere are many times you can end up 0-5-n Yi top so attack speed ain't the issue here Crits > Flat Armor pen i never build flat armor penetration since backline has no armor but black Cleaver that gives me % Armor Reduction. You can build tons of dmg and still dominate backline just fine. You can stack as much as Attack Speed as you want vs Nasus or any Tank but if you don't have % ARmor pen cause he is going to have 300 armor at least he will delete you and flat armor pen vs that wont help you this is the items i would build on zed for instance {{champion:238}} {{item:3031}} {{item:3087}} {{item:3071}} {{item:3158}} if you do 2000 damage with all your spells and crits at the same time all that damage will be stacked on his ult which will make it about 1000 damage + 100% AD on ult itself as it multiplies both physical and magical damage at the same time making it over 3000 mixed damage PBE players are bad pretty much like normal cause things are to be tested there not to be competitive so don't judge champions and item strength based on PBE or Normal Games. I am pretty sure you can get 6 types of boots and dominate both PBE and NORMALS
It's only every 2nd hit AFTER you got off double strike once. Plus. Flat armor pen is best against the Backline who has no armor. A Cleaver by itself totals 25% of all armor and if the person has 100 armor, you're removing 25 armor. If it's a squishy backliner who only has about 50-70ish armor, a cleaver would only remove 12.5-17.5 armor, meaning a Ghostblade's 20 would be more substantial. Ghostblade is also an early pick up item anyways, typically a 2nd item after the new Bloodrazor so squishies will have maybe 50ish armor by the time you pick it up unless you're getting stomped. 50 armor, a Cleaver after 5 hits would reduce armor by 12.5, taking the 50 armor from about 1/3rd reduction to 37.5 armor with about 27%ish. The Ghostblade though bring it down to 30 armor which is 23% reduction, meaning you'd do more damage with the ghostblade, plus you'd get more AD off of it and a useful click on top of the fact that Ghostblade is much cheaper than a Cleaver. Cleaver is good for late game, but you could also just use Lord Dominikk's for around the same amount of damage increase to squishies and even more against tanks since the new Bloodrazor does Physical so it'd be increased by that 15% Dominikk gives you against tankier targets.
GreenLore (EUW)
: Well imagine they never gave Trundle a VU(or that his traditional skin would have been his new classic skin),then his traditional splash art would have been eventually replaced by a new one as well. In the end the traditional skins are based on the old appearances,but thats about it,they do not have to be exactly the same in every aspect.
It would be nice if it at least touched on how grotesque the skin is though, even the in game model shows actual muscles rather than just a simple rash.
TyRamos (NA)
: @Meddler So uhh any chance we can NOT Sejuani Master Yi?
I feel like people aren't realizing the entire thing about Yi and Sated was the attack speed and the fact it made his true damage INSANE. He destroyed anything and there wasn't much the enemies could do but build health, which was then chunked by the BotRK he'd have after the sated. They decided to make it to where he instead gets 3% max health per hit as phys damage. Honestly, I've already tried him on the PBE and he does perfectly fine. In fact, tank killing is hilarious. Bloodrazor does quite a lot of damage and it's enhanced by armor pen, which also enhances BotRK. The only actual loss here is Rageblade which has been causing many issues with Irelia and Jax on top of Yi. Just get a decent build like Bloodrazor->BotRK->Ghostblade if enemies aren't building too much armor or you're able to get to their backline, or go with Lord Dominikk's so anyone who has health items gets to be murdered because you'll have 3 items that say 'HAHA, SCREW YOUR HEALTH ITEMS'.
: Well, I think the Traditional Trundle Splash is representing what the Traditional Trundle skin looks like on his current model. The point of the splash update is for it to fit more to what you will see on the model. Lil Slugger and Junkyard had traditional trundles old model in it, so they looked nothing like the current Trundle. And while Traditional Trundle originally had a rash, the splash art did not showcase how the model currently looks in the skin.
Look at his current model though for Traditional. He has a lot more red blotches and all of those blotches shows actual muscle. New splash just shows like.. a rash on his leg and arm. Traditional Trundle also never just had a rash. He was a grotesque creature that was cursed to rot, but his regenerative properties kept that from killing him. Was a disgusting horror story of a bio and his old splash displayed how nasty it was, but the new splash barely touches on it with a rash on the leg, arm, and a tiny spot on the chest.
Rioter Comments
Krinu (NA)
: It's also *strongly* countered by armor. No more "oh look, I do roughly 50% magic and 50% physical damage and you can't itemize against me" bull. If you have a Bloodrazor / BotRK jungler that's only taking Guinsoo's for the fully stacked effect, you can just build armor and ruin their day.
Well, typically the magic damage was negated by base magic resist melees get and the physical is about the same. You just built armor and health for the BotRK they'd pick up and ignore the magic damage unless they went Nashor's over BotRK, then you got MR. Rageblade junglers with Devourer were never a problem due to hybrid, just the fact they could stack it so quickly and get so much damage so quickly with the cheap costs of Devourer and Rageblade, hence why they've died out since the nerfs to Devourer and the increase of cost of Rageblade.
: Veigar's old ult compared to new.
Considering Veigar's new passive giving him AP for tapping enemies with any ability, I'll be fine with the ult change. Not only do you get AP from Q farming and murdering things, BUT HITTING ENEMY CHAMPS TOO! That'll be fun with the mana items, which I've already tried out on the PBE and they are quite shiny.
: They took out most fun reason to play Veigar. Welp I wonder where this will go.
Mana issues are getting fixed and Veig is getting AP for touching enemies with his spells, 1 per enemy hit per spell. E+W+Q combo would give 3 AP. Since mana won't be much of an issue with Tear or RoA, I can see him just becoming a lane bully to get AP, which means each time he hits you, he gets stronger. That'll get scary.
: not true in the slightest.. it still has a 100% AP ratio, it still completely demolishes anything it hits. I've been one-shot with it while above half hp i thought executes were supposed to finish you off, not kill you for the 12th time after you just spawned
Doesn't mean he's not right, lol. He's incredibly right. The difference between the old ult to the new ult is pretty much what he's showing at base numbers. Obviously with Veig gaining AP for 'touching' enemies with his spells on top of the AP gained from Q farming he'll delete things with his R regardless of if they've got AP or not. Most will just miss the 1v1 mid lane potential. Thankfully, mana issues are being solved next patch, so he'll just farm his AP quick and easy off of smacking his enemies and it'll work out in the end, but still.
: A champion should NEVER be made more clunky/less satisfying to play (Regarding Viktor's PBE changes)
They're gutting him completely. 20% loss on the E, tons of base lost on the Q (That should've been removed AGES ago when people rushed Lichbane and one shot people), and his R lost some base. In return? His R does more damage overtime from 40% per 2s to 60% per 2, but the fact it does it per 2 rather than 10% per half-sec (All DoTs currently do half-sec to make them feel like they're doing consistent damage and reduce clunkiness) is a big shaft. When they reworked him, I knew he would eventually get gutted damage-wise, but I didn't think they'd gut him harder than they gutted Kassadin and Eve.
: i see the point, but remember that bork is only 6%
Er, yeah. 6%. Still 12% current. Tons of % health damage.
: Who else is loving the MYMU for finally killing sated rageblade Yi?
Rageblade is now doing what Devourer did but BETTER, the new Bloodrazor is doing 3% max health on top of the 6% current from BotRK. Add the new Rageblade and that's 6% max and 12% current every AA.
: You know how to fix urf?
Disabling Zed would be more than adequate.
: Just when i forgot why i hated URF
I can't have fun when I don't get to ban and my teammates won't ban Zed because they want to play him. FML. I wish Zed would be permabanned. If he's not banned, there's always one on each team and it ruins the fun for literally everyone.
Bârd (NA)
: What if Warlords bloodlust gave spellvamp
Near worthless. Very few champs get to 20% health and try to go back in, plus 10% vamp isn't very much as most notice when you try to vamp with only a Revolver. WotA at least ignores MR for it's 15% and Gunblade heals for 15% of everything, so... yeeaah. 10% is practically worthless.
: >{{champion:8}} {{champion:82}} Looks like Riot's answer is going to be a "No" for this one.
Morde can't abuse that at all. His Q is counted as 'AoE', so you only heal for a third of its damage and the lifesteal is only applied to the basic attacks damage, not the bonus from the Q... so since his E and W do negligible damage plus his R already heals you for the damage it does, you're not really gaining much on him. Vlad gaining 10% at 20% health wouldn't really be much either. His Q would heal him for 10% of the damage it deals and his E and R would heal for 3.33%. Not... really much. *Shrug* WotA works because it does 15% pre-resists and his E amiplifies that quite nicely.
: What's your favorite Lol pairing?
{{champion:121}}x{{champion:143}} Something about it just seems... right.
: So after Rammus and Malphite Nautilus has become one of the best top laners
He shouldn't be nerfed in my opinion. He's doing well because he's a tank with lots of CC plus a %HP self-bubble. Judging by how they keep buffing Randuin's and Sunfire, they're not looking to actually nerf the tanks, they're trying to buff them as a whole. It is likely Naut -might- be nerfed lightly in base damages, but I'm not thinking they will since ADC's need something to take them down and with a lot of games have 2+ ADCs per team, it's even less likely for Naut to be nerfed. He's best at taking out squishies and there's nothing squishier than an ADC (Not counting Graves who can be tanky as all hell). I'm looking forward to other tanks possibly getting buffed or even a new tank champ. A lot of champs who are bruisery or tanky are getting buffed on the PBE right now like J4, Renekton, Sej (The less clunkiness on the W AA reset is pretty nice), and even Vi has been buffed. Remember all the last seasons where Vi and J4 and even Sej were nerfed into the floor? Even Renekton had been hit a few times and now they're all being given back some power. Sej less so than the others with her only getting QoL buffs, but they're still useful. While I hate tank metas, I do also hate metas where everything snowballs. S3's Assassin meta sucked with 15 minute games, but S2's 60 minute games were also unbearable. With Bruisers being given love while ADC's aren't being destroyed with nerfs means they've set the playing field and are tuning the game around the ADCs to push ADCs back down, though I doubt we'll be seeing less of Corki and Jihn mid given their kits scale with levels as much as gold where as other ADCs scale more with just gold.
: Opinion time: Who's the easiest, and who's the hardest to play?
Honestly? I'd have to say {{champion:36}} and {{champion:1}} as the easiest. {{champion:157}} and {{champion:67}} as the hardest. This is more due to mechanics and me needing to work on my speed with using mechanics.
: Upcoming Talon Nerf
Lowers his snowball potential without really changing his late game. It's probably the lightest nerf we've seen in a very long time. lol.
: The fact that ADCs are so broken right now is just a buildup of the last few years
I feel like you're all just circle jerking... ADCs are not broken right now and have never been 'broken'. You're all stupid. ADC's have one role. That's to have sustained damage. This is so they can take out Tanks and Objectives. When you can show me a champ that can do this without blowing long CDs that isn't a Marksmen and can do it at a range, we'll talk. Until then, quit complaining. Marksmen do sustained damage at a range. The day that isn't required in a MOBA is the day they don't exist in that MOBA.
: How did you guys see the changes to iceborn etc affecting ezreal? Do you think blue will still be his best build? And if not do you think he has any relevance as an adc with a more standard build (like trinity e reaver)? And also who did you see getting the most use out of the new warlords bloodlust? Do you expect it to be popular on short range marksmen like lucian or sivir, or most popular in light fighters? Etc
Blue will be Ez's best build until they fix Trinity Force or make Essence Reaver more appealing to him. Trinity lost a lot of good stats for Ezreal and Essence Reaver got nerfed so it doesn't give the full 30% CDR with a Trinity to max at 40% CDR. Between that and the fact that Crit on Ezreal feeling horribly wrong when he's always been the Caster Marksman and puts more of his power into his Q, there's really no reason to go any other build than Blue.
: Should just nerf Iceborn on ranged champions, make it have a reduced effect when used by them. I don't think Ezreal is strong enough and toxic enough to be called a cancer yet, but he is certainly annoying.
They really should just nerf it on range since their reasoning, according to the patch, is that applying it at a 'Range' is too good. Dunno why they didn't just nerf it for ranged then.
Cherysse (NA)
: Ok I will make a thread in gameplay to show you. But you should check it within the 6.0 patch.
Just checked from 5.24 (Which is patch 6.0, pre-season) up to the most recent patch. None of them showed GP being changed with his barrels being nerfed to bonus armor.
Cherysse (NA)
: Man! Did you even see the last patches? they even increased the % armor pen of GP barrels because of this, it only works with bonus armor :S I know it doesn't even say that in the masteries (and they should include it because it is misleading) but that is how it works, Im not trying to call you a fool.
Wiki must be failing then since it's neglecting the change. But the Mastery states % Armor Penetration, not Bonus Armor Penetration. Unless it states Bonus, it's of ALL armor, not of just bonus.
Cherysse (NA)
: It is bonus armor penetration, they reworked the way % armor pen works, you can even check it when you take the mastery in the champion stats CC, it says X flat Pen/ 7% armor pen.
No, they reworked how LAST WHISPER worked, not how % armor pen works. They changed ONE item, and it's new build paths. They did NOT change the Mastery. The mastery very clearly stats 'Armor penetration', not 'Bonus Armor Penetration'. Like Darius's E gives Armor Penetration. He ignores 25% of ALL armor, not just bonus. Gangplank's Barrels ignore 40% of ALL armor, though Riot has thought about changing that to 'Bonus' instead and did do that change on the PBE, though never went through with it for the live servers.
Rioter Comments
Cherysse (NA)
: It is a lot less since it only includes bonus armor, it doesn't penetrate bonus armor, so that you are sacrificing 5 points fora mastery that will only serve against tanks.
Nah. The Mastery isn't 'Bonus'. The Mastery is a full 7% and ignores the base armor of the enemy, which means it works against squishies and tanks, though even then it's still technically stronger against tanks since squishies max around 80 base armor and 7% of that is only 5.6 armor. The other tree gives 3+.3 per level, which surpasses that 5.6 around level 9 where it totals 5.7, which is funny because the 80 base armor is when that squishy is at level 18. Technically, the 7% is still stronger than last season, but much weaker than the ArP+MPen in the other tree, it just ends up being if you use Fervor, Deathfire, or Warlord's better than Thunderlord's, which some AS based or crit based champs (Though it's being changed to just low health LS instead in a day or two) use better than Thunderlord's. Corki with Deathfire is also a lot of extra poke added into his R, though Thunderlord's gives him a stronger burst combo in lane, so that ends up being if you need poke or all-in.
: so why have bork proc off his w? i just want consistency
Because BotRK doesn't have an internal CD in place to prevent 100-0'ing entire teams. lol.
: "Renekton's W procs on-hit effects"
Renekton's W does 3 procs at once. To prevent Shyvana from one shotting entire teams with her dragon's Q, there's a .001ish CD on Hydra to prevent multiple procs off of one AA. WW does 5 attacks over 2s, so of course each of his hits will proc the Hydra's AoE, though in all honesty, it's not really a problem given it doesn't affect his 1v1 and doesn't make his team fighting ability broken, similarly to WW and Shyvana. Ain't a problem, really. Just helps prevent super abuse cases.
Arie (NA)
: What role do you main?
I main Explosions. By that I mean exploding my enemies. Nothing finer than watching some one's health bar simply explode.
Shiznyte (NA)
: Just so you know the bonus damage isnt critting the AA is criting and the bonus damage stays the same.
Um... Did you not read what I said at all..? 'Oh the days before they made almost every AA-reset's _**bonus damage**_ uncrittable.' I fully understand the bonus damage isn't critting, but once upon a time, it actually used to.
: Ezreal, corki, graves.. the holy trinity, honestly I am glad I don't have to see ezreal in every match anymore.
Considering his play rate has gone up despite his win rate taking a dive into the trash can.... lol.
Rioter Comments
Kuroi86 (NA)
: Is his laning so bad that he needs to be pushed into the support role? Personally I would consider moving some of his base damage to his scaling damages, that would nerf his early game while allowing him to scale still. You could also put a static cooldown on his passive towards any champ that he has recently used his W on.
His early game sucks to be completely honest and removing his base damage and adding scaling means he'd be the support that just noms his carry and walks away while if he gets ahead while at bot, he'll become a nightmare due to higher scaling, so items would be scary. He was meant to be a support to begin with anyways, hence why his recommended items are support items, but they wanted him to be able to go Top or jungle -decently-. Thing is, you can't balance a champion outside of their primary role. It would be like nerfing Talon's Q and buffing his W so he'd be less assassin-y and more mage-y... Just like how they wanted Ahri to be less Assassin-ish and more Mage-ish, so they removed the damage buff on her E and gave her the MS on her Q, solidifyng her in more of a kite-based mage rather than an Assassin. Tahm currently is being balanced so he's good in top and good at support, but the problem with that is if he loses damage, his abysmal pre-6 becomes that much worse and kills his laning, but if you buff that damage, he's now a super oppressive support (His Q is already a death sentence with how easy it is to land and the fact it slows for such a HUGE amount). You can't focus on two very different roles for one champion. If you give them two focuses, their power will have to be split and they'll either be worthless because they're not too great at either or they'll be too strong in one that the other won't even be acknowledged. We can look at Zyra for that. Her mid lane got destroyed because her support was too strong. When they attempted to try to balance both lanes later on for mid/supports, they nerfed Annie's bases and buffed her ratios, which has made mid Annie annoyingly oppressive. Heck, Lulu right now is being played everywhere but support too because they don't want know how to buff her support without buffing her laning presence or nerf her laning without nerfing her support. Champs with more than one focus will end up having issues simply because it's impossible to balance two very different roles. A champ should have their uniqueness and be distinct in that. Where people take it should not be the focus. Riot needs to quit doing this "We want them to go here and here" and start just focusing on making the champion itself do well in one specific area. If Tahm is a support, he needs to be balanced at being a support and if he's to be a tanky, damage soaking top with good CC, he needs to be that. He can't have both.
: how about increasing flat/scaleing cdr runes to 10%/20%, or atleast reintroduceing a low tier 5% cdr masterie? It might also be a good idea to give {{item:3152}} 20% cdr, alongside with preemptive nerfs for that abusive fucker{{champion:8}}
With blues and one quint, you can have 10% flat CDR. 15% with 2 quints. Isn't all that bad though for runes. Needs more items than runes though.
Kuroi86 (NA)
: Fair enough. This raises a question though, what to do. Obviously Tahm isn't meant to only be a support so you can't just outright nerf him. But where do you rebalance him? Do you aim for stronger early game, or weaken it to let him scale harder towards the late game?
Well, mechanically he'll always be good as a support and his CC is what keeps that, so he'd need his 1v1 toned down. That could be done via his W's base being nerfed by a few % or his E to give less than the full amount of grey health and reduce the decay amount. His team fight would be the same, but his laning presence wouldn't be so oppressive against anyone who isn't ranged with a dash and boots.
Kuroi86 (NA)
: I'm looking at his kit and can't really see anything that bad. He has one big nuke on a large cool down and otherwise he's all on hit damage with no way to really build to maximize it.
Sometimes, you don't look at the damage to see if a champ is strong or not, you look at how well they do their job. Like Alistar was a jungler for a while there and demolishing things despite poor clears, so they reduced his clear speed even more to prevent him from jungling anymore because he was -too- good at it. Shyv used to be too strong in the top lane, so they nerfed her laning. Lulu was too powerful mid and top, so it got nerfed. Annie was too powerful as a support, so it got nerfed while buffing mid Annie.... They nerf the aspects that make them strong outside of what they should be good at Tahm didn't get any nerfs ever really. They thought he was too poor in his top and jungle roles, so they buffed it without thinking about how powerful his support role was, so his support AND top AND jungle roles were all buffed despite his support role already being really strong with how he could absorb tons of damage, save his carry for SIX seconds while being able to CC a champion for 3s (Morg is the only other champ in the game who can match that kind of CC power in a single ability and total stun length Leona can do is only 2.75s with Q+R, snare gives .5ish seconds based on distance traveled). He's got a 70% slow on his Q and 1.5s stun on his Q, which is on a 6s CD with lowish mana cost... Plus all of his abilities also scale off 4-8% of his bonus health (That's 4-8 per 100 bonus health on every Q, W, and AA. Most health items have 500 health, so that's 20-40 per TANK item) after level 6. He's overbearing damage-wise and his tankiness is ungodly. His only weakness is the same as a juggernaut, yet he does the job almost as good while also being capable of providing peel and a 6s Zhonya's for any of his allies on a 10s CD (6s with full CDR, which is common on Tahm). His -only- weakness is the fact he's kitable, but that's where his peeling capabilities come into play. If he's underfed or shut down or what have you, he still has the ability to act as a peeler while if he's ahead, he can peel AND do tons of damage, applying a lot pressure on his opponents who can't really retaliate. He's got too much utility for how tanky he is and how much damage he can output.
: If you pick Jax into Illaoi, you're gonna get fucked up.
Illaoi is one of the most balanced they've released so far. Her E mechanically is just a bit... over the top in my opinion. Mechanically, not numbers.
: this is not even a nerf. you still get 30% cdr with just essence reaver and shiv. this will literally make 0 difference. this item shouldnt even exist. it compeltely removes the choice for carries to go down a caster route {{champion:110}} , or to go down a classic auto attack focused build. they just get to have both with 1 item. literally the only thing people asked for for the old essence reaver was a better build path. i can still see all those threads just asking to build the item out of {{item:3114}} in the build path. they shouldnt have made it a) into a marksman specific item, as there are other mana dependent ad casters in this game who should have been considered. b) not make it completely broken by allowing marksmen to have 30% cdr with this and 1 crit item. especially when theyre going nuts and throw crit around lik candy on halloween. reaching 100% crit chance on a marksman isnt even a feat anymore. it just happens by building the same items as they used to anyways. marksmen are a class that have been deliberately cut out of cdr as a stat due to how strong they already scale with crit and as as multipliers. right now they have better cdr itemization than mages and ad casters.
Trust me, I know. I play Ez a ton and the change to essence made me cringe to begin with, but trying to make due with it... and now it's being nerfed against the ones it was meant for while catering to Lucian and Graves. Guess the mana starved AD casters won't ever get a break. Hell, when I made a post about it before the PreSeason changes hit about Essence Reaver's change, people said it was going to be OP on AD casters because blah blah blah and here we are cringing still at it.
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Zair Umbras

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