: > Wukong(maybe a little if you ask me but your the balance guy) what do u mean by a little ?
> [{quoted}](name=Ryuumoku no koke,realm=EUW,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=yOe5FROl,comment-id=0004000000070000,timestamp=2017-03-23T20:27:43.188+0000) > > what do u mean by a little ? While, he is still stat a bit of a stat checker, it's really only a little in comparison to other such as Aatrox, Jax, Irelia and Xin Zhao, atleast he has moves other than auto attack resets and buffs so really he just needs a couple tweaks here and there to some abilities to make him more like the more recent diver's.
Meddler (NA)
: We haven't made a firm commitment to who we'll be looking at post tanks yet. Divers are certainly a very strong candidate though. If doing divers I think there are quite a few who'd benefit more from the work than Lee Sin (Aatrox and Wukong being top of my mind, Xin Zhao, Panth and others having good arguments for them too).
Aatrox, Wukong(maybe a little if you ask me but your the balance guy), Xin zhao, Jax, Pantehon and Irelia are the top ones if you ask me. Irelia, Jax, Pantheon and Xin Zhao i feel could have more to their archetype, wukong and aatrox could have more to their gameplay.
Meddler (NA)
: Bard - Too weak early game in particular. Testing some stuff, likely to iterate on what's currently on PBE. Kass - Should be stronger than he is mid/late (weak laning phase is deliberate, payoff's not quite there). Kat - Looking at giving opponents more opportunities against her early/mid game, possibly with a shift of damage towards her ult late game (has better counterplay than some other spells by then). Likely to try other directions as well as what's currently on PBE.
I mean as a katarina main, it always did feel weird that she was good early and scaled well late, not amazing late but well(cause she's an assassins and assassins fall off) but uhh, maybe also lower her damage early on her passive(since it does the most) but make it greater than live in late game. Currently we don't really have a good late game assassin and i think katarina could fit that perfectly. All an assassin really needs to be able to do is survive early and farm, not stomp early, mid game is where they usually shine. Katarina's base health and regen is really high so that already helps a lot, so maybe that massive passive damage is a bit too much to have early and could be tuned more towards past 30 minute mark.
: > [{quoted}](name=Zerenza,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=adEEUEyg,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2017-03-23T19:19:09.538+0000) > > First, utility support and tank are two different things. Karma already builds tanky anyway, second, I didn't remove her mantra, I put on her passive instead. Third, this concept was tied to fleshing out her consenpt because she doesn't fit her own concept well enough and cod be expanded upon. no you removed her mantra, simple as that. Second karma builds tanky anyway? sorry but what? she builds what every single support builds nowadays or are you going to tell me that Sona is a tank as well? or Soraka? or Janna? or Nami? You did nothing but REMOVE her mantra and give her a dumb ability that fits a TANK and not a mage support. Tanks are the champions who want to take damage from others that's their job. I guess if some random champion decides to build tanky that means we should just randomly put a TANK skill on them i mean they build tanky right?
You seem to have a very deep emotional attatchment to mantra, it wasn't removed but feel free to voice your opinions somewhere else. They other's are constructive, your complaining.
: why are you trying to make Karma into a sort of tank? is this supposed to be a joke thread? really? you are complaining because a tank karma that deals no damage whatsoever is rooting you... which she cannot even do all that often yet you say it like she does it so easily... sorry but there is nobody but yourself to blame is a Karma is root chaining you as easily as you say she does. Mantra is a core mechanic of her and what makes her be her. You do not get to simply get rid of it and in it's place add something that belongs to a tank of all things. She is a mage support. Not a tank
First, utility support and tank are two different things. Karma already builds tanky anyway, second, I didn't remove her mantra, I put on her passive instead. Third, this concept was tied to fleshing out her consenpt because she doesn't fit her own concept well enough and cod be expanded upon.
Rioter Comments
: If Riot wants to make Lux a better champion in terms of support they should make her shield a bit more reliable or larger. They are going in the wrong direction again. If anything her ult is something that needs nerfs.
Exactly, she's SUPPOSED to be a light mage, but all of her abilties are the basis for every mage that came after her soooooo she basically just looks like an ordinary mage, cause she is despite the fact her ability is to control light Lux: I demacian, i deal big damage, i give weak sheild sometimes that if buffed makes me OP, rito please give me 20 second ultimate. BTW the last time they buffed her shield she was pick or ban, no more number's changes to lux, she's fine in terms of number's. It's her lack of ability to be distinguished from any other mage(cause she was the basis for all of them) that makes her bad, other mages have things that add on to their damage or CC it's not just one, the other or both.
Rioter Comments
: Ah. Is the scaling weaker, then? Because, I kid you not, I have never seen a Katarina with more health than me, come team-phase, no matter who I am (obvious exceptions apply).
Yeah, it doesn't scale as well and she doesn't buy health so of course she won't be 20 minutes into the game but for the first 10 minutes or so she has more effective tankiness and can snowball off of top laner's easily. She has high HP cause she's a mid lane assassin and needed it to deal with the ranged champions. (a good thing to do for a kat main is to take her top against teemo or quinn)
Atanchan (NA)
: Renekton's health and armor catch up by 6 and 7, respectively, meaning he ultimately has more base tankiness for most of the game, but that curve makes sense: Renekton has sustain, like you mentioned, _and_ doesn't have to deal with his main lane being against ranged while he's melee. Kat does.
Yeah, but i have taken her top just to get 3 free kills before 6-7, other tanks also don't have the damage to back it up like renekton does so they die much easier until their first tank item.
: Support player here~ {{champion:89}} {{champion:111}} Player. When i engage, i REALLY engage.
The hero we need but don't always deserve, this support.
Unvictus (NA)
: You mean the healing that is 1/3 effective cause she does all AOE damage lol. I get what you're saying tho, bronze and silver probably don't have the reaction time to cc her while channeling her ult. Even then I don't think the healing amounts to that much.
It only really helps in 1v1s your Q is counted as single target i believe? And you max it so you heal about 100 per Q hit then her AOE is ridiculous so you'll still heal a shit ton, if your opponents spells are all on cooldown it's safe to just press R and out sustain them. In a teamfight, if all their spells are on cooldown(and you've been tracking spell rotations like a good katarina) you can drain tank a hole team with just one reset.
Unvictus (NA)
: I wouldn't say it's just with kat. Soloq often leaves people with the mentality that they have to be the one who carries the game, which ends up leaving team comps with no tank or reliable front line. People are too tunneled on carrying that they fail to really strategize and observe during champ select and say "my team doesn't have a frontline" maybe I should pick a tank. Now I understand that people have their comfort picks, and skill and experience on a champ weigh in heavily, but there comes a point where you have to figure out where to draw the line. When you need to decide "hmm picking another squishy into that team might not be the best idea".
That's why my champion pool consists of 4 champions, i'm comfortable with them and while two of them such as Illaoi and Katarina have 0 CC and bring only damage the other two Yorick and Ekko have a lot of teamifght potential along with the carry potential they bring so it helps.
: See I am okay with this logic until I get a full team of useless carries with no cc lol
See i only adjust my pick when i'm top, if i'm mid fuck that a team usually has two carries, or should but ya know, meta. And your midlaner is usually your second carry, its the easiest place to get fed from, but if you don't help them get fed like you do your ADC they won't get fed and might fall behind.
: Katarina has a lot of base health? I've always seen her as having less health than _everyone_ on my team who's names aren't Kindred or Nidalee.
Katarina's base health is 590, which is 70 HP over renekton, illaoi and even darius, she's technically tankier than almost any other top laner, she just lacks the sustain, i'v tested her top myself and until they get a tank item she'll win everytime.
: I agree with everything but the squishier than an ADC part, ADCs are usually squishier, just check the stats. Good post though, Kat cant engage because of her lower health. Its like Illaoi, her ult CAN engage, but usually shell just get killed before she can land one R>W.
Yup, i play mostly AOE teamfighter's, infact illaoi is my top lane main, so i'm used to the situation but i'v been having a really hard time with Katarina recently because of the lack of an engage tank. Katarina has a lot of base health(more than most top laners) and resistances but she still dies easily because it's literally just like telling your jinx to go and 1v5 in the middle of the team, Katarina i supposed to be in the middle of a team but she's also supposed to have people there to tank for her. If she doesn't than she's basically a more useless ADC cause all she brings is damage.
Hige (NA)
: Usually if the jungler has no CC of his own you need to play the bait game, remember that his positioning forces him to walk longer than you When a jungler pings you to go in it's because the enemy laner is overextended but the time it takes for him to fall back is pretty short still, so you need to at least bait him, jump on him, you won't explode in a million pieces, he'll stay out of position long enough for your jungler to gank.
The main jungler i have trouble being camped by is warwick, the surpression makes katarina's die.
Rioter Comments
ZyniX (NA)
: Teemo?
Ehhhh i wouldn't say teemo is meant to "Purposely" aggrivate you but we kind of need his type of counterplay even if it's annoying, there aren't really any champions in the game that hard counter things like Jax, Irelia, Yasuo, Tryndamere, Xin Zhao, ect basically they made him because Auto Attack oriented fighter's don't really have that much counterplay available against them and creating a champion that specifically counter's that was a good move, even if he's annoying as fuck sometimes. It should be noted i never have any issues with him but my champion pool doesn't have an AA reliant fighter.
: ADCs Are Still Getting Crapped on By Tanks
ADC's shouldn't walk into melee range, especially with caitlynn, like do you know what kiting is? Kiting is what makes ADC's broken as fuck in this game, their the hardest to balance class and the only class with another class the specifically designed to murder them because of this fact. You done fucked up boy, all that happened was you walked into melee range of someone who built damage. Not to mention the crucial fact for 4 seconds of that you could have been auto attacking, he did barely any damage to you compared to what you did to him, you definitely should have won that.
: most mages reach tank health with only one hp /ap item
What fucked up world did you spawn from? I have never had a mage, that wasn't supposed to be a tank, out tank me me on my juggernauts. They usually have around 2k health or lower, sometimes a little higher but by no means is that tank status.
: You know what is funny about that yugioh card. That Card is actually really good. Therefore it would be so op to have in league of legends.
It is actually pretty good, i'm a fan of the archetype he created it for as well and the artwork is magnificent lol
Rioter Comments
: i think they want to call damage resistance with super bad scaleing and a super delayed taunt that you cant do anything while chargeing to a useable range and you get slowed while useing it anti mage. 2 points in annie e and she beats your taunt damage resistance at all levels.
Resistances are only useful if you have the health to back it up, annie who doesn't build full tank won't get use out of her E at all. Sometimes it might help survive with like 100 health but in most cases it won't save her, that's why annie mains above bronze don't even get a point into it until 5, it's just not worth it. {{item:3029}} {{item:3001}} {{item:3152}} {{item:3111}} {{item:3065}} {{item:3143}} I'd go something like this on galio, which isn't far from what you got anyway before. Health, resistances, damage, he builds just like rumble or gragas does and that's fine. He still does his job because any sensible galio player would know to use your dashes knock up to get in range and charge your taunt to force a mage to not be able to do anything.
: I'll keep an eye out to record it post-fix release, then. If you ever find yourself testing for it internally, Syndra gets stuck to terrain the most for some reason.
It's cause her thigh game makes her get stuck a lot on things.
: just go 1v5 vs bots to drill in a custom, their movements are more accurate then zigzagging ____________________________ [Poll: What was the best season in League of Legends?](http://stepbystepguides.org/what-was-the-best-season-in-league-of-legends/)
Not to mention the highest difficulty pantheon bot, jax bot and lee sin bot are pretty good at dodging and Lee and Jax can actually both flash pre-emtively and ward jump.
Doozku (NA)
: When you die or back, it's normal for a jungler to go into your land to farm the minions while your gone, so at least someone gets them. But if they die then yes they are bad.
In bronze they don't go into your lane to farm, they do it to get the kill, cause their dumb and think they can, the only time i'm okay with it is when it's Hecarim or Lee Sin, cause they have the damage to back themselves up if the enemy is low.
: Understandable, this simply means the jungler is not playing well. I don't expect a laner to win their lane. I do expect them to try, which is all I expect of my jungler when they jungle, to try. That is all I ask of anybody. But getting upset when you are being camped and your jungler does nothing elsewhere on the map is understandable, it is literally the same complaint I have in the OP.
That's like 90% percent of the reason i get mad at jungler's, the other 10% is cause they come into my lane after i had to back early(i play alot of assassins, you get used to being pushed out of lane sometimes really early) and they come to my lane while i'm gone then die. Like first why are you 25% health ganking a lane with NO ONE INSIDE IT!? Why are you only level 2 but the enemy jungler almost killed me and is level 3? Why did you think it was a good idea to gank a level 5 full health annie when your level 2? Idk, i'm not a jungler but 10% of the time, it happens XD I'v also grown accustomed to not getting ganks, i don't play champions that need ganks often, i don't need a gank to kill someone with Katarina or Ekko in mid lane and i'd prefer to create preasure and force the enemy jungler to gank me with Illaoi and Yorick in top lane.
Meddler (NA)
: Buffs, not sure beyond that yet. We've literally just started getting feedback on how he's doing this afternoon so we're still building out an understanding beyond 'looks like he's weak enough we should do something quickly'.
Uhm as a person who enjoy's Aatrox a lot, i'd say maybe just change the duration of his bloodwell passive(when it gives him extra AD and AS) and also change the duration of his ultimate to last longer or make so that while in his ultimate state his bloodwell increases faster than normal, that way he get's it more than just once a fight.
Rioter Comments
Raoul (EUW)
: Ok, I understand galio needed a rework....
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/featured/champion-galio-the-colossus Galio was one of the oldest champions in league, he didn't really have much uniqueness aside from being in almost every demacian's story. But the thing is he didn't really even fit the archetype of a real Gargoyle either. A Gargoyle is a statue meant to protect a place, in galio's lore not only did he fail at this but they didn't need him. In his new lore he awakens in their time of need(A reference to his new ultimate) and fits the bill for a gargoyle but instead of being a generic one he's a heroic one which also coincides with being a demacian made statue. I personally love his rework, and like Warwick and Yorick before him, feel that it will be very successful, they also didn't remove his stacking magic resist and having AP damage sooooo he just got a new kit and new look. Same with every rework buddy.
Reav3 (NA)
: Urgot is going to be so bad ass :) Don't get me started on Eve
Evelynn is the one i'm most hyped for, she's got so much archetypal potential so by all means i'll get you started on eve XD
: @Riot: can you ask commentator stop saying ocean and cloud drakes are useless?
I think its mostly priority, for example, if you securing an Ocean Drake as your 3rd drake while the enemy team is getting a tower thats a no go. Ocean drake is less useful the longer the game goes on(for most champions) so a trade like that would mean a commentator says "Why, that's pointless." Cloud drake i do think is more useful in Pro play because extra movement speed is amazing but again if your team is losing a tower for such a low amount of movement speed it's not worth it because you lose map pressure anyway. Cloud Drake: If you losing map pressure for a dragon that's supposed to help you apply more, that's a no go. Ocean Drake: If your losing anything for a drake that's only really useful in the first 20 minutes, it's a no go. Earth and Fire dragon are always useful though, you can never go wrong with more damage. In my opinion, Ocean and Cloud should spawn more frequently early, as in have a higher chance so instead of a random chance you have a higher chance of Ocean or Cloud in early but lower chance late game. That way their usefulness can be fully expressed even in Pro play.
: The burst mentality
IT depends on the situation, if you know you can burst someone for example, say your fed with vayne or it's late game(same thing honestly) then your probably going to Q into them to initiate and get in range instead of finish them off. If your not fed and you pretty much playing like a normal ADC should, then AA+AA+Q is better because if they run away you can dash towards them, reposition for your E, if they keep chasing you, dash away and also the surprise burst factor due to so many procs at once. Not to mention two auto attacks+the MAJOR empowered auto you'll get from tumble+third passive proc and thunderlords makes for bursting someone easy, especially if their bellow 75%. In 1v1 senario's or laning i'd use AA+AA+Q but in teamfights i imagine i'll be using Q+AA+AA or a combination of both more. Not to mention if you use your tumble for the last proc and to reposition yourself and land an E as well, you get another free proc soon after because they'll be stunned for at least 2 auto's. In fact most of the time when i see "CRAZY VAYNE OUTPLAYS" it's the same pattern, someones chasing me? Oh, well Kite+Kite+Q+E+AA+AA+Q dead, and that will usually repeat for every outplay.
: because it doesn't come very often and riot doesn't want to spend resources on it. (at least not right now) the only times they addressed urf champs is if they're so bad they're unplayable, or just flat-out broke the game in half. i'd like them to just address unnecessarily troll things too, like Shaco and how riot removed counterplay to him.
I believe Kassadin once broke original URF mode, his ultimate probably scaled normally but it didn't matter because it was urf.
Seiji34 (NA)
: Thoughts on Control-style marksmen?
I imagine that they would end up as a Mid-Lane marksmen, we have a couple such as Corki and Varus(they are both better mid but lethality made them good bot lane again recently) but i'm fine with that to be honest. AD Mages don't really exist in league of legends because of how our AD works and it would be kind of cool, but with all "Control" champions they would have to be completely balanced around it and would need to have a few bad parts. Marksmen for example, the traditional ones, scale hard into late, Control champions can't. Control champions have a tendency to dominate lane because they can control lane better and that means their meant to win lane/win mid game and end the game there. If you had a Control Marksman that would break the game, but an AD Control Mage would not because they would scale like a mage not a marksman. A psuedo control mage is actually Illaoi, she's an AD caster and is a control Juggernaut, she has very clear area's where she's strong along with area's that she's weak in so we'll use her as a good example of what an AD Caster/ Control Mage should and shouldn't have. In addition, i'd imagine setting up marks to be her Q, and you'd have to press Q to cause your next basic attack to set a mark, it wouldn't have a high cooldown but this way it's balanced and allows her to still attack move relatively well. I'd imagine it to have no cost either so something like this. Q: Mark Cooldown: 4 Seconds at all ranks. Forcing her to build like an AD Caster not a Marksmen for CDR this will also prevent her from abusing Runaan's Hurricane and other marksmen items because it would make her broken. Tinia's next basic attack will instead target an area around her cursor and cause her to throw a sword at the location(an AD Caster that actually uses the swords she buys), dealing physical damage in the circle and creating a mark. Marks last indefinitely but are consumed by most of her abilities(this is to allow her to have more overall damage and utility in her kit like a mage, if they last forever and didn't have a way to die on their own then she'd have to be balanced like Illaoi) This way there is a clear window of power for her, a clear area of control and a clear indicator for where you can go. I don't know what her passive would be but it would probably rotate through marks, causing her to manage her marks properly in order to control properly as well and give her the ability to re position her marks and make area's where she is strong to bait enemies in. (Ganking her would, in similar fashion to Illaoi and Heimerdinger be a not good idea due to her set up.) For her ultimate(also no hops, no no no) she would probably make a mark become extremely large then be allowed to move it with say her W or E, and it would last a certain amount of time and deal signifigantly more damage than her normal marks would when using them with Q/W/E.
: http://champion.gg/champion/Yorick So... yorick is decently strong. You mention some parts of his kit that I could see being annoying, but if they buff him, he'll need nerfs somewhere else to keep him balanced. As for the pro scene, Meddler stated that Yorick is a niche champ, and they don't evaluate success of a design by play percentage. He never has to see ranked play to be a good champ. He doing quite well in the hands of people who play him often. Just because his minions and ult work a little differently than other champs doesn't really mean much, does it? I mean, I'm up for discussing me being wrong here. But the stats and statements from Riot don't really corroborate your argument, imo.
I have an 80% winrate with yorick in ranked, but really the reason why is cause i'm bronze. I know what do to against yorick when i fight him myself cause i play him, same with my other top main Illaoi, other people don't know what to do, but i do, cause it's bronze. What OP suggests are all simply QOL changes, the cooldown change would be really REALLY nice because currently with no CDR its 2 minutes 40 seconds and that' AFTER your maiden dies. If you bought any CDR in between that time, it also doesn't carry over. So for a good 2 minutes your left with only about 60% of your kit's strength. Not to mention, she isn't controllable, you cannot control her except by using your E on an ENEMY nearby(doesn't count for camps). Which means 40% of your strength is left to a non-controllable, relatively smart AI. If they either lowered the cooldown or made it so it starts when she's summoned, that would make it a lot better becuase then yorick would have 100% of his power available to him more often like every other champion in the game. Any smart player will simply Auto yoricks minions and there goes another 15% of his power. For every other minion mancer in the game, auto don't one shot them, but for yorick they do, and Heimer's turrets, Zyra plants, Malz minion all do MUCH more damage than his minions do so i really don't see why they have to die so easily. Edit: I don't want any major buffs because i like yoricks state right now but QOL buffs would be nice.
: No lore expert, but am pretty sure Illaoi would religiously hate Yorick. He willingly ceased to be in motion and join the undead. She sees the undead as outside of the natural order of things, and I am pretty sure she would lump Yorick in with Thresh and co. as the bad guys.
Yorick didn't do it willingly, he drank from a fountain right before the Ruination and it saved a shard of his humanity. He now lives his life in a state of Half-Death, he's actually not undead, yet. He then pulled a mordekaiser and basically enslaved some souls for the sole purpose of destroying the Shadow Isles and the Black Mist. If illaoi were to willingly listen to Yorick's explanation of what happened, and i'm fairly sure that with her ability to see the souls of living things(from Nagakaboros) she would be able to see he's still alive. I'm pretty sure that if anyone would pass nagakaboroses test it would be him.
: Hi hi! Thanks for the feedback! We've been working throughout development to differentiate them, but I can sync up with the VFX artist and see if there's anything else he can do to push the differentiation further.
Why not do what you did to Star Guardian Poppy and change the color? Star Guardian Poppy's animations were originally yellow but the comunity said it would make more sense if they were blue, so you guys changed it to blue. Zyra's Dragon skin looks purple, so why not change the sphere's to Pinkish/ Purple instead? Or to the color of her hair.
Paroe (NA)
: Aatrox changes are really bad. You have no control over your blood well and cant hold it for bonus stats anymore. The nerf to his Q is MASSIVE and it makes me quite sad.
Good, holding on to a passive simply for bonus stats instead of being forced to use it is counterproductive and makes balancing hard. All you have to do to control your blood well is not spam your abilities constantly and only go in when in Blood Rage, simple. Laning as aatrox will be basically, poke with e, maybe use your W to get some health or add to your blood well, wait until you have 80%, Q and all in your opponent to win trades or get kills. All it does is make aatrox have very definitive windows of power, unlike what he had before. An issue with Aatrox is because of his kit's power, he had an overloaded kit, it was to hard to balance and made him scary when ever buffing him. Which is why riot decided to never touch him after they nerfed him, similar to Yorick's release. You could never really gauge how strong an Aatrox was because his abilities gave him so many free stats, and, as we know, early duelists and diver's are basically just stat checker's.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Swaid (NA)
: Shit man, even as {{champion:86}} or {{champion:83}} , I grab that shit {{item:3123}} if we need it.
If i'm playing, Yorick, Fiora or Camille and my enemy laner is healing A LOT i WILL get an executioner's as my 3rd item usually after a core item, like Sheen or something, cause there is no way their going to win a fight with you after that.
: Well it wouldn't actually check. It'd be just a manual ping. So you could still be wrong. Because if it actually checked and told you, that'd be broken. But yes the manual signal would be helpful for deciding on engages and the like.
What i do is ping my enemy laner doesn't have flash, even though i know damned good and well he does, just so i get a gank. Same concept to me XD
Evenstar (OCE)
: Ekko is super healthy and balanced, but am I allowed to say something about him?
"Every champion, we feel, needs to have something broken or frustrating about their kits. This way the player of the champion is more satisfied, if every champion didn't have at least one thing on them that's a little overpowered or frustrating, the game would be boring."~ Meddler First if a change like this were to be implemented, it would need to happen over 4 seconds not 6 just because his ultimate makes him constantly have to keep track of where he was 4 seconds ago, it would just make sense. Second, making his abilities strike twice would break him, that's a fact, even at 60% reduced damage, and third, if an ekko chronobreaks on top of me and kills me, that's an outplay, if he used it to re engage a team fight, outplay if he uses to get out after starting a teamfight, that's an outplay. I see no issue with him as is, he's balanced right now and what's not broken doesn't need fixing.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick gameplay thoughts: Feb 17
If i might intrude, another way to remove his stat checking issues, cause most older diver's have it, is somehow remove his reliance on auto attacks.
Rioter Comments
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: Feb 16
I really would like to see Lethality changed, the scaling, i feel, shouldn't be as good on ranged champions. They abuse way to much, way to easily and ruin it for everyone else. List of items ruined by Marksmen. {{item:3814}} {{item:3142}} {{item:3053}} {{item:3071}} {{item:3025}} {{item:3078}} {{item:3156}} {{item:3147}} I'm pretty sure that's the most well known ones, they had to change almost every item here in some way so marksmen couldn't abuse them anymore. And in most cases nerf them anyway, notice how most of these items are Tank/Fighter or Assassin items. It's no wonder those classes were all so weak for such a long time (until recently), all of their best items constantly getting nerfed, not because of them but because of marksmen.
: How are Leblanc, Kha, Rengar, and Jayce looking now after their recent nerfs?
Jayce is still pretty broken due to Lethality buffs, he builds lethality by default anyway so it makes him really REALLY strong and he basically has a free lane in top because he's ranged. Kha'zix, rengar and leblanc all seem to be a lot less frustrating when behind or on equal terms. Based on what i'v seen the only thing ruining shit is lethality, more specifically ranged champions abusing it.
Slythion (NA)
: congrats you found an outlier and applied their success to represent the entire class :-) The only 5 *really* viable adcs rn are: {{champion:21}} {{champion:29}} {{champion:202}}{{champion:110}} {{champion:119}} notice something? 4/5 of them abuse lethality while another 4/5 maintain extreme range safety while the 4th has several safety abilities (invisibility, slows, range buffs) while also being the only really successful adc to use crit builds do to his several buffs (att dmg increase, attack speed increase, built-in true damage). Draven abuses the lethality build in a different way, because he sees *immediate* results after just one item and can really pressure the early game. Other than those 5 adcs where they all essentially do the same thing, every single other adc is dead right now
I love the downvotes despite the fact that this isn't good gameplay and this isn't a good thing. THank you.
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Zerenza

Level 30 (NA)
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