: Why azir is not a battle mage ? Even if I think it's messy, I imagined that battle mage were the counterpart (all in one, ranged and melee) of marksmen and skirmishers for AP.
Because his kit doesn't reflect it...it was MENT to but since people found the "Shurima Shuffle", his range is so vast compared to other battle mages who have to actually be in the fight, his powerful initiation ability and his marksmen esc build path. He's unique because he has so many different thing's in his kit which ultimately made him...well to put bluntly overloaded and waaaay to powerful, but also made it way to difficult to categorize him, if you asked me, based on what i'v seen Azir do, he's a diver it's all based on perception.
: who are you glad ISN'T Meta?
{{champion:36}} Can anyone remember that when he's strong, he's REALLY strong. He's so laughably easy to use and his kit is so simple yet sooooooo effective when he isn't nerfed. He doesn't have to build ANY damage and he'll still face tank then out damage a lot of juggernauts that, on paper, are stronger than him. He's extremely difficult to play against because of his massive speed boost, increased health regen and incredible damage, all coupled with the crucial fact, all he does is right click. And finally, that fucking sound his Clever makes when he hit's you with it....*triggered*
: Wasn't Diana on the Rework list as she and Akali are so similar?
Not that we know of, Akali definitely is though since it was revealed during the Assassin update that Akali needs bigger changes and is like going to be after Evelynn.
: Is Lissandra worth maining?
I would be careful with Lissandra, she's a DPS mage and she brings a lot to the team but she has low range making her a bit unsafe and against anyone who can out DPS her, such as Ryze, you'll have some problems. It's kind of hard to hard carry a team with Lissandra because of how good she is in a cooridinated team as well, so just keep in mind that with her you'll have to play more around your teamates than champions that have that Solo Que, Solo Carry aspect.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: May 23
Hey are you guys looking into any changes for Diana? Her winrate is abysmal right now at 45% with a 1% playrate, i had a thread on it in gameplay that got a lot of feedback about it. The abyssal scepter changes and MR per level changes hit her really hard and since 7.5 her winrate has continually been dropping. Edit/PS: I'm really hyped for the next two reworks and i have high hopes, VGU's have been incredible lately.
: and don't tell me it's impossible to do you can even dodge his basic Q, i saw yassuo doing it many times against arkadata https://youtu.be/Vc_9mRdDFqg?t=54 go at 0:54
Lol it's not impossible to beat yasuo i just find him annoying, i don't ban him much anymore cause i'd rather ban something i have to worry about. I'm just not happy about seeing him, it doesn't matter how many times he dashes around me, i'll still get him, he'll just annoy the fuck out of me before i do.
: If you get E'd by Illaoi, are melee, and decide to fight her, consider the following
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=MadKnife IV,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ya4ZpMAm,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2017-05-22T13:44:13.142+0000) > > Sure, but wouldn't you agree that a champion shouldn't be completely unfun to play against? everyone is unfun to play against an enemy is fun to play against if he helps you to destroy his nexus that's why yasuo is never banned in high elo, we don't have fun no matter what we play against however we prefer baning broken champions like lulu and ivern as they give us more troubles to win
First, in platinum and above, Yasuo has a an 11% ban rate, he get's banned pretty often in high ELO despite apparently being "Not Strong" along with his 51% winrate and the crucial fact that he's incredibly frustrating to play against while also being effective. His lane phase is probably the most frustrating part about him, coupled with his ludicrously strong late game scaling, meaning he'll be annoying in lane, and even if you curb stomp him in lane or he curb stomps you, he'll still outscale you anyway. He has several balance issues, but it's because his kit has so many tools that make laning against him frustrating that's the cause for his ban rate being in the top 15 and then he outscales you. To emphasize, many other late game scaling champions have bad early games to counteract that. Jinx, Vayne, Nasus, Veigar just to name some from every role, but yasuo lane phase is oppressive and annoying. Gangplank for example was nerfed last year for having way to safe of a lane phase for a champion that scales so hard into late game.
: he exists with his current kit so that new players have a basic champion to learn on. He's not for even level 30 normal matches, hence the comment about pro play. He's just a stat smashing jugernaut that is kept bad so that his incredibly basic kit doesn't become overpowering. We can't go around making every champion viable for ranked with a high degree of counterplay and complex mechanics. There has to be somewhere to start. Some training wheels. He's not a problem in anyones ranked matches and he's far from broken. Leave him be
Warwick, Annie, Caitlynn, Soraka, Sona, Poppy,Teemo. There are several Easy to play champions that are still viable and fair that teach people the basic's of said role without being completely garbage in ranked. In addition, none of these champions are complex but all of them all see play in LCS and in High ELO, even challenger. They all also teach the basic's of each role pretty well and some such as Annie are designed to make lane phase easy for new player's while still being very VERY effective in high ELO play without being to oppressive.
Rioter Comments
: Anyone feel like Garen should be the anti-mage juggernaut like Gallo is the anti-mage tank?
I don't because he's the "Easy to play" juggernaut, which means he should be playable into most comps similar to other cheaper champions that are for new player's.
: If they're doing 1300 damage in autos, then this is late game. You don't wanna hang onto a not-slot efficient item by lategame. Giving the flashbang more effects or some more AP/movespeed would be a good idea, like maybe 15 more AP, 5% more movespeed, or making the flashbang either give a burst of movespeed or do damage. Also, the blind should be Quinn style, Nearsight, so you can't throw it on them and just pound away until they die. It also makes it more effective when running from mages or more ability based enemies. It also means it won't auto win you the duel against anyone AD (specifically the skirmishers and assassins, but most bruisers would be fucked up too) because they'd lose out on at least a good 30% of their damage if they're blinded and can't auto, while if you're melee, they'll still be able to fight back if you're going in. Also Luden's gives movespeed, and a fuck ton of it. AP assassins don't scale better lategame, except perhaps Kata and that's only because of her huge AoE and resets. AD assassins being tanky isn't a feature, it's not intended and just the case of assassins abusing Cleaver.
Luden's has been a lesser bought item for quite some time, i personally hate buying the item and it got nerfed for the same reason many AP item's get nerfed, mages abused it. I like your changes to flash bang, it makes sense but i didn't want to overload the item and make people hate it automatically. It would make sense for it to give a burst of movement speed when it hits someone and to be nearsite instead of teemo blind. AP assassins are generally better late game(though we don't have many AD ones to be fair) because AP items scale better than flat AD items, in addition many AD assassins just don't have the scaling's to keep up with AP Assassins as the game goes on. Zed and Talon for example, the most common AD assassins in midlane, don't scale that well into late compared to their AP midlane counterparts. Scaling into late is more about their ratio's than the ability itself. Katarina's ultimate has a HUGE ratio, but then again most AP Assassins have absurd scaling's in their abilities and can also build more AP to boot. When was the last time you had 600-800 AD With any AD Assassin? And do remember their scaling are often worse.
Rioter Comments
: It's really hard to get an advantage without ignite on Riven from what I've experienced but I'll try.
An experienced riven player takes TP, it's better for her to roam with, being a top lane Fighter/Assassin. I'd highly suggest taking TP as any top laner, especially riven, her match ups are never in her favor, the only way you'll climb out of silver with her is if your legitimately better than every one else your placed with and you know her animation cancels like the back of your hand. I do suggest learning other more efficient fighter's or juggernauts, like Camille or Kled though because you'll find more success with them than riven(just way to hard to play). By efficient i mean that riven is highly reliant on snowballing, this means you have to win lane every single time with at least 3 kills or a 45 CS lead, if you take TP that makes it easier for her cause you don't have to kill your opponent, just kill their teammates. If your a highly aggressive player like me, try playing Illaoi and Yorick. If your not a highly aggressive player pick some tanks like Sion or Galio.
: I feel that Garen slipped under the radar for a lot of people discussing mini-updates (me included). He definitely has his issues, one of the biggest I feel is that he's TOO simple. Garen is a very straight-forward and easy champion, which by itself isn't a bad thing. It gives new players a simple champion to play, but in turn he loses the access to certain tools many other champions have. Garen is only mostly good at killing one target, but he doesn't even get to choose who that target is. Maybe it's the fed ADC who can shred him fairly easily, or maybe the support who accidentally took a kill. Garen just doesn't have a lot of depth or options, and hopefully a mini-update could be very beneficial for him. I feel like being the juggernaut assassin should stay his niche, but I feel being an anti-magic/mage juggernaut would be much more fitting to his lore and identity (He wears magic-absorbing armour from Demacia). This sorta shows in his current kit through his silence, but that's the only true anti-mage tool he has.
He shouldn't have a silence at all, the idea of "Juggernaut/ Assassin" is extremely bad for design. By design a juggernaut is supposed to be a damage dealing psuedo tank, they go into the team and wreak havoc on them. An assassins job is to kill a single key target, if you combine those your left with, well, garen. Garen's ability to yolo dive a back line and one shot an ADC is unmatched and that's exactly why he's kept so weak, fizz and ekko tank builds are basically garen, high damage, hard to kill, hard to get away from. It's just not good gameplay and causes his basic design to be extremely oppressive. He should simply be a juggernaut, all juggernauts can kill squishies but none of them can do it with ease unless their fed. In my opinion the perfect Juggernaut is Illaoi, sure she's a pain to lane against and she can feel broken but her entire kit is full of counterplay, dodge, run away, CC. She even tells you to do exactly that but people still complain because they just don't, a juggernaut should punish player's severely for making mistakes, but not make it impossible for them to do anything at all, like garen does with his silence. Edit: Not to mention, Garen should punish his enemies for making mistakes, it makes sense being the "Might of Demacia" that he punishes player's like a true keeper of justice and law in demacia.
Rioter Comments
: She had a shitty winrate before the item changes.
From 7.5 it's only gotten worse.
: IMO a change they could try, Is if diana's hits her Q, it resets her ult cooldown rather than her ult reseting if she recently ulted somebody hit by Q (marked). This would give diana players more options such as ulting for an easier Q to followup ganks or actually be able to commit to her own roams once she's there (you miss Q while roaming you might as well go back mid). Diana isn't like ahri or ekko where they can still continue a fight if they miss one part of their kit, if diana misses her most vital part its very devestating, and even if she does land it, is that the one you follow up with? Additionally they could buff the shield ratios on her W to make her survive diving into fights (which would make her tankier than ahri, differing her playstyle from both being one shots, to diana being a mid laner all-in diver while ahri is a ranged mage assassin.). Buffing W ratios would double up as a revival to jungle diana who struggles in the new jungle.
In order to buff her shield they would have to reduce damage because if not she'd be similar to tank ekko and fizz, slipper and deals lots of damage while being really tanky. Though i do think it's worth trying to reset her ult with her Q instead of the other way around, her Q cooldown is pretty high(i believe 8 seconds max rank?) and having that reset her R would allow for buffs considering it would be an overall nerf to her stick ability as an assassin. Though i really want them to attempt turning her into a fighter and making her ultimate how was going to be during her conception(it was moonfall just on steroids and it was soooooc oool.)
: I don't play much Diana, but how would you feel if she was reworked into a Diver, kind of like a magical Vi/Camille? Riot could make her tankier and focus on giving her more sustained damage instead of burst. She could even keep all of her abilities, but just shift some numbers/effects around like they did with Kindred and Rammus.
Honestly wouldn't mind and i'd probably main her still.
Mobez (NA)
: Yeah that's why she has a 1% playrate because everyone is playing her
: She doesn't need a VGU A minirework? Would help her. A class update rework? Yep but more often than not that turns out bad. But a VGU is a visual and gameplay update, basically what galio, taric, yorick, etc got.
Yeah i agree, a mini-rework would be nice, maybe they could actually turn her into the fighter she was intended to be, i wouldn't complain at all if they did but if they pushed her finally into a distinct assassin that would be great to.
Antenora (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Zerenza,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZBVlqZyc,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2017-05-19T12:07:20.243+0000) > > I don't think i'd call her a niche pick, a couple other assassins and mages are but diana? There are a couple generally good Assassins in mid lane and i'd say she's one of them. Diana is not an assassin. Diana – Scorn of the Moon ROLE(S) Fighter, Secondary: Mage http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Diana She's considered a Diver by Riot.
Let me ask you something though, is she build like a diver or an assassin? Does she play like a diver or an Assassin? The answer to both is assassin, she might not have been built to be one but riot has so far balanced her to be one since her release. This coincides with her playstyle and build path being nothing like a Diver such as Pantheon or Renekton, not because their AD but because they build semi-tanky after damage, Diana builds full damage and while yes she can "Dive" people, any assassin can, what makes them different is how they do it and how they build. Diana is an assassin, regardless of what she was built for originally, she's an assassin.
: > [{quoted}](name=Ganked By Tilt,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=uATEvaap,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2017-05-19T17:01:03.388+0000) > > They are currently balancing Bork for ranged/melee, they could do the same with new ap items. I just think ap champions desperately need more items, the ones we got last year didn't to too much honestly. Well that's BotRK. And again, AD champions have drastically different dynamics when you consider ADC, Caster, and Bruiser. While for an AP champion, a Melee's reach and lack and AoE, can be made up with a higher AP ratio, and you could pretty much leave it at that. I mean, instead of Assassin items. (Or generally speaking, AP glass cannon items.) I would rather see more items geared towards Bruisers and Juggernauts, who scale with AP. Cause so far, the only real good item for that is Crystal Scepter. (Maybe RoA if their Mana reliant.)
The reason i want to see it is as you said, many AP assassins don't have access to the utility that AD assassins do. While most AP assassins do scale better than AD ones (Katarina, Kassadin, Akali all scale better than say Talon or Zed.) that doesn't make up for the fact that AP Assassins and Mages build nearly exactly the same, meaning that they all have the same item utility but the assassin offer's nothing outside of damage so why ever pick one over a mage. It would be nice to get fighter,assassin and juggernaut items for AP as well but mages would probably abuse those unless you do something like the new BoRK or Hydra item line(but riot hates doing that). In addition, one assassin was actually supposed to be a fighter, but due to the fact that there aren't any items she could build to make her a good fighter, she's an assassin now. That champion is DIana. Ultimately getting a Duskblade AP version(or old duskblade AP version) would be nice, maybe even an AP Youmu's. I'd argue that DFG would be nice to bring back if it were considerably changed and geared towards Melee champions by making the burn damage half or something on ranged champions. Also you make a point about the Dynamic of AD champions being different, containing many different champions with different roles. Well could it be that the reason AD champions are so diverse in roles is because the item pool is as well?
: I'd say she's very niche. She doesn't counter much and gets countered by a lot, and every reason you play her for besides being a main, (waveclear mid, strong roams, mobility, burst) is done infinitely better by other champions; like ahri and kat which play the same role as AP carry assassins but do it better and have a fighting chance pre-6. Diana has an identity issue nowadays, she's either overtuned to the point she's worth picking over the other champions, or she's just average and falls flat to being picked over ahri, ekko, kat, fizz, and LB. Even her matchups are way more frustrating for diana since she can't do much pre-6 while other mid laners can way easier, and even at 6 other mids still have a powerspike that counters hers. IMO she needs a rek'sai/kindred level update. She has needed it for awhile, I think she was a decent pick in season 6 jungle when runic echoes was hype, but since then I haven't really seen a diana unless they were a diana main and even I don't find motivation to play her in most matchups dispite personally liking the champion. I see them do well, but experience > actual champion state.
I really like diana, your right on all fronts, i don't find her very niche but i'd say she's a worse Ahri, in that sense i mean that Ahri is a generalist, generally ahri is very good at everything, diana is good at everything to but no where near as good as ahri. Meaning that Diana is a generalist but not a very good one, and she probably could use a small update. Though i'm not sure exactly what they would change about her, if they turned her into a Fighter and turned Moonfall into the high damage ultimate it was during her creation process then maybe that would help considering we don't really have an AP fighter. Though AP Fighter's have a hard time existing due to lack of itemization geared towards them. And yes it's mostly mains that are playing her, her 45% winrate in platinum and above is along side a 1% playrate which is most likely by mains.
: She always was played like one tho - I don't say it's good, I'd like her to be played more like the fighter she's supposed to be
Same, but her kit doesn't support it and never did. The only part of her kit that does is her Passive and arguably her W, other than that she's got everything an assassin wants and if you wanted to go play her as a fighter now, chances are it wouldn't actually work.
: I mean thats fair, I just feel like in a game where mobility is so common, landing the two skillshots is going to be super impossible and heimer really doesnt scale that well.
Just because someone has mobility doesn't mean you'll never hit them. You are right though he doesn't scale well, which is something that could be fixed but it's mainly his playstyles fault, he just isn't good outside of laning phase.
Rioter Comments
Nazoh (NA)
: But isn't the point of an assassin to kill someone single targetely?
Yes, it is. Their meant to kill a single target, the reason why AD Assassin's are building bruiser though is because they can't live long enough to do anything anymore. Their items are all severely nerfed due to ADC's abusing almost every single item they have. And most ADC's right now rush GA, making assassins completely pointless.
: Niche pick mid.
I don't think i'd call her a niche pick, a couple other assassins and mages are but diana? There are a couple generally good Assassins in mid lane and i'd say she's one of them.
: It is difficult, likely impossible, to have multiple permanent maps that are about equally popular unless you design your game from the start around it. Dota and Dota 2 were designed with a single map in mind, and don't really need an additional one, because the one map those games have aims to provide all of the possibilities of multiple maps, and provides a single, consistent balance environment. League of Legends is a direct descendant of that design philosophy, and attempts to switch things up even slightly (e.g. Dominion, Twisted Treeline) have required tremendous work for not all that much of a payoff. Even ARAM, arguably the second most popular map after Summoner's Rift, suffers from significant and long-lasting balance problems while only coming at a fraction of the Rift's popularity. It's also worth mentioning that even games with multiple maps, such as HotS, tend to stick to minor differences, because champion design tends to be a bit too rigid to allow for much more deviation. A capture-the-flag mode, for example, would have to require a map-specific overhaul to any hypermobile champion, as would a king-of-the-hill mode with defensive builds (imagine having to deal with Heimerdinger in that scenario). Even with HotS's more fluid builds and only relatively small variations in focus on AoE clearing, roaming, boss killing, etc., some maps disproportionately favor some characters over others. The **TL;DR** to this post is that **making new, permanent maps will never be viable as long as the cost of their implementation, as well as that of map-specific champion balancing, exceeds the potential value gained from their creation**. It could perhaps be possible with a much less rigid model for champion customization, but as long as League retains its current systems, that might not happen.
I mean, i'd like reskin's of the maps to be more common, so it's possible to go into a normals game or something and randomly end up on one of the different reskins of summoner's rift. That would be nice.
: You're just complaining that donger isn't an afk pusher now
Agreed, i played him in mid lane in a normals and it actually did feel like a nerf, at first but i feel that once you learn how to use his other abilities he'll be a lot better, he basically just has a skill cap now which he didn't really have before.
Rioter Comments
: I'm not saying DON'T give someone % Health damage or DO give someone % Health damage. I'm just saying be prepared for what USUALLY comes with it. I'm also not saying that IF a champion has % Health damage, they will build tanky. It will just push them in that direction unless something else forces them or provides a better reason to build damage.
Well...what i'm saying is that % Max HP doesn't "Usually" cause anything, there are only 2 cases of it happening recently and one case last year with Fiora's tank build. Other than that most champions that have Max HP do not build tanky and never have a problem with it but that's, as you said because they have incentive to build damage instead.
Done25 (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Blackstone01,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ylxah1pB,comment-id=0005000200000000,timestamp=2017-05-18T18:54:32.193+0000) > > The death of Evelynn wasn't a single change, it was a drawn out process as riot over time realized they don't want her building AP, Tank, AD, or AP again. It was a very slow death, but that was when it started.
Yeah but it was well deserved and her rework will, hopefully, be a welcomed one but i do really feel sorry for evelynn one tricks because she is still really good and effective if your good with her so when they rework her it's going to hurt them alittle but that's how it is with every rework. It's well deserved because being permanantly invisible was, well overpowered so the rest of her kit had to be nerfed to hell as a result and she went from an assassin to a fighter and that's a no go with riot who wants her to be an assassin again.
xBlitza (EUW)
: I don't think that a champion who already got a Project skin is gonna have a Pulsefire one, PF Caitlyn said something about Projects and Pulsefire being located at the same time or something
Well i think Pulsefire is more of an ADC skin line as well, the Project skin line is best suited for Assassins and Fighter's, which has stayed mostly true with a couple exceptions of course. But i can see where Ekko would benefit from being a part of pulsefire, though i'd want Quinn to be instead or another ADC.
: I think support Mao has come out as the Flavor of the Month because that playstyle wasn't tested beforehand (some rioter mentioned this to me in some other patch thread). Support Maokai is a lot of fun tho both before and after rework.
It's fun for the player of maokai, but not for the reciever, it's extremely oppressive. The fact he can completely out damage carries with just his E damage is absolutely insane and needs to be nerfed, tanks with high CC shouldn't have damage, maokai does, his E borderline does more than Teemo ultimate and that's saying something cause both will half health you with liandry's the only difference is Maokai's will do it to tanks too because it does max HP damage.
: It's simple, my dear Joxcab. Lots of people who post on these boards are low elo and don't know how to play against assassins. This frustrates them, and so they come here to rage about it even when it isn't warranted. On the other hand, tanky AP is toxic and needs to be addressed by Riot. No need to thank senpai, just doing my job.
Pick a mage, AA, AA, AA= Profit. Literally shut's down every single assassin i'v ever played against, auto attacks for days at level 1-3, poke them down endlessly, push them out of lane, make them so far behind they can't do anything. That's how you beat an assassin, i play assassins a lot myself and for some reason the people i lane against don't know how to trade against a melee most of the time.
: A Note to Riot and Players: The More % Health Damage Someone Has, the Tankier They Will Build
Well...some champions have % Damage to prevent them from bursting someone to quickly, like with Evelynn, while she is getting a rework her ultimate used to do Flat Damage, but it's done max HP damage for a long time, she still builds full AP by the way. Or for Kled, who's W and Ultimate have percentage HP damage, if they made him do flat HP damage he would litterally yolo dive your AD and one shot them, he can still kill someone though but it's much more difficult and he builds full damage. Fiora, same thing, she builds full damage and was giving % HP damage so she wouldn't be massively oppressive with flat damage auto's early game and so that we would have 1 of 3 tank shredder's to help keep the game in line. Vel'koz, full damage, vayne, full damage two more examples. It's actually pretty rare that them having % HP damage actually results in them building tanky, the only two cases that are actually worth noting are of course Ekko and Fizz, their damage didn't go down if they built tanky due to their high damage on % HP and for fizz it's his W currently. But it's not just that, their stickyness and escape ability triumphs over tanks, meaning the tank can't do anything and ekko and fizz tank builds dominate. Other champions such as Poppy and Sion are given it so that they can do a little bit of damage and actually fend of other top laner's properly without, again, being able to burst squishes to easily. Personally i'm ad advocate for percentage HP damage, usually only on someones ultimate but i prefer the %HP damage over flat damage in many cases for balance purposes. It helps keep A LOT of thing's in line and many champions would be way more oppressive with flat damage than % HP damage.
JJI744 (NA)
: OK, I mostly agree with what you said, but in Yorrik's case I think its a matter of Yasuo's kit really hard-countering Yorrik. He can easily kill off the ghouls with Q, or dash through them, dash out of the wall thing Yorrik does, force engages when Yorrik has no graves out, and windwall the mark thing Yorrik throws to get his ghouls to jump. (I really need to go look up the names on these abilities.
Well the main thing is his ability to outrun Yorick, his windwall hurts his E, his shield hurts his Q he can cancel yoricks auto attack by dashing everywhere, yoricks ghouls don't matter much since yorick himself is very powerful without them but he has so many tools to avoid damage in lane that it border's on Gangplanks level of safety which means yorick has a very hard time doing his job. This isn't just for yorick though, most champions simply don't have the tools necessary to keep up with yasuo in lane, yasuo is overloaded in that aspect during the laning phase. This is further proven by the champions that he has lower winrates with being Camille, Renekton, Pantheon, Fiora and Riven as the most noteable.
: > [{quoted}](name=Zerenza,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FesAGUAG,comment-id=00030000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-05-18T13:18:37.716+0000) > > That's fair, but according to champion.gg, he wins all but 9 match ups and for 5 of those, it's basically even because it's 49%. Out of the last 4 only one of them has a good sample size and it's completely understandable why he'd lose, cause it's pantheon. His lowest winrates are against top rammus and xin zhao which aren't really picked that much top lane so it doesn't count(only 100 games each). > > All of his other match ups(45) place him well above 50% winrate in top lane. In 12 of his match ups he has over a 55% winrate against them, meaning he apparently counter's 12 champions, and that's not even counting 24 other champions that he has above a 51% winrate against. Yasuo is a late game monster, he shouldn't be winning against so many champions so easily, especially against, say Yorick with a 65% winrate, why? Simple, yorick is better early to mid game, so how is yasuo a late game scaler, beating yorick with a 65% winrate over 500 games. > > The short answer, yasuo's laning phase is actually extremely oppressive and makes surviving with him easy, his passive coupled with his windwall and his ability to hold his CC while also dash endlessly in a minion wave make him very hard to lane against even for people that should be beating him in lane. > > Keep in mind this is all in platinum and above and he has about a 12-15% playrate. Meaning there is PLENTY of data on him now. While I have never had an issue with him even on my main account, thats probably because I main {{champion:122}}
It's kind of funny because of 3360 games, yasuo has a 52% winrate against darius.
: > [{quoted}](name=3TWarrior,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=FesAGUAG,comment-id=000300000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-05-18T07:02:44.531+0000) > > actually yasuo's winrates have been pretty high for a couple of patches, up to 61% in challenger if I remember right and for a games played comparison, it was 300 in a month compared to lee sin's 1000 in a month Challenger is way too small of a sample size to draw any kind of fair conclusion though.
That's fair, but according to champion.gg, he wins all but 9 match ups and for 5 of those, it's basically even because it's 49%. Out of the last 4 only one of them has a good sample size and it's completely understandable why he'd lose, cause it's pantheon. His lowest winrates are against top rammus and xin zhao which aren't really picked that much top lane so it doesn't count(only 100 games each). All of his other match ups(45) place him well above 50% winrate in top lane. In 12 of his match ups he has over a 55% winrate against them, meaning he apparently counter's 12 champions, and that's not even counting 24 other champions that he has above a 51% winrate against. Yasuo is a late game monster, he shouldn't be winning against so many champions so easily, especially against, say Yorick with a 65% winrate, why? Simple, yorick is better early to mid game, so how is yasuo a late game scaler, beating yorick with a 65% winrate over 500 games. The short answer, yasuo's laning phase is actually extremely oppressive and makes surviving with him easy, his passive coupled with his windwall and his ability to hold his CC while also dash endlessly in a minion wave make him very hard to lane against even for people that should be beating him in lane. Keep in mind this is all in platinum and above and he has about a 12-15% playrate. Meaning there is PLENTY of data on him now.
: Ranged carries are still using it, especially Lucian.
Yeah, because ranged carries abuse everything, the champions the item is MEANT for got nerfed by it. So i really hope clever get's nerfed for ranged champions only.
: ok, cool. cleaver next please.
Clever should get changed so ranged champions can't abuse it, but do keep in mind it was nerfed a lot several patches ago, as it gives much less AD than it used it.
Jo0o (NA)
: I'm confused. Why'd you think Vayne was going to troll? It's not like Vayne isn't an acceptable ADC pick. That doesn't excuse the flames pointed your way, of course, but you gotta protect yourself from stuff like this. Don't pick fights! It's never worth it!
It was a joke lol Cause she flashed Lucian originally but then went to vayne and ended up fighting lucian, which i thought was funny. But apparently she didn't.
: Mute button. And if this started in champ select like you said, why didn't you dodge?
I didn't mute him since i didn't dodge in time(I actually tried to) and decided to keep him unmuted so i'd have evidence of his toxic behavior.
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=Mozarilla,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xGtnXqWp,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2017-05-16T17:49:03.276+0000) > > Me & my gf have noticed that her damage is questionable. > > She is level 6 with her currently and she even admits her damage is a bit.. Well.. Whack. She has felt really feast or famine. She either does 50%+ of your life in 1.5 seconds, or barely scratches 20% over a 30 second extended trade.
It's how she's made...it's not really that she's feast or famine it's just she doesn't spike in power like other ADC's do with 1 or even 2 items based on your build. So if your behind, it feels like your useless because you either don't have a single item or only have one and that's not where her powerspike is. If your really far ahead then you have 2 items and you feel much stronger, but that's kind of just how she's built, if your even you feel just as strong as if your at 2 items because your not behind or ahead so your enemy isn't OP af to you. You don't HAVE to be ahead to feel strong, like with many assassins, you just need to be even which isn't feast or famine its just how her kit scales.
Meddler (NA)
: All on hits is the intent, not sure if it's hooked up to affect everything yet though. Depending on just how powerful that then proves to be might need to make other adjustments to compensate too.
I feel like...it might become a must buy on everyone if it reduces all on-hits. The other boots might need to start looking more appealing in that case or BoRK might just need a nerf. Side note, Guardian Angel is very slowly becoming a must buy and very obnoxious first buy on many ADC's.
Chiken138 (EUW)
: Meddler These Two Champions are very bad now , 1 is even unplayable. DR Mundo and Volibear. Any Plans about them? The tank update weakend them even further, whats the Situation about both classes
It might be because their playstyles are extremely binary and pretty unhealthy when strong. I actually lost lane to a mundo as fiora, i was building full damage but he was building full tank and somehow outdamaged me completely until about 30 minutes, the same goes for volibear. We might see mini-reworks for them though, similar to Rammus and Heimerdinger and i think that would be pretty cool.
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Zerenza

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