Rioter Comments
Rexxiee (NA)
: New champ is going to be camille all over again.
He has to chose which one he get's...he gets barely any healing if he goes Assassin, he get's 0 CC. His damage is pretty low from what i'v seen so far in gameplay while in Darkin form, and his base form without transforming is also fairly weak. Darkin form=Aatrox=Heals and very little CC, Shadow Assassin Form=Zed=Nice Burst Damage no sustain, better mobility. There's a trade off, you don't just get all of it at once.
: Would be a shame if he had to choose which benefits he gets, right?!
: And again, skill cap should not be considered to be an actual weakness of a champion.
Go into a game right now, play one of the hardest champions that you don't main, Evelynn, Katarina, Zed, Lee Sin, Riven, Yasuo, Vayne, Bard ect. See if you win that game on your own or if you get carried, skill cap is a good barrier for entry for a champion, it's not a weakness because all those champions i listed have very distinct weaknesses, trying playin Katarina into a team that has ANY Heal bot, good luck.
: I guarentee the heal on his e is shit for mid/early game. Its really to help his jungle sustain at early lvls since he can be an assassin and they want him to be aggressively ganking a lot
Yeah true, i do still think number's nerfs on it will come eventually, we'll have to see. I imagine number's adjusting for his Darkin form as well, though he only gains those massive heals by dealing his % Max HP damage to tanks, it's still quite a bit and might get hit, so far though he's probably balanced(mostly)
: Thoughts on the new champion kit??
I think it's a good change for Transforming Champions, most transforming champions have WAAAAAYYY to much utility, making almost every single one of them OP in some way, but for Kayn he can only transform once per match( I think) and his abilities change how he's allowed to play. In his Assassins form he probably won't be tanky, he won't have any extra healing unless he builds Gunblade but he'll get burst and mobility. In his Darkin form he has CC and Healing but he won't burst people, that Ezreal had plenty of time to get away, and his team had plenty of chances to collapse, but it was after a teamfight and ez was pretty low so naturally, he dies. I think number's will be an issue, just like with every new release, but i think he's balanced, the heal on his E probably isn't needed and they might need to lower the healing on his Darkin Form so he can't be an impossible to kill Drain Tank. I don't see his assassin form being an issue, people will hate it, but everyone who get's killed by an assassin, hates assassins.
: Looks alright on paper. I just fear that he will follow the similar problem plaguing many other duel for champions. (Namely, that only one form will actually be competitively viable.) That one form will be suboptimal than the other. This would be particularlly frustrating since he's going to be locked into one form for the rest of the game. On the other hand, His two form are really just overlays on the same basic ability set. This actually sets a pretty good example on how thin the difference between and Assassin and a Diver can actually be. Thematically speaking, I love it.
The thing with it is, his Fighter/Diver form has more sustain and some CC. His assassin form has more Burst and mobility, it makes sense, there will most likely be number's tuning but right now he seems okay, just don't feed the Kayn.
: Doubt it, looks better suited to being a Jungler or potentially a mid laner.
I predict Top, Jungle or Mid, it'll mainly be Comp related, if you take him top lane he's going to be a damn good Fighter in his Darkin form. If you take him Mid you can roam more, kill mages more and be a really good Assassin. If you take him jungle you can chose either, all i know is i'm gonna try him out.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: June 23
Hey Meddler, I understand that when you guys say "Assassin" item's you often just mean the AD ones, but there are AP assassins too and they miss out on a lot of the things AD assassins get, can you take a look at their itemization sometime? Edit: AP Assassins build exactly the same as mages, where as AD Assassins built completely different from their Bruiser, Juggernaut and Marksman counterparts(in most cases) so i think AP assassins need some love in their itemization.
: How to Spot a Scripter From a Scripter
One time i was playing Syndra against, i think a Ryze, and i had my Q taken off of quick cast, it was on quick cast with indicator, so i held the button and hovered over him, he immidiately began to move in the opposite direction of my Q, like i could litterally control his movements with my Q.
: ranked is the place to show your skill not practice champions you are terrible at :^) also i was never bronze was placed in silver and reached platinum the first season i was playing, want to know how? by actually trying to win unlike the majority of players apparently.
Ranked is a place to grow as a player in a more competitive environment. Practice against people in a competitive environment is important to grow as a player, regardless of the champion. You won't get better with a champion by spamming them in Normals for 100 games, normals is completely different and doesn't help you in ranked, therefor the only real way to get better is to play ranked, if you go into a ranked game with any champion, no matter how many times you've played them, your probably not going to be as good as the people who have played ranked with their champions more than you. The only way to improve is to play ranked. Also, you cannot prove someone isn't trying to win based on a champion pick, it's more than that, just because someone is playing a champion that isn't very good or that their not good at doesn't mean they aren't trying to win.
: not entirely sure why you would make the same post twice but here have another analogy, if your kid was hanging off of a cliff and i was trying to pull her up and i had a choice to attempt doing so with my arms or my teeth, would me trying my very best to pull her up using my teeth really be me trying my best to pull her up?
First, stop trying to compared a game to life and death, it's not the same and the analogy doesn't work. A better analogy for what your trying to say is, if you were to have to hand write a paper for a teacher/professor, would you use the hand your best with, or would you use your weak hand and risk not doing it properly. Thing is though, i'm ambidextrous, i learned how to use both of my hands from practice. This person is simply practicing and getting better with a champion they love to play, with many champions it takes time to "Git Gud" but once you do it's very rewarding, especially if you have a distinct love for that champion. Look at all the Evelynn, Aatrox and Urgot mains out there, do you think that when they started playing those champions that they'd expect to stomp every game after just a few mastery levels? No, they knew they wouldn't, those champs are shit, but they did it anyway. Now if you go into diamond or challenger, despite the fact that all three of those champions are pretty fucking bad, they're up there with the best of them. Riven takes time, it takes a lot of work to be good with her, this guy's not sitting there purposely trying to not win, he's trying his best with one of the hardest champions in the game to play. He isn't "Not trying to win" just by picking something he isn't good with yet, he's learning, want me to go back to when you were bronze and see how bad you were with your mains?
: Well objectively speaking, carrying in silver is easier than carrying in diamond.
Well, you can't compare bronze and silver to diamond. Diamond player's are, in a sense "Better" than lower ranking player's, buuuuut the question is, if their silver playing with other silver's, it's the same as you playing with other diamonds. Meaning, to a silver, carrying with riven in silver is just as hard as carrying with riven in diamond, even if it's technically not, if you were to be diamond and try and carry with a champion in silver it would in fact be easier. From the silver's perspective, it's not easy, and that's all it is, a matter of perspective.
: In Ranked, the goal is not to ahve fun, but to win. You can have fun while winning, but it comes second.
That is an opinion not a fact. Some people play competitive games to have fun in a competitive atmosphere, other's do it for the SOLE purpose of winning.
: ***
Even if i rioter discredits the leaks, they did the same with the first leak, they also instantly removed both soooooo i'm going to say it's either true or their just trying to throw us off their trail. I also applaud them, urgot is very unique and i honestly thought of playing him, until i realized he's very out dated and i probably wouldn't like him, but the rework i'm atleast going to try. I do have worries about his state after the rework with what we've been shown so far but i trust them to make something good.
: He requires items to burst a whole team, stopping him early will help the issue of him bursting teams, anyway he has been doing that for ages kinda what he does xD
Yes buuut an ADC is supposed to do DPS, not BPS lol He's kind of a problem right now because of that, especially since once he get's those two item's he will burst your team, unless he's severely behind, like 0/10, you need to constantly worry about him.
Rioter Comments
Meddler (NA)
: He's on watch, don't currently have nerfs in for him or nerfs planned for the coming patch at least though.
well, i'v been seeing twitch jungle a lot more in high ELO play, and the thing is. His Q reveal range is less than his auto attack range, meaning he can auto attack you from invisibilty so there is very little time to react to him, similar to Evelynn back in season 2, where her ultimate could be cast from outside her reveal range. I think this should be changed, also, i think we've all seen what twitch can do to a team, bursting a whole team is kind of absurd.
: I've had it with people belittling the amount of effort it takes to play tanks
I only think a couple Tank's are completely braindead maybe less than that. {{champion:54}} Actually wait yeah it's only one, malphite requires little to no skill to play, most of his abilities are easy to use, his ultimate is the hardest thing to hit but it's still not that hard, he's safe in lane and offer's a lot to the team. He's an easy brain dead tank to play. A couple Juggernaut's do come to mind though. {{champion:75}} {{champion:86}} Some diver/fighter's/ melee Carry's. {{champion:23}} {{champion:24}} {{champion:11}} {{champion:80}}
Pyro (EUNE)
: Riot wants to rework assassin items - what would you want to change?
I think AP assassins do have a problem with their itemization, the reason is because Mage's build their item's too. Ahri and Leblance for example ABUSE Gunblade and Lichbane, but katarina and akali need Gunblade's extra spellvamp because it helps them survive due to them being Melee which is a huge difference between them using it and Ahri using it. The Assassin AP item's need to be changed to benefit AP assassins in way's that give them the same things AD assassins get, maybe not like completely copying their actives but it would be nice to get Movement speed on AP assassin item's, or Magic Penetration, Spellvamp is also nice for them, but Mages need to be pointed away from those item's as well.
: As a fellow lover of Rammus, I don't agree. His current dance is enjoyable to look at. Having him spin faster and forever, they might as well use his Q animation and turn it sideways.
Duuuude but what if they did use his Q animation once he got enough movement speed?!
: Azir Gameplay Update: Goals and Directions
I would prefer option 1, the reason why is Option 2 maintains the "Lane Bully" aspect he can have against the champions that are supposed to be able to kill him. His range and high damage make it hard for many champions to get to him, then if you do get to him he can dash an absurd distance away, in lane he's to safe due to his dash and the range his soldier's have. Meaning that for a champion meant to hyper scale, his lane phase is way to safe to warrant how powerful he becomes in late game. I would prefer option 1 so that when he's not to far away and i can actually punish him properly and trade properly against him in lane, i'm okay with him getting survivability because of this and i'm also okay with him keeping his ultimate and dash(except for the absurd range) because at least he won't be able to bully me out of lane from 4x my range. Alternatively with option 2, if it was pushed through, his Soldier's need to not be able to stand under your tower, it's obnoxious for him to place a soldier under your tower next to his minion wave and half health you with no repercussions and no counterplay against it aside from calling on your JG. Also, option 2 fit's his thematic better but i feel his Ult and Dash would need to be changed heavily if option 2 were selected. While where at it though, his passive seems out of place, placing a tower is one of the tools he has that simply extends games and is another one of those things that makes him extremely frustrating and very powerful in competitive play. Kill his tower so he can't run back to it and be safe? Nope, i'll just spawn another one and safely farm from outside your range.
: Before people start taking decisions on which opinion is better I think we should look at ranks of the people proposing stuff here. I mean, almost 60%-70% are silver or lower players. I don't want to sound harsh but at those ranks you can't really make non erroneous decisions on a subject as complex as a champion rework and especially Azir rework. What I want to say is: People look at RANKS! Most people here are unrankeds, bronzes or silvers which is not always bad but you rank is a good indicator of your game knowledge and/or mechanics.
Rank has nothing to do with Game Knowledge, anyone of any rank can have perfectly fine game knowledge, there are several reason's you could be lower rank. For me, i don't like to play ranked, i hate to actually, it's stressful. Especially true for unranked player's as well, here's an example. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20G8epdMVXY It should also be noted that many Rioter's are unranked or low ranked, there are plenty that are high ranking but most don't go past gold 1. The reason this is important is because, i take their word on balance and champion design waaaaaaay higher than any player despite their rank.
Moooose2 (NA)
: Bronze 3 proves my point even further.
So what if i'm bronze, if i'm against other bronze's and have a 58% winrate with a champions you say "I can't play." doesn't that mean i can actually play them?
Moooose2 (NA)
: Maybe you shouldn't play a high skill cap champ that you suck at... Not saying getting flamed for it is ok, but if it bothers you stop doing it. You're being flamed cuz you're playing a mechanical champ and you suck at it.
58% winrate would argue against you, i have bad games just like anyone else, i'm no Boxbox i'm not going to stomp people constantly and i might need help, just like anyone else.
: /mute all
As i said, i don't want to /mute all every single game just cause people hate riven and flame me for playing her.
Rioter Comments
Lyseth (NA)
: So this is all the skill Riven reqiures?
It's because in higher ELO she has so many counter's that if you don't know your mechanic's better than them, you'll flat out lose. Her animation canceling is basically core to her kit, without it she couldn't win most match ups, one animation cancel, called Double Casting is extremely useful in all the ranged match ups that she loses. Riven's Fast combo is useful in dueling, she'd lose to most other duelists without it and then all of her smaller ones are simply used to make her life easier. R+E for example shortens the animation of her R so she can still fight.
: It fulfills the fantasy of that particular playstyle for some players. I'm one of them. I like to slowly toil thru bad early game to finally become strong later on. To counter Nasus, try watching Dong Haup's video on it. He has the right idea. The gist is to basically Ignore Him and catch him when he overextends (along with your teammates). Don't even bother to solo him past mid game. Think about RESOURCES spent to try to kill him. For Veigar- If u can, don't build a team full of squishy champs and that's about it.
What if nasus never over extends? In top lane it's rather easy to lock a wave, not to mention his base MS Is pretty high at 350, higher than many other champions, meaning if your jungler doesn't catch him or you don't have CC he's going to get away then by the time he's back the wave will be under his tower and he can free farm. Not to mention, my jungler NEVER gank's me against nasus, no matter what i do, free kill or not, top lane does not exist once nasus enter's it. Now, yes i can play Riven into him for her Mobility and CC, buuuuut then he'll come back with a glacial shroud and proceed to shit on me cause i can't do enough damage, then he'll hit me with 300 damage Q's with storm raider's and yolo run me down with his ultimate. He just shouldn't get the ammount of raw stats he get's, same with veigar, for doing nothing but farming, it's so frustrating and stressful to play against these two because if you don't end the game before a certain point, it's over and that's just not fun.
Rioter Comments
: of course not all of them, hell i didn't use cookie cutter builds when i was plat but the mass majority of them do and that's what makes the statistics ya know.
DO you actually have concrete proof that platinum player's mostly use Cookie Cutter builds. Cause i really don't think you do, your experience isn't enough to warrant the entirety of platinum.
: No offense, but I think you just don't know how to play her. The dagger is not a skillshot, it's a point click, sure it may bounce onto minions after but it will still be within range of the enemy when you jump to it(if you do it right away). A good, safe trade would be to drop a dagger, throw a dagger at the enemy, immediately jump to the enemy dagger, then immediately jump to the one you dropped before. You will do damage and if you do it quick enough, you should take little to no damage.
To jump back immediately requires an animation cancel, there is actually a pretty considerable delay before you can jump back, if he's new to Kat he won't know how to do it(I can barely do it consistently). The dagger will always drop the same distance behind the target, 350 units. The thing is though if you dash or flash before the dagger hits you (assuming you were the initial cast target) it will follow you, meaning if Tristana dashes 900 away, the dagger will land 1250 units away from katarina, her Shunpo range is 750, meaning that katarina can't shunpo to her dagger or tristana in time to kill her. Her dagger is actually a skill shot because of this, a good Katarina knows not to target the enemy champion unless they plan on following them and killing them, a bad one will always target the enemy champion, instead of a minion so the dagger drops on top of the enemy instead of behind them. You are right though, he's just in experienced, but he did have a good point when it comes to how hard it can be to actually kill someone who has mobility with katarina(Good kat's can avoid this with positioning though).
: the thing with op.gg is that it uses plat statistics, in platinum everyone does their cookie cutter build and never changes anything not to even mention custom runes for the matchup and these are the things that winning against pantheon depends on the most.
That's a generalization, it's not a fact, you can't prove that every platinum player uses Cookie Cutter builds.
: http://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/counters/pantheon/diamond
https://na.op.gg/champion/pantheon/statistics/top I prefer to use Op,gg due to it using Korean statistic and changing throughout the patch unlike Champion.gg.
Keyru (NA)
: Boards Moderation Discord Verification
: some riven numbers
There actually aren't very many riven mains in challenger, she has more counterpicks than most top lane champions so why not use one of them? Pantheon is literally perfect because he can 100-0 someone at level 3 and only use half his mana.
Rioter Comments
: My thought process whenever I lane against a pantheon.
A good counter to Pantheon is Illaoi, max your Q or your E, your choice based on confidence. All you have to do is E him when he leaps at you and he'll take automatic damage due to being unable to move during the animation, then proceed to W+Q him and you'll probably win the trade. At level 6 he litterally can't fight you anymore, no one can.
: How is heimerdinger? I would imagine (based on your description) he'd to pretty well
Pretty poorly, it's kind of based on positioning but i'm pretty sure that Pantheon's Spear will one shot his turret's, after that if pantheon is able to leap on to heimer once, he's going to die instantly.
: Would Trynd do well into Panth?
Trynd is a horrible pick into pantheon, for the first 5 levels of the game if you aren't sitting under your tower, pantheon WILL kill you and he will do it as many times as he want's. Even with your ultimate he can still probably kill you with ease, once you get your crit item's you should be fine but by then he's probably farming your teamates.
Rioter Comments
: No one should be allowed to 1-shot, it's bad game design.
It's important to be able to one shot, the reason why is because Marksmen for example are basically unkillable due to high lifesteal, penetration and VERY high damage unless you can get to them, and one shot them. You can CC them as much as you want but then you'd have to worry about the rest of their team, have you ever seen a game without an assassin that had say, Vayne, Jinx or Twitch on one of the teams? Those three ADC's are the most prominent example's of "Delete the entire team cause they can't get to me.". Assassins were introduced because of the massive power that ADC's had with little to no way of counterplaying against them. Once the game hit's 40 minutes, if you don't have an assassin, they game is completely over if these ADC's are on the enemy team, you literally should surrender because you'll need to kill them quickly and remove them from the fight. If you don't do that they WILL shred your entire team, hence why assassins are a necessary evil.
: I'm so sad. Do you think they will make her better or worse? She's really not one of the "best picks" for jungle in the meta right now but I just love her so much and I would hate to see her nerfed and unplayable. I also want them to keep her voice and stuff.
Better, without a question, current Evelynn is nerfed, hard. She's usable because her stealth mechanic makes her viable, but it's also the reason she can't be what she was designed to be, an Assassin. Her stealth mechanic was holding her back pretty hard from her playstyle, the rest of her abilities have suffered pretty considerably. The rework will make her a better assassin, the direction riot wanted her to have, it'll give her more burst damage and less DPS, which is good because that's what she had before they were forced to nerf into non-existance.
Rioter Comments
Sukishoo (NA)
: The fact she got a Legendary kills any chance of her getting an Ultimate.
Don't downvote based off of the chance of her getting but on whether you like the idea or not.
Rioter Comments
Broporo (NA)
: Yeeeaaaa Fiora's mobility might put a bit of a damper on Riven. Honestly, I'd suggest going into practice mode for a bit until you get the hang of her, or searching for tutorials and watching others play her on Twitch could be a good resource as well!
Twitch is an amazing Recourse, so is Youtube, plenty of riven mains exist on both, the Rivenmain reddit is a great place as well. I did what Broporo suggested last night and practiced Double Casting for a good 20 minutes, i'm a quick learner so i can do it whenever i want now but i'll need to practice a lot more to get her many many other combo's down. Double Casting: Cast your E, right before the dash ends cast Q+W at the exact same time, doing so will cast them both at the same time. Use: Double Casting allows you to stun and automatically proc Thunderlords on someone then get out with your last 2 Q's, or catch someone trying to runaway. It's especially effective for lane's you can't actually win easily, such as fiora, cause it gives you an easy way to deal 200 damage, get out, and win the trade. Fast Combo: Q+AA+Movement Command+Q+AA+Movement Command+Q+AA+Movement Command. This combo is one of the hardest, i don't know how to do it yet consistently. Use: Shortens the time it takes you to deal a full skill rotation, not absolutely necessary since you'll rarely use this except in 1v1's without minions and while playing Jungle Riven. R Animation Cancel: use your R then E immediately after, easiest combo to do, takes little to no practice. My Favorite Combo: R+E+Double Cast+Q+AA+Q+AA+R These combo's more specifically Double Casting and R cancel help a lot with a lot of match up's and are two of the most needed ones when playing Riven because of how generally useful they are. There are tutorial's on how to do them on youtube if you still can't quite get it.
Meddler (NA)
: Looks like next patch (7.14) is much more likely at this point. Still being worked on.
AP Assassins exist too, i really want to see some look into their itemization soon, they build the same as Mages and if an AP assassin can build it, so can a mage, which usually results in the item being nerfed for both rather than just one.
Nuparu (NA)
: Did Hexdrinker and Death's Dance stop existing?
The chances of you being able to get both before lane phase is over with her is very low against Morde, he usually bullies you off of farm early in the game, he'll win most trades with ease due to his Healing and Shield and he can dish out just as much if not more damage than you can. You might get a hexdrinker but by then he'll be able to stat check you even with Hexdrinker and you'll probably die. If your not behind and somehow going even for about 20 minutes you MIGHT be able to get Hexdrinker and Death's Dance, in which case if you didn't feed you can probably 1v1 him by then but any other case is in morde's favor.
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Zerenza

Level 30 (NA)
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